Mormonism, founded in the 1830s by Joseph Smith, differs fundamentally from traditional Christianity by teaching that God was once a man who progressed to godhood and that humans can become gods through temple rituals. However, the church has abandoned several of its original doctrines since its founding, including the Adam-God doctrine (Brigham Young taught Adam was Michael the archangel and literal father of human spirits), blood atonement (certain sins required the sinner's own blood shed), polygamy (essential for exaltation), racial priesthood restrictions, and the infinite regression of gods (an endless chain of men becoming gods). These abandoned teachings reveal that Mormonism's foundational leadership has been proven to be flawed, raising questions about the movement's theological validity.
MNL: Awake and Aware (6/8/26 )Added:
Heat. Heat.
Well, greetings and salutations to the 310 tribe. It's so good to see you here on this Monday night live. I am um live tonight with my good friend Steve Schmutzer who I've known for a little over 10 years now. I just had to ask him before uh he came before I came on what the uh what the actual count was. So I think it was around 2015 when we first met through the Omega letter. Anyways, he's a fantastic writer. Uh he's got a tremendous mind. He's also a teacher uh and leader of the Celebrate Community Church. Um and he'll also be putting on a conference again this year. I've done one with him in the past. I think it was two years ago, me and Lee Brainer. Um, that was more of a uh I don't know what we call it, Q&A kind of thing where we just hung out and and took questions from the audience and uh it's really cool. It was a really cool experience to do that. Anyways, he's doing another one this coming uh September and I'll show the promo for it in a little bit. But uh without further ado, I'm going to bring good friend Steve on.
Hey Steve, how are you? I'm doing well, Pete. Thanks for having me on.
>> It's been about a year since I had you on the last time. I think I don't know if it's been >> I think so. Yeah, I think so. I think you uh you and I chatted from my work office one time.
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah, they're they're in Frosty, Colorado. I don't know if it's still frosty right now. Is it warmed up at all?
>> Oh, it's really hot right now. It's uh it's crazy weather here. I mean, you just wait a little bit, everything changes. What's what's hot to you?
>> Hot to me? Um uh great question. Uh upper 80s >> north of north of that. What about you?
>> I mean hot is anything over 100 with high humidity. Like that's unbearable. I can take I can take a high heat like 115 if it's dry.
>> Oh, that's terrible. I I would rather take 115 in the dry heat than uh 90 90s with like you know 90% humidity. I could I hate >> Listen, I totally agree. I grew up in Africa as a missionary kid and you talk about heat and humidity.
>> Boy, we had it there.
>> Yeah, we call that Africa hot. When it gets like humidity above 90, I'm like that's Africa hot.
>> Oh man.
>> Well, uh tonight guys, we're going to do a uh mostly Q&A. I did want to bring up one story before we kind of launch into the Q&A. So, if the mods, if you guys can start collecting questions, I think I have some from last week that uh was Wednesday, I think it was Wednesday that I did not get to. I think there's a few that I didn't get to, but uh tonight will be mostly Q&A. And uh but I do want to touch on this real quick. Um I have the conference. If you're going to be in the Dallas Fort Worth area this weekend, Lamb and Lion Ministries is putting on their conference. You just go to the Christ and Prophecy website and it should have all the the details. I'll put it in the details uh under the the title and everything like I usually do for all of the upcoming conferences. So, DFW area, I will be speaking Saturday.
There was a Friday night uh uh event there. I won't be there Friday night, but I will be there all day Saturday. So again, if you're in the DFW area, I'd love to see you there. And let me see.
Let me pull up this article here.
See if I can get it here.
Window. There it is.
The DoD officially drops 180 faiths from military's recognized religion uh list.
Now, this was in part due to Secretary War Hixath's uh efforts to kind of clean up the I mean, they had a religion for everything. I mean, you could you could worship your dog. I mean, it was it was chaos in there. And so that dealing with the chapency ranks and everything the chaplain have to do uh to try to accommodate all the different faith. So, he basically just said, "Hey, we're just going to go back to like the major religions." And in part of that, um, there was some controversy due largely to this right here because you notice they are not included with the other Christian uh or the other churches that are listed as Christian, which I would I would argue that this is not Christian either.
So, I don't know. Uh, I could certainly see the Mormons are upset because we're like, why did you include the JWs and you didn't include us? I mean, they're a cult, too, aren't they? So anyways, I uh I in the military, we lived in on base housing for the latter parts of the years that we were in and we had a big family. So we always had the biggest like uh field-grade housing that you could have and indubly without I mean without even question either my neighbors were going to be Mormon or they were going to be Catholic. Anybody that had large families was going to be Mormon or Catholic. We were like one of the few large families that weren't Catholic or Mormon. So, uh, we grew up or, you know, served the last, you know, decade or so with a lot of Mormon neighbors. And I would say for the most part, Mormons kept to themselves. They didn't really, they were very friendly, but they didn't like want to hang out with you or do anything with you. Um, and it was only until my last set of neighbors that they actually kind of broke that mold where they were, you know, the kids could play together, you know, the kid, you know, what it was, you know, they were just kind of normal in that way. But we used to call people uh the Mormons, we used to call them Mormon friendly. And uh I need to bring this on too.
Uh Mormon friendly because they were uh they they were super nice and they would wave at they would uh they would wave at wave at you from the window of their house like this, you know, and that was about as close as they ever got to hanging out with you. So uh let me pull this up real quick. Here we go. I created this a while back and I posted on X because there was getting I was I was for whatever reason I kept getting in the algorithm with all these Mormons posting all this Mormon stuff. So I just wanted to put on there like what was the differences between traditional historic Christianity uh Mormon theology and then even going so far to the far right is Jehovah Witness theology.
And I tried to be as diligent as I could in quoting from the direct sources and in actually getting the the correct sources as best I could from each of their respective uh well primarily the Mormons and the Jehovah Witnesses uh from their doc from their books and stuff because we know the Jehovah Witnesses created their own Bible because the Bible that we have is not apparently was corrupted so they can't use it. And then the same issue with the Mormons, right? They came up with the Book of Mormon which is you know largely plagiarized and you know even even all the the King James stuff that it does copy chap by chapter and by verse uh and we know now that there are some grammatical errors in the Hebrew and uh I think it's primarily in the Hebrew that that when Joseph Smith copied he was claiming that he got these from the golden tablets that the angel Moroni gave him and those dated back to like the 400s, but he's quoting from King James, which didn't come about until 1611. And even then, the King James has had many uh updates to it to clean up some of the errors and some of the things that were wrong with the King James. But they came after the fact or he came before the fact that they made these major changes. Uh, so he has the same grammatical errors as some of the earlier King James versions have that we know now is incorrect because we have the Dead Sea Scrolls and we have other things that have been able to revitalize the the Hebrew language. It was a dead language up until Israel became a nation again. So, >> right, >> he copied the same problems that the King James. So, we know that these the King James that he or the the tablets that he claims that he's copying from weren't from the 400 AD time period.
They are from the King James version that he plagiarized from. So, uh just some of the things here, the nature of God, we believe in one eternal unchanging holy God. Uh Mormonism, God was once a man and that humans can become gods if they do all the temple rituals and they do everything right and live the right way. obey all the law etc. That this is called this uh exaltation that they can become a god in their own right one day and and have their own planet become uh gods and goddesses and have many god you know children you know the wives are perpetually pregnant from there on out giving birth to whole new civilizations.
Um, this is largely now I also went back and um because I wanted to see what were the major changes from the 1800s to today like the doctrines that Mormonism began with that said uh you know you know largely that came from either Joseph Smith or Brigham Young. And what were those those main doctrines then that have now been largely rejected by modern uh uh Mormons? So we have some here that are um let me find it. I had posted all this or uh put all this here into a presentation.
Uh see okay here we go we have okay the godhead.
So oh I'm sorry the Adam god doctrine. So this came primarily from Brigham Young.
Brigham Young. Young taught that Adam, who was really Michael, the archangel, was the literal father of human spirits and bodies for this world, an exalted being from another world who became the god of this earth. And so, Brigham Young taught this as as fact. And many people uh even up until the 1970s believed this and it was explicitly rejected and disavowed by later leaders i.e. Spencer W. Campbell in 1976 and is not taught today and considered a false doctrine by the mainstream Mormon church. The second uh major change from their original doctrines to where they are today is the blood atonement. Again, this was from primarily Brigham Young and then some of those Joseph Smith era roots type folks uh other leaders at the time. The idea that certain grave sins i.e. murder, adultery, apostasy, breaking temple covenants, the Mormon temple covenants could not be fully covered by Christ atonement alone. The sinner must have their own blood shed voluntarily or otherwise to atone promoted during especially during the 1856 to 1857 Mormon Reformation.
Again, current status is no longer taught. The church emphasizes that Christ's atonement is sufficient for all sins through repentance. Blood atonement is viewed as non-doctrinal rhetoric from the theocratic context.
The next one is obviously one of the most famous ones is polygamy or plural marriage. Joseph Smith introduced it secretly in the 1830s and 40s and his uh doctrines and covenants number 132.
Brigham Young publicly practiced and defended it vigorously in Utah teaching it as an ex as essential for exaltation.
So again, in order to become a god, you had to have many wives. Officially discontinued uh current status is officially discontinued in 1890. This is in the official declaration number one and 1904. The church no longer practices or teaches it as a current commandment.
It is presented as a historical practice commanded at a specific time. How convenient. Celestial eternal plural marriages remain in doctrine for some ceilings, but earthly practice is rejected.
Um, there is still some segments of Mormonism that uh still practices. I think what was the guy's name? J Jeffrey.
>> Is that the reality show?
>> No. Well, not sisters, wives, but uh there was a cult guy out there and I think West Texas or New Mexico >> who had a he had multiple wives or whatever.
>> So again, this is uh the Mormons distancing themselves from uh their foundational teachings.
uh you know this isn't it's one thing you know when when Mormons if you have a conversation with them and they say well you know back in Abraham's day you know uh you know or back in the Old Testament people had many wives God never con God never condones multiple marriages he never like said oh yeah this is great just keep doing it um what instead it was uh it was well I say it was it necessary I was going to say for Adam and Eve and there's an interesting theory about all the Adam and Eve and and where did Cain's wife come from and all that kind of stuff. U I don't want to get into that because that's going to be another huge rabbit trail that we'll go down for 45 minutes and never get to the Q&A.
>> But um this is something that that is not uh condoned in scripture if especially in the New Testament. But even still, even still, the fact that we're talking thousands of years ago that people did this at the the very beginning of human history versus like what 150 years ago, not even that, >> you know, let me um if I could interject on this. Um I indicated at the beginning of our session that I grew up in Africa as a missionary kid. We h we face this issue over there because if say the African chief of a village would accept the Lord and be and come to faith uh all 13 of his wives would do the same thing and their conversion was genuine. You know it just cascaded down. Then their children accepted the Lord. I mean, churches grew and flourished, but we had quite a few missionaries that would uh debate behind closed doors, you know, which one of the 13 wives should he stay with >> and let the other 12 go. And this was very common, you know, as recently as the late 70s, uh, when I left over there to come here to the States. So the problem that you're raising um it continues in other cultures and um the solution over there was he just remains married to all 13 wives. I mean what can you do at that point?
>> It's it's still prevalent in in Islamic culture as well.
>> So and I I'm not sure about Hindus but uh um yeah in other cultures it's still widely practiced. But uh I think once we get past uh you know obviously Solomon had u >> 300 >> 700 wives or whatever uh some insane some insane number and look at all the problems it caused for him. So uh certainly not anything that is con condoned as biblical and Jesus reiterates this in the in the uh the New Testament uh talking about that you know that uh everything began with Adam and Eve you know and so >> and we look at the concept of the church the church is corporately singular in the sense that we are many uh many that make up one body and as the body we we become um we take on the uh um I don't want to say persona, but we take on the embodiment I guess of the bride um that Christ comes back to take, but we're also part of his body. Um and so when you look at the concept of of uh the marriage and the act of >> um what's the proper way to say this?
um on the honeymoon night when you come together you become one flesh. Right. So >> it's not like that for us.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. In the in the spiritual sense, we are all joined in at the moment of the moment we get saved. We're brought into the body of Christ. Okay.
>> Right.
>> Let me keep going because I'll, you know, I'll just rapid trail off into other things. Okay. So again, it's this teaching was discontinued in the 1890s and reiterated again in 1904. They don't practice anymore uh with the exception of uh Warren Jeffs. Thank you uh for bringing that uh name to to memory here.
I'm sure he's not the only one though.
Number four is the curse of Cain, racial doctrines in the priesthood and temple band. So uh this was taught and supported by both Brigham Young and earlier uh teachings the teachings linking black skin to the curses from Cain or premortal choices. Black people were barred from priesthood and temple ordinances formalized under uh Brigham Young. This obviously changed in 1978.
The revelation that this is a official declaration number two lifted the ban.
The church has disavowed theories that black skin was a divine curse or a sign of inferiority inferiority or some type of premortal disfavor.
So again, u this is the fourth of the major doctrines within Mormonism that they've abandoned since the founding in the 1830s or 1840s.
Number five is the calling and election made sure or the second atoning. So this was introduced by Joseph Smith in practice under Brigham Young and later leaders. So, Joseph Smith introduced a second anointing as a higher temple ordinance that can make quote make one's calling and election sure end quote providing assurance of exaltation i.e. becoming godhood or becoming a god. And this is linked to the second comforter.
I didn't know there was a second comforter. I knew there was a comforter but not a second comforter. Current status still performed rarely in privately for select members often the leaders but rarely taught or emphasized publicly. The focus has shifted to enduring faithfulness rather than specific ordinances guaranteeing exaltation in this life. Okay. And the last few here that are some notable shifts are their teachings that have become deemphasized the god the father as a former man. So, uh, King Flet Discourse is one of, uh, one of the I think it's got the Joseph Smith sermons in there that he taught that that God was once a man who progressed to godhood. Um, and so this has largely been abandoned or ignored or now they're trying to sweep it under the rug as if that never happened. Uh, Gordon B. Hinckley publicly downplayed it. U, but there are still many that still hold to this within the Mormon faith. And then you have the law of consecration. uh united order full communal implementation is long no longer practice. It's spiritualized or limited to tithing and welfare certain speculative cosmology or theocratic ideas uh i.e. the kingdom of god is a literal as a literal political theocracy is not emphasized. So again abandoning some of these things. So, that's the uh that's the the um doctrines that they held to that have largely since been abandoned.
But here's uh the last thing I want to say on this and then uh we'll get on to the rest of the program tonight. It's the problem that's called the infinite regression of gods. And I posted this on Facebook a while back and I caught some major grief from Mormon friends that I have. It to me is it is the the conundrum for the Mormon faith in the same way that Islam's main conundrum in their own faith is that they honor Jesus as a prophet yet they only you know because Islam came along five or 600 years after Jesus you know death burial and resurrection. So they only know about Jesus from the Christians yet and from the Christian faith and yet they only look at Jesus as a man, a prophet, right? So and they also honor him as a as a holy holy prophet sent from God.
Yet Jesus himself claimed to be God in in several places in the scripture and obviously we see him after the resurrection. We see him in Revelation and so forth. So the main problem with that is that how can Islam claim to be the true new revelation of God yet deny that Jesus was God come in the flesh when Jesus himself said that he was God in the flesh and that he was equal with his father although he was subordinate to his father um in purpose and why he came in the flesh in the first place and so either Jesus is lying or Islam is lying you can't have it both ways Equally uh troubling for the Mormon faith is this idea of the infinite regression of gods. So the Mormons believe in an infinite regression of gods where God the father was once a mortal man who progressed to godhood and his own father God did the same and that father god before him did the same and so on and so forth. You see that there was a infinite line of men that somehow became gods and then they made the next person the god to be their own god of some new reality.
Right? And so at some point there's no beginning. It just goes on and on and on and on and on. So there's a neverending stretch of men who became gods to become their own version of God the father. And so this is a conundrum and this is why they've abandoned this teaching because it's theologically ide I mean whatever way you want to look at it it's impossible. So uh anyways I I posted that and yeah I caught some uh some Yeah.
>> Hey Pete, this chart that you have on your screen right now, this is something you said you put together.
>> Yes.
>> You should uh you should make that available. I'd be very interested in taking a look at that.
>> Yeah. Um, I'll email it to you after, but it's on my It was on my uh X page.
>> Okay.
>> Posted it there, but I can send it to you and >> I'll post it on Facebook again. I think I posted on Facebook before, but I can post it there again.
>> And um, but yeah, I mean, if you just take them at their own words, they're going to tell you who they are. And Mormons vehemently denied being Christian back when Jose in fact Joseph Smith himself said the reason that he wrote the Book of Mormon or you know whatever started the Mormon faith was because God told him that all the all the churches in his day all of them had apostasized and that none of them were teaching the truth anymore. So the church had largely become extinct by the time Joseph Smith had come along. And so now he had to have the new revelation from the angel Moroni and start his own movement that allowed him to become mayor. I think he was editor of a newspaper.
He tried to run for president. I think he started obviously started his own religion, his own compounds and got to marry all the women he wanted to marry, even some as young as I think 14. And then he married some sisters. Uh I mean, he he was not a good man. So my whole point in all this is that when you look at the Mormon faith, it's not been around that long. It's only from the 1830s really. And so if the founding the two founding leaders of your of your movement have been proven to be crooks, frauds, uh polygamists, uh liars, false teachers, um racist, I mean on and on and on you could go.
And this is this is where you're claiming even though the modern- day Mormons are disavowing the earlier teachings of their leaders, this is where their foundation is from. I mean, I if I if I were Mormon, I would have a serious issue with that because I'd be thinking like it'd be like, you know, same with dispensationalism, right?
Let's just say that let's just say hypothetically that that Darby invented dispensationalism. We know that he did it because >> he simply codified what was already in script. He he already he simply popularized what was already there. He didn't have to make up or create anything out of you know out of thin air error. But let's say hypothetically that Darby did invent Mormonism or dispensationalism and Darby was you know we we would have to like disavow major teachings that he had because of how faulty they were or how flawed they were in their logic or in their theological prowess. I would have questions about being a dispensationalist at that point. You know what I mean? Like I would have a hard time like if the two founding leaders of my movement were so wrong on so many major issues. And this doesn't even get into all the issues with the problems in geography in the Book of Mormon and the fact that they're naming and claiming things about the Americas that simply historically and archaeologically can't be proven and and have never seem to exist here, like having horses on the continent before the Spaniards arrived or elephants or iron uh you know, I don't know, chariots and things like that and major cities and and civilizations that we should have found at some point. Uh, you know, anyways, all that to say is that there's a lot of problems with Mormonism. I would have I would ask anybody that is from the Mormon faith, if you somehow stumble on this channel to to Google and look this up yourself, man, because you know, it's not like the 1800s where you could totally make up um what did Joseph Smith claim that the some of these tablets were written in um neo uh >> yeah, some some type of Egyptian hier hieroglyphic.
uh and it was completely uh it was completely made up uh in fact but at the time nobody could fact check them because nobody knew you know but now I mean we've gone into Egypt for 100 plus years you know archaeologists and historians and Egyptologists and and the whole modern world has gone and studied Egypt and we know that this new uh this book of Abraham I forget what it was but he was claiming it was written in some type of new Egyptian hieroglyph or something. Anyways, all of that is just complete completely bump. And um anyway, >> you know, Pete, just a just a quick little curious observation here. It's really interesting that Mormonism, which was, as you say, founded in the um 1800s, has so much support today. And yet Darby, who reached his acclaim in the roughly same time frame a little bit later, but he's attacked for being purely about biblical truth.
>> Oh yeah.
>> Um it's just ironic that, you know, within a span of probably 50 years, those guys overlapped.
>> Yeah. Yeah. And and I and I'm of I'm of the mind I'm of the I'm of the belief that the reason that Mormonism came out because Darby the Plymouth Brethren movement I think began in the 1820s late 1820s and it was a few years before Margaret McDonald had her vision and Edward Edward Iran and all those guys >> kind of followed after her. And Margaret McDonald for the simple >> uh for those that that don't know a whole lot but have heard that name. She did not invent dispensationalism. She was in fact she was a or a preerttrib rapture whatever. She was a she was like mid-trip or pre- wrath if you looked at her theology her esquetology. I mean she wasn't even preerttrib. So she thought the church had to go into the tribulation. So, she wasn't even teaching the same thing that that Darby and Darby simply reading through scripture started to pick up on the patterns and things that that were there and noticing that God never changes. God never changes, but how he's dealt with mankind throughout time has changed.
There was an obvious change from before the fall of Adam and Eve and after the fall of Adam and Eve. I mean, >> right, >> nobody nobody disputes that. Even the reformed guys don't dispute that that the world was a different way before they fell than it was after they fell.
The next obvious change would be before and after the flood. The world before the flood was one way and the world after the flood was another way. There was an obvious change between or before and after the law when the law was given, you know, the law of Moses and the calling of Israel and the 12 tribes and and all the Exodus and everything because now the the focus of the story of the church then wholly shifts from mankind writ large, which is you see that in Genesis 1-1. And now the story picks up in Genesis 12 and it begins to focus on Abraham who was the first man called the Hebrew. And then from then on all of his descendants who we could trace down as the tribes of Israel uh and also you know the patriarchy Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and then the 12 tribes and then we also through there we trace the lineage of Christ the Messiah who was prophesied to come. So, um, yeah, I think that when Darby was getting revelation from God about, hey, go back and return to a literal understanding and interpretation of the Bible, forget all the dogmas and stuff and all the additional creeds and things that the church had tacked on and just simply go back to taking the Bible as it, you know, taking a literal, historical, grammatical interpretation of the Bible. And that began to lead to these very obvious differences in how mankind has lived under these conditions that we've lived under throughout time.
And that is around the same time that that that Joseph Smith in the Americas was now began his movement with uh Mormonism. So I think always trying to corrupt >> anytime God's hand is moving in some particular direction, Satan is always trying to counter that. And so he comes out here with this Mormonism stuff right at around the same time that Darby is repopularizing or rediscovering dispensationalism. So >> So Pete, going going all the way back to the beginning of your uh little uh Mormon thing here, you're saying that Pete Hegth took Mormonism off the list or just did not call them Christian anymore. What was your point again?
>> Yeah. So there he was trying to reduce the total number of religious faiths that the chaplain I guess had to service across the DoD.
>> Gotcha.
>> From 180 down to I don't know what that final list was, but >> right. Okay.
>> The Mormons the the big drama out of this was that the Mormons and Glenn Beck and Senator Mike Lee and other senators that are Mormon started throwing a fit and started, you know, uh complaining because they're not considered Christian. Well, they're not Christian in the same way that Hindus are not Christians.
>> Mormons or Muslims are not Christians.
Just because you have Jesus Christ in the name of your religion doesn't mean you're a Christian if you deny the major tenants of our faith, >> right?
>> It doesn't make you a Christian.
>> Anyways, >> yeah.
>> Okay. Well, let's get into Q&A.
And I'm gonna You said throw these to you, right?
>> Well, maybe. Let's see what they are.
I I uh the very first time I ever did a Q&A was with Tom Hughes years ago and I said I the first thing I ever said was like I reserve the right to say I don't know and I still >> I'm not afraid of that either.
>> Uh I need Okay, I need to find the right app for this. Okay.
Okay, I got them.
Uh, this is from last week. This is uh from Catalyn. Oh, no, I'm sorry. Catalin collected this. This is from Julie. Uh, Congress just passed a resolution forcing Trump to pull out all troops out of the the Middle East and do and to end the conflict with Iran. Does he have to comply? Is this constitutional?
>> If you don't know, I think I can answer this one.
>> Yeah, I think that's more up your alley.
>> So, Congress can pass this. I think a couple of Republicans sided with the Democrats to actually pass this. Now, it's got to go to the Senate and then ultimately Trump would have to sign that. So, you know, Trump's not going to sign that, >> right?
>> Uh so, they have the right to pass this resolution.
Um they do not have the right to force Trump to do it, though. And you see all the the political maneuvering they've done since Operation Epic Fury began months ago is that they would allow that to go to the very extent to which active conflict could go and then they go into the peace treaty time. So now it's a new thing. Then it's economic fury and then it's it's so every time they change it, it's resetting the clock on this. So they could perpetually go for however long they need to until this is done. And and I have the distinct feeling that uh out of just sheer frustration of this whole thing that Trump will end up nuking Iran or at least nuking those facilities because there's no good options for them to get out the the uranium the whatever the ur the um the the enriched dust or whatever they have. It's like >> yeah radioactive dust.
So, if they can't get it out with the Delta Force teams, which even if even if Iran was uh said, "Yeah, we'll help you get it out." And even if the Iranians tried to help us get it out, it's it's been bombed so much by uh when they did Operation Midnight Hammer. I think it's Midnight Hammer, right? Um they they collapsed all those tunnels. I don't even know how they're going to get down there other than to drop more bombs to create a a cratering effect to be able to get into those areas. But I would say if you're going to go to that extent, you might as well just nuke it. And they have these u low yield uh earth penetrating missiles uh the B61 series like B61 111 12 and 13.
They're different uh grade of or yield for explosions on those 11 being the the smallest and I think it's like 60 uh kilotons of yield versus the 13 which is like 300 kilotons of of of nuclear yield that but it it doesn't blow up on the surface and create a mushroom cloud.
It's like when you think back to the 1950s and60s when we had those atomic testings out in like Nevada where they did all the underground bombing and stuff. It would penetrate the earth by however many meters, 30 meters or something and then it detonates underground and it basically evaporating everything under there. So, in my estimation, that would probably be the easiest way to make ensure that nobody ever gets it again with the minimum minimal loss of life and uh you know, risk to service members and troops trying to go in there and dig it all out and stuff. So, >> do you think he's going to do that?
>> I think he will. Um >> I mean, that's just my that's my thoughts. We'll see how it ends up playing out. And I had something that I thought about last night and I sent it to um Oh. I sent it to a bunch of folks just to share with them, you know, I was like, "Dude, what's the odds of this?"
So, uh, I sent it to Mondo. Let me pull it up real quick.
So I've done this list a number of times and I talk about if you go back through the last 130 years or so there every seven every year that ends on seven not every year but but a lot of the years that end on seven seem to be significant for Israel.
So 1897, first Zionist Congress.
1917 is the Bowfor declaration.
>> Y >> 1947, UN resolution 181, which allowed for the partitioning of a Jewish and Arab state.
1967, the six- day war.
>> 1977 was the beginning of the Camp David Accords, land for peace, which they tried to do for like 40 years. 1987 was the Temple Mount Institute's creation when that started. And then we have 2017 was the US recognition of Jerusalem, the first president and the first time the United States has recognized Jerusalem as the eternal capital of Israel. And then we have what I I'm theorizing now is that 2027 will be the consummation of the Abraham Accords. So we're here what halfway through almost halfway through 2026, >> right?
>> And uh obviously the conflict's still ongoing and whatnot. So, I'm thinking, what if the Abraham Accords are signed in 2027? That would be another seven-year, which means that it could look like, and this is complete speculation, that 2037 could be the end of the 70th week of Daniel.
>> So, if you back that up seven years, that puts us in 2030. So, between 2027 and 2030 is about three years. Um, I'm I'm still convinced that 2033, the 2000th anniversary of Christ's deathbound resurrection, is going to play some role in the 70th week of Daniel in some way, shape, or form, whether it's at the middle, beginning, or end.
>> I think it's reasonable.
>> Yeah.
>> You know, I just asked a question. Go ahead. Let's move on.
>> No, go ahead.
>> Well, I just asked a question. Uh if you think Trump has the constitution to do this, I find his postures lately rather uh unpredictable. I think he's been a different president since his trip to China. Uh he seems to have a different What's that?
>> That's true. He has been different.
>> Yeah. I mean, you take Trump on the Iran issues pre-China and you see a lot more consistency in his words, his postures, his determination. Since that point, I I feel like he's a a patchwork. There's there's a lot of mixed messages, uh a lot of inconsistencies. It just it makes me wonder. I had a couple people in the class I taught uh last night. uh they claim to have this idea that they believe that Iran actually does have, you know, one or two nuclear missiles right now or nuclear bombs and that they're going to end up using them. Who knows? But I'm just been a little bit dismayed at some of the waffling and the changes I've seen in President Trump lately. You know, I think I think with him what's the what's going on is his age is finally k c catching up to him because he is uh he everybody that works with him uh Marco Rubio I mean everybody that's close with him >> consistently report that he never sleeps. He's always working >> and you know he's always eating McDonald's or pizza or diet cokes or whatever. So I don't know. I I think that age and his just being worn down uh it's just wearing him down. So, it's catching up to him.
>> And uh the Iranians obviously he wants more than anything in the world, he wants to get this Abraham Accords done before his presidency ends as a le a l a lasting legacy for him that he somehow achieved peace in the Middle East.
Something that no other president has done. Um on top of all the other things he wants to do with Fortress America and all these other concepts of Western, you know, dominance. But I think with I think with his inconsistency, I've noticed that too. And um I don't know I part of me also sees this as a restrainer is restraining is holding back uh certain agendas and certain things from happening too fast before their appointed time. So >> yeah, >> it to me that this is also the work of the Holy Spirit or primarily the work of the Holy Spirit holding back certain things until the right time and at that right time everything's going to fall into place and I think that's right after the rapture at some point.
>> So do I. I agree with that.
>> Okay. Um Jason asks, "Is Gog of Mog Russia or Turkey?" H >> I Yeah, obviously scholars seem to be more divided on that, especially as of late. Uh there's been a couple of prominent scholars that have come out and tried to make the case that um Gog is really Turkey. Um I think the traditional camp of prophecy scholar still leans in the southern Russian territories uh more than not, but I don't dismiss that. Um, Turkey could be I'm not dogmatic on this one, Pete. I I I've looked at all of the uh territories that Ezekiel described by their ancient names. I've seen some very scholarly arguments going slightly different directions. Uh I do think Turkey is involved. Definitely Turkey is involved.
>> Yeah.
>> Uh to me the the question is not about that. It's more, you know, the identity of Gog. I I lean in the direction that it's Russia, >> but I'm not dogmatic on that. How about you?
>> Uh, yeah, this is uh >> I agree. I think Turkey is 100% involved. I mean, Ta Bertoan, even his son, I I think are chomping at the bits to uh >> to come against Israel and finally destroy them or try to and they're going to lead some type of a a march against that. But I also know that Russia has a ton of Muslims in there and you got a lot of Muslim provinces of the former Soviet satellite states and even even still proper Russian provinces that are that are, you know, overwhelmingly Muslim. So, Dagistan, um, Chetchna, um, Kazakhstan was a Soviet state. All the stands basically are from Soviet satellites. So, >> um, I think that this massive army, a coalition is going to come from all directions. But I think I don't I I don't know if it will be like Putin himself leading it.
>> Um, the Russians or I don't know.
>> I think Yeah. I mean, if I had to go on record, you know, today and say I would lean in the direction that those southern Stan, as you call them, regions of Russia are definitely involved if for no other reason that they're astonishly Islamic.
>> Yeah.
>> And and I I think that that right there is an issue we have to consider with this uh Ezekiel prophecy. I think among other things it's God's way of corraling the uh Islamic you know world so to speak and dealing with them. So I I do think they are involved and that may be where we just simply say Gog is that southern part of Russia, but I absolutely do believe that there's no question Turkey is involved, obviously Persia, obviously Libya. I think the rest are, you know, not not as much in question.
>> Yeah. Okay. Um to the dude question. Do you think that Iran must still be controlled by the anti-Israel group after this present war in order for the Ezekiel 38 war? Some say that biblical Iran may not be the current Iran.
>> Um, if I understand the question correctly, the inquiry is, will there be an anti-Semitic component within Iran's leadership remaining? Is that what the way you read it?
>> Yeah. the IRGC or or the Ayatollah, somebody still in charge that hates Israel.
>> Yeah, I I definitely think they're going to continue to exist. I I do not see a regime change happening in Iran uh the way it's uh pushed for in, you know, modern world leadership. I I I don't see that that's going to happen. the fanaticisms of, you know, the Iranian leadership go broad and they go deep. And I think rooting all of them out is virtually impossible. It's very clear in the war of Gog and Magog that there is a strong desire and motive to uh join uh an attack against Israel. And that would not be the case. I mean, one can surmise that would not be the case if there wasn't such an anti-Jewish sentiment in their leadership. So, I think that that simply argues for the fact that it will remain at some level. There will not be a complete regime change that turns Iran into a western democracy. That's not going to happen.
>> Well, we know that right now there's a a lot of Christians in Iran and a lot of people come into faith in Iran. So even at the rapture of the church, they are going to be removed and what's going to be left behind is going to largely be the Islamic >> um peoples >> residual. Yeah.
>> Residual. Yeah. And they're they're Shia Islam. So what we what's not what's interesting about Gog and Magog is that you see both Sunni and Shia come together to march against Israel.
>> Yep.
>> Which is >> the enemy of my enemy is my friend.
>> Yeah. Yeah. You know, Pete, you do raise a really good point, and that is you insinuated that the war of Gog and Magog is post-ra >> and and I agree with that. I actually I teach it that way. There's not a very clear biblical uh passage which says, "Hey, read this right here. The war of Gog and Magog is after God supernaturally removes his church." You won't find that. But there is every evidence that the war of Gog and Magog being supernaturally won by God is a post-rapture event. It plays by the new paranormal rules. And the rapture is a dividing line. Everything on this side is normal. I know it doesn't feel that way, but um you know, we're not in Mayberry anymore. We're in Gotham. But um on this side of the rapture, it's normal. On the other side of the rapture, it's paranormal.
>> Yeah.
>> And the war of Gog and Magog is a paranormal event.
>> I was looking in um >> the Bible.
Well, I was looking at the end of Ezekiel 38 and the last of the last p the last verse in 38 is verse 23. It says, "Thus I will magnify myself and sanctify myself and I will be known in the eyes of many nations and then they shall know that I am the Lord." So that's the last verse of 38. And then last verses of 39 talk about uh Israel being restored. Uh now I'll bring back the captives of Jacob. have mercy on the whole house of Israel. And I will be jealous for my holy name, after they borne their shame and their unfaithfulness, in which they were unfaithful to me when they dwelt safely in their own land, and no one made them afraid. When I brought them back from the peoples and gathered them out of the enemy's lands, and I'm hollowed in them in the sight of many nations, then they will know that I am the Lord their God, who sent them into captivity among the nations, but also brought them back um to their land, and left none of them captive any longer.
and I will not hide my fa face from them anymore for I shall have poured out my spirit on the house of Israel says the Lord God. So the focus on in Ezekiel 38 and 39 is all about Israel.
>> I cannot help us >> think that the church has no role in this. There's no there's no illusion to foreign non-Jewish believers or anything like that. And our our responsibility right now is to be salt and light in the world and to bring Christ and the gospel to the nations and uh that here it's it's this the focus is solely shifted back to the nation of Israel and reconciling with Israel. So to me the church is gone before Gog and Magog happens. And interestingly there's two things that come out of both the rapture and Gog and Magog. It creates two vacuums.
The rapture removes all true believers from the earth and presumably all children under a particular age of accountability as well as anybody that that has uh down syndrome or you know things like that where they cannot make those decisions of their own accord.
>> That creates a vacuum that and then the second vacuum is at Gog and Magog where militant Islam is wiped out.
>> Yep. Now, Islam may still be a faith after the after Gog and Magog, but >> it's not going to be in the same vein that they are right now, a milit militant political force that they are now where they got to take over and conquer. They're just going to be rolled up into whatever that final world religion is going to be. So, it it both there's two different gaps that or vacuums that are created from these two events. And that also enables the beast kingdom to come about and to form their own version of a new Rome as well as a new Babylonian type of religion that basically wraps everything up. And you can't have you cannot have this uh a of Babylon religion um when you have the true church on the earth and you have uh militant Islam because militant Islam will not tolerate competition in that way and the church the true church will not bend a knee to that. So, >> no, I agree with you. I've always uh taught that the war of Gog and Magog um you know has among other purposes the virtual elimination of the scourge of Islam. Uh to your point, they are not going to um what you know what's the word when they come into a country, they don't assimilate, >> they don't cooperate or whatever you know we're trying to say. that is not a religion that's going to link arms with any other type of faith apostate or otherwise. Um so I think that the war of Gog and Magog and you know the fallout's not just the nations which are named it goes to the islands and shorelines coastlines you know of the world.
There's that passage in those two chapters and I think it's God's way of dealing with uh the radical Islamic element.
Okay. From Good Breakfast, how long do you think it will take Israel to subdue the proxies of Iran, i.e. Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthis, Islamic Jihad, all the different factions that are still giving Israel grief? Um >> I can take a stab at that. Um, I think it's going to be a it's obviously going to be a protracted time. We're seeing that right now. I mean, I think pre um what was it? Uh, October 7th, 2023.
You know, I think those people in the prophetic community and I probably had one foot in that camp as well figured that the uh Psalms 83 conflict and the related conflicts around it would be fairly rapid. you know, would be fairly uh quick in terms of, you know, dealing with the problem. That's not been the case. It doesn't mean that the Psalms 83 prophecy or the related conflicts aren't happening or can happen. It's just that they're more protracted. Um the as a great case and point, I mean, uh look at what's happening in southern Lebanon right now. I mean, Israel is marching up technically, you know, north of the Latani River and uh I don't think they're going to pull back from there. I think when you look at scripture, uh it's pretty clear that they acquire that territory and they stay there. You know, they basically annex it like they did the Golan Heights. And but if you read all of the related passages which sort of pivot around the proverbial Psalms 83 conflict, uh we see that Israel is going to have to deal with Jordan. They're going to have to deal with Syria. This is the destruction of Damascus. They even have to deal with Egypt. Uh even per chance parts of Saudi Arabia. Uh so I I think we're looking at a drawn out conflict. potentially this could last another couple of years. I I think we're on a tinder box right now at the present moment because there's there's a parting of ways between Trump and Netanyahu right now. Uh they're not the buddy buddies they were even, you know, three months ago.
And I think Israel's hand is being forced. Trump wants a deal. Israel wants to survive. And those are two very different motives.
And I think with uh Israel's survival or her existential interests, she's going to do what she needs to do.
I think this will be a protracted event.
It will be drawn out, but the job will get done.
>> Yeah. And we know that by the time Gog and Magog comes about that they're living peacefully and securely in their land. So that means the immediate threats have to be neutralized. So I think um what's happening largely with like Hezbollah is that you get a lot of the leadership gets taken out the the high rank the high the the the the captains and the uh kind of commanders are taken out. So what we have left is all of the foot soldiers and people that basically were affiliated with Hezbollah kind of stepping in and trying to fill the the the the ranks and uh there's no shortage of of people willing to jump into that. But um at some point Israel is going to have such a devastating effect maybe with the destruction of Damascus or something to that effect, >> Isaiah 17 where that basically neutralizes the the immediate threats in their surroundings. So, you know, I know you me you mentioned earlier about Trump, you know, how inconsistent he's been when I mentioned about him nuking the the nuclear sites.
I he also is a guy that likes to be the first in stuff like the first one to do this, the first one to do he would be the first president since I uh since Truman >> to use an atomic weapon even if it is underground. And I think that Israel may have to demonstrate that same fact that they have nuclear weapons by taking out Damascus um with some some type of similar type of a attack, >> you know. Can I comment on that real quick? Um >> yeah. Yeah. You know there is no army there's no military let me back up and say military there's no military in the world today which is has a higher moral character than Israel the IDF and you know they have all these techniques about being polite in their warfare like knocking on the roofs of apartment buildings before they eliminate them. I mean, there's just no military that is as polite, I'm just going to use the word colloquially, as Israel. And yet, we read in Isaiah 17 about the destruction of Damascus. We read, you know, about how Ammon Jordan is going to get flattened the same way.
We have to ask ourselves why. Why would Israel do that sort of thing? I mean, this is Israel. This is not the way they behave.
And I think it's because Israel takes a profound hit.
>> Yeah.
>> Uh somewhere in this equation, you look at Isaiah 17, um Israel takes a hit. You know, there's not a lot of people up in their northern parts, if you read, you know, all those analogies about a few olives in the upper branches, a few grains of wheat. I don't think we've seen whatever that event is yet, but somewhere in this equation, and it could be soon, uh, Israel, I believe, is going to take some major hit that completely changes the paradigm of this conflict. And as a result of that, she responds in like kind. And it makes me wonder if Israel isn't going to receive some sort of a dirty nuclear bomb thing or a chemical weapon or something. But she takes a grievous blow and um that's why we see her reacting the way she does with Damascus and Ammon Jordan. There's no other provocation which would account for that.
>> True. Um, I would love not I'm gonna say I love, but I would I would be curious to see that um I I somehow there's either two scenarios I think could play out with regard to the Temple Mount that either Iran or Hezbollah like one of Iran's proxies accidentally hit blows up the Alaka mosque or the Dome of the Rock with their one of their missile strikes like it almost happened a couple times this summer uh where they it landed you know just short of the you know the proper area was kind of on the periphery. But um I would be curious to see if they accidentally destroy the the Alex mosque or the Dome of Rock. The only other option I think you have is uh at the end of Gog and Mog there's that big earthquake that devastates the city.
Um so I think that that Temple Mount's destroyed at that point because that going forward from Gog and Mog there's no hindrance to them uh seemingly being able to build their temple. there's no political there's nothing to hold him back anymore from doing that. So somehow that temp that the Dome of the Rock and the Alex mosque get destroyed and it kind of just paves the way for Israel to go ahead and reclaim the whole temple mount and rebuild their temple. So >> yeah, I agree.
>> All right. Uh from Talia, hey Talia, questions uh a question. After the rapture, could the governments initiate a lockdown to protect the left behind from more abductions?
What do you think?
>> Say that again. After the rapture, could the government institute a lockdown >> to protect the left behind from more abductions if they believe aliens if they try to pass off the excuse that aliens took people at the rapture?
>> Well, what effect would a lockdown have?
I mean, I I guess if the aliens, if it's believed that the aliens could, you know, do their thing and transport you, you know, from here to there supernaturally, what would a lockdown do?
>> I mean, I could see >> Go ahead.
>> Go ahead.
>> I could see the government trying all kinds of things, but let me just be clear about where I'm at. I think there is going to be such an overwhelming powerful delusion almost immediately after the rapture that everything is going to align behind that powerful delusion. I don't think uh the government in the absence of all Christian influence in the absence of all godly uh morality is going to do anything noble. Uh all the fuddy duddy Christians are gone. I I think if anything, the government that remains is going to act more depraved than it was before.
>> And so I don't think the government that remains postraapture is going to necessarily try to do anything except save their own skin and buy into whatever deception is almost, you know, upon them thereafter.
That's just my take is I it's a great question but um I don't I don't see how they can impose a lockdown.
>> I think let's just say hypothetically the rapture happened tomorrow. Um I think what you would have is basically the breakdown of western or you know society in general would break down and collapse and you would have about a good two to three weeks of just pure chaos and I think eventually within a couple of months you would have whatever the government whatever is left of the government with with the aid of artificial intelligence and drones and surveillance and all that kind of stuff beginning to clamp down and they'll definitely just come out and do marshall law and that would be pretty much everywhere. And you would have uh the government trying to reclaim control over certain areas like military installations uh obviously the nuclear silos and things like that and then from there uh begin to spread out and use technology to kind of subdue the lawlessness. And there would still be large parts of the the US and and the world presumably that's very lawless until um you know at least the the starting of the 70th week. I think that there's going to be a massive amount of lawlessness that happens. So >> people are going to take advantage of the chaos. You know they're going to take advant you know look at just the normal looting and rioting you know after a hurricane. you know, people coming out of Walmart waiting through water like up to their chest and they've got these big flat screen TVs trying to carry them out stuff, you know, like >> if they'll do that now, imagine when there's no kind of repercussion for that, you know?
>> Yeah. No, I agree. I I don't think that um Yeah, I got to thank my wife for turning on the light.
I don't think uh Pete there's going to be a lot of success by any ruling group like our government to control anything in the wake of the rapture. I I think there'll be efforts, but I think it's going to be mass pandemonium and lawlessness to use your word a moment ago.
>> Yeah.
>> Unlike anything ever before. I mean, you think about all the private property, all the homes that are now vacated. you think about uh all the stoves that were left, you know, cooking meals or homes going up in flames. I I think it's going to be an unprecedented time frame when um you know, good intentions might be there, but I don't think they'll be successful. I I I think it's going to be absolutely crazy.
>> Yeah. I mean, that's a good point. Even we know that in the 70th week with the um seal judgment that a quarter of the world's population will die which is you know by today's standard around two billion people but even before that between the rapture and the official start of the 70th week I think the amount of deaths uh that are going to come about from the lawlessness that that spreads after the everything collapses is going to be I mean You're millions, tens of millions probably of people that are killed, murdered, >> they die in crashes, they die because somebody crashed into them or you know people left on the surgery table you know the doctor's raptured and like right in the middle of like a open heart surgery and he's gone and the nurses are like ah we can't do it you know so they're there you know uh so >> I think it's gonna be like it's gonna be a mad max.
>> Yeah absolutely especially like >> mad and What's that?
>> Especially in places like Nevada and Utah, like the desert, the open desert land. Yeah, >> exactly.
>> All right. Uh, this is from Gary Turner.
I've heard there are two Gog and Magog wars. Can you explain why? And do you expect to see one soon?
Um, so we've talked about Gog and Magog, but I think the first one would be after the rapture, but before the 70th week.
And the other reference to Gog and Magog is at the end of the millennial kingdom.
uh and it's simply referred to that is because I think it's in it's in a similar fashion in the direction that all of these enemies against Christ are going to march from every different direction. Gog and Magog being kind of the the the hither the furthermost uh distances from Jerusalem coming and it says in Revelation 20 it's like the sand of the seashore. It's just like so many people are going to march against Christ in in Jerusalem. So it's that overwhelming sense of force that is is what's the connecting tissue between those two events that the whole Muslim world is going to come against Israel and at the end of it the whole world is going to not the whole world a lot of the I guess the youngest generation in the in the millennial kingdom they're going to march against the Lord as well.
Um >> yeah, here's you know I get this question from time to time about the uh the two Gog and Magog and and I have settled on this take the original Gog and Magog which is I believe postrature pre-tribulation what's the one we've talked about Ezekiel 38 and 39 I think that one sets the template there are dynamics within that first event that are then mimicked or they it recalls the original dynamics in the revelation one at the end of the millennial kingdom because obviously you won't have the world structured at the end of the millennial kingdom as it is immediately post rapture uh there will be a very different dynamic of religions in the world as one case in point you won't have overwhelming uh dominant populations of radical Islam at the end of the millennial kingdom.
You will have rebels. The Bible makes that word very clear. But to try to cookie cutter the specifics of Ezekiel 38 and 39 and place them over the dynamics of the end of the millennial kingdom. What I tend to teach right now is that that conflict, and you said it yourself, they're coming from all quarters like the sand on the seashore against what? Against Israel again.
They're coming from every direction as they did before against Jerusalem again.
So it it's language that recalls a previous conflict that is well known.
Uh it's not so much a repeat of the stands, a repeat of Libya, repeat of, you know, Persia, that sort of thing. That's how I see it.
>> I same way. I just think it's similar in the the overwhelming sense of the directions are coming from and the numbers, but >> right.
>> Um, okay. Uh, this is from, uh, keep looking up 11. And this is a question. Genesis 15:13-16 seems to indicate a generation being about a hundred years. I've heard you say that we don't really know how long a generation is. What do you think? Thank you. Yeah. So, I think in scripture we have three different and I don't know the all of the references to them, but a generation being about 25 years, 40 years, and 100 years, >> right? Um, so Genesis 15:13-16.
Then uh this is God. Then he said to Abram, "Know certainly that your descendants will be strangers in a land that is not theirs, and they will serve them, and they will afflict them 400 years."
So this is talking about um Canaan and Egypt. And also the nation whom the whom they serve, I will judge, and afterward shall come out with great possessions.
Now, as for you, you shall go to your fathers in peace, and you shall be buried at a good old age. But in the fourth generation, they shall return here. For the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet complete. So they're getting that hundredyear generation from being the fourth generation after he said it was going to be about 400 years. So it seems to me that there is there is different variations of a generation.
And obviously if you go before the flood, >> you know, a generation is what when you're living for like 900 years.
>> Yeah. So, I I I think that's the the trap that that many fell into in the 1980s, thinking that it was 40 years from 1948.
Um, you could even make the 40-year case from 1967.
And I think 40 years is long since played out. We're now on what 70 is it 78 or 77 years since Israel became a nation again.
>> Yeah, exactly. So the question being the question being uh I guess how long do we have left? Is that the person's understanding?
>> They were just wondering uh if you know that there's different variations for the generation what they're asking what we thought what a generation was. I I think for me the the term generation in so far as that question is concerned has to be interpreted by context. You know, one of the things that uh is frequently talked about is, you know, Jesus's reference to this generation shall not pass away, you know, in the Olivet discourse.
>> And and I think too many people try to, you know, pin the tail on the donkey there with a number. And I'm not necessarily convinced that it's a numerical issue he's driving at. I think what Jesus is driving at there in the Olivet discourse is a population of people that are present to witness those things and he's making reference to that population is they will not disappear.
They will not be eradicated until all these things come to pass. I don't think it's a necessarily a numerical thing in that case.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Um this is from Blake on Facebook.
Uh he says uh but since individuals among the Hebrews aged 20 and older were considered adults capable of military service tithing and were held legally and spiritually responsible for their actions before God. Some believe that 20 will be the age of responsibility.
What do you think of that? And whether or not all people under the age of 20 will be taken in the rapture. So I I I know that if you go if you look go in scripture there's not especially in the New Testament there's not anywhere that says the age of accountability is 13 or 18 or whatever >> right >> it doesn't say that.
>> The only places that you can find ages associated with guilt or innocence is in the Old Testament and primarily in two places and I've talked about this in the past. Exodus 30 uh really verse 12-14 and then numbers 32 primarily in numbers 32:11 and so in Exodus 30 there is a um verse 11 it says then the Lord spake to Moses spoke to Moses saying when you take the census of the children for their number of Israel for their number then every man shall give a ransom for himself to the Lord when you number them there may be no plague among them when you number them. This is what everyone among those who numbered shall give. A half a shekele according to the shekele of the sanctuary. And it says a shekele is a 20 gar, which I don't know what that is or how much that is. The half shekele shall be an offering to the Lord. Everyone included among those who are numbered from 20 years old and above shall give an offering to the Lord. Uh the rich shall not give more than the poor and the poor shall not give less than half a shekele. when you give an offering to the Lord to make atonement for yourselves.
So in this instance, there is a a requirement, a ransom that every man must pay for himself above the age of like 20 and above. And then as Blake alluded to, there was also the requirements for military service didn't begin until you were 20. Um I think even the temple service, you could not work in the temple until until I think you were 30. So there was age requirements in in uh that Moses was told by God to give to the Israelites in terms of how they are supposed to conduct themselves.
Now when we go to Numbers 32, this is uh talking about entry into the promised land. And uh let's see.
Moses said, "Surely none of the men who came up from Egypt from 20 years old and above shall see the land of which I swore to my swore to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob because they have not wholly followed me."
Um so in that case there is uh another point in time where Israel is now being um there is a restriction on the age.
Now this time it's 20 and above cannot go in. So obviously 19 and below would be able to go in. It says nothing of the people from 19 and below. It says nothing of their moral behavior, their moral character.
Doesn't say anything about whether they believe or don't believe. It has it does nothing. It's simply the age is the requirement. They have to be under the age of 19 or 19 and younger to go into the promised land. And in the first instance in Exodus 30, if you were 20 and over, there was a requirement for you to pay a ransom tax for your soul for the atonement, right? This half a shekele.
>> And obviously, it would also include military service and all the other things that is associated with their considered adulthood. So, the biggest push backs I see on this about people saying the age of accountability is way younger, uh, they they mostly go to the age of 13 because that's the age in which in Jewish culture they have the bar mitzvah for the boys and the bat mitzvah for the girls. Well, both the bar mitzvah and the bat mitzvah did not come about until the middle ages. I mean, until like the 12,300s.
>> Uh, so this is not a big biblical concept. that this is something that came along culturally within Jewish culture, you know, 1,200 years after the Bible, after the New Testament. So, that is not a that's not a biblical principle to hang your hat on. Now, with all that said, that's really the only place in scripture that we see um age associated with uh guilt or innocence before God, I guess, in a way to put it that way.
We see in the New Testament, Jesus said, "Forbid not the little children to come unto me, for such is the kingdom." Uh we see a couple of other places alluded to Romans 7 where Paul talks about when he was younger, he was alive and then he came to understand the law. Then he died. He didn't die physically. He died.
He was talking about his spiritual self died. His spiritual man died because he came to understand the that he was guilty of his own sins. Right? So that's so there's a recognition in there. Now I will say this having five kids, five awesome, wonderful kids that they even at a young age at the age of say five, they know right from wrong. They know >> they know it's wrong to kick the dog or they know it's wrong to hit their sister or brother or to do certain things. They know that. What they don't understand at that age and they don't even understand at the age of 16 is the consequences of their actions. And I think back to when I was a 16-year-old and all the stupid things I did and I thought I knew everything, you know, and and that's pretty much all teenagers these days, you know, like think back to your own childhoods and when you were 16 and how much you thought you knew versus how much you actually knew. In a large part, it's because your brain is not yet fully developed. God created us in the way that our brain we could have been, you know, coming out of out of our mother's womb. We could have been born fully conscious and fully cognizant of everything, right? We could have been had the mind of an adult coming out, right? But he didn't. We we were allowed to enter into this world in a state of infancy and our brain as well as the rest of our body had to physically grow and develop over the course of our lives. and that your body not only you're getting taller and bigger and stronger and all that way more, but your brain is also developing. It develops from the really from the from the rear to the front. So the rear is governs all your motor functions and how you walk.
And so as a baby, you know, you're laying on your back and then eventually you figure out how to roll over on your stomach and then you're doing the tummy time and then you learn how to push up and then eventually you can roll back on your back. Eventually you start crawling and then from crawling you walk and then uh you know you're trying to walk you're trying to stand because you don't have your balance yet. So all of that is the back part of your brain. The front part is your prefrontal cortex which is governs all of your critical thinking skills and that takes years. that's shaped by your education, by your culture, by your upbringing, by your uh you know, the things you're exposed to, the things you see, and that forms your worldview. And that in the brain doesn't fully really start to fully develop until you're about your 20. And so, what is salvation based upon? It's based upon our ability to understand that Christ died for our sins and understanding the consequences of our sins and understanding that if we don't change our ways, we're going to go to hell because we're going to be separated from God forever. So that's my thoughts on it. I think that the age of accountability is older, somewhere in the neighborhood of 18, 19.
I don't think it's 13. I don't think it's seven or anything below that. I think uh God created us in a specific way. You know how people say uh well God made me that way. You know they're gay or whatever and oh God made me that. No no God didn't make you gay. God didn't make you a mass murderer. God didn't make you a thief. God we are all born with sin natures. We all have the propensity to do those things if we allow ourselves to do those things.
>> But but one thing that God did do is he created the the process in which our brain develops. So that's 100% him.
Yeah, I have a um I have a slightly different view. Uh but I don't make it about a number, you know. I mean, I've known you and I have talked about your age of accountability view for quite some time. So, I was aware of that. My view, Pete, is that the age of accountability issue is um it varies from person to person. I I'll give I'll give my rationale for that. I came out of the medical background as you know >> and um I saw plenty of what's the politically correct term these days for people that are mentally um um challenged >> on the on the spectrum.
>> Yeah. On the spectrum. Um I saw plenty of adults that were you know in that spectrum. I have to look at many of those cases and say, you know, they're still within the age of accountability because it's not about the age, it's about their comprehension.
Um, you take a child that has cerebral pausy, um, they'll never comprehend.
>> Yeah.
>> Um, I accepted the Lord as my savior at five years old and I fully comprehended because my mother and I had a long conversation one night. I fully comprehended not just the good news of the gospel, but I understood the good news because of the bad news. So I understood the consequences of my sin, my choices, and my eternal fate in hell if I did not choose Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. And I made made that confession in full knowledge at the age of five. And I remember it like it was yesterday. Now that's me at five. Not everybody at five is going to be there.
So where does that where do I end up with you know on this issue? I think it varies Pete from you this is my view. I think it varies depending upon the the individual. Um if you can take an older child that has been you know abused their whole life kept in a closet. I mean, we've read all the stories, you know, in the news, and they have never developed mentally beyond a, >> you know, a toddler.
>> Yeah.
>> Certainly age is no longer an issue for them. It's their mental state as you have, you know, so brilliantly made the case for. But I think the bottom line for me is it varies from person to person depending upon the situation.
You it's really interesting when we take this matter and we look at the rapture who is going to disappear. You know what? A lot of kids are going to be gone.
A lot of young people are going to be gone.
Somewhere in that there is a message God has for the world that remains. I think a lot of pregnant mothers their bellies are going to go flat. Uh there is something there that confounds the you know powerful delusion that Satan is going to impose on a postraure world.
There's going to be some inexplicable dynamics when his fallen angels say, you know, we had to take the obstinate, fuddy, duddy Christians out of here because they refused to evolve to the next level.
Okay. Yeah. What about the kids?
What about the babies that never even had a chance to figure out if they were blue or red? You know, the argument is not going to add up. And I think the age of accountability issue in the grand scheme of things has a brilliant way of God passively throwing a wrench into Satan's deceptive message at that point in time.
>> Does that make sense?
>> Yeah. No, it does. And that's that's a valid the valid points, too. And I I'm certainly I mean, this is just my theory on it. Uh >> Sure. So I I'm not I mean >> I'm kind of dogmatic in a way, but I'm not like it's not one of those things where I'm gonna be like, "Oh, we're never going to be friends again."
Because you don't >> agree with my position.
>> I'm I'm never there. I'm never there.
I'm not dogmatic either.
>> All right, good response. I liked it. Uh let's go to the next one because we have a bunch. Um this is from Gary Turner. Uh with shortages and famine on the horizon, what are some ways we Christians can band together and help each other when we start feeling the results of the shortages?
>> Do you think the question is in reference to what's going on in Iran now? Now, because I'm hearing a lot of people saying that, you know, with oil prices going up and fertilizer, you know, supplies dwindling, >> I suppose it doesn't really matter. How can Christians band together? Um, you know, I've seen many churches try to do this, Pete, and it never works. Um, what I've learned, and in solid bread community, I interface with many, many, many dozens of churches all the time, and I think it's extremely rare that any of them cooperate with another church.
um they tend to be all about nickels and noses.
They're very worried about losing congregants that sit in their pews to another church's pews. I do not typically see churches collaborating very well on anything. And when you wrap into that something that smells as catalogical, when you wrap into that something that has an aura of end times, you know, dynamics, I think they're even more resistant. I think what it comes down to is to answer that person's question, we have to be in good fellowship with other believers regardless of whether they are in our church or not in our church. And I think that is a more closeknit function than churches taking up that cause.
Churches today are not taking up very many good causes very well. You know, they're much more inclined to adopt woke ideas because the government tells them to. They're much more inclined to not saying because, you know, we don't want to spread COVID cies. Um, I don't see churches being very proactive. That is not the nature of the modern church.
uh it is struggling right now just to even get basic doctrinal things in place. And so my suggestion to this person and anybody listening would be have a network of close Christian friends sit down and get together in someone's home an evening or two for a few weeks and talk about a plan. Who's going to do what is does somebody in the group have medical backgrounds and prowess? Is somebody else really good with agricultural things? What about meat processing? I mean, you divvy up the duties and responsibilities and you agree to band together if that kind of a time comes. That would be my recommendation.
>> Yeah, that's good advice. So, wherever you live, um find like-minded believers if that's possible.
>> Yep.
>> Um in one of your Bible studies. I know many people in these groups already kind of uh you know already hang out do stuff together. I mean if something happened here man I'd be going over to Tyler's house in like 5 seconds like no um I would but I I we have a lot of family in the area here so it's kind of we're fortunate in that ways. I know some people don't have that same luxury where they are. So >> um first and foremost trust in the Lord right trust in the Lord that he will provide. I would say even before then uh before the crisis happens have have a certain amount of food stored away.
Canned goods just have it. You you don't have to eat it. You don't have to go full prep prepper but you know try and think of like okay what if the power goes out or what if a hurricane hits or snowstorm whatever the case is. I mean you need to have stuff on hand anyways just to have food in your house and and access to fresh water. That's even more important is the fresh water.
>> Yeah. Um, so >> you know, Pete, you remember that article I wrote years ago, pick a pack of proper preers?
>> Yes. Yes.
>> Um, my wife and I when we moved way way out in the country here in Colorado, I mean, we're we're remote where we live.
I mean, we're way up in the hills, um, the one more house north of us and you're completely off the grid. It's hundreds of thousands of acres between us and the Wyoming border. Um, we live remote, but we have a lot of what you would traditionally call uh the prepper supplies. I mean, food, water filters, you know, everything. We have it all.
Beans, bullets, band-aids, the whole nine yards. But I did not build up that inventory necessarily for me. It's been our prayer since we moved to this place in 2014 that it would all be here along with all of the tracks, the Bible books, the postrapture guides, my curriculums.
We hope that people find it after we're supernaturally raptured because we want this home and all of its resources to be a ministry to those. Obviously, those things are there for us. If we have a economic crunch for a few months or whatever, that's not a problem. But we really didn't do it for us.
>> We we did it we did it in faith for those that we knew would find, >> you know, would come looking to see if we're still here.
I I I kind of I mean I'm leaning for me personally. I mean I I know that we need to have that personal stockage for whatever uh you know again power goes out, hurricane, whatever. You need to have some type of access to food and water if you're going to be shut off from society for a few days. Y >> and I know a lot of people are also prepping for those that come after the rapture that if they find their house that they will find the gospel tracks and the rapture kits and all that as well as food and other practical things that they could use.
>> Um I but I I don't know that we're going to see this massive economic turmoil prior to the rapture of the church. And I I go back to Luke 17 where Jesus was saying it was like the days of Noah and the days of Lot. They had no idea what was coming when it hit them.
Um I think I think if the world were in a state of economic collapse um you know the world would definitely not be in that position of normaly bias or cognitive dissonance where they just think ah you know today's like tomorrow and tomorrow's going to be like yesterday and blah blah no we would all be like super hight I mean look at how look at how uh how much people woke up from 2020 even during the lockdowns like people woke up spiritually from that because of the unprecedented nature of the lockdowns, you know, that the whole world basically shut down. So, um I I think uh Satan is going to try and keep people as fat, dumb, and happy as possible and and and in the dark. And in order for that to happen, he needs the things to stay kind of as they are.
>> I absolutely agree with you. Yep.
>> So, >> I know I >> Go ahead. No, I I just I just want to affirm how much I I agree with what you're saying. I I think that things will remain relatively normal. You know, gas prices will fluctuate up and down, price of eggs, you know, will fluctuate up and down, etc., etc. But I think to your point, um, what Jesus says before, uh, the rapture comes like a thief in the night, um, things are going to be relatively normal. And I don't see us facing a major prepper type crisis pre-rapture. I just don't.
>> Yeah.
>> All right. Um, from Gary again, Steve, what do you know about Elon Musk >> since he's born born in South Africa?
>> Yeah, well, he's a South African like I was raised in. Um, what do I know about him? I I don't know a lot about him. I I know that he was um I mean, his brother just lives right down the road from me in Boulder, Colorado. Um, I I don't trust Elon.
I I think, how do I say this? I got a lot of things going through my head right now. Um, I think Elon is one of the prototypical uh 10 kings.
I am not one of those prophecy scholars that believes it's going to be 10 countries in the EU. Um that you know these are some very traditional views. I'm not there. I I think it's going to be 10 very influential figures that act as kings. I think the Bible's pretty clear about that. They don't have the traditional trappings of a territory. They are given power, you know, like a king would receive power, but that is the image and the dynamic that they hold at that time. Not because they are ruler of some sovereign geography.
And I think Elon Musk fits that very, very well. If we look particularly at the last few uh fraudulent elections in this country, let's just be candid about it. Uh it was the powerful elite that had key technology uh expertise. whether it's the Mark Zuckerbergs, whether it's the, you know, the um the Bezos folks of the world, whether it's, and I'm not saying these guys specifically were culprits, but they represented this technocrat uh model that got behind a political agenda. And I think Elon Musk fits that very, very well. I think he is perfectly positioned right now to in a postraapture scenario have his true colors come out and I think he would lend enormous resources and power to a globalist agenda. That's where I'm at.
>> I I I think that he is if not anything else he's one of the 10 kings.
>> Yep.
Okay. From Steven Randles, Trump said he controls what BB does in a recent interview. Do you think we might be in trouble based on the verse of Cup of Trembling with all that to try and h to try to handle Jerusalem?
I think that Trump uh I think messing with Israel invites trouble, invites divine trouble. So, >> good, bad, or indifferent. I know people have mixed views on BB Netanyahu.
I I just think that regardless that he is the appointed leader that God put in charge of Israel at this time and when we step against Israel, we try to force their hand or put them over a barrel over some type of issue, it doesn't work out. Does not bode well for the United States. So, um, that's the one thing that drives me crazy with Trump, what he's doing is just his his kind of, uh, dismissiveness of Israel and a key ally in the Middle East, the the the main ally in the Middle East to try and get them to do what he wants them to do when they're trying to act in their own self-defense.
He's like, "No, no, you shouldn't fire back when they're launching, you know, missiles into Israel." like no, they absolutely have every right to defend themselves and to go after the perceived threats. So, um I think we get in trouble. We get in dangerous ground when we start messing with Israel like that.
So, >> thoughts?
>> I absolutely agree with you. I mean, you basically take the words out of my mouth. I think Trump is on thin ice right now. I think his posture towards BB Netanyahu lately has been arrogant on the world stage. I do not think that that's a good thing. I think it has been um discouraging uh BBE and Israel to act in their own welfare, their own existential interests. I think that's a stupid thing. Um it has also been alluding to um you know, Israel not really having a right to the territory where she's ultimately going to annex and that's a bad thing. You know, you look at what is it? Joel chapter 3 um where you know Jesus is going to judge all the nations post uh tribulation in the valley and he's going to divide in Matthew chapter 25. It's a parallel passage. He's going to divide the sheep from the goats and and you look at the harshness of what that judgment is all about. A key indication is their attitude not only towards Israel and the Jews, but their desire to divide up the land. And it is a key litmus test for their spiritual integrity. There's no way around it. I I think Trump is playing with fire right now. If I was one of his spiritual adviserss, we'd be sitting down having a long talk looking at um esquetology through an Israeli lens.
And that's the problem is he, you know, he had Robert Jeff, Pastor Jeff, uh and some pretty solid people. Jack Hibbs, I think, had access to him in the first administration. And now it's like Paula White and >> yeah, >> all the the uh post postmillennials who think that that you know the seven mountain mandate and that the United States is going to be around for another 250 years to uh live in the golden age or whatever. Like uh he he's got some bad uh bad wolves uh he definitely does.
And we haven't heard hardly anything from Mike Huckabe. I don't you know not a peep in in the last five or six months.
>> Well, no, he did go on record here in the last couple of days and he's speaking out very Yeah, he I can't remember what he said, but he is uh making it very clear how this current administration needs to stand with Israel. Marco Rubio did the same thing.
It was almost like he and Rubio um were clarifying to the world their own personal embarrassment of Trump's stance right now. That's the way it appears to me. Uh but Huckabe was pretty strongly worded in his pro-Israel stance.
>> That's good to hear that. Um >> that's just in the last couple of days.
Yeah.
>> Yeah. He definitely needs some some reality checks given to him. He needs um Bill Kanik's book Eye to Eye. He may have already had a copy given to him in the last the last term he was in, but uh he needs to go back and revisit that book because whether whether you like it or you don't like it, when the US or any other country begins to mess with Israel, like just bad things start to happen.
>> I totally agree.
>> Okay. Uh from Patrick Hart or the Patrick Hart, Lucifer is a cherub. Were the angelic third that fell with him also cherobam or a mixed class?
Wondering if this ties in with the alien classes, deception, reptile, insect, gray, Nordic, etc. Um, you know, I don't think that uh the one-third of angels that fell with Satan, and by the way, you know, the Bible does not specifically say that that happened. The strongest suggestion is in Revelations 12 >> where it says his tail swept a third of the stars from heaven. Um you look at that and you look at several other passages. I think there's, you know, one in Isaiah and one in uh Ezekiel as well.
You put it all together and the natural conclusion is that Satan took onethird of the angelic hosts with him. I don't disagree with that, but just for the record, the Bible does not explicitly state that. Um, but I think it's mixed.
I I don't think it's all cherub or all saraphim or anything like that. I think that that's um that would be reading too much into a place where scripture is rather silent.
I I would not conclude that. Um, remember Satan showed up in the garden with Eve as a um as a fiery serpent. He was there in the Hebrew term was a nash.
Uh he was a divine illuminated being of a serpentine form and she wasn't a bit surprised to be talking to him. Um but that was a very very high order of angelic creation.
I don't think the Bible suggests that all the other angels of that order were the only ones to go with him. I think it was a mixed bag.
>> Yeah.
I think uh if you look at the living creatures in um Revelation 4 and and beyond uh in other passage, I think also in Ezekiel and Isaiah where the angels that have the face like a lion, the face like an ox, the face like a man, the face like an eagle. Um, it could be that Lucifer uh was over the, you know, all of the realm of like the scaly creatures or like the reptile type of animal, the kingdom, the the class of animals in the same way that like that one angel with all of the the face like an ox.
>> Yeah. be in charge of all like the boine type creatures in the face like an eagle would be the one over all the flying creatures in the Anyways that's a theory I don't know if that's true but he's referred to as that uh that old serpent we know he was the serpent in the garden he's also referred to as a dragon um >> and so it it seems that he is has some kind of connection with with snakes or serpent serpentine type creatures and when you look at Peter's account he says that Satan goes about like a like like a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour.
Not that he is a lion, but like a lion.
>> Correct.
>> But I find what's interesting in Revelation uh 16, 13, and 14 is these froglike creatures that come forth out of the mouth of the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet. If you look at when I think of frog like creatures, I think of like gray aliens. I don't know what that pops into my head, but like >> it seems there is a connection between the the the these things showing up and apparently we're breeding them or I don't know whatever Matt Gates was talking about with um I can't remember who he was interviewing with, but um he was talking >> uh no Matt Matt Gates was talking with uh >> Oh, yeah. Matt, I'm sorry. I know who you're talking about now.
>> Yeah, I can't remember who he was. He was interviewing with somebody, but he he mentioned that an army military guy had come in and briefed him on the the breeding program. Plus, we've heard that from other places as well.
>> Um the thought is is that they are not they're not really living creatures in the sense of uh like us where they have a spirit or whatever. These are more like insects in the sense that they they're like puppets. They're like meat puppets that can move and be controlled, but they themselves are not have a soul or anything like that. So, yeah, I mean, >> can I jump in?
>> Yeah, go ahead.
>> Um, this is uh this is why I brought up Ellie Marzulli's name a second ago. I thought that's where you were headed. Um the Bible teaches uh there are two forms of dark entities out there. Uh there are fallen angels which God created all the angels and then a third became fallen but >> he created all the angels in Job chapter 38. Um but then demons also uh came about. They are not created by God. I personally believe that uh the Bible makes the case. I think obviously the apocryphal books like you know Enoch make a very clear case that the uh demons are the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim giant but with demons on one side and fallen angels on the other you really don't have any other kind of entity in between which raises a lot of questions about the grays as a case in point because you know when UFOs crash and let's be honest um they are nuts andbolts technology uh they have uh abilities that def defy our laws of physics and our time dimension space parameters. But these alien beings, these grays, they die. It's very interesting when you read all the reports, uh when they do the autopsies on them, there's nothing there that resembles anything close to what we would call human organs or human structure. So LA Marzulli's theory, and I think he's probably as spoton as anybody could possibly be at this point, is these are essentially avatars. You called them like a a meat a meat house or a meat puppet.
>> And the question is, um, who are they inhabited by? Uh, the natural presumption is they become a house or a a meat house for demons that are always seeking um a a body to to you know possess. Uh the only potential problem with that that I see is uh I believe that the Bible teaches that demons are wandering spirits that are confined to this earth. So the question goes, well, how far up from this earth is still this earth?
Um, and the demons don't have access to heavenly realms the way angels do. Um, can angels possess a body?
Yes. Look, remember when Satan entered Judas?
>> Um, it's just not their norm.
>> They don't need to.
>> But they don't need to. That's right.
They don't need to because they have the ability to physically manifest any way, shape, or form that they want. But I personally, if I had to take a stabbing guess right now, I think the grays and the little ugly alien creatures that we see are basically what La Marzulli says.
They're basically an avatar inhabited by demons.
>> Yeah. And I would even I would even say that the uh the Nordics could be the fallen angels themselves because they are >> Yeah, they could they are um they can possess a human form just like holy angels can possess human form and and pass amongst us and we don't even recognize that they're they're really angels. You know, entertaining angels unaware. Presumably, if fallen angels can have that same capacity that they also can take on human form and take on the form of a an extremely tall Nordic looking person, you know, just to present the facade that they are >> from some ancient, you know, or future civilization like they're us but in future time or us in past or whatever the case is >> and they can kind of present themselves that way.
I I definitely think that immediately or very quickly after the rapture there is going to be a return of fallen angels into the sphere of human existence. I think that when you look at all of the evidence and you tie all of the complimentary parts of scripture together, I think that is the prevailing uh obvious view.
I think it is as it were in the days of Noah. It's Daniel chapter 2 verse 43.
They will mingle themselves with the seed of men. And I think the fallen angels are going to return to appeal to all different kinds of cultures around the world. The Nordics is a great case in point, but that's probably not the way they're going to show up in the Aboriginal uh portions of um of Australia. You know, they're not going to show up as Nordics in the dark part of Africa. I don't think I think they will adjust themselves to appeal to and to deceive as many cultures as they can at the same time.
>> Yeah. And that's that's what's interesting about this disclosure movie is it's not like Independence Day where the things are coming out of the sky, but they're here already in in people that we know seem to be uh able to manifest these things somehow or you know like the I guess on the clip on the trailer where the reporter is talking then all a sudden she's kind of freezes up and she's like makes all the clicking noises and stuff and um I don't know. So to me, if you look also at like uh Mitch McConnell, Senator McConnell when he was on camera, gosh, I don't know, this is six months ago, maybe eight months ago, he just he just like freezes up and he just like, you know, the lights are on but nobody's home kind of thing.
>> And I think there was a glitch with his whoever the demonic host was switching out or something, taking a break or something because he was just like blank slate.
>> Yeah. No, I remember that. Well, um, have you seen that movie, by the way?
Disclosure, >> is it out? I don't know. I haven't seen it yet.
>> I I was under the impression it was either out now or just about to be out, so maybe I'm my question is premature.
Let me ask the question this way. Do you plan to see it?
>> I don't know. I don't know. Um, I've got mixed uh feelings on seeing it, but I'm I I guess I I don't know. I'll I'll let I'll let the the folks come out and you hear kind of I always like get the reviews of stuff after a movie comes out usually before I go see something.
>> So, >> I'm talking about it with my wife. We haven't decided yet.
>> Yeah, I think that uh between Stephen Spielberg this and then other folks coming out saying that this disclosure is going to shake the faith of a lot of people. Um, I mean, I don't think it's going to shake my faith and I don't think it's going to shake your faith or this audience's faith, but >> um, and that's why churches need to talk about this stuff because it to warn people about what's going to happen. And so many churches are completely tonedeaf to what's happening right now that that there's going to be people in their congregations that are going to have to >> to wrestle with this decision and they may go turn to their pastor and their pastor's like, "Well, I don't know. I don't And so then they're going to go to YouTube and they're going to listen to some influencer and some influencers like, "Yeah, this is our our space brothers. They're ancient astronauts or whatever that seeded this planet millions of years ago." And so I could see I could see a lot of people turning off that way and just kind of following because their pastors refuse to talk about it. People are going to get answers from somewhere.
>> I think most churches today, the vast majority are very very poorly equipped to deal with this whole dynamic.
um they they have turned and looked the other way for so long. They don't understand esquetology. They don't understand Bible prophecy. They have they they call everything demonic that they don't want to understand. Uh I think the church is fantastically poorly equipped is how I will say it to deal with this.
>> Nicely put.
>> Okay. uh from uh Kathy Marie. Do you believe that the rapture will follow a catastrophic event such as nukes going off?
Um if they go off, they would be going off like right at the same time, I think, not prior to it. I think again I I think 1 Thessalonians 5 is pretty clear that when they say peace and safety, then sudden destruction will come upon them like labor pains on a woman. So, I think that things are going to be fairly normal and >> yeah, I do too.
>> And then it's going to hit the world and then maybe right then and there or right after there there's going to be stuff kicking off like crazy. But I think it's going to catch the world largely by surprise. And I've read a lot of the the um what are they calling the National um >> Inquirer?
No, the uh the national uh council of I don't know, they put them out every 10 years, they do like these forecasts on what are the big threats that they're forecasting for the next 10 years.
>> Oh yeah. Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
>> Council, intelligence council or whatever. But anyways, and all of the scenarios where they look at like what's these ex existential threats to to humanity or whatever and it doesn't matter where you go look at them.
Everywhere you look, nobody I mean, none of these groups ever talk about the rapture as being a possibility. I mean, they'll talk about aliens, they'll talk about asteroids hitting the Earth, they'll talk about a super solar storm.
I mean, all this other stuff, but it it truly will catch this world off guard because they they don't take it seriously. This is like a joke to them.
So, >> yep, I absolutely agree. I and I think unfortunately as much as it concerns me to say it, I don't think that most of the church is looking for the rapture.
>> Oh, no.
>> Um, you know, I I teach these long long long series on Bible prophecy. They're 90 weeks in length. You know, I've taught them over and over now. And I will tell you that every time I begin a series and we promote it within a wide region, um I am never attacked more. I am never reviled and ridiculed more than when I teach the pre-tribulation rapture. And that is coming from the church.
>> Yeah.
>> We're not talking about, you know, the unsaved folks out there on the street.
I'm talking about the church. Uh for some reason uh Pete the um well second Peter chapter 3:es 3 and four um where is this coming he promised you know ever since our you know forefathers lived bottom line is they're attacking the notion that God could come imminently at any time and take a church out of here.
And so I think the church is very poorly equipped uh to handle that when it happens.
Very well put. Um, okay. From Elizabeth Wright, question. Possible rapture this year, tribulation in 2027, 2030 reveals Antichrist and the second coming in 2033, which would be jubilation, jubilation, and 2,000 years of resurrection. What say you? I say I don't know. I say, uh, we know that we were in the season. Uh, but I I certainly am not going to be we had the final four. It ends this year. So, if this this was my kind of thing I was thinking about for years and years. So, if if this doesn't pan out, I I it's not going to shake my faith, but I I know that we're super close and that we're in that window of time and how exactly close it'll be. I I just think I'm convinced that 2033 has to factor in somehow because I don't think the 2000th anniversary is going to go unnoticed.
But Lee Brandard makes a good point in terms of like u relative closeness to something, right?
So, is it going to be exactly in 2033 that some prophetic event happens or 2026 or 2027?
We don't know. But we we see all the signs. I mean, we know it's going to storm. The cloud the clouds are rolling up. The winds, you know, blowing. The clouds are getting dark. the, you know, weather radar is showing signs of of, you know, lightning activity and the the the charge in the atmosphere. You could smell the rain in the air. Like, you know, the storm is coming. Exactly. When is it going to start pouring down rain?
I don't know. So, we just know we're close.
>> Yeah, I would uh agree with everything you're saying. I would just add a couple of other related thoughts. In fact, it was you a couple years ago that used a phrase that I've gafted from you several times since, and that is we're running out of runway.
>> Um, we are definitely running out of runway. And I feel like right now I'm not a date setter. Not at all. Not even close. But I think we are called to be season watchers as you say. And as I study and understand the seasons and all related scriptures, Pete, I have a hard time seeing us be here, you know, beyond five years.
>> I just do. I'm not I'm not saying that that's a definitive God- orained window. I'm just telling you, I have a hard time seeing us here beyond the next five years. Um I just can't imagine it.
Even even if you take uh all the theological and esqueological stuff away, if you simply look at the technology that they're racing to um implement, whether AGI, I mean, we're already at AGI now. So, I mean, it could be very soon that ASI kicks off. And when that happens, it's it's going to change everything on Earth. And so, I don't know. I there's just so many other things happening right now that that this world is not sustainable in its current form. It's just it's unraveling too quickly. So if >> you did you've mentioned a couple of times something and I just want to uh unders >> you mentioned a couple of times something and I just want to underscore it. You've mentioned the 2033 year. You feel like that's going to be very significant. I agree with that. Um, exactly what happens with that, >> I don't know.
>> But like you, I believe that that can't come and go without some major ripple in the pond. I I think it has to be significant in some respect.
Yeah, it it feels like uh also watching Israel, watching how close they are getting to um starting to take control of the Temple Mount as well as annex Judea and Samaria. I feel like I honestly I feel like what change there's been some some major uh pivot points in the in the world that have when they when they happen there's no going back to the way things were before. So 911 would be one of those cases. Another one would be obviously co 2020 with COVID and the lockdowns and the world shutting down in the way that it did. Not that CO in and of itself was that you know the the mortality rate on that was actually not bad at all. I mean it was like uh I don't know 54% or something. But um it's the way that the world all shut down at the same time. Like everything shut down. And that to me was like something that had never happened before. And another thing would be then Israel on October 7th. I mean that that changed the middle that's going to change the Middle East forever. So um there's these certain time certain dates that have come and gone that are prophetically significant in a way that none of us foresaw coming.
>> Yeah.
>> You know, I don't know. I I studied about pandemics and stuff simply because of the military and and uh you know I'm in I was in medical service which is a a branch of off of the medical department within um the US Army. But you know in that training and stuff and all the training we study a lot about the pandemic you know going back to the Spanish flu and all the way everything that's happened since then chemical warfare biological warfare and all the other stuff. So, I knew it was certainly a possibility, but I didn't know it was going to happen the way it did, and I don't think anybody else did really.
>> No.
>> Um, okay. Uh, let's see. To the dude, do you think the verse that says, "If possible, even the elect would be deceived," is a verse referring to the rapture being before that deception.
>> Um, I got to think about the question again. The verse, if the elect would be deceived, is it referring to to the rapture being before the that before that deception occurring.
>> Yes, implying it.
>> Yeah.
>> Uh I think it implies it. I'm I'm not going to be super dogmatic about that, but yes, I do think the rapture needs to happen uh first in order for the great deception to then wax from that point. I I there are degrees of deception happening right now. I mean, I I read a study the other day where um more Christ no, excuse me, more people believe in the existence of aliens than now believe in the existence of God. And that was a staggering thing to to hear. But what we are seeing is the world, including the church right now, is being prepared for the great deception. And I think when the rapture happens, uh, the delusion that follows it, I believe it's with the return of fallen angels. I believe they're going to claim they put us here on planet Earth. I mean, I'm seeing that stuff being said on mainstream news right now. There are newscasters out there right now having casual conversation on the camera and they're letting it be known that this is what they believe. Um, so I I think it requires the rapture first.
That's that's how I would land right now. And then I think the uh delusion is going to be so strong because seeing is believing. That's how we operate as human beings. And when you see fallen angelic figures showing up like Nordics and these beautiful superhuman, you know, iterations, I think people are going to be convinced by what they see. And >> yeah, that's how I that's how I see this shaken out.
Yeah. You know, it's funny too because I think in relation to this, although I don't really ascribe any of the Olivet discourse to the church, I think we're seeing the beginning parts of it. And I think that of all the people that are out there talking about disclosure, that are talking about all the things happening in the world, the Christians, the Christians who study are students of Bible prophecy largely are the only ones that have a an accurate understanding of what's actually happening. So, uh, uh, yeah, I, you know, and honestly, I think if Satan were really going to deceive the world purely with aliens, they would all be like, you know, blonde bombshells coming down like seducing men, like, you know, uh, superm models, you know, they wouldn't look like little disgusting insects or or reptiles or whatever. They would come down in some way that would So, there is some purpose that they're these things are coming down in the forms that they are. I agree with that >> and I just want to add that I agree with what you're saying. Uh the Olivet discourse I do not believe is geared towards the church. Yeah.
>> Um, in in proper context, it's Jesus talking to a Jewish culture with u Jewish references, you know, like the Sabbath, um, you know, the temple. There there's there's references he's making to a Jewish population. It is not about the church. But, um, I think there are going to be many who will be actively deceived in the wake of the rapture. I I just I think that's going to put the nail in the coffin, not only for those who still find themselves in the churches they had always attended, but I certainly think for the uh apostate Jews which remain.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. Uh from Catlin or from Tim Tempate, I don't know how to say that. Tempatate.
Uh 4685. Are we who are are we who are raptured only only live in heaven for seven years and then live on the earth for a thousand years?
Um >> go ahead. I'll let you go first.
>> I can tackle that. Yeah. So, let me just wade into this by saying we need to correct our view of heaven. Um we have this idea that we're all going to live in heaven forever and ever. um sit on the edge of a cloud and strum a harp if we're believers in Jesus Christ. That's not biblical. Um heaven or paradise or Abraham's side or Abraham's bosom, these are all synonymous terms used in scripture uh for heaven. But what is the role of heaven right now? Heaven has a role. If you and I tonight uh Pete were to be taken out for some reason, we would go to heaven. It is functioning right now. We would go there as souls.
That's the real us.
But heaven will not serve a purpose after the end of the tribulation time frame.
Um, heaven is not where we live forever.
We will come down to earth at that point. We will reign and rule with Jesus during the millennial kingdom on this earth after which point he destroys this heaven and this earth and he creates a new heaven and new earth. Uh but we will in one way or another I'll use the phrase long term in the long term of eternity we're not sitting on clouds in heaven. We're on a newly reconstituted earth.
That is where we will be. So heaven in the traditional sense is short-term if I could put it that way.
>> Yep.
>> Also, um if somebody were to die right now, you would you would your body right now is considered a tent. And you know how flimsy a tent is, right? So your body and your mortality is considered a tent.
>> You would be without a body in heaven until the rapture. So you would be naked. And then Paul talks about this um and so does Peter uh 2 Corinthians 5 starting in verse one. It says, "For we know that our earthly house, this tent is destroyed.
We have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
For in this we grown earnestly desiring to be clothed with our habitation which is from heaven, meaning our glorified form. Correct.
>> That what that occurs at the rapture. If indeed we have been clothed, we shall not be found naked. So that means that we are without body, without any type of a physical covering. For we who are in this tent grown, but being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed it, but that mortality may be swallowed up by life. And then uh also Peter addresses the same issue with regard to this body being like a tent.
So the thing is is that when you're if you die before the rapture and you go to heaven, you're in a you're in your soloulish form which is attached with your spirit. And that's the real that's the real you that will live forever. The body will go into the grave or cremated or whatever.
>> And then at the rapture, your physical form is reconstituted and given and you're put into this immortal glorified body that will never age, never die, never get sick, never get boooos, never get gray hairs or love handles or warts or freckles or whatever. you're going to be this perfect version of yourself forever.
>> And I I agree too that that heaven is a >> we all got to think too that the seven years like we get raptured and let's say we get raptured on one day and then the next day the tribulation starts which I don't think that it happens exactly like that but let's just say that it did.
>> You're not gonna you're you're seven years in heaven is not going to feel like seven years. I mean you're stepping out of time into eternity. So time is a a whole different kind of animal in that scenario because there is no time yet God still reckons and deals in time. So there is an understanding of time but yet you're not bound by time in the eternal realm. I think it's a little uh you know abstract thinking when you start thinking about like the bootstrap paradox and all that you know just being you know John seeing the elders there or seeing all the people around the throne seeing the future and we would be in heaven at some point and we would see John there >> looking at the people in the future you know even though that he wrote about it ago So, what do we think about >> the the the main thing I try to contend with as I as I teach on heaven in this series is uh the loose understanding in the church that we're going to be in heaven for all eternity with Jesus. No, that's not true. True. Heaven in the traditional sense uh even with eternity in in perspective, heaven in the traditional sense is short term because we will be on this earth not only for the millennial kingdom but then we will be on a new earth in the new heavens and new earth.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. You like that?
>> Yeah.
>> Okay.
>> I do.
>> Oh, Pete will have his mullet and sideburns. Oh, I see that. Okay.
I'm gonna have sideburns one day and a big handlebar mustache if nothing else >> really.
>> So, I got a couple questions for you on this issue.
>> Okay.
>> How old will How old will we all be in heaven?
>> Uh, probably my age right now. Like 25, 26.
>> Oh, yeah.
>> Why is your nose getting longer?
>> I face this question. Let me let let me let me give you a short story about the age thing because I' I've done a lot of books with Terry James and we have another book coming out here shortly and Terry had a widowmaker heart attack back I guess when he was in his early 70s >> right >> and so he's in the ambulance he see he feels himself coming out I think he's written about this quite a bit but he feels himself coming out of his body and he can see himself there he's already coded out he's clinically dead at this point he sees the paramedics everybody's kind of working on him and he's immediately into heaven and he sees young people there. They're all in their like 20s. All everybody's in their 20. Beautiful. And this is again they're in their spirit form right now because they don't have their bodies yet because the rapture hasn't happened yet. But he sees a woman come towards him. This beautiful blonde woman comes over towards him and he instantly knows who she is. And she was his Sunday school teacher when he was a young boy and she was in her 70s or 80s. I mean she was she was aged at that point in his life and he hadn't seen her in 70s something years but he instantly knew who she was and she was in her perfect form I guess you know her >> right >> perfect age or whatever so I think that that's you know amongst other near-death or out-of- body experience what people that have gone and I'm talking about the the verified cases that people like >> there's thousands of cases where people and it's verified died, you know, six ways from Sunday. They were clinically dead. A woman was dead for like 30 minutes under a a waterfall, trapped under a waterfall. Underwater. Um, they all kind of say the same thing that people are in this young, like 20s, I guess, age.
>> Yeah.
Yeah. That's what I believe, too. I, you know, I could be persuaded that we would roughly be in the early 30, uh, thing just because that's when Jesus ascended to heaven. But I do concur with what you're saying. I think it's a younger form.
>> Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay. Uh we've got a couple left here.
>> Okay.
>> Actually, I got one one left >> from Scarlet Wool. During the millennial kingdom, Jesus will literally sit on the throne of Jerusalem to reign for a thousand years. Believers will rule with him. Will we have geographic assignments or responsibilities?
>> Oh, I'd love to answer that one if I could. Um, I tell my classes I teach all of them that I currently right now regularly pray for great responsibility in the kingdom.
One of my prayers right now has been this way for a long time is that I will not be a bystander to all the roles and responsibilities, jobs and duties. I pray today for great responsibility in the kingdom.
What will that look like? I don't know, Pete. We've all been made with different gifts and abilities. You have gifts and abilities I don't have. Vice versa. I think some of those things will constitute us moving forward.
I think your interests, your abilities, your talents will somehow manifest in your glorified body in the kingdom. And I think you will have duties related to how God made you. And will that be a large geography?
Um, I don't know. Uh, will it be more policy related? I don't know.
Um, but I do believe that we will all be assigned key job descriptions to put it that way.
>> Yeah, I'm looking up uh Luke 19 17.
Okay.
So Jesus talking here the parable of a long journey.
>> Yep.
>> Uh >> yeah. The parable of talents.
>> Talents. Yeah. A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive himself a kingdom and to return. So he called 10 of his servants, delivered them 10 miners, and said to them, "Do business until I come." That's where you get this idea of like occupying until he comes.
But his citizens hated him and sent a delegation after him, saying, "We will not have this man to reign over us." And so was it that when he returned, he having received the kingdom, he then commanded these servants to whom he had given the money to to be called to him, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. Then came the first, saying, "Master, your miner has earned 10 miners." And he said to him, "Well done, good and faith good servant, because you were faithful in a very little, you have authority over 10 cities." And the second came saying ma master your minina has earned five miners. And likewise he said you will have you will also be over five cities.
Then another came saying master here is your minina which you have kept which I have kept put away in a handkerchief.
For I feared because you are an austere man. You collect what you did not deposit and reap what you did not sow.
And he said to him out of your own mouth I will judge you. You wicked servant.
You knew that I was an austere man collecting what I did not deposit and reaping what I did not sow. Why then did you put not put my money in the bank that at my coming I might have collected it with interest? And he said to those who stood by, take the miner from him and give it to him who has 10. But they said to him, Master, he has 10 miners.
And for I say to you that to everyone who was who will that to everyone who has will be given, and from him who does not have even what he what he has will be taken away from him.
bring here those enemies of mine who did not want me to reign over them and slay them before me.
So, pretty harsh parable, but I think that the truth underlying that is that in this life, we're each given talents.
>> Yep.
>> And abilities and giftings and whatever that is, and it's different for each of us, and we're not all held to the same results. we're we're held to the same uh standard with regard to how we um how we do those like how do we execute he's he's judging us by our our um >> attitude and diligence >> our attitude our diligence and and our um blanking on the word here on our in our heart and in our mind and wanting to do those things because you can do good things and still have uh you know bad motives, you know, but if you have the right motives and you're you're in tune with the Holy Spirit and he said, "Hey, do do this thing, >> feed this poor guy or help this family out or share the gospel with this person or give this person a hug, whatever the case is, being responsive to the Holy Spirit is what we're charged with doing." And so if your gifting is singing and you refuse to sing or if your gifting is >> teaching or writing or or charity or or some other thing, >> um like I don't think my gifting is is prophecy. I have I have a a decent understanding of it, but I don't think that's my gifting. I think my gifting has always been encouragement to be an encourager.
And at times I don't feel like I'm a very good encourager. And so am I held to that standard of of of encouragement regardless of what I know intellectually? Um, I would think that I don't know. I I all I know is that God is our perfect judge. He's perfect and his judgment will be perfect.
>> Now, to those I think uh to the ones that the one that did not do anything with the money but sat on it. Um, I know there's a question and I don't know where you stand on this, but like there's this idea about Christians being ca cast into outer darkness. Um, what what is your thoughts on that? I know Chuck Mistler had posited that in his book uh the kingdom and the glory which did not get received very well. Um but what are your thoughts on that?
>> Um you know I I let me back up and take a running start at answering. If by Christian we mean somebody that has placed their full faith and trust in Jesus Christ for their salvation, I don't see anywhere in God's word where it makes a clear case that they're cast out into darkness. I just don't see it.
>> Yeah. I don't >> um I I I mean even those who are tried at the beac seat and everything burns up like wood, hay and stubble. Even there they come through Paul says as if by fire.
They basically smell like smoke to put it you know um you know figuratively but uh at the same time they have the blessing of being in the fellowship uh of heaven. I I just don't see if we are saying that a Christian is somebody who has it who has gained full and true salvation. No, I I do not see where the Bible supports the idea that they're cast into outer darkness. I just don't see it.
>> I don't either. And I think some of the uh the difficulties comes when the church begins to apply things in the gospels uh solely to the church. We got to remember that the gospels are though they're in the New Testament. They are really recording the last moments of the Old Testament which is the life of Christ. Because we know at >> it takes the death of the testator for that new that New Testament to go into effect. So after the crucifixion is where we start the church. That's when the the the dispensation of the church begins. And that's not to say that that's not to say that the gospels aren't applicable to us. Everything in scripture is is applicable in the sense of that we can take and learn from those things, but not everything is directly appointed to us. You know, everything is for us in scripture, but not everything was written directly to us. And so the laws in the Old Testament, the uh you know, I would even say parts of the the gospel aren't applicable to the church because when Jesus was do giving in his ministry, the church hadn't come yet.
The church wasn't even it was a mystery.
It people didn't even understand what that meant. In Jesus referring to the church age in Matthew 13. I think this is the one of the clear cases we can see of the church being referenced is in the mystery that the church is the kingdom kingdom in mystery form but not in its realized form or not in its final form.
And so we are in we we are in >> I call it spiritual uterero right now because I don't believe that the church was born on Pentecost. I believe the church was conceived at Pentecost and we've been in spiritual uterero ever since. We're waiting to be born as it talks about in Romans 8 at the rapture of the church and that is when we'll be born the sons of God u in in that proper context of being in our mortal glorified bodies at that point. U now to to kind of backtrack way back to the beginning.
We talked about Mormons and how Mormons believe in exaltation that they will become gods in our glorified forms. We are not gods. We are not we will never be gods.
>> No, >> we are we are simply uh children of God and we share in his in his he we have to be like him in a certain regard just to be able to live in his presence but not right and >> it's not anything that we do and it's not because we become our own deified persons or anything like that. That's not it at all.
>> Um but we do have a glorified body that we get at the rapture of the church. So I think right now the church is in utero, spiritual uterero. And um it's it's it's when you look at the gospels, look at Matthew had a particular audience he was trying to get to. Mark had a particular audience he was getting to. Luke had a particular audience. And we call those the synoptic gospels. Matthew to the Jews because it's very Jewish nature. And it also points to Jesus being the rightful heir of the tribe of the line of tribe of Judah and the one that is rightful heir to David's throne. Then you look at Mark has no genealogy. Uh it's very actionfocused.
It's got a kind of a gentile audience in mind, a Roman audience in mind. Luke is written to the Greeks with a probably the most in-depth uh look at Jesus as a man, the humanity of Christ in there. And also even in the genealogy, it traces back to Adam rather than Abraham as it does in in Matthew.
And then we have the last gospel which I believe is to the church and that's the gospel of John which John then is uh I think written in the 80s of the first century. the last gospel written I believe >> and John starts off with the deity of Christ and it's very very focused on uh the message in there is what we glean from that is what we look to for like uh salvation John 3:16 I mean for God so loved the world and on and on so everything in John is seems to be with the church audience in mind he's writing it >> you know the church has already been established now for some 40some years at this point and he's thinking about that with the Holy Spirit guiding him to write it with the church audience in mind rather than trying to prove the case to the Jews that Jesus was the Jewish Messiah that they they they crucified.
>> Um so >> anyways, any any closing thoughts? Any >> um I just want to make sure that uh you let your audience know that you're going to be with us out here in Colorado in September.
Um, I'd like to Yep, there you are.
So, we have Pete Garcia showing up with Lee Brainer, Gino Jerase, Brandon Hullhouse, and Mondo Gonzalez. And you can see the dates there. It's uh September 11th and 12th. It's Friday and Saturday. It's only 40 bucks, but um we have sculpted this particular conference to have a particular theme, awake and aware.
And um tickets are already selling.
They're selling well and um looking forward to it. We always try to do a bang up professional job.
Um love to have any one of your followers uh run out here to see you live, Pete.
>> Yeah, this is uh Fort Collins is uh north of Denver, correct?
>> Correct. We're about an hour north of Denver. Yep.
>> All right. So if you guys >> Yeah, >> it's a beautiful time of the year because honestly right about this particular time um you know like Rocky Mountain National Park is just 45 minutes away and all the aspen turn gold. I mean that's Estus Park. I mean this is a ridiculously beautiful time of the year. So it's a good time to come to Colorado.
>> When was it last time? What time of year was it last time when Malia and I came?
>> You guys came out for that one day deal.
Um gosh I can't remember. Uh Pete, I'd have to go to my website or which by the way is another thing we I would just encourage your folks to do is go to solidbread community.com.
You can actually we have that link there of you and uh Lee uh under the uh special events.
>> Yeah, that was a really good I really enjoyed that time and meeting everybody there. I thought that was fantastic. I wish conferences, more conferences were like that where there was just more uh just the interaction that we had. I think it was different from a lot of the other type of conferences I've gone to or spoken at.
>> We will have Yeah, we will have a lot of that. You know, we've designed a number of things into our conferences that are typically not done. We offer a Q&A after each session for a real brief time.
um everybody wants to ask a question, we only get maybe two or three in and it's on to the next speaker. But we try to make it very interactive. We lay out the logistics of the event so there's lots of opportunity to meet people and to it's not cramped. It's it's very well done. So be a good time.
>> All right, guys. I will uh post this also under the description as soon as we're done here. And then uh so that's going to be September 11th and 12th. Uh also if you're in the Dallas Fort Worth area this weekend, I will be at the the church in McKenna. Let me see if I can pull this up. I don't even see Lamb and Lion.
I think it's Lamb and Lion or Christ in Prophecy.
I don't know. Okay, it's Lamb and Lion Ministries, but then the website is Christ in Prophecy. It gets a little confusing. Uh, let's see. Events. Oops.
>> Is that with Dr. Nathan Jones?
>> Yes. Uh, Nathan Jones and um let me actually pull this up here.
>> Well, tell them hi for me.
>> Oh, yeah. For sure.
For sure. Um, let's see.
This is where is the promise of his coming? That's what it is. Um, let me see if I can share this real quick.
Share screen.
>> Okay.
Uh, so Friday, June 12th, and then Saturday morning and afternoon, June 13th at the Brook Haven Church in McKenna, Texas.
uh key passes second Peter 3 uh $20 registration fee. I don't know if they I guess they are doing a free live stream of the conference on their YouTube channel and it's me I don't know who Jake Herbert is but he's from ICR and I think he's talking on um if I'm not mistaken he's talking on uh living to be 900 years old or something something it sounds pretty fascinating whatever it is and then Nathan Jones and Tim Moore will be there so and then there's a special singer I don't know how to say her last name Paris Pierce pairs. Um, so anyways, but yeah, I'll be on around 10:45 that morning talking about the tyranny of the present and um I think that's it. Um, okay. Well, hey, uh, Steve, thanks for coming on tonight. It was a long one. It was almost all exclusively Q&A with the exception of the Mormon stuff at the beginning. But, uh, I look forward to seeing you in September, Lord willing, if we're still here.
>> And, um, >> I am, uh, super pumped about coming back there and being with your fine folks again. And if anybody's in the area, Colorado area, um, come on down. So, >> yeah, appreciate it, Pete. Really enjoyed it.
>> All right, hang out real quick. Let me say goodbye to everybody. Thank you moderators for collecting all the questions. Uh, thank you guys for hanging out for another Monday Night Live. I will be on uh the next thing I'm on is uh I think next week uh so next Monday I'll be on with Tom Hughes. Hope for our times uh 4 to 5 and then I'll do my Monday night live. My normal time would be 8 o'clock and I think that Wednesday or Thursday I'll be on with Lauren from Certainty for Uncertain Time. So more to come. I'll post this stuff under the the description for the show notes. Um, but thank you guys for hanging out. God bless you all and uh we'll talk to you real soon.
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