Biology? Never heard of them! || JOVAN DEBATES

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-11

[00:00:00]All right, coming up is Anthony from North Carolina. Anthony is calling to talk about uh trans men and women being men and women. Anthony, if you can hear me, please provide me with your age and pronouns.

[00:00:20]>> Uh 24 and I'm a male. He I think I don't really know about the pronoun stuff.

[00:00:27]>> Okay. Well, just for the third grade English lesson, yes, you would use he him pronouns if you're if you're a man.

[00:00:34]>> Yeah. All right. Well, I disagree that male uh trans women and men are men and women. I think that your chromosomes depict that I think the day that we can >> Okay.

[00:00:46]>> I was I was thinking about it. The day we can change chromosomes in somebody then >> Yeah. The day we can implant a uterus and that person can have a baby. Yeah.

[00:00:56]Maybe. But as of now, I don't bet you to >> I don't >> Anthony, let's just start at the beginning here. Your claim is that your chromosomes predict your gender and your gender is tied directly to your chromosomes. Is that correct?

[00:01:10]>> Uhhuh.

[00:01:11]>> Great. What chromosomes are required for me to possess to be a man?

[00:01:18]um to for you to be a man is um I don't want to tell you the wrong thing, but males are XY and women are XX.

[00:01:29]>> Great. Okay, great. And this is a necessary requirement to be a man is I have to have XX or I'm sorry, XY chromosomes because that would make me male. That would make me a man. This is required. All All men on this planet have XY chromosomes.

[00:01:45]Yeah, I would believe so. Yeah.

[00:01:47]>> Okay, great.

[00:01:48]>> That's what we were taught in Was that not what you we were taught in science class?

[00:01:52]>> It might have been what we were taught in science class.

[00:01:55]>> Science class.

[00:01:56]>> My next question for you, can men give birth?

[00:02:01]>> No.

[00:02:02]>> Great. I don't know if you have the ability to look at the screen. Um, you might not. So, this is something you might have to go back and look at um after the fact. Hey, I don't But are we talking about born a man giving birth?

[00:02:16]I'm not talking about a woman who decided to call herself a man and then had a baby.

[00:02:22]>> You got to you got to be patient. You got to be patient. I promise everything will be explained. So on the screen right now at this date and time is a case report of pregnancy and delivery in a patient with pure 46xy karotyping summary of actual knowledge about XY women. So some women are born with XY chromosomes. They have XY chromosomes.

[00:02:45]Uh it is and this one has pure 46 XY chromosomes. Some women have this. So uh by the way chat, what you just saw is my new source document I'm working on. It's going to be it's slow bill, but it's coming. Uh so pregnancy and delivery in a patient with pure 46 XY chromosomes.

[00:03:01]Now you told me something that I'm a bit confused about. So this is somebody who has XY chromosomes and they gave birth.

[00:03:09]They got pregnant and they gave birth.

[00:03:10]Now, you told me that only >> men it was a woman or it was a woman was born a woman. I'm not >> I'm we're we're getting technical into I'm saying like straight up commentary.

[00:03:23]>> I'm not saying I'm not saying they're one in a million. They're one in a million with a special chromosome.

[00:03:30]>> Anthony, you have to listen. The reason you're confused is because you're not paying attention to me right now. Okay.

[00:03:36]This person has a pure 46xy karotyping.

[00:03:42]Okay. They have a uterus.

[00:03:45]>> They have a vagina.

[00:03:48]>> They got pregnant via IVF.

[00:03:52]And they gave birth out of their uterus.

[00:03:55]>> What, sir?

[00:03:56]>> IVF. In vitro fertilization.

[00:04:00]>> Okay. So, it's not natural. Okay.

[00:04:02]>> I'm sorry. Would would what does that matter? There are plenty of cisgender women who give birth via IV.

[00:04:07]>> No, I was just >> Yeah, I was just wondering what you were saying. Yeah, I know. I was just understanding what that meant.

[00:04:13]>> So, in my mind, I classified it as not natural.

[00:04:16]>> This person >> got pregnant, >> carried the pregnancy for 9 months, then gave birth.

[00:04:25]>> Okay, >> they have Y chromosomes.

[00:04:30]Okay, they are a female who has andro or they are they are a a cisgender woman who has androgen insensitivity syndrome, >> right?

[00:04:40]>> They have AIS.

[00:04:41]>> So even though they have XY chromosomes, >> right? Um >> they had androgen sensitivity syndrome and they had swire syndrome. So even though >> they fe they had male chromosomes, they still got pregnant, they still gave birth. This conflicts with a few things you said. You said, >> "Okay, >> men only men can have XY chromosomes and no men can give birth."

[00:05:06]>> Okay, >> this proves incorrect.

[00:05:10]>> At the end of the day, that proves that no man did give birth. That was a woman.

[00:05:15]>> So then men said it was a woman.

[00:05:17]>> So then men can give birth.

[00:05:21]>> That was a woman though.

[00:05:22]>> So then you said it was a female with a uterus, dude.

[00:05:25]>> So then not all men have XY chromosomes.

[00:05:28]Oh, well I mean if that was a stud. No, I'm went off of what I was what what if you look up as the basis of everything as you're a man, right? You were born a male, if you don't mind me asking, you have XY chromosomes. Me, I'm a chromosomes I have. I've never been karaotyped and I doubt that you have either.

[00:05:45]>> Oh yeah. Well, I meant from what they told us based off of off of what we were told scientifically, that's what I meant. But yeah, but my argument still stands. I don't think that trans women are women. I don't think if I mutilate myself that makes me a woman. If we're going off a talking >> Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. You said the only thing that differentiates the sexes is the chromosomes.

[00:06:06]>> Yeah.

[00:06:06]>> You said men have X.

[00:06:07]>> Oh, no. There's a lot. I said I said the only way that it would work is if we could put a live you I said if you I said the day you can change a man's chromosomes.

[00:06:17]>> Hold on, friend. Hold on, friend.

[00:06:18]Anthony. Anthony, hold on.

[00:06:20]>> Yeah, I'm listening, bro. I asked you very specifically >> what >> is the thing that creates your gender.

[00:06:27]You said your chromosomes I asked you do your chromosomes predict your gender.

[00:06:31]You said yes. I asked you what chromosomes are required to be a man.

[00:06:35]You said XY. I used the word required.

[00:06:38]>> Right. Right. That means it has to exist. But now we've come to the conclusion that there are women who have XY chromosomes as well that aren't men.

[00:06:46]>> Okay. So, it would appear to be the case that you don't need to have XY chromosomes to be a man.

[00:06:53]>> Some people who are men have XX chromosomes. Some people who are men have XY chromosomes. Some people who are women have XX chromosomes. Some people who are women have XY chromosomes. So, this would not be something required to give birth or I'm sorry to be a man or to be a woman.

[00:07:13]>> Okay.

[00:07:14]>> So, then what is the thing that's required? If we know it's not chromosomes, what might it be?

[00:07:21]>> Uh, a uterus.

[00:07:24]>> Okay. So, you can only be >> You can only be a woman if you have a uterus. That's what you're telling me.

[00:07:31]>> A natural, not one that somebody sliced you open and put in there. I'm talking about a natural uterus.

[00:07:36]>> A natural uterus. So, women >> Yeah. natural uterus. Natural uterus.

[00:07:41]And I for me to be a male, I got to have a natural penis and a natural >> natural penis.

[00:07:46]natural testicles.

[00:07:48]>> So, I don't even know. And I'm not sure I'm not sure what kind of surgeries they can do to people. And I'm not sure if technology so advanced now that they can put a uterus in somebody and it can work.

[00:07:59]>> Anthony, if a woman's born without a uterus, what is she? She's not a woman anymore. What is she?

[00:08:05]>> No. If a woman is b If a woman is born without a uterus, >> Mhm.

[00:08:12]What is she? Um, a I believe ain't that an act? I >> Um, >> nope. The word you're gonna use, don't use it. The word you're gonna use, don't use it.

[00:08:20]>> But what would she be using? What did you think I was about to say?

[00:08:23]>> Uh, I'm just I'm just trying to be careful here.

[00:08:26]>> I don't I actually didn't I didn't have a word yet, so I don't know.

[00:08:29]>> If a female person is born without a uterus, what is she?

[00:08:34]>> Ain't that an actual medical condition, though? But we're way off a term, though. But how does this make it how does this make a trans woman Now, I want to hear your argument. How does a trans woman or a trans man a men please listen to me? Please listen >> because they say so.

[00:08:48]>> Anthony, please listen to me. The reason I believe trans men and women are men and women is because there is no one biological trait that will cleanly separate men and women. Therefore, the trait must be an internal trait that has to do with our our mind and our senses of self.

[00:09:09]You believe there is a biological trait that makes you men and women yet you can't >> tell me what that trait is.

[00:09:19]>> Can I ask you a question about like what you're thinking? So like if you had a child >> try >> and let's say it came out as a male. So in your mind you're like I don't know what I have yet until they decide what they are. That's what you're saying. I can know the sex of my child and I can make an estimated guess about what their gender will be based on that. But I could I could very well be wrong and when they get older and can start to verbalize to me, >> I could find out I was wrong about that estimated guess >> because again I'm a little old school. So I thought sex and gender are the same two thing, ain't they?

[00:10:00]No.

[00:10:04]>> Yeah. But I don't know. I just don't I just So, we're going off of what people think.

[00:10:09]>> If sex and gender are the same thing, just let me just If sex and gender are the same thing, are all males men and are all females women?

[00:10:26]>> And then so um All right. So, you just believe that it's just something you decide. All right.

[00:10:31]>> No, I believe Anthony, what I believe, and this I'm going to move on because I only have a little bit of time left after this. What I believe is that there is no one biological trait that will cleanly map men and women and therefore because there is no one biological trait for this, it is instead going to be an internal trait. Thank you for playing, Anthony. I'm going to move on to the next person.

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