Social housing represents a transformative approach to affordable housing where the municipality or community-owned entities own and manage housing, creating permanent affordability through revolving loan funds that reinvest revenue back into the program. Unlike traditional affordable housing tools like the Barnes Fund (which provides grants for affordable housing development), social housing creates a sustainable financial model where 70% of residents pay market rate while 30% pay at 50-80% Area Median Income, with the majority equity position enabling deeper affordability over time. This model, implemented successfully in cities like Chattanooga and Atlanta, provides robust tenant protections that cannot be achieved with privately owned housing and addresses the gap where workers earning $40,000 cannot afford either market-rate or deeply affordable housing. The implementation requires dedicated staff positions and community involvement through co-governance models to ensure long-term success.
05/27/26 Metropolitan Council Committee: Budget & Finance Work SessionAñadido:
Um, hopefully you all saw the update from me sent out by the council office earlier today. Over the next couple of days, we are going to dig into the individual wish list items and really talk about the the nuts and bolts. Um, in prior years, I know council members uh doing their due diligence have had conversations with department heads and other individuals with nonprofits. uh but sometimes that information doesn't carry to the larger body. So as you see the room is packed because I have invited some department heads or department representatives as well as representatives of some of these nonprofit groups that folks have put on their wish list. Uh so there'll be folks here today as well as folks here tomorrow so that we can have those conversations in the open and that everybody can be on the same page and we can understand what the wish list item is, what the actual cost is and if the department can take it on and how they plan to do that so that we don't allocate funds and those funds are just sitting doing nothing uh when they could have been gone could have gone to something um something else. Uh so we will start with council member Euing who a few of her items got left off yesterday. Uh so she is going to go through a few of her wish list items. So I will quickly >> I appreciate the quickly. So I'll turn it over to you council member Yuing.
Thank you chair. Um, okay. Um, first up, oh, I just have to preface all of this by saying that that as I said yesterday, I do understand um that judgments and losses cannot bear the full responsibility and brunt of things I want to shift and add. So, with that said, and knowing that I will have a full robust discussion about where this money will come from, here I go. under the fire department. Um I would like to as others add a position to the reach program for the downtown zone Thursday through Sunday. I think this is a very important addition. Um anything we can do to increase the mental health care um that we provide on a daily basis is is good. 75,000 um from judgments and losses. Okay. Uh, next, sorry, going quickly. Thank you. Page 8 under Metro Public Schools. Um, again, this is repetitive. I also want to add 580,000 in for um the composting um to to expand um environmental and sustainable um education programming, a position for a sustainability officer. um 580,000.
I am going to try and get that from MMPS operating.
Next, Nashville Office of Entertainment.
Again, repetitive as with others, looking for funding for an executive director for the entertainment commission. Um, I think that this is important to finally fund this so that we can get this underway and let the ex the new executive director then get a staff member and get moving. 300,000 uh judgment and losses.
Okay, next up, Office of Family Safety. Um, I would like to help continue the success of Red Frogs, which is completely volunteer- based. They need a consistent source of funding. So 250,000 um from judgments and losses. Okay. Yes.
Apparently I'm a onetrick pony.
Um okay. Next is parks.
Oh, sorry. Planning. Um I would like to add 500,000 to the existing 7 million set aside for affordable housing. um to help boost the administrative support, staff positions, etc. that are needed in order to make that 7 million really go as far as it needs to. Um the funding I am hoping can come from planning commission.
Let's see. Um two under the police department. I would like to add back in the 150,000 for vehicle retention and maintenance um to complete the budgeting needed for appropriate fleet maintenance because it doesn't do much to have um police without vehicles to carry them places. Uh secondly, secondary employment unit. I want to add back in the 279,000 um that will allow the MMPD to scale infrastructure to meet increasing demand for secondary employment services. And again, those are two are from judgments and losses.
And I think that that is it. Thank you, chair.
>> You're welcome, council member. And was there anyone else whose items were left off yesterday?
Councilwoman Al.
I spoke about them yesterday, but they I'm still not seeing two of them on the list. So, I may just add my name to the list or I'll check with Maria.
>> Which two are those?
>> Um, the 350,000 for soar under health.
>> Is it under health or somewhere else?
>> Okay, I haven't gotten to that one yet.
Okay, great. So, that one's there. Um, And then the other one I had a question about.
That may be the only one.
Um then the 580,000 for the compost program under MNPS. I don't see that one. Maybe I'm looking at an older list.
>> Okay. I appreciate that. That's all.
>> All right, colleagues. Um just to go over the departments and organizations that are here today. Uh and we will discuss the wish list items that are related to those departments and organizations. So, we have fire, we have health department, Nashville General Hospital, HRC will not be here today.
They'll be here tomorrow. Uh, MNPS.
Uh, do we have a representative from Juvenile Court?
Okay, I see a hand. Uh, do we have a representative from Metro Action Commission?
Okay, I see a hand. Thank you. Uh, INDOT Planning Department. Do we have a representative from CASA?
I see a hand. Great. Uh, stand up Nashville People's Budget. I see y'all.
Uh, and then Pet Community Center will be here. Uh, well, hopefully tomorrow.
They won't be. Oh, no, there's someone.
Oh, fantastic. All right. All right. So, we will go back to there is a handout that says funding requests by appropriation.
And I'm going to go through that list um by the um departments and organizations that are present today.
Um I'm going to skip over the the Barnes fund and lump that all with um does that get lump with planning or is that a separate thing?
>> We can have it's separate it's a separate budget but discuss it with Okay. All right. So I want to start with uh CASA.
So the CASA person if you could just I guess that um either end of the table back there feel free to join us.
and say it again.
>> And press the right button to turn the mic on, but the request is for 75,000.
And I know I've sat in on a on a presentation for where that 75,000 uh comes from, but if you could just give an overview of the 75,000, what it would be used for and what's the impact um and then we'll get into a larger u discussion as a committee.
>> Certainly. Um thank you all for having me here today and for consideration. Um, last year we were funded 75,000 to support our program. And for those who don't or aren't familiar with CASA, uh, it stands for courtappointed special advocates. And we are positioned as a independent nonprofit um to provide advocacy services by way of community volunteers to children and families that are in the foster care system. Uh we provide this service 100% free to juvenile court and um to the children and families that we serve. Um our volunteers uh collect information and fact and they report directly back to judge on what's actually going on. We don't investigate allegations of abuse.
Um but we're there to represent best interest of the child. Um in any given year there's about 700 youth in foster care in Davidson County alone. Last year we were able to serve 300 of those youth. Um with the funding that um we were able to um get last year we uh put that towards directly towards the program and serving um our children. Uh we have paid staff that helped supervise these volunteers and they have a case load of upwards to 30 or 45 volunteers and cases. Um our volunteers come from all walks of life. So, we have our dedicated staff persons to be there with them in court, provide guidance and everything like that. Um, with the investment of the 75,000 last year, we were able to train 30 new volunteers. We keep on average about 120 to 150 volunteer advocates a year. Um, we were able to close 77 cases um that uh impacted or I'm sorry, 41 cases that impacted 77 children. Um and as the end of March, we were serving 275 children.
So we're on par to exceed the 300 number um that we served last year.
Now I had and I need some clarification from um our council director because my understanding is that last year CASA was funded or you probably can answer.
Excuse me. Uh, which department are you funded through?
Is it Office of Family Safety or Juvenile Court?
>> We ultimately ended up at Office of Family Safety.
Okay.
And do you know why why that was? Was it just a better fit for the program or because you're servicing juvenile court, >> correct? Um, I I wasn't exactly sure. I do know that the office of family safety um works with other nonprofits that um serve children who have experienced abuse and neglect. So, uh we had just assumed that that's why we got Clump there. Um they've been fantastic to work with. So, uh but we are primarily serving juvenile court.
>> Okay. And that's why I invited the juvenile court representative because the service you pro provide is for juvenile court. And so the question was whether juvenile court could take on that those funds to allocate them to CASA. And there's also um for the women's caucus, they have the funds being allocated to juvenile court. Um so we may not need you juvenile court in this instance. Anyway, we do need juvenile court, but in this instance, um, but any questions from colleagues for around the CASA allocation? It's the same as last year, 75,000 that allows you to train additional volunteers.
Um, okay. All right. Well, thank you so much.
All right. Next up is the eviction right to council.
And what was that last year? That plan.
And so I have this being the funds the funds being allocated to the planning department. So if I can get a planning department person up here and then I know the program is administered through legal aid. Is that correct?
>> We have two separate contracts.
>> Okay. Okay.
>> That would be helpful. Am I Can everyone hear me now? So, we have two contracts, one administered by Legal Aid and one administered by the Nashville Hispanic Bar Association, which is part of why we have so many people here today.
>> Okay. And so, what we're needing today, so there are several wish list requests around eviction right to council. So, we know in the mayor's proposed budget, there's $2.4 million allocated to the planning department to be um granted to to this program. So there we have wish list items for a million uh dollars. We have one is for six million, one is for 2.4 million, 6.6 million, um 5 million, 6.5. So there's a lot of interest in in increasing the funding. So, can you speak to what the actual need is for the eviction right to council program?
>> Absolutely. Um, and we have, if council members are interested, we have a sort of a summary um that we can pass around, do a take one and pass it. Actually, can I keep one so I don't forget all of the numbers the moment I hand away the piece of paper. Thank you so much. Um, so these are this is a quick summary provided to us by um an independent outside analyst company, Stout Rius Ross. We uh contracted to them to get an outside perspective on what we have accomplished and these are the accomplishments of our coalition or a quick summary of the accomplishments of our coalition during calendar year 2025.
Um there is more than this and if you scan the QR code you can review a little bit in more detail of what all we accomplished. Uh but the short version is the eviction right to council program aims to help tenants who are facing or at risk of eviction. So some the core of the program operated by legal aid and Hispanic bar attorneys who represent uh low and middle inome Nashvilleians who are facing eviction in court. So we are in court. I was in court this morning.
Uh we are in court most every day. We operate a help desk in the courthouse for tenants who are facing eviction and we also have a coalition of other nonprofit organizations we work with who help with other aspects of the intervention around the eviction process. So that includes the Nashville Conflict Resolution Center. They do mediation because we want to envision a universe where there are alternatives to the eviction court process that are cheaper, faster, more humane, kinder to tenants and to landlords. As well as Rooftop Nashville, which is a rental assistance organization, and AAC, the American Muslim Advisory C council, who helps us with language access and outreach um around Davidson County. So we have been in operation since 2022 with a pretty much that entire time basically a steady funding level of about 2.4 4 million slight tweaks in there over the years. And we are hopeful. Uh many of you may have gotten emails from some of our coalition members asking for an increase to at least three million and if it's possible to 4.5 million, which we think represent scalable increases that are practical that we really can absorb in a single year and show similar results to what we have shown with 2.4 million. Three million would just allow us to sort of rightsize some of the investments in our partner members of the coalition. When we were first getting started, those coalition partners, uh, AAC, NCRC, and Rooftop, we weren't entirely certain how everybody was going to work together and what the different pieces would be. So, they got 50,000, 100,000 without really knowing. And now we know what it takes for them to participate in the coalition. The three million would just allow us to sort of rightsize that because some of our partners right now are kind of losing money participating in our coalition. 4.5 million is a real investment in growing toward a fully implemented right to council program.
Apologies. I'm a lawyer. I talk a lot.
>> So am I. I love it. Um so the 4.5 million at 4.5 million you could reasonably scale. you could use all of that funding in a single fiscal year.
>> Yes, ma'am. We're very confident we have just as one quick data point to show how quickly we could scale. Um, just in the month of April, there were about 51 people who contacted Legal Aid, went through our intake process and wanted us to represent them in court and we didn't have enough attorneys to say yes. So, we gave them advice, which is great. We love giving advice. It is helpful to people. But what they really wanted was for us to stand with them in court.
That's 51 people just in the month of April. Um, so give us the money to hire attorneys. We can represent those people immediately. 4.5 also lets us invest in building some other exciting and different new ways of reaching um, Nashvilleians. But the need is right there. We are ready to serve them as soon as we can afford to hire a couple more lawyers.
And just looking at you, Angie, just to make sure this is something if you were these funds were given to the planning department. This is something you all are on board with uh assisting with the the funding for ERC.
>> Absolutely. This is one of the programs listed in the unified housing strategy that is needed in our community. We um are excited about the eviction right to council moving into um our division so that we can work alongside the partners in evaluating where the evictions are happening and how we can use that information to address policy especially in programs we fund. The concern would be funding uh the addition through um other um housing programs such as the Barnes fund because that's pulling from what we need to put in the pipeline that addresses the problem where this is important to addressing a symptom of the problem. So these work in tandem and address and addressing our housing crisis holistically.
>> Colleagues, any questions regarding ERC?
Councilwoman Yuing.
Um it's it's more a request for a reminder to give you an opportunity to talk about um in the end how much we're saving by funding this type of program versus going in after the fact once people are already out on the street.
>> I thank you so much. I couldn't ask for a better question. Um this is summarized on this sheet. So for 2025, estimated return on investment was $418 for every dollar spent in this program. That's split about not it's like 6040 between public fiscal impact. So that's avoided costs to the city in terms of additional health care costs, loss funding when people leave Nashville, uh criminal justice related costs, um and costs in responding with the social safety net, as well as direct client benefits. These are people who don't lose their jobs, don't lose their schooling for their children, don't lose their uh subsidies, their subsidized housing. Um, I always like to say we're blessed in Nashville to live with a really wonderful and generous community who will really try to reach out and help folks when they have sort of fallen off the edge of that cliff. And it can cost a lot of money to help somebody climb all the way back up to stability. How much cheaper is it to reach out a hand right before they fall?
And that's what we try to do. And we do not want this to be uh pillaging from other affordable housing programs. There are so many wonderful and needed programs. This one is on the scale of housing programs relatively cheap and effective um and is helpful for addressing this one piece for the folks who um where the housing where they are currently live is the housing that's affordable for them.
Thank you very much, >> Council Member Webb. Oh, and I see you.
Council member Evans, >> can you tell me a little bit about the 58% of the clients with defective conditions in their home wanting to move? Is that landlords that what what is that? When you say their home, I'm assuming it's not their home, >> their rental housing. Yes. So, one of we try very hard to collect data when we're um doing intakes, when we're speaking to our clients, and we always ask them, are do you have problems? Are there con repairs problems in your homes? And which is unfortunately common, and we ask, do you want to stay? Do you want to go? What's your goal?
>> And what happens in that process if they're inhabitable or what is the process after you go in there and somebody says, you know, I've got all this mold on the ceiling.
Does codes come in in there at that point and shut that facility down the house? I'm just trying to think where the missing block is here.
>> Yeah. Um, so with conditions issues, I sort of sort for what this body can do.
Codes is wonderful. We really appreciate them. They they do so much and they respond really quickly to tenant complaints and send real human beings out for tenants to see, which is hugely valuable. And for many landlords, just getting that letter from codes does encourage compliance and improvement.
Um, >> that's good to hear.
>> Tenants who are dealing with defective conditions in their homes, it's really hard. One of the questions we often ask folks is, well, do you want to stay? And if and a lot of people tell us yes, but only because I don't have anywhere else to go, which is where the Barnes fund and that kind of program comes into place because there are plenty of people who tell us, "Yeah, I'll stay. It's terrible." They spent 30 minutes on the phone telling me how awful every single thing about this experience is. And I ask, "Do you want to move?" and they say no, I don't have anywhere to go and it's close to my kids school and close to my job. Um, we are trying, you can see here, one of the statistics is avoiding disruptive displacement. This 93% of our clients have avoided disruptive displacement. This is where when you get evicted, everything falls apart and you experience a period of homelessness, perhaps losing your job, uh, having to stay temporarily with family, kids who aren't able to go to school, all of those problems. When we're able to get involved, we can usually organize what's called a soft landing. We can help them negotiate with their landlord for what is a solution that will give this tenant enough time if they want to go enough time to move out and find another place.
Can we still make the landlord whole?
Our goal is not to stick it to all of the landlords and make sure that no landlords ever get any funding ever again. That's why there's rental assistance in our coalition because sometimes that can help. So, what can we do to organize a safe transition?
Thank you, >> Council Member Evans.
>> Thank you, Chair. I I wanted to you just touched on it just a little bit on uh the idea of families, you know, with children um that are going through the system and there's been an increase um in families experiencing homelessness in Davidson County and that's been a topic of the homelessness planning council.
And so do you all get once you get a a judgment or disposition of a case, do you tr end up tracking anything where it's connecting like here is the impact like if you're not able to help with somebody, if they end up with a default judgment or any of those details or if you help somebody and maybe the landlord is not as agreeable and the person is still going to end up, you know, with their children being homeless. Does that I'm I'm looking for is there a connection that then ends up informing um conversations around MNPS and families like with the hero program and those kinds of things.
>> Um yes, it's an excellent question.
We'll give it to Ann.
>> I think we'd really like to collect that robust data set, but we don't have the internal capacity to do it, frankly. Um, I think an additional investment in ERTC could potentially support something like a more robust data collection or to answer your question, uh, tenant suits against, um, law landlords who aren't following the law, right? So, not only can they get their problems fixed, they can get some justice financially. um with additional investments into ERTC, we would love to expand into these areas, but as it is at both probably the three and the 4.5 funding levels, we are not able to do that.
>> There is one member of our coalition who I will say who is able to track that data. Rooftop Nashville, they do follow-ups after I believe it's six months and one year and I don't have the data off the top of my head. Do any of you remember the percentage who are still housed?
>> No, it's pretty good.
>> It's relatively high.
>> But they don't track the folks they can't help. Same with us. We do follow-up data for our clients, but not the folks that we couldn't help.
>> And on the folks that we couldn't help to, I'll chime in here. In the course of just this year, we were able to help at Legal Aid Plus Hispanic Bar, about a thousand people or so. At Just Legal Aid, though, we had to reject about 1,500 people. Those are folks that called in that we couldn't do three follow-up calls with. We do two, but couldn't do that third one. Or it's folks that we had to reject simply because we didn't have attorney capacity to take those cases. on those latter folks. Those are folks that have gone all the way through the intake process, talked to an intake specialist, gotten some information from us, and still at that point, we don't have the attorney capacity. So, in that terms of people we could help, there's, you know, a thousand plus people every single year we have to turn away.
>> I do have a remote question.
Can you can you elaborate about the cases where you can prevent eviction versus keeping the eviction off of their credit record?
>> Uh yes. Um which I will attempt to do it without uh giving everyone a deep dive into the law around credit and reporting and evictions. Um in any given case, our first question is what is our client's goal? Um that is our number one thing and we you have we have data around our success rate in achieving our clients goals which has been consistently 90% often higher of what is their goal. So some people come to us and their goal is to stay in their home. Some people they say their goal is to leave. They have these conditions issues and they want out. Some people are concerned about their credit report or what might follow them. So we have different legal tools that we are able to use depending on the facts of a particular case and a client's goals. Um, we have the kinds of sort of the different some of the different kinds of successes when an when an eviction case has already been filed and it comes to us. Sometimes we are able to negotiate a dismissal just a flat landlord's going to drop the case.
We get those a lot very very frequently and we're able to get the landlord to just say we're going to drop this case.
Often we're able to negotiate about the amount of money that is owed which then is what usually triggers credit related issues. So, we can negotiate. Hey, you say that the tenant owes $2,000. The tenant is claiming $3,000 in damages from repairs that have never happened.
Can everybody walk away without reporting anything on someone's credit?
Um, we're able sometimes to uh work with the clerk's office around the names that the cases were filed under. There's not a right to seal or expune eviction cases in Tennessee, but sometimes we can work with opposing councils or the clerk's office to help mitigate the effects downstream. It depends a lot. Uh we do take cases to trial and then sometimes the judge will say that we win and the landlord loses. Um so all those different ways we can sometimes re reach positive results for clients.
>> Any additional council member Greg?
>> Thank you, Madam Chair. often those have a very specialized need don't know how to find that specialized help. You said with the 4.5 you would expand your outreach. What would that look like? I know you're at the courthouse at present, but what would that expanded reach look like?
>> Yep. So, our court help desk is a really great example of meeting folks that have not heard of us before. They walk into their eviction court, boom, there we are. And that's awesome. Uh we want to expand to do more listening sessions in specific communities, in specific zip codes, in specific neighborhoods where eviction rates are very high. Uh we believe very strongly in a very forthright education campaign. If people know what their housing rights are, they can prevent evictions before they even get filed. That's both tenants and landlords. We're able to work with tenants primarily, but with additional funding, we can work with landlords also, help them and coach them on what their rights are, what their responsibilities are, and same with tenants. Uh so that dedicated community outreach is very important to us. AAC's a great coalition partner. They work really well in the Muslim community here in Nashville. Um and so being able to have more funding to reach other communities, other demographic areas, other neighborhoods, um is really where we expand and that's like I said through listening sessions. We right now have a tenant webinar series in the works. So we're using technology, social media to out have folks and meet them that way.
So with that additional funding, it would not only be meeting folks in the communities where they are on the ground, but also on TikTok, on Instagram, where a lot of our clients are getting legal information. Um, I couldn't tell you how many times someone has called in saying, "Well, Chad GPT said X, Y, and Z." Um, and so being able to reach those folks with social media managers, uh, folks that are on boots on the ground doing knocking. Uh, just some really great examples of how we could expand that outreach to meet to meet more people.
>> Excellent. And yes, we all have to be on social media. If I might add, when it moves to the planning department, we'll be able to host information on it on the housing division web page as another resource for the community.
Any other questions?
All right. Well, thank you. You can stay, Miss Hoverard, if you could because there are several wish list items related to the planning department. So, we'll just dive right into those if those are okay.
>> That sounds great. May I ask Lisa Milligan to join me?
>> Absolutely.
>> Thank you.
>> Absolutely.
and colleagues, if I am skipping over something that's related to the housing, I mean to the planning department, let me know because what I see, we just done ERTTC. Um, I also obviously Barnes fund uh the social housing. There is a wish list item from council member Gamble.
um for the implementation and management of recommended programs and initiatives to address Nashville's housing needs, especially for persons experiencing housing insecurity. And that facilitates the creation and preservation of affordable and workforce housing. I don't know what specific program that is, but perhaps uh once we get to that item um we can figure that part out. Are there any other wish list items that related to the planning department? Am I skipping over anything? I don't think so.
I'm looking at funding requests by appropriation.
So, we will start with the Barnes Fund.
Um there are several wish list items related to the Barnes fund. Some given, some taken.
But, uh I'll ask you to just speak to We all know what the Barnes funds is, but but just for the viewing audience, if you could speak to the Barnes fund. Uh the mayor's proposed allocation is 22 million. We know that the unified housing strategies recommendation is 30 million. So if you could speak to um the impact of the proposed appropriation, the impact of potentially $30 million and and what is the overall impact in terms of housing units for the Barnes fund?
>> Okay, please remind me if I forget a question. Um, first for the viewing audience, the Barnes Fund receives its primary funding from or all of its funding from the operating budget. In historically or in the past few years, we've received appropriations for the American uh rescue plan act. The 22 million is the largest appropriation from the general fund budget in the history of the Barnes Fund. Um, it's been supplemented by the ARP funding to get it to that 30 million in the past few years. Um, let's see. Our total appropriation since the fund was created is a little over 200 million. In the past four to five years, we've received about half of that. So, it's really scaled over those years. The um through the fund is grants to nonprofits or partnerships with nonprofits. They can partner with a for-profit as long as that nonprofit remains a 51% control in the deal, not necessarily in the dirt.
Um since then we have put about um 6,500 well let me say this a little over 5,000 units into the pipeline both home ownership and rental and then the balance of that is the preservation of owner occupied housing through our um so we fund really three things rental new construction or rehab home ownership which is for sale and owner occupied rehab and we make these available through competitive funding rounds and altogether together that's funded um or preserved 6,500 units total. So with the 22 million we expect to um fund between 6 to 700 homes um this with that funding. Um at around the 30 million we get to around 800 homes. It um really does depend. Um we're looking to prioritize deeper affordability at that 30% AMI or below or permanent supportive housing. So, we tend to see a higher per unit investment when we target deeper, but that moves us um the needle more though on housing that's not going to be created by any other tool or any market intervention. We have to have grants for those. Um home ownership also tends to have a higher per unit investment because we don't have other tools in the country really like the low-inccome housing tax credit allows us to scale rental. we don't have a comparable tool um at the federal or state level to allow us to do home ownership at that same kind of rate. So um as we look how the Barnes fund and I know I'm getting in we uh driving over into that 7 million loan program, but as we can drive um higher production like low-inccome housing tax credits into that $7 million lane, we can free up more barns because right now it's trying to do everything to fund all of the affordable housing needs that we have.
We can target it better for that deeply affordable or permanent supportive housing, home ownership in the rehab space that really isn't conducive to a loan program.
>> Colleagues, any Barnes fund questions?
Council member Porterville.
>> Thank you, Chair, and thank you, director, for u being here in that explanation. There were some um uh wish lists that showed a request to cut money from the Barnes fund, which for the record I don't support. So that's not why I'm asking the question, but could you please speak to what cuts to the Barnes fund would do and how that would impact the the projects that y'all have uh currently and any projects in the pipeline or anything that may be coming forward?
>> Okay, thank you. any um so everything um that we have appropriated um has already been funded so it wouldn't affect any existing um project if um whatever our fiscal year our fiscal year 27 budget would look like.
Um the unified housing strategy calls for putting um 2,000 rental homes affordable at 60% or below into our pipeline every year for the next 10 years. That doesn't even count the rental. I mean, the home ownership that we need to do or the preservation we need to do through the owner occupied rehab. So, every um every time we um reduce the funding to the Barnes fund, we're we're delaying putting projects into the pipeline and pushing back our ability to meet that that goal over 10 years. And then we are creating um or we're not addressing the problem and are compounding housing insecurity which is what the eviction right to council and those other programs are attempting to do because we are in a still in a hot housing market even though we have some cooling. Um overall we are still having um an issue and there are no market interventions at that deeply affordable or even at 60% or below. Um market just doesn't create that on its own. We have to have those interventions through the Barnes fund or the loan program.
>> Council member Coopin, >> thank you, Chair, and thank you for for being here and all the great work you do to help affordability in our in our city. Um, you mentioned that uh the loan can or Barnesman can be used for for sale and for rent. Um, what's the breakdown of how often is it being used for creation of for sale product versus for rent product? We see about 60% on average over the history going toward rental about 30% going toward home ownership and 10% to the owner occupied rehab.
>> And for the the home ownership um how how does that work structurally in the sense that is it um is it deed restricted or or how does that how does that work uh for ownership?
>> So for owner home ownership and rental there is a 30-year deed restriction. So the subsequent sale of an affordable home would need to be sold um to a buyer at the um at least 80% AMI if they propo if a nonprofit proposed to target a lower AMI, it would need to be sold at that AMI level over to subsequent owners for the next 30 years.
>> Perfect. Thank you.
>> You're welcome.
And um Director Hubard, has there been any or any consideration given to outside funding sources for the Barnes funds? I know right now I believe Metro is 100% of the funding. Has there been any consideration of looking at outside private sources as well for funding?
>> Yes, from time to time we do get offers of donations. Um, one of the things we're working on with the Unified Housing Leadership Council is the um a menu for um we have um opportunities um underutilized opportunities with both corporate and philanthropic organizations to contribute to all all across our housing spectrum, all of the programs to create an investment menu for those opportunities as well as the right vehicle to bring that from so they can get their advantages for their contributions. how to bring that into Metro while they can also um claim whatever advantages they want through that investment. And we are working on what that um both a strategy and those vehicles could look like. But we um make a we're making a call to action for more philanthropic and corporate investment in Barnes all across all of our housing tools.
Um, and you did mention the the revolving loan fund, and since there are a couple of wish list items that take money from the revolving loan fund, and I know there's been a a concern uh whether that $7 million would actually be spent in fiscal year 27. Um, so if you could speak to the revolving loan fund, please. So, I want to um clarify being awarded versus spent because when you're building something new, it's going to take three to four years. So, we can't expect to spend Barnes fund in the year that it's awarded or the loan fund um because that's just that's just the nature of development, but we um are certain we can get the 7 million awarded in this coming fiscal year.
And we believe that it'll perform as as well or if not better as the Barnes fund does when we move some of the high production like the low-inccome housing tax credits into the loan pool.
>> Council member Porterville.
>> Thank you, Chair. Can you explain for the viewing audience how the um revolving fund will work? So, we're currently building out that structure and all the parameters with um our consultant foresight street, but it's not just intended to be another program that we do. Um it's intended to set the I will call it a prequel for a larger evolving housing tool. And Janine is not here so I'm not going to conjure up the words but um what it is intended to do is it one it's a missing tool in our ecosystem. It is something we heard about in the development of the unified housing strategy because really giving grants away to projects that could actually support debt is not an efficient way to use uh public funds. So that's one. So this is creating another tool but instead of making it just another program. It is um used to um move to that next level where we could create a subsidiary with a governance structure and a brand. test the market before we introduce a larger, more riskier tool and evolve it to like what a real housing kind of finance ecosystem looks like where there's um you couple it with land and other um mechanisms to um do the long-term affordability, achieve the policy outcomes we've been talking about. Also, the loan allows Metro to have more of um let's see, a bigger bite in the deal than we might have with a grant.
Council member Allen.
>> Thank you, Madam Chair. My understanding is that foresight worked really hard on the catalyst fund creating that structure, but it took about two years.
Is it possible they can start at that point and just build on it and make this happen quickly? Do you have like targets and timelines? So the different the difference with the catalyst fund was we went we initiated that fund with a commitment to raise other capital before we launched it and we wanted a credit facility on board to bring those banks.
So it took about a year and a half to get a credit facility which is first Horizon to um be our partner in it. So that's a different that affected the timeline more than this. So now we're having the conversations on what the initial infrastructure build would look like, how that would structure, but also creating those parameters now so that we can be ready to launch this summer >> with with a loan with a loan product.
Yes.
>> Summer 26.
>> Summer of 26. We're not looking to I mean we've got to get the money awarded.
Right.
>> Right. Okay. Great. Thank you, >> Council Member Spain.
>> Thank you, Madam Chair. Not not to put you on the spot, but >> um Okay. But >> since we since we obviously have a pretty long list of ideas about how to spend money and council member Yuing has already spent all of judgments and losses.
>> Um >> assuming that that what we have in these three housing programs is what we have to work with. The 2.4 for uh eviction right to council, the 7 million for the revolving load fund, and the 22 million for Barnes. Is that the right breakdown of those three pots?
>> Well, I would ask for double. Um, so you put me on the spot.
>> I mean, that's the total.
>> I um I would certainly keep them at those levels.
>> Okay. Thank you.
>> Any additional questions related to the revolving loan fund or Barnes?
All right. Seeing none. We're Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't see you. Council member Nash.
>> I'm sorry. We've also had a lot of discussion about the social housing uh and wonder if where that is in in planning so >> thought process.
>> Oh, that's next.
>> Oh, never mind.
>> So, and I wanted to give the community groups, so we have uh representatives from Standup Nashville as well as the people's budget coalition. I wanted to give them a chance to speak first to give the community perspective on what social housing is and then bring in the folks who do housing uh for the city and and see how we can possibly mesh the the two.
>> Sounds great. Do you want us to step back and let them come up?
>> Just make some room.
>> Okay.
And if y'all could introduce yourselves and you have the floor.
>> Absolutely. And >> y'all, I'm >> I'm Cade. I'm a organizer at Stand Up Nashville. You all see me around council.
>> Hi, I'm Mariam Appleley. I'm the organizing director at Standup Nashville.
>> I'm Andrew Cranks. I'm an organizational coordinator with the Nashville People's Budget Coalition.
>> All right, great. So, I'll give the basic overview of what we're asking for.
So, basically, as our groups have identified, as all of y'all who ran for council and had to listen to your constituents have identified that housing is one of our major issues in the city, I think everyone's on board with that. I think the question we're at now is how do we attack that and how do we meet that problem with the sort of ambition um and imagination that it deserves? And so our approach for that in studying policy was really looking at in other cities what has worked like what has tangible results what's what's not just like throwing stuff at the wall and hoping it sticks. What is like using our money well um to get the results in a housing market where people can stay where we're actually having a large scale of affordable housing. We already have great tools on the books. The Barnes fund is a fantastic tool that not a lot of other cities have. Um love the catalyst fund. of everything that the planning department is doing and we do believe that we have a good partner in both y'all's and the mayor's office that actually cares about solving this issue.
The what we want to do is add another tool to the toolkit. When we look at other cities in Europe, in Asia, in other places, even in the US now that have had better outcomes relative to other peer cities when it comes to housing affordability in the long term.
we see that they have a largecale portion of their housing be dominated by what or not dominated but create uh has a lot of like what we call social housing which is some people call decommodified housing. There's a lot of other terms for it. Um but basically what that is is housing that is owned uh and operate owned and then managed by either a municipality, a group of tenants or residents themselves or a nonprofit. Um, so that's like the very broad one. And the one specific thing we want to do is we are figuring out how do we leverage assets that the city has in a way that, you know, in a state that is fairly, you know, it's a hard environment to build affordable housing.
How do we leverage what the city has to get these results? And what we came up with was sort of this using bonds uh as a way of getting this housing. So I'll pass it to Andrew now.
>> Sure. So you all should have um the one pager which is a front and a back. Um I'm just going to run through briefly.
You can read this in detail later, but just to kind of hit the high level stuff around the key pillars of what we understand social housing to be. Um there's been some questions around like is what MDHA does already social housing? The answer is no. And we can talk about why, but just to run through this quickly. Um these are kind of the three ingredients that tell you whether or not this is a social housing um uh program. basically as Kade mentioned that it's either publicly or community owned or there's majority equity ownership uh from the public entity or municipality. So this could be um a municipality itself owning the housing, it could be a public development authority or it could be a subsidiary um uh as director Hoverard mentioned or like a 501c3.
Um often public land is involved in this. Um uh you can also take over stalled private projects with this model u because there's different funding streams. And then the owning entity contracts with uh vetted developers and management companies. Uh revenue importantly revolves back in this notion of a revolving loan fund. Um it revolves back into producing more housing as opposed to just going into essentially private pockets of private developers who might still build affordable housing but that return comes in and that really makes a big difference and makes great financial sense compared to other models. Um, it also, uh, public ownership ensures robust tenant protections because you can't really do that in a state like ours for privately owned housing. But if it's municipally owned or owned by a public authority or community organization, then that then that is possible. Um, and it stays off the private market, which allows for that long-term affordability even when other housing crises come and go. And then this all sets you up for being able to mandate permanent affordability in a way that you can't with other tools like LITC um and other funding sources. Um Mariam may talk in a few minutes about uh some of what happens with LITC and the quality of housing and things like that. Um do you want to jump in and speak to that right now?
I also just want to um just a quick commentary. Um for those of you that feel like you're fiscal conservatives and words like social freak you out, I want to say that this is sound financial strategy as well. It is the only financial strategy whereby you invest and get the return in terms of the building and also what you've invested.
So, um, while I we completely agree that the 7 million revolving loan fund and just to be clear is intended to provide a loan to developers to finish their programs, maybe get deeper affordability because they're getting a little bit more cash in their capital stack. Uh, this is distinct from that. And again, we need all the tools in our toolbox or or our are the backbone of our city and our thriving economy. our workers are literally slipping through our fingers and we're sending a message to them that actually Nashville is not a place to root yourself. It's a place to leave within two to three years because you can't afford it. Um so on top of that I want to just say um this what's really key that Andrew and Kate have both mentioned is the permanent affordability and the C3 ownership that comes out of the subsidiary. That's what Atlanta's doing. Um they were here just the other day at the chamber conference. they were lauded as kind of this model in the business community. Um and also um Chattanooga and again Montgomery County and elsewhere. So um Chattanooga for instance, they they charge an 8% and they plan to pay off their buildings in seven years. They get majority equity positions. So if I'm getting too financially, I apologize, but I want to speak to that because I want you to know that we we're serious about this and this is for a legacy for the city of Nashville. when we all leave there will be beautiful and that's the other important part. Uh LITC affordable housing is a great option. We should continue doing that into you know into the future. However, sometimes some of the requirements for instance the 30-year requirement or LITC makes it where you have to reindicate or sell that building to make it viable in any way. You're also really not making enough money off a lit building to make it somewhere that anyone would choose to live. It's largely a place where people don't have choices end up living. We're talking about a product that has value that is mixed income such that 70% actually pay a market rate and I know that's hard to believe but it is done across the country and 30% pay a 50% uh 80% AMI and over time because you have that 51% majority equity you can get to those deeper affordability issues that I don't know if y'all know that's what we hear about all the time is someone makes $40,000 as a line cook or social worker or a teacher and can't get into the AMI buildings because they still don't make enough to get in there or they make slightly too much but they can't afford that market rate. This would over time get us to that deeply affordable and it gets to preventing some of the stuff that we talked about with ERTC. So I just want to say all all the things in the buffet but it is important to put a little money in this and get this going.
Why? Because let the foresight study that um that director Hubard uh mentioned is going to be done in a couple of months. Now, if we don't fund a position or two in this piece, we are going to go another year without starting on it. They have some great people that I think they're trying to hire right now. And ideally, those will also be champions because this was in the United Housing Strategy. And we've talked to Director Hub and she totally is on board with all these concepts. But we just want to make sure that we're not waiting another year because we know time is ticking for our neighbors and we got to we got to get this going. Now, I will also just mention there are many ways to skin this cat, but um we've asked for 500,000 because you can have a variety of staff to make this happen. Uh a lot of it is legal fees when you're when you're building buildings and you're putting things out there and you need uh someone on top that's a real driver of this. Sometimes they come from the private market. Sometimes they've driven this in other cities. Uh that's what they've done in Chattanooga. And so, um we're asking you to finally like let's put some let's put our flag in the in the sand. Let's let's make a statement that we actually are going to do something visionary, ambitious, but do it in a smart and incremental way that in 20 30 years from now is making money for the city. Thank y'all.
>> One other thing I want to add to just about the budget um that you have on the back of the sheet um is that we uh reached out to some other cities including Chattanooga, including Seattle and some other places to talk to them to them about what their operating budget is internally and this is reflective of that. uh as a firstear kind of approach.
So um consultant fees are kind of high at the beginning but it could be that permanent staff over time take the place of consultant services. Uh but this is kind of an estimate for for this. Also, I will say that uh multiple cities have told us that having a director is essential, but also having an admin support person as well is essential. Um because it just goes way slower if you don't have kind of at least two hands on deck plus the consultant services to help help make it happen. Um there's more on the sheet if you want we can speak to. Um do you want to speak to something about real? Yeah.
>> Very quickly going off what Andrew said, yeah, we feel like we need a driver at this point. Um the planning department is doing incredible work and we have been sort of the ones answering the questions that have have gone from being broad why is this important to being very technical and we feel like for this to really go into like being an actual thing we would like to provide extra support for the great work the planning department is doing um someone who knows and who has done this before and can answer those really technical questions.
>> All right, thank you. and we will bring our planning folks back up.
>> Yes. Yeah. Because I'll Yes. Because we'll kind of go back and forth with questions.
>> And so there are multiple uh multiple council members put on their wish list the 500,000 for the staff. Um, and I wanna I'm gonna turn it over to Council Member Porterfield for a moment because she did something similar a similar structure last year with her fiscal year 26 budget with the Office of Youth Safety and um how some community members work with Metro to kind of build that um office up. And I think the the point is for this staff member to kind of serve that same purpose within the planning department and to work with the community. So if you can talk about that co-governance model and then we'll turn it over. I'll look at you uh director Hubard and and Lucy in terms of not Lucy Lisa in terms of how that could potentially work within the planning department.
Council member Porterfield.
>> Thank you chair. So, um, historically, government has kind of operated in a way where elected officials feel as though, you know, people elected us, so we're going to make the decisions that we believe are in the best interest of our constituents. Um, more recently, there has been a surge across the country of a model that's called co-governance. And co-governance is in essence democratizing knowledge. So, as council members, we get a lot of information that our constituents will never know, they'll never see, they'll never have access to. So a big part of it is democratizing knowledge to make sure that our constituency has access to that information. It's also sharing power. So as an elected official, you sharing your power with community members and community members also sharing their power with you, giving you access to spaces that you may not have access to as an elected official and vice versa.
So last year with the office of youth safety, we were able to do a uh actually two years ago, I think it's been two years now, we've been working with uh SMC, Southern movement committee on a co-governance model. So when we looked at uh looking at getting the funding for the office of youth safety in the budget, it was really important to me that as a government we didn't co-op the work that the community did and we wanted to make sure that I wanted to make sure that the community continued to have a voice in how we move forward with the office of youth safety. So prior to getting a director, we were in uh constant communication. We had uh SMC, myself and juveninal court clerk Lenel Matthews uh met on a consistent basis to discuss the office, the needs of the office. uh what it could potentially look like. We got in a relationship with the mayor's office and we were in a constant cadence of meeting with the mayor's office as well, looking at um the responsibilities for the office, the characteristics of the type of director that will work well um looking at research across the country on uh addressing youth violence. And to this point, we have continued to be in this co-governance relationship. Uh we honor and acknowledge and we're very thankful uh for Dr. Hilddrth and um Mayor Okonnell and the administration and everyone that has worked on this model um you know we acknowledge that uh ultimately um the decision maker is the person who has the job right so Dr. Hild is the ultimate decision maker, but we are doing this work in collaboration where we're having community partners sitting at the table helping to uh influence and give their expertise. And I think that this is a beautiful example of what the co-governance model could look like when we're talking about uh social housing. Uh I know uh myself and council member Parker actually uh went to study social housing. Uh so we um saw how social housing has been done in a few other countries. um the representatives from standup Nashville as well as people's budget coalition as well as uh Kay Bowers in the back who I see and a few others are experts on social housing and I think it's really important to acknowledge um like when I talked about budget last year um uh we all have like a different stake in the game right so if you're talking to finance finance is number one concern or uh their primary function is to make sure that our city is making good financial decisions well as a community advocate their number one concern is going going to be to sure that we are prioritizing the housing model and that may look different than the way that director Hubbert wants to uh to prioritize it. Everyone is bringing a wealth of expertise and everyone is bringing knowledge and lived experience.
So in that co-governance model, we are allowing the community to we're giving access to the community, making sure that they have a seat at the table and making sure that their expertise is being um considered when we're making these decisions. And I think that this is a wonderful opportunity to continue to practice co-governance in Nashville.
All right. With all of that information, >> so I'm not on the spot, right?
>> You're not on the spot. Absolutely not.
>> Well, first I would like to um thank the People's Budget Coalition, Standup, Noah, and all the advocates that have really put in the deep research on this.
They're they're actually much further along than than we are as a division. Um I think they've probably been working on this longer than our offices have been around.
Um, also, um, we've been hearing them loud and clear. Um, we've evolved the Barnes fund policies and our other policies to prioritize longer or long-term affordability, stronger tenant protections in our programs. So, if it really wasn't for their advocacy, we probably wouldn't have those in our programs now. And we've funded three housing cooperatives through the Barnes Fund uh, through with community land trust that will be permanently affordable. So, we're already starting to implement that across the um all of our programs and how we're looking at um we acknowledge the um state of play when it comes to tenant protections and try to where we can as metro uh make those as strong as possible. When it comes to social housing, we started with an engagement with foresight first to look at the performance of all of our tools because all of them are um very important as we've talked about, but we also need to clearly clear clearly identify what's happening in our market and how these all perform and what then the next model could look like because there are different the Chattanooga and Atlanta models are actually different and um our team and Janine Reed and her team went to visit both of these so we could learn ourselves.
Um where we are is um as foresight wraps up, we would like to share those recommendations with the groups here as well as with a national expert um in this um space, Paul Williams, to analyze it so he doesn't have to start from the very beginning with the analysis of our ecosystem, but pick it up where we where we've landed. Um, I think with the budget request I um I think but when and you'll have to excuse uh Lucy sends her regard. She was off today so we haven't had a chance to uh socialize the um the wish list request is is the conversation or the wishes to embed I guess staff within our division and planning or to have funding ready for the subsidiary to stand up because I think there's there's two conversations here. one might need a deeper and I'll let Lisa speak maybe to the deeper legal analysis because with planning being a chartered department that reports to the planning commission how all of that works versus funding for a subsidiary that we would still um have the uh community involvement in informing how that is uh created. So um Lisa if you wouldn't mind speaking maybe to some of the like if it's internal staffing things we would need to explore. Sure. Certainly. So the planning department as you all know exists under the purview of the planning commission which is charter created. Um the staff of the planning department is largely um contract employees of the planning commission. Um the executive director is she's officially the secretary of the planning commission as well. And so those are all um positions that are through the planning commission and we report to um the planning commission in regards to our structure and operations. Um so the housing division is is under Lucy um director Kemp as the executive director and then also reports back to the planning commission. And so, uh, we just haven't had time to sort of think about and look through what a co-governance structure might look like given our operational organizations being a charter, um, created department.
>> Council member Porterville, >> thank you so much. Co-vernance can have many different faces to it and I am happy to help you all hash out what that can look like. I actually train on co-governance across the country. So I am happy to for free tell y'all and support y'all in how you can co-govern.
In essence, it's just giving community people a seat at the table instead of just making all the decisions ourselves as a government. It's just saying we're consulting with the community. We're making sure that they have a voice and that they are in conversation. So that doesn't have to look a certain way. It is just sharing information with the community, taking information from the community and being in relationship. But we can definitely talk about that offline. But don't think you can't do it because of a capacity thing. Y'all can definitely do it.
And I think also there was a desire or there is a desire to have a social housing expert in house that is kind of guiding or guiding the city as the city decides how to structure its social housing model particularly when we get to the point where we can issue bonds like what that looks like and how that can be used for social housing. And so there is a so the staffing is a u an issue that needs to be resolved whether or not there could be uh even if that's a a contract person that is working with the planning department planning commission um to create a social housing model in conjunction with community members.
>> Thank you. We still have a h 100,000 from it's moving forward from last year to be able to engage with an expert on a contract basis to evaluate that.
>> Miriam, >> just to give an example, in Chattanooga, this was driven in the mayor's office first and the C3 was created as a subsidiary to the housing agency and then the director was brought in. So, it could definitely be a transition that happens. um hearing, you know, the the legal and regulatory things, but you just need someone to get that ball rolling and then initially that C3 is there or in the works of being there and then you can kind of put the people over there if that makes sense.
>> Gotcha. Okay. So, I think the question for this fiscal year is one whether it's appropriate to put or possible legally possible to put a position within the planning department.
um if it is, would you be accepting of that of funding to pay that person? Um I think as a backup looking also looking at the mayor's office as a potential spot to put that per person in and al obviously getting the buy in from the mayor's office um for that. But you agree that's where we are.
We are certainly open to the social model, social housing evolution and looking at how that evolves. I can't without director Kim Fier can't commit on her behalf on what we will do staffingwise >> but would love to have the further discussions on how we can have the deep community involvement in how this moves forward to achieve the outcomes that the um people's budget coalition standup and Noah have been advocating for.
>> Okay.
Council member Nash, >> I guess this is for stand up and Noah and People's Coalition. I think I heard uh the director say uh Mubard say that uh they have $100,000 maybe to jump start to jump start so to speak a consultant to bring on see what it look like for Nashville. Maybe the best within I'm I'm sure cooperation with you all. Uh is that something that's acceptable. We've already got something funded.
>> So, that was um in last year's fiscal budget. I'll start. Um we had planning had a $500,000 request for financial consulting and underwriting to take the next level implementation from the uh to looking at the tools. Are they scaled right? Are they targeted right? And then um uh Council Member Porterfield asked us to um or appropriated money for the social housing. We s we we didn't do those concurrently. We've sequenced those so that we could get this first study done and then have the social housing consultant instead of having two consultants looking at the same market data and doing kind of maybe duplicating work getting one thing done first and foresight street is the one who's who did all the evaluation on our catalyst fund. So that's what how we utilize them in this work. So now we can um as they're wrapping up be able to present this these findings of our market to help the expert really look to see what would work better here because how Chattanooga is doing their housing is different than how Atlanta is and there's those are all based on how their market is performing.
>> Could I just respond quickly to that? Um I think the studies has its value and but it's like it's a certain kind of function a study as opposed to um a staff member to kind of set something up. So I just want to name the distinction between someone to contract for a study and someone to start running and operationalizing something if that makes sense. So just want to name that.
>> Council member Nash did you have addition?
>> Yeah I not sure I got my question answered. the uh the $100,000 would provide the expert consultant that might determine how to best set this program up and then lead into bringing in staff so that the staff knows exactly what the program is supposed to look like moving forward and certainly part of the consulting I'm sure you all would be involved in those discussions. So, I was just curious if that was acceptable to you at the moment as we >> um I appreciate the conversation. Um I think the most important thing is having used a lot of consultants sometimes they're outsiders and they're sort of giving you advice, right?
They're giving you guidance. Um they can't necessarily drive a thing. I don't think they can establish like a C3 for instance, you know, this type of thing.
So, we just want to get at um you know, does planning there's also a position that the mayor's got this housing director, right? And these are out there. Is there a person that can because y'all are on so many cylinders on, you know, and we've put you on so many cylinders. Is there a person because a lot of times my experience with consultants is you have to consult the consult you you have to drive the consultant a lot of times and so um is there a person internally that understands Nashville understands metro understands it's going to be an MDH question that's going to be legal issues right you're going to have to work with all these that can drive that uh so that we set it up for um for for this to take off and I'm I'm just total honesty I'm I'm skeptical of an outside consultant and having that ability. So yeah, that's my response to that.
I would also say that probably the difference between where we are and where planning is is we feel like if and sort of the responsibility for council is like we feel like if y'all if the mayor's office feels like this is a good plan we should do this that we are like I have faith that you know down the line studies and come here and though but also like tides change really quickly and the political tides of this city you know heading into another election year we don't know what will happen. So we would like to also like see stability in the way that a staffing position provides that maybe a consultant wouldn't of being like this is something that we have the intention as a city to do to bring in and to build this program and to like again I think like one of the reasons and y'all are kind of seeing a meeting with us and the planning department and director Huard here is like they are so busy and it would be really nice for like talking about a co-governance model for us to have one person who is in charge of this is what I'm doing. I'm setting up this co-governance. I'm like answering your questions. I know how to answer them.
So, we're not always, you know, playing phone tag with Director Hover being like, "What about this? What about this?" You know, so that's sort of like our what we see the benefit of a position being.
>> Council member Evans.
>> Thank you, Chair. Um when we had the uh planning department conversation, it there was a really robust conversation on kind of this topic and one of the things that I mentioned um at that time was in 2023. Uh it's good that council member Gamble just walked in. Council member Gamble, Council Member Tombs and I were all on the bus in Atlanta touring properties related to this development corporation and how they had set up their corporation, seeing some of the projects that they were working on, um the impacts that they were having. And so I think about that from a that was November of 2023, it is 2026 now. We're going to have a year left of this term.
And so it's like if we're if this is a council that is going to be um take some bold action in the space to me this feels like a natural place to do it because of the dovetailed conversations kind of around metro and property that started last term um that has carried over. So you just think about the longevity and how long it takes. And so speaking to um Kad's reference about stability and kind of forward thinking, it's I feel like it's important, but I also rec recognize that if planning isn't in a good space or if the mayor's office is not feeling confident about this direction that that can break the whole thing. And so that's where I feel like we need to kind of maybe get some more guidance, whether it's director Kemp or um the mayor's office on on where they're feeling um about this. But I also feel like who's in charge and we have power and we should exercise that power on this issue.
>> Council member Porterfield.
>> Thank you, Council Member. Uh thank you, Council Member Tons. Thank you, Council Member Evans. I was over here giving you some amens. That's right. We have power and we can execute that power in the way that we see fit. Um uh I I wanted to um I piggyback on everything that you just said. Um, this problem gets worse by the day and every day that we wait, the problem is just going to continue to snowball. Um, and I wanted to answer Council Member Nash's question. The the consult the money for the consultant won't that that won't be enough. Like we put that in the money in the budget last year and I'm thankful that uh Director Hubard is uh willing to move forward with it. Uh but we're a year later and we haven't moved forward with the social housing piece. So we move forward with the financing piece. Um, and I also want to acknowledge I'm very thankful that we're in the position that we are now because a few years ago there would have never been a situation where you had community leaders, council members, and uh, Metro officials sitting down talking about social housing. So, I'm very thankful that we have made the progress that we've made, but we can't continue to like slow this down. The consultant will be great to advise us on what this could look like based on the financial model and the financial information that foresight has given. Uh but to uh Miriam's point, you really need a driver to really uh push forward with getting everything established. And also uh for anyone who's not familiar, it takes a while to hire somebody through Metro. So like even when we looked at like getting the director to the off for the office of youth safety, we put the money in the budget, but it still took a while. Like usually um HR has uh I don't want to say a hierarchy, but they are, you know, they have positions that are already in the queue that they're working on that they're trying to hire for. So funding for this position right now doesn't mean we have somebody that starts July 1. It may be November or December before someone even is hired at that point. Uh the consultant could be wrapping up their study at that point. So we need somebody that's willing to uh ready to take the ball and move it down the field once that consultant's done.
>> Council member Coopin, >> thank you chair and amen from me for both of what was just said. Um and um I'm very supportive of this as well.
Appreciate Kate's point. Um having a point person would be great. Uh, Director Harvard does a phenomenal job and I've sent many, many people her way.
Um, but having a point person for this social housing um, piece would be great.
I get, you know, as as you all know, my day job is in residential real estate and so I talk to people quite often who say, "What can I do to help? I know there's an affordable housing issue. How do I get involved? How, you know, can I help develop something? Can I help invest in something?" And so I get those calls a lot and I send a lot of them to director Hubard and she does a great job kind of communicating with them and giving options. But to have another kind of direct point person for this direct topic um I think would help also take members of the public who want to get involved in this issue um and give them some um someone to kind of run with in that particular particular lane.
>> Any I see council member Gamble.
>> Thank you all. Good evening everyone.
Sorry to be late, but I'm glad I'm right on time actually because this is one of the most important things that I uh listed on my on my u wish list. I didn't list the specifically the social housing piece, but learned a lot about it uh yesterday uh from the um representatives from Standup Nashville. And as Council Member Evans pointed out, we did see how this program works in action in Atlanta.
It was Atlanta. Yes. Yes. and um were left that tour of that facility optimistic about all the things that we can do in Nashville. And as she said, we are three years later and really haven't moved the needle. Um and so I see this as an opportunity to move the needle and as we're looking at funding towards affordable housing, it needs to be diversified. I mean, there needs to be a lot of different ways that we look at affordable housing, not just the Barnes fund. Of course, I support the Barnes fund, but we have to have multiple tools to achieve the goal that we're trying to do. This is another tool, as I spoke about yesterday, and I don't know if you all talked about that yet on the um on the list about housing preservation, is another tool for affordable housing. And so, it's not a one-sizefits-all. I hope we can look at diversifying uh the funding so that we're we have multiple tools in order to get broader results.
And so um I support social housing. I hope you all support the housing preservation and I I hate that I miss the presentation from planning about the status of of everything that you all are working on and I hope that this is something that you foresee. I know even with the uh housing programs funding that was in last year's budget, it took time to get that going. We're at the end of the fiscal year and you're just now kind of getting that funding out, but I'm hopeful that uh during that last year um you kind of got some things in place and and policies. I know uh even for the affordable um loan program, it'll take time to get that program up and going and policies in place and and it's like I would really like to see us move the needle on the programs we already have before we start funding new ones at a level that's really taking a bite out of what we have been doing and what we know is successful. So, I'll just leave it there. Thank you, >> Mr. Crinks. Did you have something to add?
>> Yeah, quickly just um in the spirit of the co-governance um topic, thank you council member Porterfield for for what you shared and council member Evans and others. Um just want to just this is a room that uh is deep in the halls of the of city hall and we're all here and there's a great deal of power in the room and I just want to name that right now our organization has people out knocking doors in apartment complexes around the city like literally right now and people are clamoring for this.
People are clamming clamoring for um housing that they can actually stay in.
We're all familiar with the notion of of of a desire for people to stay, right?
And people are telling us uh every other door we knock that they're not sure if they can. And so I just want to bring in the voice uh to just note that people in our community that we have been talking to um every day for the last few weeks as we go out and knock doors um are really eager for this type of program to come into the city. So just want to bring that voice in. Thank you.
>> And thank you for that. Uh it sounds like we will need to do some followup with Director Kemp. Uh we have several more work sessions uh scheduled. So hopefully we can get her in on one of one of those um so that we can continue to flesh out at least the initial like what it looks like and if you all can actually take on uh funding uh for a a new position um dedicated to social housing. Any other questions on the social housing piece?
Well, thank you so much uh folks from standup and uh people's budget. I really appreciate you you all coming and engaging with us.
Uh stay right there because council member Gamble, you are right on time because uh the housing preservation is the I believe it's the last thing uh that relates to the planning commission.
And so if you could talk about your wish list item and so we could flesh that out a little bit.
>> Thank you, chair. Uh and as I kind of alluded to yesterday, but not in much detail, I'm asking that we uh add $1 million from the affordable uh housing loan program to go to housing programs.
In last year's budget, uh we had a line item account for housing program programs and projects that really focused on uh preserving housing uh for individuals in the affordable housing space. You know, preserving keeping people in their homes is like the first step to affordable housing. Um and so I noticed in this year's budget there was no funding towards that effort. And so I have seen firsthand as a volunteer with be rebuilding together Nashville how organizations such as those help seniors particularly in neighborhoods that have been gentrified and where they can no longer really afford to live but own their homes. However, those homes are dilapidated and need a lot of work and they're cited by codes and but on a fixed income and can't make the necessary repairs. Whether it's a roof, a a fence that's laying down, whatever it is, these organizations fill the gap and help those individuals stay in their homes. And so, as I said earlier, there are several different pieces to affordable housings. There's not one silver bullet, and we need to look at all the different tools. And so I didn't have a chance to talk to Angie Hubard before I made put this on my wish list, although we've talked a few months ago about the importance of that program and where you all were on that. Um, and so I guess my question is as what is the status of the program as it is today with the with the funding from this current fiscal year and do you see the benefit in adding a million dollars to the program moving forward?
Director Hubert.
>> Thank you. Yes, in in the FY26 budget, we had 1.75 million for anti-displacement, and as you acknowledge, it takes a minute to get things ramped up, and we had been um following up on an announcement that Rebuilding Together um partnered with environmental court. So, we felt like it was a natural partnership there. Um it's my understanding council member that money because it was in the department budget is in our department budget this year rolled up in the general planning operating budget and we are currently we have um working with rebuilding to finalize that um and move that into move that forward beginning this fiscal this coming fiscal year. That's great news because in the past, Westminster Church and Rebuild Together has had to compete with Barnes funding, which in my opinion should be dedicated to new affordable housing projects, not competing for that. So, if that's in your budget and it's continuing, I'm good.
>> Yes, it's it's in our budget. But also this year with the Barnes fund, the um following a uni unified housing recommendation, instead of all the projects competing against each other, we and the trust fund commission approved um allocations by project type.
So we have a specific lane for owner occupied rehab only. It's not the biggest portion, but it's about comparable to what they've been doing.
Then we've got some federal grants rolling in where we'll also have opportunities to do home repairs. So, we're going to have um several millions of dollars flowing um soon around the preservation side of things.
>> That's great news. I know that Rebuilding Together has a waiting list of about 30 clients that are in need.
So, thank you for that update.
>> You're welcome.
>> Any questions around home preservation?
Thank you, Director Hubard and and Lisa.
Miss Milligan.
All right. Next up, um just going through the wish list, we have uh several wish list items related to fire.
So, the first one that I see looking at that same uh funding request by appropriation on page four, council member Evans, if you want to talk about your 75,000 for a mental health care professional.
>> Sure. So the 75,000 um which I know several other members have requested um would be to expand um the reach program specifically to have a mental health care professional that would be um working Thursday to Sundays uh specifically in the entertainment uh the edu.
>> Okay. And Mr. Young, if you could um speak to that.
>> Yes, ma'am. Uh Mark Young, National Fire. I think um first uh I think we should understand uh how we how our presence of the fire department and our EMS division is in the downtown area on Thursday through Sunday.
Unlike the police department, we don't have a full-time unit uh staffed there.
Our presence is staffed by overtime.
Um, and anywhere from 20 to 26 uh people would be uh from the fire department uh there on a daily basis, Thursday through Sunday.
Um, and no same person would work any of days other than one. They wouldn't work two days of the four. That it's just too heavy of a toll on that. uh shift Thursday through Sunday with their day work that they've already done that because we're there on overtime.
So what that is what that's meaning is it's would be very difficult for us to staff a reach personnel. Plus we you'd never staff it with one. Uh you would always want two there. It's unhealthy not to have two uh present.
You would our our problem with that would be it would take about four to five personnel actually to staff that. Now the wish the wish item is great. I understand exactly why the the request is here, but the allocation of funding is probably about 10% of where it needs to be. And even I mean I I think I've Councilman Coopin even has a match or asking for a match from the downtown partnership.
Um which would be great but we would need four to five to really staff that because of the hours and you know you got your vacation time that you got to consider.
You've got to you know other things that's got to be in consideration.
However, I do think that this is something that we should continue discussing and figure out how we get this in place. I do believe and many of the um Chief Swan and many of the U leaders of the department believe that this is something that needs to be continued and in the conversation to see how we can actually get this in place.
Um, but we we're we're way off on the funding request uh to get it done.
>> So, Mr. Young, is the was the additional personnel part of the modification request from the fire department? Is that in your um budget request that you submitted to the mayor's office? Because I'm I'm asking >> for reach.
>> Yes.
>> No.
>> Okay.
>> So, you didn't request y'all didn't request additional staff for reach?
>> No.
>> Okay. Y'all just asked for equipment, right? Is that is that right?
>> Well, no, there's uh a few administrative spots. Uh I don't have uh that request in front of me, but uh there was some uh I know there are some administrative spots, some equipment.
Um looks like maybe some uh help in our air in our air services department.
Yeah.
building maintenance equipment, a few administrative positions.
>> Yes, >> there is one.
>> Which way is >> one day? Yes, council.
>> She's saying that no, the reach is on there. I gave him my sheet so I can't look for it, but the dollar amount was 83,000, not 75.
>> Okay.
>> To your point, >> so what was submitted is >> five five paramedic uh FTEEs, one paramedic captain FTE, one Tahoe, and one wheelchair accessible van are needed to provide uninterrupted 247 mental health response coverage. These additions address the identified gap in response coverage caused by insufficient response capabilities. And yes, it's $83,600.
>> And what I'm sorry, >> Council Member Webb, >> what reading that I I just want to point out like the van during the ice storm. We didn't have that. So, anytime they came to get somebody they were picking up, they had to send a whole engine. I just didn't think I didn't think about that. I didn't see that on the list, actually.
But I can see where that would even, you know, we talk about how we put the mileage on these engines. Well, I could see where they would need that because during the ice storm when they went to pick up people, they had to send a whole engine.
>> I just wanted to make that comment.
>> Thank you.
Um, so would this 75 do anything for you?
>> No.
>> Council member Coopin Thank you, chair, and I appreciate it.
Um, so help me understand. So, what what would you need four to five FTEEs for to run a reach program in downtown?
>> We would need um five paramedics.
We would need to uh also uh involve health department with the for the clinician.
um the van, the transport, and um that that's about it. And currently Thursday through Sunday, if there is an EMS caller, let's say Thursday 9:00 at night, I call and I sit and there's an EMS call for that reg requires mental health, is there any reach professionals that are on staff at that point that would respond to that call downtown?
>> Yes.
And how how does so how does that work currently?
>> Right now right now we're running we're running two two reach units um if if they're available uh they would respond. But the the initial response to that call would come from we we we got two units down there. One of a fire cart and one's called a med cart. The initial response dispatch would come from the fire cart and then a med cart would be along with them and then they could make a determination based on the what they see if they want to dispatch reach or if it's something they want to go ahead and transport.
>> So then they would dispatch reach and where is reach staging waiting for those calls? Uh that they could be they could be at uh special operations center uh over at Fifth and Voland. They could be at a fire hall. They they'll be in a city uh placed throughout the city.
>> And are there more more reach calls than you have people for on on Thursday through Sunday? Or do you feel like those calls are um you know are they sitting around waiting? Are they are they always kind of on calls in the weekend evenings? I don't believe.
Okay. So, a lot of the 911 calls that come in from the Thursday through Sunday in downtown don't really come in and in real detailed information like it would be if somebody was at home because a lot of times it's just somebody walking by 911.
Hey, there's a I see a man down. We're at home. you say, "Hey, my so and so is here and he's got mental health issues."
Dispatch knows. So, a lot of times we don't know the nature of the call until we actually get on the scene other than man down. Man down is a lot of calls that come in Thursday through Sunday in downtown.
Now once we get there and we find out this is man down with some mental issues that needs mental health and not emergency room. That's where reach would come involved.
>> And so with those calls where reach you man down there's dispatch and then they say we need reach. Is that is reach always available or are there times where the reach is reached for and then not?
>> No no it wouldn't be always. There's a reach is making since reach has been implemented they're they're busy.
>> So with that being the case if there was an additional reach person focused for to give extra support Thursday through Sunday maybe not just dedicated to the downtown box. Would would that be would that be helpful?
>> Yes. And would that be something that that So it sounds like maybe that could be something that was operational not just in the downtown core but with the existing infrastructure.
>> Yeah.
I I was talking th this weekend um I was talking with some paramedics uh up at special operation about the conversation that uh was going on during the um downtown uh people's budget hearing that questions that was coming from them about this and there was some we was having some great conversations and they was thinking about how to make this work.
They know the need is there. And one of the paramedics, you know, is like, you are on to something. He was setting up that we needed a clinic. We actually need a clinic to handle this type um calls downtown that we can get the patient to a triage type place, assess the patient, and then move that patient to where they need and not take this patient to an ER when they don't need to get ER. The last thing the last thing someone needs in this condition is a bill from an ambulance service and a bill from an emergency department when they did not even need that. That's another stress level that's put on them that is unnecessary.
>> Sometimes that's your only option.
>> So it sounds like having a clinic or some space would be also also helpful to bring someone to kind of in a triage capacity. a clinic with a clinician or maybe two that can triage the care and you know it may be just a ride back to the room in the end or something. It could be something that simple but transporting somebody to an ER when that's not where they need to be is not healthy.
>> Absolutely. And so what would be what would if if we were going to kind of refocus this as adding a reach clinician Thursday through Sunday in the existing infrastructure um what what would what would the cost of that be? I'd have to get with all of the um divisions and come up with that. But I do believe that this conversation needs to start just like this the last presenter. you know, we're behind. We're behind. We need to get here. Um I think it does need to start and I think we need to put this in play and um solve the problem. I I know, you know, the council members don't have radios in their hand and listening to them on starting on Thursday night till Sunday night, but the call volume is unbelievable of fire carts and med carts. Uh and that's the reason they're down there. uh if they wasn't there uh getting heavy equipment and big equipment into downtown uh it would be it would be very uh uh troubling. Um however call volumes Thursday through Sunday is is very high in the area.
These natures nature of the mental health calls is there. It's there, but I think we need to start a discussion how we approach it.
>> Sure. Thank you, >> Council Member Nash.
>> Thank you, Madam Chairman. Um, I'm a little bit confused in that why we're taking people to emergency rooms when you have the mental health co-op that is basically a clinic where they will do some of that triage and and and h take them in or or and I know as a police department we've always taken people to the mission or to Father Strobels. U so what why are we going to emergency rooms if we don't need to?
Well, I mean, I I I guess they could take them to the places that My Here's my experience. My experience in this is um a lot of times they go to jail.
Um I I've seen that. Um, sometimes it's jail, emergency room. Um, I don't, you know, it depends on, it depends on the nature of the call, depends on what's took place here.
Sometimes somebody can be very agitated, uh, very aggressive.
Someone that's very aggressive, you don't just take them to room at the end and they get there and they're being aggressive to that staff. You know, it it it all depends on the nature of the call.
>> Council member Yuing.
>> Thank you, Chair. Um, thank you so much.
I just wanted to, um, drill down just a little bit on understanding that this is, you know, a little far down in your priority list. However, um in that line item where it talks about the reach program, it you talk about one wheelchair accessible van being needed.
So right now am I to understand we don't have any wheelchair accessible >> no >> transportation vehicle. Okay.
>> No.
If you were if if we were somehow to be able to find money just for that one thing in that line item, how much how much would that cost do you think roughly? Or do you have a ballpark?
>> Probablyund between 125 150,000.
>> Okay. And and what what kind of difference do you think that would make to the the calls you're receiving? How many times have you had instances where where you haven't been able to properly transport people because they have a disability and you're just not equipped to provide that assistance or where or where more resources had to be mobilized that that that constituted just sort of overkill because we didn't have any other choice.
>> You're talking about the non-ambulatory patient. Um, I don't have the numbers on the transport uh that we've had to actually call a ambulance because they're non-ambulatory.
>> Um, I don't think that's a big number.
But it's enough that we do pull an ambulance out of not out of service. they're in service, but they're they're somewhat out of service because they now they're just transporting um a non-emergency situation. Um but I don't I don't think it's a huge number, but it's a it's something that would definitely keep ambulances in service, you know, two or three two or three times a day maybe.
>> Thank you.
>> All right. Any additional questions related to the wish list item?
Sounds like either Well, we have to figure out how to fund this stuff, but sounds like we're either looking at what Council Member Evans has put forth, maybe something related to that vehicle or looking at that total request, which is huge.
Council member Evans.
Um, so some of what uh, Captain and I'm sorry, district director, I can't remember your new title. Uh, what you were talking about I think fits into another potential project. I think there needs to be some more more offline conversation. Okay. um because it it's I'm part of a little project team and I don't know that everybody's informed about this project team yet and it's not my project to be delivering any information but there's some synergy that I think should be explored and I'd like to help bring people together on that.
>> Okay. Council member Coopin.
>> Yeah. Real quick just um thank you chair. Um, yeah, I'd love to explore this further as as um that's looking at it as an additional staff member to kind of take that burden on Thursday through Sunday um in in a maybe broader capacity.
>> Yeah.
>> And so there are a couple other um items for fire that I think may have may be covered under the 4% fund that's on the agenda for next meeting. Uh there's one from council member Spain for additional funding for medical supplies for $395,700.
And then council member Webb, your $ 1.5 million I believe was for PPE. And there are a couple of requests. There's like $4 million in the 4% fund legislation that's before us next week for fire. And I know it's PPE and it's medical supplies.
>> Budget director uh Pratt.
>> Yeah. Um so the 4% that's going that you'll guys see next week does include medical supplies that um fire needed as portion of you know what was requested in this budget that we couldn't fund and also what they needed to um have for the rest of this year.
>> So does there need to be any further discussion on those wish list items or if there's any wish list item that I am overlooking for fire.
I don't see anything. Thank you, Mr. Young.
>> Thank you.
>> All right. So, we have several more and I'm trying to to stick to the 7 o'clock.
So, I'm going to pick folks that I think aren't going to take that long. I think we had someone for pet community if you could come on up.
And there are several requ several wishlist uh requests from uh council members regarding uh $60,000 uh for additional spay and neuter services. So, if you could just speak uh to the additional services that you could provide and if that $60,000 amount is accurate >> and introduce yourself. Yes.
>> Yes. Thank you everyone and thank you council for having us and for considering this. I'm Brandon Dice. I'm the CEO at Pet Community Center. And just quickly, if you're not familiar with us, we are Nashville's largest nonprofit veterinary clinic. So, we focus on prevention, prevention of core illnesses in dogs and cats, prevention of pet homelessness, and prevention of pet overpopulation.
So, we work very closely with MAC um on the outdoor cat program. Um we think they are the unsung heroes of our community. Um, one of the things we know that could help them most is certainly there are a lot our county is growing.
Um, but one of the things we want to see not grow is our pet population. Um, because right now one of the key ways that we feel like we can help MAC and help the citizens of Davidson County is just to prevent fewer stray, unhoused or homeless animals in our community. So for this $60,000, what we would be able to do is right now we're seeing a lot of calls. We have a a program called SNAP program. So anyone in our community in Davidson County that qualifies for any form of government assistance, they can get a spayneuter surgery at our clinic for $15. Um, right now we are filling that need, but we are hearing from a lot of county residents who make a little more than they need to to qualify for any form of assistance or we also have members in our community who cannot qualify for those programs but still need that support for that discounted surgery. So, we would be able to pretty much fill uh our demand is down about 20 appointments a week. So, we are hoping to use this additional funding to broaden that SNAP program so that more of your mid-tier or mid income mid-inccome households could qualify for a reduced surgery price. And so that 60,000 would effectively allow us to perform those additional uh thousand surgeries over the next year.
>> Any questions regarding pet community?
And my understanding is this and this is a direct appropriation to the pet community. So it wouldn't go through any particular department.
All right. I don't see. Thank you.
>> Oh, wow. Thank you.
>> All right. Uh Nashville General Hospital.
Good afternoon or good evening.
>> Good afternoon. So, there are several um several council members put on their wish list providing additional funding for Nashville General Hospital. Uh I believe during the last uh during their budget hearing, they spoke to a $4.3 million deficit. I know there's been some recent conversations with the finance department to uh identify some perhaps some line items that could be put in 4%. So, if you can just update us on where you are in terms of uh needing additional funding because I think the primary concern, well, I know the primary concern is making sure that those uh promise raises get to employees and so if you can update us on where you are in terms of your uh financial need.
Uh, sure. Thank you so much um for recognition of the employees and the other unfunded items. So, we have met with Metro >> Introduce yourself.
>> Good evening again. I am Kimberly Blackage. I serve as the interim chief financial officer at Nashville General Hospital.
>> Veronica Elders, the interim chief executive officer and chief nursing officer at Nashville General. Thank you.
>> Right. We have met with Metro Finance and we have identified a list of items that are eligible for the 4% and just to expand and speak a little bit about those items. These are items that are based on our actual spend for this current year of 26. And so we've received a document that notifies us of what is eligible, what is not eligible.
And when you think of supplies, I I'm happy to share some examples, but when you think of supplies, we use a large amount of medical supplies. We also have pharmaceutical supplies. A couple of those items will include as examples like a balloon pump, uh a surgical bed, uh workstations on wheels. So when we go into the patient rooms and we're discussing financial items with them or engaging in any activity, u we use scopes. We use echo units. They look like little hand ones, but they really kind of take pictures and outline the heart. So, those are just a few examples. So, we will be able to submit the list. Our intent is to get that list over. We're trying to get it over as soon as possible. We have a team working on it now. So, we'll get that list over. It will be vetted by Metro Finance and through their channels. And we believe that that would be appropriate to fund the 4.3 outstanding and others.
I'm off. Any additional questions for our representatives from National General Hospital? Council member Gamble.
>> Not a question. I just want to add that I didn't have that on my list because I knew our wonderful chair, budget chair would have that on her list, but I totally support it and uh think that this is a great step forward to continuing to make the hospital. So, I just wanted to add that little tidbit.
>> All right. And you know, I will be following up just to make sure just to double check uh that those numbers line up, but uh happy to hear that you all were able to get together and and and figure that out.
>> Right. Well, thank you, council chair, and thank you, council members, for this evening.
>> Thank you.
>> Any additional questions?
>> Oh, council member Allen.
>> Thank you. So, there was another line item that's council member Sard put in that was 7.8 8 million to do the 2% retroactive pay, which I don't know if we'll be able >> that that was part of their total budget request and then that was the $4.3 million deficit.
>> So that'll get you whole and >> that will make us whole. Cool. Correct.
>> Thank you.
>> Thank you.
>> Anything else? Thank y'all. Appreciate you.
>> Thank you guys. Have a wonderful evening.
>> All right. We do have I see one item for the health department.
There has to be more than that. Let's see.
Okay.
Okay. Okay. Well, I think the only thing left that's still under health department is the Antioch Health Study and that was submitted by council member Styles. Um, are you familiar with that? I >> I am not. Uh, Jim Diamond, I'm the finance director, health department, and I did discuss uh this with Dr. Areola this morning. We were unaware of this.
This wasn't one of health's asks, so uh we we did just see that in the uh in the request list, but we we don't have any information. And um Dr. Ariel didn't didn't have any hadn't had any discussions with the council member or I'm not sure if if she did with any of our other staff, but um I'm here to claim ignorance.
I know it has to do with a a feasibility study. Um and I know council member Evans, you've been council member Styles proxy.
Do you have any any notes on this one?
If if not, we can save it till tomorrow.
Okay, we we'll we'll just save that. Oh, Council Member Allen, >> not not on this one, but before we end up with with health, I do want to go ahead raise one question. Uh to circle back around to the the contributors sore program, which is um taking people from emergency rooms and stabilizing them and hopefully connecting them with SSI. Um that seems to be listed under nonprofit, which is why I couldn't find it. Um but I had put it under health again because things need to be in some department to make sure they happen. All the other ones are somewhere. Is there another department that that is going to claim that if if we should be able to fund that or or would that come under health and would health support that?
>> This was put in as as a request from health uh this year. It was not funded in the mayor's budget, but we uh Dr. Areola and Kristen Zach who's his executive administrator were in conversations with with the contributors. So, this was one of our asks.
>> Okay. Because I think there about five council members that that asked for that and I believe I believe this is where it belongs.
>> Okay. And you're one of those council members >> and I'm one of them >> for the for the viewing audience if you can explain what that is. So yes, so the cost the contributor had asked for 350, hundred I think dollars um and that would enable them to catch people as they are being released >> um from both uh National General and some other place other hospitals I can't from they had several specific hospitals that they have done this successfully last year um and both help work in housing navigation and also in um connecting them with social disability social security disability which can then enable them to um hopefully stay in housing and and be independent. It's been a very successful program. Their their rate is much higher than um other volunteers that are not as knowledgeable about how to navigate that system.
>> So, I'm looking at that and I and I saw it um yeah, it was under the nonprofit bucket because it actually mentions Nashville General Hospital. So, is this a program that is out of the emergency room at Nashville General?
>> Yes, chair.
>> Okay. and as well as one other emergency room.
>> In the proposal that we have, it only had general, but I'm not discounting the fact that some others probably did.
>> Is it administered by the health department?
>> Oh, well, >> that was that was the proposal. Yes, we the funding would flow through us. We would analyze uh the data coming from uh the contributor.
>> Council member Evans, >> thank you. I was just going to um council member Allen asked about the other um hospital. The other hospital program doesn't exist anymore. My understanding is it's only Metro General.
>> Okay. Thanks for that clarification.
>> Could you repeat what you just said, Council Member Evans?
>> Sure. Um, Council Member Allen had asked about was there another hospital involved and originally, I think when the pilot first started, there was. Uh, but then that program ceased to exist and the only program that remained up until April was the Metro General program.
>> Okay. But just to be clear, it um health is asking for the money so that health can administer the program.
>> That's right. I was more answering council member Allen's question about who else was involved other than Metro General.
>> And we'll uh this will come up again tomorrow because um I think there's also a program that u OHS is looking into. So, it's a little bit of conf I know I see the confused look that I am also confused in terms of of this item. Um, uh, I'm getting some information that OHS is also doing some work around this sore program. So, we can have additional discussion about it tomorrow, but we do know today that it is an item that health has requested um $350,000.
Is that was in health's budget request?
>> Correct. Okay. Are they okay? All right.
Any additional questions for our health department representative since we have him here in front of us. Okay. Well, thank you. Sure. Appreciate it.
>> All right. Let's bring up Metro Action Commission.
Good evening.
So, there are several um requests related to Metro Action Commission. Um Raphael Institute couldn't be here and I know one of those requests is related to their program. Um so there's 660,000 for training homebased child care providers.
I believe that's Raphi Institute.
um women's caucus continuation of the restorative therapist position that we first funded in 2022 and a study of its effects.
Um you also have that request. Council member Evans, do you want to give a little bit more information and then we will um turn it over to our Metro Action Commission um director.
>> You you basically read so basically back in um 2022. So we had uh worked with um Rafa Institute um on you know looking at child care facilities and how to kind of do a pilot to scale child care facilities. Well, one of the things that also came out of that conversation was um kind of the supports needed um for child care uh workers and and homebased providers. And so there was funding allocated for therapists that was specifically dedicated to folks who are going through that process. And then there has been subsequent conversation to what does that look like continuing? And then also uh what does it look like or what would it look like to actually determine is this an effective practice? Are these child care providers getting something out of this uh the supports that they're receiving? And so then the request, you know, was uh women's caucus discussed the idea of having um a study that would be, you know, part of Metro Action Commission. And so that's where the ask came from.
>> And are these programs we've done through Metro Action Commission before?
If you can introduce yourself and then you you have the floor. Sorry.
>> That's okay. Hello to everyone I haven't met yet. I am Jimmy Kab, the executive director of Metro Action Commission. So yes, the program, the therapist program started in 2022 in a partnership with United Way and Rafa. And so in 2022, we received $50,000 in funding over a two-year period. However, that funding did not sustain the entire program over that over that term. And so Metro Action Commission has supported the program in the absence of the funding. Um, we discussed with the women's caucus that that program because it is an outward-f facing program and doesn't necessarily support Metro Action Commission internally for our programs that that program was not something we were able or had the capacity to continue without the funding to support it. In that conversation was the discussion about um the child care centers to scale up when the program initially started in 2022 was for those child care providers because they did not have the funding to support the program themselves would be able to scale up with the support of Rafa. However, over the time period, there was some, I'll say, miscommunication or misalignment. Um, and so we've just continued the program um through MAC, but without the funding to support it.
>> And when continued the restorative therapist program, >> correct? They're the same. Yes, the childcare therapist and restorative therapist, they're the same. I think they're just defined as two different purposes.
>> Okay.
So it's we call it community counseling.
>> Okay.
>> So there is a $660,000 ask for training homebased child care providers and then there's $153,000 for the continuation of the restorative therapist position.
You're saying those are the same?
>> No, I'm saying the two that's listed as 153 is the same program.
>> Okay. Okay.
>> I am assuming the 660 and the 659 are the same program. This is the first we've seen it. So, I'm assuming it is the purpose of Rafa as pass through funds to support their program.
>> Yes. Okay. Are you familiar with the the training the home base that 660? Are you familiar with that program?
>> I am familiar with the information we had in 2022. Um it is my understanding that it is a continuation.
>> Okay.
>> Um >> we do have some concerns about the funding. Um based on its based on our history with the initial funding um the initial funding back in 2022, what that would require for MAC in terms of oversight for the for the program. Okay. So, what responsibility MAC would have for the use of the funds?
>> Correct.
>> Gotcha. Okay.
>> And to distribute the funds to the organization, what would need to be defined as part of that? A report to ensure the accountability of the funds.
>> Gotcha. Okay. But with the restorative therapist program, that's something that you all are already doing. And so that 153 would help MAC continue that program. You wouldn't have to would you have to pass those funds through to WFA or would you continue to do the program yourself?
>> No. So when MAC received the funding in 2022, we hired a staff person for that that they provide assistance to non I mean to um child care community childcare based programs where we just provide the support to those workers but it doesn't support Metro Action as an agency. We are supporting the community through the program to help child care providers and so the program is expected to end at its June 30th date without the funding to continue it.
>> Gotcha. Okay. And you all would continue to support the program even though it's not really an extension of any of the services you provide as a department.
>> Correct. And that was our conversation with women's caucus with the also addition of doing a study to determine if the program is viable to those um childcare providers that it is currently providing services to which has increased really just from 41 to 46. But again, it was not able to be scaled because of the funding that was associated with it from 2022 and MAC's ability to have to support the program moving forward.
>> And I may have have missed it. What does the resto restorative therapist actually do?
>> So, they actually provide counseling, emotional therapy, and support to the child care providers that are either homebased or community- based. So, they go out into the centers if there's anyone that's a childare provider as we understand that it is a very stressful job. So, if they want to have the opportunity to speak to someone, go through counseling, we do have a licensed counselor who provides that services and provides group therapy to those individuals. But it is a community-f facing program.
>> Okay. All right. Thank you.
>> Any um additional questions on the restorative therapist or Oh, Council Member Gamble.
>> Thank you and thank you for being here and thank you for all you're doing in this role as a new person in this role.
Um I just I had a question and I'm not sure if you can you can probably answer it. the 2022 funding did that that came out of ARPA funding if I'm not mistaken.
I know uh we the co 19 committee did uh allocation to United Way to do uh to increase homebased centers and also uh uh regular neighborhood centers and Rafa got a portion of that funding. So I'm I'm I can't I'm not clear if that was that funding or if it was another funding. No, I I do believe that it was a part of the ARPA funding, but I can always go back and look at that. But I do believe it was part of that because it was partially funded for those two years.
>> Right. Right. Okay. So, and I remember your presentation at the women's caucus and I think you did show that there was some value in the uh therapists. The one thing we one question we had and I wish we had still had somebody here from the health department because there was a question at that meeting about if the health department provided these kind of therapeutic services and maybe if that was a a better place or a more suitable place to funnel that funding if we're going to continue it to funnel it through the health department because they already have therapists as opposed to putting it on Mac who doesn't even do that program And then the second thing uh the other request the 600,000 I'm I'm I'm not and did we talk about that? Are we talking about that now too?
>> We need to get a representative from Raphael Institute to come talk about that.
>> Thank you.
>> Any additional questions for director Vice.
Thank you.
>> Thank you.
>> All right. Next we have see MN or IND dot.
Let's go with INDOT.
All right. So there are several requests um from council members related to INDOT and additional FTEES for for TLC.
Um, I'm looking for where it is in my in my packet.
Um well I'll just and none of those council members are here from what I can see but uh staff in staff INDOT to staff support the transportation licensing commission with two positions focused on micromobility.
Did you want to speak to council member Coopin?
>> Yeah, thank you chair. I can kind of jump in um since the TLC does quite a bit in my district. Um, and I spoke to uh uh Deputy Director Rooker today as well. Um, so my understanding is the that there are some concerns from commissioners um on the TLC that there's not enough staff um to specifically address concerns around things that they oversee, party buses, um records, taxis, etc. Um my understanding from my conversation with Director Rooker is that it wasn't an ask from NDOT per se, but it's something that um you know wouldn't wouldn't say no to the help. Um could you speak a little bit to what those FTEEs what they would do and how that would um impact kind of the current enforcement or increased enforcement?
>> Okay. Uh Kristen Cumro um INDOT assistant director of finance um the positions that are referred in these um asks these wishes um would be primarily for compliance inspection. So they would go out and they would make sure that they're complying with all of the um regulations policies related to transportation licensing. Um, we do have support staff in the office that helps to issue the permits and handle any questions that come in. Um, and we do have compliance inspectors already that go out and do that. Um, one of the things we would like to say though since this wasn't an ask from from INDOT, um, is that there is the opportunity to cover these positions with the upcoming fee increase legislation. Um, in the uh fiscal year 26 budget, we actually received five compliance inspector positions that have been pulled back, but if the fee increase actually passes council, then we can request those positions back through a supplemental.
So, we would definitely support and appreciate um the two FTEEs unfunded um at this point and then when we when the if the fee legislation passes, then we could get those the funding for those FTEEs. So, we would actually have a total of five um including those.
>> Thank you. And would would um would these compliance inspectors be able to issue things like noise violations for for party buses if they were would they be driving around and if they heard a violation, they could issue that?
>> Yes, they would be out in the community looking for um non-compliance.
>> Okay. Um just just for for context, um one of the challenges that we have with party bus noises um is that either a compliance officer has to witness it so that they can then take it to the TLC for a violation um or a member of the public has to witness it, document it, and then be willing to come to a TLC hearing is my understanding um to address it. So that's obviously hard to do to get a member of the public to do all those steps. And so um it is something that I know um some folks would be would be interested in.
Any additional questions around this wish list? Ask hear none. Thank you.
>> All right. Last but not least is M. Oh, one moment.
Yeah.
>> Um Okay.
All right. So, um little bit of confusion. So, I hear that the Office of Homeless Services is here. I had y'all down for tomorrow. But if you are willing, I know you've been sitting and you're looking at me like I will hurt you.
But but if you're if you're willing to to stick around for a few extra minutes, I don't know how long MNS will take. Maybe not that long. Uh and we will go ahead and address the wish list items.
Okay. Okay. So, it's fine for y'all to just go tomorrow, right? Okay. Cool beans. Problem solved. All right, MNPS, come on down. Last but not least.
>> So, uh, colleagues, correct me if I am mistaken. The only wishlist item that I see and many council members put it on their wish list is regarding the environmental stewardship towards uh environmental stewardship program. Most folks have 580,000 listed. I think Councilwoman Woman Allen, you had 270,000. If you could speak to where you got your number from.
>> Thank you. Yes. That's acknowledging savings from uh not having as many dumpsters be emptied because they would be composting it. So that's operational savings from that.
>> Your front loading savings, >> right?
>> Okay.
>> So that was that was the 580 minus the two 210 Councilwoman Porterville.
>> Thank you, Chair. If I could uh uh shall I direct the question to you or to Council Member Allen? I don't know how formal we are today.
>> We're we're all in for a community together.
>> Thank you. I appreciate that. Uh Council Member Allen, um are you saying to allocate 270,000 to MNPS to um make sure that they can uh benefit from the savings? I'm trying to understand the the number. So the the total 580,000 was to cover the cost of the program and some staff and some educational materials and things like that, but it also acknowledged that they would be saving $310,000.
>> I got >> that was the difference between the two.
>> Thank you. I have my numbers backwards.
Thank you.
>> And where did that 310 come from?
So, we we'll come back to you uh Council Member Allen once you have that answer, but I will turn over to MNPS and if y'all can introduce yourselves before you speak, but I believe most of the um funding sources were MNPS's own operating budget. Um, so can you all speak to this program because I know it was part of your I believe your aspirational budget. Um, can you speak to whether or not MNPS could absorb this cost within your your existing budget?
>> Good evening. Uh, Jorge Robles, uh, chief financial officer for um, Metro National Public Schools. um it is not considered in our operational budget. So right now um the budget includes um all of our continuation items. So all the uh $56 million that were allocated in the ordinance have been distributed about 70% of those goes to um um all the costs associated with investing on the educator. So the um the step increase, the cola as well as the insurance premiums uh increases um and in addition to that um we already considered in in the budget um budget efficiencies um approximately for 1.5% of vacancy rates and we still have to um reduce by $3.6 $6 million which is the cost of the pass through um metro charges u that we have u you know pending form for next year. So in in short that is that is not something that we currently can fit within our operating budget.
>> Okay questions from colleagues. All right. Councilman Porterfield.
>> Uh thank you chair and thank y'all for what y'all do. I'm a former MNPS teacher, former M&A member, and a proud parent of a MNPS graduate who is excelling in college right now. So, thank you for um everything that y'all do for our our students in our city. Um my question is, uh I understand you're saying that y'all cannot absorb it, but my question is if you had to, um where would that money come from? So, like what what would be cut if y'all had to kind of sacrifice something in order to be able to fund the uh program?
>> Um, we would have to essentially go to back to the drawing board. Um, we went through a pretty exhaustive process on identifying all the things that we wanted to budget for next year and we would have to essentially identify what would be uh one of the priorities that we budget for that we would cut. So, I couldn't tell you at the moment uh without considering all things since there are different implications that um budget items have um for the day-to-day um operations of our schools.
Um, Council Member Evans, >> would this be an appropriate time for me to ask um kind of an a finance operational question, but it's related to what I saw on the MNPS website about their budget or do you want me to save that because it's not specific to this item, but it's kind of a little related.
>> If it's a little related, I'll allow it.
>> Okay. Well, I was just because you know in the um budget presentation, you know, the reference to you can go to our website and look at the uh document that that is on the MNPS website. So I did I went and looked at it and so I was really more interested in you know these um I would say like interdep departmental um fees and charges like it as an example because I recall looking at there was an IT line item um and it looked like it was kind of metro IT or their IT and I guess and I we can pin it for later but it's just more like a holistic question around like what departments are we assessing uh fees to that than they are paying for that may kind of where we're is we go is another example. It's like where are we being um we char we meaning metro charging departments for things instead of just making like all of it a loss leader and you know that it's just there and and we pay them directly and then they support all these departments. So I won't take any time really getting an answer now but I think it's just something to talk about about why we do it like that.
Council member Mash.
>> Thank you, Chair. Um I'm uh so uh our roughly that we're talking about we're that um MNPS the MNPS budget is like around 1.3 million this I mean billion this year. Is that >> 1.4 >> 1.4 billion? Um, and so and then council member Allen's uh figure there was 580 and yours went to 270.
>> Okay. I'm like I'm I like that's below 0.02% of the budget. Um, uh, that that seems like it like it just seems like there should be some easily found wiggle room there to and we've gotten a lot of emails about this. Um, like I know, let me ask this because I've been curious about this since I stopped teaching um, right before COVID. Like when in your budget like is this a year for a specific textbook adoption?
Is that one of the things in your budget like one year is social studies, one year is English and um and I'm just wondering like since we've like like I mentioned COVID because we had to do virtual and so a lot of there was a lot of um online platforms that were invested in Dell. I we bought a bunch of Dell computers. Um, and so I'm just wondering like are we continuing to buy the big thick, you know, like textbooks, hardbound textbooks at the same rate when we have so much more in the last decade or to um, you know, like online, which should be cheaper. I'm just wondering if like I I I remember when I was in Metro Schools, it was and and was a part like uh Council Member Porterfield was a M&A me was an MNS teacher, MEA member, and I have a proud uh graduate that is thriving. Um and I just remember that like when we when we the those like MEA members and other teachers were organizing to uh get a get a pay raise or get something that we wanted out of the budget, um you know, it was like really look at stuff. don't cut positions because we need those people helping us, but like really look at um the stuff. And so I I would uh ask that you take another look at the stuff and see this. We've got a lot of um and and I don't think it's just a program. I think it'll be educational for a lot of students and beneficial for our community. Um I kind of want to ask another question if I may that is not about an item on here, but it's something that we have gotten some emails about. May I do that?
We are at 701. You will be the final question. Council member, >> we we are continuing to get emails um from Metro teachers who uh seem to be under the impression that we are the ones that give them their raises. And I find that it just and it's been a number of years and I believe that that wasn't the case back when Tennessee allowed collective bargaining.
uh that it it felt it I think it felt more like we knew that the um that the ask of the council was the amount that they gave the school board this the school system and now it seems like they believe that we are actually the ones that are supposed to give them raises why is that and I I don't know who that might be a better >> yeah sure uh so um I you know we don't try to position that as you necessarily give raises what we have talked about over the last several years is we've tied um a large percentage of our colas to the metro's pay plan. And so we work with the mayor's office. We provide an aspirational budget. We have to submit a budget um document before the mayor actually considers the budget. And so what we do is we provide what the cost of a cost of living increase will be every 1%. We include in our um our oper operational budget and our um our continuity of operations budget the step raises. So for every step increase, which is what, you know, if a teacher moves from one year to the next, they get a step increase if they haven't topped out. So we include that into that into that pay plan, but then we provide that flexibility in terms of what the cost of living increase will be based on what the mayor's allocation will be in the budget. And so u the mayor in the state of metro and in the release talked about items that they wanted to fund with that. And so we look at that u that those numbers and then you know we have gotten additional funding from the metro council in the past to further increase that when for instance they increase the metro employee pay plan. So if there was an effort to increase the employee play plan for metro we would certainly appreciate um a commiserate increase in order to to do that cost of living increase. And so ultimately the metro cu uh the the board of education um after the metro council adopts their budget will we'll take another look at the budget and then they'll they'll make their determination. So to the questions about policy anytime the budget is a policy, right? So we cannot sit here and say we're going to take money from this policy and give it to that policy. Um that's ultimately a board decision and and working with the superintendent. But uh but certainly we advocate for um additional funding and I know I'm sure the service employees union is advocating for additional funding for the for metro uh and metro uh schools employees as well.
>> And I guess part of my part of my ask here is that I I understand what you're saying and it does seem we've kind of gotten into a system of um that we try to align on the co on the cola, right?
Um, I think what would help some is and maybe it's happening and I'm just not as aware of it is if there's a little more engagement with the with the especially leadership of the groups but in and other other employees about here's what we're looking at right >> um I think that would be helpful.
>> Okay.
>> Thanks. Thanks chair >> and madam chair I found this information if I may do that. So we during the during the discussion we were we were told that the the dumpster cost savings would be between 178 and 270,000 in landfill cost. So that was the actually my math was incorrect but hopefully that's close enough that they could work with it. So I would just I would just again say many many people were very grateful for what the schools the 11 schools that participate in that pilot. My my grandson tells me all about how to compost because he's learned at school. So it it is it is teaching both the youngest generation who will then teach their parents that's part of Nashville's zero waste master plan. So I would love to push for this just as a sustainability thing could be a cost savings. So my question to you would be if we were to give you additional money in your in your budget can you at least acknowledge that we went on record asking you to use it for that?
Yeah, and I think that's been part of the aspirational budget process in the past is that when when the metro council has funded specific items, we've gone back and and added those in there. So, that's something that we always look at not being able to commit to what the board is going to do, but generally they have been amenable to when the metro council makes a specific request, they they try to fulfill that request.
>> Very thank you very much.
And we did have another wish list item and my apologies for that because uh council member Spain had a wish list item related to MNPS which was a for the comprehensive audit. Um we can briefly discuss it now internal audit we requested that they come tomorrow. Um so if there needs to be some further discussion from that perspective we'll have that tomorrow. But council member Spain if you wanted to kind of briefly touch on that.
>> Thank you madam chair. Just quickly, we talked uh briefly about this yesterday, but the the request, we haven't done a a comprehensive operational um audit since 2015 of MNPS. And so the request was to uh update that audit since in that time.
Our our student count has gone down uh by from 86,000 to around 81,000. The budget has essentially doubled from 750 million to one and a half billion. Um so I'll just leave it there to ask if you want to comment on on that.
>> Sure. uh you know in terms of there's two parts of that question. One was removing a million dollars from our operating budget to to fund that. Um that would require a million dollars worth of policy changes and and reductions in other programs in order to fund something like that. And you're talking about recurring funding source uh for one-time funding source is what I believe you're looking to do. Um which is to unless you're looking for a million dollars annually for metro audit. I'm not sure. But um you know in terms of the audit, we participate in annual audits with Crossland. We participate in specific audits at the request of Metro Audit. We try to be very responsive with those. Um looking at the for instance the 2015 audit that that was a comprehensive audit. You saw recommendations. I think they did a district uh organizational study and their savings was a million dollars a year for coupon books. um it was outsourced bus drivers, outsourced cafeteria workers, outsource facilities.
So that's the type of thing you might get with an audit of that nature depending on how you would frame the scope of that. And so it might be a policy conversation as to what you know the metro council wants in that because while an auditor or or a finance person might say yeah you can save a lot of money by by by outsourcing transportation uh from a school's perspective and having that internal perspective. We know that having our own bus drivers and paying them well is really important to provide safety for our students as well as um we've heard plenty of like horror stories about audit you know transportation outsourcing. I'm not saying that's necessarily what this would go. I just that's that's one of those things to be considerate of when you talk about kind of the comprehensive audit of those natures.
>> Yeah, sure. I I appreciate that. And I'm I know you participate in regular financial audits. I think I'm more interested in the in the performance aspects that we would talk about and and proficiency levels. Um we of course all aware of what's going on with Memphis Shelby County Schools. You know, the state has taken a great interest in um their proficiencies or lack thereof uh and have did their own audit, you know, a very extensive forensic audit and use that as a basis to take over their school system. At this point, none of us want to see Metro National Public Schools in that in that boat. Um, so I just I feel like it's it it behooves us to make sure that our own houses in order before someone else tries to do that for us.
>> I I I do. Yeah. just uh in terms of you know kind of proficiency um what we've seen is year-over-year increases in proficiency above what the state has done in terms of our our students performing. We've seen the the highest two graduation rates in the last two years. Um you know the metro council and the mayor's office along with the board have invested significantly into student support services and positive school supports. We've seen uh a significant reduction in behavioral incidents as a result of those investments. So, the investments that the the Metro Council and the city have made have seen actual results for our students. Um, and so it all kind of ties back to the conditions for teaching and learning and making sure that we're improving those. So, um, you know, unfortunately the budget process doesn't align with TECAP. Um, so, you know, I I believe we're going to have some some positive results coming out of it. um we it's embargoed until the state releases it. So, we can't really talk too much about that, but I think we've seen those investments tied to that. And so, and then just in terms of, you know, where MNS lands as a percentage of the overall metro budget in terms of revenues, um we've seen it that decrease over since let's say 2017, 2020, it's decreased. Not not not to say that they haven't invested considerably in MMPS, but as a commiserate share of the overall share of revenue within the city, there has been a bit of a reduction in that um over over the sort of a 8 10 year span. Last this particular budget year, there's a slight increase in that. So, we appreciate the city putting that investment in there.
So, I just wanted to kind of put it in that context. But, you know, the the city council or the metro council, the mayor, um they've all been very supportive of increasing employee pay.
And so, the vast majority of our increase goes to that, just like the the vast majority of the metro government increases going to the pay plan and benefits. The same is true for MNS. It's going to fund those. It's going to fund those internal service fees and a variety of other continuity funding. And if I may I may add that makes a tremendous difference on our ability to actually recruit and retain quality teachers. And as you know we have uh seen the the needs to support uh students with exceptional needs. You know multilingual learners. uh is paramount that we actually are competitive and we offer um you know a way to actually attract educators that will actually provide the services that then translate into the results and outcomes that that Sean was referring to.
>> Absolutely. And I I I don't want to give into a running thing about this. I appreciate all that. I I just I think we ought to be able to show how those increased investments over time are driving student outcomes um and and helping us recruit the best and brightest and and all that sort of good thing. Um, and I don't think it's unreasonable to to take a look at that, you know, at least once every 10 years for a department that does still constitute more than a third of our of our budget annually. Um, as far as the funding source, you know, I understand the concern there. It is a one-time ask.
Um, and we had talked some during your budget hearing about you you have a a targeted amount of savings uh for salaries. I think it was 1.8% which I think you said for this year was like $18 million. I don't know if that's a viable source for something like this or not.
>> That is already included in the budget.
is considered as part of what helped us essentially meet u the allocation.
>> So it as as Sean referenced it an additional taking one million out will be a change in policy that we would need to essentially work with the board to figure out what would need to be reduced.
>> Thank you for that.
>> Yeah.
>> Council Portville, you have something.
>> I had a clarifying question. Um uh did I understand you correctly? Like were you saying that the percentage of the budget that goes to MNPS is what has gone down over the last 8 to 10 years?
>> If you look at all the the revenue sources, so the big $3.7 billion number I think it is, you know, as a percentage of that, the MNPS debt service and MNS operating budget has gone down since let's say 2017, 2018, etc. So um that's >> the percentage and the overall city budget >> of overall revenue share. um the MNPS budget, we have definitely seen an increase in actual revenue from the city, let me be clear, and we've also seen an increase in the percentage of our budget that is funded by Metro. So, yes, to to that point, um the state level of funding has gone down over those last 5 years, whereas the city's percentage of of investment in our schools as a per pupil basis and as a budget basis has certainly increased as a result. I think we've gone from we were looking at the numbers we were at uh 30% maybe 2019 >> it's about 58% local 38 state to now it's like 7418 >> yeah but and and but to be clear year after year metro government has been given more right and I just wanted to like name that for the record because like for the constituency that may be watching that language may a little confusing and thank you for the you know the city has gone up the state has gone down and I think that that becomes a a point of um tension for for us and just frankly a point of of tension like nobody wants to throw anybody under the bus so it shouldn't be like council members versus schoolboard members but it is literally tension in the fact that we have a $3.8 billion budget and we have to fund the whole city with $3.8 billion. So when we're giving like 1.4 4 billion to schools. Like we have to do debt services and everything is left. We have to do the whole city. So it's like we want to be able to give more and we know that our students are our greatest asset and we want to continue investing in schools and giving y'all more and more and more. Um and also like recognizing that it's really the state that needs to be given more and it puts us at a point of tension of y'all are having to make really tough decisions and we're also having to make really tough decisions. So I just wanted to like name that. I'm also one of the people that supports the sustainability um supporting you all finding it within your own budget because like we have to find it within our own budget when we're like that's literally the point of this work session is like we're trying to figure out how do we find in our own budget to fund the stuff that's a priority for us. So like I would just advocate for if there is a way to find it to find it because we are like doing the best we can. We're also robbing Peter to pay Paul. I know that's that's what y'all are doing. So, I just want to like name that like I feel like that's the elephant in the room and nobody's saying it, so I'll say it. Like that's just the the the point of tension.
>> All right. And I think that is a good place to end.
Thank you all uh for your patience. We will be here again at 4:30 and we have some other departments and organizations that are coming um tomorrow as well.
This has been a service of the Metro Nashville Network. If you would like to see this presentation again or for more information on this and other programs, visit nashville.gov.
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