The Super Bowl is coming to Nashville: Is the financial value of the game OVERRATED?

Added: 2026-05-28

[00:00:03]Welcome to Lamestream here on the 440 Sports Network. I am Braden Gaul and you can get to me on the internet. Normally, this is where Steve Cavendish of the Nashville Banner would introduce himself and I would pray and hope that he didn't start his introduction with uh >> that articulate is he >> wait when when Cav's away I get to give him a hard time. Uh, and convenient that he's not here either because I'm going to brag about being right about the Super Bowl. Paul Kaharski of Paularski.com is filling in. PK, how are you?

[00:00:36]>> I'm well and I want it to be known that I'm considering myself a guest, not a co-host. We were just fighting about this coming on the air. So, special guest Paul Kuharski.

[00:00:47]>> Fighting is a loose term, PK. It's a loose term. Doing a lot of work in that sentence. Fighting. Fighting. Uh, all right. So, I have a question about why uh I I have a question about my first journey through EPL soccer uh but more less so about my journey more so about how they decide a champion. And I want to ask your opinion on that as we are very close to the World Cup just a few days away from the USA men's national team making their choices on who is going to be the roster. And of course this weekend Nashville SC will take its break. They will have their final game uh before the break and they'll be out of, you know, out of commission for a long time during the World Cup. Uh, you teach a media ethics class at Belmont.

[00:01:24]Is that correct?

[00:01:25]>> I uh I taught it in the fall of two 2025. I taught it twice in the spring of 2025. I will teach it twice in the fall when I'm expanding to teach two other classes as well.

[00:01:40]>> Okay. Well, I want to hear I want to know uh throughout your career and with young people today how ethics has evolved through technology changing. I'm going to ask you about that coming up in a little bit. So, we'll talk a little bit about your class and your work with Belmont around media. Uh there is a I this was I was so glad. Look, I'm never glad that Cav's not here, but I was so glad I get to talk to you about what happened with the Vegas Golden Knights because because the head coach just won a playoff series and refused to speak to the media after winning a playoff series and then they did not open the dressing room either. They got fined a large chunk of money and a major piece of actual team capital. So, I want to ask you about that coming up. And I know you're going to be in good shape for that one. I know you're I know you're in good shape for that one. Um, and of course, the Super Bowl is coming to Nashville in 2030. But before we do any of that, Lamestream Sports is brought to you by >> is brought to me by I >> Eighth and Roast.

[00:02:42]>> I don't Where is it on the screen here?

[00:02:44]I don't see.

[00:02:44]>> Eighth and Eighth and Roast. Uh, the beans are just better. Eight and Roast.

[00:02:50]four great locations, Charlotte Avenue, 8th Avenue, over at Vanderbilt, and two different locations technically in the airport. They are wholesaliled at over 350 locations. Uh, and uh, and you can buy them at retailers all across the the city as well. They are >> This is what I know about Aan Ro. It was put in, I think, through you, into the press box at the Titans uh, Nissan Stadium. Now, I'm not a coffee drinker, but everybody was excited at this addition to um not the not the best u selection of food in the league, and I don't like to complain about it. It's it's free and they're accommodating to us. Um but um coffee drinkers at uh 10 or 11 o'clock on the morning of a Titans game in the press box were raving about uh the new coffee available to them this season. Seemed to really enjoy it and uh think they needed it based on the way Titans started a lot of uh a lot of their home games. Uh, and Aan Roast of course in the facility as well for for when you guys are all there and all the press are there doing all these different events. You've got all kinds of snacks and stuff in there, but the Ethan Roast coffee is featured there prominently. Now, I would love to take credit for this. I can't let that go. I was thinking about just letting it go and just letting it hang there that I'm the one who did it, but I can't let that go because I'm a man of integrity, PK, >> and I'm pretty I'm pretty sure Ethan Rose paid a fortune to be the official coffee of the Tennessee Titans.

[00:04:20]>> Is that right? Well, they're the coffee beyond the press box. Uh, >> that's right. They are the coffee in the press box at the facility and also they've got they've got two um setups uh on both club levels and they're on the first level as well uh at Nissan Stadium. This will be the last season of course at Nissan Stadium and they are there. They I'm pretty sure that that is not a cheap contract to be the official coffee partner of the Tennessee Titans.

[00:04:44]So, I cannot take the credit for that.

[00:04:46]>> Well, good for them. It's uh by all accounts of the coffee drinkers in my life who are connected to the Titans, it is quality product.

[00:04:55]>> I I you don't you won't understand this, but if you drink coffee at home and you buy beans and you drink co like if you do that changing to the eighth and roast beans and grinding them each morning for your pot of coffee like I do at my house, it it it it will change your life. You don't realize you're doing it wrong until you try the real stuff. So, Ethan and Roast, everybody. The official coffee of Super Bowl 2030. Can I say that?

[00:05:20]>> No.

[00:05:20]>> Can I say that? Uh, worst kept secret.

[00:05:22]>> They're probably not policing that yet because they have three Super Bowls to police before.

[00:05:27]>> They're not. They're not. Uh, so I will take a victory lap here and I'll do it again next week when Cav is back because he has been saying February of 2031 on this show. I have been saying February of 2030. We confirmed it two weeks ago on other podcasts uh that it was coming in 2030. I've been saying it for almost a year. The Super Bowl is here in 2030.

[00:05:46]And apparently, PK, after 60 plus years of executing one of the most watched sporting events in the history of this planet, Burke Nihill, Jim Nance, Eric Church, the Tennessee Titans, Freddy Oonnell, Bill Hasslam, they're going to reimagine, reinvent, and redefine the Super Bowl in Nashville. Yeah, I was at the press conference on uh Wednesday morning and I wrote a little bit about that and and quite frankly, it's hard here to write about this at this stage.

[00:06:19]So, I was glad there was something to react to at at this. I have a few other things though, right? But, uh not well read so far. I mean, I think this story, you know, everybody knew it was coming and it came and it's official now and I think everybody's excited that's official, but there's like not really anything new about it, right?

[00:06:38]>> Um, outside of the officialness. Um, but I thought it was interesting that several of these people, Burke Nyhill and Peter O'Reilly, who's the NFL executive who's in charge of this area, both kind of said that redefine uh reinvent Super Bowl. um on on the stage and then you know Sus and I were both asking them questions about it and they both admitted well you know it's a 60-minute football game which the nuts and bolts of that can't change but uh you know we're really looking for ways to take it to new places and everything and we did that with the draft. Well, the draft was an infant in 2019 in terms of being an out of house, out of uh uh >> like on location >> radio music hall um and on the road as a road show. And so there was a lot of room to help create what the draft was and Nashville did an excellent job at that. I don't know how much room there is and God bless them if they come up with stuff and I'm anxious to to see it, but I've been to many Super Bowls for the whole week and you know, you can create different events and stuff, but the the spine of the thing is the spine of the thing and the fun of it is the anticipation of the game and hopefully good good weather and good events and good sponsors and I think that grows uh every year and sometimes it's exponential. rather than incremental based on uh America's love of the biggest thing. But reinvent is an awfully big word.

[00:08:15]>> Do you have anything like is it possible for you to think through as a fan or observer through some of the games that you've been to where you noticed something a city might have done a little bit differently, maybe a little bit more authentic to their story as a city? Is there anything that comes to mind when I say like, man, when you've been to all these games, what stands out to you as something a host city did that might be different or unique in that sense?

[00:08:40]>> Well, uh, the first thing that pops to mind, I don't think was an Indianapolis thing. It was just a cool new innovation, right? They built that JW Marriott, which isn't very far from Lucas Oil Stadium, and they had one of those gigantic stickers up the front of that hotel, which I hadn't seen before. They've become pretty common place now, but it was the maybe that was the first one. It was the beginning of that era where you had one of those that covers, you know, 30 floors of a hotel and doesn't block the view out the window of the premium hotel rooms and it had the Lombardi trophy or the Super Bowl logo or both or whatever where from every vantage point in Indianapolis with that being the biggest skyscraper in a small footprint, you saw it and it was in the background of everybody everybody wanted a picture with that in background and everything.

[00:09:40]And that was a visual stamp of that Super Bowl, which I think very uniquely branded that Super Bowl in a way that I hadn't seen one that I'd been to before.

[00:09:53]Branded with a >> let's call it a monument, right? A skyscraper turned photo op.

[00:10:00]>> Right. Right. Do So this I've been thinking about this on a different for different reasons. mostly as a parent like everything today in like our cultural experiences are are being catered towards digital experiences. Let me say what I mean by that. Like you the number of places in Nashville where it is clearly designed to be a backdrop for an Instagram shot, right? And I'm saying that as a catch-all for all social media posting that you something happens in your life and you got to post about it.

[00:10:28]You got to take a picture of it. You got to take a video of it. If you don't post about it, it didn't happen. Um, I hate that generally about life, but I do think that we're seeing that. Do you think that has changed at the Super Bowl events? Like more and more of that type of thing has happened because I can see >> changed at every big event where they're setting up things for you to do that at the uh >> I mean, Nashville is going to have a lot of I imagine a lot of that stuff with all the glass buildings downtown. It's going to be overrun with that stuff.

[00:10:58]>> Absolutely. and they really emphasizes the footprint at this press conference.

[00:11:02]So, the idea of something being at Opry Land or in East Nashville or uh you know, Belmont's got good event space just because we're talking a little bit about Belmont or stuff. seems and and I think look, they've reserved every building in town as an option, you know, so if they're thinking of uh NFL honors on Thursday night, you know, I think most people would automatically think the Ryman. I've been to that several times and I think the Ryman's a little snug for that. Like I think the charm of the Ryman with the pews and everything is one thing, but shuttling so many celebrities in and out of that building and having them shoulderto-shoulder in the >> large large a large celebrity group.

[00:11:52]>> Yeah. Especially Yeah. with a lot of football players that might not be ideal, but I I got the sense that they don't want to ship things on shuttles and buses far outside of the footprint.

[00:12:06]Now, you know the two teams will stay out. You would presume one team would be at the Titans facility and another probably at Vanderbilt, though they like to get those things >> further away from the core. And those are both pretty close to the core, though I don't know >> what you know how good Endworth is. That would be further away. Um, you know, >> Endworth is a is a college campus. Like it's a high >> and that's further away, but still not, you know, I'm thinking more, you know, what's 30 miles outside of town.

[00:12:39]>> Oh, okay. Um, I do think so. The the AFCA, which is the American Football Coaches Association, which is a college football coaching convention. A lot of times it's held at at Opryland. And then the and then the event itself and the TV show is actually shot at the Grand Old Opry, which is larger than the Ryman.

[00:12:55]like it just it just kind of is. And so what I'm curious about to be honest now that I'm thinking about it is probably TAC because they will have it'll be on the river. It'll be built down on the river. Brand new building. It's supposed to open months before the Super Bowl.

[00:13:10]You know, construction overages are a concern there. Um but it's going to be super swanky, super fancy. It's going to be baked into the campus that will be on television for this Super Bowl. The renderings are really cool looking. It does look like it's elevating kind of the city's status architecturally because >> Nashville architecture leaves a lot to be desired in in in my opinion generally speaking downtown. Uh and so I think I think they have a 6,000 seat room at TAC and they're going to have a 2,000 seat auditorium. The Ryman's about 2,000. So again, we're down the rabbit hole here on where the events go.

[00:13:42]>> Plus, you got extra space, you know, like like a place like the Ryman. A lot of cities have done their equivalent of the Ryman, you know, and then this press conference space and stuff is really tight. Now, I don't know if they say, "Hey, it would really be ideal if we had a place that had more space than that."

[00:13:59]Or if they say, "We don't give a damn about that. We'll just shove it wherever it needs to be." Yeah.

[00:14:04]>> You know, but they're introducing the Hall of Fame class and they're they're doing interviews with the media and then they're doing SiriusXM, you know, passing them around and all of that. Certainly would be better if there was a better green area in that building. And I would imagine a new TAC would have something like that.

[00:14:27]>> Oh, yeah. or you know like at Bridgestone they've got that that back area that's like a secondary thing. Um they could do that. I I also don't know that that thing like radio row I imagine would automatically be at the Music City Center but I don't think there's any foregone conclusion. I think uh what's the the the outdoor thing that they have generally? Well, no, it's indoor and it's always been in the convention center. The thing I've been the NFL experience has been kind of adjacent to radio row in most of these places >> in the convention center. I don't see what the alternative to that is or why it would be. That convention center is perfectly suited for and and it will be placed and I and I I don't remember the name of the hotel. I think maybe is Nashville Yards maybe. I'm not sure what the hotel is g that's that's an area they're g the Omni right now is currently the largest hotel in Nashville. They're opening one that's going to have more rooms than the Omni in the next like I think it's in the next couple of years. And so the idea be you know you could have a bunch of uh executives or team employees or whatever. I don't know where they stay normally if they're with the team out at the facilities or not, but you could easily put up everybody that's going to be involved in these things in the two biggest hotels which kind of are on either end of of the Music City Center.

[00:15:44]I assume the downtown camp the downtown campus will be totally activated in every possible way. And uh that will be the gist of it.

[00:15:52]>> Like the practice facilities aren't as big a concern because they're so secure, but the team hotels like I automatically think of that Marriott out by the airport. I don't know when that's been redone, but that's the kind of place that teams stay kind of isolated and away.

[00:16:07]>> Um, >> that makes sense.

[00:16:09]>> You know, Opryland could be a candidate for one if there's a cordoned off kind of they get one of the sections.

[00:16:16]>> Yeah, that makes sense. Um, there's a lot of stuff here I want to get to with you about this. Is there anything in partic So here's the other thing that I've been asked a lot about and I want to get you know this isn't necessarily your wheelhouse but I the the group chats are are are lit up with the the the halftime show and that's years down the road. Obviously music is a huge part. Burke said it you you know you had a quote in your story from Burke about sort of the creativity and the music as as being the fabric of the city. Um, I I think people are assuming automatically that this is going to be an enormous collection of country stars. And while I think there will absolutely be a country element and that Nashville as a city is going to want to showcase that, I I generally speaking, and this is more the question to you, the NFL wants number what's the number one priority for the NFL during the Super Bowl? Get as many people watching the game as humanly possible. That is their number one goal.

[00:17:12]Period. And if you can get more people watching because of the halftime show from an international standpoint, from a diversity standpoint, from a differing audience than the audience that loves football, which is international, diverse, and women mostly speaking, then that is why they go the direction they do with their halftime performers. It's not political. It's about eyes and ears.

[00:17:36]And so I don't if you just put a bunch of country acts, old school, new school, mainstream or outlaw, whatever into a one halftime show, you are drawing a circle over the top of your audience.

[00:17:49]White white men generally speaking, are the ones who are listening to that stuff and it doesn't have the you're not drawing in a new audience. So what are your thoughts on the on the strategy behind the NFL? My my guess is I'm going to call it country plus >> is gonna be their strategy.

[00:18:07]>> Nashville doesn't like the fact that country music isn't uh popular to the depths that that that you're talking about. It doesn't have that cross cross appeal. And there's a reason. Look, the music is not often keyed to the city that it's played in. the who played Miami when I covered Colts Saints who has nothing to do with with Miami. Um, so I I don't think it has anything to do with that. And if some of these country acts warranted in the NFL's eyes a thing, they would have played. And there hasn't been a country act since an amalgamation of country acts that was >> 15 years ago now.

[00:18:50]>> Uh, before the halftime show became what the halftime show is now. Look, the clear-cut best choice, which has cross appeal and would be perfect for Nashville, is Taylor Swift.

[00:19:02]>> Now, maybe they get Taylor Swift before Nashville with Travis Kelce out of the league. That's one of the re there were two big reasons she wasn't doing it. One was uh I can't remember who was sponsoring it, but she was connected to the other was Pepsi was sponsoring it and she's a co person, >> so that was an automatic no. And then she's she said I think on the record like it's Travis's thing. I don't want to be in his arena. So he's gonna be out of the arena after this year presumably.

[00:19:34]So that would open things up to her. But you know why not in Vegas the year before? Why not in you know SoFi this year? about this year.

[00:19:45]>> Well, the LA one was a lot of like it was kind of a I think that's the one that I think of when I think of like actually the city and the culture overlapping, which was that enormous collection of hip-hop artists from Southern California >> that I think did that. And and of course, didn't they bring out Eminem? I feel like in that group, too, which is But if it makes sense, he's from Detroit.

[00:20:03]>> It's perfect, you know. So, if she hasn't played it and you could get her, that would be absolutely killer and a no-brainer. And that's what everybody's going to match up until something else happens. Ultimately, the NFL's decision, uh, Nashville's, you know, planning committee will have, >> you know, the ability to, uh, nudge, encourage, etc. >> That that So, that's what I've been telling folks is be prepared for this not to be nearly as Nashvilleian as you think it's going to be with just a bunch of like hardcore country acts all together coming together to create this great thing in your mind.

[00:20:40]>> Minutes. It's like don't get carried away with how many acts you can get in there.

[00:20:43]>> I think it is going to be I'm going to call it country plus, but really the plus is the lead. So this is I would use Taylor as an example as well here. Like I would think you could do something like Ed Sheeran who has got this n international appeal who's a big rock star in theory, but he's got a little bit of tie. Like he's been caught at Santa's pub before, right? Like he's he's in town a lot. He's very close with Taylor Swift. And so Taylor comes out and does one song and then you have Dolly come out and do one song and all of a sudden you've got one little Dolly touch, one little Taylor touch, there's your hat tip to country, but really it's Ed Sheeran who's an international rock star, right? So >> I think if you get Taylor Swift, you give it to Taylor Swift and you leave it alone. Now, if she wants to incorporate something the way some of these people have, so so be it. But if it's Taylor Swift's halftime show, Taylor >> Let me let me be Let me be clear. I am not >> I want a threeperson halftime show. No, what I'm what I'm saying is it's 100% I agree. I would have I would choose I would ask Taylor Swift first and make her say no. 100%. If she says no and you have to go to plan B, CD, whatever it is, I'm saying that that artist who is the featured artist who is going to do four songs, let's say, right? Or five cuz they're cut down and they're trimmed up or whatever. that person is going to bring pull in shades of Nashville, pull in shades of country or or that that would be my guess is like it's somebody else is a star of this show and they're going to they're going to bring in artists one here maybe for 30 seconds like Lady Gaga, right? Like Lady Gaga came out and did a few minutes with Bad Bad Bunny and that's that's what you do, right? Like you kind of do the plus. So that's what I would tell people is don't don't this is not going to be Tim McGra and Carrie Underwood. Although NBC does have the broadcast. So Carrie Underwood singing Sunday night, you know, like >> if it's not if it's not Taylor Swift and it's some other country thing, unless something explodes in the next four years, it won't do as well as Bad Bunny and that'll kill people. But it's slap in the face to reality of what >> the broad taste in music is. By the way, I talked to Jim Nance about this. Um, you know, he thinks there could be a scramble of the Super Bowl order. So, he's not entirely convinced that these Super Bowls beyond the TV contracts are going to remain married to the networks that they're with. Now, I didn't realize it was an NBC Super Bowl, but when he talked to us, I asked because he's one of the two with with Bill Hasslam.

[00:23:16]they're the two co-chair of this whole Super Bowl committee. And so I asked him, "Is it potentially sticky for you if CBS gets this game, you know, with you being the chair of the host committee and and the playby-play analyst for the game?" and he kind of said,"I think I have enough skins on the wall and interest in the town that, you know, they can see me doing that and then when the game comes, >> sure, >> it's the game, you know, and it's not like he has a rooting interest for the city, not for something that's going on in the in the game, which is a a good answer." But then I texted him later and I said, "It looks like NBC has the game." and he said, um, you know, those things don't, from my understanding, those things are not as totally sticky based on the team.

[00:24:07]>> Gotcha. Um, yeah, I think you could be an ambassador for the game and for the city at the same time without it being a conflict of interest in any way. I don't I don't see that being a problem.

[00:24:16]>> I I I can't imagine the workload. I can't imagine the workload for him over the next four years being one of the two main pointmen on this while he's doing his full-time NFL job even having given up and golf even having given up basketball. And I'm not saying I know he's a figurehead in a lot of ways and everything, but he's going to have a lot of legitimate work as this I would think. And that's taken on a lot. And that's a real testament to how much he's come to love this town. and it's only been he said he's only been here five years >> and and was very upset when the Nashville Scene and Post published his purchase of his house which they do for every human including Robert Salah by the way uh his $8.5 million like 11bedroom house down in Franklin. Um >> so I you mentioned all the things that that committee is going to do. Uh they're going to be working long hours so they're going to need a lot of coffee. Ethan Roast is my recommendation to Jim Nance and to others on this committee and all these people that are going to work together for this city. I want to lay out some of the things that that entails because I do want to get your perspective on what that means for the city. Um because I think you and I talked a little bit about this on a football show. We'll talk a little bit more um uh with Nick Sus and I are talking about it on a football show on Friday as well. Um depending on when when that show comes out. But the the deal for the stadium, for those that do not remember, it is called a lot of times and it is technically true that it is the most publicly financed stadium in the history of the NFL and I think in the history of most professional sports to be honest at 2.12.2 billion. Now, while that is technically true, it's not actually Davidson County Nashvilleians paying $2.2 billion. That's just just not what it is. It's $500 million in state money, which is less than 1% of the state budget, and that money has already been paid to the Titans many a couple of years ago when the vote actually happened. Um, $840 million of that is coming directly from the NFL. And what I've been told is that it is the NFL loaning money to Amy Adams drunk and that she has to pay it back $840 million. So, that's the private part of the of the deal.

[00:26:25]>> And a lot of that's PSLs.

[00:26:27]>> There you go.

[00:26:29]um that they add they added the 1% of the hotel motel tax which is something that does technically take it's an there's an opportunity cost that the city could use that money for something else. However, you then have to have the political will to pass a bill or a resolution that would increase that mo hotel motel tax and then take that money and steer it somewhere else. Um, and and that $760 million is not just the motel tax. It's also the sales tax recapture, which is a revenue bond. Not to get complicated here, but the revenue bond is something that only exists if there is something like new. The the actual general fund of the city is not involved in this, which is where our tax dollars go as Davidson County residents. This is a revenue bond saying that they are going to capture sales tax in the stadium and on the stadium property and the acreage around it over the course of some years. That only happens if there's a new stadium. So, you can't just say, "Well, we're going to recapture all the tax for that area because, right, it was a parking lot before that." So, >> yeah, but there is some fundamental misunderstanding out there. Like somebody tweeted me today, well, two Super Bowls in the stadium pays for itself. Well, all this incoming money from the Super Bowl isn't going directly to where the money to pay for the stadium came from. The guy who's making a killing on Super Bowl merchandise at his store on lower broad, he's making a good profit, but that's not repaying the stadium bill. Now, some of the tax on it is repaying some of the stadium bill, and that's an awfully good week for business. But a lot of that money is going to the people who make the stadium sweat or the >> Super Bowl logo sweatshirts. And a lot of it's going to, you know, only a small portion of it's going to help refinance the debt.

[00:28:20]Another thing that I think is important, Freddy Oonnell went out of his way to say this at the press conference on Wednesday. You know, a lot of people say, "Why the Super Bowl? I'm not into the NFL. Why the stadium? I'm not into the NFL." Whatever. He said, you know, we pay for things in this city through and in this state through sales tax, and this creates an awful lot of sales tax.

[00:28:46]And with that sales tax, we can pay our teachers better. With that sales tax, we can address affordable housing. Um, and it opens the doors to a lot of things.

[00:28:58]That's political speak. But his message is this is a financial generator the way this state operates without state income tax and it's going to drive that. Now there are believers in that and there are non-believers in that and there are people you may have face that are halfway on that. Yeah. It it I mean it's not I don't it's affordable housing.

[00:29:22]>> It's a good talking point for a guy who's running for re-election already.

[00:29:25]Yeah. Um, so let me let me wrap up here cuz quickly the stad the estimated renovation of the stadium was 1.7 to 1.9 billion of the current stadium. That would have been on our general fund taxpayer dollars. Now that estimate got a lot of flack when it came out. Let's just call it a billion for the sake of it. That billion dollars was going to be on our city to pay the upkeep and renovation on the old Nissan Stadium. So my point is, long story short here, is that the deal itself, which catches a lot of flak because everyone has this oneliner about going, "Well, it's the most publicly funded stadium in the history." Like, while there's some technicalities that are true about that, it's actually a way better deal for the city and for Davidson County residents than people realize. And to your point, the actual economic impact of the game itself is a is a much worse thing for the city than you realize. And that's maybe not the right phrasing of it, but it is it is couched as hundreds of >> hundreds of millions of dollars of economic impact for a community. And it's re like we you have to give the NFL so much free stuff.

[00:30:28]>> So security, limousines, transportation, parking spots, hotel rooms, ballrooms, all the things you just talked about, booking all those things, those event spaces around the city. They're not paying a penny for any of that stuff.

[00:30:40]you've got to give it to them for free, which is tens of millions of dollars.

[00:30:44]>> And so what what happens is >> and the other thing for Nashville, February is a down month, relatively speaking, for of the 12 months in terms of the tourism engine that you're talking about, which does which does fund our state. There's no question about that. Mayor O' Connell's right about that. But what's interesting is like if we have 85,000 hotel hotel rooms or something crazy like that, like the vast majority of them are full. most of the time. So, you don't get >> those studies, I think we hit on this last week on a football show, those studies tend to for some reason act like, okay, you've got a blank city and we're coming and filling that city for this week and look at the economic gain.

[00:31:25]Instead of saying, if you're watching this, I have my hand. Instead of saying you've got a blank city and we're going from here to here, instead of saying, "Well, here's what it would be and we're building it from here to here, which is still a significant increase, but it does go up." I a outrageous increase that they make it out to be. Look, is it good for the city? Yes. Is it is it the the windfall that they make it out to be? like it's a godsend from heaven based on what I'm saying that there is stuff going on if there isn't a Super Bowl based on what you're saying where it's a boondoggle for the NFL in terms of getting free stuff. No, it's it's not that dramatically good. And somebody said it today, I didn't catch who said the biggest event in the world, let's be conscious, the biggest event in the world's about to take place, biggest sporting event in the world's about to take place all over America uh this summer. far more corrupt, but way more eyeballs on it in the world. It's called the World Cup. It goes on for a month, not for a week.

[00:32:24]>> Isn't Isn't it like 500 million viewers on the World Cup final? Something like that.

[00:32:29]>> Yeah. And >> I mean, it's almost impossible to uh um you know, >> it's a world sport. It's not a national sport that has some interest around the world.

[00:32:38]>> I'm going to try to see the 2022 because that was one of the best matches ever played.

[00:32:42]>> Great final. The final is usually not a great game.

[00:32:45]>> Yeah. So here this is this is an AI overview so take it for what it's worth um from Gemini but the 2022 FIFA World Cup final between Argentina and France which if you'll remember was an Mbappe hat-tick and Messi scored I mean extra time PK's like the whole deal unbelievable match um a record-breaking global audience of approximately 1.5 billion people the Super Bowl the Super Bowl does 140 million >> that's like a seven of the world population.

[00:33:12]>> Yeah. Um, I think the Champions League final at worldwide does more viewership than the Super Bowl, I think.

[00:33:19]>> Yeah.

[00:33:20]>> Well, I mean, it's the biggest thing going in America.

[00:33:23]>> No question. No question. No question.

[00:33:25]Um, all right. So, um, man, I got now I was derailed on the cost of the whole thing. So, the the point is, oh, to to be honest, like, who makes the most money on this stuff in our in our community? Who does it benefit the most financially? It benefits people who own bars on Lower Broadway.

[00:33:40]>> It benefits people who own hotels. It benefits those types of folks. The probably the top 1% of business owners in this city are going to benefit enormously. The sales tax of the entire event at large is going to pump a bunch of extra money into the state economy, which is good. But the average person working at the stadium or working downtown or working somewhere in the surrounding areas is probably not going to benefit a ton economically from all of this. Hopefully some small business owners like the guy selling sweatshirts can make a can make a bunch of extra money on that week. Uh hopefully restaurants do much better that week because people are going out into the city and exploring the area whether it's families or NFL people or whatever. So, but the the basic thing on this is the brand of the city. The brand of the city gets elevated as you wrote. I didn't realize this. We're there's only 16 cities that have ever hosted this event.

[00:34:30]We're going to be number 17 >> in metropolitan areas. Yeah, we're >> we're going to be number 17. That's a pretty rarified something.

[00:34:36]>> That's rarified air. Yeah.

[00:34:39]All right. Uh Aan Roast. Everybody go get some coffee from Ethan Roast. The beans are just better. Um All right. You are Okay. Quickly here. I don't know if you saw this, but John Tortoella is the coach of the Vegas Golden Knights. They beat Anaheim in six games in the Western Conference semi-finals. They're now playing in the Western Conference Finals. They ad they they win a playoff series to advance. He does not speak to the media after the game. The dressing room is closed after the game. There were two players, I think, that came out to the podium and interacted with the press and answered some questions >> and one who spoke briefly in the hallway.

[00:35:13]>> Apparently, this was an ongoing problem with Tordella and the Vegas Knights.

[00:35:19]Apparently, there had been warnings. So, the NHL fined John Tortoella $100,000 and took away a second round draft pick in the draft that comes up next month, which is crazy. They appealed and and the NHL said absolutely not. We're hitting you really hard with this punishment. And so I'm curious, do you think a that's the right punishment for this? And what on earth are they thinking Vegas on this? Like what are they thinking?

[00:35:47]>> Well, what precipitated it? Like was there some incident, some buildup, animosity over the course of the year?

[00:35:55]Like what do we know about the buildup?

[00:35:58]the owner of the of the Knights basically has come out and said like we're not going to talk about why all of this happened which to me if it had happened with a reporter or if there was a particular po portion of the media core maybe that there was some kind of back and forth like the media would know about it if if that happened they could write about it they could talk about it but but apparently this is >> John Tordell is a known a-hole >> he's just a hard he's just a hard Okay.

[00:36:28]I No, they did. They did not explain why this took place. And nor has the neither has the NHL. Other than >> things returned to normal.

[00:36:34]>> We've warned them. We find them. It won't happen again is what Vegas But Vegas came back and said it's not going to happen again. So like they've taken their medicine. But can you imagine the Titans winning an AFC divisional round game and then the Robert Salah and and the locker room being closed after winning a playoff game. That's insane to me.

[00:36:59]>> Yeah, I don't think it would ever happen at the NFL level. Um, you got a coach who's got a reputation as being a jerk.

[00:37:08]Um, a team that he obviously got to rally around one of his themes for for some reason. Um, I don't know. There was one guy who talked for a little while in the hallway. Maybe he was the rebel amongst the group that felt like, hey, this isn't the right thing to do. Um, but he wasn't able to bring many people with him. I just don't understand. Uh, it's it's not that big a deal, especially like the sore loser element. I'm not sympathetic to, but you can say, well, they're being sore losers and you have a a a claim there. They don't want to be standup guys. They don't want to answer for their problems. here when the the inches spent writing about them and the video of their conversations would all be a chance for them to pat themselves on the back and to celebrate about advancing to the final four, which is a substantial thing. Just doesn't make any sense. I hope this story will ultimately come out. I'm always going to advocate for for access. I'm I imagine there are a good share of fans here who say screw the press and let them do what they want. They're winning and everything which I >> is what it is.

[00:38:24]>> I hate >> I mean that that is an opportunity for a coach and players to to kind of to your point celebrate with the fans a pretty big accomplishment.

[00:38:33]>> Yeah.

[00:38:34]>> Like like a really big accomplishment.

[00:38:36]It just doesn't make much sense. And then to not for it not to be out there what exactly happened. I mean, I would think if a reporter was at the center of that and it was something negative, they'd still come out and say what it was because it's so newsworthy. So, >> it's just so bizarre. It's so bizarre.

[00:38:57]But it honestly like it just h you know, John Tordella, not a surprise it was this guy, right?

[00:39:04]Like it's just not a surprise. Uh you win a playoff series and you you you lose a second round draft pick because it's just wild, dude. there. I mean, that's a valuable pick. I mean, that's >> that's enormous deep a penalty >> as we've seen in any league for uh antidia behavior. Um so quite a precedent's been set um in in the NHL.

[00:39:27]Uh >> do do you think that's too steep of you think it should be fourth round? I mean, fourth round picks are not >> I mean, if they had been having conversations with him and with the organization and warned them, like if you keep this up, something big is going to happen. Then I, you know, credit uh the league management for actually following through on what they said they'd do and they probably surprised the hell out of them because they probably didn't take him seriously.

[00:39:54]>> Uh anyway, I just I saw that happen and I thought about you. I was like, "Oh, I'm glad I'm talking to PK this week because you would you would your head would explode if that had happened in Titans Land."

[00:40:04]>> My head would explode.

[00:40:06]>> I would love to see it. Um, I mean, I'd like you to keep your head intact, but I would enjoy seeing >> I would too. My fat head.

[00:40:15]>> Uh, Ethan Roast, everybody, you guys know the deal. Good beans. And by the way, please fill out our survey. Um, there is a survey linked in the show notes. Pressforward midtn.news.

[00:40:24]Pressforward midtn.

[00:40:26]It is linked in the show notes. Uh please check it out. It is super super easy to fill out. It gives an organization, Press Forward, which is a national organization, but has a local chapter, 40 counties, including Davidson County, where they're trying to help fund and create a a healthier news environment for uh all of you out there listening and living in this area. So, take five minutes. It's anonymous. it will help them get a better picture of kind of what's being consumed and what subjects we care about uh so that they can kind of better more efficiently steer resources to the right places. So please please fill out the survey linked in the show notes on the podcast app and of course uh I might I might throw this one up on YouTube as well. So it it'll be linked there as well. Um uh so make sure you check out that check that out.

[00:41:08]The URL if you're just listening is press forwardm.news.

[00:41:13]Please it takes 5 minutes. Go fill it out. Okay. Um you're teaching an ethics class at Belmont. I'm cur I want to start with you know go back to when you were um like in J school and being taught ethics versus learning from editors at newspapers versus you know your career in radio versus now you know independent reporter and the technology shift in the last 20 years has just been extraordinary in terms of what we now what people want how we're engaged with our audience where we find audience I'm curious I asked a college football coach one time who was really really old. He had been coaching, you know, back in the late 90s and I asked him in like 2022 when he came back to coach at North Carolina. It was Matt Brown. I said, "Has anything changed in recruiting?

[00:42:02]It's totally different era of the game."

[00:42:04]And it always stuck with me that his answer was, "It's still about communication and relationships and it doesn't matter how you're doing it. It doesn't matter what the rules are.

[00:42:11]That's still how you go about recruiting players to come play on your team." Is that how ethics works in your opinion to some degree regardless of the change in technology? Because I gotta know how you teach 20 year olds about media ethics in 2026.

[00:42:27]>> Well, yeah. I I would think it's the same. The practice of it isn't the same and the the environment isn't anything close to the same.

[00:42:39]Um, I don't remember having a specific class at Columbia J School about media ethics. I think it was just woven into, you know, something regarding it was woven into probably everything that I I took. But I mean, it's it's pretty simply like the basic principles of right action, ethics, right? So ethics, you know, I guess change with the times sometime, but in a in a business that's struggled so much, um, I I would like to think people trying the good people, well-intentioned people trying to do a good job are trying to stick to basic principles of of right action. They were then during Watergate when newspapers and and media were at the height as an institution of public trust and they are now when we're probably at the depths of public confidence uh in us as as an institution. Um, so we talk in a in a bigger form with with regard to media ethics about trying to resolve conflict, right? What's the process of ethics in the media? You're trying to resolve conflict by asking the right questions, coming to a conclusion that satisfies you while considering the consequences for everybody else, and being able to explain how you're being fair to those people. Look, I considered all of the options.

[00:44:24]This is why I went this direction. Uh, and I can I can defend that against everything you might bring at me. while you might disagree with it. And so we then talk about that with uh you know about Pizzagate and about AI slop and about spotlight and about all the president's men and about unnamed sources and about cancel culture and about every topic you could think of that would fall under media ethics umbrella. I I imagine that there is a there's a lot of tension in the way modern reporting is incentivized based on technology and that ethical line that a reporter must adhere to because in 1970 you know you talk about all the president's men or some of the like there were three places to get new you know it was it was TV that had a executive Ive producer it was newspaper where you had an editorial oversight process and now it is just you by yourself in your office literally you and I are doing this but like also if you're 21-year-old and you're coming up and you sign on to an or an organization you might have an editor but a lot of these folks are building careers because they're just they work hard they're talented and they want to go accomplish something and so it does it it's it it feels like that tension is easier to um give into if that makes sense to take the easy the easy win while not adhering to the ethical line.

[00:46:00]And so >> a lot of people don't don't I mean couldn't tell you anything about the ethical lines. I'm gonna tell you about SEO and uh clickbait headlines and how to generate as much money by being as attractive to the algorithms of the the outlets that they're using um as as possible, you know. So, one of my one of my favorite sections that we have is like how how to consider anonymous sources, you know. So if if you're reading a story with close sources close to the situation, say so and so could be fired, you know, all of this couching, that's a lot less reliable, a lot of this is governmental than two high ranking justice department officials saying something happened past tense that's coming to light and that like predictive stuff is often nonsense because you and I talk about this in the sports world. You're not on the hook for it. I use Adam Shfter example. I tweeted this out lately. Adam Shfter said uh in in March that the belief was that Aaron Rogers would sign earlier this year than he did last year, probably within a month, which would have been midappril. And here it was late May before it happened. There are absolutely no consequences for that for you can couch absolutely anything that way without any consequence what whatsoever and that's the environment we live in sports reporting is it federal issue no >> does it bother somebody like me >> yeah there's no precision to it there's no real reporting to it because if there's no consequence if you're wrong you're not on the hook for anything when you report something >> and And and broadly it feeds into the lack of trust in the institution in general when the average consumer can just be like, "Oh, I don't that person was wrong. I don't care about the media or whatever." So it doesn't >> they said they don't care that Adam's wrong. They just want I don't care. I just want to know what's going on with Roger. He was just talking on the radio.

[00:48:16]What's it matter? And that lowers expectations for everybody.

[00:48:20]>> It perpetuates the stereotype for sure.

[00:48:22]I'm curious if you can sense the general mood towards ethics from your class. Like can you sense because so you mentioned AI slop. I find this really interesting because I I was looking at a Gallup poll recently. I think it was conducted this year and it came out a couple of weeks ago in April and this the information is is that AI by by young people under 29 uh they are over 50% use it every day. 80% are using it every week. So, they are clearly using the technology, but their belief in the product and their appreciation for it, their feelings towards it are plummeting into the negative range.

[00:48:59]Like, we're talking 18% approval rating for AI with young people under 29. 30% hate it. 15% will tell you that it has a net positive effect on their lives.

[00:49:09]They're seeing the job market is what is what I assume to some degree. So, it's it's a fascinating uh uh confluence here of feelings amongst young people that are like, "No, we are definitely using this thing and we don't like it." So, I'm curious if >> my students uh almost unanimously hate it. Um now, they're banned from using it in in this ethics class. They're allowed to use it in other places and they'll be allowed to use it. I taught a podcasting class. they were allowed to use it for certain things and that, you know, they're coming up with a a design for their mark for their for their podcast.

[00:49:47]Of course, they're going to use it for that. That that's But as for the intelligence, I want to see in a media ethics course. I'm not interested in any artificial intelligence. I'm interested in in their intelligence. And we have a very strong conversation about that early. But in terms of AI slop, in terms of the environmental concerns created by AI, in terms of drift, and then we did a section this year off the story I found about uh you know, say what you will about the inherent biases of of chat GPT or Claude or whatever. I think they're intended generally to be down the middle. But now there have been um just like there are in every brand of media ones created that are going to tell you what you want to hear from a right-wing perspective and tell you what you want to hear from a left-wing perspective just the way you can go to uh >> whatever MSNBC has become and to Fox um to to just be an echo chamber for you.

[00:50:52]So they are very wary of it um and uh and very determined to not let it um impact them very much. And we kind of talk throughout, you know, they're very idealistic, which you got to like out of some college kids, but I talk at the beginning when they give me some of this, and I finish with it like your willpower and your determination is great here at around 20 or 21. Now, add a full-time job into the equation, and then add uh a fiance onto the equation, and then add a baby onto the equation.

[00:51:32]and this thing you're doing where you're limiting yourself to 45 minutes of doom scrolling a day. And I'll really respect it if you're thinking back to this class and saying, "I was dedicated and I pledged that I wasn't gonna >> doom scroll AI slop. And if you're doing it at 20 and you're still doing it at 30, God bless you. But remember this conversation about the willpower and the dedication that's going to take."

[00:51:58]>> I I do think there'll be some structural changes. this now we're in kind of a slightly different conversation, but um my 9ine-year-old just looks at stuff that looks fake and just goes, "That's AI, Dad." And I'm like, "Actually, that's animation. It's not AI." But the fact that her brain is sort of using it as a catch-all as like anything that appears fake, people don't like the stuff that's obviously fake. Like people just really don't like it. they they young people in partic are are very skeptical of of the actual effects of it writ large on you know their futures. I I think that's a really good place for them to be and I'm actually glad to hear about those numbers and your class.

[00:52:41]>> But I show these kids you know look I'm I'm a reporter. I'm a trained reporter and a writer and so I spend my time as best I can reporting and and writing, but I am not at all ashamed that I use ChatG to help me with a meta description and keywords and headlines because I'm not an SEO expert and that stuff's constantly evolving. And so for my business to thrive as best as it can, >> having something that knows better than I do about those categories >> helps my reporting and writing get seen.

[00:53:23]Um, and I need it to be seen in order to do well.

[00:53:27]>> It's almost like you're adding this maybe this an this is half baked, so go with me on this. It's almost like AI should be sort of like adding an entire college course, like a 100level college course to your resume. So, like you didn't study SEO, you didn't study coding, you didn't study HTML or social media or audio engineering or any of that stuff, but but a good quality prompt in AI by the by a smart person using it properly, you've added sort of an additional skill to your ability to be a reporter, but but at a fairly fundamental basic level. And I think that's kind of the right way to look at it. Like I if you work in healthcare at a major healthcare company and your expertise is not finances but but chat GPT can help you monitor your finances of your team and all of a sudden you can make more efficient decisions as a leader of this other skill. I think that's where you're going to see advantages for the people that know how to use it. So I'm glad to hear you have students say I mean they haven't said it but but they wouldn't hesitate to say it. still environmentally you're you're killing us with the water usage that's happening there in neighborhoods that don't want it etc etc which makes for uh lively and healthy debate and conversation and I'm confident that uh that while I've got a long way to go to to get this thing closer to really good uh you know many of them have told me that they they left having thought about things that they never would have thought about before. So, I'm off to a reasonable start.

[00:55:02]>> There you go, man. You're affecting the youths of America. There you go.

[00:55:06]Changing >> Listen, I I 25 people who are obligated to sit down and listen to me for an hour and 15 minutes.

[00:55:12]>> It's pretty pretty good.

[00:55:14]>> You like that, huh? You like that? The power feels good in your hands. I appreciate that. Um, all right.

[00:55:21]paulcarski.com is the website. Eighth andro, of course, fill out the press forward survey as well. Listen to all the other great shows across the 440 Sports Network. all that good stuff. Um, last but not least here, I I experienced my first champion ending to an EPL season >> regard regardless of who won. This is not about who won. I I I just I have never I've always found it difficult to get into the EPLL regular season championship because there is no actual tournament. There's no postseason like like League MX has in in Mexico or MLS does in America. And so I've always kind of found it trickier. I've always loved the Champions League more than than any one particular league in soccer. Um, but because this was my first year kind of following a team throughout the entire course of a season. Um, and it happened to be, I guess, the closest race maybe in 10 years. I don't know. You can correct me if I'm wrong there. Um, it it it worked out to be very entertaining, but it felt it felt very strange the way it ended, which is, if you haven't been following this, Arsenal and Manchester City have been kind of chasing each other. U, Arsenal's had the lead for most of the year. City kind of caught them. They had a one weekend of of of football left to go over the weekend and because Man City on a Tuesday at 2:00 in America, 7 o'clock in in London or 8:00 in London, prime time in London, uh Manchester City tied with a team named Bournemouth and Arsenal clinches the championship. And I find it fascinating that like you have settled the entire championship on a Tuesday without the team that's playing for it. It doesn't look it on the field. It doesn't even look less like you look you were talking about social media like I don't get on Instagram very much but my entire feed on on on Wednesday of this week was nothing but >> parades and videos and tributes >> them watching TV watching this draw was close that clinches the championship >> very much. Now, >> I think there's something beautiful about it. I mean, that's not ideal and you don't want it to happen often. It's obviously not the way you would want it, but the fact that it's a possibility is part of what makes it so intriguing.

[00:57:33]That a regular season title means so much is the championship of the league that it can happen that way. and that the weekend's not over because people are playing for fourth place which gets you in the championship league, Champions League. People are playing for sixth or seventh place, which gets you in the Europa League. People are playing for 17th and 16th place, which gets you in or keeps you out of getting relegated. There's a whole bunch still at stake when everybody plays, I believe, at the same time on on Saturday. Maybe the games are scattered.

[00:58:08]>> I think it's I think it's Sunday. I think it's all on Sunday. Sunday. Yeah, >> where there's still so much going on.

[00:58:14]And the EPL quite frankly, I mean, it's gotten a little bit better, but it's generally the same five teams for those four spots at the top. And nevertheless, it's incredibly compelling. And there are teams that are never going to be better than ninth that probably aren't going to get regulated either. And there's it's still compelling despite the fact that there's something a little bit broken about it. But well, look, there's stuff that's broken about the NFL, too. That seventh wild card is probably never going to the Super Bowl or very rarely. And it seems very obvious that that seventh spot is completely unnecessary that six was the right number, right? But we embrace it and we love it because it's our thing.

[00:59:01]So, I think there's something kind of beautiful about the fact that it can happen that way. It's not the way you want it to happen. It doesn't happen very often, but I it's one of the wrinkles and I think the structure is really cool where >> Okay, >> I know America hates this. I know uh second place is losing in America, but there there are all kinds of permutations where finishing fourth has some consequences and finishing sixth has some consequences and finishing 16th has some consequences. And so there all kind of battle and you've got these other tournaments going on parallel where Man City just lost that game on Tuesday to lose the Premier League, but on Saturday they beat Chelsea and they won the FA Cup. my my team lost out on trophy and then three tournaments going on concurrently during the the season.

[00:59:55]It's a whole layered textured thing that we can't really comprehend.

[00:59:59]>> No, I I have uh because I followed all of that this year for the first time.

[01:00:03]I've definitely enjoyed it just the entire like watching Nashville SC for example win the um was it the open cup or the league cup? One of the two last year I can't I get them confused. um when they beat Austin the regular season and trying to explain this this ConAF Champions Cup to my kids like it is it is trickier to teach young people about the layers.

[01:00:22]>> It's a lot easier when your girls like my kids both play on a club soccer team.

[01:00:26]So it's easier to say like hey here's the the regular season here are friendlies and here's the tournament in Clarksville and they kind of oh that's a tournament this is a regular season thing. So they're kind of understanding of all of that. But even you mentioned like Bournemouth, so the top five go to the Champions League now of course and Bournemouth was like two points back and had they not given up the goal to Man City, they would have been one point back with one game to go and clinching a spot in the Champions League, which is something that Bournemouth I don't think has ever done in the 120 years of their history. So like to your point, I'm getting all of that stuff. I'm if you're the EPLL leaders of all of this and we just got done talking about the scope and size of the Super Bowl and I I agree with your point about uh like it's kind of like fantasy sports where a roto league versus head-to-head or a points league versus head-to-head. The team that is the best team in the league for the regular season wins the championship. And I there's something very pure and clean about that that I really like. But that's but why we do head-to-head in fantasy football is because we like the chaos of the playoffs, right? We like the chaos of the the NFL playoffs and that's kind of why we do it. If you are the EPL, which I think is the second richest league in the world behind the NFL or maybe the most maybe the wealthiest league in the world alongside the NFL, I find it interesting that the entire celebration of their yearslong championship mostly happened on social media except for the people that are involved in the actual parade in North London or what?

[01:01:53]Like, >> are you home on Sunday? Are they home on Sunday?

[01:01:56]>> Uh, Arsenal's at Crystal Palace. So, >> it would be really nice if they went now and played a a quote unquote meaningless game and got their stadium got to celebrate for two hours while they played, but it didn't even tie up neatly that way.

[01:02:12]>> It feels like they're leaving something to be like lots of money on the table or in their table. Lots lot. And it feels like the EPL is like losing.

[01:02:22]>> How beautiful is that? a league is not squeezing every drop out of and saying, "You know what? Oh my god, they won it on a Tuesday while they were standing in their locker room after training. We gotta fix that. That has to be monetized, but we got to get that on Thursday night on Amazon in an exclusive window." I think it's terrific.

[01:02:41]>> Okay, I look I I hear you on that part.

[01:02:43]I I can't argue with that on on that part. Um it does remind me I heard a stat and this is this is how I'm going to close here. Um and I'm curious. I don't know if I doubt you have any more classes. I assume it's over now uh with the semester, but >> but I I want I want you to do something.

[01:02:58]I have an assignment for you for next semester with the kids.

[01:03:02]>> And I was this was of course this was from Nick Sus uh who who studied the use of the phrase you had to be there. And the use of the phrase and this is what I'm reminded of looking at video of a parade in England for this championship that was impromptu, right? Nobody knew it was going to happen because City loses this match or has a draw, all of the sudden everyone in London who's an Arsenal fan who wants to celebrate it's like, "Oh, I what am I going to do tonight? I got to go to the parade." And they end up >> and it's very organic, which is really cool and I agree with you on that.

[01:03:34]What's interesting to me is um the use of the phrase you had to be there. I never that phrase felt so palpable to me watching Tuesday night and Wednesday watching all the videos of what was happening in in London around this team winning a title for the first time in 22 years. It it reminded me of the you had to be there thing and Nick has said that the usage of the phrase you had to be there has like dropped off since 2009.

[01:04:00]What came around in 2009? Smartphones.

[01:04:03]And so I I am curious when you get to your class I want you to talk to them.

[01:04:06]Do they know what the phrase you had to be there means? I want to know if they know what that means.

[01:04:11]>> Good conversation.

[01:04:13]>> Yeah.

[01:04:14]>> You had to be there. You had to be there.

[01:04:15]>> I mean, our generation, the last that will feel like you had to be there. I mean, I still know Well, I don't know how many people I know younger younger than us who feel like, oh, I I have to be at at something. I was seeing like interviews with people from all all different like people from with you know from America, people from Asia, people and they're all had they all had come to this one place to express sort of like what this title meant to them or whatever which I'm sure happens to every fan base but it was very like tiny little glimpses into this bigger thing that was happening because there was no >> I think there two things going on with the had to be there for older people for somebody like me Um, not just that I'm more inside it in uh in in a social media way, but the experience of being at some games is absolutely miserable uh with the drunkenness around you and with the idiots around you. And when I listen to the people in front of me or to my right or to my left or behind me, if I haven't hit a grand slam there and I'm listening to them be John Sterling for the entire game with incorrect stuff.

[01:05:30]Um, oh, dear God.

[01:05:34]I mean, I I told you about the Phillies game I went to last summer with my family where they're just spouting off in incorrect things and coming up with dumb stuff to say to the pitcher about where he's from, which isn't even correct. And this this is fun for them.

[01:05:48]They're having the time of their lives, which is counterbalancing that I'm miserable and what should be a glorious night in the second row behind the Angels dugout with my boy and my wife who are Phillies fans in heaven. And I can't not hear this stuff, which makes me think, boy, my TV is fantastic.

[01:06:11]>> Well, and it's really the point of the it's it had to be there is not like obviously you and I and this show, we think about it through the lens of sports and we think about how much better the viewing experience is at home for in particular college football games where being at the stadium is just miserable. NFL games can be miserable.

[01:06:28]But it's all it's not even that. It's like, hey, we're all getting together to go hang out and play darts and like you missed somebody do something crazy or some guy talked to some girl or like it's it's anything in life that that there's no like, oh, you had to be there, man. Because now you can just see it. If it happened and it's crazy, you could just see it now all over social media.

[01:06:45]>> I think too we're aging out, right?

[01:06:47]Those moments at the dart board are less frequent.

[01:06:50]>> Well, that is true. That is true. All right. Well, thank you for uh being a wonderful guest, co-host. Special guest >> special guest slashfillin co-host on the show Ethan Roast. Everybody fill out the survey paulcarski.com as well. Uh Cav is back next week. Um thanks for listening everybody. We do appreciate it for Paul and Braden. We'll talk we'll talk to you next time.