By The Way...I'm Charlie Jeer

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[00:00:00]Hi, I'm Harriet Rose.

[00:00:01]>> And I'm Charlie Jer. And by the way, I'm half Indian.

[00:00:04]>> Charlie Jer, welcome to the show.

[00:00:06]Saxophonyist, singer, songwriter. Your latest single, My Madonna, is absolutely gorgeous. Welcome to the show. I only just learned how to say saxophonyist.

[00:00:14]So, that was cool. I thought it was saxoponist.

[00:00:17]>> Saxophonist or sexy phonist.

[00:00:19]>> Sexy phonist. I prefer to say sexy phonist.

[00:00:22]>> You can Yeah, you can say that.

[00:00:23]>> That sounds like you're a bit of a weirdo on a phone, though.

[00:00:25]>> Um, >> someone sexy phones you.

[00:00:27]>> Yeah. Yeah. I I try not to do that too much unless it's unless it's wanted.

[00:00:32]>> Hey, unless it's asked for, in which case you can have it.

[00:00:34]>> Do you know what I mean? Yeah, there's nothing wrong with a bit of that.

[00:00:36]>> Saxophagenists. Um I feel like in the music industry um most sort of musicians are vocalled or like Fred again a DJ producer but actually having like sort of mainstream saxophonyist is is is is great because I feel like we don't shed enough light on I guess musicians who also sing and create music.

[00:01:01]>> Yeah. I mean like my whole journey into you know writing my first song that I released and doing all of that stuff. I started playing the saxs when I was like 11 years old and uh I had a moment that had kind of really inspired me and I was like right I need to make a song about this. This is like my calling as a person. And when I went to write it, initially it was just going to be an instrumental piece. And uh I'd sung in privately and like in the car and in the shower like other people do, but I never really believed that even saxophone could be a career, let alone that. And then uh went in started writing this track and uh started singing in the studio with my producer and um and he was like, you know what, Charlie, I think you got to put some vocals on it.

[00:01:41]And I was like, you know what? I'm going to do it. and I recorded vocals for the first time, put it out and that was her eyes and it blew up online and then kind of ended up spiraling into a music career. And now I've given a lot more attention to my vocal and kind of taken that side of things seriously like a sport as well. So it's it's nice to kind of have the two to be able to play off.

[00:02:00]And I think in my style of music especially, I like to have these instrumental breaks so that with the lyrics and the vocal, you can say, "Right, this is what you feel. This is where you are." And then with the instrumental you can go and this is what it feels like and you just get to feel it and just groove you.

[00:02:17]>> Oh, I like that. So you're kind of explaining your emotions and then you're feeling them in the same song.

[00:02:22]>> Yeah. I mean like when when you listen like for me I love to go out to house music. I love to listen to house music as well. And when you go out a big part of it is the stuff that's not vocal and you're just sat there and you're just thinking like yeah this is how I'm feeling. This is the head space. And I think that that's actually sometimes a bit of a lost art in a lot of commercial music cuz it's like right let's fill let's be vocal vocal vocal give them another chorus another chorus and it's like no let's just let's just groove it out for a bit.

[00:02:46]>> Let's go back to you you mentioned you started uh making music at 11. So as you say today's by the way is that you're half Indian. Your dad's Indian.

[00:02:55]>> My dad's fully Indian. Yeah.

[00:02:56]>> Yeah. Um so tell me about what that was like growing up as a half Indian boy.

[00:03:01]How did it influence your music? How did it influence making that first song when you were 11? I want to go back to the very beginning of of how it's impacted your life.

[00:03:10]>> So, I started off like classically led and then I went and learned kind of how to play a bit more jazzy style. As for growing up half Indian, it was interesting. I grew up in Canterbury which is like, >> you know, in Ken it's quite a white area and um even at my school there wasn't really a lot of cultural diversity. Not the school's fault, but just you know, the place in general. And it's weird.

[00:03:32]you kind of get categorized as you're growing up just off of appearance. And I think where I h look white, I just got put in the white box. And it's strange cuz like my little brother, for example, he's got really brown skin. He's got a twin sister who's white. They had the same schooling experience, but you know, the experience of going to school as a brown kid in Canterbury was my brother maybe came home a few nights crying because he got called a burnt sausage or something, whereas my little sister never got put in that box. So it it was it was strange. I think to be honest, I think growing up half Indian in an area like Canterbury, it just leads you to not really know exactly where you belong within that within that kind of racial bracket. Um I never really got the opportunity to be surrounded by, you know, my family's culture when I was growing up. And so that lack of exposure can kind of lead you to lack that cultural identity on that side of things. So when it comes to making music, I've tried to lean into it in times in the studio, but it's actually not necessarily felt truly authentic to me. So I think something I'd much rather do, I want to go to India for like 2 months and then make a project when I'm out there or come back and make a project that's like, I don't know, say a three song project that's like directly inspired from that experience. I think that would be a much truer way for me to do it.

[00:04:49]>> Well, Jade came on Jade was our first guest on the podcast. Um, and she discussed her experience as a mixed race person. And actually, she read a book by Natalie Evans and Naomi Evans. They wrote a book called The Mixed Race Experience. And I wanted to mention it because I feel like it's a really beautiful book for mixed race people.

[00:05:08]She explained that it really helped her kind of look into who she was and how she feels about herself. I guess it is a really uh disjointed feeling for you, right? that you have this culture that you represent but you don't feel connected to. Do you feel more connected now that you're >> I I I think so. I've still not actually gone there for the first time, so I'm looking forward to when that happens. I mean, my full name is Charles Michael Bjet Singh. So, I literally can't help but carry Yeah. No, I I love it and I carry it around with me and um my baba, which is is Punjabi fur granddad, he gave me this bracelet. It's called a cutter. If you if you know about seekism, you'll know about it. And that's my family are from Punjab in North India and so I really want to go there and like really really properly intentionally connect with that. Um but yeah as as I've got older it's kind of something that I've had way more understanding of I think being exposed to say when you go to uni for example and you get exposed to all these different cultures and you might meet someone who's like really in touch with their culture and I'm sort of there thinking yeah but you know I grew up half Indian in Canterbury and didn't have any of that exposure. So, you know, it's something that I definitely want to expose myself more to and immerse myself in. But, you know, it's just one of these things. It's like as you get older, you find out more about yourself.

[00:06:26]You can go and explore these things and work it out. So, maybe when I get some time, I'll go over there. And >> yeah, I mean, honestly, I my dad um was Irish and I only went to Ireland for the first time when I was like 28. Like, I hadn't ever been to Ireland. Haven't ever hadn't ever visited there. So, I think it is like fairly normal. you're in your early 20s, you're forging out your career, you're working out who you want to be, but it's an exciting prospect to think about going and experiencing that.

[00:06:53]>> But no, like yeah, that's the thing. I wasn't I wasn't really too exposed to the culture growing up, so it's something that I need to like I need to go and really get into, but >> Oh, no, but I think that's a really shared experience. Yeah, I think that's a really um I know I've got a lot of friends who have experience similar where they haven't necessarily known the full extent of their fullest cult, you know, their whole culture, but that's also something exciting that you can explore and especially musically. I mean, I'd love to hear when when you go to India and you make some amazing pop album, that'd be incredible.

[00:07:23]>> Yeah. And I think it's kind of like it's also quite a new thing really. I mean, if you think that it's not been that long where, you know, getting married in different races was even socially acceptable, like if you really trace it back. Um, and so even it's quite it's still quite a new issue really that people are growing up without that kind of identity or without the ability to really immerse themselves in a culture that they're told that they belong to. I mean, another thing like when I was growing up like people always used to tell me I had a big nose, but it's like I don't have a big nose. I just have a nose from the Indian side of my family.

[00:07:56]You have a gorgeous nose. I've got to say I'm cuz I I I'm obviously not half Indian, but I grew up and same. I got told I had a big nose and it's because I have like a I guess they call it like a sometimes they call it a Roman nose or that like you say it's it's like related to your cultural heritage and your family. I love that. And I think society like to try and edit like make everyone skinny, make their noses one type of size. And it's like I see beauty in what is represented in who you are. Does that make sense?

[00:08:29]>> Yeah. To be that's something that I've become so much more aware of since putting myself out there is like, you know, even like little things like so I've been going gray since I was 16.

[00:08:39]Like my hair has been going gray. Um and like I've I've just owned it. We called it salt and pepper. I'm proud of it. I actually love my gray hair. Yeah. But and have you got >> Well, that's why my By the way, for you, you've skipped ahead, but we're going to do it right now. By the way, I love your hair >> really >> because I also went gray at 16 and I did nothing about it.

[00:08:59]>> So, I am older than you. So, mine is fully gray now. And I really wanted to bring that up because first and foremost, like you are 23. So, it is people would be I guess shocked that you'd have gray hair so young. But what a lot of people don't understand is it's pigment loss. A lot of the time it's genetic. It's pigment loss. Like so it's not like aging for example. Like your hair is not aged hair. It's just that you've lost the pigment in it.

[00:09:22]>> You're teaching me about it cuz I didn't even know that. So >> yeah, it's like and it can be stress. It can be trauma as well. But I think it's beautiful and I love seeing young people embracing it. I was the same as you when um I was in my 20s. I started growing gray at 16. Everyone was telling me to diet it. everyone was and I think I do think it's um easier for men because I think women are more aged whereas like men looking older is kind of more socially acceptable but I think it's really important that you stick with it.

[00:09:49]I mean tell me about it like did anyone ever tell you to dye it or change it?

[00:09:53]>> Pretty much every comment section of something I post or if I go live on Tik Tok people just people just comment on it and it's like it's something that makes you kind of aware of yourself. So like I don't know whether it's like a nose or a hair or like you know a bad skin day or whatever it is. I think when you're putting yourself out there these issues are just highlighted to you and it kind of makes me like aware of the fact like it's no wonder why loads of people are out here getting so much work done or transforming themselves after being put into the public eye because it really shines a light on you and can bring up things that you know if you feel remotely insecure about like that's actually quite a difficult thing to deal with. Um, I'm lucky that I kind of don't care and I don't care that my hair is going great. I love it and so like people can talk away and that's not going to get to me. But, you know, if if you're someone who's more affected by that that sort of thing and people's opinion, it can really like shine a light on you to kind of change yourself, which I don't think is healthy.

[00:10:46]>> No. And I think it's a really important point to bring up. I think the element of not caring, I don't care either, and I never cared because I was a tomboy.

[00:10:54]And I remember my first one of my this guy used to cut my hair. He was like, "You should think about dying it soon."

[00:10:59]And I was like, why?

[00:11:01]>> Cuz I think it's kind of cool. This was like 20 years ago when it really was not cool to have gray hair. And then suddenly people started to be like, "Oh my god, your hair's so cool." However, a bit like you, I occasionally will just get someone commenting, "Who's this old woman?" Whereas I don't look old. I don't think >> you don't at all. You have lovely skin.

[00:11:20]>> Oh, thank you.

[00:11:20]>> It's all right. Um, I feel like it's one of those things where if you can't be weaponized by something that someone says, then what a power that is. Because the reality is that if it was an insecurity for you, they would be getting exactly what they want, which is to bring you down a peg or two or to hurt your feelings. And honestly, I think it looks amazing, guys. It looks amazing, doesn't it?

[00:11:42]>> Two greats.

[00:11:44]>> Both of us. Both of us. I mean, I think yours, but I think they both look amazing. when you're my age, give it give yourself 10 years and it will be if it keeps going. I think it's going to be sick.

[00:11:54]>> I can't wait. I've I've even contemplated dying the whole thing.

[00:11:57]Great.

[00:11:58]>> Yeah. So, I just Okay, bit of advice for you. No, bit of advice for you. I did that when I was your age. I um I was making it sound like I'm like 50 years older than you, but but when in my 20s, I dyed the front two pieces of my hair bleach blonde to make them gray to match the rest. Ruined my hair for years. do not do it because your hair as it is is so unique and beautiful and everybody that I meet that likes my hair asks me how I did it because they think it's not real >> and you cannot recreate the single strands. So my best advice please keep it >> I'm owning it.

[00:12:33]>> The only thing I would say you could do which would be so fun is dye your eyebrows.

[00:12:37]>> Great.

[00:12:38]>> Yeah, you could bleach your eyebrows one time for a photo shoot or something. Art directors come at me. I think that would be cool for Charlie. bleached eyebrows dyed toned gray could be cool, but it also could be awful. So, don't blame me if it is.

[00:12:50]>> Yeah, maybe I need a bit more of a tan or something first.

[00:12:52]>> Yeah, maybe.

[00:12:53]>> But I I really appreciate you um leaving it as it is because the amount of comments I get from other women and I feel like as a 23-year-old, a lot of men will look to you and go like, "Yeah, I can I can leave my hair and let it go gray." And I think it's important to have role models in the public eye who are doing things that are, I guess, natural to them, what they feel comfortable and sexy in. You know, >> I've had loads of support from the gay-haired community out there who have reached out to me and they've gone, "You made me feel confident in my hair."

[00:13:23]Yeah. Genuinely, cuz you think like there's so many uh >> the gray hair community. I love that we have a community.

[00:13:27]>> Yeah, we're a gray hair community. Like, but um there's so many people who like literally go through the exact same thing and it's probably like one or two kids in a school year. But when you put that together throughout an entire country or world, there's quite a lot of people who just start to go gray younger. And I just think owning owning whatever's natural to you and feeling confident and comfortable in that is always going to be a win. So that's kind of what I root for.

[00:13:49]>> Exactly. And and and that confidence can come from if you want to have tweakments, if you want to do stuff, I have no judgment of that. It's about doing it for you though. That's the key is making sure that whatever you're doing is just for you and how you feel.

[00:14:00]Um, and I think a lot of men experience obviously receding hairlines, hair loss, and all that stuff. So, that's probably more predominantly what people think about that others would comment on in a man. So, I'm intrigued that people negatively comment on the gray hair because to me, men with gray hair is something that they have always been celebrated for. Whereas women, I do get called old a lot. And I'm like, it makes me laugh because I'm like, cool, I'm not old, so I'm not worried about it. If you're worried also about someone being old or not old, why don't you just live your life? Because life is too short to be calling other people old or young or >> Yeah. I mean, people kind of comment.

[00:14:35]They're like, I can't tell if he's 16 or 50. Do you know what I mean? That's kind of what I get told.

[00:14:40]>> And that is firstly bizarre.

[00:14:42]>> Weird. Yeah.

[00:14:42]>> And secondly, it's also like, great, good, cuz you're not somebody I'm wanting to know my age. I don't need you to know my date of birth. Thank you.

[00:14:50]>> Yeah. Stay unbothered. Do you know what I mean? Like >> Yeah. And imagine how fab it's going to be 10 years time. re-watch this podcast.

[00:14:56]It'll be it'll be like white. I think it's an element of when you go gray younger as well. I don't know if you noticed this of it being quite silvery.

[00:15:05]>> Like yours is quite silvery as well.

[00:15:07]>> Is it silvery?

[00:15:08]>> Yeah. Like silver color rather than like total gray. It's like a It's like quite a sharp color.

[00:15:13]>> It's in your face. It's in your face.

[00:15:15]Opposite. It's like a It's like a tennis ball that's been colored in different colors.

[00:15:19]>> Yeah. It's gorgeous. A gorgeous tennis ball. Um like owning your hair color. I loved that you when you sent your by the ways today that you wanted to do um by the way I'm half Indian. How important is it for you to represent your cultural heritage even though you haven't fully immersed yourself in it yet? Like how important is it for you people to know that about you?

[00:15:39]>> I I think the way that I view it is I know that when my babe came over to uh England, he did it with the intention to provide a better life for my entire family. And uh the way that I view it is I carry his name in my name. Buljit Singh Jir is my middle names. Um and so it's a part of my identity and who I am to carry that with me no matter how immersed I am in it. Um and so I do understand from a self-aware perspective that like there's an abundance of learning you can do about yourself and your cultural heritage and that's always going to be the case. Having more to learn is not a reason to not be proud of kind of what you are, whatever that is, you I love that. Yeah, >> that is a beautiful way to put it as well because also as a human I think we shouldn't be putting so much pressure on ourselves to know everything about ourselves.

[00:16:29]>> Baby boy, you are 23. You have got all the time in the world to be learning about yourself. And like when you're ready to learn the different things, not just about your cultural heritage, but also about who you are as a person, it's exciting. You've got a whole life to do that. And that's so fun.

[00:16:43]>> That that is what life does to you. It makes you learn [ __ ] about yourself. And one of my affirmations that I'm saying at the moment, I see room for growth without self-deprecation.

[00:16:52]>> That's what I'm saying about myself.

[00:16:54]>> I like that.

[00:16:55]>> Yeah. It makes me feel good.

[00:16:56]>> Is that coming from because you're very um focused on gratitude? I know. Like it's something big for you.

[00:17:02]>> Is that something where you have an internal negative voice that you're trying to fight against? Is that does that come from a place of self flagagillation or >> uh like without getting too deep into trauma? I would say like I I just know the value of being happy with what you've got. And I think that when you overlook what's in front of you, that is what leads you to be a sadder person later in life. I think you know like I don't know if you've ever had a sore throat and thought, "Jesus, I wish I could swallow right now." Or if you've had a bad knee and thought, "Oh, I wish I could walk." I'm not being a preacher.

[00:17:36]I'm not being a motivational speaker, I swear. But when I when you go through those experiences, it just makes you realize kind of what you had. And they're like small situations that can happen on a much larger scale in daily life. So I just try and say the things I'm grateful for in the day cuz it makes me feel happy.

[00:17:51]>> It tr I do it every single day. Top top 10 grateful things in that day. And it can range from my cat to a big job that I got or whatever. And I think it's important to remember like anybody listening that these great gratefuls don't have to be these huge things that you're achieving. It can be getting out of bed in the morning. Yeah. It can be getting out of bed before noon. You know, it can be as small as you want it to be, as large as you want it to be, because each grateful creates a ball of gratefuls that then kind of steamroll you into >> I think I think it's better the more small and specific you can be with the things that you're grateful for in life.

[00:18:25]>> Um, let's talk a bit little bit about my Madonna. There's a lyric in there that I wanted to get into. I bought you Jasmine when your hands are empty. I loved that lyric.

[00:18:33]>> Yeah. So, my Madonna, the song is about the push and pull of a toxic yet magnetic love situationship. That's how I've >> configured it into words. Yeah. And I think that what that lyric kind of represents is like I gave you something when you had nothing. Jasmine is like a flower. It's like I put I put flowers in your hand. I gave you what you didn't even know you needed when you had nothing. Um cuz you gave a miracle to me and the miracle being I don't know like a feeling or love or anything else.

[00:19:03]>> Oh interesting. Spiritually jasmine symbolizes purity, divine favor and the sweet aroma of prayer. The flower represents hope and resurrection.

[00:19:11]>> There you go.

[00:19:12]>> I love that song. It's really great. I mean this it's exciting. Like you say you have gone from sac saxophonyist.

[00:19:19]>> I said it right.

[00:19:20]>> Saxophonyist. Yeah.

[00:19:21]>> Not saxoponist. I'm so lame. Oh my saxoponist. I've been saying that my whole life and my producer was like, "Please don't say it on the podcast."

[00:19:28]I'm going to out myself. I don't know how to say saxophonyist.

[00:19:30]>> It's okay. Some people call it trumpet.

[00:19:33]And >> I used to play the trumpet so I would never crossction the two.

[00:19:36]>> Cuz when people get the two mixed up, that's when it kind of gets it gets beefy. I can't like >> Yeah. You want to fight me? Cuz I play the trumpet and you play.

[00:19:43]>> No, no, it's not because that. But if you called If you call my saxophone a trumpet, like then it's >> that sounds like a euphemism.

[00:19:50]>> If you call my saxophone a trumpet, I'm going to kick off.

[00:19:52]>> Everything sounds like a euphemism. be taken out way down >> in this room. Yeah.

[00:19:56]>> Um I actually was a trumpet player back in the day because >> I fancied the trumpet teacher who was a guy and he honestly shocking for everyone but um I fancied the trumpet player and I've had a lifelong affinity to trumpets ever since.

[00:20:12]>> Wow.

[00:20:13]>> Mr. Cadman his name was.

[00:20:14]>> Shout out Mr. Cabman.

[00:20:15]>> Shout out Mr. Mr. I still remember and I can't remember what he looks like but I can remember his name but I remember playing the trumpet and being like do you know what I would love to play the saxophone and there's a very big difference between people like me and people like you because the idea of playing the saxophone is very saxophone but the reality of it is very hard.

[00:20:35]>> I'd say the same about the trumpet though because I I was looking at the trumpet saxophone. I was like that's cool. You know >> you know what you have to be good at this >> Percy lips.

[00:20:45]Oh, is that you? Whereas I'm more like this.

[00:20:49]>> Do you know something about the saxophone? So when you play it, uh, if you hum through the instrument, it makes a growling sound. And the same happens if you whistle. So if you whistle >> normal >> growl.

[00:21:02]>> WOW. We got a growling saxophonyist in the building. Everybody >> top tips. Maybe I'm going to take up saxophone.

[00:21:09]>> Yeah.

[00:21:09]>> You were once a dorman.

[00:21:11]>> I was once a dorman. Yeah, I was a dormant for 3 years whilst I was at uni.

[00:21:15]It was the best >> job I could have had as a uni student, I would say, >> because you can be self-employed. It's super flexible. I was between where I live at home and where I was at uni. I would go up to uni and I would go, "Hey, I'm here. I'm ready to work." And they'd send me loads of shifts cuz the reality is with the security industry is it's a licensed industry. Look, we're completely switching chat right now, but security is a licensed industry where you have to have a license to be able to do it. And to get that license, you have to have paid. It's not like a crazy amount of money, but like it isn't.

[00:21:48]>> So, you had a license?

[00:21:48]>> Yeah, I had a license.

[00:21:49]>> A license to bounce.

[00:21:51]>> Yeah, I got my license to be a dormant 3 days after my 18th birthday.

[00:21:55]>> I was a dormant at a club before I went in a club.

[00:21:58]>> Yeah.

[00:21:58]>> Wow.

[00:21:59]>> Yeah, >> that is I don't even know what to think about that. I was in a club at 15, so I can't relate. Okay. Is she a party girl?

[00:22:07]>> Party girl. Well, back in millennials, I'm a millennial. Um, in millennial times, like you could get into the clubs without an ID. Yeah. Like it was just it was just the wild west of going out. And I do not recommend it to anybody. But I like had a photocopy of my passport and changed the date on it. Is that illegal?

[00:22:24]Well, I'm admitting it too late for you to come for me. Police.

[00:22:27]>> I think you'd be all right.

[00:22:28]>> Yeah. I think the statute of limitations is uh >> I wouldn't have let you in, though.

[00:22:31]>> No, would you not?

[00:22:32]>> I would have known. I would have known.

[00:22:34]Yeah, >> I think I think um nowadays there's just no like back then it was as I say the Wild West doormen weren't really doorman. They were just like people standing on the door who let you pay them and then they let you in.

[00:22:45]>> Yeah, it was you know it was actually such an interesting job for so many reasons. I think for character development being a doorman is very good like you get to deal with you deal with all sorts of people and you really have to stand on business. But you know separately to that there were so many experiences that I went I was literally a dormant for 3 years. I had glass bottles thrown at me. I stopped people getting spiked when it could have happened, which for me was like a huge thing because like that when that situation had unfolded, it was like, wow, something really serious could have happened there. And uh you know, >> I'm very grateful for that. Let's pause and like reflect on that because I think it is something for people in general in clubs.

[00:23:26]people in clubs, men or women, bouncers or workers or just people attending. If you see somebody that looks shifty around someone's drink or you see someone that doesn't cuz sometimes people are drunk but there's a very big difference when you've been spiked. You can go from naugh to um unable to move.

[00:23:46]And I think always on the side of caution, right? Is that what you did?

[00:23:50]You just saw some Did you step in before it was spiked?

[00:23:53]>> I'll never forget. So, I was on the door of McDonald's, actually, and it was like an early hours in the Sunday morning, maybe like 5:00 a.m., and there was this boy on the other side of the street, and he just looked he looked pretty drunk anyway, and he was with his mate. Then his mate left, so he's just by himself, and I'm just there sort of observing this like, hm, he doesn't look all right. Then a guy's gone over, started chatting to him, and then he's gone away. And I'm watching him. I'm like, okay, cool. Then he's come back about 2 minutes later with a with a beer can and they're walking down the street together and I'm literally just watching it cuz I'm like this doesn't feel right.

[00:24:25]>> And then I watched the guy put his hand on the boy's lower back and this boy looked young. Put hand on the lower back. So when I started walking over then he raised his hand to the top of the boy's neck and went to pour the drink in his mouth. And I went, "Stop there." It actually gave me goosebumps even talking about that. I was like, "Stop there. Um, do you know him?" I said to the boy. And the boy turned around to me and he was like, and I was like, "Absolutely not."

[00:24:48]Grabbed the boy, started walking him back towards McDonald's. And one of the homeless people who had been sat outside all night came up to me and he went, "Was that boy just talking to that man over there?" And I was like, "Yeah." And he was like, "He got kicked out of the club down the road last week for spiking someone." And I was just, it was like a heart drop moment. I was like, "What?"

[00:25:05]And then I took this boy to the side. I was like, "Right, open your open your phone. and I'm going to take your take your details so I can make sure you get home.

[00:25:13]>> And uh he opened his phone and I looked on Instagram to follow myself and I had one mutual with him who was my little sister who was 16 at the time and I went I went home and I asked my sister and the boy was 16 and he nearly got sped out in the street. So and that was a real moment for me cuz I was like you know what when I was younger my mom used to tell me there was wrongs out on the street. She was so right. She was so right. You never know who it is like these people look normal. They go out on normal nights out dressed in normal clothing and then they'll wait until you're vulnerable and take advantage of you. And that's something that I really learned. Insecurity is that you can never judge a book by its cover. I I literally have so many security stories I could tell you. Like it's crazy.

[00:25:50]>> No. And and I and I firstly just want to say well done for doing that. And I think a lot of people would wouldn't and I and I think it's something in society now to remember is like >> those small moments will fill your life with more joy. Like doing something like that where you really truly can help someone. Walking past someone in the street that's passed out is not humanity. Stop, check, check if they're okay. Say, "Hey, how you doing?" Young people especially need people looking out for them. And it's so great to hear that you did that. And also something to look out for. Also, please, and I think this happens more with men because I'm a woman, it very rarely happens. Don't leave your friends alone. M >> like if your friend is drunk and out and about and they want to stay out and you want to go home, you drag them home with you.

[00:26:38]>> Like in most of my female situations, there's no way we would leave a girl behind. Like if somebody wants to stay, you stay with them until they get home.

[00:26:46]Like you just don't leave them. And I think it's more of a culture of like, oh, he'll be all right. And actually, he might not be.

[00:26:52]>> Well, boy boys are vulnerable, too.

[00:26:54]There's no doubt about it. um you know there are people who are out maliciously looking at younger boys to target them specifically and so like you know you whether it's a case of like just getting in an Uber or whatever it is I don't know I always take those kind of precautions and I think when you've had the experience of say working in night life as a dorman it's completely different because it makes you look like even now sometimes when I'm in say a club or I'm out and about like you just kind of look at things differently and you're kind of just always aware and I like to go out with like a mate who I know is kind of there for me and like, you know, we're looking out for each other. You need you need that with your friends.

[00:27:31]>> 100%. Great advice. If you're going out, make sure at least one of the people you're going out with is someone who you would trust to call in the middle of the night to come and get you. You need a ride or die. I do think if you're going to be intoxicated or if you're going to be out and about being silly, take a mate with you that you know is your ride or die. So, I'm going to ask you um to get something off your chest, Charlie.

[00:27:53]Um, is there something you can think of that you'd like to tell the people to get off your chest?

[00:27:57]>> By the way, you never know what's hidden behind a closed door.

[00:28:00]>> Oh, is that metaphorical?

[00:28:03]>> Kind of. Like my mom always used to say that to me as in you don't know anything about a person more than what they show you.

[00:28:11]>> So, anybody could be anyone is what you I guess you >> Yeah.

[00:28:15]>> Do you think that's why you're so safety conscious? like as a bouncer when you worked as a bouncer like it seems like as a human you're quite like emotionally switched on. You're like I don't know if I can trust that person.

[00:28:26]>> Emotionally switched on but also emotionally open and uh and I'm I'm I'm very open like to say what I feel or to communicate something that I'm feeling in a given time. What I mean when I say you never know what's hidden behind a closed door is like you don't know what someone's dealing with at home. You don't know what's happened to them in their past. you don't know how they talk about you when you're not there. You and that could be good or it could be bad.

[00:28:50]And so it's just generally like just don't forget that you only know what a person shows you. And I think that a wider part of that conversation and maybe why that resonates with me the more I grow up is because like you know people can see all sorts of things about you on the internet. They can have all sorts of perceptions about you. Many people who might have you know seen this thing about you might not have seen that thing about you. And so you only know what you know about a person but that doesn't mean you know the person. I c I couldn't agree with you and your mom.

[00:29:16]Yeah. More.

[00:29:17]>> Shout out to Haley.

[00:29:18]>> Shout out Haley. Um because I in this job I meet a lot of people for a living.

[00:29:25]And I um have learned a really important lesson which is knowing that I don't know someone from one meeting. I really dislike the concept of like meeting someone especially it happens with like celebrities and stuff and being like, "Oh, they're not nice." And it's like I know that people probably say that about me. Although maybe not because I'm like a weird puppy dog. Nice. But I think there's probably people that don't like me. There's probably the people that don't like you from one interaction or one thing they've seen online. And that makes me sad. So anyone I meet, celebrity, non-ceelebrity, person I work with, whatever, I won't ever take the first meeting as verbatim. I'll always be like, "Let me see what's inside that." because we discussed actually um with Grace Campbell on the podcast about um how shy people might might sometimes come across rude and it might just be because they're shy and actually they don't have the confidence to be able to open up with you yet. And I'm kind of the person, I don't know if you're like this, I want to crack if someone's like a bit shy or a bit like introverted, I'm like I'm going to crack this nut, >> you know, and get it out of them.

[00:30:30]>> Yeah.

[00:30:31]>> Yeah. I I I definitely I definitely resonate with resonate. Yeah, I resonate with that. I would say >> What's your type with dating?

[00:30:39]>> My type with dating? Um >> cuz they tend to say like I'm a I'm a golden retriever. My girlfriend's a black cat. That's the kind of vibe. It's like the black cat's someone that's more emotionally reserved and the golden retriever is the one that like really wants to please. Yeah.

[00:30:52]>> So, do you fit into those tropes or not really? Do you like girls that are like following the black cat or the golden retriever vibe? I think my type with dating is just people that know themsel.

[00:31:02]Like I find that very attractive when someone has a very strong sense of self and they're like I know who I am. I'm com like comfortable in myself enough to be open with someone else. I think that's like >> that's like the first thing. Um beyond that just like I really I really don't know with dating anymore cuz like what I've learned is that I don't know what I like.

[00:31:22]>> Well that's fine.

[00:31:22]>> Yeah. I think that's the main that's the main thing that I've learned is to be open to whatever.

[00:31:26]>> And I think um you never know what's behind a locked door. Um because you don't you don't and you're going to meet someone that's going to have certain tropes and they might be a totally different person. I mean I hate to tell you 10 years deeper than you into life and I've just realized I date the same similar kind of people. But what I end up realizing is that you just date a version that fits with you more well.

[00:31:48]>> Yeah. And I think like regardless when it comes to dating, it really often depends on the space that you're in in terms of how you're going to receive that person because it's not just like it's not just a person >> being them around you. It's you receiving them. It's the same with like I don't know like you know sometimes someone can say thing say something to you and they don't mean it in a bad way but you take it in a bad way cuz you're not in a space to receive it. And I think that when it comes to like love, relationships, all of those things, the most important thing is to clean the house so that someone wants to come to it rather than getting other people to come to a house that's not worth coming to.

[00:32:23]>> Yes. And trying to get them to clean it for you. Do >> you know what I mean? Like no one's going to sort your [ __ ] out.

[00:32:27]>> I love all the metaphors that we're doing. Hey, if you clean the house, they'll come.

[00:32:31]>> It's all writer [ __ ] Do you know what I mean?

[00:32:32]>> Yeah. I like that. Um, tell me, we're we're coming towards the end of the show. Um, but I wanted to You're about to do your first ever international headline show in Turkey.

[00:32:44]>> How are you feeling about it?

[00:32:46]>> 9th of May in Turkey, Istanbul. It's going to be my first time ever going there. Um, I'm very excited. We've sold a lot of tickets. I've had a lot of messages from people saying they're excited. I've never I've only just last month done my first headline show in London. Yeah. Um, and so to step that up and sell a show that's in a completely different part of the world is something that I'm like endlessly grateful for.

[00:33:09]Really looking forward to. I'm going to bring like so much energy. I'm going to be vibrating on the stage. I love that.

[00:33:14]>> Um, so yeah, I'm just buzzing for it.

[00:33:16]Like >> it does feel like the right time for you cuz Madonna's back.

[00:33:18]>> Madonna's back >> and your my Madonna's here.

[00:33:20]>> Can I just say about that? Yeah.

[00:33:22]>> I My jaw hits the floor. Yeah. So my Madonna was written months ago. Yeah. My jaw hit the floor the day that we release it. Sabrina Carpenter brings Madonna out at Coachella. The day after Madonna reach releases her long anticipated single. I'm there and I'm like bro what on earth in the alignment is going on right now. Like it just felt like a crazy set of coincidences to happen. I was just there like what >> are you a big Madonna fan?

[00:33:51]>> Madonna actually in the song my Madonna is about >> more about the historical Madonna.

[00:33:56]>> Yeah. The historical religious figure is kind of like putting it in that way. So, it was just like a massive coincidence.

[00:34:00]>> Coincidence? Oh my god, I love that.

[00:34:01]>> Coincidence is just God's way of staying anonymous. Believe that one.

[00:34:05]>> Don't believe in coincidences.

[00:34:06]>> So many taglines. It's unreal.

[00:34:08]>> Yeah, I come with them.

[00:34:09]>> I feel like we could write a book on this.

[00:34:10]>> Yeah.

[00:34:11]>> Um, thank you so much, Charlie. It's been such a pleasure to chat to you and I'm really excited to see what's to come for you. We got more live gigs. Is there anything else coming up you want to plug?

[00:34:20]>> Loads of live shows, loads more music hopefully coming this summer. I've been working >> with one of my friends, Mahalia. Mahalia is a legend. I love Mahalia today.

[00:34:29]>> Did you make that in the UK or in >> Yeah, that was all done in the UK. Like we got in the studio together. We had a great time. She's an absolute legend.

[00:34:35]She brought me to an Arsenal game which I'm endlessly grateful for.

[00:34:38]>> Um and yeah, like just more music, more live shows, more life, more happiness.

[00:34:43]>> Are you Aona?

[00:34:44]>> I'm a Goona.

[00:34:45]>> I'm a Goona, but I only watch women's football. No offense.

[00:34:50]>> Cheers. Oh, >> cheers. Nice. So, Charlie, um we like to at the end of the show leave a bit of advice for our audiences. So, what piece of gold have you got for our audiences to leave them with?

[00:35:00]>> My my little like golden piece of advice.

[00:35:04]>> Oh, what's this?

[00:35:04]>> Is a Hello Kitty fidget spinner.

[00:35:08]>> So, everybody must carry everybody must carry a Hello Kitty fidget spinner.

[00:35:13]>> Yeah.

[00:35:13]>> Is this ASMR now? Do it again.

[00:35:14]>> We got some ASMR.

[00:35:17]>> That's beautiful. Is that something that calms you down?

[00:35:19]>> You know what? It's something that I picked up when I was at home like a couple a month ago or something and it's just kind of stayed with me in my body.

[00:35:25]Whose is that? Your little sisters.

[00:35:27]>> Yeah. You know what? 2026 is the year we're bringing bringing back 2016. I believe in two things. The fidget spinner and a whip.

[00:35:35]>> Whip. Whip. Watch me. Na na.

[00:35:37]>> I'm saying it's probably the best dance to be forgotten about. Ever.

[00:35:43]>> I don't know if that's a compliment or a mug off.

[00:35:46]>> Just crack out a little whip. Rev it up.

[00:35:48]>> I don't think I can. I think I'm too >> But I will crack out fidget. Never.

[00:35:53]>> No. Let's not cut it. Let's keep it.

[00:35:54]>> Never.

[00:35:55]Charlie Jer, it's been a pleasure.

[00:35:57]Thanks for coming and giving us your By the way, it's been beautiful to talk about your half Indian heritage and also everything that's going on with you. And we look forward to seeing you again soon.

[00:36:05]>> Thank you.

[00:36:06]>> Charlie Jer, everybody.