Goth Gatekeeping: Your Comments!

Added: 2026-05-08

[00:00:00]Following up on my episode on gatekeeping, like a sequel that probably won't be as good, like Speed 2.

[00:00:11]>> [music] >> Welcome to Bat Channel Lite, beaming goth, dark wave, and post-punk straight into your brain.

[00:00:20]It's no good hiding, I'll find you. I know you like to hide in the wardrobe in the spare room.

[00:00:26]This episode is all about your comments and your experiences of gatekeeping, so no wrong answers here. For those who don't know what the hell I'm talking about, click that small blob of death up there. If it appears, it's a fickle little beast. If it's not presenting itself, it's in a vid called is goth gatekeeping toxic or necessary. So, yeah, most of your comments were delivered with the expected passion and grace. There was this one, though, which is hilarious.

[00:01:04]Finally making watertight the correlation between those who troll and very low IQs. Before I get to your comments, it's worth reacquainting ourselves with what goth gatekeeping actually means. There is no dictionary definition, and this is not a thesis, but there were some comments that highlighted more serious issues or situations. Some that could require well, police intervention, or at the very least some serious education. Here in the UK, we do have the Sophie Lancaster Foundation, which is about celebrating individuality, and it also provides some education around inclusivity and tolerance. So, if you search online for what is goth gatekeeping, you'll most likely get a definition such as goth gatekeeping is the practice of restricting entry to the goth subculture by enforcing strict criteria, primarily focusing on music knowledge and authenticity over fashion.

[00:02:11]And there will be slight variations of that according to how you search for it, what you're searching on, is there an AI input here, but that is generally what it tends to throw up. So, with that definition brought back into focus, let's bring that forward into your comments.

[00:02:32]So, the very wonderful Sun is says, "It definitely has both good and bad sides, depending on the thought behind it. I have been told that I'm not goth enough, especially when I don't look like the modern trad goth version 24/7." So, a nicely balanced start there, and a real reflection on how context is important. And also how toxic gatekeeping can actually be, which is that we can't look like this every minute of every single day. It would be fine if we all ran goth record shops for a living and could wear exactly what we wanted, but most of us can't do that.

[00:03:16]Valoria Black, hope I've pronounced that right, said, "Gatekeeping doesn't necessarily mean elitism, and it's not always, if not mostly, about simply not wanting people in and keeping it for yourself. There are many, and I mean so many, who are interested in a subculture, but in an extremely watered-down way. Thanks to the internet, everything is accessible. That means twisting and turning things easily." Yeah, totally, the internet has made things a lot more accessible, and in many ways that's a good thing, but it has also provided social media platforms that spew out this watered-down and shallow version of a subculture. I did cover this in the last episode, and you just see a ton of from norm to goth transformation videos, and they're there to garner followers, support, fame, and also to generate income. JG said, "What people call gatekeeping is really nothing more than fans of a particular genre not wanting to have their genre subverted into something unrecognizable.

[00:04:29]The only people who have a problem with gatekeepers are the people who are trying to subvert the genre." Hmm, not sure I agree with that, JG. As I mentioned in my previous vid, I was called a poser in a non-troll way, in a non-troll environment, and I had a problem with gatekeepers at that point.

[00:04:51]But either myself or the channel are not out to subvert the genre. So, I totally get your first point, but it seems that gatekeeping can strike anyone anytime, and when it hits one of our own, it's like to the toxic bin with you. Barbed Wire Rat said, "I suppose I gatekeep around what it means to be goth, because I don't want the subculture to be diluted away into being just whatever any random person decides it means to them. If it is all relative and can be anything, then it loses all meaning.

[00:05:29]I like to say that being an enthusiastic fan of goth music is mandatory, whereas the dark, beautiful aesthetic is optional, though highly appreciated. I suppose I look at it as though the music is the essential, primary attribute of the subculture, and the aesthetic is the most significant secondary attribute."

[00:05:49]Thank you, Barbed, and yet another comment about not wanting the subculture to be watered-down or diluted in any way, and that's a common concern. Also, a reference to the external aesthetics being secondary to the music. Late Dejected said, "I've had sand thrown my way just because I don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of every goth band, every single song, or that I don't wear much makeup. But for me, the defining factor is not giving a about others' opinions. If it's not in your heart, then you've got your answer." Love this. Not giving a about what other people say. There's an alarming amount of gatekeeping thrown at our own, isn't there? I've had it, and I'm reading lots of instances where it's happened to others. That's not good, is it? Eden Wicked 66 said, "I'm the worst gothic gatekeeper elitist. I'm the kind that will tell you that's not goth, but proceed to not educate you about it, and even go as far as saying I'm not goth."

[00:06:57]I know someone with a love for metal and Black Sabbath who has never been to a concert. I never invited them to one, nor will I. I will not introduce anyone to cool gothic music unless you know the basics. Don't know Bauhaus or Joy Division? Guess you will never know Twin Tribes' Vision video or She Past Away.

[00:07:17]Eden, you're gatekeeping yourself.

[00:07:21]Noir said, "I've never seen the sense of it. If you're new to the thing, you're new. People aren't 100% real from the start, especially if you don't know the relevant parts yet. How can you know people are serious about it just by looks? So, calling others a poser is just another form of bullying." Well said, and in terms of that facet or reason to gatekeep, that's the one that I find most mystifying and toxic. Snap decisions are made, and the gatekeeper deals their unfriendly card to one of their own. Now, as promised, I'd like to move on to some comments that, although they fall out of the frame of gatekeeping, are still important to highlight. These comments concern the sexualization and objectification of members of our subculture. Whilst shallow and disingenuous social media posts can exacerbate the problem, it remains a huge issue, not only in our subculture, but generally. As Robert puts it, gatekeeping is an annoying term, but I think safeguarding is a better alternative. Definitely when it comes to clubs, you want to keep out people who will put other people in harm's way, who are not welcome in our subculture. The wonderful Our Vampire Secret said, "Hi, [snorts] Dan.

[00:08:47]Gatekeeping has only one valid purpose, and you did not mention it." So, I hope that a refocus on what goth gatekeeping means has helped clear that bit up.

[00:09:00]Let's continue. I only hope every goth gatekeeps it to hell and back to keep misogynist, transphobic, homophobic, racist, fascist, toxic people out of the subculture, and of late, also to protect goth women from men fetishizing us.

[00:09:18][music] Sanguine Addiction said, "Gatekeeping, unfortunately, sometimes it's necessary, especially when it comes to protecting goth women from perverts." And Ebony Atropos said, "Goth is many things, anti-authoritarian, individualistic, queer, occult culture-centric.

[00:09:39]Anyone who hates difference or abnormality, anyone who supports fascist, repressive, or conformist principles, anyone who's a racist, xenophobe, or nationalist, anyone who hates women or trans people, or any conservative Christian who has a problem with witchcraft, Satanism, or occult practices does not belong. Some very important comments to highlight there.

[00:10:05]As soon as any member of our subculture feels unsafe, verbally attacked, or victimized in any way, those [music] need to be reported as criminal offenses, or at least raised up to the level of safeguarding. Apart from anything else, the act of gatekeeping would not be enough to tackle those instances. And the framing of them to be dealt with under the umbrella of gatekeeping would actually undermine the seriousness, and in some cases urgency, of those kinds of situation. I have to say a big thank you to everyone who commented, and I'm just sorry that I couldn't cover everyone's comments in this follow-up video. I know it's a hot subject that can generate a lot of passion, but you guys pulled it out of the bag. And it was nice to hear from those who are fully on board with gatekeeping, but actually have really logical reasons as to why they do it.

[00:11:08]And let's be honest, who genuinely care about the subculture. So, do I occasionally still feel angry about being called a poser?

[00:11:18]Uh yeah.

[00:11:19]Yeah, I do, actually.

[00:11:21]So, this has not changed my gatekeeping is toxic stance. But, we shouldn't confuse gatekeeping with staunch defense of the realm when it's needed. If you do want to continue the discussion in the comments below, please feel free. I'm unlikely to make another vid on this unless something significant happens, and it won't be as good as this one, anyway, like Jaws 3.

[00:11:48]>> [music]