La blockchain et l'IA peuvent-elles combler le déficit de 2.5T$ dans le financement du commerce ?

本站添加: 2026-05-26

[00:00:00]There's a $2.5 trillion gap in global trade finance. That's $2.5 trillion that could be in legitimate transactions on a yearly basis, but isn't because there's no demand, but because the current infrastructure is outdated. There is a potentially a solution and that's blockchain technology. But in order for institutions to utilize this technology, it has to be fast. It has to be accessible and most of all it has to be trustworthy and that's where this conversation comes in today. I'm joined by Billy of XDC Foundation and Wrongway of Certik, the founder of Certic, the largest web3 cyber security firm in the space. Uh Billy, I'd like to start this conversation asking you why trade finance and why now?

[00:00:54]Yeah. So well trade finance uh originated on the network because the founders uh Tul and Resh had and specifically a tool really had worked with some banks back in India at the time and they were working on risk mitigation and when they were kind of done with that particular project this was before the launch of XDC network. uh they started to look at what is a need within the enterprise space and it really turned to trade finance and so they were really looking at I think from the vision from the very beginning was really about you how can we helpmemes across the globe have access to the funds that they need and naturally the trade finance gap I mean there's trillions of dollars that are happening annually within trade finance and but there's trillions of dollars was clearly that are a gap and are not happening and that's what they really decided they wanted to solve.

[00:01:54]>> Wrong way. Do you think is it more of a security problem? Why is that gap so large uh in your humble opinion?

[00:02:01]>> Oh yeah, I would say that uh uh security is definitely one of the important u uh uh factor for that gap but may not be the only one. So as you mentioned right like well it's it's about accessibility right it's about whether the underlying infrastructure is let's say efficient enough but I would say cyber security is indeed a a reason that scare away many of the institutions right or make them hesitant right to embrace this technology right now right I would say that first of all so many hacks right happen every day right uh like we uh yesterday we started we just we post a tweet like uh in April there just only three days without a hack event in a industry and so on. So this is this is I would say first thing second that um cyber security is one u is part of uh it's one of the risk but there are also other risks like uh compliance risk risk right like uh onchain risk offchain risk and and so on so I would say kind of like uh is uh is still at early stage but we have uh there's so a lot of challenges ahead of us that we need to address uh to indeed empower our I would say the the the full adoption from institutions and so on.

[00:03:21]>> You obviously live and breathe security but Billy for you you know you're approaching this more from a innovation perspective. So when you're having conversations with folks what kind of challenges are you seeing from their perspective? Well, I think always the first thing is how do you go from what is traditional >> to or offchain to what is or can you do onchain and I think that uh the as easy as we talk about what you know the things that you can do in blockchain there are still challenges or points of friction >> that happen for somebody who lives in the off-chain world to be able to figure out well first I have to go from fiat into a dig digital uh stable and then from there you know I have to put in a new wallet I have to maybe move it to another wallet I have to do all these transactions and I I do really believe that at the heart of all of that it then becomes a uh this thought of well the more times I'm moving it the more risk there is >> and I do think if you talk to institutions who are really like wedded in trade or traditional finance whether you know they're traditional custodians or or other you know traditional types of banks if they're holding cryptocurrencies they have such secure vaulting that I I to be able to move it from there has to be you know a pretty risky proposition >> and I think that's the way people view it you know there's just you know when does that risk of doing something on chain outweigh the reward >> and I think uh that's the problem that ultimately needs to be solved. But I will say I I there's been tremendous you know from the uh trustworthiness perspective it's been tremendous work done >> on securing networks what you're doing from an audit perspective uh the fact that it's a standard and you know there's also uh other ways in which people are looking at trustworthiness which is what is it that I am buying if there's a tokenized asset and you know is there something from the source and can I trace it to the source and so >> uh there's been a lot of really great work that's been done and I think there's still a lot more that has to happen.

[00:05:44]>> Yeah. And that's a good follow-up question to you, Wrongway, about tokenized assets. How do you trace it back to the real asset?

[00:05:53]>> Yeah. Well, it's a great question. So, I would say the the the most right now the most successful uh uh tokenized asset is stable stable coin, right? And uh for a stable coin you can see well there are there are compliance um framework right now and uh uh but but I would say uh there are also there are still some effort trying to push forward something what we call real time provid reserve right now let's say this a company first of all you need to trust the company right second they they report this like like the the backed asset right in the um uh in some periods right and work with some external auditing firm right financial uh accounting firm and so on on it but uh this is just for stable coin but for more u a broader u uh class of uh let's say rwa and so on we may need let's say uh real time pro pro reserve right and uh uh and also as we mentioned how we can making sure that this indeed connect with uh uh underlying assets so this uh we need to uh have u uh I would say have new solution also we need to kind like work with more um let's say regulators about let's say if some some some something bad happen right how how can we how can we protect the retail user and so on these are still unclear at the at the moment we need to work with let's say partners like FTC and so on to figure out yeah >> to your point these are ongoing questions but Billy I want to go back to something that you mentioned earlier about you know from a user experience having to go and you know uh switch wallets or make a certain transaction you're you're having to do you know four or five different steps. Is AI the solution to that?

[00:07:45]>> Well, I mean I definitely I think the uh advent of AI agents and what's going on within that space allows for a lot of things to happen that were not happening before. And you know, I I think that um depending on the the corporation or the enterprise that's looking to do something, I mean, they can invest in it how they see fit. And obviously that's happening significantly, you know, across industries. So I I definitely think that there's something in there for that. Uh I don't know what the ultimate solution is for it other than the fact that we all know that the outcome has to be when you open up your phone. It has to be as easy as really what you're doing with say like an Apple Pay >> or something like that where you can walk in anywhere and you just pay for it and uh you know on the back side of it nothing's any different. you want to see your balances, you go to a website. You know, it's it's very simple and it's easy and uh I think the the benefit of blockchain is that it can be immediate in and have finality in transaction. So as a basis for that if when you're bringing kind of those web two interfaces to web 3 uh I think that's you know one of the real values from the financial side but uh that helps people maybe not double spend and some things that people have talked about in >> crypto for a long time but it doesn't actually necessarily make it easier on their part that's the interface >> and so yeah I mean AI agents can go from here to here to here if they if it's set up properly right And so maybe it takes those steps uh and makes them super easy and quick.

[00:09:28]>> That seems to be one of the narratives in crypto as a whole that it can just streamline the process. And so runway for question for you. Does this type of seamless transition? Does it create more opportunities for vulnerabilities or are there any risks associated with these AI agents?

[00:09:47]>> Oh yeah. So uh first of all I would say the development of AI indeed introduced lots of new stress right to uh to crypto industry. So as I mentioned right April may be one of the our most busy months right only three days with our hacking events. uh although there's no strict evidence showing that well this is cost or uh related to AI development but we we have things some some um uh evidence like well it's highly related and uh with the development of AI and so on. So I would say the but right now the hackers life can be easier and but for sur as a security uh firm right our job become more and more uh challenging and uh also we need to catch up the trends like uh uh so so you talk about this uh this new interface and so on. So I think uh in the past few years we work closely with the partner to make the smart contracts itself more and more secure.

[00:10:48]Right. So we have seen that the hacks related to smart contract vulnerability has been dropped but right now due to this we want to create a better uh interface right like user they do not want to directly interact with smart contract and so on right so we want to have a web two like right user experience well this ch will introduce definitely more um uh uh attack vector uh that that's that's for sure and uh it's still at a very early stage right I would to allocate the the industry to pay more attention to to spend more allocate more resources to secure beyond the smart contract right to secure let's say the application right uh to uh to uh let's say secure the uh the the operation right and so on so that this part I would say is is more urgent from my point of view at at this moment >> and so while we're on the topic of AI I do want to follow up with you know how is AI impacting the cyber security side >> of the things.

[00:11:51]>> Yeah. Well, so first of all, I would say the the AI model right now can in already find very uh I would say uh manifold um vulnerabilities and uh uh from our current evaluation is it can work uh as good as um I would say uh junior auditor or junior security researcher. So big advance compared with maybe two years two years ago. uh and uh uh well the when hacker utilize AI right they do not worry too much about the cost right like they want to target a project or want to target let's say exchange they can simply spend lots of tokens right try to do the attack but for the let's say but as a cyber security firm right it it's hard right it's kind of like we we have some budget right we work with uh let's say a number of clients right and we work just in scope so that's that's makes this wall a little bit unfair, right? So, we try to kind of like So, that's why we release our AI auditor, we try to release some um uh cost effective um solution that uh can integrate that solution into the development cycle, right? Rather than wait until let's say a big release, right? And a a big apple audit and so on. We try to utilize this approach to uh to to def to fight against you know kind of like the the the new risk introduced by AI.

[00:13:20]>> Thanks for that breakdown. I do want to get back to the uh conversation around uh trade finance uh because trade finance seems to be a very general topic but you know your boots on the ground Billy you're talking to a lot of teams they're thinking about things a little bit differently than most are. So, what are some of the use cases that you're seeing from a trade finance perspective?

[00:13:44]I know like accounts receivable is most likely part of that process, but I'd love to hear from you. What are some of the great use cases that you're seeing?

[00:13:52]>> So, I I really when we look at it and I think trade finance is really in many ways it's just really about somebody has a shipment and they've got an invoice and they want to send it somewhere and so and I guess the thing of you know you got probably have 40 different pieces of paper in making that transaction. So, getting that onchain and doing all of these things, you know, there are risks.

[00:14:17]There's risks obviously to being on paper, but uh I I think it's it's a hard pull to say, okay, well, it's a complicated system. Let's just make it happen. And I think along the way while we've been doing this and it's been building, you know, the idea of just real world assets and tokenization has grown just in general and access and ability to be able to launch tokens has grown tremendously across the network.

[00:14:46]So now we see opportunities where uh you know tokenization isn't just about taking an asset and putting it on a network but it's also really about uh what can a business maybe do with their debt. Can they restructure it? You know do they have cash flows?

[00:15:05]And by bringing that on chain and creating a vault and offering it to uh people who kind of fit the profile of what they're looking for to, you know, help businesses like that and where where they want to put their money, then um you know, you're creating sustainable yields that are building and supporting real businesses, but it may actually be more uh generated towards working capital than maybe specifically, you know, here's an invoice, let me just get that paid for so I can deliver it. So, we're starting to see the evolution of what's really happening in the space.

[00:15:38]And I think a lot of our focus has really been, you know, we we're not really just here to tokenize. We want to because, you know, it's been proven you can tokenize, but we want to actually add real value to industries and markets. And so, that's really been our focus. How can we actually do that?

[00:15:54]>> And so, is tokenizing uh more about the liquidity aspect of it or what's like the real advantage there going through that tokenization? Well, it depends on, I think, what side of the equation you're looking at because, you know, you have the issuers and then you have the liquidity providers. And so if you're looking at industries that typically, you know, securization industries for off-chain trade finance where you're doing a lot of transactions and you're you're turning dollars over on a very short cycle, you know, 45, 47, 60 days, something like that from a traditional invoice, you know, then, you know, you're looking at how can you actually streamline the process? How can you actually have everything digitized so that you can see it on chain and you know no documents are ever lost when in in that process. But I I I think the big thing on that side really is somebody's not taking a bill of lady and going to five different people and saying can you give me money and five different people giving them money because only one person actually has that product secured. So when you're on an a network and you have a platform that can do that, you can see that there's one person that has actually uh lent money towards that invoice. And you know, you're going to actually save a lot in the way of fraud. And you know you want to talk about the trade finance gap you know if you have multiple people who are lending money you know giving money to somebody for an invoice you know it's not a very uh good system in terms of efficiency. So I think that's one way in which we're seeing things that have like real potential.

[00:17:35]But I also think there's opportunities to kind of change the way invoice factoring happens in that it can become more efficient on secondary markets. So, you know, those people that maybe are maybe if they're stuck with an invoice that's not really performing, they have, you know, better outlets to be able to uh, you know, manage those assets. And, uh, if you have it on chain and it's immediate and people can see these marketplaces and and participate in them, then I think, you know, there's opportunities for that. And so, you know, those are the kinds of things I think, you know, people are trying to do.

[00:18:16]transparency, faster, cheaper. It seems like a lot of benefits in in implementing this system. I wanted to uh pivot about the uh I don't know if we call it partnership, but the collaboration you're obviously building this uh infrastructure and runway you're securing it so that way more institutions can use this.

[00:18:34]>> Uh walk me through the process of you know what made you decide to work with Certic? How has that experience been on your end?

[00:18:42]>> Yeah. Uh well overall I mean it's been great. Uh and it's been years at this point. Uh I'm I'm trying to think at the first time we had really realized that okay and we need to get out and you know find somebody to you know audit a particular contract or what we were doing.

[00:19:01]>> Uh it's been so long I can't even remember what it actually was about at the time. But um yeah we ended up uh working together on it. And I think since that time, what's really kind of happened is that, you know, it's not just a matter of what's happening on the network level, but we have a lot of different projects that are coming onto the network and they're looking to do things and, you know, we're we're working with um with other people >> to help bring these projects here. You know, we were talking about this earlier. We're doing work with uh PlugandPlay in Silicon Valley. we have an accelerator going on and we have a number of projects that are coming through there that uh need to have audits and you know they're building something on the network and so uh I think that's just a natural progression you know we have kind of these partnerships that we kind of tried to build with people that we want to work with over a long period of time and you build confidence and then you know the opportunity is to kind of expand within that network.

[00:19:57]>> Yeah know it's it's been a real pleasure working together. runway. What about uh from your end? Um how's it been working with XDC? Yeah, I would say it's definitely a great experience uh because uh so I would say this uh in let's say tokenization institution actually they still very new uh concept and uh and as a new uh technical stack and working with pioneering um project like XDC also you know help us uh to improve our uh cyber security technology right to improve our internal solution right uh to see if if it can match the what do we call institution institutional grade uh cyber security right and so on so well I would say it's it's great pleasure for us to working with um XTC and uh we learn a lot from this procedure as well and hope hope that we can uh work uh together in future and help secure not only the FTC network but also the entire ecosystem.

[00:20:57]>> Yeah, thanks so much for your collaboration. and it's a it's a real pleasure and enjoy learning a lot from you in terms of what you're seeing boots on the ground and runway. Thanks so much for adding your insights to this uh conversation from the security perspective. That's all from us. Thank you all for joining.