'This Sort Of Tax Hits the Poorest Hardest' | Down The Local

Added: 2026-05-07

[00:00:00]Hello and welcome to Talk Down the Local, the show that goes from pub to pub across the country, speaking to punters about the subjects driving us all nuts at the moment. Tonight we're at the Raven in Tower Bridge. I'm Phil Dave. Here's what's coming up. So, they don't care if someone's sitting next to you and they've got their arms out like this, nudging their way past people and encroaching for one bit at a time into their space. The thing I have a real issue about is inherited wealth versus people who've actually worked well.

[00:00:32]People just wake up one morning and they've inherited millions. Well, >> that's what I love about opinion. You're entitled to opinion.

[00:00:37]>> Of course.

[00:00:37]>> Anyway, anyway, next question, mate. Is so how would you address me?

[00:00:44]>> Hello.

[00:00:47]>> Who the hell in their right mind wants their food to look like it's already been digested?

[00:00:58]All that and so much more to come on this edition of Down the Locore. Now, of course, our first mission of this evening is to introduce you to our mighty fine panel. And my what a panel it is. We have ourselves political commentator Rory Bole. We have writer and podcaster Lewis Oakley. And we also have founder of Fair Fuel UK Howard Cox.

[00:01:19]Welcome gents one and all to this lovely little corner of Tower Bridge.

[00:01:23]>> I love this. This is a nice location.

[00:01:26]>> Yeah, it's almost like sort of borderline bar meets club. I'm loving it.

[00:01:30]>> Yeah. And right off Tower Bridge.

[00:01:33]>> Totally superb location. Now we must establish what everyone is drinking this evening. So Rory, you've gone for >> I've gone for a ginonic fill.

[00:01:40]>> And Lewis, you've gone for a >> I've gone for a full fat coke.

[00:01:44]>> Yeah. Oh, sorry. No, you were being honest.

[00:01:46]>> Full fat. Um, not because I'm a good person that doesn't drink, but because I'm slightly hung over from drinking last night.

[00:01:52]>> Good work. Well done. That's what we like to hear. Please drink responsibly.

[00:01:55]And how would you've gone for?

[00:01:57]>> I've gone for a leg over.

[00:01:58]>> And what about to drink?

[00:02:00]>> It's a beautiful setup, isn't it? It's the name of the brewery. You're >> too kind.

[00:02:04]>> They got They got some decent reals here, which is nice.

[00:02:06]>> So, we've actually both gone for the pub brewery, which is uh which is Lega, it's called. No idea, but let's get into this. Anyway, here's Cheers, gents. It's a pleasure to see you all. Cheers.

[00:02:18]>> Great to see you guys.

[00:02:19]>> So, let's uh let's crack straight on with with our first discussion.

[00:02:25]>> And so, now I've been very nice. I've I bought the drinks this evening as I always do on Down the Local. But that's not because I'm showing off my money. Far from it. But there are some people who find money a distasteful discussion. So, for that very reason, we're going to have a conversation about money. And it's in particular, it's about distribution of wealth. Because I hear this come up a lot. There are some people who say that it's disgusting that the rich are getting richer, that the poor are getting poorer, and that the rich should be responsible somehow for the poor in society. I'm going to level with you. I think everyone's money is their own business. And I don't see just because someone has made money that they should be forced into giving it to those who don't. And I'm speaking to someone who's not rolling in it. Where do we all sit?

[00:03:14]It's a tricky one cuz I think this has evolved right a little bit because you know I'm definitely of the mind get as rich as you want does it really matter but when you've got food banks you know multiplying by the day it feels like um I think there's a discussion to be had we I think there was one stat I saw where it was like the five wealthiest families in the UK have more money than the bottom 20 20%. And society's got to feel fair right and it's also got to feel like the ladder is movable. No one really minds that people have more money than them if they feel like they could achieve it too. But I think increasingly I mean you look at house prices now 14 times the average wage in London. It feels more and more unachievable. People people feel more and more stuck. And as I found as someone that you know what would I even class myself as working class, middle class, I don't really know. Um but the more jobs I' >> But you know me, I've got I've got about 10 different jobs, right? And what I found is the more jobs I get, the more gets taxed away. So actually you stand still. It's like, but I'm waking up at 4:00 a.m. going to a TV studio, doing paper reviews, then doing a full-time job, then after that off to a podcast, I'm writing an article. It's like, well, that's all going to Rachel Reeves. So, I I don't really know. I think there is.

[00:04:23]And then if it feels like a billionaire is being taxed less than me, that is an issue. Well, I don't know if they're being tax less, but the percentage wise, you could argue it probably works out less. But then in that situation, Roy, you can kind of understand why people go down tax. You know it evasion is obviously illegal but avoidance is within parameter. You can kind of understand why people go down the avoidance scheme's gone. I understand greed. I think we live in a very greedy society where we are conditioned to believe that we never have enough. I think social media has exas exacerbated that. I think reality TV has exacerbated that. I think a lot of what you just said I agree with. I think going back to your point about how we don't talk about money enough. I can tell you as someone who's literally just going freelance as we speak, I was talking to somebody at a radio station the other day that shall remain nameless. And when I started bringing up um certain subjects around pay, this person basically ran for the hills. They didn't want to go there.

[00:05:21]They didn't want to have that conversation. They found the whole thing really awkward. I think we're really bad in this country about talking at those sorts of things. And then going to some of the points that you've just raised, I think as well leaving even billionaires out of it because billionaires are the extreme side of things. You know, there's a small amount of them in Britain by comparison to everybody else.

[00:05:39]I mean, just living in a cost of living crisis and seeing the average ordinary family not even being able to heat their homes, that's got to create, I think, a justified envy. I agree completely.

[00:05:49]However, I'm not sure about you, but to my mind, the fact that people can't heat their homes is not a billionaire or a millionaire's fault or problem.

[00:05:57]>> Well, the issue is very simple. I've been on this planet for over 70 years.

[00:06:01]And this argument >> to which we say impossible.

[00:06:03]>> Oh, it's it's very very clear of you.

[00:06:05]But let's face it, for you know, this particular question, this argument, what people are saying has been going since well, adnauseium. The thing I have a real issue about is inherited wealth versus people who have actually worked well. People just wake up one morning and they've inherited millions. I can't handle that. I I struggle that. But if you've worked hard and you're delivering taxes and let's face it, the top 5% of all the millionaires in this country deliver something like 60% of the tax to Rachel Ree. There's that sort of issue.

[00:06:33]They've worked and they deliver jobs.

[00:06:35]They give people jobs. I don't like the idea at the moment. I'm particularly fighting a campaign as you know for for for cheaper fuel. I've been doing it for 16 years and managed to be successful keeping fuel duty frozen that time. But what really bugs me is the fact is that the this sort of tax, this dual duty tax, hits the poorest the hardest.

[00:06:53]>> The truth is extreme wealth is inherited or earned. So extreme wealth earned is a badge of honor. I don't have no problem with Jeff Bezos. Um I mean he made the incredible decision to make um using Amazon effectively free as a you know he didn't charge people to uh market on Amazon. And the reason he's a billionaire inherited wealth is something else. I mean, if you if you achieve nothing in life and you simply accumulate wealth, probably in a relatively tax-free manner, I do think that's a morally dubious position.

[00:07:26]>> 80% of the wealth in this country is owned by 1% of the population or something like that. And it's that to me that's that's moral.

[00:07:33]>> Don't think it's a moral failure, but I suppose it depends how you wear it, you know, how you come across to people, how you present yourself. If you're super wealthy but you're a massive dick.

[00:07:45]That's not nice, is it?

[00:07:46]>> Depend how you look at it. Like if you work hard, yeah, then it's a good thing.

[00:07:50]But if you kind of just crawl your way to the top, then it's a slimy thing.

[00:07:54]>> I think wealth is a badge of honor if it is earned. I think there should be a cap on what distributed wealth from old money is. So >> So what defines old money, do you think?

[00:08:06]someone who was wealthy centuries ago and they just their offspring just followed that wealthy path. Yeah.

[00:08:15]>> So that's when you get into the distribution of wealth. They're not distributing. They're keeping it in a family. That's where the conversation gets a little sticky.

[00:08:23]>> I do need to work out whether or not I'm addressing any of you properly in the city because I feel like the day and age where everyone used to address each other as Mr. whoever or sir or anything or indeed of course madam or madam or any other way I get it fine it's all gone and I used to like that I used to like going into a shop and people for a brief moment in history addressing me as sir now I seem to get mate so is this a sign that we've maybe become a bit more relaxed in formalities or is it actually just deterioration in society I used to like being called sir what do you think sir Howard Well, but it's interesting you say that. I was actually nominated to become a knight, would you believe, of the real by three little groups, but it's been turned down by Star cuz I'm in love with fossil fuels and I and I hate admitting net zero. So, I'm afraid that's a no, but anyway, that's another story. You can have that.

[00:09:19]>> I'll call you s.

[00:09:21]No, you're right. I mean, it's nice when you walk into a shop and say, "What can I do for you, sir?" And that sort of thing. It I do find one of the things it's sad the the love and the mating thing. I'm afraid I've been brought up in southeast London, Lewisham area, New Cross, and everyone was love. I moved up to and I had a farm in in the in in the in the Peak District and everyone called you Dook and all that sort of thing.

[00:09:42]>> Called you what?

[00:09:43]>> Storage. Slap them.

[00:09:45]>> I know. But the thing is the other day, only last week, and it's happened a few times, only the other week, I was just opening the door in a supermarket for a lady who had was carrying some kids and everything through the door and opened the door. I said, you know, and she said to me, "Oh, thank you very much." I said, "No problem, love." And she turned me around and said, "Don't call me love.

[00:10:02]>> Forget >> exactly. Get a life. I was just trying to help you." And I'm afraid there's this addressing people and this sort of thing. My daughter, I gave away a marriage last week and you know, single sex marriage. Mrs. and Ms. She's, you know, it it's lovely, but I don't give a damn. And then we, you know, I was on plank of the week this week. We're talking about gender fluidity.

[00:10:21]>> Oh, funny. So, was I >> It was you. Amazing.

[00:10:24]>> And to cut a long story short, I don't care what you talk. You're polared, you're polite, and you recognize people and respectful of what they do.

[00:10:31]>> I agree. I mean, I just it's obviously it boils down to respect. That's kind of where this conversation comes from because to my mind, it's far more respectful to refer to a stranger as either Mr. or Mrs. or Miss whoever versus mate, love, or do you know what I mean? It's I just don't get it. It's not the way it was brought up.

[00:10:49]>> Swings and roundabouts though, right?

[00:10:50]Like the linguistics changes over time.

[00:10:52]So it was Sarah and madam once now it's mate because that's seen as being you know you you've gone from that to now oh that's that gives a level of closeness and it'll probably swing back around. I mean maybe the fact that we're talking about this means that it's time for a bit of a shift and people will start going back to sir. Well I mean people think I'm bonkers at work because I respect anyone who's either on a similar level of management to me at work or more senior. I would typically address them as Mr. whoever. Now I know people think I do it in jest but it's actually because I wouldn't dream of doing anything else. It's the way I was dragged up. So for example in my previous place of work I always used to refer to my boss as Mr. and surname. You know I wouldn't obviously give his name away on this. But the point being is that I always used to address him as Mr. whoever. And I can't understand why people now look at me as if I'm weird for doing that. That's how I was dragged up. Well, when I first met you many years ago when you know came on I don't know which show you were producing at the time. You said hello Mr. Cox. I remember you coming up >> totally and I think that's >> the way I was brought up.

[00:11:54]>> That's completely fair enough. But I think going back to your point about somebody you know >> that was also cuz I couldn't remember your first name.

[00:12:00]>> But I think someone getting their head in a spin about being called love. I mean do we not have bigger problems to worry about right now in society in general. I think if you're getting offended by that you really need a reality check. I think that do you understand why some people misunderstand it in a day and age where we're encouraged to believe such nonsense is a sign of toxic masculinity. Well, I think for me it needs to be an equal playing field. So, for example, say I walked into the pub right now and you said hello sir to one of these two gentlemen, but you said hi mate to me. I think that would be slightly disrespectful. It's like let's use the same term of endearment for everybody.

[00:12:35]>> You're saying we're not worthy. I'm saying we're made, >> but I'm saying I think yeah, it is swings and roundabouts. I understand the the nuance to it and I understand that it there is something um quite sweet about being called sir or madam. I think the first time I ever really experienced being called sir um as quite a young person was in the US. I spent a lot of time in the US and everyone calls you sir there basically no matter what age you are and there is something kind of endearing about that but I'll be honest and say it's not an issue I'm going to lose any sleep over anytime soon. And also flip this. If I said to someone, you know, hey, how are you? Didn't use anything and they said, please address me as sir. I feel like the majority of Brits would be like, who he is? Like, so if you if we're going to say that, then when people come at it from the other way and insist you call them something, you are going to be like, >> you can call you can call me my lord.

[00:13:24]And on that note, >> man makes me feel old to be honest with you.

[00:13:28]>> No, really, >> I'd rather be called love any day of the any day of the week.

[00:13:32]>> Really? Cuz over here it's so patronizing.

[00:13:35]>> I don't mind it at all.

[00:13:36]>> No, you're just getting to know someone, aren't you? I think there should be more of it. Getting to know people.

[00:13:40]>> I mean, it's okay for me to get to know you, though. What about if you're in a shop and someone you're giving them your hard-earned money?

[00:13:46]>> Well, and they said, "Hello, mate."

[00:13:47]>> Yeah. I think that's rude.

[00:13:51]>> I I I personally don't. Okay.

[00:13:54]>> I think that that'd be all right.

[00:13:55]>> Well, that's what I love about opinion.

[00:13:56]You're entitled to opinion, >> of course.

[00:13:58]>> Anyway Anyway, next question, mate. It is um >> say you go somewhere and they say is this good enough for you? So it it sounds a bit more scripted more so than it >> really you don't but you wouldn't surely you wouldn't want the total stranger to call you Nick. I mean I'm a total stranger I think that's rude right >> like dad said before they wouldn't know my name but >> well I do.

[00:14:21]>> Well yeah I know you do >> cuz I've asked you.

[00:14:24]>> I don't like love.

[00:14:25]>> No like love. It's just a bit >> too familiar perhaps.

[00:14:30]>> Not even familiar. It just feels a little bit patronizing.

[00:14:34]>> I think a certain degree of formality gives a level playing a level playing field to life.

[00:14:40]>> There are some people who think that being called love is derogatory. You don't see that?

[00:14:44]>> Uh it's how you say love. So if you say love or love, that's when it crosses a line.

[00:14:53]>> So how would you address me?

[00:14:55]>> Hello love.

[00:14:58]Whoops. I can't help but spot one or two empty glasses. That can only mean one thing. It must be time for a round on a rant.

[00:15:05]>> Okay, while they are getting the drinks in, here's what I want to have a chat with you about this evening. And that is sitting considerately. Now, I know you're going to say this is a bit niche.

[00:15:16]What the hell are you talking about? But I'll tell you exactly what I'm talking about. The other day, I was on a train and I was sat next to an individual.

[00:15:23]This is not the first time this has happened to me at all. sat next to an individual who decided deliberately to expand. And I'm not talking about their waistline. I'm talking about the position they were sat in. They were sat there with arms sprawled like that, legs a kimbo. And it drove me bonkers. I was on a crowded train and they knew full well what they were doing. They weren't even necessarily that, dare I be blunt enough to say, rotund. It was deliberate that they decided they weren't going to be considered to the person who was sitting next to them. And so here is my offer to you this evening. I can't stand people who sit selfishly deliberately expanding whether it is on a train, if it is in the air, wherever it might be that they decide that the only person that matters is them. So, they don't care if someone's sitting next to you and they've got their arms out like this, nudging their way past people and encroaching for one foot at a time into their space. No, get a grip. What the hell is wrong with you? Okay, you must be able to see someone sitting right next to you. And no, you decide that it's in somehow acceptable to plunk your arms in that person's space. Have you not heard of personal space? Come on. We live in a day and age where people are more aware of other people's feelings more than ever. Personal space is a big deal, right? So, as far as I'm concerned, if you're that kind of individual who puts your elbow into the person sat next to you, you are a disgrace. Get a grip. Be less selfish and remind yourself there's someone sat next to you and frankly, they don't want to spend the duration of that journey with your elbow shoved into their side.

[00:17:07]You're disgusting. You're selfish. Sort it out.

[00:17:10]I need a drink.

[00:17:13]>> About time.

[00:17:15]>> Oh, I've lost my cards. That's terrible.

[00:17:17]Look at that. Oh dear. Right, let's go through. Now, this is actually quite unusual for Down the Local because normally everyone goes for the same, but we've gone for different this time, which I like. So, we got Well, we're going to review everything. So, Rory, you're the same. So, this is what you're going for?

[00:17:32]>> Yeah. Jin and Tonic again for me.

[00:17:33]>> We've gone for Jin and Tonic. And oh dear, we've led him astray. All right.

[00:17:38]What have you got?

[00:17:39]>> I've been peer pressured into a ginonic, too.

[00:17:43]>> And Howard, what have you got?

[00:17:44]>> Well, I don't usually like red wine in pubs, but I'm sorry. That's my favorite drink is red wine.

[00:17:49]>> Well, there you go. And I've gone for a little cheeky whiskey. So, there we go.

[00:17:52]Why not indeed.

[00:17:53]>> Is it Irish or Scotch?

[00:17:54]>> It is most definitely scotch. Thank you very much. No offense, Roy. None. But anyway, but I will say one thing. I have to The reason why I don't drink and normally whiskey would be my go-to.

[00:18:03]Please again, drink responsibly. But one of my go-to would be whiskey. However, I have a problem with the fact that most pubs have the most diabolical whiskey selection. I'm very much a whiskey snob.

[00:18:14]So, the fact they had Lagabul in 16 year, I'm a very happy bunny. So, here's Cheers, J. Cheers again. Cheers.

[00:18:21]>> Bottoms up. Lovely.

[00:18:22]>> Is Irish whiskey ever on the menu, Phil?

[00:18:24]>> Absolutely not.

[00:18:26]>> I wouldn't move swiftly on then.

[00:18:27]>> I'll save my recommendations for a little bit more tasteful pallet.

[00:18:31]>> No. Do you know what it is? is that the main reason >> this I'm going way off topic here, but the main reason I'm not the biggest fan of Irish whiskey >> is because >> what I love about certain Scotch whisies is the way that you get that real burn at the back of the throat.

[00:18:46]>> And that to me, Irish whiskey sort of has more of the sensation of maybe some sort other spirit like vodka or something like that where it's got a kick but it's not the burn.

[00:18:56]>> No, it's not the bun. Anyway, >> it's a bit like Coleman's mustard.

[00:18:59]>> Well, quite absolutely. Anyway, I never thought we'd talk about mustard on down the local, but instead what I do want to talk about is well, I think I was quite calm explaining that, you see. But the truth is that I think Brits are really bad at getting angry. And I'm quite lucky because my heritage is a mixture of British and South African. Now, South African is even more chill than British. So, very rarely do I get angry.

[00:19:28]But there are some people I know who've got heritage to say is Italian or maybe it's Israeli or something like that. And typically they're very angry nations or they got the ability to be angry and as a result of it I want to know why is it Brits are so flipping calm. Get angry.

[00:19:45]Come on. Why don't we?

[00:19:47]>> But do you think that the nations that get angry easier are better off? Like look at France. You can say they get angry. They'll >> guarantee their mental health is better.

[00:19:56]Guaranteed.

[00:19:56]>> Do you think?

[00:19:57]>> Yes. And I tell you why. It's because they let it all out. We suppress it. We keep quiet and as a result of we've got a very miserable nation. Yeah. I'm I'm not one for suppression. I don't think suppression is a good thing. I think we should be open with how we feel and we should be able to be honest with each other. But I don't know if we need to be leaning into anger necessarily. I mean, I look at Ireland, obviously, where I'm from, and I'd say we're a nation of people who are extremely expressive and talkative. We don't have much of a problem holding back. Everyone's got the quote unquote gift of the gab as they say in Ireland. And that's why you're here, Rory.

[00:20:30]>> And that's why I'm here. But then then I look at somewhere like the US where I think progressively over time. I think people there have gotten more angry. I think Americans used to be very friendly, very welcoming nation. And a lot of them just seem really grumpy these days, which I would argue really is hugely to do with their political situation.

[00:20:49]>> Well, look, Howard, you're never grumpy.

[00:20:51]I'm sorry. I mean, in the the years I've known you, you've always been very polite, very civilized. You're basically you're the epitome of a British gent as far as I'm concerned. Why don't you get angry?

[00:21:00]>> Well, it's changing.

[00:21:01]>> Oh, and it's changing.

[00:21:03]>> What did I do?

[00:21:03]>> Well, no, no, no. I I'm changing because I'm worried sick about where our country is going and what's happening to it. And uh even to the extent of the US, you're making a point, you know, have a nice day disappeared now. There's a lot everything self, which we talked about earlier. But the thing that matters to me which in terms of anger and everything is what's happening in Ireland for example is at the moment is that they're actually having blockades and things about the cost of living in this case fuel. I've been >> I should point out by the way to anyone watching this episode this was recorded about 3 weeks ago. So just in case the fuel crisis has calmed down a little bit everything's been just in case.

[00:21:42]>> Actually the oil price has fallen today.

[00:21:43]So in 3 weeks time when you see this hopefully petrol price will come down.

[00:21:47]But really from my point of view, I'd like to see a bit more not anger, but I'd like to see a bit more approach to things actually saying what you really want.

[00:21:56]>> Depends on the on the reason behind it.

[00:21:58]Depends on the purpose of being angry.

[00:22:00]You get angry.

[00:22:01]>> I I can get angry, but not generally I don't I I'll take it out on on something rather than someone else. I don't generally get angry to to and be rude to people if I can avoid it.

[00:22:12]>> There's a great line. There's a film in 1973 called Papio with Steve McQueen and Dustin Hoffin and there's a great line in it. Dustin Hoffman said uh blame is for God and small children. And I I think it's a good way to live your life.

[00:22:24]I love that line. It's a great film and I love that line. I rarely get angry with people. I think politeness always.

[00:22:30]>> Well, I am Italian American so we have a feisty little temper.

[00:22:34]>> Yeah.

[00:22:34]>> Uh so it doesn't take me much to get angry to be just people walking too slow on the sidewalk pisses me off.

[00:22:40]>> No, I do get a little bit angry. What makes you angry?

[00:22:43]>> What makes you angry?

[00:22:44]>> Oh, silly.

[00:22:46]>> Is it maybe people asking you questions in the past?

[00:22:48]>> Yeah.

[00:22:49]>> Sorry about that.

[00:22:50]>> I'm a New Yorker, so I was born angry.

[00:22:53]Um, I had to go to therapy to be more of a Brit in that case. Hello.

[00:23:01]>> Well, I always make a point of trying to finish down the local on a very light-hearted subject, you know, and as far as I'm concerned, we've all been very civilized this evening, but I think we're going to go even more civilized now. And this is what I love about it, by the way. It's the art of discussion.

[00:23:14]It's exactly what Down the Local is all about. I want to talk to you about food.

[00:23:18]Yes, we're going to go culinary people.

[00:23:20]That is absolutely not to rival Spooning with Mark Logan, which you can find on the Virgin YouTube channel, by the way, and I highly recommend it. But what we are going to talk about is British cuisine because I have never for the life of me managed to get my head around what the heck is British cuisine beyond fish and chips and a pasti.

[00:23:38]>> Yeah, they're right. I mean, when you think about French cuisine, Italian or even Germany, you can think of the big Frank Burger sausages and all the other bits that go there. And you can look Portuguese. I can talk about things. I think American and British actually you can put under one umbrella to me which is >> American's always like burger and chips.

[00:23:58]>> Well, that's what we are now, are we?

[00:24:00]>> Wow. I don't think that's British. I take >> drive down the high street and you'll see burger and chips. Burger and chips.

[00:24:07]Oh, kebab. I must say there's kebab shops all over the place.

[00:24:10]>> No, kebab's Greek or something, is it?

[00:24:11]It's not really It's dominating.

[00:24:14]>> Yeah, but loads of foods are here. But it doesn't mean that they're British, right? Even fish and chips technically speaking is Eastern European of origin.

[00:24:22]So technically that's from British.

[00:24:23]>> Are you trying to find meaning in something that just there isn't really that much meaning. People just ate what they ate. If I think about how my grandparents, you know, they they ate what they grew in the garden. They ate what was in season. This idea we've got to stick to these culinary dishes or else our identity will evaporate is a bit over the top. I mean, look, food is important though. Like I I'm originally from a place called the Black Country in the Midlands. Well, and the fish and chips there is honestly I feel like everyone should try it before they die.

[00:24:50]Like you had mushy peas with >> No, I wouldn't ruin it with mushy peas.

[00:24:54]It's ju just the chips and the fat. Can we talk about mushy peas for a second?

[00:24:59]I'm sorry. Who the hell in their right mind wants their food to look like it's already been digested?

[00:25:05]>> Well, here's what I think. The fish and chips >> there.

[00:25:09]>> The fish and chips in Dublin is what you need to try. Fish and chips is always best when it's coastal. And there's nothing better than going for a swim in really cold water and then having salty fish and chips.

[00:25:19]>> But the problem is I love Dublin, but you are already referring to another country's cuisine. And this is what I'm getting at. The fact that there is no British cuisine.

[00:25:27]>> England and Ireland and the UK in general are so closely aligned cuisine wise. I think there's basically no difference. I will say, and you know, obviously I enjoy a Sunday roast. I enjoy fish and chips. I do think our cuisine is really boring and bland. I think it's the most boring blend probably of you can find in Europe and certainly on a more international scale.

[00:25:45]I waver fair, >> but that could of course be historic from the fact that basically cropwise bugger all grows in this country. Let's be honest.

[00:25:53]>> I think that's the point. And I also if you think okay the Italians what they got pasta and pizza okay no but hold on they're not eating pasta and pizza every day. So you think about Brits. Okay. Uh fish finger fishing fish and chips. Um and then you know >> there's the Sunday rose. The Sunday rose two staples.

[00:26:11]>> There's a thing called Yorkshire pudding. I mean I'm sorry.

[00:26:14]>> Oh I do like Yorkshire pudding actually.

[00:26:16]>> Yeah. Let's get Sunday rose. You got the horseradish with a nice loaf of beef. My wife is a vegetarian but she does she likes the crunchy.

[00:26:23]>> I don't mean my wife. I mean I'm veggie.

[00:26:24]>> Yeah. But but she this is the hypocrisy of my darling wife. Sorry darling. But the simple thing is that we have a lovely lamb joint. etc. And she won't eat the meat, but she likes the crispy bit on the outside. Isn't that hip hop?

[00:26:36]>> Mrs. Cox, come on. That's not >> Sorry.

[00:26:39]>> I think sausage and mash.

[00:26:42]>> Really? You're a bangers and mash kind of guy?

[00:26:44]>> I like a sausage and mash. I got a few friends that like sausage and mash.

[00:26:48]>> And what what type of sausage would it have to be?

[00:26:51]>> I think a nice cumlin or some chipellas with a nice co >> So pork based >> coconut and mash.

[00:26:56]>> Yeah.

[00:26:56]>> Yeah.

[00:26:57]>> Also shepherd's pie.

[00:26:59]>> Yes. Shepherd's pie.

[00:27:01]>> Um, >> there's a an Americanized version of it, but those are the two that really jump out to me the most when I think of British cuisine.

[00:27:09]>> Chicken tikka masala.

[00:27:10]>> Really?

[00:27:12]>> Why?

[00:27:12]>> Yeah.

[00:27:13]>> It's just >> You got an applause for that.

[00:27:15]>> It's just a classic.

[00:27:16]>> I love it.

[00:27:17]>> Of course.

[00:27:18]>> You got your audience with you. I don't have an audience.

[00:27:21]>> Where's my audience? What do you recognize of British food? Uh, Indian.

[00:27:26]Indian.

[00:27:28]>> Yeah. Come on.

[00:27:31]>> For goodness sake. Do you know what? I love this program, but it doesn't half irritate me how the time absolutely flies by. Alas, that is all we've got time for for this edition of Down the Local. All that's left for me to do is say a huge thanks to our marvelous host this evening at the Raven and Tower Bridge. Love this pub. Got to also say a huge thanks as well to our panelists, to Rory Bole. We also have to say thank you to Lewis Oakley and to Howard Cox as well. And of course to you at home for watching. Please remember until next time, do drink responsibly from me, Phil Dave. From all of us here on Down the Local, don't forget subscribe to us.

[00:28:05]We're now podcast. You can now tune in to Down the Local on wherever you get your podcast from. From all of us here, until next time. Cheers.

[00:28:12]>> Cheers.

[00:28:13]>> Cheers.