How should the Indiana Pacers approach trades this offseason? Things they should and shouldn't do

Añadido: 2026-05-22

[00:00:00]How should the Pacers be approaching trades this off season? Just generally, without getting into specific players, Rhett Bower and I tackle what we think their strategy should be, how they should value their own assets, what should and shouldn't be important to them. You'll get it all today on the Locked On Pacers podcast.

[00:00:21]You are Locked On Pacers, your daily Indiana Pacers podcast, part of the Locked On.

[00:00:29]your team every day.

[00:00:31]>> What's up everybody? Happy Friday.

[00:00:33]Congrats. You've been through the week and a long weekend this is coming for some of you and welcome to another edition of the lockdown pacers podcast where we of course talk about the Indiana Pacers as always. My name's Tony East. I cover the team for Forbes and Circle City Spin. And today Rat Bower is going to join my favorite guy to bounce trade talk off of. We I think did a really good job previewing the Pacers trade deadline this year and today we're kind of doing the same thing for their offseason trade outlook. How should they be considering just generally packaging their assets or not packaging their assets? What should they be looking for when doing so? How should the value of some of their things be perceived as they go into a very fascinating offseason in terms of trying to get better but not maybe knowing exactly how good their team is going to be, but clearly believing it's going to be very good. I think we got to the meat of a lot of good stuff today. Ready? Even came with the stuff that I hadn't even thought of that we talked about off air for quite a bit. I hope you guys enjoy.

[00:01:24]Let's just get right to it. Everybody loves trades and yeah, we're not going to talk specific targets today. There's lots to be said for that. Some teams will be eliminated that may or may not have more trade interest based on how and when they get eliminated in the last round where eliminations have that kind of effect. But I do want to set frameworks for the Pacers potential trade goals this off season if they're going to make them. Kevin Pritchard has talked about the fact that they have more picks available to trade. They have some salary considerations. They have both this year and in future years that make trades a thing. This team has been very good at getting value out of such transactions. There is a lot to get to from this. And joining me to do it, the trade deadline, Oracle, we said the most likely player to be traded was Ben Matherin and the second was Isaiah Jackson. They were both moved in the same trade. Rhett, we were all over it.

[00:02:12]Welcome back, R Bower. How are you?

[00:02:14]>> Thank you. I'm doing well. Uh, I actually also predicted that the they might put the pick in the trade and hit top four.

[00:02:22]>> You were the first one who said it.

[00:02:24]>> I I feel pretty good about that. I don't I feel less good about the outcome of it obviously, but I uh at least uh I predicted and I did not apologize for making that prediction either. So, um maybe maybe I should have, but I'm excited to be here.

[00:02:39]>> O well, you do not have skin in the game as much, so I understand that. But we on a several year streak of the most likely to be traded being exactly right. And now we're going to transfer those thoughts into again general things that I think the Pacers should be considering in trades this offseason. You can find specific targets that you might like within the frameworks we get to at the end. But I think that there's a lot for them to consider beyond just like good team get better at this stage of their time as a team, especially as it pertains to like the two threeyear medium-term kind of thinking for their trades. And so I'm going to start with something I have already talked about red. This is not the most fun thing for to start with because it's like kind of minor salary stuff, but it's very important. And that is that look, there's a lot of talk about the MLE and the tax and things of that nature. And I've said if you want them to spend more of the mid-level exception as a fan, you are probably rooting for a trade of either one or both of Jarus Walker or Ben Shepard so they have a little bit more spending to get a player who helps them. now. And in doing that podcast with Yosi Goslin and talking about it on the show, I've said, "Yeah, something like an early second probably is what the value of those players would be.

[00:03:43]They're rotation level players for good teams. They're clearly good enough and have positive value, but right before they get paid, it's hard for me to imagine they would fetch at least a good first, maybe like the very latest first." And I got a lot of push back that was like, "That's not the right value for those guys. I wouldn't trade them for that." So my trade take is please think about that in totality and not in that sort of thinking. What I mean by that is this year, three years from now, 5 years from now, the odds that I'll just pick the 38th pick because that's the fake trade OC and I did for Jarus Walker, but I think he might get maybe fetch a little more than that. 3 years, 5 years this year, Jarus Walker's probably and almost certainly going to be better than whoever has picked 38th this year. But if the Pacers do that and get no salary back, they you also have to include the player they would be getting by signing somebody who would be a player in the rotation who is good and is the cumulative value of early second plus that player worth more to them than maybe Jarus Walker's immediate or long-term after he gets paid future. That is where that could be higher or in their case with their window being the next two or three years might be higher and they probably think is higher if they actually do that trade. So that is I think my trade take number one is you have to include if they if you consider a Pacer salary dump what they do with the extra flexibility as part of the deal when you consider their values.

[00:05:02]>> Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's the the thing if you look at the tier of player that the Pacers might be looking for the flexibility of taking like would the team trade said player for Jarus Walker straight up?

[00:05:15]>> No. Like almost certainly not. Like if it's a Kelly Ubé, I'll use that as an example. Would the Sixers just trade Kelly Ubé for Jarus Walker? No. No chance. I agree.

[00:05:24]>> So in totality, as you said, trading Jarus, getting some sort of asset, clearing that money, and then even if it is using a using the MLE as an MLE or using it as a trade exception, that flexibility is far more valuable than the asset you get for Jerus. I could not agree more. Even though >> I kind of want to see what Jarus does this year. I agree that I would like to see what Jarus does this year because again the like if it's just for a draft pick it would probably it would probably feel weird like the way that that would go after he was picked the lottery and things of that nature but their windows now like they can't really wait and I do think to your point like to use Kelly Ubé as an example there are some teams in the NBA who like no we want Jarus Walker instead but they're like not teams trying to win right now they'd be you know maybe some of them are like a 4-1 team or something but there's not that many of those and it's not an insult to Jarus he had a great close to the season Kyle and I already did his season review like he could be something he's been in a playoff rotation already in his career. So has been Shepard twice. Like these are not bad players, but the Pacers goals are high and to do that you need as strong of talent as possible and that's why both the financial and asset considerations matter. Okay, give me a trade take Matt Bower.

[00:06:32]>> I don't think there's a world where the Pacers should trade their 2027 first before the NBA tread deadline in February of 2027. I think that if if because so they're what they have said is and this is true. This is fact. They can now trade five of their next six first or whatever it is be 27 31 33 and I'm missing something. I got something wrong there. But they can trade a lot more first now than they could have if they had lost 31. Okay, that's great. So why 27? Because of what I've talked about and because what is referring to they have no youth in their pipeline.

[00:07:05]And if Shep and Jarus are not on the team next year, they're both expiring.

[00:07:09]They literally would not have a rookie scale contract on their team. I would think even if they're trying to win now and they would like more talent on their team now, getting in at least a shot at something and a cheaper deal on this team to have some financial flexibility because spoiler alert that's going to come up for me in one of my future ones should be a priority. And they'd prefer 27 especially without seeing Hallebertton play to let's say 31, 33, 32, whatever it may be.

[00:07:35]Yeah, I think the only exception I would make to this is if they were able to turn their 27 first into either a 26 asset of some kind and something else or multiple 26 picks because I think if you look forward to the draft, the 27 draft sounds like it's going to be pretty horrible. And maybe that means the back half of the draft is better. But it could mean that the 26 draft, which is highly valued, not only at the top, but also in the middle and towards the end, if you could trade a future flexible pick to bring in two younger assets or younger, you know, resources or players or, you know, options, that might make sense. But otherwise, like, I don't think we have any idea how good the Pacers are actually going to be to risk trading the 27 first. that is your only path to getting a young player in the pipeline. I think if they trade the 27 first it would be included with 31 33 30 some some other lots of stuff to get something awesome in the door or I think you're right moving forward would be great because they already can't trade 28 so there's not really a stepping in change by trading your 27 trading 27 for 29 would be the most pacer still thing last year uh during the finals um if that was even like a possible thing.

[00:08:55]Would the Clippers do that unprotected 27 for unprotected 29 just right now? I would highly doubt it given the Pacers current time horizon. But, you know, I would generally agree with that, especially if they're only trading one first that they would absolutely prefer for it to be farther out and everybody's going to say, "Oh, it's so risky." It's like, yeah, that's the point, dude.

[00:09:12]Like, if you're good now, you make those kind of risks to be as good as possible and you hope that these shorter, closer picks can be the ones. And they might not be. It might be a bad draft next year, but they they h I don't even know how they do it with no picks this year, but they almost have to somehow in the next now to 12 months because of something I'm about to talk about, address their youth pipeline situation to some extent, even if it's not a player they are confident is going to be good. They need some kind of shot in the dark there.

[00:09:36]>> Yeah. I mean, the the the thing I keep coming back to, which ironically did not work for the team involved that did this, was the Minnesota Timberwolves trading their future distant first for Rob Dillingham. and the Spurs got a future asset for a pick that they really didn't want to make.

[00:09:50]>> And that's the kind of trade that I think the Pacers might be looking to do.

[00:09:54]I don't know who the heck that player might be. It may not work. But that's exactly the kind of thing that, you know, if it's a if it's that 2031 that they've already shown they're clearly fine including as an asset, you know, maybe that's what it is. But yeah, there it would be shocking to me if they didn't leave this draft with some player on a rookie scale deal. I don't know if it's it's hard for me to figure out how they get a first this year because I don't think any of the players they'd be willing to easily move would would fetch that even if all stacked together >> and trade I I do agree that trading a future first for a first this year is something that would make sense >> for them but for a backend player that I I don't know feels like >> Go ahead. Go ahead.

[00:10:37]>> No, no, no. It's I'm just saying it's tough. It's it's really really tough. It feels like their dream to me. And this is completely like impossible. There are years in the past when I went through like all the traded firsts since the new in the new CBA where it's like the 28th pick for like 10,000 seconds or like a very heavily protected first. That's what I think their dream would be is like a top a lottery protected future first and a a trillion seconds for like you know for like pick 20 or something.

[00:11:06]I don't know if that would even be something they would do. to get the highest pick possible, they're going to have to send out stuff. And that's that's hard to do. That's risky.

[00:11:13]>> Yeah. I mean, I I went through about like four or five days ago and just said, "Hey, here's the 2026 trade draft partners where it's like OKC 1217 37, San Antonio 20, 35, 42, 44, um Dallas 930, 48." Like there's multiple teams that have either late second >> or uh late first, early second, mid-second. And those are the kind of things that I think we've seen the Pacers be very willing to trade a bunch of seconds to get another second or and so um like I said I I would be shocked if they don't have some sort of rookie after this draft. I just don't know exactly how it happens.

[00:11:49]>> Their own pick that Memphis has from a trade where the Pacers did what you said and traded four futures. Well, two crappy ones and two futures for a pick that they traded for Isaiah Jackson.

[00:11:58]Memphis is a good one to me. They don't have a ton of picks this year, but they have a lot of players on their team already. Yes.

[00:12:03]>> So, that would be another one. But >> that's a good idea. I should >> Well, they have >> they have three 16 and 32 with a bunch of players. So, like 32 is in play.

[00:12:12]>> Yes, I I agree. They Pacers can't get 16. I wouldn't imagine for a rebuilding team, but uh yeah, 32 would be one that I'm like, hm, is that possible?

[00:12:23]>> Everybody, quick break so I can tell you about two wonderful groups of people.

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[00:14:10]And we are back here on Lockdown Pacers.

[00:14:12]Thanks for making us your first listen today and every single day. I'm recording this before Cavs Knicks, but that's tonight. Locked on Cavs and locked out Nick Knicks. We'll have more from game two in MSG. Hey, check out the Everydayer Club. You can get locked down Pacers or your favorite lockdown show fixed completely ad free by joining the Every Dare Club today, plus Discord access with fans of your favorite team.

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[00:14:44]So, let me set the scene for this. The Eastern Conference playoffs this year have been fun and exciting. Pacers eliminated both of these teams last year. Nobody looks better than they did last year, right? The East looks fairly like winnable now. Maybe these teams get better. So, let's also set their salary scene for what I'm about to say. TJ McConnell is 5 million guaranteed next year. Their core seven besides him all go up, all get raises naturally, and Aaron Emith gets a somewhat significant raise because of his well-earned extension at a value that is completely fair and reasonable for him. This is not a commentary on the contracts they've already given out. That's to say their team is not getting cheaper next year.

[00:15:22]Now Ben Shepard free agent, Jarus Walker free agent. They could save a little bit from McConnell, but Niss raise plus the general just 8% raises for the rest of the team. They get basically zero cap relief for their top 10 contracts next year. It's almost exactly the same. It's like high 180s million next year. That's a lower percentage of the cap. It's a farther distance from those spending barriers, but their team is not getting cheaper. And there's a chance with team options for Huff and Fury and then all the rest of their guys could be free agents or not guaranteed. Like they just have to use all that resources to fall at the back of their team. Which is all to say in a time where the East looks open and they're trying to get better players on their team to win said East, any player they trade for, anybody they sign, if they're on a one-year deal, it's almost immediately a non-starter for me because they need to have either a tradable salary on their team for the next summer that this player would be or somebody who's guaranteed to help them because next summer, all these conversations we're having right now, barring like dramatic moves from their salaries, we're going to be having them again next year with the same barriers and the same numbers just all a little higher, right? So they maybe they could get two of these players by doing this all two years in a row, but they're gonna have to be maybe shedding money again next year, just losing someone in free agency to sign someone good next year. So to me, if the player is on a either an unextendable contract or a one-year deal or you're signing them and they're like, I'm only taking one year deal, it's I'm almost like just no. Like no, I'm not doing that. That doesn't make sense for them to do.

[00:16:47]>> Yeah. The the only and this isn't even truly a one-year deal. if it was like a team option where it's like, "Oh, no.

[00:16:52]This we control whether or not this is a one-year deal. You do not get to tell us that, you know, you you get only a few chances at this." So, I'm I'm completely with you. Um >> Yeah. I I don't even have anything else to say about that. I think that so many of these players, it's like if they're expiring, you can't do it. You just can't do it.

[00:17:12]>> Correct. And if they're going to be a taxpaying team at some point, some of you might never believe that. Well, that's fine. I'm not trying to predict that. But what I will say is this. The best way for them to do that in adding players would be use the MLE this year, get somebody for multiple seasons, then guess what? You can use it again next year. So you've then added two veterans who are helping you and are better than minimum salaried players or draft picks along the way. And that would be valuable to them in a way that if that player is expiring, it's harder. Like they have their non-verb rights and don't have to use MLE, but then their contract goes up. Or if they're a free agent, maybe they just stunk. Like you don't know that. And so it's obviously risky. Like I think you're right that an option would be great or some partial guarantees would be great. But if it's a trade using their MLE or if they're using it to straight up just sign somebody starting at you know six seven million whatever I think it has to be at least a two-year deal if not more because of all those things because it's it's just hard for them to add in this current reality. Especially because if they have one of Shepherd or Walker they're probably going to play that guy.

[00:18:10]Like if they kept them there's a reason they kept them anyway. So, it's going to be a tight financial reality in a way that they can't maybe they want the flexibility of letting that guy go, but I would disagree with that. I would think they would want somebody for longer, especially given the way the Eastern Conference is going. You are up.

[00:18:25]>> Oh, I think that there's no world where the Pacers make a trade that pushes them out of that puts them in position where they can't get under the tax.

[00:18:37]>> I agree. There's there's no world where the Pacers are trading for a 20 plus million dollar salary unless they are sending out enough salary to like seriously get one almost dollar for dollar matching there because there's this thing called the repeater tax. And as much as we don't know that the Pacers will ever pay the tax once, we can be darn sure they're not going to pay it twice in a row.

[00:18:58]>> I would assume all the penalties correct with that. Yes. Yes. Like if I'm them, like my PR strategy with the tax would be that the repeater tax exists to be like, look, we have to be smart when we start the clock, right? And even if it's X number of years out of five, like, okay, great. You got to know it's the right time to do it. And if you'll recall, listeners who are new don't know this, but Rat certainly knows this. We talked about it all the time. Part of what I thought would happen with Miles Turner last year was his contract would land in such a way that they would have been a Ben Matherin or Jarus Walker trade away from getting out of the tax at any point during the season in case let's say everybody got hurt and they won 19 games and needed to get out of the tax and they didn't end up being in it anyway. They spent basically every dollar up to it. Like that's what you should do if that's your spending barrier provided. But to me that's what I thought they would do last year. And so look, they think they clearly by their actions think they're going to be really good next year and that and the history suggests they will be right.

[00:19:53]Okay, that's great. They have to prove it a little bit after their star player towards Achilles and they have a new center, but the roster says it should be very good next year. But I do understand given their like if they're going to pay it at some point, they have to know it's the perfect year to do it. And so if they go over by more than Jarus Walker's salary, all of a sudden it's like wait, how are they like how would they manage this if the season goes poorly? like are they going to have to give up? Because the fear so for fans who are like screw this, what are you talking about? The fear is that they if if you're a fan would be that the front office gets in a spot where they're the team is playing way under expectation and they're never going to pay the tax or repeater in a season that bad. And they get to the trade line and their goal is you have to get under. You're mandated to get under, but they're so far over that it requires like a lot of assets to do it or dumping a better player than you'd hope to do.

[00:20:42]>> Jared McCain.

[00:20:43]>> Yes. Jar. Exactly. He was like the casualty for this, which is weird because they had less they had to give up to get under after the Paul George suspension. But, you know, instead, if you're in a situation where you have the option to dump, even if it's somebody who's like kind of good, but not as core, if you can just do that and get out, even if it comes slightly at the expense of your team being good in the near term, there is the benefit of like knowing it's possible and not having to surrender something so significant down the line. that's hedging against yourself, which is super exciting. You never want to be in a situation spending wise if you're betting against yourself.

[00:21:17]But I do agree with you and I've talked about that two summers in a row and it's never mattered. They've never even started the season over at all. But yes, if they sign someone right now without trading anybody and that person makes more than Jarus Walker, I'd be like stunned. Like absolutely stunned >> or traded for.

[00:21:32]>> Yep.

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[00:23:16]>> Well, and that's the thing, too. My my next take is actually like you can't the two for one three for one deal right now cuts that even further because you have to fill the roster and you have you have you have less players that you want to dump and they've already shown that they wouldn't move any of their top seven or reportedly allegedly >> I honestly shouldn't. I think that's smart. Yeah.

[00:23:38]>> Yes. And so it's like oh let's just put Jarus and Ben Shepard together and go get somebody who makes $18 million instead of $13 million. Well, uh, you're hold the math isn't going to math after a certain point.

[00:23:49]>> And I' I've seen a lot of even with free agency. It's like, oh, dump these three guys and then use the full mill. I'm like, they have to they they don't have to get two minimums in the door. Like that that doesn't help them financially.

[00:23:58]You've not solved any problems. And the team is maybe better if you do that.

[00:24:02]Yes, that is 1,000% true. And the first apron exists like they would immediately be hardcapped by spending more than the tax pyramid level. And then they can't exceed 8 million over the tax or whatever it's going to end up being.

[00:24:14]don't know the cap. I'm estimating using the most recent estimates, but >> yeah, >> whatever how close that would be. I will say this, this is not we're the first people to talk about this. I think the Pacers are thrilled that there's been many game sevens and great ratings in this playoffs because that might creep the cap up over the most recent projections, but you never know how that's all going to interplay.

[00:24:36]>> Yeah, we need OKC San Antonio going seven because that'll that'll pay for that'll that'll pay for an EML for the Pat. First time ever the Pacers are like, "You know what, Jaylen Brunson, you can win like two. Go Knicks. Win three games in the finals. Get it get it to seven.

[00:24:50]>> I don't think I could ever root for the Knicks, even if it meant benefiting my team." So, but you know, silver linings, I suppose.

[00:24:59]>> I don't know how much playoff revenue actually influences the cap because Sham's reported that a big reason of for the drop was the local TV revenue, and there literally is none in the playoffs anymore. the way the new TV deal is there like the local TV stops the second the regular season ends so it might be nothing but I the way that's been described before I would certainly think it might be something uh okay my last kind of just general frameworky trade take I I you I'm sure you agree with this even on their current contracts every Pacer starter has first run value probably way more I would say especially when this was on 11 million all of them probably have multiple first value maybe's fairly paid but all of them have first round pick plus trade value. And this kind of goes back to what you were talking about with trading a single first or how that would work. One first round pick in a trade is probably not even netting them a starter or somebody who's going to to significantly shape up their team like that. Now, to be clear, trading a first round pick gets you a good player. That's like a good thing.

[00:25:58]Having a good player on your team is good. But what to what end does that get you when you're not upgrading your starting five? And if you're trading a first for somebody, they're probably good and that means they get paid like a good player. So you have to trade a core player to do so. So to me, if they actually are going to upgrade their team in a major way and upgrade their starting five, you're probably trading two first round picks or more to do so and matching salary. Now, it's true that the Pacers have this pick flexibility in trades, but there's a lot of short-term challenge function to that. And so, it I really don't think this kind of goes back to what you said about trading just the 2027 first. Any trade of just one firstrounder would be kind of weird to me unless it's for somebody who is presently on a rookie scale contract and is good. Outside of that, I cannot see a move where the Pacers just trade a single first round pick. that just it doesn't seem like it would align with the what their team needs to be.

[00:27:00]>> No. And that I literally sent that to you. I said my offseason strategy does trade change the starting lineup or bring in a player on a rookie contract.

[00:27:07]If yes, offer future first/firsts. If no, don't. Like it is it is quite quite simple honestly. even if that is a little bit, you know, disheartening or maybe disappointing, but if you look at like the players that you'd be getting, setting aside the financial aspect of matching the salary and all that stuff, you're not you're not getting a player that's changing your starting lineup for a single first round pick.

[00:27:28]>> Yep.

[00:27:28]>> And so now you're trading a first, a future first or at present first for a team that hopefully is good, but we don't actually know for sure in the 27 season to get at the >> I'm mostly sure, but not 100% sure.

[00:27:41]>> I you Exactly. No, no. I I I am optimistic about the 26 27 Pacers, but how you do have to consider that there's a downside. Um it's just it doesn't make sense. Like you're either going to get an impact player or you're going to fill out your rotation and I'm not using my the only assets I have cuz clearly they don't want to break up the starting lineup. You get a very very limited number of chances to improve your team and doing so to get a sixth or maybe even seventh man depending on how you feel about TJ. Like I don't I don't know. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. I completely agree.

[00:28:15]>> So that's kind of the it of my like here would be my principles for trades.

[00:28:20]There's lots of players that fit within what we've said. You could trade a swap.

[00:28:22]You could trade lots of seconds. You could trade these young players who I think have positive value even to the Pacers to be clear. Like it's so easy to say like, "Oh, they could dump one of these guys and sign somebody else." But like Jar Sheeper are still good. Like they're still of of value to your good team. It's not like you have to do that.

[00:28:37]Um and again, this is not a trade tick.

[00:28:39]Like if they use them, it has to be on somebody better than those players. If they're not better, it's a complete waste of resources. But I don't know that I have anything else that I'm like, these would be my principled stances that I'm thinking about as it comes to trades.

[00:28:52]>> I'm going to walk on what I'm certain is a future podcast for you. It's tangentially related to trades, and it's that there's no world where I'm extending Jarus or chef.

[00:29:01]>> No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. That is >> Let me let me check. This is the next week. Oh, it's >> it's it's the Memorial Day show. I have extensions preview now that the lottery is done. Zero chance. Yes, I >> I will I'll talk about it from a trade perspective and for nothing else. If at any point you want to make your team better, you will have to wait for that extension window to to have passed in order to do that. And I don't I would be absolutely floored if there's a number for Jerus or Shep that makes sense to do that. And so from the perspective of trying to set yourself up for trades, it's unlikely that something gets done in the fall, but we've seen it before.

[00:29:41]It would be a disaster to have missed out on that. So you could extend these two players.

[00:29:47]>> Yeah, it cuts into their salary situation quite a bit for next year, which I already touched on that their core seven already basically makes what they would make this year. And uh so people always do this with the young guys, and it's right. It's usually like, well, you can't extend them now. The poison pill would make it hard to trade them. Neither of these guys would get enough that that is probably relevant in this case. Their poison pill and current salary value is probably close enough that it wouldn't be a thing. But it is different trading them in that reality.

[00:30:13]I think Jerus is an extremely low chance because of the way he closed the season.

[00:30:18]If you're him or you're his reps, you're like, dude, if we do that again, we're getting not like a lot of money, but something someone's going to want that to be the >> a rotation level player for your team.

[00:30:27]And if you ball out, you get paid even more. It's like the same for Ben Mathan.

[00:30:30]Shepard is at least like possible to me because he doesn't have that kind of like lift his salary up 10x or whatever amount level of upside even though he's a good player >> and but it it's very rare that players take those we we've talked about this.

[00:30:48]It's becoming more common. I used to say it never happens. Now, it happens a little bit with those subm rookie extensions, but he he is a candidate that actually does make some sense for it, and it has worked out at least with Payton Pritchard, but most of the time it just straight up doesn't for the team that ends up paying the guy to do it.

[00:31:04]So, I would agree that the most likely thing is neither of them get one, and it makes them it easier to trade them if they're not extended also. So, yeah, I'm with you on that. No, I I mean I I thought about not putting Shep in there just because it's like hm he currently makes five and an extension for him might look dangerously close to five.

[00:31:24]Like I have no idea.

[00:31:25]>> Three for 15 tech man. Great.

[00:31:28]>> Exactly. So like in that way, but even still that there are it brings a certain level of complication for a player who's likely not going to have a like scorching hot market and restricted free agency next summer that the risk is just not there. and and that is trade related even though uh obviously it's more important for uh your extension episode here soon.

[00:31:48]>> Yeah, that's funny that you said that.

[00:31:49]That is that is going to be next Monday's show. How the lottery impacts all that because they don't have a giant rookie scale contract impacting their future capers. Does that change any of the extension spoiler? Yosi told me a player he thinks could get extended. I didn't even consider as one of the more likely candidates. That's coming next week. Rhett, thank you for the time.

[00:32:08]This was as usual wonderful. We always I think do a great job with the trade takes where uh you you don't you don't post stuff anymore. You just kind of tweet like once a month. Do I even need you to promote your your internet existence?

[00:32:19]>> Yeah, I uh No, I'm good. I I on X_Bower every once in a while. I am still on there. Um but yeah, I'm just watching basketball right now. It's it's pretty good.

[00:32:30]>> Yeah, this tall French guy, man. He's uh >> he's something.

[00:32:34]>> He's pretty good. series it's been.

[00:32:36]>> It's a It's a bummer that the the Wolves got knocked out though. The tall French guy isn't uh >> Oh, you're Oh, you're talking Oh, not Rudy.

[00:32:46]>> Not Rudy.

[00:32:48]>> Yeah.

[00:32:49]>> Somebody Somebody asked me like who's the best defenders in the league for for Wimi and I said Go actually did pretty well. Like he didn't stop him, but he did did an okay job. So >> shocking stuff. Okay, I have nothing else today. So, next Monday, Memorial Day, everybody in Indie, enjoy race weekend. Enjoy the lovely place that is Indianapolis during that time of year.

[00:33:14]Uh, and then the Memorial Day, we'll do extensions here. And then next week, Kyle and I will do centers. Uh, I'll get to external free agents by positions.

[00:33:22]Cam Jones's off seasonason. So much fun stuff coming now that the lotteryy's over and I can actually get a clear picture of what the Pacers might do.

[00:33:28]Thank you all so much for the time. Have a great weekend. I'll see you very soon.