Interview with Robin Anderson and Jo Lawrence, Tribe Payments at Money 20/20 Europe 2026, Amsterdam

[00:00:01][music] [music] >> I'm Robin Anderson. I'm a head of product at Tribe Payments.

[00:00:18]>> Joy Lawrence, head of customer success services at Tribe Payments.

[00:00:21]>> So, Tribe Payments is an issuer and acquirer processor.

[00:00:25]Core markets include the UK and Europe.

[00:00:28]And we have recently expanded to Asia Pacific and the Middle East.

[00:00:32]>> [music] >> Our focus is on larger financial institutions who want to take the next step in terms of evolving their payment infrastructure.

[00:00:51]Okay, so if think about mainstream adoption, I tend to think of it in two different ways, right? So, from a consumer perspective, you know, using stable coins as a you know, a payment option at checkout, I don't think we're quite there yet. I think it's still very much in the space of the kind of crypto aficionados space, like who's who kind of naturally gravitate towards that. I don't think it's something that people wake up and go, "Hey, I'm going to pay with a crypto with a with a stable coin today."

[00:01:24]However, I do think we're starting to see some traction on the payment rails industry side of things.

[00:01:31]If you look at Visa, for example, towards the end of 2025, they opened up USD sell USDC settlements in the US. They've been talking about 7 or 8 billion dollars in annualized stable coin settlement, which isn't massive, right? But it does at least start to tell you that you know, the networks are starting to take this seriously. And they're even offering, you know, seven-day settlement from that to issuers and acquirers.

[00:02:01]Seven days, right? Not instant. And that is a really important point. So, I think going forward, what we're more likely to see is, you know, consumers are less likely to know that a stablecoin is involved, but on an infrastructure level, I think I think businesses are really starting to take note of its of its of its potential opportunities.

[00:02:21]>> And I'm going to be a little bit doomsday on that side, though. And so, my background is always been client-based, but it's risk and regulation and compliance and everything that comes with it. So, over the couple of decades I have been in payments and looking at it, the thing to me and I think the elephant in the room is risk and regulations. Because with anything it is the visibility and the understanding of it as we simplify it from a consumer's perspective, they don't know what's going on behind the scenes. And with that comes that instant payment when we do move from seven days to instant where technology and everything is taking us, it's making sure what is it secure? Do people understand there isn't a chargeback process which everyone dreads and and it's painful for everyone. But it's got us to a place where there's a consumer security level if you like and and kind of that safety net in place. So, that for me is the risk of will we ever truly have instant payments?

[00:03:12]>> [music] >> I can see a use case for it as a consumer myself. We've got to make sure it comes with risk and compliance, [music] which would then potentially make it boring.

[00:03:20]>> Oh, totally.

[00:03:21]Absolutely. And I think that that that's the point to your to your So, I can second question. Is friction always bad?

[00:03:28]Um, the answer is no, right? We tend to think of friction in terms of consumer or customer UX, right? And that friction is generally bad. Like you want to make things as simple and as as seamless and as instant as possible.

[00:03:41]Um, but when it comes to back-end infrastructure, some friction is good, right? AML, sanctions, fraud screening, [music] controls and checks, all of these kind of things are what imparts trust in payment rail. And without the trust, you know, you don't get that consumer adoption adoption at the front end.

[00:03:58]>> It's it's a buzz term and it's one that I've used before from a credit card rails perspective, but there's such a thing as intelligent friction. And it very much is that it it's looking at it and it used to be with websites and e-com, you saw the padlock and as silly as it sounds, that gave people reassurance that there was something in the background whether there was or not.

[00:04:16]I think that's where it is as well. What goes on in the background is truly where security needs to sit and consumers need to be confident in that.

[00:04:28]>> Yeah, so I think I think stable coins solve a number of Um but I think they're more localized than the the glossy decks and the and the and the you know, the glossy demos suggest.

[00:04:40]So, you know, things like instant cross-border settlement, reduction of the number or the amount of friction and intermediary banks, I think is really key. Dollar access in in in areas of the world where, you know, you have volatile local currencies.

[00:04:57]Um and more and more generally also solving for um you know, the unbanked or the underserved in those communities as well. So, when you think when I think about stable coins, I think about it less as, you know, okay, we've solved payments now and more actually we're starting to help we're starting to we're starting to find solutions [music] using stable coins to solve some fairly perennial problems in the industry.

[00:05:21]>> And I think just to add to that briefly as well, it it is solving a problem and there is the unbanked and with every development in technology that comes around, we're trying to solve that problem with inclusion. And even I think another buzzword that I've heard in the last few days is the number of hops. So, at the moment there's three plus hops in some of these kind of transfers etc. If stable coin can consolidate that in a way and bring that down to one and then also look at the intelligence of how you're then able to scale that.

[00:05:48]It It's the future of where we need to go. It's just doing it at the pace of where technology is taking us at the moment.

[00:06:01]>> I tend to think about it less as the balance and more the hierarchy of needs.

[00:06:06]>> [music] >> Without trust, you know, the innovation speed, all that kind of stuff doesn't really matter that much, right?

[00:06:14]Um when it comes to stable coins, but when it comes to any kind of payment instrument, having that consumer, merchant, and ultimately FI trust is absolutely paramount. Once you have that, you can iterate, you can build, you can innovate, and you can start to think about solutions which are giving you some level of differentiation, but trust is always the foundation.

[00:06:40]>> It's around the risk, the compliance, the governance that I really think is going to It's a talking point at the moment, but it needs to evolve from being a talking point because also there are so many borders to cross.

[00:06:51]>> [music] >> And you need buy-in from all of those, and they need to be working to the same framework, which if there are slight variations, etc., it then again becomes disconnected. And that kind of then eradicates the purpose of simplifying and kind of >> [music] >> enabling that friction or intelligent friction, I'll say, not frictionless.

[00:07:08]Um but really that instant payment needs to have everyone on board so that the the funds can flow. And I think it It goes all the way along the chain as well, and Robin mentioned kind of, you know, the different [music] entities that are involved as well. It's thinking about the end consumer, too, and taking that journey all the way along and actually understanding what the risks and limitations are all the way along, as well as what the positives are cuz it very much is being positioned and it and it sits alongside it, and it has an existence for a reason.

[00:07:36]It's a complementary to the ecosystem that already exists, and it's finding the use case, and I think it is then also >> [music] >> unifying with that use case to understand like the AML risks and everything concerned because with anything we do for good, there's always somebody and somewhere that's looking at how do you break it and how can I make that profitable for me because fraudsters do that as a full-time living and it's not like the pictures that everyone used to envisage of like the hoodies and you're sat in a dark room etc. This is not this is incredibly intelligent people that are using tools the likes of where using to build technology, they're using exactly the same to be able to break it. So [music] looking at AI agents and even using those to anything that we create, they're also there to break and so something again the nerdy me coming out and playing around with them [music] was I started to type in to see if I could actually if I could basically fraudulently use stable coins or how I would do it.

[00:08:30]>> [music] >> Like a cheat sheet or how-to guide.

[00:08:33]Whilst it's picking up buzzwords and it definitely says you're looking to perform fraud and he as in the agent as everyone refers to as a male for some reason.

[00:08:41]Um possibly because Claude is a male name but anyway, but he then came back and told me that it wasn't possible to use that. But it's with anything if you word it in the right way >> [music] >> and you ask it almost like a genuine prompt of I'm intrigued or I'm looking for this, it will give you insight as to actually how the technology is put together and I think that's where people are missing the mark of like we've seen in credit card friendly fraud. I mean something that I heard only two days ago in one of the sessions is >> [music] >> fraud continues to grow and it it grow it grew last year circa 65% [music] which considering how much is invested in fraud protection, prevention, you see it from the card schemes, you see it from ourselves even having like a a risk product and service because >> [music] >> it's required for regulation. Stable coin at the moment doesn't have that set of rails in place.

[00:09:31]>> [music] >> It has the technology but the security and the governance and the guidance that comes with it, still needs to be built out and it needs to be tested because like with anything until you have your first broad, you won't know actually how it can be manipulated or broken.

[00:09:46]Um [music] so, I think it very much is it's valid, it's there for a reason.

[00:09:50]Um do I think [music] that stablecoin is here to stay? Absolutely. It will become boring, which is great because then it will become regulated and and >> [music] >> governance, and hopefully it won't be as I'd say restrictive because quite often people associate governance boring all of these negative words of look, people are trying to kill stablecoin. [music] It's not that anyone's trying to kill it. It's actually looking at it from a consumer perspective because again, >> [music] >> with every consumer and fraudster that knows what they're doing, there are vulnerable people also that exist, and it will be those that with the instant payment, it's a bit like contactless and everything.

[00:10:26]>> [music] >> You know, if people have their phone or their device stolen and it's unlocked, I can go and use if you drop your card and it's contactless. If I have enough knowledge or I use an an agent [music] to ask what I can do with it, I can go and use that three times up to 100 pounds in the UK without the cardholder being prompted.

[00:10:42]>> [music] >> So, it's very much looking at it and it's doing it for the right reasons at the right time.

[00:10:46]>> A really interesting conversation is around autonomous commerce, agentic commerce, and stablecoins, right?

[00:10:52]Stablecoins, they're the natural choice for autonomous commerce because they're fast, they're programmable, they're you know, all all those good things. But I think one of the conversations the industry has isn't having enough of >> Yeah.

[00:11:04]>> is okay, what are what are the rights of recourse? How does a dispute happen? How does an investigation happen? How does a chargeback take place?

[00:11:12]>> [music] >> Um and I think until some of these some of these concepts are better fleshed out, um I think the industry's you know, always going to see it kind of more as a as a as a as more of a back-end solution than a front-end one.

[00:11:27]>> And I think just the other thing that springs to mind as well is that actually outside of these walls, so outside of a payment conference, speaking to family, speaking to friends that aren't in the payment industry, mentioning stablecoin to them, they don't know what it is.

[00:11:43]Um and it's very similar and and it's always that thing of education and it is the responsibility of the providers and everyone in the ecosystem to actually inform. [music] It's It's the same way of when cards first began to be used, etc. >> [music] >> Because what it will be, you won't know about it until the fraud has happened. Uh and this is But people also will be nervous to adopt it. You'll get your your kind of your first kind of pilot and your beta that want to be the forefront of it and really drive it. But like with a lot of these things as well, there's the association to with open banking and crypto and now stablecoin. A lot of these originated and were associated with gambling [music] and that area. Gambling, which is again, for my sins, um an area of expertise that I covered in acquiring many years ago, because [music] it was interesting, it was complex, but that's where they then started to introduce licensing >> [music] >> and regulation. And they're actually one of the most regulated kind of KYC and other industries look to them to learn from them. But again, it also has that negative connotation of gambling and it must be money laundering and it must be you can pass it to anyone and what's going on behind the scenes.

[00:12:53]>> [music] >> It doesn't look at it from actually it's a consumer base, but it's broadening that consumer base to the everyday of if I want to purchase a pair of shoes from the US. From what I'm understanding of stablecoin and what Robbing described as well, going forwards, I won't know that stablecoin is involved whatsoever.

[00:13:10]I will simply see that I'm purchasing a pair of shoes and what goes on behind that then is absolutely [music] seamless to me and unknown. However, if there's a problem with those shoes, I don't know who to go to or even if I go to them, my bank, for example, will they know where to go?

[00:13:26]That's That's the question mark for me at the moment that I think as an industry [music] we're getting it up and running um and typically it's referred to the lawyers and others out there. It's not everyone involved kind of needs to work out what that consumer experience is. Be it good, be it bad, and everything in between.

[00:13:46]So, I think with regards to the tipping point and it's something again being at Money 20/20 I've heard in the last day or so is when it becomes boring. When it becomes mainstream.

[00:13:56]To me that's actually [music] a good thing as much as boring is typically negative. It's not because it means that it's established. [music] So, it's just a different term of of saying established.

[00:14:05]>> I think the only thing I'd like to add is look, I think stable coins is uh a super interesting topic at this moment in time and obviously, you know, Money 20/20 um it's a great forum to discuss these things. Um I think until stable coins becomes less of a crypto conversation and more of a payment rails, treasury, um and and use case solutioning question. Um it's always going to have, you know, a somewhat uh >> [music] >> a bit a bit of a niche following. That said, in 5 years time, I don't think we're going to be talking about uh stable coins at Money 20/20, right? Because it's going to be an accepted part accepted, regulated, fully understood solution to very very specific problems uh in certain verticals and certain markets.

[00:14:56]And it'll just be a little bit boring at that point. And that's a good thing.

[00:14:59]That's when it becomes mainstream.

[00:15:01]>> Yeah, I think it's really the use cases will become established. And that's what it is. It's looking at the different payment methods out there and seeing this as another payment method. And actually it will have its use cases. So, like cross-border being one of them from those countries that are underserved as well as those individuals that are underserved.

[00:15:17]>> [music] >> And it's really using that to be supplementary.

[00:15:21]But I'm hoping [music] that it it does it to to Robin's point as well. It's it's kind of there are always things that come around be they buzzwords be they actually new to the industry. This is the next step of evolution. I'm excited to see what comes next as well.

[00:15:33]And actually what this evolves into. So yeah, it's exciting times. I think it is for me a big thing. [music] Again it opens doors and that again just means that people are conversing with each other. They're also able to businesses will grow and individuals will grow on the back end of that because they will be able to do what they haven't been able to today or that has cost them [music] substantial amounts versus this should actually be an enablement for them.