Andrew and Tristan Tate's falling empire – 59 charges, Miami jail and UK extradition fight

[00:00:00]Isabella Quite, thanks very much for joining us because we're we've just seen that the Tate brothers are in a deep bit of trouble uh here judging by their by their latest uh court appearance. Talk to me about that. Why are they appearing in a federal court in Miami?

[00:00:20]>> There was a big development this weekend for the Tay brothers. uh they were arrested in Miami uh by US marshals under uh charges issued by British prosecutors. So the Tates charged by British prosecutors for rape and human trafficking allegations um and prosecutors issued uh new charges um which were revealed on the weekend and uh the Tates were arrested under those British charges. Um and the prosecutors uh in England said that uh they are seeking extradition for them. So they're in federal custody right now. They're in a Miami prison and we are watching to see if if that extradition order will indeed move forward.

[00:01:07]>> No, their appearance in the federal court was it was kind of a plenary appearance. It was really just to to to set out what what the case was, but quite dramatic though nonetheless seeing the two of them there. Um yes, they were in their um orange jumpsuits. My colleague was covering the hearing in Miami. Um a judge said that they would stay in jail. Um um you know, which means that they wouldn't be released uh on bail. Um and you know, their their lawyer gave a press conference in which they said that the tapes were innocent and that um this is politically motivated um and that they will fight the extradition order. Um, and so, you know, this is the first appearance since they've been arrested. Um, I think many, uh, people in recent months will be more used to seeing them traveling around the world, you know, jet setting to different countries. So, it was a a very different image that we saw yesterday.

[00:02:05]>> To be clear here, they they have been under investigation in the United Kingdom for quite some time. There was a previous set of charges. Now, there's a fresh set of charges on on top of that.

[00:02:16]And that's why the extradition is being sought.

[00:02:18]>> Yes. And it can be a little complicated to explain, so I will do my best to break it down. So the Tates have been facing criminal investigations in three different countries. The UK, Romania, and the US. Um, and their last time that they were arrested in 2022 was in Romania, um, under uh an investigation there. And uh they were in and out of house arrest uh for several years. Um and the UK had made an agreement with Romania when the UK also issued charges uh similar charges of rape and human trafficking that Romania would resolve its case first and then they would be extradited to the UK. Um since then the investigation in Romania um there there has been some quiet around it and uh prosecutors lifted their travel restrictions which meant they were able to leave Romania and um you know go to the US for example um and it's in this situation that we see the UK uh prosecutors now saying here are some fresh charges these new charges are fairly expensive Andrew is now um being charged with uh rape, sex trafficking, and indecent images of a child and extreme pornography.

[00:03:44]And Tristan is charged with sexual assault, uh rape, and also sex trafficking. These offenses were alleged to have taken place between 2010 and 2017. Um and so uh the prosecutors said that this was the reason why they issued this new extradition order. The US Marshall Service um arrested them and that's why they have they are now once again in custody. extradition between the United States and the United Kingdom. Uh quite tight in terms of there there is a pretty solid agreement.

[00:04:21]Uh there there has been controversy over the failure of the United States to ex extradite the a family member of a diplomat who was involved in a car accident in the UK. The controversy over that. that tended to be the exception there, the Americans claiming diplomatic immunity there. So this all this agreement tends to go back to to to the war on terror when there was exchanges of prisoners and so on. So this is quite serious. It's it's they're they're not facing extradition charges in some country where the the the arrangements would be more loose.

[00:04:57]Yes, there's a very clear treaty in place between the US and the UK on extradition. And as you say, very few instances since that treaty came into um being where the US has turned down a UK uh request for extradition. Um we don't know what's going to happen here. Uh the lawyers are planning for the Tates are planning to fight the extradition order, you know, and that the Tates are both British and American citizens. So, um we will wait and see what the developments are. Um it could take several months if you know if the lawyers are challenging this and appealing this before we know.

[00:05:37]But if we're looking at what's happened before this in terms of extradition um that it's it's very rare that the US has turned down a request from the UK >> separately. You mentioned there is an investigation underway in the United States uh into the Tate brothers. What what's the status of that investigation?

[00:06:02]>> When the Tates were allowed to leave Romania uh last uh February, they traveled to Florida. Um and uh you know this news sort of broke in the middle of the night and they arrived um and the officials in Florida, you know, the attorney general there um and the governor uh Dantis were not very pleased that the Tates were in Florida and they said, you know, we we don't I think the government said um you know, you're not welcome here. And um shortly afterwards, the attorney general in Florida uh announced that they were opening a criminal inquiry into the tape brothers.

[00:06:47]Now, we don't know what came of that inquiry. It's been a year since then, but um there is that investigation. As far as we know, it's still open. Um and uh my colleague Megan Tui and I um um wrote a story last year in which we found that um the Department of Homeland Security uh had also opened an investigation into the Tates and they had been um looking at them. Um it was anti-trafficking agents had been looking into the Tates for several years. So um we also don't know the current status of that investigation but um that was the first time we really knew more details about what the US were um looking into.

[00:07:32]>> Investigation ongoing there seems to be fairly clear what that one is about. The the one in Romania probably has collapsed for for technical reasons. The the UK are are are clearly quite intent on on taking a a prosecution here. the extradition treaty. It's it's very clear. It's very robust, but ultimately any extradition has to be signed off on by the Trump administration. Is there a a a potential for a wobble there?

[00:08:05]>> Yeah. and and I do want to um highlight that the UK is the only uh country in which there are um active charges uh involving the brothers when it comes to charges like sex trafficking um and you know investigations and charges they are different. So um yes in terms of how extradition works um you know a judge will need to determine whether there is legal basis but the detary state will have to sign off on it which in this case is Marco Rubio. Um we our reporting found that the tape brothers over the previous few years um have culminated uh relationships with uh various right-wing allies, podcasters, influencers, and people in the Trump administration. We found that that did play a role in the lifting of their travel restrictions um when they were able to leave Romania. Um this is now uh more than a year ago. Um, anything we say right now would be speculative. Um, but it seems as though, you know, they're in custody and yeah, we will see what Marco Rubia does. But even for uh the US marshals to arrest them, there would be involvement from uh the American side on um handling that extradition request from the UK and and moving forward with it. you know, the Department of Justice um has to sign off on those orders.

[00:09:40]>> Yeah. Because the the the allegation is that in Romania there was possibly interference, possibly just an approach, possibly just a casual reference, which you know did did appear to be inappropriate from the American side.

[00:09:59]>> Yes. in Romania. Our reporting found that there was an order from the highest levels of uh Romanian government uh for the Tates to have uh their travel restrictions lifted. Um there was also earlier reporting that um the Tates had come up uh in a conversation between um uh the special envoy to the US at the time uh Rick Grenell and the foreign minister uh of Romania at the time um at a security conference in Munich. Um and I it and and the Tates have spoken widely about their um relationships with the Trump admin administration. They publicly supported Trump. Um and you know that is what our reporting found that there was an order from uh high levels of Romanian government to um you know have the travel restrictions were lifted. However, I do want to note that there at that time were no active charges against the Tates in Romania.

[00:11:04]The investigators there had um issued an indictment. That indictment had been uh blocked by the Romanian courts who said that there were issues in in that document. And the Romanian um prosecutors had been saying, "We are still investigating, you know, and and here are what our investigations encompass. The Tates had been accused of coercing dozens of women into pornography, um including a 17-year-old.

[00:11:34]Andrew had been accused of raping a 15year-old." And so, you know, but but as far as we know, the Romanian prosecutors were still looking into forming an indictment and forming official charges against them. And in the meantime, you know, the Tates lawyers had argued that since there were no active charges against them, them being detained in Romania um could be a human rights violation.

[00:12:03]>> Okay. Okay. So, obviously we see how >> complicated.

[00:12:07]>> Yeah. But we we we'll see how those legal processes play out now because your point is what's happening now in the UK is very different to what was happening in in Romania where there weren't charges. There was an active investigation. The United States active investigation in the UK there are charges and there is an extradition agreement. So uh different level uh altogether. Can can we talk about the Tate brothers then? Why is Andrew famous? What is it about him that has has propelled him to kind of worldwide notoriety?

[00:12:42]>> Yeah. So, we need to go back to um the origin story for them both. So, Andrew and Tristan Tate, they are uh American and British. They were born in the US.

[00:12:57]Um Andrew was born in Washington DC. and their father is American, Emory Tate, and they have an English mother, um, Eileen Tate. And um, eventually the parents split up and, uh, their mother brought them to the UK to live um, and they settled in Luton and that's where Andrew uh, first began training as a kickboxer um, and built up a profile um, in that sport. So, in he um he won several titles in his weight class. Um he uh bought professionally. Now, kickboxing um I'm not, you know, a sport expert, but I think that it has very specific categories when it comes to weight classes. So, um you he won um championships in those weight classes.

[00:13:52]And he often, you know, both brothers talk about um their upbringing and, you know, coming from humble beginnings, coming from um living on a council estate and not having much money. And part of their um story that they part of their brand really is that they have managed to overcome these challenges and make something of themselves and make um build you know an empire of of wealth and you know self-discipline and you know pushing to to higher levels of of success. So um but that all came after the kickboxing. Um, Andrew talks in interviews about how he started um um wondering, you know, how to make money and kickboxing is is not one of the sports where you can make a lot of uh money like others, right? So, um he has talked in, you know, interviews about how he pivoted then to um getting some of his girlfriends to work with him in a webcam business in which uh they chatted to men online and streamed themselves and he managed them. And that was the beginning, I think, of this era that he was in where he built up a a business uh from doing that. and um began sharing more about his opinions online. Um I would say the peak of his notoriety or one of the peaks came in um after Big Brother he was a contestant on this reality TV show in Britain. Um but before uh too long he was kicked off the show uh for after a video emerged that appeared to be of him hitting a woman with a belt. Um and you know he and the women uh came out and said that this was a consensual encounter but um ultimately he was booted off the show. And then the second wave I think is when he started posting a lot about his opinions on women. Um I think saying you know even even even when he was uh on Big Brother you can see on a website that he had you know he was saying Andrew believes that a man should be able to sleep with as many women as he wants but that does not apply to women. Um and then um later on he began sharing more of those opinions online and the basis of it is that he believes um men are superior to women.

[00:16:29]you know, men need to be in control. Um, and those opinions started to get a bit more attention and it also came as he was making these connections with um prominent influences in the right wing uh in the UK and later in the US. Um so yeah if if there is something else um yeah say >> he he he's also had very controversial comments about sexual assault victims you know suggesting that that they are they are to blame for what happened to them. He's he's got views about women that they're, you know, that they're they're basically involved in in kind of transactional relationships with with men and and that, you know, it's it's a form of of of consensual slavery and and things that it's so it it's what we now call in the mainstream the manosphere.

[00:17:29]sports.

[00:17:30]>> Mhm. [clears throat] He is one of the most prominent figures in the manosphere uh which is this ecosystem of influences and podcasters that talk about the definitions of masculinity and um talk about often, you know, men gender relations um and and it can be very macho and and hyper masculine. Um and you know Andrew has in interviews shared his opinions which are that um he said after me too which was that reckoning um about allegations of sexual harassment in Hollywood uh and further uh workplaces came out you know Andrew said that um you know men should women should bear some responsibility for being raped. Um he's also said that you know mental health conditions don't exist. Um he's called women sheep in interviews and said that they need a man to guide them that they are not made to um make their own decisions and be independent.

[00:18:34]Um you know these are extreme opinions that um caught attention online and spurred conversations. But um in our current um media uh ecosystem those kind of opinions um and that kind of outrage can be get more attention on people.

[00:18:55]>> Yeah. as you say, part of the manosphere, but that translates into being quite influential in terms of the social media space having a big hold over over young men in particular who will who follow and listen to the views of of of people like this.

[00:19:16]>> So, in 2022, um Andrew T was one of the most Googled people on the internet, right? Uh and uh around that time uh we began hearing more reports of um his name coming up in in schools in uh the UK. So you know we did um teachers were were telling us that Andrew Tate references were coming up and being um made by young boys you know um they were talking about Bugattis. They were talking about um rape and it was making some teachers very uncomfortable. In fact, there were efforts um and workshops um specifically aimed at talking about Andrew Tate's philosophy around women and why that was misogynistic or why that was uh to toxic by teachers themselves to to young men.

[00:20:08]Um and so there there there has been a lot of concern about the impact of his um uh messaging on um boys who are you know as as many children are and as many teenagers are trying to understand their place in the world you know their own definitions of what it is to be a young man and um you know they're also looking for guidance and looking for mentorship and um at that time Andrew hate was coming up as a as a name. Um, and there was a lot of concern from British officials. Um, I do want to highlight a survey that I pulled um recently and um it does note that I think at at one point there was something like um um over 90% uh of uh young men in the UK were aware of Andrew Tate and who he was, but a far smaller percentage of them um said that they had a favorable opinion And um this is a yuggov survey in 2023. Um and of the young men and the young men who um you know did have a favorable opinion of him, the messages that they resonated with were um his take on uh work and success um uh over his opinions on women. Um, that's not to say that there weren't concerns on how the messaging on treating women was impacting uh, young boys. Um, but I do want to note that um, as I mentioned, their origin story is, as they put it, about coming from humble beginnings and working hard to overcome them. And, uh, that is appealing to many young men who I think are struggling with what it means to be successful in today's world.

[00:22:09]He's pivoted this into an academy where you can he can basically teach you how to be successful in in life and and it's a it's become a a a significant revenue stream for him as well.

[00:22:26]>> Yes. So, one of the ways in which they have built their wealth is offering self-help courses uh to teach them how to build wealth and and how to um become successful. Um they have had several quote unquote programs, universities, um Hustlers Academy, The Real World, which offer them uh a access to a community essentially of other young men. And um and I I I think we we got a little insight into their financial situation in 2024 when um the UK authorities uh basically accused the brothers of tax evasion and a London court ruled that the British police could seize about 2 million pounds from bank accounts associated with uh Andrew. And so um they said you know that between a period um in the 2010s um the brothers had made something like 21 million pounds um which include you know online businesses um adult entertainment sites uh to name some of those revenue streams that the brothers have had.

[00:23:40]>> Yeah. And then so Andrew is the more prominent one. Tristan kind of lives in his his shadow. Kind of a obviously similar upbringing. Uh also pretty successful at at kickboxing, but he's not as prominent as Andrew.

[00:23:58]>> Yes. Uh you know, they're the brothers are quite close um from appearances. You know, they travel together. Um Tristan also um was a a professional kickboxer.

[00:24:13]Um and you know they've they refer to themselves as business partners uh and and going into business together. Yeah.

[00:24:21]And very close.

[00:24:22]>> They talk as well about their own upbringing, their their father's discipline having an impact upon them.

[00:24:29]>> Yes, that's right. Their father was a very well-known chess player. Um but both of the brothers have on social media and interviews um talked about um their father being abusive and beating them and how uh that had an impact on them growing up. Um they've also been pretty complimentary about their father and said that they learned a lot of things about um how to be a man from from um Emory Tate. So it, you know, it it's it's something that they they seem to in their words say was uh influential on them as children and um yeah, it's it seems like they have um they credit their father for things like being disciplined and um yeah, but at the same time, you know, I think their father passed away a few a few years ago [clears throat] and and they have lived in the UK primarily with their mother.

[00:25:27]Isabella, are all of these investigations and allegations and now charges is it are they actually damaging the Tate brand?

[00:25:39]>> The Tates have denied all criminal uh wrongdoing. Um they've come out very strongly against this and said that they um you know they are innocent. They are not guilty. And I think it is notable that they have sued quite a few of their accusers for defamation. So in the US um one of the women who uh had traveled to Romania to meet them um uh and later gave testimony to Romanian authorities um before returning to the US. The Tates have sued her for defamation in an ongoing lawsuit there. Um and they um they basically have uh you know even this week their lawyer has said that that lawsuit will clear their names. Um they've also um sued a woman in uh California who said that when Andrew visited there uh last year he uh assaulted her and um he abused her. So um you know the defamation suits have uh shown that the brothers um are addressing these allegations by broadcasting their innocence. Um but of course I think things have changed from 2022 where they were well known for their opinions and now as more authorities you know in these different countries have come out with announcements of investigations and you know in this case active charges these allegations are also um something that has become a part of their story.

[00:27:22]>> Okay Isabella Quay thank you very much for joining us and giving us that update.