Overcoming with Penny Slater

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-23

[00:00:02]Hey everyone and welcome back to the Women's Race Podcast. I'm your host Jackie Herring and I am home. I'm freshly back from Chattanooga and I just want to say a quick thank you to all of the pod listeners that came up to me in Chattanooga and said hi. It was my first time being out in the wild, out at a race since starting this thing and it was a really cool feeling to get to meet some of you guys in person. So, thank you for saying hi to me. Thank you guys for listening. And today we have another good episode on tap. I'm joined by Australian professional triathlete Penny Slater. Penny has been among the top long course athletes for several years now and has some really good standout performances on the big stage even. And I've gotten to race against Penny a handful of times. And she's one of those that's just a really solid allrounder.

[00:00:56]and she's actually can be a pretty scary athlete because she's one of those that when she's on, she's really on and you know she's just going to have a great day. Um, but in this episode I want to talk to Penny about some of the highs she's had of course and some of the struggles and some of what she's working through kind of going on this year that I've been seeing over social media and just hear about how her year is going. I want to just talk about some of the races that are going on and a lot of different things. So, Penny, thank you for joining me here on the pod.

[00:01:32]>> Thanks for having me on, Jackie. I love what you're doing.

[00:01:35]>> Yeah, thanks. I have been uh really happy and lucky with the guests so far.

[00:01:40]So, I'm trying to bring a variety of people from different countries. Uh so, it's this is not just a US uh protriathlon podcast. So from Australia and so this is my first also evening recording. So we're going to find out if I am brain dead by this time of day or if I can functionally uh process and ask questions. So it's a experiment.

[00:02:06]But first off, how are you? How are things? What's going on?

[00:02:11]>> Yeah, I'm not too bad, thanks. Um I'm we're just getting into winter over uh down here in Australia, so getting used to the cold. Although it's nothing like you what you have Jackie over winter, I don't think. Um but yeah, in terms of life things, I've just moved into our um very own apartment that we now own, which is really nice. And got a dog and all those things. And um yeah, still training and racing at a medium level.

[00:02:38]Training is going well, but racing is still very up and down as a lot of people have probably seen. But um yeah, we're just hanging in there and just trying to keep being consistent in training and hope that things will uh come out on the race course eventually.

[00:02:53]>> Yeah. Yeah. We'll we'll definitely probably have to get into some of that.

[00:02:58]I'm I'm interested, I guess, in in what's going on. But I do want to do a really quick lap on I guess how you got into the sport and how you came to be what seems to me at this point a full-time professional triathlete cuz that is kind of a hard step for a lot of people to take. So what did you do before and how are you doing it now?

[00:03:22]>> Yeah, so um how did I get into triathon?

[00:03:25]I was like just I was a really mad horse riding girl when I was in my teen years and played um a lot of uh team sport. So played field hockey and did a little bit of running and then just of a offseason thing for hockey. We did like a local novice triathlon series. Um and that's how I got into it and that was in 2014 and um I kind of got the triathlon bug from there. Um I was very bad at it but it was it was fun. Um, and I liked the the I I think I like the individual nature of it and also the fact that you um kind of get out what you put in. Like it's basically just how hard you work.

[00:04:03]Um, especially in the early stages as to how how much better you get. Um, and then yeah, from there I just kept kind of kept training and um I was going to university um studying exercise science.

[00:04:15]So, I just kept training and then I got into the exterror side of things and I really like that cuz I love being out in the mountains and in nature. So, um did a lot of mountain biking and was in my early 20s so I was pretty crazy. Loved going off jumps and um doing crazy stuff like that. Um and then yeah, so I then that's actually how I got my pro license um through the Xterror side of things.

[00:04:40]So I started racing pro in 2017 in the Xterra side. Um, and back then like pro for Xer was like pretty chill. Um, which was kind of my vibe anyway when I was a bit younger. Like I didn't take it that seriously. I just liked the fact that you got to travel and maybe get a little bit of money at races. Um, and back then there was a pretty good Asia circuit on.

[00:04:59]Um and then yeah, I kind of started uh long course in I did my first one in 2019 and I realized I was like actually quite liked it and that my physiology was pretty suited to it I think. Um and I was like okay I'm going to try doing this. It's at then co hit. So um and I was finishing up university then. So I actually basically that's how I kind of got a full year of training like a pro because I was in lockdown at home pretty much. Um so yeah and then after that I did my first full which was um at cans in 2021 and at the time I was working as a high school teacher as well. I'd came forth there and thought oh like that's pretty good um like maybe I can do this.

[00:05:50]Um, I was lucky enough to be living with a friend at the time who wasn't charging me rent. Um, that made Love. Yeah, thank thanks Lil. Love you.

[00:06:00]>> And yeah, so I was coach I I had started a coaching business then too and just had like half a dozen athletes. So I was able to start training full-time and then um like just have that as a way to make a bit of money on the side and hope that I got prize money at races. And um yeah, I guess from there I've kind of made it work and in ter and then my coaching has grown a little bit too. So it's nice to have that as like a you know it's like that's how I kind >> stable income.

[00:06:30]>> Yeah. Live dayto-day which I've been very lucky. I've had that the last year that's for sure. And then you know the money I make from racing I try and set that aside for actually all the traveling and racing and stuff you need to do.

[00:06:42]>> Yeah. Yeah. That's a really great path.

[00:06:45]And I love how natural and pure it sounds that you just started out cuz you wanted to get out in nature. And that's such a such a great way to get into it.

[00:06:56]And I feel like the people that get into it of with that like puress are people that can last a really long time because you got in cuz you love it. You don't get in cuz you're trying to make a ton of money or be a fancy, you know, pro alete like in the image that people think it is. Um, so that's cool. And you did have, you know, some early success right away. And so that's great that you're able to build the coaching around that and and figure it out. And you're still coaching now. You still have like a team of people.

[00:07:27]>> Cool.

[00:07:27]>> Yeah. I have like probably about 15 staple athletes who are all around from where I am like still with the club I've been with for 10 years. So, um, they're all very loyal and also are just like they know what it's like with me like being away for racing and stuff. So, they're all very chill about it. Um, and it's kind of a lot of mine are like just athletes who want to, you know, do their first Iron Man or do their first 70.3. I have a few like higher performance ones, but I kind of love I love the just like helping people to get to the finish line of an iron man like cuz that's kind of what our sports a lot like a lot of that's what it's about. So, I love that.

[00:08:05]Yeah, that is a I started when I first started, I kind of did a similar type of path with getting the coaching going just to know like, all right, I'm going to be able to pay rent every month. Like I I need these people. Uh but then it is really fulfilling and rewarding to help people achieve such a huge goal. Like an Iron Man is a big deal in regular people's lives and yeah, that's pretty cool. Well, that's good. you're still still doing that and still like finding joy in in the coaching part. I I had to let coaching go. Uh even though I did >> a few other things going on, >> I just like to put as many irons and as many fires as I can find. So yeah, but well for me it was the kids that put me over the edge of course of things I could handle. But you also have a lot of irons in the fire because now you're working on um your PhD. It sounds like I've been following very closely because I find it very interesting. You're studying Red S. And this is something I I was a I was a young and and stupid athlete who made a lot of poor decisions in my younger years with around eating and and have healed myself over many many years um in my 30s. Actually, having kids made me come good on my relationship with food and my body in general. But I think it's important work that you're doing and I think it's really cool. Um to just get it out there. So for people that aren't familiar, can you just give like a quick rundown of what you're doing and and if people want to follow along, you're sharing a lot of this on your socials and then maybe like what your goals are during this process.

[00:09:53]>> Yeah, for sure. So, um, for I guess the reds is kind of the I guess since I started my PhD, it's kind of become a bit more of a hot topic of conversation within the endurance sport world, but >> it's because of Lionel.

[00:10:07]>> Yeah, literally. Yeah, that's it. Um, I mean, I was watching his videos from like the beginning, like, you know, from about nine months out, and I was going, "Oh, no, I know what this is, like these signs and symptoms."

[00:10:22]Um but yeah, so yeah, for those that don't know, reds is basically um when you're uh exercising a lot and you're not consuming enough um energy to sustain what your normal physiological functioning is. So like your liver health, heart health, breathing, brain function as well as your um calories to cover your energy expenditure. So through exercise um and from that that if that's happening over a period of weeks, months sometimes even years for many of us um there's a lot of body system breakdown. So one of the most common is the bone stress reactions and in females the loss of menstrual cycle and then there's also um a lot of metabolic consequences as well as well as then um performance consequences. Uh so yeah so I got diagnosed that with that in 2021. Um, I made a fair few poor decisions in 2018, 2019, 2020 in terms of my eating and fueling habits.

[00:11:24]And yeah, so I had my first stress fracture in um 2021 and then got diagnosed with reds and basically spent all of 2022 um and early 2023 trying to get back on track and um yeah, get get healthy again. And I hadn't really heard much about it. I'd heard about the female athlete triad and um Reds is kind of like a lead on from that to encompass male and female athletes and when I finished university I was like there's no way I'm ever doing going back to uni. Um, and then yeah, I just got really interested in it. And I was like, how do not more people know about it? And then I was talking to other athletes and other coaches and they were saying kind of going, "Oh, no, like it doesn't really matter that much." You know, this is like just part of being a professional athlete or being an endurance sport athlete. And it just didn't sit right with me. I was just like, "No, this is not right." Like this, you know, it doesn't have to be like this, I don't think. Um so yeah then I kind of got into doing some post-graduate work learning how to research um which I did over the next couple of years and then um got into a PhD program in 2023 and sort of the whole uh my university wants to have a big focus on female um researching female athletes cuz only 7% of the research is done on female athletes. So >> isn't that crazy?

[00:12:47]>> It's crazy. I mean, I think it might have gone up to 10% now, but when I started it was like 7%. Um, because I always get hated on because I'm just focusing on female triathletes, but lucky I have a few stats to back me up that um this is probably very warranted and very needed. Um yeah, so I started my PhD and the big focus of my um my PhD was finding out what uh female triathletes and coaches in the industry know about reds and um if they've experienced it, if they've worked with athletes that have experienced it and if they have like what they've done um and if they've looked at any education, where have they gone to that um and then how they like to learn and basically the big crowning jewel of my PhD which is hopefully going to be um starting the end of this year early next year is uh like an intervention study where we've developed a education resource based on all these there's I've done three studies so far that are kind of have given me information as to build this resource um to be hopefully the best that it can be for catering to how female athletes like to learn um and then seeing if that uh increases knowledge on reds and then also potentially behavior change in the athletes that are in the intervention.

[00:14:09]Um and so like yeah that that that big aim for me is to get to that prevention stage so that you know athletes aren't getting down into a big hole like I have been for many years unfortunately. Um so we can prevent the early stages um of stress reactions and stuff like that um before before I get to the serious long-term consequences of reds.

[00:14:33]Yeah, I mean there's a lot of things there, but first off, I think I think this is awesome. I think you could have a huge impact, especially on some of these like new and younger pros. I think it's just such a common thing. You experienced it. I experienced a bit of it, but kind of got got ahead of it before I had any I've never had any bone injuries. Um, >> thankfully, knock on wood, I probably will now that I'm like getting going to be geriatric sometime soon. Uh, just kidding, I eat a ton. I eat ice cream every day. I think that's what's always saved.

[00:15:09]>> Yeah. Um, but it is really important and I think that is a really cool goal to try and figure out how you can communicate this to the younger athletes. And I think it really is on us as athletes to keep understand our bodies and keep a like a running kind of tally on on how things are going and be honest with ourselves. I think that's really the key uh the key to it because nobody else knows how you really feel deep down. The coaches don't know.

[00:15:42]Nobody knows like what your energy and your attitude in your mind like truly feel like. And I just before talking to you listened to a podcast you just did on the fueling with the fueling guy. I don't know. I just clicked on your link.

[00:15:57]I'll link it in the show notes of this.

[00:15:59]But um in that pod, Penny goes really into like a lot more about these studies and a lot of this stuff and I found it to be a great podcast. I loved it. So people should have a listen to that. But then I think it sounds like you're on a really solid path to to try and help well girls and boys like all people I guess get on top of this. like is that I think the main message is we're training. You have to fuel it and if you don't know how that you need to find somebody to help you figure out how. Is that kind of the summary of like >> Yeah, pretty much >> where we can start.

[00:16:41]>> Yeah, definitely. And also just like I think um big part for me is trying to um work on that like you know leanness culture that has been persistent in triathon from when I started. It's definitely getting significantly better now but um yeah that yeah that people are obsessed with being a certain race etc etc. So, um, and that can definitely feed into it. Like, yeah, um, I think there's probably a lot of disordered eating that occurs, especially in younger athletes, and they maybe don't even realize.

[00:17:15]>> Um, especially that, you know, the low carb fasting stuff is a has been a big problem and a big contributor to a lot of athletes, you know, facing these symptoms. Um and also yeah then a big thing is like trying to really drive home those you know consequences and long-term consequences that you can have from being under from under fueling for a number of years. Um you know that kind of I'm still facing the consequences of that five you know five years later on from my diagnosis.

[00:17:49]>> Yeah. Yeah. That's really interesting.

[00:17:52]So, looking back, I've got your results pulled up here because it helps me uh understand everything.

[00:17:58]>> I mean, even though it sounds like you said you were trying to figure it out in 22 23, you raced a ton.

[00:18:06]So, you must have been just like trying to find your groove, finding your balance, like but at the same time, you were trying to get healthy. Like, what was what was that process like then?

[00:18:20]those those few years and I guess yeah, what's it like now?

[00:18:25]>> Yeah, I I'm I'm not going to lie. I think 2022 I was running away from a few of my life problems which is why I was racing a lot and also um you know at triathlon's always been and training have always been a thing that's helped me settle um and be calm in. So I was still training a fair bit then. Um my coach at the time, Jackie Allen, though was really good with me. Like we still, even though I was racing a lot, I wasn't doing any crazy training. Like I was doing um pretty, you know, a lot of zone 2 work, a little bit of zone 3, but not much like high intensity cuz that's the stuff obviously that's pretty high risk if you've um uh yeah, if you have a history of bone stress injuries and stuff like that. And I wasn't doing a whole heap of running because um it took me like I think I had six months off running after having that uh TBR stress fracture. So um yeah, and then I kind of got myself together at the end of 2023 and then was able to start training more consistently and doing a bit more volume. And I think um that's when I kind of hit my stride. Like I would say looking back like 2023 was my most consistent year and I felt like I didn't have any big dips or anything. I was like just a steady build throughout the whole year and felt like pretty good most of it and didn't have any um any issues at all that year. So, um yeah, and then I made a coaching change in 2024 and had a very up and down year.

[00:19:54]And then, um last year was a bit of a um shamoszle, but yeah, we're getting there. Yeah, it looks like you're straight up struggling last year, but what I do see uh is that you somehow manage to crush Iron Man cans every year. And that's where I saw you last year, so I didn't even know you had a bad year. I just thought like, oh, she's >> you look great in cans.

[00:20:21]>> Yeah. Well, I mean, it's funny how like, you know, it's easy when you for all the bad performances to overshadow the like the pretty good ones, you know? So, like can actually was a pretty good race for me last year like and then I also came third at Sunshine Coast, but basically every other race I struggled hardcore apart from that. Um, but yeah, I mean, I'm doing cans in 3 weeks now, so I can't miss it. I I still haven't quite cracked it perfectly there, but I love that race, so I'll be going I'll be going back there for sure.

[00:20:50]>> I think you have some like good mojo at that race, so maybe that can just like set you on the right path for this year.

[00:20:57]>> Hopefully. Hopefully.

[00:20:58]>> I hope so. So So you have So do you think you have like ongoing health problems because of this or is it something completely else going on this year?

[00:21:09]>> It's really hard to know, right? So, um 2024 I had, um I trained really hard. Um probably too hard. Um like was doing some crazy stuff. Um and I had a had a good performance in Texas, but I had a grade three stress in my feur. So then I had to take a big Yeah. Well, I was grade two and then it turned into grade three cuz I got misdiagnosed and I started running on it again. Um >> Wow.

[00:21:39]>> Yeah. So then I'd have a chunk of time off in the middle of the year in 2024 and then kind of just managed to get myself in shape for Nice, but was probably was on the bit of a knife edge there and then um got back home from Nice after coming seventh, which I didn't appreciate that that was really good at the time. um and just got back and started working. Trained crazy again for like 4 weeks and then raced a few races at the end of the year, but I was completely blasted by the end of 2024 and then had a training camp in at altitude at the start of 2025 and then got another stressy in my feur um again.

[00:22:24]So I at that time the coach I was with I I decided that it was time for us to part ways cuz I'd felt like it was >> Yeah.

[00:22:34]>> bad.

[00:22:35]>> Yeah. And and you know like for me I've learned you know like it's my well-being is more important than performance. Like I I've said to every coach I've been with in the last four years like I'd prefer to be 3% performance-wise that and not get injured and be able to train consistently and race consistently than be trying to push the limits all the time. Um I think you know sometimes you do have to push the limits but it's like once a year maybe before Kona or whatever you know. Um yeah so then that happened. I got that stressy and it was all a bit of a disaster. Um and then I got pneumonia um in April and um had to have a lot of like antibiotics and stuff like that. Um probably got back into training a bit quickly cuz I really want to do cans and I want to do well at cans. Um did okay at cans. Then got caught up.

[00:23:30]>> Then you paid the price.

[00:23:31]>> Yeah. Then I got caught up in trying to um trying to chase the pro series. Um and yeah 3 weeks later went to Swansea and then placid um and I in cans I had a few stomach issues and just thought kind of thought ah no it's fine like you know I probably just swallowed too much sea sea water you know like it can happen um but then yeah it happened again in Swansea and I dnfed there cuz I got deh too dehydrated and basically passed out on the run course. Um and then >> I remember that because I saw you then in placid. Yeah.

[00:24:07]>> And I was like, I can't believe you're here.

[00:24:10]>> Yep. My flight's already booked, so I was like, right, I might as well do it.

[00:24:15]>> Yeah. So, you spent a lot of money doing that and then, you know, was did okay at Placid. Like, I didn't run that well.

[00:24:22]But I was like, oh, that's okay. Like, okay, maybe I will be all right. But I still had stomach issues in that race.

[00:24:28]>> Um, yeah. Came home from that and tried to get um tried to figure out what was going on. and couldn't really figure out what was going on and then was like, "Oh I got to train for Kona." So then start training for Kona and um then got a bit of a niggle in my leg. Anyways, it was just all a bit of and at that stage I should have just gone, "Okay, you just need to like chill." Um >> yeah, it's so hard in the moment to like pull yourself out of it and say, "I need to take a step back." M like it's really really hard especially if you have all the flights booked and all that. But besides the flights like >> that moment when you just need to say like separate from me as a triathlete and me trying to get these results or chase whatever series like you got to like take a real step back and like figure out the health of of you as like a human.

[00:25:25]>> Yeah, definitely. Um Yeah. And so like this gut stuff is like potentially, you know, cuz one of the consequences of reds too is it can affect your gut health. So we think maybe some of that's carried over and then getting sick. Um and then like my gut gut just got stripped from the antibiotics potentially. Um but then yeah, I went to Kona. Kona was a disaster again. I was I had a good swim but then was basically um throwing up on the bike from like an hour hour in and was like completely stunk on energy and got out to 17ks on the Queen K and was like I'm not doing this again and just lay down on the edge of the road until I got picked up by the sag 2 hours later.

[00:26:12]>> That's so long. They make you sit there that long.

[00:26:14]>> Yeah, I was there for ages. I mean I saw the women's race coming back. I saw like cat and I saw everyone exploding. Um >> yeah. Um so then I finally after that I said, "Okay, I need to sort this out."

[00:26:28]And had a big had a big off season. And um yeah, it turned out I'd um took a while to figure out I had something wrong with my blood sugar as well as my gut health. Um, so kind of got in on top of that, tried to anyway in February, January, February, March.

[00:26:49]Um, and then, yeah, I had some okay races at the start of the year, but we're still trying to get in someone to get in and have a look at my gut. It's just like trying to figure out when to when's a good time to do that. Um, cuz I like I'm seeing improvements and they don't want to kind of go in when I'm getting better, you know? Um, so yeah, we're just taking it taking it slowly, but I'm slowly getting there. Um, but it's just um, yeah, a long process and I think I've had to kind of re-evaluate what my goals are for this year. Like I'd already made the decision I wouldn't do the pro series and um, which I think was a good one and stay a bit bit closer to home and yeah, just try and get back on my feet and get get some confidence back in my ability again too, I think.

[00:27:40]Yeah, I think I mean that's the way to do it. Anyone that I've that I know or have talked to on the pod so far, I feel like you know when you're dealing with these things that you don't have a lot of control over necessarily, injuries or things like this that are a little more like nebulous, like you have to just do things that are a little easier, not as high stress or high risk, you know, racing closer to home. That's good. Like racing in Australia, that's where you got your initial success and that's where you'll probably like get your groove back and hopefully hit it at Cans and then you can uh get some redemption at Kona, right? Yeah, maybe. I hope so. I hope so. But uh if if Kona qualification isn't on the cards for me this year, then I've just like kind of accepted that that's maybe a good thing. Um, but yeah, I mean, as you know, it's hard with sponsorships and stuff like that as well, like when you're not performing well, which is fair enough. There's lots of really good athletes out there who are performing well, um, who the sponsorships go to. So, that's been a bit hard this year. I lost a lot of my sponsors at the end of end of last year.

[00:28:55]Um, so I'm kind of just going at >> going it solo a bit more this year. But in a way it's like hard but also kind of good cuz it takes the pressure off as well. Like I can actually just do what I want to do in terms of races. Um but yeah hopefully once some performances come that will be another thing that will come and I'll have to stress a little less about that as well.

[00:29:19]>> Yeah. Did your sponsors did they did sponsors tell you what races to do or not do? Did you ever have that or did you just feel like pressured to do certain things? There was a few races previously that um some of my Australian based sponsors wanted me to do, which is kind of fair enough if they're in Australia. Um but then yeah, just general pressure that like it was basically like the that carrot of you need to do perform X Y and Zed to get XY Z in your contract next year. Yeah. So >> Oh, >> yeah.

[00:29:51]>> Which is pretty like that's relatively standard I would say. So >> yeah, that is >> unless you rem for 10 plus years or something like that. But yeah.

[00:30:00]>> Yeah. Then they're like, "We're not paying you any more money no matter what you do." Or that's >> Yeah. Yeah. True.

[00:30:07]>> Or they just mine every single year for the past three years. It's like, "Oh, you're going to race another year?" I'm like, "Yeah, can I keep can you not fire me, please?"

[00:30:20]They're just waiting for me to retire.

[00:30:22]It's fine. No, my sponsors are great.

[00:30:24]They're thank me, please.

[00:30:27]>> You're You're still performing every single year. You're still getting >> I'm doing fine. I'm hanging in there.

[00:30:32]I've never taken, by the way, listening to all this makes me realize like I can't imagine taking that long off of running and like it's no wonder like things are a little more roller coastery because and I hope that you can find this just to have like the years and years of consistency like you just need years like without taking you could take a few weeks off here and there of running But it's really just the long-term build that seems really so boring.

[00:31:10]I think I air on the side of like more than the two to 3%. I'm I on the side of like five to 7% to in in order to keep the consistency.

[00:31:23]Like it's just seems so worth it to not not have to try to get sick or get hurt or >> do anything that's going to like freak your body out.

[00:31:34]>> Definitely. Well, I mean 2023 was like >> um I didn't have Yeah, exactly. I didn't have a single week off running or anything. And I'm definitely one of the I'm not an athlete who can, >> you know, have a niggle and not run for two weeks and then have a really good run. like I need to be running consistently and like kind of highish volume for me, even if it's just super easy volume. But um >> yeah, >> yeah, it's always it's a for me it's a really tricky balance of yeah, what's going to make me run well, but also what's going to keep me healthy.

[00:32:08]>> Yeah, for sure. Um, so while you're getting ready for CANs, do you will you assess after that what you think you're going to do after cans or do you have a rough plan?

[00:32:20]>> Um, I mean it all depends if I get Kona spot, I think. So Kona, there's two slots there. So um, and I have no idea what the start list will be like. I assume it's going to be pretty just Australian based. Like I know Beex from New Zealand is gonna race, but um yeah, I'm not sure. There might be a random European or two in the mix because they sometimes come over. There's always a random European who you're like, "Wow, they're really good.

[00:32:54]>> They're just trying to get their Kona slot, too. Everybody's just looking for that."

[00:32:57]>> Exactly. So, we'll see. Yeah, we'll see what happens with that. Um but then my plan after that, depending Yeah. If I get Kona, then I'll probably just train and try and stay consistent and just race Kona and do maybe a 70.3 leading into Kona. Um, but if not, I'll probably do maybe a few 70.3s over winter, well into our spring and then would race Bustleton um at the end of the year. So, yeah, >> we'll see. So if you So if it didn't work out in cans, you wouldn't go chase a >> I don't think so. I think I I got caught up in that last year unless I just unless something crap just happened at cans maybe and I was like oh I'm actually firing on all cylinders like I would have gone really well then maybe I would think about it. But even just like getting to cuz the only it would either be PL I'd have to go to Placid or Europe and getting to Europe right now is like pretty hard for us. So um >> yeah cuz it's still closed.

[00:34:02]>> You have to go like the wrong way >> around. And then to get to Placid isn't the greatest travel for us either. It's like pretty terrible.

[00:34:12]>> Um yeah.

[00:34:13]>> Yeah. There's not many options left truly. It's like >> Yeah.

[00:34:18]>> Yeah. I think I know what my coach would say, which would be to just Yeah.

[00:34:22]Anyways, we'll see. We'll cross that and get to it.

[00:34:24]>> Yep. No need to worry about stuff like that yet. Um Yeah, it's interesting. Um the decisions that athletes have to make now, which obviously this year you chose to like not worry about the Pro Series.

[00:34:42]I think we have it feels like we have a lot of options and I feel like it's interesting how people choose you know some people like do a little bit of dabbling like T100 they're doing this they're doing that and then some people like I'm like pro series or bust pretty much is my jam and and other people kind of look like they're trying to decide or dabbling in and out and it's interesting to me but I guess you just got to find find what works what works for you. And you know, if you were uh like a newer athlete, like if you were coaching like a brand new pro, say they don't live in Australia, maybe where they live in Europe or the US, like would you tell them to try the Pro Series or would you tell them like how do you think people should choose these things? I think it really I think it's like one of those things that you have to measure up like depending on where you live what's financially viable. I think as you get older I think when you're younger if you was a younger athlete I think I would just say if you have the means to do it I would say go for it cuz you're going to get some seriously good experience and like the only way you're going to get better is by racing the best athletes in the world. Um, and so then when you get to a world champs or whatever, you're not going to get a massively rude shock to your system. Um, like I did at my first world champs. Um, so yeah, for younger athletes, I reckon it's definitely I I think it's worth it. Um, and I think you would like get a lot of experience racing at a high level. Um, but then yeah, I guess as you get older and you have a family and you have kids too or have other stuff going on, I think like there's a bit bit of a weighing up of what's possible and what's viable. Um, I think yeah, like being from Australia, it's definitely a bit harder cuz we obviously have to travel um to a different continent to be able to do the whole pro series. But I mean that's kind of what everyone in the Oceanana has had to do for the last 20 years, you know, like all the >> like um Crowy and Renie and stuff have all lived in the US um when they were in the peaks of their careers. But yeah, it's hard. I but I mean for me definitely if I'm healthy next year I'll be going for the Pro Series. I think it's really cool. Um and it's like I think it's important not to shy away from racing in really good fields. I think it's exciting and good to be part of. I really enjoyed it when I've done it the last two years.

[00:37:19]>> Yeah, it's very inspiring to feel >> how much I didn't even know I could get beat by that much in a 70.3.

[00:37:31]>> Yeah, that's shocking.

[00:37:34]>> Yeah, even when you think you're having like a pretty decent day and then somebody's like legit four miles ahead of you.

[00:37:42]>> So, I don't know. the pro series, you got to like be a little strategic with the race picking, I think. Um because there are just some people that happen to be really really fast right now. So >> yeah, >> that's Taylor. Sig is also fast.

[00:37:58]>> Yeah, cat.

[00:37:59]>> Try and not do too many. Try and not do the two fools that they do probably.

[00:38:04]>> Yeah, I just Hey, I changed my schedule after Oceanside. I was like, nope, I need I need different races pretty much.

[00:38:13]Yeah. Do you want to tell me your thoughts about I know you've only done like a couple of the PTO. I don't even know. Have you done any T100 branded ones?

[00:38:24]>> No, I just Oh, 20 No, I did it when it was still PTO. Yeah, I did it when it was still PTO. I think 2022 and 2023.

[00:38:34]>> Okay. Well, what are your thoughts? And I'll share I can share mine, too. But on the idea of like splitting up the men's and women's, >> um, >> I feel like Iron Man tried that and it pissed people off and then they put them put them back together and now T100's doing that. But yeah, we've got Spain coming up and it's women's only.

[00:39:00]>> What do you think? I mean, I love the fact of it being like there being coverage of just the women's race from a purely um you know, looking as a fan perspective of loving the women's racing. I really like that. Um being able to see what's happening the whole time. Um I still like the idea of it being like if it could be separate days like but on the same weekend. I think that would be is the most ideal scenario I think for all racing you know like even if Kona was able to be that which I know people are going to say it's not possible but anyways um you know so >> I do wish that was possible too I'm a big fan of everybody being there >> cuz I like that then it's you know you got a lot going on but I do like the full coverage >> um of each individual race on its own.

[00:39:52]>> Yeah, exactly. And like just like the from a purely selfish perspective as a female pro too like in Kona just like not having to worry about interference at all from any males um in our race. Um but yeah the T 100 is interesting I think like it seems like it's just attracting a lot more especially on the male side but a lot more of the short course athletes.

[00:40:18]I just yeah I would I would wonder how it would go if they ever did like an actual long course race if they would get more act like full distance athletes going over because I think like for me at the moment it doesn't appeal to me because um like I'm not a strong strong enough swimmer I don't think and also the fields aren't big enough you know >> so and the courses yeah I don't know I'm it doesn't really appeal to me so that's why I think a lot of people are going with the time in the the Pro series, you know. Um it's just going to become a niche set of athletes, I think, doing the T 100.

[00:40:55]>> Yeah, I think it's really suited towards >> the short course athletes who are used to having such a hard swim because they all just go swim hard and then, you know, you and I on occasion are by each other in a swim, much to not my liking.

[00:41:12]Um, if I'm by you, I'm not real pleased cuz a lot of times you ride faster than me.

[00:41:18]So, uh, but in these races for people in in our vicinity, we like to have a bigger group because then it kind of forms, >> uh, like yeah, a better bunch. And and in the T100s, the the swimmers are just so fast and there's only a few people that would be around our speed and and who knows if someone's going to make the front group or not. And it gets a little dicey and yeah, I've done several of them. And besides not caring for the swim dynamics very much, I don't like like tiny multi-loop bike courses. Like for me, >> I cannot get excited about it. I I ride my trainer like six months of the year and I am an outdoor animal and I love doing big scenic bike rides and riding back and forth uh on a multiloop thing doesn't do it for me. But as a fan, I do enjoy watching the T100's a lot of times. So, I am looking forward to it this weekend since I don't have to race it.

[00:42:26]>> Yeah. And um I don't know if you've seen anyone that's racing. Do you have any favorites? Do you got any personal favorites?

[00:42:34]>> I actually saw the start list the other day. I mean, I'm always rooting for Ly Wilms. Um she's like we we like to claim her as an Aussie anyway. So um >> Well, she lives Does she live near you?

[00:42:46]>> Oh, she's she's in in Queensland, so a little bit away from um a little bit away from us, but like still within Australia. So, I'm just trying to see if I can see the start list actually.

[00:42:58]>> Yeah, she's >> It looks like a great >> Yeah, it looks like a great start list.

[00:43:02]I mean, I think Kate W's um racing, so she'll be good. And is Sophie Evans racing as well?

[00:43:08]>> She is. We just had I just had her on the pod. I think she's going to do well.

[00:43:13]>> Yeah. And Holly Holly Lones like it's a it's one of the I think Taylor's not racing, is she?

[00:43:19]>> Nib.

[00:43:21]>> Yeah. No, >> Taylor Nib. No, there is a Taylor Spivey. Oh yeah. Okay. Jeez. Okay. So, yeah, a fair few of the short course girls racing. Y >> um >> Georgia Taylor Brown, she could win.

[00:43:33]>> Oh yeah, she definitely could win. I mean, there's a hand. I mean, the British girls, they're on fire, aren't they?

[00:43:39]>> Um >> Yep.

[00:43:40]>> Especially across that distance. Who's your pick for the win?

[00:43:45]>> Uh podium.

[00:43:49]>> Yeah, I think Georgia Taylor Brown.

[00:43:53]I think um I mean Imagigen Imagigen just had a really solid couple 70.3s.

[00:44:04]I think she could probably do well. I'd like to see Sophie Evans do well. Bianca Boen, Rico Bogan's sister, has two kids.

[00:44:15]Um >> I know you're crazy.

[00:44:17]>> Yeah, I would vote for her.

[00:44:20]Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I'm just going to hopefully I can watch. It's probably middle of the night or something, so we'll see.

[00:44:27]>> Yeah, I think the course over there is a bit um more exciting, too. Like, they've got a climb and stuff in the in the um on on the course, so yeah, it'll be good.

[00:44:37]>> Yeah, that's very good. Um looking a tiny bit ahead.

[00:44:42]What do you think of Iron Man Hamburg?

[00:44:45]>> Oh, yeah. Um wait, is Solie doing that?

[00:44:48]Yeah, that's why I'm not doing it honestly is because her and Laura were gonna go to Yeah, >> I was gonna go to Hamburg again because I I love like a short, fast, easy Iron Man. I actually don't like to >> Does that mean you're going to have to go back to Placid then?

[00:45:03]>> No, two years in a row.

[00:45:06]>> You say you said no way I'm going back to Placid after last year.

[00:45:10]>> Oh, that is two years in a row. It's It's beautiful. Don't get me wrong. Last year was torrential rain.

[00:45:17]>> Yeah. the whole time. That sucked. And I just sucked at it. Two years in a row. I did not do well. So, >> same.

[00:45:25]>> I just don't like that. So, I'm going to go to Sweden >> cuz it looks beautiful.

[00:45:31]>> It does. I think it's supposed to be It's a fast course there, too, isn't it?

[00:45:34]I think >> Yeah, I hope so.

[00:45:37]>> Yeah. Punch out a quick iron man to get your confidence going.

[00:45:41]>> Yeah. I don't even care what my Well, I mean, whatever. A flat course is going to get you a faster time. I just like it to be over with quickly.

[00:45:50]>> Yeah.

[00:45:51]>> Yeah. So, yeah, fair enough. Um, yeah.

[00:45:54]So, Hamburg, I reckon Oh, yeah. Money's got to be unsolvito toe, which I think is highly highly likely. Um, I mean, I know Laura has been sick, uh, which is probably why she didn't have as maybe as good a performance as we would have thought in France. I mean, she still got on the podium in a very good field, but um, so if she's 100% healthy, I think they'll probably be going toe-to-toe for sure.

[00:46:30]Yeah, I think that's possible. But the thing that is killing me about Soulvag I in Oceanside and in Texas, she's like going so so fast and she's like smiling, >> chilling.

[00:46:45]>> Yeah.

[00:46:46]>> She's just like running with this look on her face like she's just >> doesn't even look like she's crying.

[00:46:52]>> She just loves it. She's just having so much fun and I think that's why she's doing so well honestly. Definitely.

[00:47:01]>> I think all these Norwegians like they all seem like they take it seriously but not that you know like they're still very relaxed about it. I think so and that definitely seems like it would help. Like someone said to me at Placid last year, I can't remember who it was.

[00:47:15]they were she was riding in front of them and they said she looked like she was just chilling out literally the whole first lap of the bike and then decided okay I'm going to go and went and just like destroyed everyone and then got to the front of the race like pretty quickly. So >> yeah, >> um >> there's something to that mentality, don't you think? Like I know that's something I try to keep in mind a lot of times when I'm training and racing which is like especially if I'm coming up on like a workout that I know is going to be really hard. It's like, yes, this is going to be hard, but also like you still have to keep it light somehow. Like it you can't be stressing about it. And I think somehow they carry that into their training. Um, which allows them to do a lot but do it kind of like happily and they're very like happy about what's going on.

[00:48:10]>> Yeah, definitely. I think yeah it's like yeah I mean there's never I think the more pressure you put on yourself like for me definitely the worse I've gone.

[00:48:18]So the more relaxed and happy I am, the better I go. And I think the long the longer I've been training, the more um >> I'm yeah, I'm able to do that with sessions. Like I used to, you know, I would open my what what have I got in training peaks for like the whole week.

[00:48:33]Whereas now I always am just like I'll just look the day before and I usually won't click into the session. I'll just be like, "Oh, okay." And then like you don't have time to rumin. I'll just be like, "Oh, I've got a 4-hour bike. It looks like there's some intervals.

[00:48:45]Better make sure I eat enough so I'm good to go tomorrow or whatever." and then I'll click into it on the morning go okay well I'm already going out to do it like you know just try your best and see what happens like most of the time you can get you most of the time you can get through it anyway and it's more like as you know just putting bricks in the wall really like whether it's a exceptional session or not most of the time it's not so which is actually probably a better thing for you to race well save your cookies for the race day for sure >> yeah yeah that's for sure yeah I that's that's a good method I'm going to kind of try to do that a little more cuz sometimes I'll look at it. Actually, I don't even have a coach now. And this is what's most messed up. I'm the one putting my own bike workouts in.

[00:49:26]>> Yeah.

[00:49:27]>> So, I'm like doing like double mental dut duty to myself cuz I'll put in something >> and then I'm like, "Oh, that's too hard." And I want to change it all the time. And I'm like, "No, I know that's the right workout I need to be doing."

[00:49:42]Uh, and then I get a little stressed about it. But it is true. It's the You have to have the attitude like, "Nope, I'm just going to go out on my bike. I'm going to start this ride. I'm just going to do the best I can and it's going to be whatever it's going to be." Like sometimes you feel terrible and then magically once you get going, it's actually like, "Oh, my legs are fine."

[00:50:04]You just >> they just feel tired. I have seen in your Instagram that you do still seem to be training quite a lot.

[00:50:13]>> Do you are you would you consider yourself a high volume girl?

[00:50:17]>> I think I think I'm on the higher volume for of the women.

[00:50:23]I just respond to it a lot better. Like I don't I mean a 30hour week is like I would only ever do like one maybe two of them back to back. The rest of the time I'm pretty much floating like around the 26 to 28 hour week I would say.

[00:50:42]>> That is so much. I just want to let you know.

[00:50:47]>> Yeah, I know. I know. It's um But yeah, I don't know. It's just >> that's just what you do for ages. Yeah.

[00:50:55]And it's what I've always done the best of like um I mean that's like when I'm getting ready for a race like if I'm when I'm building up at the start of the year it's more like you know 24 24 25 hours a week. Um but I love training. I just love training Jackie. So that's why I need a coach. So they they >> sounds like it. Otherwise >> otherwise if I coach myself I'll just go out and train.

[00:51:20]>> I'll be I can do another 5 hour ride today. That's fine. So yeah, that's why I have to have a coach. And >> um my coach now, Liz, is Liz Liz Blford, and I'm forever I finally convinced her.

[00:51:32]Yeah. So we're >> she she's always um saying to me, "Why are you going you're always going on the upper limit of the intervals I've given you or like you're always going doing?"

[00:51:42]Yeah. The maximum that I've given you.

[00:51:44]So that's why Yeah. That's why I need a coach because I just love being out there and doing more probably than what I should. So I need to be kept on a chain. You're the opposite of me. I'm like the most underachiever possible. When I did have uh actually funny story, so I had one year I was coached by Ian O'Brien who was Taylor Nib's coach and Taylor was like you where she would always like want her power to be at the top end. She would want, you know, be doing the max. So Ian was like used to that. So then he starts writing my workouts and he would write them and I always do my power at pretty much the bottom end because I'm like, "Well, I don't want to get too tired. I don't want to do too much. Uh I don't want to pretty much I like to work as least hard as possible, which is I don't know, maybe that's bad, but whatever."

[00:52:35]And so then he started like I noticed like my bike workouts were like inching up, inching up, and I'm like I don't feel like I need uh higher power. He's like, "I want you to be more towards the top." And he's like, "I know you're not going to do it naturally, so now I need to force you." So, >> yeah. Making that increment shorter.

[00:52:56]Like, you don't have a 20 watt or you have a five watt range.

[00:53:00]>> Exactly. It would be like a five watt window. I'm like, what happened here?

[00:53:06]>> So, yep. Everybody >> I am trying to learn to be better at that. I have got better this year because last year I think I was just grinding stuff out when I just should not have been probably and wasn't being probably honest enough with myself and with um Liz about like that the fact that I was a bit cooked. Um so yeah, I am better with that now that if I I actually you know cuz in training I would always be like oh my Iron Man Watts is 230 but it's actually not.

[00:53:33]Let's be real. Like my reality is like my average best average for an Iron Man is like 220. So it's like >> Yeah. Well, we all have like >> could be doing 230 >> our aspirational race and then like what they really are. It's a really sad reality >> sometimes. Exactly.

[00:53:50]>> Yeah, for sure.

[00:53:51]>> Yeah. Um well, we won't Well, it's almost my bedtime actually, so we're not going to stay up too late, but we're going to I want to do a couple just random questions and then we'll close with the same thing. I would like to hear two things for Iron Man. Your favorite I think I know the answer. Your favorite Iron Man course and then your hardest or Iron Man course you never want to go do again.

[00:54:19]>> Yeah, favorite Iron Man course is definitely Iron Man cans. Um, got a soft spot for it. I do think it's the best course in the world, especially the atmosphere on the run course is amazing. Like you can't beat it, I don't think.

[00:54:32]Um, and it's like a beautiful, beautiful ride, even if there's always pretty much a headwind coming back into town. But yeah, that's definitely my favorite. Um, my least favorite.

[00:54:46]I don't love Texas. I don't love Texas, but I had a really good race there, so I think I'm going to have to go back there again. Um, but in terms of like stimulation for the brain, Texas is definitely pretty boring. Um >> yeah, that bike ride, >> that bike ride, that bike ride is like hectic on the second lap for sure as well. Like and also it looked even worse this year just gone by and all also all the crap that was on the road did not seem ideal. So >> yeah, it was crazy this year. Um but just a loop I on Iron Man cans. I also absolutely love that race and I would love that's one I would for sure despite the plane ride, I would love to go do that race again. Yeah, I really hope it's a pro series again. Um, but I assume that maybe New Zealand will stay for one more year. Um, >> uh, anyways, we'll see. But I would love to go and do New Zealand cuz I've never done that as well. So, >> oh yeah, maybe. Looks hard.

[00:55:46]>> Looks too hard.

[00:55:48]>> I think the roads are very are quite slow. Like pretty pretty lumpy. So, >> yeah. Um, a couple more random questions.

[00:55:57]What do you think younger female triathletes need to hear? What's the most important thing or a couple things? I'm going to say making sure that you're eating enough food, especially carbohydrates.

[00:56:15]And um that fitness is not how you look.

[00:56:20]Fitness is a feeling. and you'll know when you're feeling fit, not all based on how you look.

[00:56:27]>> It's so true. And actually, to go way way back to the beginning, you said the words race weight and I think the sooner somebody can just delete that from their vocabulary, the better. I remember when I first started, that term, it just always comes and goes. When I first started racing a long long time ago, that was a very popular thing that people were talking about all the time.

[00:56:55]>> And I got like sucked into that >> and it is so strange cuz it >> cuz it is like it is not a certain weight at all. It is actually just a feeling. And even now like my weight kind of goes up and down.

[00:57:13]>> But guess what?

[00:57:14]>> I don't pay any attention to it. Because when your training ramps up, like your body turns into the thing it's supposed to be.

[00:57:22]>> Yeah.

[00:57:22]>> Like naturally. So >> yeah. I always say to people like if you're doing triathlon then it's highly likely, especially if you're trying to get to a high level, it's highly likely you're not eating enough food. So like you can pretty much unless you're doing like sweat stuff, like you can pretty much throw out those scales and just make sure. And if you have a thought, hm, should I eat something? You definitely should eat something.

[00:57:45]>> Yeah. Yeah. If you're thinking about eating, you're probably hungry. You should Yeah.

[00:57:50]>> Yeah. Yeah. And I think the other the other problem that really happens is people hear that >> that they should be eating a lot and then they eat like a ton of like crap empty calories. Like I have seen some really horrendous diets where >> you might take be taking in a lot of things but it might all just be junk and then your body's not >> uh actually getting enough protein or getting enough um of the carbs or the calories that will actually help it repair and restore everything and let you wake up and keep training every single day.

[00:58:26]>> Yeah, for sure. I think a biggest investment someone can make is like one if you're already doing a lot of training then just be seeing a dietitian if you're not sure. Um you know if you've got your head screwed on you probably only and seeing one who's like worked with endurance athletes is good cuz there has there is some bad advice out there. So um you know like your coach isn't necessarily someone who's qualified to give you advice on what to eat. So outsourcing that to someone and if yeah if you've got your head screwed on straight like you probably only need to see someone once or twice. um to um to get you on the right track of what you should be eating when and how much um on how much you should be eating. So definitely worth doing.

[00:59:05]>> Yeah, I think that's great advice. I you know we we invest a lot in sport in money and time wise and I think yeah getting a handle on that and an understanding is is super important. So I think that's that's good stuff. Um let's do the final thing on the pod.

[00:59:26]It's called What I'm Loving Right Now, and it can be anything, Penny. Anything you're loving right now. Oh, well, we just got a little rescue dog as of four weeks ago. So, his name's Huie. I'm loving him and I'm loving being able to finally get um cuddles on the couch every night cuz I've wanted my own dog basically since I was 8 years old. So, um yeah, having him has been really, really cool. And yeah, he's very cuddly and loving. So, it's been awesome.

[00:59:57]>> That's pretty sweet. What kind of dog is this?

[01:00:00]>> He's a Maltese Cross. Hang on. He's coming to say hi. Can see >> him. Oh my Oh, that is cute. All right, you're going to have to send me a picture of that. I'll put that one on the the Instagram.

[01:00:14]>> Yeah, for sure. Yeah. No, it's been great. So, and especially coming into winter, so he's uh having someone to cuddle with on the couch is great.

[01:00:21]>> Oh, yeah. You need you need a dog for winter for sure.

[01:00:26]>> Yeah.

[01:00:26]>> All right. Um I don't have anything to share about what I'm loving except that it might become summer here up north.

[01:00:35]>> Summer comes late. So I just want it to be warm.

[01:00:40]>> Um but lots of out outside riding.

[01:00:43]>> Yeah, I need to ride my bike. I need to get faster. I just had a terrible ride in Chattanooga, but luckily this pod isn't about me, so I don't got to cry on here. So, >> still got on the podium, though, so that that's good.

[01:00:57]>> That's fine. I know how to >> consistent as always. Know how to get on the podium.

[01:01:00]>> I I can do that. North America 70.3.

[01:01:04]I can do that. Um well, that's it today for for the pod. Thank you, Penny, for coming on here and chatting and sharing all of your experience and um great wisdom with us. Um I'm really glad to chat with you and thanks everybody for listening and please subscribe and share this with somebody who you think might enjoy it and we'll talk to you guys soon. Thanks.