Six Flags' Regional Pass Moat & D'Amaro's Disney+ Pivot

Added: 2026-05-11

[00:00:00]Hi. Okay. From our studios in Los Angeles and Tampa, this is Green Tag Theme Park and 30. I'm Philip from Ganttom Lighting Controls, and I'm joined as always by my co-host, Scott Swinsson of Scottson Crate Development.

[00:00:12]On Green Tag, we look at the top news each week, and we try and pick the stories we think are most important for theme park professionals, and explain why we think they're important, ask some questions, try to get to some answers.

[00:00:23]This week, we're looking at earnings from both Six Flags and Disney.

[00:00:26]Hopefully, we will get there. But, but >> yeah. Well, and actually before we even start that, we probably should talk a little bit about our about last week's show because some of our listeners did exactly what we asked you to do, and that is to double check us and make sure that, you know, we're staying honest and and if you have any additional information that we may have missed or misinterpreted to to go ahead and share.

[00:00:45]Um, last week we did talk about uh the the Six Flags closing, which um even when we read it, even when we were presenting it in the show was a little sketchy. Um, but I will say that we basically took the same trend as most major networks from as far as news outlets go. Um, and uh, so we we apologize for for missing the uh, the fact that the park did not actually close early and that the fight took place in the parking lot, but that still doesn't take away any of the the talking points that we brought up during the show, which is theme parks are not as safe as they were when we were kids. And um there were some people who commented, you know, back in my day, we didn't need this. And I'm I'm glad you're you feel that way because that's kind of what we said in the show. Um but I I I think it's I think it's important to to recognize that even though we did make a mistake and we we completely admit it.

[00:01:35]Um there was not an actual there was not an actual early closing. Um, but it actually took place at closing time in the parking lot and it is still trying to be determined as to whether the people who were in the parking lot causing the fights as part of a teen takeover um were actually people who were attending the park who actually went to the park that day. Um, all of this said, we apologize for missing the that one that that important detail, but I also think that we stand by all of the things that we said in regards to what these kinds of this kind of violence in or near a theme park is uh could negatively potentially impact and create, you know. And the other the other question I had was, you know, one of the biggest things we talked about was the chaperone policy. And um that if the chaperone policy, you know, if it did if it did only take place outside in the parking lot, then a chaperone policy is not necessary.

[00:02:29]>> Exactly.

[00:02:29]>> But if they feel as though some of those people were in the park and coming out to to start a rumble, is it called a rumble anymore? Damn, I'm mold. Anyway, um so then clearly they feel that the chaperones could help that as well. So the the context may have been misrepresented and we apologize for that. However, the content we still stand by and feel as though it was valued valuable uh discussion to have on a show like this one. Um another comment that we got is that I am far too close to my camera. Um well, I just want to tell you the shot I'm I'm back pretty far now and this is a horrible shot.

[00:03:05]This is a hor this is way too much headroom. So, you know, I guess it's just a matter of taste and I I agree with you. I don't think anybody wants to be this close to this face. I totally get that.

[00:03:14]>> I never watch us really. I I just, you know, you let it play in the background.

[00:03:18]You go do other things. I don't know.

[00:03:19]>> I don't even listen to us either. So, you know, I know what we said.

[00:03:24]>> So, anyway, um if I get too close, I apologize. And yes, I have nose hairs, okay? I'm an old guy. Uh but anywh who um the idea is that I will I will do I will we'll try to meet a find a happy medium so that you're not completely repulsed by my giant close-up of my face.

[00:03:41]>> Okay. I'm not repulsed by your closeup.

[00:03:44]It's fine. Okay. Uh shall we to the earnings then? Okay.

[00:03:49]>> Yes. Go on. Let's talk about it.

[00:03:50]>> All right. That's that's unnecessary but okay. You're gonna scare somebody. That was a jump scare. Okay. That was unpleasant even for me.

[00:03:57]>> All right. So, Six Flags earnings uh were very good. I think uh you know, everybody was pleased with them.

[00:04:06]>> Are we back on Six Flags again? What the hell, Philip?

[00:04:08]>> I know. Well, >> are there other parks?

[00:04:11]>> We'll get >> after this show, I want >> after after this show, I want to put a moratorum on on Six Flags for at least at least like three weeks.

[00:04:18]>> We we will get to Disney. Okay. Yeah, let's get through this pretty quickly.

[00:04:22]So, attendance and revenue were up for the first three months of 2026 at Six Flags as theme parks. Six Flags welcomed 2.9 million guests up 4% from the same period 1 year ago. Revenues were up uh increased 12% helped by 6% increase in per cap spending under score that we'll come back to that. Uh operating costs also fell but that's a little bit of a uh more complicated puzzle because it's it they did reduce headcount from corporate staffing but it's also because a lot of maintenance because they got rid of a bunch of parks, right? So they they're losing like staff from those part they're getting you know maintenance is going down from some of that but um they did mention >> I don't want to just brush over the fact that they did reduce headcount corporately because right >> you know you and I both know people that that are that were released let go um and to all of them of course I say congratulations because it's the best thing that's going to ever happen to you in your career. Um but uh the other side of it is I know it's scary and it's um it is one of those things that is is we don't mean to make light of it but it it does it does help the numbers and >> it does help the numbers right and the consolidation they're doing. So uh overall it was a good earnings call at least shows that Riley is making an effort to rein in some of the uh expenses and costs. However, I'm going to point out so there's a lot of interesting stuff here that didn't really get covered by main people mainly for us park people. That's interesting.

[00:05:49]But the TLDDR here really in my opinion is that they're in a really good position to combat the current macro uncertainty. And they almost I'm not going to say they stumbled into it by accident, but it's sort of um something where what they found is that people are finding a lot of a lot of value in their regional season passes.

[00:06:14]And if you think about what we talked about before with the concept of people needing to trade down depending on their budgets for summer. So in that regard say and they he actually there's a quote we can read about this but he uses the one here in SoCal and the one in Texas as good examples of where people are now using the regional passes and they're taking a day trip to a park that's you know within driving distanceish for them. So that way they're getting multiple visitation under the same pass.

[00:06:41]And if you think about that, it kind of dovetales exactly like >> if you think of people that want to take a vacation, but they're trading down and now uh they could, you know, quote unquote trade down to taking a day trip to another Six Flags Park because they already get in because they have a regional or if the cost is just upgrading to a regional, that's a pretty good value proposition. And so on top of that, um, this was not mentioned in the call, so I'm adding this for you all as context, but on top of this, uh, Six Flags has made a lot of announcements leading up to the earnings call for bringing back live entertainment. Like so many announcements. Um, it's an incredible amount of live entertainment they're bringing back. And of course, they just opened the Phantom Theater over Phantom Theater, right? Um, I think it's Phantom Theater opening nightmare.

[00:07:28]I don't know. that they they they opened that family-friendly ride, but then they also announced a lot of So, they announced uh Christmas slate returning for several of their parks. Holiday in the Park coming back for a few. They also announced the uh Dead Man's show that it's Anyway, they're announcing live entertainment for Halloween that's returning. Uh even that was being cut last year. They also announced summer activations at a few parks. In particular, I wrote a piece for Attraction Magazine about the summer stuff at King's Dominion and it is all day and it's literally part of the strategy that they talked about where they want to provide all day entertainment that transitions. So during the day you have parades and you have uh little performances and you have shows and they're they took their circ outdoor uh stage show and they're putting it inside of a theater and remounting it as a full theatrical production. So they're upgrading live entertainment at a lot of properties and this so that's the context that this comes into right and then they're saying oh looks like these regional passes are doing really well when you can see how this fits together where it's encouraging people to upgrade to the past and it's making people want to keep the past because they there's entertainment there's new things to do and I feel like this is just back to what we have been shouting at for years about Six Flags which is make it local make it personal, make it back in live entertainment and then do this regional pass to encourage people. So, I actually think they fell into a really good position right now because the regional passes is something that nobody else can offer.

[00:09:07]>> And so, it's truly a moat. And if then you're able to put the park presidents back and make each park individual and make each park doing something interesting, then you can actually um really widen that moat. I don't know.

[00:09:19]That's the TLDDR. We can do another thing. If you're going to do if you're going to do a regional if you're going to do a regional pass and you make all your parks the same, there's no point.

[00:09:27]>> That's right.

[00:09:27]>> There's no point. So, I can I can spend more money to drive somewhere else to get the exact same product I can get in my own home park. Um, what's really interesting is, you know, for me, because of my my what was my home park growing up was Six Flags Great America.

[00:09:40]Now, it was Marriott's Great America when I was there and then it was Paramount's Great America and then it was Bali's Great America and now it's Six Flags Great America. Um, but what they're doing is they're going back um and kind of um thumbming through the rolodex of previous owners and um from an entertainment standpoint, they're actually bringing back um parades and shows from the early seasons in the celebration of the 50th anniversary.

[00:10:05]That's right.

[00:10:06]>> Um so I think that is really cool. Also over the summer um they are have because >> um because my husband is a is a former entertainer there. He's former performer at Six Flags Great America. they have invited all of the previous entertainers to come back over the summer um over the 50 years that they've been open to um to do a big event for them as well. Now, I don't know whether that's a public event. I think it's mostly a private event, but still the fact that they are um recognizing the 50 years in this particular park of the entertainers, I think that bodess very well for bringing back or putting a focus back on live entertainment and not just and not just thrill rides.

[00:10:48]I agree and I think the point is you can see that at kind of every property especially the ones where they're bringing back park presidents that really know to what you're saying like that's again we talked about this on the the multiple weeks ago so I don't want to rehash it but that's a big reason that we've talked about park president's help is that they know things like that >> and they can from a leadership standpoint they can say yes send those invitations out to those performers yes that's a great idea like yes let's let's do more to celebrate the history of this individual property, right? They can make those decisions. And clearly Riley is supportive of that. And I I the other things to note, just a few other random things before we move on. Uh he did talk about quite a lot how they were going to rethink their marketing spend. And that one was hard for me. They did they did do a lot of uh restructuring. So they've replaced their some marketing people.

[00:11:41]They've replaced some other people. he kind of hinted my my take on this is that they hinted on their spend not being as effective because it doesn't doesn't utilize like new channels. So, I interpreted that to mean they're going to do more Tik Tok. Like that that was that was like my take on it. I don't know if that's accurate. I don't know whatever. But that was my take is that um like less billboards and and more uh Tik Tok was my take. But maybe maybe not. Um he did and a few other things. I mean, I literally everything he said, I was like, "Yes, yes, yes." Cuz he even said he gave everyone a heads up. It's like, "Hey, we're going to be spending more on maintenance this next quarter.

[00:12:19]You're going to see maintenance rise up." And the reason is because we want to improve our downtime on rides. We want to make sure the rides are functioning properly. I'm like, "Yes, that's all that what we want to hear."

[00:12:31]And even more, he snuck this in, which a lot of the outlets didn't cover, but I covered it just cuz I was comparing numbers. So he actually they raised the capex envelope by 25 million. So in the previous quarter he said the the the top the higher end of the capex was going to be 450 million. Capex is how much they're going to spend this year like reinvest into their into the parks. So he raised it up to 450 million. So 25 million higher. So could that partially be expenses whatever? Yes. He also said they were looking at going park by park to really think about the opening days and they're going to likely reduce some of them for Q2 but expand in Q3 and 4, which just happens to be Christmas and Halloween. And if you combine that, >> right? And if you combine that with the um capex spend, which some of that will go there, but basically it's like he's committing to spend a little bit more on improving the services and they're going to try and use some of the funds more, you know, in a more focused way for, you know, for uh like marketing and things like that. So, I think that's all good.

[00:13:39]Um he me they mentioned the regional passes over three times. Like I had a little ticker going and they just kept coming back to that >> where it's a drinking game. Yeah. Yes.

[00:13:48]Our our bingo card for this year now has uh regional passes in addition to weather challenges.

[00:13:55]>> Yeah. I No. And I think the I think the other thing that if I'm going to read between the lines when he's talking about we're going to invest in in a lot of the upkeep of the parks and and the >> that's where the extra capex money is going to go, >> right? I mean, >> because it's it's really hard to say we're going to all the new stuff is going to be we're going to make sure our rides don't break down. Well, that's hard to market. So, you gota you got to go in and go here's what our capex is going to be. And then when you recognize after going parkto park um that when you recognize, you know, our parks still aren't as clean as they should be.

[00:14:30]They're they're not as the maintenance is not as strong on the attractions as it should be. Then you've got to realize, okay, we've already committed X amount of of capital spend to improving the park as far as adding new fun stuff, but this is equally as important. So, let's go ahead and and raise that ceiling just a little bit so that we're not taking anything away and nobody can complain and say, you know, oh yeah, well, you know, we're buying more brooms and we don't get a roller coaster in our park. Um, but it's it's it's a very smart way to do it. And I love the fact that he keep that he keeps going back to um we're going to go park by park >> and and look at how each park operates because when you have when you have a um >> the idea of McDonald's doesn't work as well as it used to with theme parks. It used to be that with McDonald's, part of the reason that they were successful is because you knew exactly what you're going to get no matter where you were.

[00:15:26]But with a theme park, there are different needs and different desires in different demographics and different audiences. So, you cannot paint them all with one brush. You've got to make sure that you maintain some uh local flare and um and focus at the very least focus on what the local crowds are, you know, either complaining about or praising and and make sure that that park continues to do the things they're praising and gets rid of the stuff that they're complaining about. And that may be different in each and every park. So, >> y >> yeah, >> kudos to them. It's it's the right mindset.

[00:16:02]>> It's the right mindset. And I think that was evidenced by the King's Dominion piece because uh they talked about how John Riley went there to work with the park president to do a feedback session from some of their best fans and from their passholders and whatnot. And they used that feedback session to directly shape the summer programming which includes some returning stuff that was popular, but also some historic things like the clown patrol and things like that. And they're adding on some new elements. And I think that's that's a good approach where, you know, his job is to help with the leadership. that he can deploy if he needs to to help an individual park president figure it out or whatever align on their vision. But it kind of has to start with feedback and generating that feedback into actions. So I it's all positive I think.

[00:16:47]And because the corporate and because the corporate office is looking at reinforcing the individuality of the parks, there's also a great way to share best practices with different with slightly different outcomes or to solve slightly different problems because you've got such a broad spectrum of parks and types types of parks that are working within your system.

[00:17:08]The only so on consumer sentiment, that's the one thing we didn't touch on. He they basically just dodged the consumer sentiment question. Of course, everybody now everyone's always asked about consumer sentiment and how is this for forwardleaning demand and all of that and um he basically just said we're focused on what we can control the levers in the business and for us we're not really able at this point to attribute performance trends to those kinds of external factors. So our focus is execution, focusing on what we can change, what we can do and we've got our heads in the business and of course we'll monitor external forces and we'll be agile and we have other levers in the business that we can go after if we need to.

[00:17:51]So you know you say that that's kind of brushing it off to me that's really addressing the issue. That is that is directly addressing the issue. It's not saying what people want to hear. What people want to hear is you know we will coddle to all of the demands of our of our guests. But what he's saying is we will do the things that are in our control because if you've been in the industry even for five to 10 years, you recognize that no matter what you do, there's going to be people who aren't happy with it.

[00:18:18]>> So you you have to continue to keep your nose to the grindstone, stay true to what you set out to do. I mean, this is, you know, every time every time Disney the few times that Disney's had failures, it's because they got off track from what their core product was.

[00:18:34]Um the the um uh alien encounter came up came across my feed not too long ago and I loved it but it was so off-brand that that you know so you got to go back. You can't control you can't control guest sentiment. You cannot what you can control is how well are we doing what we set out to do. And that is much more of a long-term success plan than a short-term success plan. running around chasing to put out little fires uh that of guests flaming up on on social media is a short-term plan. A long-term plan is to continue to build an infrastructure that will allow you to deliver top quality product so that there's nothing for people to complain about. Now, they'll still find things to complain about, but the things that the things that are outside of your control, >> you know, there's no use wasting time and money to try to fix those. you might as well stick to your core product and and do the product well. Don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying don't listen to them. Be aware of them. Be aware of what they're saying, but put it through that filter of is this something we can control? Is this something that, you know, like we talked about last week and I and I mentioned again this morning, safety and parking lots. You know, one of our one of our listeners said, theme parks are not going to be able to stop team takeover team takeovers. And they're absolutely right.

[00:19:59]But what they can do is they can elevate security in their parking lots. They can make it more difficult for people to get into the parking lot who aren't parked there to go see the to go and experience the park. You know, those are the things they can control. But can they address the the concerns that people have because some teen is some group of teens is going to organize something that takes place in their parking lot? They have no control over that. So, it's it's focusing on what they can control as an organization and how they can continue to focus and improve their business by looking at it from a by looking at it as a business.

[00:20:38]Well, I have nothing to add, so let's move on.

[00:20:41]>> All right, that was more than enough.

[00:20:43]>> I Yes. Yeah, we got to move on. But I I think that that's a that's a a great framing for leaders and I I do see your point about that and it's something I often tell my team is similar things. So we can only control what we can control.

[00:20:56]Um and >> anyway at Disney >> meanwhile at Disney. Yes. Uh this one's a more complicated to me and I feel like I I have uh I don't know if I really want to go I have so many notes in front of me. I'm like, I don't think we really need to go through all this, but maybe just get to what I thought was the most interesting part and then um if people want to. So anyway, it was a good earnings call. They beat on the top and the bottom. Revenue uh was up 7%.

[00:21:23]Adjusted IBIDA was huge. The stock popped 7% on the day. Um that's all great. I'm sure all all of us have already heard that. the thing that was most interesting to me and I have a little I have like a I don't want to say hypothesis but I just have an interesting um weird theory about this but what was interesting to me most is that he kept coming back to the idea of Disney Plus like over and over and over he kept coming back to it and he kind of described it as being the center of the fan experience he literally even described it as a hub and spoke model which is like sounds familiar right but like yes he literally described it's like land. Yes, that's what I was thinking when he was saying it. He literally was like a hub and spoke except that Disney Plus is at the center, you know, and then you have like the spokes are like, you know, sports and ESPN and, you know, it kind of that stuff, but Disney Plus is at the center and um that it becomes a the hub for the interactive fan experience, you know, that is like all the Disney fans would would use Disney Plus as like the hub, like a inner, you know, whatever. And I'm like, that is a really interesting to me. It seems like a a a big reframing of what it had been before or or I don't know. It was just really interesting. Um and he said, quote, this is from tomorrow. He said, "All the opportunities that we have to drive value at this company, reducing turn, Disney Plus might be the single most significant opportunity that we have.

[00:22:52]And so it's probably not surprising I'm pushing the entire organization to prioritize that goal." what I mean when when I heard that when he was like Disney Plus is our best opportunity. I kind of it was a what moment for me. Um anyway, we can get into he said a lot of stuff a lot of they talked about short form content and putting that on Disney Plus. They talked about their new strategy pillars. So they have three new strategy pillars. Invest in IPA and creativity, reaching more consumers in more seamless engaging ways around the world and using advanced technologies to power storytelling. Okay.

[00:23:27]>> Well, if those are their three pillars that if those are their three new pillars, then yes, Disney Plus does get some additional traction. Um, I think you also have to recognize that and here's so here's here's my theory just based on what you've explained here.

[00:23:43]Disney Plus is not completely but more passive income than the parks are.

[00:23:50]>> Yeah. it. You basically put it out there and whether you have one viewer or a gazillion viewers, you you have the same infrastructure, you have the same investment basically.

[00:24:02]Um, and so by making Disney Plus more popular, they can take a a flatline investment in essence and, you know, make it so that it generates far more revenue. Now you have to invest in the marketing of that obviously and you have to continue to to buy product and and make certain that you have the right IPs but one of the pillars is investment in new IPs. So lookie there um >> right I I do think this is a little bit of a flip-flop >> from where they were going because they were saying that the parks were the were the epicenter and the core. Um, but uh it's I can certainly see why when they look at the money and they go, "We have to work how hard to make x amount of dollars in the park and we have to work how hard to make x amount of dollars on Disney Plus. We just have to get more people tuning in."

[00:24:52]>> I think um I I don't disagree with that, Reed. So, we're in more like my crazy hypothesis land now. I don't disagree with what you're saying. I have a crazy alternative hypothesis, which is that >> if you look at I I pulled up some numbers and and basically if you were looking at a 10-year kind of average, the Disney is roughly flat to modestly down over the last decade, like the rolling decade, right? Um so it it's kind of underperformed the S&P 500. And >> and this is Disney as a full company, not just the parks, >> right? And also, so that's point one.

[00:25:28]Point two is that they kept this was the first earnings call. They changed the format. So now he like releases a big letter that's kind of like this is what I'm thinking and all this kind of like a big essay uh tomorrow does and then they kind of do an earnings call which is mostly Q&A but they're basically trying to talk about the company as a whole instead of like each individual segment.

[00:25:48]So he's making a shift more to like talking about the whole. That's point B.

[00:25:52]And then uh point C is just some numbers here for you guys for context. AI related stocks have produced 76% of the S&P 500's returns since Jack GPD launched in 2022. So 76% of the returns are from AI. Basically 87% of earning growth and 90% of capital expenditure growth. And so I think he's reframing this as a way to make it seem like they have a bigger AI plan than they do. Um, we've heard for a lot of like Elon and everybody everybody has been chasing this idea for a long time about like the one app like the master app. Uh, and of course now if a lot of companies are AI washing where they're just kind of like we're using AI and efficiencies cuz I feel like it's become a thing where if you don't mention AI it's actually a liability because it's driving all the returns right now. It's like propping up our entire economy and so it's like if you don't mention it that might be a li. So, I kind of feel like part of this is maybe they're reframing it as a way to um give a nod to that like look, we also can use technology and AI and we're going to be able to insert efficiencies, you know, and and he did have a whole AI section, actually, a whole AI section where he talked about how they're using AI and all this stuff and how they're still keeping humans at the center, but they're using it for labor deployment and for better ad targeting and all this stuff that's really logical and makes a lot of sense. But I sort of feel like the reorientation is more um trying to sell a vision of like a master app like if Disney Plus cuz right now Disney Plus in my mind is not that competitive if if you compare it to Netflix. But what if it wasn't Netflix? What if Disney Plus was instead an app that was like one app to rule them all that controlled a person's whole experience in the parks and also streaming and was also Tik Tok and was also all this nonsense. Well, then it's worth a lot more. So, I sort of feel like that maybe is going on.

[00:27:49]It's a that's my crazy um conspiracy theory. So, what do you think?

[00:27:55]>> It's not that crazy, though. I mean it's it's one of those things that that technologically could happen, >> right?

[00:28:01]>> Um the biggest risk something like this happen has is um will people abandon Tik Tok >> to move to the one app the Disney one app?

[00:28:16]Yeah. or is there a way for the Disney One app to integrate with Tik Tok, you know, which again creates a whole another layer of challenges and problems and usually legal issues. Um, so I no I think I think that's a very interesting >> well I very interesting take and whether and the thing is >> a point on it. I think that because they did he did mention that the short form content basically what they're trying to do is build in um short form content into the Disney Plus app. So I think their I think their take would be they want to instead of you posting stuff or I don't know how the user generated >> instead of you posting stuff on Tik Tok you post stuff on Disney Plus.

[00:28:56]>> Yes.

[00:28:57]>> Yeah. And and my point is I'm not sure how many people are going to embrace that.

[00:29:01]>> Right. Exactly.

[00:29:02]>> We don't we turn we turn you know we we like to think that we accept new things quickly. Um but the things we accept quickly we also abandon quickly. the things that we become comfortable with and uh have become part of our lives, we don't let go of that easy. Um there's already AI push back, right, >> in certain in certain areas. So, um you know, I'm not saying that AI is going anywhere. It's not. I I think that to your point, Philip, I think this it's it is very very possible that he is because it is such a you know business buzzword right now or business buzz concept >> that he is coming to the forefront and saying hey we do AI too. That is very possible as well.

[00:29:46]>> That is very possible as well. Um, I I think yeah, I I I think honestly what we're saying here is not necessarily in disagreement. I think we're probably looking at different phases of potentially the same plan. Um, but the first thing you got to do is if you are going to get that one app, you've got to get everybody to to abandon what they're comfortable with.

[00:30:10]And retraining your retraining your audience or retraining your um participants, your creators is, I think, a much bigger problem than just creating a platform for it. Because a platform for it, they could do that right now. Um, you know, it's funny that we're talking about AI.

[00:30:26]I I think what we're probably going to do is because we're out of time for this show, but as we move into um as we move into our Unhinged show, uh thanks to all of our Patreon folk. Um we'll we're going to we're going to dive a little bit deeper into AI, but for this show, we're out of time. So, on behalf of Philip Hernandez with uh with Gantum Lighting and and Controls and Scott Swenson with Scott Swenson Creative Development, this is Green Tag Theme Park in 30. And guess what? We'll see you next week.