Why Are Vegans So Lonely?

[00:00:14]Okay, I'm live.

[00:00:17]How is everyone doing out there? This is the time part of the live when I'm just talking to absolutely no one. I mean, I'm talking to people because the live gets recorded and posted.

[00:00:32]So, this is probably the most important part of the live when people are actually watching the recap of the live.

[00:00:39]So, uh yeah, uh it's been an interesting morning.

[00:00:46]You know, I spend a lot of time like just researching topics and Hello, welcome. Welcome to my live.

[00:00:55]I spent a lot of time researching topics and uh I have a couple of things on my mind and some of them are a little more dicey than others.

[00:01:11]But uh I mean let's start with the easy one. No, we'll start with the dicey one.

[00:01:16]Uh, I I mean I feel like I cover a lot of things in the vegan community that a lot of people don't talk about.

[00:01:28]Maybe because I'm interested in not just the community. I'm also interested in the business of of being vegan. I'm I'm interested in, you know, some of these uh venture capital companies.

[00:01:45]But the thing is, I approach a lot of these things as a journalist.

[00:01:50]So, I'm always breaking them down. I'm seeing the people involved, what they were involved with before.

[00:01:59]And I gotta say, there are a lot of alleged grifters in the plant-based vegan business space, people that have like changed their names, been involved in other uh u illicit activities.

[00:02:25]I'm being very vague about this, but I just find it kind of ridiculous that a lot of people in the vegan community or maybe people in the the I don't know the information space prop up a lot of these, you know, I know shady people because it's like a win or because they're, you know, oh, a win for plant-based, a win for the animals without really doing any proper vetting.

[00:03:09]Oops, I just kicked kicked myself out of the live here. I hope I didn't just kick myself out of the live. Just hit my computer and hold on a second. Let's see how this works.

[00:03:21]Okay, we're still back.

[00:03:24]Hello, welcome a wave. That's great. So, yeah, I I I mean I'm vague about it, but I mean there's I mean I could give you a lot of different examples of [laughter] particular establishments, businesses, uh restaurants where the people uh running these places were not are not necessarily 100% above board. I mean maybe they have I mean good intentions when it comes to you know I don't know the you know their maybe ethical vegan stance of you know protecting the animals but when it comes to like you know I don't know having investors perhaps or uh um working working within like a business frame uh there's a lot of uh impropriety going on and uh maybe it's a American business thing. Who knows? I don't know.

[00:04:24]Anyway, so that so I'm thinking about doing a video about a particular business. I want to be really careful about it. So that's one thing.

[00:04:39]The other Okay. Okay. The other thing that's sort of related to this is how the vegan media, I know, we have like veg news, we have like I don't know plant-based news and we have a couple like green queen. We have a couple different like website media and then people based in like you know social media or have their own little like I don't know streaming channels and stuff and how any like bit of news that they can frame as a win for the animals or a win for vegans or win for plant-based is framed that way. And if it goes like horribly wrong, that stuff like just is later, [laughter] but it has to do with like not properly vetting like the news story.

[00:05:39]So yeah, that's I I've seen that happen a lot where, you know, like you're not going to believe this, you know. I don't know. I mean I mean I mean it always I mean for example like when you know big celebrity goes vegan and everyone's like really excited about them going vegan and there's like all this news and all this you know recipes and whatever and then they stop being vegan and it's like you know it's like that other stuff didn't happen you know like I mean I mean that's kind of the soft part of grifterism because there's not I mean I don't think there's any I mean other than the victim being the animals But uh [clears throat] human victims, you know, I don't know, do do happen, especially when it comes to people that are maybe say grifters driven by short-term clicks. Correct.

[00:06:30]Gazotly is an example of someone losing sight of what veganism is. Yeah. Or may Oh, wow. You go live. Only recently discovered your podcast and doing vegan information. Truly appreciate them.

[00:06:40]Great great recipes. Yeah, I do all sorts of things. I go live, I make recipes, I complain on the internet, I do a lot of things. Um, yeah. So, yeah.

[00:06:52]So, I don't know. I mean, there's no I mean, I I I've se Okay. I see this like shortterm situation in the activist space too where things don't 100% add up when I see like a c animal rights activists going after a certain um um social media clickable thing and if you sort of know all the details it doesn't necessarily 100% add up. It's more of a um um posturing attention getting device than a true win.

[00:07:37]God, I'm being vague about all this stuff, but I I just don't want I don't know. I just don't want rocks thrown at me.

[00:07:45]Are you lonely? I'm not lonely. Yeah.

[00:07:47]Oh, okay. So, that's the other thing.

[00:07:49]Okay. Okay. So, I was thinking about how vegans deal with alienation because I mean we live in a society that does the opposite of what we do. They eat animals, you know, they they they consume animals, you know, they are they are totally different type of people.

[00:08:13]And um how uh like like um it actually came from a conversation I had with uh you know I mean what what happens is like you know I have a daughter she's like a teenager and and uh I I remember talking to a father who like knows that I make videos who's who's who has a the same age daughter like I don't know maybe like maybe younger I think like maybe 16 17 years old and he was saying oh you know showed my daughter your videos because she wants to be vegan now. And I was thinking like that's I mean an age when a lot of young people decide like whether or not they want to eat animals or not or you know it's an interesting age. Um, but I was also thinking like the social impact of deciding to become vegan and what's it like when someone makes that choice, that lifestyle choice that they're not going to eat animals and and how does that affect their omnivore family? How does that affect the their friends around them, their, you know, their support system? And uh I feel like that's the thing that's the most difficult about being vegan is these social aspects and uh that there is a level of alienation that we experience. Even if you're in a very supportive, you know, vegan community, you you know, I mean, I I feel like in LA there's a lot of vegans. You know, we connect a lot of times. I mean, I do things like I go to these popups and I connect with a lot of people in the, you know, in the community. I do my best to try to, you know, you know, I don't know, offer support, but in a lot of areas, it's not like that.

[00:10:11]And uh so and I mean and even like the psychological impact of like everything we see on social media where you know you see like people fishing you know like where people oh it's just a normal thing. I remember watching a video where a guy was fishing and he got a big fish and they were like cheering and smiling and high-fiving each other. I'm worried about the fish. I'm like this is like not cool. The poor fish is flopping around. It's like they're they're they're they're behaving like this creature is like like just like, you know, doesn't have any value at all other than their their conquest.

[00:10:46]And I'm thinking, okay, I have a different perspective than most people.

[00:10:50]Most people think, oh, what a great idea. He caught such a big big fish.

[00:10:53]What a wonderful story.

[00:10:56]Um, and uh, you know, or or just you drive around, you see a a hamburger on a big billboard, you know, or you know, I don't animal whatever, food porn, like up up of everywhere you look, you know, it's there. Uh, so yeah, I was just wondering what you guys think about this type of stuff because, uh, you know, I'm maybe I'm just a cynical, alienated person. Who knows? I mean, I feel like I'm alienated from the vegan community, too. So, I'm whatever. I'm just I'm alienated from the alienated the most alienated of them all.

[00:11:39]I see what you're saying. Yeah.

[00:11:42]Okay. Let's see here. Are you lonely?

[00:11:45]I'm not lonely.

[00:11:49]I can think lonely can mean a lot of different things. Well, yeah. No, I know that. I mean, I I try to be provocative.

[00:11:54]uh little like you know headlines. I mean it's YouTube you got to get people interested in what I'm doing. I've heard solitude to loneliness. Yeah. Well, you know if I wrote solitude no one would click on it.

[00:12:10]Now I found so many of you it makes it easier for me to be vegan lifestyle. It isn't extremely easy but it's simple enough. You got to be consistent. Well I mean that's I mean I I always tell people about social media that they have to be consistent. they have to, you know, constantly put out content. I was I was I do a I'm doing a podcast with someone who is interested in being in social media and I was giving them advice about how they should be consistent consistent. I mean I mean I feel like uh that's part of not being lonely is is is creating content and making you know creating connections and getting engagement you know like that's that's a form of non- loneliness.

[00:12:51]Oh yeah, being vegan and spectating reactions to animal harm makes you feel like you're genuine going insane sometimes.

[00:13:00][laughter] Yeah, 100%. Like what kind of mad world is this? When I mean it was like they got like some kind of blue fin tuna and it was a dad and a brother or a dad and a son and they were like on the boat and had a lot of views and the the the the fish was obviously in distress dying right at their feet and they were there was so much joy on the boat. I'm like, dude, like like like this is something that only vegans can like totally empathize with. Like like dude, this is not I mean, don't you feel sorry for this beautiful creature that's you know the the you know that's just the object of their you know you whatever elation.

[00:13:54]Okay. Animals uh are not objects. For them, veganism is the principle. Okay.

[00:13:59]Yeah. Okay. I understand. I'm you don't I mean, you can I know what it is. I mean, again, you can post it. That's cool. Um I think it's important to get involved in your local vegan community activities. Yeah, it is. I mean I mean, but again, I mean, it's it's kind of a thing where I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's important to be connected with people and and I mean I I think advocacy is also part of it. You know, that's why, you know, we we feel less lonely because we're we feel like we're doing feel like we try to do sometimes we do things.

[00:14:33]Some we achieve things. [laughter] We try to achieve things.

[00:14:39]I'm sorry I'm laughing. If I'm not laughing, I'm crying. Uh we do our best to make a better world. I mean, I I feel like what I do is try to offer comfort to people. you know, in my recipes or entertainment or, you know, just I don't know, whatever. Just, you know, be a a character, a vegan character in the world. Uh, trying to be as authentic as possible. I mean, I think that a lot of, you know, vegan creators do that. They offer some kind of comfort to uh the to the uh whatever the troops. I mean I mean I feel like another thing especially with my social media um presence, you know, on the on the especially with the shorts is I really try to reach out to people that are not vegan with my content. Um which I mean I think sometimes I'm more successful than others when it come I don't know sometimes I'm successful sometimes I'm not.

[00:15:39]I hate catch and release fishing.

[00:15:42]Yeah. I mean, yeah. And then it just destroys the fish. I don't know. I have no idea if it was a catch and release.

[00:15:47]They might have made it into a trophy. I have no idea. I just I just saw an animal suffering on the deck.

[00:15:56]I really want to get into vegan advocacy, but I really uh don't do much outside of like my family.

[00:16:07]I always feel like it I make it worse.

[00:16:11]Yeah. I I mean I don't know. Well, I mean when it comes to the family, I don't know. I think you can just do whatever you can do and not be as annoying, not be annoying. I mean I mean I feel like sometimes the um the best way to influence people super close to you is with food, you know, and just sort of like look, I'm eating this amazing delicious cake or you know I mean uh you know I feel like that's you know I mean I mean I mean my vegan food I mean I have an omnivore family so you know and I'm the only vegan in the family but my vegan food's way better than what they eat. It's just so much better. So they generally just eat my food. You know, it's just I I make I make better food. I bring better food home. I go to better restaurants with vegan options or with I go to vegan creators that make incredible food. My food is better than their food. It's just it is. And I am lucky. I live in LA. I'm also a vegan influencer that can promote some of these businesses. So I get the best vegan food, probably some of the best vegan food in the world. So, it's like, you know, I I I I can I can say that with confidence. My vegan lunch is better than pretty much anyone else's vegan lunch.

[00:17:27][laughter] I don't say that with arrogance. I just say it just it I mean, just look at look at what's up on my on my, you know, on my feed in literal and and and figuratively.

[00:17:50]Okay, let me see what else is going on.

[00:17:52]Um, if you're not vegan because you are lonely, you're not a vegan. Okay, so yeah. So, so my premise is kind of working out a little bit. I mean, I don't know. I mean, I I feel like I feel like, you know, vegan community needs to do better to be more accepting. I feel like there are elements of elitism in the community.

[00:18:16]Um, I mean, just like any freaking high school community, uh, I think we need to be more open and more friendly.

[00:18:24]Um, I feel like the LA scene, there are elements of like, you know, just profiteering, things like that that, you know, I mean, yeah, people need to make make a dollar.

[00:18:40]Uh, but I do think that it's important that, you know, I mean, I mean, in my world, I try to promote people that are in it for the right reasons. So, so I have selective promotion. There there are a lot of vegan things going on in LA and I don't talk about a lot of those things because I just like it's like I don't know. I I can't I don't know much information about them. I can't get behind them. But if I know the details, I know like especially I feel like I get a lot of comfort promoting uh uh the pop-up people because I feel like they're really doing it for the right reasons. A and also too the people that I promote make amazing food. So, you know, I mean, I feel like I'm bringing people to a place where they're going to have a good experience, you know. So, that's the other thing is like I feel like, you know, or have good value and, you know, there, you know, and it I feel it all takes care of itself, you know. Um, you know, I want people to go and have a good experience, you know. I I I you know and that and that's why you know I I mean I turn down uh deals like brand deals or or uh you know collaborations. I turn down a lot of things because it doesn't align with my main goal is to just you know lift up top tier stuff.

[00:20:07]Oh more some waffle talk. Uh, you need to open up a restaurant where each sitting at the table has a mini waffle and there's buffet of foods to the waffle. Yeah. Yeah, I should. That would be good. Like you have like a wa like like the appetizers waffle the the maybe some we can waffle some soup and then and then a waffle of salad and then we'll have a main course waffle then obviously a dessert waffle at the end.

[00:20:37]But we're gonna do it all in reverse.

[00:20:39]No, we're gonna put it all together in one giant waffle and then there'll be segments. So So I'm like, I I'll I'll put the giant waffle in front of everyone. And I'm like, okay, so that's the main course part of the waffle and that's the dessert part of the waffle.

[00:20:54]That's the way to do it. You put it all in one giant waffle. See, that's how these amazing ideas happen.

[00:21:08]drop by the Happy Healthy Vegan live stream tonight at 6 PM time. I I don't know. I'm not a schedule person. Maybe if I'm there, maybe I'll I'll see what it is. I know sometime I think I follow him.

[00:21:24]How do you heck do you waffle soup? You just leave it in the waffle maker really a long time. It'll turn it'll dry up and turn into something. Especially if the soup has like some thick elements.

[00:21:38]Vegetarian is anti-vegan. I I I mean I feel that vegetarianism is a step to veganism. And I can say that because I've been vegetarian almost my entire life. And I've been vegan for maybe 16 17 years.

[00:21:57]So uh there there that was a step. I've been vegetarian and then I moved to veganism. So, so I mean we can go after the vegetarians and maybe they won't like vegans anymore or or understand that uh maybe vegetarians aren't necessarily informed about the factory farm system or uh how you know the dairy industry works handinhand with the meat industry all these other things uh you know so yes but but we can see vegetarianism as a that.

[00:22:33]So, I don't know. That's that's that that's just my perspective. I mean, we can go after people if we want. I don't think it it I mean, it's maybe fun to go after people. [laughter] I don't know if it's uh I don't think we're accomplishing anything other than maybe making ourselves feel better.

[00:22:55]We know we know being in Anthem, we know I know about the factory farm system. We I'm I'm sure that we're most of us are brainwashed vegans. We already know.

[00:23:17]I think that the idea of a giant waffle that has like all like like the appetizer, main course, and dessert. I think I I it makes me want to get a big waffle maker all of a sudden. You know, I'm thinking like, wow, it could be a waffle that has all of the the the the things that make it special. I I came up with that idea right now, this very minute here. This is how legends are made. Or maybe one single viral video How big the do waffle makers come? I mean, I'm sure they make like like like like massive ones for like, you know, I don't industry.

[00:24:03]Most of the I mean, I used to have a big waffle maker that was like a flippy one, you know, like I mean, so so, so, okay, so if a waffle maker is like in four, you could put the appetizer, the salad, the main Well, you know what?

[00:24:19]You know what? The main course might be two. So it would be the appetizer, the main course, and then maybe the dessert would be in the corner, but it would have it would be like the perfect thing.

[00:24:31]So you could just kind of turn it around or what would be better is the dessert could be in the center and you just kind of eat around the edges, you know, just kind of like so so the appetizer be one side and then the the the core would be the the whatever the chocolate syrupy part, you know what I mean? So, so, so you just kind of just eat around in circle. Maybe I could have like a special spinning device that that's impaled with the waffle. So, you could just kind of sit there and take bites of it as it slowly spins.

[00:25:09]I don't know how this got this way, but we got we got there.

[00:25:16]I saw your short where you were trying all those Dutch Brothers drinks. Those things look like artificially dyed chemicalinduced nightmares. Yes, they were.

[00:25:26]I I feel like um because I live in the social media sphere, it's not like I'm going to go to Dutch Brothers every day. If there was one down the street, I'd probably avoid it like the plague. But since I had never been there and I always hear about it on social media, I'm like, it would be funny for me to do a video where I go to Dutch Brothers and try all the different drinks. So, I did. And they have like, you know, crazy drinks, Shark Attack, The Kicker, you know. And also too, I feel like it's important for me to go to a place and show that a vegan can go there and try like they have uh they don't charge extra for oat milk or or any other uh dairy. So they don't they don't do that whatever that premium charge. So I feel like it's important that I show that, you know, vegans can go to a place and try and try a kicker or whatever a shark attack or whatever.

[00:26:22]Um, uh, that's, you know, I don't know, that was the motivation behind me trying doing that video, you know, the the ability of to try things. Um, I don't I don't I don't want us to be scared of society, you know, you know, and and and I don't know, maybe uh a teenager might see my video and go and replace, you know, dairy with oat knowing that there's, oh, I'll try oat milk. They might like it better. I heard that there was a someone mentioned in a comment that they work at one of the Dutch brothers and they're vegan and they always say that the oat and the plant milk taste better than the dairy. So, they're always pandering and pushing the the um plant milk out. So, hey, you know, I mean, we're all doing what we can, the little increment changes to try to make the world a little bit more plant-based.

[00:27:20]a mini waffle each seating like a shaboo shaboo hot pot restaurant. Yeah. No, but I I like the idea of it being one waffle because it's less work for the for weight staff. They just bring the they put the waffle in the bucket and then you just eat it, you know, and and all the flavors, the main course, the appetizer, everything is all I could put maybe I could like waffle sushi in one corner. Uh that would be the appetizer.

[00:27:45]Um, maybe waffle of I don't know what would what would the main course be?

[00:27:50]Maybe I don't know, vegan chicken cordon blue. Something like that. Something that has like an interesting filling.

[00:27:57]And the dessert would just be like a dessert waffle maybe and with some ice cream on top.

[00:28:02]The ice cream is going to melt, but you know, you got to eat it fast. It's good.

[00:28:06]It's fast turnaround. So they'll they eat their waffle, they get out, you get another customer coming in. There's gonna be a huge long line for this because you know at BHP, man, people want to eat the VHP waffles. It'll it'll be open one day, one day of the year.

[00:28:21]So, there'll be a huge line. People are going to eat their waffle. They're going to eat it fast because they don't want the ice cream to melt. They'll get out of there.

[00:28:31]One waffle meal. Yes, we know the dairy. Yeah. Yes.

[00:28:43]I don't Does everybody know this stuff?

[00:28:45]I don't know. I I I I can like like I I I mean I understand about the dairy industry and subsidies and all that stuff.

[00:28:56]I'm doing my best to fix the chickpea flour in place of eggs for an omelette.

[00:29:00]It's not perfect, but I'm still working on it. You make it look so easy. Yeah, because I keep on doing it. So, what's your problem with? Is it a texture problem? Is a flavor problem? What what's what's not working for you? I really feel that adding aquafaba to the mixture really changes things. So, get some chickpeas, take the aquafaba, put it in like um some uh like a um um an ice tray and freeze it. And then get the ice. And then and when you need aquafaba, just put an ice cube of aquafaba, let it melt into your mixture. Mix it up. And I think that definitely helps make it kind of have an egg-like bouncy texture really. I mean, it does a big difference.

[00:29:50]And it's, you know, I mean, it's it's part of the chickpeas. It's the chickpea ooze. I don't know.

[00:30:05]I can't say that I'm a lonely vegan. I'm the only vegan with nine kiddos and a great Yeah. No, I understand that. It's not I mean I I understand that I'm I'm thinking about like that alienation we feel when we are doing something or having a lifestyle that is so contra to the rest of the world and we we just you know we we have different I mean I mean I have I'm I'm I have a omni family and and you know I mean I have my own section of the refrigerator that kind of takes over everyone else's because I have a lot of extra food. I basically take up the whole freezer section, too. But, but I'm saying it's like it's like like my food, you know, we all have our own food stuff. It's like it's not that it's not it's not sharing and stuff.

[00:31:10]Correct me if I'm wrong because I might be projecting, but it's the loneliness we feel specifically referring to the vegan experience.

[00:31:20]Yeah. I mean I mean I I also think I mean if you want to just look at like statistics I mean I don't know whe whether or not like I mean the the the concept of I always like love it when I see like a vegan couple and obviously you know I'm and you know there there are vegan couples of all different uh orientation but when it comes to like let's say like cisgendered um relationships like men account for like 25 30% of the vegans. So there's a uh an inequity. So So it's going to be very difficult for um there to be a cisgendered relationship where they're both vegan.

[00:32:09]So there's going to be tension, you know, when they're or maybe not tension.

[00:32:13]I don't know. Depends on how we deal with things. I mean, I'm at a certain age where like I don't know.

[00:32:20]I don't know. I I I my tension I I I take my tension out on social media.

[00:32:26]But but but I mean that's I mean but but I'm thinking about like like couples like like just a like I feel like a couple that's vegan. I mean they can go to the same restaurants together. They can try, you know, try different things, you know, but most couples the way it works mathematically are going to or are not going to be I mean talk about cisgender obviously sick gend Yeah. The we're talking male and female relationships.

[00:33:03]You never think about it actually. Yeah.

[00:33:05]I don't I think about things like this.

[00:33:08]I just think well I remember just like you what what makes me think about these things is like when I go to an event and I start talking to people like and and you know usually what will happen is because I feel weird in these kind of like I don't know I I don't like the attention public even though this doesn't seem like it. It seems like I'm an attention but I don't like the attention when I'm in public that much.

[00:33:33]I mean, I feel like I'm always like trying to promote a business or shooting my food or whatever. I don't know. I'm at an event. I'm doing my thing and then people come up to me like, "Hey, you're VHP. You know, I like your work." And and so my way to uh deal with this situation is and also something that gives me value, makes me feel better is I try to learn about that person. So I ask them questions about where they come from, what restaurants they like, what type of food they like and things like that. So I try to learn a little bit about, you know, you know, I don't know and how who they are. And so that that usually come, you know, I don't know, maybe I'm get it through osmosis or something, but I get the idea that there are people that um I mean I mean I I I mean obviously I don't loneliness is an epidemic when it comes vegan or otherwise, but I feel like it's amplified because of the alienation that we experience as people that are different that are taking a different route than the mass of society and all the stuff we see around us. You know, all these other like, you know, I don't know. I could just keep going.

[00:34:58]You mean traditional couples? Yes.

[00:35:01]Should I said that better?

[00:35:09]No. Oh, I get you so hard. I come online and talk and advertise and shrink when people talk to me, too. Oh, you're talking about that? Yeah. I mean, I've been into the whatever the social media spotlight enough now. I mean, I I remember the first time I got noticed was like years ago and I was like with my daughter and we were at like like a Pink Berry. It's like an ice cream place and and the it was like someone who was like the age of my daughter who who watched my videos and was like like was fanning out and uh that was like the first time I've ever had someone w you know like like see my you know oh you're that guy you're that guy that had makes those videos. Um, and it was I don't know. It was it was awkward, you know, the first time and now it's I don't know. I mean, I it happens. I try to make it happen. Okay. Okay. I'll tell you a story. Okay. So, like, and I and I I don't I love having these interactions. I I I'm not not having these interactions. So, I'm going to Whole Foods and like I I like park my car and there's like this big ramp going up to Whole Foods. And as I'm le I'm going into Whole Foods, there's this like Amazon guy like he has got packages. I guess he's he's I guess he like moves the packages around or I don't know. Amazon returns, you know, like that's right in the front and he's like, "You're a vegan hex pod. I love your thing." and da da da and we were having all this like like really great conversation and and this and that. I mean this is a me thing. Okay. So I'm having this conversation with him and you know I had to go up this kind of like like this kind of um people move a ramp and I get up to the people move ramp and I'm I'm in the garage and then and so we have like I don't know maybe a nice you know I don't know six seven minute conversation and then I do my shopping. It's time for me to leave. And I'm like, do I really want to go the same direction? I mean, I should have just like I should have done that. I should have went down the same direction, kind of waved to him like, "Hey, see you. All right." D. But for some reason, I'm like, "How do I avoid this guy?" [laughter] You know, I already had my interaction.

[00:37:29]We had a good experience. I don't want anything bad to happen. Let me go ahead and like figure out a way to avoid this.

[00:37:36]I'll take the elevator.

[00:37:39]So, so I like go around in a different area and I know there's an elevator that'll take me to my car in the level.

[00:37:46]I I get into the I I I push the button for the elevator. The elevator opens up and that guy is in the elevator and so that it get another awkward bit and I'm thinking to myself, does he know that I'm trying to avoid him or what? I mean, it wasn't I mean I mean it was it was okay, but it was just kind of funny that that that he literally was in the elevator. I was trying to sort of circumvent another whatever fan interaction thing. I don't know. Is that funny? I don't know.

[00:38:28]I vegan anthem. We understand. I I think we we know you you don't have to you don't have to spam my uh that is pretty funny. Okay, you don't have to you don't you have to spam my we we I think most of us are on the same page. We understand that it's not right eating animals.

[00:38:51][laughter] Dog is cheap. Whatever, man. Yeah, it is. But we we do it anyway. [laughter] I I feel like I feel talk is cheap but action is is is is uh something you know we can do and I I mean I do it every day. I make videos. I make uh um I I tell people uh you know restaurants to I try to support small businesses. Do it every day. Do something every day.

[00:39:19]That's part that's not just talk.

[00:39:26]Not the vegan message. Okay. Whatever, man. I I dude I I I I I post about my stuff. If you if you if you don't like my message that you don't have to follow me, it's okay. I can just do my thing.

[00:39:39]You can just live your in your world, okay? you know, is I I do my thing and and I'm good at what I do and I have I don't know a lot of followers that that like my content and uh and I I try to provide comfort and recipes for people.

[00:39:58]I just do my thing, you know. I you know, that's it.

[00:40:15]Anyway, I don't know if it shows it's a good story. It shows that I'm humble as well.

[00:40:23]I don't know if it shows if I'm humble.

[00:40:25]I think it shows that I'm awkward because I feel that it's a it's an element of awkwardness for me to like like like how I'm I'm I'm more like okay, [laughter] you know, how do I avoid another fan interaction? I don't know. It's more of an awkward thing. And then but it's just funny how he just happened to be in that elevator and so I had I was forced into a second interaction. I mean, it was fine and we're cool and whatever, but maybe you're watching right now. Whatever. You think it's funny. I think it's funny.

[00:41:02]I I didn't sign up for being a vegan celebrity in the vegan space. I did. It didn't. It just happened that way. I started just making content and uh I don't know. I became like whatever Mickey Mouse, Goofy, whatever that I'm I'm a theme character. vegan theme character. But whatever, that's just the way it is.

[00:41:38]I you know, you know, vegan anthem, you're just coming off like a bot.

[00:41:45]I'm being vegan and being attacked. No, you're not being attacked. You're just coming off like a bot. Just be a human being. We We're all We're all on the same page. You just You don't have to keep attacking people that are [laughter] we we're we're we're friends. You're in a friendly environment. You don't have to you don't have to go after us.

[00:42:06]I understand that it's important to uh you know, be aggressive, but you go go after the the factory farm system or you know the carnivores or people that are making steak or whatever. You know, take off fast. You're in a friendly environment here. We love you.

[00:42:22]Even though you you're coming off like some kind of robot or something.

[00:42:29]That was funny. What happens to you anyway?

[00:42:43]You're you but you see the thing is is if you're you see being in the anthem if you're if you're telling information to people that are already already know all this information you're not you're not making you're not making impact. You need to bring your information to other another live not this live.

[00:43:06]Most of us are you know you know just we're just doing our thing.

[00:43:12]your your your information. I mean, I can I I I can, you know, voice I I know I know what you're saying.

[00:43:27]He's preaching through the choir. Yeah, that's right.

[00:43:37]I feel like if you want to be lonely, it's okay to be lonely.

[00:43:45]We've made it we've made a certain choice to be socially, you know, in a in in situations. I mean I mean I I feel like a lot of my content is about um how we are different in a non-vegan world and how we have to interact and react and behave in a in and uh I don't know and and honestly so a lot of these you know omnivore people are just like you say the most innocuous thing and they think that you know you're attacking them, you know, they're just there's just so much uh uh cope, you know, uh you know, like like like I don't consider myself, you know, I mean, obviously I'm not hardcore activist, but there's people that think I am because I share recipes.

[00:44:43]Okay.

[00:44:58]I put vegan anthem in timeout.

[00:45:01][laughter] [gasps] I don't know. Maybe Vegan Anthem was a bot, you know? Maybe that was maybe that was like some like like like some vegan activist like just kind of like puts a bot like on this on the and just has us just going on and on. I don't know.

[00:45:27]So annoying. I [laughter] don't know. I should have said that a long time ago. I mean I I I just like I feel like I I I I you know the thing that bothers me about like the vegan community is there are people that actively dislike me and we're all part of the same team you know and they you know I'm like dude just like I mean I do my best you know I mean I mean obviously you know I'm a trutht teller but I do my best to not hold any grudges. is, you know, I promote I've promoted businesses where, you know, the whatever the the owner of the company was mean to me and I promoted their business anyway. Uh, you know, I just like I just I just like feel like it's important to not get my ego involved in the in the situation.

[00:46:30]just me. Okay.

[00:46:37]Yes. I I I feel like I feel like we get into a position where um I don't know. I I um obviously someone I mean again this it was it was turning into bot behavior where the there was all this just [clears throat] the same cut and paste stuff. I remember I mean it happens with the meat trolls too like like the like I remember like cornering like this kind of meat troll that would always like put up bacon emojis and and then put up like you know oh you vegans are even worse than you know you you cause all the crop deaths and stuff like that and like like and and uh but I but I but I I noticed a pattern where a lot of the same wording going after me was this like like it was the same wording and I I remember cornering them like like why are you saying exactly the same thing that that person said you know two days ago or why why and and then they saying well I'm just cut and pasting this from a from a site. So they were actually like cutting and pasting the troll like like they they weren't even like coming up with the stuff themselves. They were like like just it's the same trolls, but they were just everybody's just sort of moving the text around. So maybe they don't even believe in it. I don't know.

[00:48:02]Maybe they're just getting paid for it.

[00:48:04]Or I I I had this I had this like whatever. I I shouldn't engage, but I had this uh conversation with a a troll recently and I I just made it into an economic thing. He was like, "You vegans, you're so self-righteous. You're such hypocrites. F you." And you know, and and and I'm like I'm like, and then I I Googled their name and they like they go after everyone. They're like, they're going after the burger dude. They're going after all these people. Like obviously this person has a history of doing it. I'm like, and so so I asked them. I'm like, "Are you getting paid for what you're doing?" They're like, "No, I wouldn't do that." And I'm like, "You're the hypocrite. you're probably getting paid and d I'm like I'm like why are you wasting your time like going after us if you're not getting paid you're very good at going after us you know you should be compensated you know I mean if if you aren't compensated you're probably wasting your time so it was this kind of thing you know and then eventually I just block them doing what you do is great to show people the possibilities and perhaps the influence of their choices. Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I just do I I I feel that they'll always there'll always be people that want to eat meat, you know, and and and you can't change their whatever.

[00:49:34]They're just going to do what they're going to do. But there are people that will change.

[00:49:39]Hopefully for the better. [laughter] Same wordings used as leftists against conservatives. I don't know. I don't know what that means.

[00:49:55]Trolling is inherently an emotional act where the emotion in the individual pretends everyone else is emotional. It's okay to mute. Okay. Yeah. I I don't know. I mean, I I block a lot of people. I've done that. I've begrudgingly blocked people like like it's kind of this thing too where uh you know I mean this that the whatever that bot troll guy, you know, you get to a point where I want to have a good conversation with people and it's like they don't want me to have a conversation. They want to talk. They they want to control the the narrative. It's like like dude like yeah we're I mean if you're a real human I I'm I'm down you know you know like I tried to I you know it took it took what five six minutes of me like oh yeah yeah no no we're down we we understand that we don't we know that factories farming is bad. You don't have to tell us the factory farming is bad. You don't have to tell us that the dairy system is you know you know dairy is a bad is is is part of the factory farm system is not good. We don't you don't have to tell us this stuff. We know that stuff. Okay.

[00:51:00]Can we move on and talk about complexities of the community, you know, things like that?

[00:51:10]Vegan hex asks a hard-headed question.

[00:51:12]Yes. Yes. So, so the the the one thing that I came like the uh across the one thing that I discovered about this whole like live that we did is that and I say that in past tense because I'm about done is that maybe I need to make a Swanson's hungry meal dinner waffle that has the vegan salisbury steak, the mashed potatoes, I don't know, cranberry sauce, and whatever. I don't know, some appetizer thing. So, I need to make an entire waffle that has an entire meal in one waffle.

[00:52:02]That's what I've learned. That's that's that's the only thing I got out of this whole conversation.

[00:52:10]We need to be concerned about solutions.

[00:52:12]Yeah, I know. My solution is to make a waffle. So, you know, I it'll make me happy. Maybe I'll get some views from it.

[00:52:26]Yeah, I might do I mean, one day maybe I'll do a live. I'm not really set up for it. I mean, so much work, man. It's hard to even just do this one where I just pull up my screen and, you know, so you don't see my bedroom. All right, kids. Thank you. I appreciate all of you. Thanks for sticking around. Even being an Anthem, wherever you are, give me a timeout.

[00:52:50]Just go to another live. I hope they're at another live having a more productive experience.

[00:53:00]Um, vegan loneliness epidemic. Yeah. So, so yeah. So, I was I might do a report about it. I'm not sure. I I have like a bunch of notes that I wrote about vegan loneliness.

[00:53:12]All right. Well, I'm going away. Thank you.