The UK government's declaration of a 'national crisis of anti-Semitism' following attacks on Jewish people reveals a troubling pattern of double standards, as similar attacks on Muslim communities (such as the 50 mosques attacked between June and October 2025) did not receive comparable government response. This selective application of crisis framing suggests that anti-Semitism may be weaponized to suppress legitimate political discourse, particularly opposition to Israeli policies. The discussion highlights how different minority communities are treated unequally, with Jewish communities receiving disproportionate attention and resources compared to other marginalized groups, raising questions about whether this represents genuine concern for Jewish safety or a strategic effort to limit pro-Palestine activism.
Rise of Antisemitism ....Added:
[music] You don't like [music] [music] Heat. Heat. Heat.
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[music] [music] >> [music] [music] >> Hey everybody, happy Tuesday.
How are we? How are we? Cheers. Cheers.
If you don't have your your tea or your juice or your water, what? [laughter] Go get some. We're going to be having some good conversations today and um it's so much needed. Oh my god, what the hell is going on with this world? Now, for those of you in the UK, you know the local elections are coming up and it is absolutely insane how um all these different parties from the Labor Party to um to reform and the Conservative Party are trying to get rid of the of the Green Party. It's I it just tells you that it it's wild. the Green Party that nobody was paying attention to in the last election cycle that made no waves in God knows how many election cycles before and now the the the party that that has all these all these other parties are united against them. And that tells you that the Green Party must be doing something must be doing something that's making them scared. By the way, before I get into it, go get your drinks. Settle in. Drop your hellos. Let me know you're in the house. Drop your hells. We have a few things to to get into tonight. Now, yes, in about 30 minutes, we're going to get into a whole conversation about what the hell the government is doing. The government is basically what it sounds like to many of us, they're saying there's a national crisis of anti-semitism.
And because of this, they're going to the PM K star says he might just he might just stop stop all of the pro Palestine marches. Um and this is following the um appalling knife stabbing of two Jews and a Muslim man.
Um where was it last week? And following that and only focusing on what happened to the two Jewish men, Khalma says they're going to take quite um a different approach to people's rights to protest against against Israel. So, let's explore what the hell is going on with that. Hey, Iraham. Hello. Hello. Hello. How are How are we doing?
Hello. Uh, Flaky, I think you're trying to say hello, too. But hello to you, Flaky. Uh, people, drop your hellos. Let me know you're around. Get your drinks.
Who's sending me an angry sign?
[laughter] [gasps] Drop your hellos. Let me know you're in town. When I say in town, I mean you're in the house, okay? that you're here and you're ready to dialogue, to conversate, and um and any questions you have while the guests are here, please feel free to drop them. And any comments you have as well, comments, questions, statements, let me know. Hey, Nazia. Nazia says, "Hello." Hello. Hello. Hello to you too.
Hey Joel. How you doing? I think this is a better time for all of us. You know, I tried that whole 7:00 p.m. thing, but I think most of you were like, "Nah, I'm going to show up around 8."
[laughter] So, it's all good. It's really good to see you guys. Drop your hells. Drop your hells. I think the conversation that we're going to have later on today with the guests is a really important one.
[gasps] Donald says, "Okay, Philadelphia is in the house." Hey, Philly, how we doing?
>> [laughter and gasps] >> Good to see you. Oh, okay. So, Flaky, you were trying to say hello. Hello to you, too. Hello to you, too.
It's always so much more fun when um I can interact with you guys, you know, or else I just keep I just end up talking to the screen and it's kind of like with my with my husband. My kids are like, "Oh, is she talking to herself again?"
Oh, listen. Listen. Oh, Donald, you're very kind. Sending you love. Thank you so much. Thank you. I appreciate it.
500. Hello. Hey to you too. How we do?
And it's only Tuesday. It is only Tuesday. Oh my goodness. All right.
Okay. So to is it Ton? Yeah. Tonsia Moon Girl says, "Yes, we are anti-Israel. We most definitely are. We are anti- anything any anything construct any state any any people I don't care who person individual that is progenocide we are against genocide so we we're not into that hey Jen Jen says hello from Canadian in Cornwall hello's in the house and Canada is in the house too we love to see it we love to see it we thank you I thank you so much okay let me start with this. Okay. Um I think this kind of cracked me the heck up. So you know the Reform Party up, they're hoping to take over from the tries.
They're really really hoping. They think that they the next be the best best thing to the Conservative party. And I don't know if many of you know that Nigel Farage, who runs the Reform Party, has basically imported a lot of um Tory MPs. So for I think for a lot of us we're thinking reform is not new. Reform is just conservative regurgitated. I don't know about you but why would you be importing all of these conservative MPs if you are meant to be something different from the conservative party.
Anyway, this made me you know cackle one of these MPs or one of these um uh reform people that wants to stand for office. He was caught out and racist.
>> You've spoken about >> so they're going they're confront confronting him here because of his racist post. I mean literally just >> you've spoken about white people as the master race.
>> I don't recall that at all.
>> You see this one here?
>> Yeah.
>> You see there?
>> No.
>> Essex Priy Stuart Prior.
>> I do not recall that at all.
>> And then here it's obviously an ex. You see this one here? He must be taking lessons from the royal family. You know, recollections may vary. [laughter] >> Yeah.
>> You see there, >> Essex Priary, Stuart Prior.
>> I do not recall that at all. Blind me.
And >> then here it's obviously an ex- Labour MP who's tweeting about a woman of Punjabi heritage being raped in a racist attack. And you've put good repit.
>> No, that's that's this isn't this isn't me. I'm >> It is him. Those those are his posts and this is the kind of people they want to put in public office.
>> Do you know Do you know how we know that this is you?
>> Do you know how we know that this is you, Stuart?
>> How do you know that?
>> You've tweeted a picture of your house on this on this account, >> right?
>> This this house.
>> Okay.
>> It shows that plant there. You've got a dog, haven't you?
>> I do have a dog.
>> Yeah. You've tweeted a picture of that dog >> from this account. So, that's how we know it's yours. You've tweeted a picture of the front here at this house.
>> Okay. I don't recall these tweets that you >> Another one here. You've talked about immigrants a cancer.
>> This looks like it's something that's been kind of created against me.
>> Nobody created it against you, Stuart.
You tweeted those posts. You have been cut out. You know what I say? Racist and dumb. Abso freakingutely. They did not He did not think he would be caught out.
He didn't think somebody would do the necessary homework and catch him out.
And listen to him standing and go, I don't recollect. I don't think it this is me. It is you. I mean, I love the power they went, uh, yeah, we know it's you because you you tweeted a photo of your house and your dog. These are the kind of people that reform Nigel Farage's reform party is full of, but because they want to run for office, the local council, the local elections on Thursday, they're now trying to backtrack. No, no, no, no. The internet does not forget and we don't forget. And I hope people are using the the brain that God gave them. Reform has nothing to offer you. The conservatives have nothing to offer you. Labor has nothing to offer you. I mean, it's it's ridiculous. It is absolut freakingly ridiculous. Joel says when confronted, they can't admit their racist comments.
Obviously, it's exactly. And they knew when he knew when he was posting that it was wrong. He didn't care because, you know, this is racist Britain. I can do what I want. But the moment he's confronted, nah. Now it's not me. I don't recollect. And and the thing is a lot of this racism that we experience and misogyny that comes from people like him are not prosecuted. They're not prosecuted. But I promise you, if he had said something anti-Semitic, yeah, the med police would have been all over him like a freaking rash. But hey, you know, uh, Five Hind say the worst part is they feel this way and speak this way behind closed doors and their supporters believe it too. Exactly. This is why I expect us as voters to use our God-given sense. You know, I if the if the leader is a racist, the party is racist. if they're members of the party who are racist, misogynist, you know, if they express uh you know, all these expressions of of hate and they've not been kicked out of the party, then the party is not where you you ought to be if it's not going to be tackled. But this is exactly what I mean. This is exactly what I mean. Now, this is something. Let me show you this one that also cackled me because I swear white people, they they're they are not original. They are not. Listen, the cauacity of white people is not original. They regurgitate the same hate, the same false equivalent of oppression that there the same, you know, um, insecurity and inferiority complex every single time. Now, were you guys aware that this GB news what's what's her face? GB News commentator wants to sue 10,000 intern um charity wants to sue them for not offering internships to white people.
You know what she's trying to do here? I mean, this girl clearly does not know her history. This girl clearly thinks there's a false equivalent of oppression. All of these white people she wants to claim are are not in a they they already in first of all they're already in a privileged position that these 10,000 black students are not because the entire system is set up to serve whiteness first. But before I go into it, let me play this. Let me play this video here.
>> The recent reports that >> Hold on one second.
>> GB news. So, this is um hold on one second. One second. Yeah, this is Kane Kawasaki and I want to play his video because I think he does an excellent job of really explaining what this commentator's issue is and I mean her racist issue and quite frankly the importance of the work that the 10,000 um black interns charity does just >> commentator is seeking to bring legal action against 10,000 black interns.
[music] Firstly, it's important to recognize the impact of 10,000 black interns. The organization continues to deliver measurable results. This year alone, it has impacted over a thousand underrepresented young people into professional roles. Given the wellocumented disparities in unemployment rates [music] between young black individuals and their white counterparts, initiatives like this are not only valuable but essential in building pathways to opportunity and equality. [music] In contrast, the proposed legal action by the commentator, which he is fundraising for, appears to lack a substantive foundation. 10,000 Black Interns is a UK [music] registered charity operating within the framework of section 158 of the Equality Act of [music] 2010. This provision explicitly allows for positive action to address persistent under [music] representation. The organization's programs are both legal and rooted in evidence. Unfortunately, the need for such initiatives remain clear. Research from Nutfield College has shown that applicants with Nigerian or South Asian heritage sounding names may need to submit up to 80% more applications due to CV name discrimination. The same study also found that black and Asian candidates continue to face levels of discrimination in hiring that have remained largely unchanged since the 1970s. This underscores why targeted interventions are still necessary.
Separately, it's also important to reflect on broader social environments.
The response to a recent year 11's crowning video highlights a reality that many young people are still exposed to racism online. [music] These experiences do not exist in isolation. They often carry through into employment. For these reasons, it's imperative that we all, especially allies, support organizations like 10,000 black interns. This can include raising awareness, amplifying their work, donating where possible, or contributing professional expertise including proono legal supported disparity.
>> I think that um he he really really explains it well. This is Kane Kawasaki.
I think if you're not following him on Instagram, follow Kane Kawasaki on Instagram. Uh he explains it really well. I think the bottom line here is that there is still a desperate need for positive action to place black youths at least on on on on an equal playing field, equal playing ground as white students. And and it's so important that our society recognizes that that need has not gone away. And it's because that need still exists that charities like 10,000 black interns exist. And what this Sophie what's what's her face in it again? Sophie Kakuran wants to try to play here. She's accusing organizations like 10,000 Black Interns. She's literally accusing them of discrimination or based on race, which is [ __ ] Okay? It's utter nonsense.
What they don't want, what people like her don't want is for black and brown students to have that level playing field as white students do. White students don't have to worry that their name alone would would cause them to be excluded. They don't have to worry about facing racial discrimination at work.
They it's not something that they experience, period. and charities like 10,000 Black interns are it's it's there to be able to ensure that black interns, black students get that positive, you know, that positive action of work experience and a and professional experience that can help lead the way.
The government isn't doing it. There's a gap and these charities like 10,000 black interns stepped into that gap. And what white um British people like her, not all of them, but like her, they want to cause, they want to take away from black youths the opportunities that black people are trying to create for black youth by stepping into that gap and saying, "Okay, nobody is no one's trying to help us here. Let us do the facilitation. Let us facilitate. Let's let's um give them skills. let's help them all of that. But they want to take that away. She's what she's trying to do here is claim a false equivalent of oppression, which is BS. There is no oppression. There's no what what did 10,000 black interns charities try to achieve here is equality, some measure just to give um 10,000 black students, black young professionals a fighting chance. even that they want to take away from us. So I think we should watch this space. I might actually do I might actually do a um a guest slot with them so that they can talk about what they do and why it is important to fight this. She's fundraising.
She is fundraising to sue this this charity. Well, if the charity is fundraising, I'm going to help amplify their fundraising because they have they have to fight this and they must win. We need we need charities like them. It's they their work is incredibly important. Now, I don't know how many of you are aware, right? uh you know following the golden green um the appalling attack uh by the mentally ill uh black man um who attacked a Muslim man and also two Jewish men. This has led to a whole load of conversation right online and offline and all of these political leaders especially like Kem Bay have come out once again showing us their true colors.
She wants to ban protests, the the pro Palestinian protests, and she's also positioning this as there is something specific that Jewish people are experiencing that nobody else is. I I want you to take a listen to this because as I heard us speak, my my my blood consider one second. Let me see if I can get rid of this. Get rid of that and let me play >> against the march that's planned for the same day as the pro Palestinian march May the 16th. The rally being organized by Steven Yakley Lenon, Tommy Robinson, a convicted far-right activist. Would you consider banning that?
>> Well, is he clear? Is is he creating a climate of intimidation and violence that is resulting in two people murdered in Heaton Park, two people nearly murdered in in Gold's Green? I'm not saying that we shouldn't have a right to protest. There is something specific that is happening at these marches that is different from the sorts of protests we've seen uh previously. Let's you know people are not protesting about domestic issues. They're protesting about international issues. It's costing us a fortune. It's resulting in the normalization of violence towards a minority group. I think that we need have a right to protest.
This is where [clears throat] Kem I mean on any normal day Kemi pisses me off.
Let me not lie. As many of you would know on any normal day she opens her mouth and I'm thinking what the hell is wrong with this woman the the Tommy Robinson she's defending here. This is Tommy Robinson.
>> These are Tommy Robinson's marches. protest.
This is the Tommy Robertson marches where they say falah where they they make all this really disgusting scam of co anti-Muslim bigoted statements and chants. This is a Tommy Robinson march where you had >> there's still hope. You are still the majority. So you either fight for this nation or you let all of these rapist Muslims and corrupt politicians take over.
>> This this this is who she's defending.
This is who can be bait specific that is happening.
>> She's basically saying well really there it doesn't matter what's happening to Muslims. Whatever is happening to Muslims in the United Kingdom does not compare to what is happening to Jewish people. A and this is exactly part of the problem where there is an unequal treatment to how minorities so when I say minorities I you know marginalized communities are being treated unequal. the the the standard the hypocrisy and double standards it's just it's mindboggling and the fact that chem feels so confident that she can come out and state this un undermine what is going on with the Muslim community not find grace to say yes I can see what is happening to the Muslim community. I mean there was a Muslim woman who was run over Rakar not a pin from any of these politicians at least there were 50 mosques um within a space of a few months last year that were attacked not not pe not a sound from the prime minister or any of these politicians and even the fact that all of these marches that they claim are targeted against British Jews which are not has these marches has only had one purpose which is to oppose genocide to oppose apathide to oppose supremacy.
This is what I'm saying. We we exist in a society that has lost its godforsaken mind. And this let me just play this uh Sky News.
>> Let me start from the beginning. So >> this is really interesting.
After the uh golden screen stabbing which we all know that the media and politicians they refused to talk about the Muslim man. They in fact this Muslim man did not exist. Nobody was paying attention to him. Right.
Some of what we were hearing was, well, why doesn't anybody care about the Jewish community? Why isn't everybody doing enough? Why aren't the anti-racists coming out um to speak up for for Jewish people? And even I I I won't lie, I was I was dumbfounded. I'm like, I'm sorry, what? How do you not have everybody speaking about you? How do you not have everyone from the politicians to the police to every conversation online and offline only being uh you know about the Jewish community about how they feel and about what happened to the two Jewish men and nobody's talking about the Muslim man.
Nobody's talking about the Muslim community. Nobody's talking about anything else. It's I'm dumbfounded.
This response by Natasha Devon, if you guys don't follow her on Instagram, please go do so. Natasha Deon has her own show on LBC and this question posed by um Sky News broadcaster. Her response to it is chef's kiss. Listen, >> this accusation all the time that and let me start again.
>> I hear this accusation all the time that anti-racism groups don't do enough to be inclusive of Jewish people. So I just want to try and pour some clarity on that if I can. When that appalling stabbing happened, Karma called a Cobra meeting. He got together some leading thinkers to ask what more can be done to tackle anti-semitism. The Met police called for more funding to protect Jewish communities. The media gave it pretty much its und diverted attention for days. That is the correct response.
>> That response did not happen when a Muslim woman was um targeted by a hit and run which happened just the other month. when a woman who was sick was um targeted by a racial attack because the perpetrator a sexual attack thought that she was a Muslim. When 50 mosques were targeted between June and October of 2025, we don't see the same response.
Anti-racism campaigners are looking at where the need is. When these appalling attacks happen to the Jewish community, we have the correct response. when it happens to other communities, whether that's women, whether that's LGBTQ people, whether it's black people, whether it's Muslims, not the same urgency.
>> Exactly. It's not the same response. And this is what people are trying to highlight and they're raising awareness of because there's clearly a double standard. But for you to even mention it, oh my god, that's anti-semitic. Now, says, "Are the Jews attending these pro Palestine marches now also anti-semitic?" They are not anti-semitic and yeah there thousands of Jewish people who show up at these marches. In fact, they're right there front and center and they make it clear that what Israel is doing does not represent their Jewish identity or their Jewish faith.
So I it's it's mindboggling that media continue to parade the voices of um you know of those who represent Israel and those who want Israel to carry on and they I I hardly see them ever platform anti-ionist Jews. I hardly see them ever platform Jewish people who are so strongly u they have that strong opinion that this is wrong and our country should not be should not be complicit in it. And that's one of the reasons why those protest marches happen because people are like the UK government is directly complicit in this genocide. It has to stop. It it it just beggars believe that this happens all the time.
And so these conversations, it just feels really really um what's the best word to use? Not not only is it divisive, it's it's to me it distracts from any form of unity whereby we have to recognize that Muslims are experiencing a lot of hate. But for you to even talk about Muslims, for you to even talk about British Palestinians, it's almost as though people start to complain. But you're taking the light away from what British Jewish people experiencing. That's not what anyone's trying to do. We're saying, can't you give both communities that same, you know, response? Can't Can't we all care?
But this is what we'll be tackling and discussing with uh with our guests in a couple of minutes time. Let me let me get some more uh comments in. Let's see.
Uh oh, JK says Tommy Robinson is funded by the Zionist Jews. He was in the Hebrew Files, was he? No idea. Joel says, "You love Natasha's response."
Yeah, I know. It's just beautiful. The way she delivered that so calmly. I don't think I have the calmness.
I think when God was giving her calmness and patience, I wasn't on that queue. I must have been feeding my face somewhere. Rosie Palmer says, "We can most definitely protest about international issues because our tax is being used to fund a foreign regime committed to destroying Palestinian lives." I agree with you, Rosie. But also, I don't see it as an international issue. I see it as our issue because it is our policy. You know, it's foreign policy. So, for me, that foreign policy is domestic. If we want to change the foreign policy, we have to do it domestically. And that to me is really, really important. Um, okay. Let's see.
Oh my goodness. We have some of our guests are here. We're about to have the conversation. Let me let me let me I'm coming to you. [laughter] So, we have first Helen. Hello. Hello.
Hello. Hello. Thank you so much for joining.
My brother, how are we? How are we?
>> I'm doing very well. How are you all?
>> Oh, thank you both so much for joining.
Um, expecting Ramy soon. Uh, mama, can you try to center yourself a bit? I I don't know. Maybe move your There we go.
There we go.
>> Perfect.
>> And Helen, you're perfect.
>> Absolutely.
>> Thank you so much for joining. Uh, let me just check. Um, how are you both doing?
>> How you feeling today?
>> Good.
>> Good. Good.
>> Apart from world politics.
>> Oh my god. I know. I know. It's I'm doing my best for it not to drive me mad. But um this is exactly why I need this conversation [laughter] so that I don't go mental by myself.
And Muhammad, how you doing?
>> Yeah, I'm doing well. You know, trying to make sense of the madness and uh trying to connect the dots because there's a lot of people there are a lot of people out there who are paying a lot of money to prevent us from having these conversations and from from reaching people. So, you know, the fight continues every day.
>> It does continue. And you you are absolutely right. I love the way you frame that that there are lots of people, lots of money who don't want us to have these conversations. Rabbit is Hello. Hello. Let me put bring her to the stage. Hello, my sister. Are you here? Let me see if I brought you on.
Hello. Excellent. You're muted. You're muted. On mute.
>> Hello.
>> Hello, people. We are all here. Are you ready for this conversation? This is a conversation you're not going to find on mainstream media. Okay, which is why we we need to arrange it ourselves. So, let me just start with a like a brief introduction. Now, if you do not know Dr. Ram Aladwan, okay, I need you to follow her on X and on Instagram. Dr. Ram is a British Palestinian NHS doctor who has been oh my goodness persecuted to such extent by dead police by the Zionists. She's been arrested like five times for what? As as for what? For nothing that makes sense. She's been speaking up for Palestinians speaking out against the actions of Israel. They don't like it. Muhammad is an educator storyteller mindset with U. Muhammad, he does some really really great like really calm, you know, drinking tea and really like breaking down nuggets videos. And I'm thinking, how's he doing that without screaming? Because usually my videos, I'm I'm literally screaming at somebody or laughing because I can only do one of the two. You guys should definitely follow him on Instagram. Now, Helen, I need you guys to wake up to Helen Marks. I don't Helen, you're not on social media, are you?
>> No.
>> No, >> particularly. But I think Helen is a badass. Helen right here, right, was one of the uh she was a former Labor um party member who was falsely accused of anti-semitism just a few years ago. And she's Jewish. She did nothing wrong. She spoke up for Palestine. She spoke out against what Israel is doing. But the powers that be thought that what they could do was to weaponize one of the you know worst expressions of hate against Jewish people against a Jewish person to remove her. Listen wherever she is what you can do is read up on what happened.
This was in 2023 was it Helen?
>> Um bit earlier >> particularly after the um panorama program. Ah yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes. So I I just want you guys to know that Jewish people in this country who are speaking truth to power are being persecuted and we have to stand by our Jewish brothers and sisters our antionist Jewish brothers and sisters because they are in the line of fire like we are. But let's get to the topic of conversation people. I have to ask a question. Are we dealing with a national crisis of anti-semitism or do you think it's a it's an opportunistic crisis manufactured to manufactured basically to m for consent to censor opposition to Israel?
Let let me let me start with you Helen.
What do you think?
>> In a way I think it's both.
I think what happened is that we did during the Corbin days we did have a witch hunt. They turned Corbyn >> into a racist when everybody knew that if you had to pick anybody out of parliament who was anti-racist who stood up for the Jewish community in Islington in North Yeah.
um it would be Corbyn, >> but they turned him into a monster.
>> And I think I at that time I thought this is going to be really bad for the reputation of Jewish people in this country and it's going to ferment anti-semitism.
I know this will be really unpopular with Zionists for me to say that but I really believe we are getting now we are we are getting the backlash of that. Um and as a Jew um I have to be scared now as well. I don't I don't go through every day worrying about whether I'm going to be attacked but I think things have got worse. But I do think people are failing to acknowledge that there was a winch hunt and they're failing also to make the connection with what Israel is doing in Palestine.
So you've drawn to disconnect the two. M you've drawn a connection between the um the conditions that started before the Gaza genocide which has basically created this environment of weaponizing anti-semitism against anybody they don't like. designers don't like and that there's a direct correlation and connection to what we're seeing today because they did it then they they they've it almost feels as though they they've they they've harnessed the the the means and method of doing it in every single situation. But Ramy, what do you think?
Do you think we there's a national crisis of anti-semitism or do you think it's a manufactured crisis to censor opposition to Israel?
You're you're muted.
>> I think the government is saying there's a there's a national crisis. So they are defining it as such. So their definition of that are the the attacks that have happened. So, uh, the ambulance attacks, the, um, the the killing of the two Jews in in Manchester, and the stabbing last, um, last week. Is there Can we Is there any more that they're adding to this?
>> I think those are the key ones. Those are the key ones they use as the examples.
>> So, I I wouldn't even, you know, I don't even think that there is a uh a discussion about whether it is or not.
It is. That's what they're saying it is.
So for them that is what constitutes a national crisis. Now would that constitute a national crisis if the victims were Muslim Christian Hindu seek? I don't think so. And I think that is the problem.
And I agree because yeah, as I me as Natasha said in a video, Natasha Devon in a video I played earlier, there was the Muslim woman who was run over. Yeah, the Muslim woman hijab who was run over there over like 50 mosques that were attacked. Um there all of these cases of discrimination and attacks against Muslims that that did not constitute a national crisis. So you're right. It seems as though it depends on who the um the victims are. Muhammad, what do you think?
>> Yeah. Muhammad, what do you think?
[snorts] >> Well, I think um what we're seeing right now is not something new. I mean throughout history we we've seen how anti-semitism has been weaponized and it's almost as if the guilty projections of Europeans is being projected upon the rest of us right and whilst I acknowledge that there is of course anti-semitism rising um not just in the UK and Europe there's also rising isophobia there's also rising violence towards women you know which which we don't talk bad enough. And what is happening now is any form of, you know, any conversations that we're trying to have are being shut down as anti-semitic. It's it's pure gaslighting and it's pure, you know, manipulation of language. And I I also had this an issue with the term anti-Semitic because Israel has murdered over 100,000 Seemetic people, >> people. And most of my Jewish friends who I I've met over my my life here in London, they tell me we're not seemetic people. You know, our ancestors are from Lithuania, Poland, you know, Germany. We see ourselves as British because we've integrated into society here. So, I would argue that the murder of 100,000 Palestinians, thousands of Lebanese, thousands of people around Asia is anti-semitism. So, it's about time we reclaim words. We reclaim narratives. At the moment, what we're seeing is we're seeing words being manipulated. Even with a word like inif, which is an Arabic word, yet we've got these Western pundits, these Europeans trying to translate our words for us. And >> what do you know about what inif means?
You know, you know, I'm I'm not translating your words for you, even though I speak your language, which is why I'm using your language to decolonize everything that you're telling me. But who are you to translate my words our words for us >> right? So as you often use the word caucassacity of it is something that I find mindboggling and this is why I'm all about advocating for us as those of us who are resisting this to to think of it as an intellectual defa we need to up rise up against the way language has been manipulated because that is the first battleground you know the way words are used and misused and of course LBC is a massive battleground and a massive respect to Natasha for using her platform to to constantly speak out on this.
>> No, I cannot I can't.
>> Can I add something to that?
>> Yes.
>> I think Israel has behaved in an incredibly anti-semitic way. And the example of that is you will actually hear um Israeli members of the cabinet say Israel wouldn't survive without anti-semitism. It thrives on anti-semitism. It needs anti-semitism in the rest of the world to populate Israel. So you'll see Netanyahu rushing when there's any anti-semitic um event like in France, he rushed there.
>> Yes.
>> And he said to people, you're not safe in your country. You have to come to Israel.
>> Right.
So, Israelis don't like people, Jews like me in the diaspora to settle down and be live in harmony with others. No.
Because that's not good for Israel.
Israel wants the Jews to go the Zionist.
>> Yeah.
>> And is and the government now wants people to go to Israel. So you're saying that the Zites Jews thrive on Jews in the diaspora living in or making feeling and living in fear so that they can drive them to come live in in Israel.
>> Definitely.
>> Can I do another a word thing that just like um sort of so-called anti-semitism, I I now refer to it as anti-Jewish discrimination, right? So I think that's more accurate. But another thing that I I always sort of think about when it's being said is when people say um Jews in the diaspora, I always think, are you saying that you do have a clinic? I don't think that's correct.
>> I think one second. I think Muhammad is trying to change and then we have a >> Sorry, pardon me. Pardon me. Pardon. I think mommy, you need to switch off your other device, please.
>> I know. It's giving us some surround sound.
>> I'm wondering I don't Is it my mic?
>> No, I don't think it's you. I think um I think Muhammad came on twice.
>> Oh, where where has Okay, good. I think Muhammad came on twice and let me put him back on. I think he's back on now.
>> Hey, Muhammad.
>> We can hear you. We can hear you. So, to your point, Ramy, you were saying >> so. Well, yeah. So, when people say um the Jewish diaspora, I actually I I find it really um distasteful. I think um the Palestinians outside of Palestine of the Palestinian diaspora because otherwise you're saying that a for example a British Jew who is a British person who of the Jewish religion has a claim to Palestine. So, I think that's another word that we need to decolonize there.
>> What do you say, Helen? What do you say to that? No, I can see that point. I can.
>> Yeah. Okay. That's that's something new and something I've learned. So, learning unpicked this moment. Thank you very much. This is why we're here to educate each other. I think that's so important.
But I think that the point um Helen raised as well about how Israel and particularly Zionist Jews thrive on when negative things happen to Jewish people in all of these other countries in order to that they thrive on Jewish people feeling scared and that by being scared they want them to come to come to Israel. That that's the method or weapon that fear they weaponize it to make them move to Israel. That's to do cuz I have seen I I I won't lie in the past two and a half years it it started to I started to notice these things and I thought are these people literally salivating that something has happened to a Jewish person because the way they jump at it the way they they change the narrative because think about it two innocent Jewish men were stabbed in Golden Scream by a mentally ill black man. How does that link to pro Palestine marches? How does a mentally ill black man who has a history of stabbing, who has stabbed Muslims, police officers who are probably Christian, stabbed even a police dog, was um you know in a psychiatric hospital because of his actions and was also in prison. How does that how does that turn into anti-semitism?
What it is is a criminal knife crime.
Definitely, especially the more you learn about what the man has done. But what I'm trying to drive out here is how they immediately weaponize that that awful appalling knife crime to try to use it to censor opposition to basically say, you see, this is what happens when people go globalized in father and free Palestine from the river to the sea. I'm like, neither it's they're not connected. What do you guys think? Ramy, >> I mean I I agree with you. I think there is a unholy alliance between the pro-Israel Zionist Jewish lobby whatever and um the establishment. So the pro-Israel lobby doesn't doesn't want the protests. You know, the all actions are effective and you know they just they don't want Palestine action. Of course, they they don't want protest.
They just don't want opposition to Israel. So, of course, there that's one goal is that they're going to >> get take anything to try and justify it.
Now, if we had an unoccupied government um or and if we had a government that wasn't so hellbent on pushing a police state >> Yeah.
>> as well, then this wouldn't be happening. But our establishment is going, "Oh, perfect. You want it shut down. We are aligned with you in terms of Zionism and we want to push, you know, in terms of the military-industrial complex and the police stating perfect. This is like the most horrendous coupling that you can think of that just serves all of the terrible levels in society to suppress the citizens. But I think what isn't talked about enough is that the Palestine movement is used as a sort of scapegoat.
But it it it's like because the Palestine movement is almost kind of uh sort of I would say it's like it it's not really I mean a lot of people are in it but there's certain aspects of society that are are very infested with Zionism and they are just not supporting the Palestine movement against the establishment when you think they would be. for example, the civic nationalists, they're I mean the entire thing of sort of the so-called nationalists is being against the establishment, but they're seeing that, okay, they're going to ban repeat protests. We've got counterterrorism laws being, you know, placed on on people. Uh they're going to increase hate speech laws. I mean, those are all the things that you think all the right-wingers be outraged about, but because they're using the Palestine movement and it's like, oh, these sort of third worlders, oh, this is a a whatever cause. This is like a leftist cause. We don't have that unity of the public to stop it. But once these things are put through, they're going to apply to everybody. just like that person I think yesterday who said, "Well, if you um if you believe that the Palestine movements are sort of intimidating to Jews," and then they said, "Which they are." And I thought, "Well, no." Um then they should be banned, then okay, fine.
Then we can ban the Tommy Robinson march.
>> Yes. Exactly. But it's above. It's like they even went further than just the Zionist uh the thing and and their own uh kind of goals to say okay actually what is the what is the most superior thing is the the forcing of the police state I'll go with that which is ridiculous.
>> Exactly. I mean this makes me think Helen that what you know as a Jewish person especially as an anti-Zionist Jew do you think that at the at the crux of this Muhammad if you could please mute just on the >> Hi sorry I'm having a lot of troubles hearing today but I just heard Dr. Rah speak. I heard you speak earlier. Now I'm trying to coordinate my sound. Um but just to um pick up on what Rah said there you know the the hypocrisy of double standards now right now is just laid bare. It's naked. It's for it's there for everyone to see. Even those people who were not sympathetic to the Palestinian cause initially are now seeing the the sheer hypocrisy and the the way in which our our civil liberties are being just stripped away. Um, and what this is doing is in many respects it is waking people up to see not just the Palestinian cause, but just how embedded uh, Zionism is in [clears throat] the British establishment. It's not this not just a case of Britain sending arms to Israel.
You know, Britain essentially Britain created the state of Israel. you know, we know that from historically, but also the political system is is engineered to ensure Israel's security, Israel's um you know, legitimacy on the international stage. Um the complicity that that the British the establishment has in terms of the genocide and the continued dehumanization of Palestinians goes way beyond arms deals and and and handshakes with Netanyahu. It's embedded within our media class. We've seen that very clearly. You know, was it the the Telegraph was it where one of one of the boss of the Telegraph said that if you don't support Israel, then that you're not going going to be a part of our me as a staff. Also, you see the way Rakh has been treated treated. You know that there's a doctor who served in the IDF who boasted about committing atrocities upon children. Yet, to my understanding, he's still practicing.
>> He's not been arrested five times, has not had his civil liberties stripped away. So then again, go back to what I said earlier, people are beginning to see the double standards. People are beginning to see why there seems to be one rule applied for some people and not to others. And one more thing I'll add to that is that children are very good at noticing double standards and noticing injustices. And children as young as 10 years old are now beginning to ask those questions. The kind of questions that I wasn't asking when I was 10 years old.
>> Why are Palestinians prisoners? Why are Israelis hostages? And this is what this this gives me hope because we're now having those conversations now. So I think yes, it's it's horrible. Yes, it's nasty to see just how insidious this all is. But a silver lining in this all is that people people are not stupid. You know, despite what you may see on social media, people are waking up and seeing this for what it is. And this is, you know, people again, they're not necessarily Palestinian supporters, but they're being drawn to this cause because it's again, like Rahman said, it's not just the Palestinians tomorrow.
They're going to come for you. They're going to come for >> the next group. So, they're already coming for us. I mean, they're already coming for us. I I don't have to be Palestinian. I don't have to be Muslim.
They're coming for us. I I was interrogated by the police. But in fact, Ramen, one of your posts that I retweeted, the police asked me, "Well, why did you retweet this post?" In my mind, I'm thinking, "Did you actually drag my my black ass here to ask me such a dumbass question, but I I promised my lawyer to be good, so I kept no comment."
>> Could I could I just pick up what Muhammad was saying about the establishment? Yes, please.
>> I don't know how many people are aware.
It has been in the the news, but it isn't really made much of that our cabinet, most of our cabinet have received massive donations from [clears throat] people like Chin, you know, from the Jewish lobby.
>> Um, so that's right in the heart of government, isn't it?
>> It is.
>> And this protection of Israel has gone on forever.
like the western countries helped Israel get a nuclear weapon.
>> Yep. Yep. Yeah. Who >> did our media make it plain to the rest of you to to our public and our readership that they had uh I heard David um Millie band he was interviewed one time and he was asked about that you know what do you think and he said well um Israel isn't party to the non-prololiferation treaty as though that was a an answer secret. So I think Muhammad's right all the time there's protection and when you said Muhammad that uh more children were um asking questions there is still quite a difficulty getting schools to allow discussions about what's going on in Israel and Palestine.
>> [clears throat] >> We've tried >> and uh it's been incredibly difficult and yet they allow Zionists to go into schools to talk about the Holocaust in a very biased way.
>> Exactly.
>> So I think there is a major problem.
Also um as Liverpool Friends of Palestine, we try and uh we try and hire rooms to show films to have meetings. It's become so difficult. We are being shut down.
[clears throat] Although there's an attempt to shut us down.
>> Wow.
>> Um I I think it's it's very very worrying. It is. I we clearly live in a Zionist state, but this may I have to ask I want to ask this question, but I'm going to pose it to to Helen first.
Helen, do you feel that the root of all this Zionist pervasion and the way it's pervaded our society um do you think the root of it is supremacy, Zionist Jewish supremacy?
But I think certainly in the modern times since um since the end of the Victorian age, since the 19th century and when Zionism was beginning to um be discussed, um yes, Zionism is a supremacist political ideology.
>> It is >> um it's an expansionist ideology. It's a racist ideology.
Um, and Britain has given air to this, haven't they?
>> Yep. And the thing is, they don't allow us to have these conversations without attacking us with, "Oh, you're being submitted because everything you said >> getting arrested."
>> Exactly. That's what they arrested um Dr. Ramy for because Zionism is racism.
Zionism is supremacy. Zionism is all of these evil things. Dr. about me.
>> I I would say that yes, Zionism is definitely supremacy.
Okay, there's it's very simple if you if you ask so Zionism is the establish establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine, right? So if you ask most Palestinians in or out of Palestine, um what's happened? They will say that a Jew has stolen my home or stolen my land. Okay, why can't you have it? because I'm not Jewish.
>> It that's that is this that is how simple the Palestinian cause is.
>> Yes, >> that's it. Okay. And why did they steal your home? Because their god said that it's theirs. Okay. It's not my God though, >> right? So why why do they get to say that land is a a scripture is equals a land deed?
I don't know. Why has the international community allowed it? don't know.
>> Hold on. I I need that statement you just said. I need I need I need it to sink in. I need people I needed to mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar mar marinate. You said a scripture has equal a land deed.
>> That sums it up.
>> That's it. So, so actually when people say Zionism is racism, that doesn't explain how I, as a Palestinian, can have my house stolen by a black Ethiopian Jew.
>> Explain it.
>> Now, people people say, "What? No, but Jews between themselves, for example, in Israel, there's racism." Yes. So a for example a Ukrainian Jew who is white can will be could be racist to a Yemeni Arab Jew or a black Ethiopian Jew.
There's racism everywhere in the world.
But all of them the Yemeni Jew, the Ethiopian, the Ukrainian, the Polish, they can all steal my land because I'm not Jewish. So Zionism is not racism.
Zionism is supremacism of one particular group and it is discrimination against everyone not in that group.
>> Okay. So I agree with you to an extent but I disagree when you say Zionism is not racism because Zionism works exactly like white supremacy does. So the way white supremacy does is what it does is this you have the white you have the black you have the brown. So maybe you know black people we always say and we all see this that black people are always at the bottom of the br and then you have almost like Asians at the buffer. So what is happening with the Ethiopian Jew is the white Jewish supremacist i.e. The Zionist have said they will prefer a black Jew over a Palestinian whose land it belongs to.
Yes.
>> So the the racism Yeah. Yeah. But the racism and the supremacist construct is what is allowing a black Ethiopian Jew to take land from a Palestinian. It's not the black Listen, the black person does not have the the power. The power rests in the construct that the white folks are running. That is where racism comes in. So multiple truths are existing here.
>> I see what you mean. Those are separate systems that exist.
the one system that allows this black Jew, white Jew, brown Jew, Chinese Jew to take land in Palestine or to the reason why they will murder a Palestinian, a Persian Iranian, a Lebanese, the three uh world central kitchen British people, Rachel Cy, Tom Tom Hurdle, uh black international activists, the Turkish activist shot in the head. That reason is because all of these people are not Jews.
>> Yes.
>> And I don't racialize Jews. That's a harmful 19th century western concept. I do not racialize Jews. I think that's terrible.
>> Jews are not a race though. So >> it comes from we already said it. It's the the scripture is a landi. So it's it's religious supremacism.
I would argue that Zionism is so sorry someone said here Rama is dropping bars. You are dropping bars.
You are listen you should write a book.
I will buy it.
>> I've been thinking so much about this but it is in in the end it's religious supremacism and I'll tell you why. This is where I win the point but Muhammad you can go. If a Jewish person okay converts to Christianity they cannot claim citizenship under the law of return in Israel and steal my land. So the red line is religion to steal the land. So the supremacism, the red line of it is religious.
>> Could I just >> It's the same thing that that that we saw, you know, when you read history books and you see how Europeans when it settled in North America, in South America, in Australia, it set like colonialism. Zionism is a form of white supremacy. All right? Just if we look through the the historical in, you know, the the the data of the the passages of history, you'll see that it's an extension of European colonialism, right? And we shouldn't be shy to call it for what it is. Zionism is a form of white supremacy. And as Rafa said there, when you so I I've been to Palestine and I've seen how European Jews treat Ethiopian Jews, how they treat Jews that look more like me. And it is even within itself a hierarchal system.
>> Yeah.
>> For me, it's not controversial to talk about Zionism as being racist. I think what we need need to do is start, you know, owning that and being able to talk about it in a way that doesn't py around the fact that this is a form of racism.
The same way we don't tolerate supremacy from any type of of culture. We wouldn't want supremacy, white supremacy. We don't want supremacy from any group. We should be able to call it out. However, the the thing that unfortunately hampers us is the fact that we we're surrounded by structures and systems which protect certain words. So, we can't use Zionism in the same way as racism now.
Otherwise, we get called well get called anti-semitic.
So, just one more thing, I have to go in there because it's prayer time. I just want to say thank you so much for the opportunity to share a platform with you all. Uh apologize for my technical issues. I'm usually quite techsavvy, but for some reason, you know, well, God has handled me now and showed me that, you know what, doesn't matter how techy you are.
>> Someone actually said, somebody actually put a message, Muhammad, and said, >> I look forward to speaking to you all soon.
>> Thank you. Somebody actually put a message and said, "Chill, Muhammad.
Chill with the camera. [laughter] >> Thank you, Muhammad. I appreciate it. I appreciate it." Listen, what Muhammad said, um, Ramen and Helen, what Muhammad said, I think it's absolutely spot on because the reality as well here is that white supremacy and Zionism, which is religious supremacy, as you said, Jewish religious supremacy, they work hand in hand. This is why Zionist Christians support the whole Zionist Jewish supremacy. the religious angle. The Zionist Christians who might go, "Oh my goodness, Israel is, you know, it's a continuation of the biblical kingdom of Israel," which it is not. I'm a Christian. I can tell you for a fact it is not. And um and then the white supremacy angle is that it is a a continuation of the European settler colonization, which is why they support it. I mean to me Israel is a colonial construct of the west in West Asia.
Let's not call it um Middle East because that is let's decolonize our language.
And it it was it's put there deliberately to cause chaos. Put there deliberately. I I I will tell you this after the second world war I mean I wasn't born at that time. I don't think any of us were but we all learned so much about the um about the Holocaust.
Now Helen, you may have family that um that are survivors of of the Holocaust.
Well, a lot of what we know is history.
And that is why when someone like me in the last two three years, my mind is blown watching descendants of Holocaust survivors commit a Holocaust. I I it took me almost like a year. My My brain could not fathom what I was seeing and experiencing, how they were they were justifying it. It's just insane. And I think to Muhammad's point, we have to take the power back. The power back of language. We need to be able to say what it is that we're witnessing is that Zionism is religious supremacy. It is it is it's Zionist Jewish supremacy. It is religious supremacy. It is racism. It is, you know, co coexist with white supremacy. that all of these things, multiple things coexist together because it is there to persecute marginalized groups, persecute anyone that opposes the this colonial construct. And as you can probably see, Helen, especially with your u the experience you had at the Labor Party, it affects us here in Britain. In in Britain, you're experiencing the consequences of if you open your mouth against Zionism or against Israel, you will lose your job.
you will lose your degree, you'll be discredited, you'll be punished. So when they say things to me like Hamas hates you, Hamas will kill you. And I'm thinking, well, Hamas may do that, but what I know for sure is you are the one trying to kill me. You are the one in my backyard. I'm in my front yard. Hamas isn't here, but Zionists are. What What would you say to that, Helen?
Well, first of all, my experience is that I didn't have grandparents on my father's side. They were killed in the Holocaust. And in fact, I'm going in a few weeks time um because the grave of uh my grandmother um was found recently. My father never knew what had happened to his family, but that we've now found the grave. Um, but what what Israel and the Zionists have done is to make Palestinians as though they were responsible for the Holocaust. And I think this is the most disgusting thing that that they've done.
Not only that, right from the start in 48, you know, and around that time before Israel was um created, they were already calling Palestinians Nazis. M >> so and I think people in this country still do not um reject this idea that the Palestinians had nothing to do with the Holocaust. they had the misfortune that the Zionists um who did have a reason, you know, for being worried because there were all these pograms in in Russia and um but that's no excuse.
>> Yeah.
>> For putting that blame onto Palestinians, but people have bought it.
Israel spends millions on the husbar on on uh you know persuading people to their point of view. Why do they have to why do they have to spend so much money?
Because they know that actually what they're saying a lot of the time are lies. So they have to keep manufacturing different stories.
Um I I have to disagree a little bit about this religion bit. the the original Zionists were not really religious.
They were Jewish, but they weren't religious. The Netanyahus of the world um the the the leaders um in this modern time, they weren't they were after territory.
>> Um they then used the religious Jews for their own end. So I don't see it as a basically religious, you know, Jews against Muslims. I see it as people Zionist who want territory and they are trying to get rid of the Palestinians ethnically cleansed to get territory careful about the the religious bit.
>> I and I hear your point Helen. I think the reason why um Ram's point about religious supremacy has validity validity is because it is religion that these Zionists use to >> use it.
>> They use Exactly. They weaponize.
>> They use it but they're not actually >> they're not religious. No religious. No, >> we're talking about the system of oppression of supremacy. So that's what we're describing and I think that's the the backlash that we were getting when the term Jewish supremacism came about because everybody was like whoa whoa whoa whoa and it's like you know a Jewish person may choose to not go colonize Palestine but they can. So the system is that doesn't mean that they will or do or should. So we're describing a system we're not describing people. And so if a system uh selects its colonizers occupiers based upon religion that's what we're describing am I saying and you know the the religious discussion is far far from this you know right now it is just what this system does and how it selects and you know in terms of of the settler colony of Israel it quite literally will not um will refuse a Jew who has converted to Christianity or Islam to do it. So you know that's we're describing that system. So I think it's really important to separate people from system. Um but uh at the same time I think you know there is this and again I'm not saying this is a holy war right. Um be because I I always feel like the Palestine cause is always made to be like okay this is the Jews are who are in Palestine are against Muslims. No, no. The the Zionists, the the Zionist Jewish settlers in Palestine, they are against everybody who is not eligible under their doctrine for the for the land which they want for Jews only. So actually Palest do you know the do you know the percentage of Palestinian Christians who were murdered in Gaza during this genocide? 3% >> of Palestinian Christians have been killed. All three churches, the St. um Proferious um the Holy Family Church, the Baptist Church bombed. All three churches. Um so I think that gets really missed. 30% of Lebanon are are Christians. 35, sorry, this is 30 to 40%. So um and and some some have no faith. Of course, they're a minority, but some don't. And of course, you know, hundreds of thousands of Muslims have been killed, a thousand mosques bombed, churches in in in Lebanon. So again, th this also tells you how this system >> this discriminates against everyone who isn't eligible to be in that group, which is why this is such a universal fight, >> you know, and a white person in Britain cannot cannot steal my land. a a white non-Jewish person cannot steal my land.
So I think there is some people want to say that this is an extension of okay yes there there was European settler colonialism but settler colonialism wasn't only done by Europeans. I'm not I'm not taking away guilt from you know the colonial guilt is is there you and and pal Britain played a big role in giving our land away. I don't absolve them. I don't absolve Christian Zionists. But it's so important to get this fact right because actually it's a universal struggle. We don't want any group to have rights that any other group do not. And that includes Jews. We must all be equal to oppose supremacy is to want all I do I as a as a Muslim, as a Palestinian, as a human. Of course I do not think that any Jewish person in Britain should be getting attacked. I don't think any Christian person should be any non-faith person, anybody that this is a fight for a universal moral order. This is actually just right and wrong. Is you as a Christian get to take land because somebody isn't Christian?
No. Do do Jews get to do it? No. But they can. Right now in this world, that's the big injustice. And that seeps into this impunity and entitlement that then we see now our rights of protest being taken away.
>> Right. Right. because they're I think they're definitely weaponizing Judaism and they're also hijacking the Jewish identity and it's not because they are religious per se but because they understand that religion is a is a is a is a keyway a weapon just like white Christians used during this trans transatlantic slave trade and during colonization.
Christianity was a weapon and they understand that religion can be a weapon to be able to secure the power Helen was talking about the territory they want because how else are they going to buy in all these people who are not actually that invested in their own faith. So whatever it is they hear they just buy into it and the religion is what also draws the Zionist Christians. The Zionist Christians come in because of the religion. Only in the last few months I heard about this whole connection to Armageddon, you know, and the Americans who are celebrating that this war in Iran is going to come on, you know, Armageddon and Jesus is going to come. And I'm like, as a Christian, I'm like, are you people stupid? Why would Jesus need you to start an Armageddon for him to come down? I mean, what what the hell? And that's why I say these people, these Zionist Christians, whether they're Zionist Jews, Zionist Muslims, these people are not of the God they claim they serve. They they clearly not because they're Jewish people like Helen that see through it. They're Christians like me that see through it.
They're Muslims like you that see through it. And we're like, this has nothing to do with the faith we profess.
We, you know, we follow. This is clearly about power. So let me just bring this back to the again [clears throat] to the main question we're talking about which is I think we are kind of saying look there is anti-semitism we're not denying this anti-semitism but the framing of the rise of anti-semitism is what I am questioning because anytime they talk about the rise of anti-semitism they immediately tie it to the pro Palestinian marches they tie it to watermelons they tie it to flags they tie it to oh I feel intimidated by what especially when anti- Zionist Jews are there on the same marches and most of these marches is just speaking out against genocide against an apathide that's why I question is it a rise of anti-semitism and are they are they manufacturing crisis based on their to your point definition of um of a rise of antise-mitism why aren't they talking about a rise of Islamophobia when there are more cases of attacks and you Musk attacks, Muslim attacks than they are of Jews. What? Why is it always I mean Kemi Baitnok I saw with Kemmy Bnock I don't know if you guys saw this clip of hers on social media and all of the eyes were like clarity leadership where she where she was um confronted by a heckler who went you know talking to her about what's happening to Muslims and she immediately went no there's a special thing happening to Jewish people this is like 1930s Germany I'm like this isn't 1930s Germany for Jews what the hell are you talking about? This is not 1930s Germany. Where is the 1930s Germany? And why aren't you showing the same level of concern and care to Muslims? Why can't you do it for both?
Why can't you say, "Listen, our Jewish brothers and sisters are feeling scared.
Our Muslim brothers and sisters are feeling scared. I, as a leader, I'm going to come bring both communities.
I'm going to give you 25 million and one minute. I'm going to give you 25 million. 4 million the net police Mark Rowley what's his name he's actually he actually said there should be a special police force special police force for Jewish people I'm like okay if you're going to do that who's going to do it for Muslims who's going to do it for black people I'm I'm listening to you Helen please >> well first of all I think it's really interesting that um the Zionists have targeted Jews like me, the wrong sort of Jew. Why is that?
>> Why is that? Because first of all, most of us are leftwing.
Don't like that. But also, we're raising the issue all the time of Palestine and they don't want that. So, they're going to spend a lot of time, you know, evicting us from the party and suspending us and doing all that.
nothing about religion. It's about what we're trying to reveal, isn't it? And can I go just say something about the marches?
>> Yeah.
>> Um while there's a genocide going on, they they pick on, you know, things that are they might think are important, but actually the people on our marches in Liverpool, I am always so impressed. There are old ladies who come. There are mothers with little children who come and have been coming for two years regularly every Sunday. We've we've reduced the number of marches now, but in you know until very recently every Sunday and they were motivated by peace because they couldn't bear to see the horrors of what's going on in the world and the way Palestinians are being treated. And that's what's being erased from that's what they're trying to do all the time. Erase it from the from uh our knowledge and the public's knowledge.
>> Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. I agree. And this is why we need to amplify, you know, anti-ionist Jewish voices like yours, Helen, because >> could I just add?
>> Yeah.
>> I talked to some of the policemen in uh in Liverpool. I know people have different views about the police and you know whether you can trust them or not but I talked to one of the policemen and he said I prefer to be policing your marches >> than a right-wing march. He said the your marches are easy because you know we are peaceloving.
>> Right. Right. Right. Right. It doesn't mean that we don't feel strongly about things, but generally we have possibly two, three policemen. If we have any right-wing people coming into Liverpool and trying to disrupt our marches, or even if it's just on their own, you get 50 policemen, 100 policemen, and there's much more violence.
>> But, uh, that's not how it's being portrayed.
>> No, it's not. And and the reason it's not portrayed that way is because again they need to weaponize they need to weaponize violence. This the violence that comes out of the Tommy Robinson marches is okay but because they're policing our language they're using the language of protest and portraying it as violent. This is why we need to fight. I mean I was so angry with um Kama when he made his speech and said if you see anybody say globalized in father I I mean I made a video where I was literally screaming I was reacting to it cuz I said globalized the freaking inif father globalizing father against Israel globalized resistance globalized uprising because what do you mean I'm seeing children children's heads blown up I'm seeing people parents picking up the body parts of children children picking up the body parts of their parents and you tell me that I shouldn't say globalizing resistance. You you say to someone like me, a black person who has a history of ancestors who fought for their freedom because they globalized the freaking resistance. We had our antif father and we still having it. The enslaved African-Americans who globalized the antif father against the enslaved against the slavers, the white slavers. So why would you think that the Palestinians should not respond? And this is why when the oppressor is committing genocide and using violence, it is okay. The moment the oppressed tries to respond energy for energy. Oh my god, that's terrorism. That is terrorism. Or you attacking all Jews.
I'm like, nobody's attacking all Jews.
Then this is why I don't understand the Zionist British Jews because it it seems to me like they do not see the irony.
They're not the ones committing the war crimes. Nobody is thinking of Zionist British Jews. Nobody's thinking of British Jews. Period. We are speaking about Israel, Israel and Israeli Jews are committing war crimes. End of story.
But the Zionist British Jews and Well, you're making me feel very scared. Why?
You're not committing the war crimes.
Why are you centering yourself in this?
Why are you making this all about you? I mean, Helen, sorry. I I I some of my videos I have to do this idea like me me.
It's not about you. You You're not the one being oppressed. You're not the one committing the oppression unless you're manufacturing consent for it. And I think this is what so many of us feel so frustrated by. And that is why I'm saying this to all those in the comments. Please, especially those of you in Britain, take this local elections very, very seriously. Look at what the Labor Party did to Helen. Labor Party, especially under that political prostitute Kama is not the party for us.
Kick them out. Kev Bay, she's clearly in the pockets of the Zionist and she's a Zionist. Kick them out, people. We need to take We need to take back power. We need to control the narrative and stop them from controlling the narrative. We really need to. Now I I I know we've kind of come to the top of the hour now but if I if you Helen and Ramy if you could just say something to round off what would you like to say to kind of like round up this um conversation? Um Ramy first >> I would like to say that I want to go back and center the issue here and the issue is there is still an ongoing genocide >> and Palestinians are being murdered every day. Iranians have been murdered.
>> Lebanese people are still being murdered.
>> Millions displaced.
as Chem Baden, you know, she said, um, the Palestine marches are sustained every week. Why, Chem?
Why are they sustained? Why do they need to be sustained? Oh, right. Because Palestinian Christians and Muslims are being murdered every week. So what you're saying by in inaccurately linking linking the the the attacks on what uh I don't know how how many Jewish people every attack is terrible. Okay. Um but you're saying that those lives are worth more than the hundreds of thousands that are are are killed and are most of them still under the rubble. and the ones that we're losing every single day.
That's what you're saying. Okay. By inaccurately as well, this link because it's not a causal thing, but because she's linking it inaccurately, what she's inad invertently saying, yes, >> is that those lives matter more than the lives that this these protests are standing up for? Why?
>> That is supremacism. Shouldn't you be saying that every life is what? So in so not only are you doing that to to to stop these marches, you're also stripping the freedom of every single British person. That is a single two-tier hierarchy that unfortunately mirrors far too closely what is going on in occupied Palestine.
And we must resist that. Everyone has to be equal. every life is created equally and is equal in the eyes of God in the sight of God. And we have to resist this because this is a slippery slope >> y >> of of of of placing a single people above everybody else whether they want to be placed or not. Okay. So Helen doesn't want to be placed above me because she's Jewish. But this is the system that that is being parited. You know, this is we have to see what's happening here and and we have to resist that and call for complete equality.
Whether you are white, black, brown, whatever your religion or no religion you are, I don't care. I don't, as a Muslim, I do not want an extra 25 million pounds. Okay? I can say one name, Wayne Broadhurst. People don't know about Wayne Broadhurst. I bet you they don't. That's a white man who was stabbed. So should white people say, "Okay, now we want it, you know, 25 million just for white people." That's that's strange. That is weird. So no, I don't want extra funding. I want a single system that reacts in exactly the same way to every single life because otherwise we are completing who is more victim, who gets more somebody's going to be left out. What we're going to categorize humans in, you know, some people going to say the LGBT, some people will say white people, brown people. No, we're all equal. That's what we have to push for. So, that was a bit a bit long.
>> Well said. And Kemi actually refers to the two Jewish men who were killed in Manchester and two Jewish men who were um um stabbed uh in Gold's Green. So, that's four Jewish people she's saying, whose lives mean more than the hundreds of thousands being, you know, and we know it's a whole lot more than that who are being killed in Palestine, Lebanon, and in Iran. Well, that's such an excellent point, Ramy. Thank you, Helen.
>> Okay. [snorts] Well, I I agree with what everything that uh Ramy has said. I just want people to know in many ways this is not such a complicated issue. This is a group of people who've come into a territory.
It wasn't empty and they've taken it over. And people have to get that into their heads.
that there was an initial really, you know, it was a crime that was committed >> and land was stolen. It wasn't done peacefully.
>> People were killed in this >> trying to get the land.
>> Um, it didn't start in October the 7th. It's been going on for 70 plus years.
>> Yeah. Again, I don't think people have got it into their heads really. Some people have obviously and [clears throat] there are all these marches, but like with the Iraq war, um our politicians are just flicking this away. Um when Kia Starmer was asked, "What do you think of the um the report that Amnesty International has come out with?" and um I think it was human rights watch um who said that Israel is an apartheid state. Now when you mention that over South Africa, >> yeah, >> you know, people know what how awful that is. When you say it about Israel, >> K Dharma just said it's not true and flicked it away. And that's what's happening. It's these atrocities, these, you know, Israel still maintains it's not breaking international law.
Um, Britain maintains it's not breaking international law and it's all untrue.
Yes. Um, so >> in our faces, we >> still got a big job to do unfortunately, but I don't want people to lose hope.
It's it's sometimes, you know, you think, oh my goodness, what can we do?
But we've just got to carry on. It's got to a point where it's been trivialized so much and the the closing down is so much. I go into a football match. I wear a a Palestine badge, pro Palestine badge. Oh, do you think we can allow this woman to go into the grounds with her badge?
>> What? And we had a gar and um we had the three doctors talk just this last week and they were asked you know um you're supporting Palestine um how are you treated by your employers and they said well actually our employers because of some complaint by a Zionist um said oh you can't you can't wear any symbol of support for Palestine And these doctors were absolutely brilliant and they said we will take off our badges if you stop um making big noise about Ukraine or you know talking about other political issues. Yeah.
>> We will listen if you treat people fairly like Rakma was saying you've got to treat people fairly.
>> Yeah. Yeah. And justice.
>> Oh thank you so much both of you. Oh my goodness, the comments coming in. Um, let's see. Oh, Dr. Aladwan and Helen Marx, true human beings. I couldn't listen, I agree with you totally. Someone said here that um agree. I totally agree with Helen. Yes, someone said uh Rame is dropping those golden nuggets. I swear, you need to go write a book. I you really need to go write a book. We will all [laughter] Thank you so much for your time this evening. Uh this is going to be an ongoing conversation, but I think you are both leaving everybody um with the inspired and thoughtprovoking uh um instruction.
Don't give up, keep fighting, sure about the protests, take back, you know, control of language and we keep moving.
We must not allow the government or these [snorts] institutions to shut us down. We mustn't allow allow it. Thank you so much, Helen. God bless you both. And I hope I hope you both come back soon again because we love having you. Everybody w wish them a good evening. Send them love. Send them love.
Send them love. Come on. All right.
Thank you so much.
>> Thank you very much. All right.
>> Listen people, that that is the kind of conversation I want to see on um on our mainstream um stages. That is exactly the kind of honest conversation because we are all seeing these things and if we are all seeing it, why is it so difficult? Why is it so difficult for these mainstream channels to see the same thing and to have these kind of conversations truthfully? Cuz part of the problem here is that we're all going insane. We're like, you're gaslighting us. You are lying to us. We can see that you're lying. We can see you're gaslighting.
Some of us are about to scream. You know what I mean? I mean, some of us are already screaming. So, you know, having Helen on here and having Ramy, of course, and Muhammad, I think it does it does a lot to really kind of like just let us all know that we are not alone.
And having I think that anti-Zionist Jewish people like Helen and thousands of others, they honestly, they're such a breath of fresh air. I swear it's like you, one, they make me feel like I'm not going insane. two, they restore your well, they restore my um my my what I've always felt about Jewish people. When I hear them speak, I'm like, exactly.
Thank God. Because some of these Zionist Jews, when I hear them defending the festival, I'm like, I I don't understand. You you are the exact opposite from what I have learned about Jewish people all my life. So I I don't understand how you can how you can do this. So this is why I make a point whenever I come across anti-ionist uh Jews to amplify their voices because if the mainstream will not amplify their voices that we must amplify their voices. It's so important for everybody to know out there that Zionist Jews do not speak for all Jewish people and that they are Jewish people and you know Jewish people are not a monolith of a single race or a single ethnicity or or a single thought. You know what I mean?
So, but you can see that there is a unified amongst the different um nuances that that that form the Jewish identity.
there's a unified stance amongst across thousands of um anti-Zionist Jews that that that makes it clear that Zionism is not Judaism. Zionism is has nothing to do with the Jewish identity. And I think we we have to be part of their messaging to let people understand that because we should not ever say it is okay to attack anyone be them Jewish, Muslim, Christian simply because of their faith. I mean that's madness. Forget that. That's all anybody wants, nor is it what anyone should want. Of course, there are real anti-semites out there. Okay? They do not they don't speak for us in our in our stance against Israel, in our stance against in apathide against um genocide.
They don't speak for us, right? But I think there was something that Helen said I I found that really speaks to some of the u multiple um uh things that are coexisting which is that this ongoing condition right this ongoing um standard of exceptionalism that the government seems to be showing you know Jews versus Muslims or versus other people it's going to breed breed it. It's going to breed some resentment and that res resentment is not nec I would not call it antise-mitism. The resentment would be against the une unequal treatment. The um resentment will be against the hypocrisy and the double standards. And of course, as people express that, they're going to be called anti-semitic when all they're saying is no, we're just saying treat everybody equally. Can you all believe that when Natasha Devon gave that, you know, I played what she said earlier on Sky News where she said, "Jews always get the correct response, but other communities don't." Can you believe she was attacked on X? Do you saw how calmly Natasha spoke? If I was giving that, if I was saying what she was saying, I would not have said as calmly as she was very articulate. She spoke really calmly. She she brought out the nuances of the point and people on X were they were attacking her. They literally said what I saw a post and went oh she's angry extraordinary. She's angry that Jews are getting a response and people had to go no she literally just said it's the correct response that Jewish people are getting. Other people should also get the same correct response. I'm like I don't understand the world that I live in. I I I'm trying to understand the world that I live in and it is crazy. I it's it's you know this is why I need this is why I need you guys.
Okay. This is why I need you guys. This is why I need this live stream because whether it's once or twice a week, I need people to have this conversation with because I am not finding this conversation on the mainstream media.
And as I've told you guys many times, I have nearly thrown my remote control at my TV screen. And the only reason I don't do so is because if that TV screen breaks in a cost of living crisis, I will have to buy a new TV. And I can't buy a new TV right now. That's the reality for me. Okay. Um I'm seeing your comments. Let me see your comments.
Let's see. Uh let's see. Um Natle says, "Natasha was right and people don't like the truth, so that's why they attacked her."
Absolutely. You're absolutely right. Um, let's see this here says, "Thank you, Dr. Ramy. You're right. Absolutely."
Um, let me see more comments. I just want to go through your comments before we round up. H it is. I mean, that was a really good conversation. So many of you are saying that was a great interview.
Nazi says that was a great interview.
Many of you are saying that you really enjoyed the conversation.
And oh, Joelle says it was so refreshing. I know it's even for me listening to Helen, listening to um Muhammad, listening to Ramy, I'm like this is exactly what I need now. Now I have the energy to go into midweek tomorrow. I know by the time I wake up tomorrow, there's going to be something else that's going to drive me up the wall, but at least for this evening, I can go.
Thank God. Um yeah, so many thanks you guys. Stephanie saying, "Thank you all."
Jen says, "Thanks so much, ladies." So many thanks coming in. I I'm so glad all of you enjoyed that and I hope that we continue to have these conversations.
Again, people, if there are any conversations you would like me to have or people you'd like me to invite on, DM me. You've got my details on there.
You've got my social media account. Tag me shalam. Email me at helloshola.com or drop it in the DMs. Now people, it is that time of the evening where we have to say goodbye. But it's never goodbye.
It is see you later. So here's my big jug of water cuz you know I talk too much which I'm going to take after I have said my see you later. I hope that you found the conversation really instructive and that it it drives you gives you that inspiration to carry on.
And remember, whatever they tell you from the politicians to the police, question it. Don't swallow it. Hook, line, and sinker. Question it. Read multiple sources so that you can make an informed decision. Okay. All right.
Thank you guys. God bless. I will see you soon. Bye-bye.
>> Thank you for watching. [music] Like, comment, share, and subscribe.
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