Are your finances in order? Rate hike exposes ‘bad mortgage strategy’ as an expensive problem

Added: 2026-05-06

[00:00:03]Welcome to the Smart Property Investment Show, the podcast by investors for investors.

[00:00:09]Good day, Phil Terren, Smart Prop Investment. I hope you're well recording this literally as the Reserve Bank Governor is coming to the conclusion of her remarks in relation to the rate rise on Tuesday. You're probably tuning into this on Wednesday and maybe you've seen it on Thursday.

[00:00:27]So, uh, no doubt, uh, some water under the bridge by the time you may tune into this or you might be picking it up as you get set for Saturday as you're heading out looking at things. Um, the headline is 25 basis point increase to the official cash rate up from 4.1% to 4.35%.

[00:00:45]80% of the market were expecting uh the rate rise. Uh, these are the the buffins who sit behind economic houses and decide these things whether they're bank economists or otherwise. I think most Australians were expecting uh a rate rise today um connected obviously with uh the inflation numbers that came out last week uh which is intrinsically connected with uh inflationary pressures coming out of the war in the Middle East. So, uh, I've been tuning in to the Reserve Bank Governor's comments, um, it would appear that inflation remains a problem, uh, continues to remain a problem and to use her language. She said that this rate rise is going to give them space inverted commas, uh, to try and determine, uh, the impact of the war in the Middle East or a prolonged war in the Middle East and the ramifications for that. So I think we get together in June is the next uh >> um time the RBA gets together. So that's the third consecutive rate rise that's three this year. Uh we're back to levels uh that we saw from February 2025. So, uh, for all those Australians who thought there was a reprieve of softening interest rates, uh, over a period of time, well, we're back to where we were and, uh, we're sort of looking at similar rates to where we were in 2012 or 2013, I think. And the headlines is that, um, you know, whether or not and already commentator is having a big discussion, they pull apart the the RBA governor's language and try and work out what she means. Some people are saying, well, that this idea of space means that it may stay that way for a while or may hold. But again, we don't know what's happening in relation to global markets. So that's where we are.

[00:02:26]That's what it means uh for you is where it's going to be determining. But we're sitting now at this intersection of uh hiking interest rate environment. And we're looking down a barrel of seismic or significant changes to the tax regime in the upcoming budget which is on Tuesday of next week. So who knows what's going on. I don't know. And I'm not sure if my guest today ever loans from Finny Mortgages knows either, but rates have gone up. That we do know.

[00:02:59]>> Yes. Well, I guess what we do know is what we can do about it.

[00:03:02]>> Yes. Well, I saw McQuary Bank was the first bank to come out saying, "Yes, we'll put our rates up, you know."

[00:03:07]>> Yeah. They would be all very quick to do this again, I'm sure.

[00:03:10]>> So, what do we do all about it? Well, the same old thing. There's nothing.

[00:03:13]Well, if if you're already redlining on your mortgage and you're struggling with the considerable mortgage stress and there's been interest rate rise, time to do something about it.

[00:03:23]>> Yeah. Yeah. I think um I think the first thing is most people get uh a bit confused about it is to actually check how much more a rate rise will have um what effect it's going to have on your on your mortgage. Some people have had um you know extra repayments. Some people have um fixed part of their mortgage. Some people have money in offset. Some people have money in redraw of people who have money in account outside of their mortgage. Um and I guess just to have a look at this and understanding how much actually that going to affect them is very important based on how much also the mortgage is, how long the term is, should they refinance, should they stay, should they fix. Um just have a at least a sit down on what it looks like for you. That' be the first thing.

[00:04:10]>> And your broker can help you do that.

[00:04:12]>> Of course. Broker can help.

[00:04:12]>> Yeah. Okay. Do how many people actually know what's going on? Do you >> No, not many.

[00:04:16]>> No, it's >> Yeah. You know, the first thing we do ask when people want to refinance is what's your rate? How much do you pay?

[00:04:22]>> The answer is just, oh, let me check.

[00:04:25]And it's easy. You know, they're going to apply second, but they had never taken the time to do it before the conversation.

[00:04:33]>> Yeah. So you may have PNI loans offset or nearly completely offset or a small balance on it. That doesn't mean you don't have to keep paying your repayments. It just means you're chipping away the principle quite a lot.

[00:04:46]And if you or if you've got interest on your loans and it's offset or got a level of offset uh that should compensate somewhat to it. But anywhere where you have debt, there will be an application of this rate rise. I can't think of any bank who isn't going to pass on.

[00:04:59]>> No. No. And sometimes it's not the question of you know when are they going to pass it if they're going to pass it's also by how much and you know it's not because the RBA increased by 0.25 >> that banks or lenders will follow with the same amount and that's where it gets a bit >> tricky uh and you might think oh you know all bank are going to pass it on so I end up with the same rates anyway um but check by how much your rate is actually going up. Yeah, you you sort of do a a box pop on this and because you work in and around mortgages and property, you think everyone's absorbed and obsessed with with what's happening with interest rates and what's happening with the budget. Um, you speak to the average Australian on the street most of the time if it doesn't really affect them. If they're a renter, they go might get a little bit more whereas other people will be like right on it and connected with it. So, um, if you don't know, know if you're a property investor, know what your rates are, know where you're at, know where you're sitting, know what your buffers are, know how this will influence >> your cash position. Um, you know, and then you need to make a determination of of what the future looks like, and it's difficult. Um, but >> before you end up with a with default on your mortgage, >> you don't want to default in the mortgage. That's a bad >> then it's really hard to do anything.

[00:06:10]>> Yeah. A default is like not missing a repayment. It's when the >> the bank actually sort of >> Yeah. default and but as soon as it's you start being in into that I guess um financial hardship type of situation um it's really hard to do anything and to keep going so better to check what you can do first even if um that's saving not you think it's not going to save you much uh every every month there is ways to stretch things out um delay things >> yeah even things like you know um shifting from PI to interest only interest only for a little while you know and banks >> banks are quick to help where they can and a lot of people beat up banks and I can sometimes participate in that but banks will be quick to um uh support through times of hardship and they'll be very conscious of rising interest rate environment and changes to potential >> I do I do think this is the rate hike that's going to break a lot of people >> why do you say that >> well you know we're back to where we were back in December about 24 >> just before the the rate started to drop and >> by then already people were were struggling. We had a lot of conversation about should I keep my property, should I sell. So at the time we were doing a lot of refinance back to studies to extend the term to lower the repayment on the loan. Um for an occupier for investors we were resending to interest only. were trying to sometimes um people would get cash out from their investment property that had equity >> and paying the debt with the new debt they were getting right and not up front not disclosed that way but when we go back to it six months later we're like well where is this gone oh well to pay my first mortgage >> so there was there's like um you know domino effect on yeah paying debt with debt so this happened and then a year ago obviously inflation was there but we are months later a year later with everything that has gone up the whole geopolitical situation >> that has happened um yeah I think that's going to be the right that's going to really so it might give space to the RVA but um people might not have the space >> and and that's the RVA sort of getting a vertic space and and and the governor sort of >> hed towards um you know they still don't yet know what the consequences are of prolonged war in the Middle East, but she she spoke to the cascading impacts of this and and and you know the the impact on on the production the the sort of um productivity or production of trade and other sort of commodities, right? We still don't yet know.

[00:08:53]>> No. Correct.

[00:08:54]>> And and should the war in the Middle East sort of conclude and >> do we do we know yet as well, you know, the the two hikes we've had, the effects haven't been through still as well?

[00:09:06]>> No. So we don't know anything. So it's >> you don't know what the real inflation number is on they can work it out but how much of this is is >> is led by the war in the Middle East. Um and there's going to be long tail to that as well. So inflation going to be sticky. I think what they're trying to really avoid is stagflation >> and stagflation being let me try and work out a simple way to explain this is when you've got high inflation but very sort of humrum or lackluster >> growth in in in economies. So you sit there and just go, why is this the case?

[00:09:36]The GDP growth is poor, but >> inflation, >> we don't want to be in a recession.

[00:09:40]>> No, but already people have and I sort of flagged it beforehand, you know, potentially you could be looking down the barrel and >> and hindsight's going to be a wonderful thing. And when you fast forward 5 years and you say, well, this happened, this happened, this happened, and the government did dot dot dot, >> you know, it become um >> what did our uh >> Oh, it's always easy when you have all the cards in hand and you know what's happened. when it was the the recession we had to have under it's like now it's like a an emote thing going yeah we had to do that well yeah a lot of it was manufactured unnecessarily >> and we're certainly looking down that pathway especially when we look at maybe changes to to tax regime >> yeah what I'm what I'm I guess concerned about is also because I deal with them all day every day is investors >> and I know they're always the one that like oh who cares you know they're the one doing well but this plus what might come um budget next week might really trigger like a one in a lifetime generation thing of everything's going to know about property investing >> maybe. Well, let's talk about that.

[00:10:38]We'll go to a break though. Uh stay with us back in a moment. Well, >> welcome back. Phil Tarant investment with ever Lois principal at mortgages.

[00:10:46]Now, I picked up the paper today and sort of running on the back of uh what we were speaking before the break and I sort of everyone's been musing about what all this means and and I'm conscious that every time we say something it's it's it gets, you know, pre presupposed and and and you know, the next day it's it's changed a bit, but I picked up the paper this morning and the headline was budget tax amnesty for new homes.

[00:11:09]>> Yep.

[00:11:09]>> Uh so this is something that I've been speaking about where I think we're going to end up with a two-tier system.

[00:11:13]>> Yep. Definitely. any update as of now and and this is this is people speaking on the condition of of being an anonymous but um would would appear to be close to uh the source. They're pretty much saying um uh new homes that new homes may be exempt from some of these changes and the idea being is that they want to stimulate but I've been talking about that for for some time that you may end up in that regime.

[00:11:38]They're also saying in terms of grandfathering is that it may be grandfa if you do have investment properties in existing properties. It may be grandfathered up to the point there's a change and then there will be >> the new application which will be an indexled thing how it used to be back in the day. So uh good luck to the accountants who need to um interpret all this stuff and and work all that out.

[00:11:58]But there there there is as I sit right now um potential for uh these changes and and and and um not to be affecting new homes, new builds including CGT or maybe a variation thereof. So that's that's what >> yeah I think I think that's um lenders as well have had a bit of I guess inside information about that because a lot of them are reviewing reworking their construction new builds turnkey all of those loans and also funny enough from last year when ASC um released you know their six DTI threshold doesn't apply to new build and construction >> it looks like they're going to incentivize new build now I I sort of said sometime weeks ago now that maybe this is the way it's going to go and I said that on the other hand there's going to also have to be some mechanism to support >> developers and whether that's changing the um uh and whether they can do it structurally the the the budget or incentivize the states around the planning regime needs to change but if you if you incentivize property investors towards new property and you incentivize developers through some sort of regime change on taxation that's going to shift a lot of property investors to new.

[00:13:13]>> Now there's cause and effect with with everything. Now you think about it. If um negative gearing isn't connected in with new build properties, right?

[00:13:21]>> Depreciation starts sort of playing a big game. Then if you're buying new um you get significant, >> you know, depreciation upsides and benefits because planned equipment is obviously taxdeductible. Um, so whether or not it changes investor behavior towards um, and I was chatting to someone today about this towards new, who who knows? But, you know, this is this is the world we're moving into >> potentially.

[00:13:45]>> Yeah. And I think a lot of investors don't buy new.

[00:13:50]>> No. No. Because they're being told not to because they don't perform as well as existing, you know, and and whether or not there's anything to that. I don't want to get into that today, but you you'll find that. And again, also there's two different sorts of new property. There's >> there's a brand new apartment in a block of 300 apartments versus landbased >> house on land, right? So again, you've got to you got to look through um the the shades of it. So that's where it's at right now. Um >> we don't know.

[00:14:23]>> Who knows? We got to wait to see what actually plays out uh around it. Um From what I understand also with this story was saying that it's it's actually going to impact other asset classes as well other than just property. I don't know if that that includes commercial >> uh commercial but anything I think not just property >> which seems fair if they're going to do it.

[00:14:44]>> Um but this whole idea is there says investors acquired before the budget changes come in effect will be partially grandfathered from new CG arrangement.

[00:14:52]capital gains tax made up until the change takes place will be adjusted will be subject to the 50% discount while gains made after will be pre-tax 999 regime like this is just like already it's complicated there's going to be so much more >> complicated moving forward >> I read I read I don't know many article about this and they're all saying one thing and the other there is very very dark you know doom and gloom everything's going to be cancelled no more you know negative gearing at all for many properties and some of them it's like oh maximum two or depending when you do it on depending what's you know depending depending the truth is no one knows.

[00:15:31]>> No >> and let's let's wait and see. Um what we planning though as um mortgage you know mortgage broker is that whatever happens we're going to have a rush of people trying to get in before you know this change. It depends when they say it's effective because because what they wouldn't want to do is say, "Hey, we're going to make but these things still need to be all the changes need to go through through the Senate, right?" But >> I think >> Yeah. But if there's a window of two months where people can still put their name on a property with signature, they will.

[00:16:03]>> Yeah. Or doing a really long like terms on exchange or sorry in settlement.

[00:16:08]They'll do a six-month thing. But I think the the government's reasonably confident in that they've got such such sort of strength. um particularly you know how the Greens will be aligned to these type of like Labor and the Greens don't always say eye to eye but I think Labor will be sorry the Greens will be supportive of these changes they've been sort of championing some of them themselves so >> you know it may get sort of pushed through the Senate reasonably easily but um another change here is um >> uh is the introduction of a minimum 30% tax rate on dispersements from trusts >> yes so that's very interesting >> this is another thing as well Right.

[00:16:45]>> And look, we've seen we've seen the changes in landing with trust and people almost giving up on them. Like it's like, well, you know, the benefit on on worth it. If this happened as well, >> the whole the whole trust magic that we've seen in the last few years, it's >> but you might find more people therefore investing probably accounting side, but in company structures where it's potentially 30% tax. So they go, "Okay, well, I'll just move to a company tax."

[00:17:10]That's right. But they say there that's a um uh the government is expected to exempt farmers and estate planning from the change.

[00:17:18]>> So you don't want to you don't want to mess with farmers, right? Because most farmers conduct their business inside of sort of family trusts and and and estate planning is pretty vague, right? Like you know, yeah, I've done it for estate planning, but I've I've structured my portfolio this way for estate planning.

[00:17:33]Yes, purchases. Oh, well, we don't think so. It's it's a tax minimization. Um yeah I don't know I don't know um >> interesting here is asked whether the government cared about the integrity anymore about integrity anymore given it and broke promises on the stage three tax cuts since you raian taxes in the first term char said the government will bring trust by making a case for the changes that's what they're going to do so we made these changes but you can trust us because we've made them in your best interest no doubt uh quote there are generation there are genuine intergenerational concerns and pressures in our budget, in our tax system, in our housing market, and in our economy more broadly. The government like ours is a responsible government, he says, cannot ignore the variable pressures and concerns people have in those communities is year of delivery. Anyway, I did see yesterday though, and and this is maybe a stat you might hear me sort of bandandy around a bit, >> the Australian government loses 12 billion dollars a year. I I read I read 20 >> through illegal tobacco sales.

[00:18:38]>> Okay. Okay. It wasn't the same thing.

[00:18:39]>> 60% >> Yeah. Okay. Let's just >> 60 60% of all cigarettes bought in Australia now >> Yeah.

[00:18:46]>> are on the black market tobacco economy and it cost the government $12 billion a year.

[00:18:51]>> Jesus. That's a >> Yeah. But but that that that's not a that's more of a policing type of issue, right?

[00:19:00]>> Yeah.

[00:19:00]>> Anyway, >> that's a lot. That's a lot. What what um I guess worries me though is the those reform like I guess to help first on buyers.

[00:19:09]>> Oh god, here we go.

[00:19:11]>> Here we go. Should I not say anything?

[00:19:12]>> No, no, no, no. I don't want to say but I was out of the block probably first going this was going to happen and this where we are.

[00:19:19]>> This is what you got to talk about first buyers.

[00:19:21]>> I think so. First time buyers and renters that that this is supposed to supposedly going to help is like could it really backfire?

[00:19:28]>> Like really really backfire?

[00:19:30]>> Yeah. Yep.

[00:19:32]>> Should we mention this? Should we just give them a call or >> No, no, no. Like, >> have this been looked at or or we just forget the real reason why this is happening?

[00:19:42]>> Everyone's forgotten about it.

[00:19:43]Everyone's forgotten about all the all the the first time buyers. They're, you know, they're talking about generational quality now. They're not talking about >> getting first home buyers into the market through schemes, which is going to put a millstone around them and compromising it. But there's another thing here which I saw which is interesting, but we're going to have the break. Stay with us back in a moment.

[00:20:01]Welcome back, Phil Tarant. Ever from fine mortgages.com.au. So to compound everything, another another piece I saw here ever >> is the push to ban SMSF property loans.

[00:20:15]>> All right.

[00:20:18]>> Oh god, >> here we go.

[00:20:19]>> I did not read that one. The Albanese government's plan to restrict negative gearing on investment properties in a federal budget has triggered calls for the crackdown to extend to banning self-managed super superanuation funds from borrowing to investing housing. And this is the first you've heard about this. There you go. Treasure Jim Charas is expected wineback tax breaks blah blah blah um in the budget to help first buyers get a leg up in the housing market. Uh there's some stuff about what we sort of spoke about here.

[00:20:51]When Labour campaigned at the 2019 election to limit negative gearing to investors who build new homes, it also had a policy to ban SMSF's borrowing to buy property and other assets such as shares. Uh as an economist here, uh Matt Bal said SMSF borrowing peras turbocharges the already generous tax breaks available within the superanuation system, especially in the retirement phase. These kinds of SMSF investments in real estate are at odds with the broader goals of superanuation savings which should be at providing a steady stream of income in retirement, not just providing a tax vehicle for wealthy Australians. This is the world that we're living in right now.

[00:21:34]>> Yeah.

[00:21:34]>> So, they're going to have a crack at investors and change the tax regime outside of super and they may I'll tell you who's behind this. It would be the the super annuation blobs.

[00:21:47]>> Yes, of course. Yeah. For the not we shouldn't let people have an advantage and let them borrow inside of their super fund. It's got to be slow and steady. Slow and steady. It's not the banks can use all these different schemes in order to >> to um manufacture, you know, rapid growth and and and and profits. But SMS >> it's not it's not going to fix affordability in supply which is a real issue there. Well, I think people will be saying, and Graten Institute here, um, is is is behind it all, um, saying, well, if if investors weren't buying property inside of their super funds, there will be more properties available for first time buyers to buy. That would be their argument, but it's investors are incentivized >> to make >> to do it. So, which makes it makes demand. So, again, they're focused on the demand side rather than the supply side. But it says acco statistics show that of the $1 trillion in SMSF assets about 60 billion is tied up to assets financed by LB, which is sort of non-reourse borrowing arrangements. This represents about 6% of the total assets held by the nation's 663,000 SMSs across 1.22 million members. It's only 6%.

[00:23:02]>> You know, >> yeah.

[00:23:03]>> Anyway, this is where this is where we live in.

[00:23:05]>> Yeah.

[00:23:06]>> So, that's an update. What are you going to do about it? Well, maybe wait around and see what happens.

[00:23:10]>> Become an investor then.

[00:23:11]>> Yeah.

[00:23:11]>> Become just invest instead of buy your first home.

[00:23:15]>> Yeah.

[00:23:15]>> I mean, this could um this could Yeah.

[00:23:17]hurt the real people they're trying to to help.

[00:23:21]>> Yeah.

[00:23:21]>> I think we're going to Yeah. Very very interesting to to see what's going to happen next Tuesday.

[00:23:28]>> Yeah.

[00:23:28]>> Um but but yeah, in the meantime, I think people should have a look at their current mortgage, review their pre-approval as well if they're looking Pre-approval only lasts six months.

[00:23:38]>> Three months.

[00:23:39]>> Three months for a pre-approval.

[00:23:40]>> Three months. And a lot of banks uh you know if you assess that I don't know 6% and the rates have gone up your probably is not worth what it was written on.

[00:23:49]>> Yeah.

[00:23:49]>> Yeah. On average like by each rate hike your capacity reduced by like 25 to 30k.

[00:23:58]>> We've had three already.

[00:23:59]>> Yeah. So, not only even for first time buyers um that we're trying to help in the market, if you've had three hacks like we've had, potentially that's 90k less on your borrowing capacity, all of a sudden you're not in the same asset class. You're not buying a house, you're buying a unit or you're not buying a unit in this suburb, but you have to move further away from where you want or alltogether you're not buying.

[00:24:22]>> Yeah.

[00:24:23]>> So, that and two, if you had a pre-approval, well, it might not be valid anymore.

[00:24:28]You got to be comfortable with your own numbers, your own budget.

[00:24:32]>> Yeah. So, check check that again. Um, also what we've been saying is if you are on a fixed rate, you might actually want to break it soon before the end of it. And if you're looking to fix again, fix it before it goes up again.

[00:24:49]>> Okay, there you go. Hot tip. You got to do the math on that.

[00:24:52]>> You got to do the math on that.

[00:24:53]>> Yeah. might be worthwhile breaking paying a break fee and then then going back into it.

[00:24:58]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:25:01]>> Anyway, see what happen. I'm going to be in CRA. I'm going to be talking about this.

[00:25:06]>> Yeah. Who knows? Who knows? It's got to be interesting. I'm actually No one really ever looks forward to the budget, but I'm quite interested to see these are interesting.

[00:25:13]>> Quite interesting to see how um how this goes. But you got to remember also um you know the treasurer's hero I think he did his PhD thesis on him was uh was Keading right so he's just trying to emulate these things but you know history leaves a lot of clues and um we know the consequences of tinkering too far with with property markets and uh unfortunately um you know and I saw a report today saying that these changes may I think it was in the Daily Telegraph lift push rents up 20%.

[00:25:42]>> Yeah. would definitely push rent up.

[00:25:44]That's that's the one thing that's >> so so they're going to go we're going to make all these changes and there's also going to be regulations saying that you can't lift rents by more than x% like you might end up in this world you know but sort of thinking more and more you know like this is really going to accelerate new people investors buying new property which is what they're trying to do >> but they still they still yeah they still need to have properties to buy them >> yeah this is it right >> yeah and a lot of people buy new build stuff in their super funds, right?

[00:26:16]That's quite a dual key type things.

[00:26:18]>> Yeah. There has to be you can't have a construction in in SMSF.

[00:26:22]>> No, it has to be has to be established.

[00:26:25]Yeah.

[00:26:25]>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're buying it. But then the whole question who gets the depreciation benefit of it, you know, gets complicated, but >> you Yeah. And look, I've got a lot of clients that just like I'm going to put thing on hold and see what's happening >> because Yeah. It's just so Yeah.

[00:26:41]certain. I think we're going to see people, you know, shifting what they are investing in. Um, and and also I had clients that say, well, look, if that's the case, I would just never sell.

[00:26:51]>> Yeah. And that's the reality to this.

[00:26:54]You got liquidity problems and they comes don't get what they need. And >> so, yeah, let's see exactly what what they do. Uh, and I guess it would be good to have another podcast on actually what's happening. And >> yeah, we'll do that.

[00:27:05]>> What will happen on uh on uh Tuesday night, I think we'll be recording. I might Yeah. do something over that period. So, >> yeah, >> it'll be fun.

[00:27:13]>> Can I give just one quick hot tip? If you are with NZ, >> I think you are >> some people are anyway.

[00:27:21]>> Um, if you really push them on the retention team, they'll give you $2,000 to just stay there.

[00:27:26]>> No.

[00:27:26]>> So, bluff, bs them, tell them you're going to move and they will give you two grand to stay.

[00:27:32]>> Really?

[00:27:33]>> Really?

[00:27:34]>> Well, there you go. And is probably going to be unhappy about that. Probably just cost them millions of dollars.

[00:27:39]>> Millions. Now obviously you need to to have some some case on >> need some evidence right there's some sharp around >> it's not hard just come up with okay this is the rate I was offered that I don't know bank A B and C you just need a bit of um paper evidence which is not hard to get online these days >> um and they will yeah they are I've had a few clients um successful at this >> and it goes back to the point I think a lot of people now are starting to see like a lot of people think a mortgage is a liability in many ways mortgages is are assets because >> they're harder and harder to get.

[00:28:13]>> Yeah.

[00:28:13]>> And if you have one, you know, even refinancing, you know, with a with a mainstream bank to a a second tier bank or a third tier or a non-bank, like you know, there's there is equity in in bank based mortgages. Um, you know, and you need to remember, uh, yes, we we're a rising rate environment, but rates will come down, uh, in time. There's a hot tip. I don't know when. um when they do they come down a lot slower but there's a lot more pressure applied on banks to reduce mortgages on the way down whereas non-banks and other lenders there's there's less pressure there and you find that all the time and people end up with >> mind you feel this these days like the the interest rate difference isn't that big anymore >> it doesn't really matter dollar is a dollar right >> yeah yeah there we go all right well lots of again musing who knows but that's out of the paper today um which is sort of consistent with with what I'm hearing and thinking uh in and around the market, but um we'll find out.

[00:29:14]>> Yeah, I'm still hoping for first time buyer um help to buy scheme, you know, when they 40% in government.

[00:29:21]>> Apparently, they're removing caps as well on that or >> Oh, really?

[00:29:24]>> Oh, >> that's so that's where it's a shared equity scheme, right?

[00:29:27]>> Yeah.

[00:29:28]>> 40% on 40% government.

[00:29:30]>> What did I say? I say something else maybe.

[00:29:31]>> First, I can't remember what.

[00:29:32]>> Yes, I'm talking about the 6040 which is capped at I can't remember.

[00:29:35]>> That's on your property. So you do 60 later the government does 40 and 30 70.

[00:29:39]Yeah.

[00:29:39]>> So they're removing a capsule >> well you know >> who knows but that's one of the story which would you know um allow access to a lot of different suburb of Sydney or Melbourne that wasn't accessible at this stage.

[00:29:55]>> Yeah.

[00:29:55]>> So um but that's >> allegedly there's some smart people behind the scenes making these decisions.

[00:30:04]It would be It would be really hard though because you tricking one thing, the other one just goes on fire. You're putting the fire out there. It just goes there. It's It would be really hard.

[00:30:13]>> Yeah.

[00:30:14]>> You can't please everyone.

[00:30:16]>> Can't please everyone. But >> you can't please filter anyway on this.

[00:30:20]>> The unpleasable person to please. I'm easy to please. I just want to see sensible policies, you know, and everyone's got a view on policies and >> it's hard not to be biased in some ways, but you know, this is this >> reality is of people need somewhere to live and if they can't afford a home, they need investment property. So, you know, there's only so much you can do before you you really erode the the uh incentives. And you see it happening now in in in business like every step of the way they make it harder and harder and harder and harder to to you know really grow in business and they're really stifling innovation. Like there's a lot of reasons why people now just go >> too too hard. I'll just get a job in the public service you know where there's you know we got the biggest public service in the world in the western world per percentage of populations just go it's just too hard. You take all this risk and then I'll just go and get a job in government. That's what they want.

[00:31:14]Want everyone on the government coffer and then they see property investors to tax them to to make sure we can >> That's a very dark word.

[00:31:22]>> Depends how you choose to see it. But very interesting, but everyone's got a different view of it depending what your politics are. That's just one view. I'm not saying necessarily that's my view, but um >> just one one view of how it all works.

[00:31:33]But anyway, we'll find out.

[00:31:35]>> It's not too late though. Call up Finny.

[00:31:37]Finny.com.au today. Tune in to this.

[00:31:40]Yeah, there's lots there's actually lots you can do to to push rates down.

[00:31:43]>> Yeah.

[00:31:44]>> And unfortunately, um, loyalty doesn't pay.

[00:31:48]>> No, no, you pay loyalty tax, right?

[00:31:51]>> Yeah.

[00:31:51]>> Um, all right.

[00:31:52]>> So, sometimes it's good to move.

[00:31:53]>> fi.com. Do you go and speak to the team over at Finny? I'll sort you out. Um, yeah, I know they're busy at the moment, but I'm sure they'll find time for you if you tell them. Phil sent you there.

[00:32:04]>> They'll go, "Sure thing. I've heard about on the Smart Property Investment Show. Do that." um heaps of other stuff we're going to be talking about. This is pretty much going to be, you know, core part of my role for next week or so is is trying to um uh extrapolate out changes, impacts and ramifications from the budget. We'll see how it plays. Uh go and check out Smart Investment, keep connected on it, social media, like us, follow us. Uh and we'll see you again next time. Until then, bye-bye. The information featured in this podcast is general in nature and does not take into consideration your financial situation or individual needs and should not be relied upon. Before making any investment, insurance, tax, property, or financial planning decision, you should consult a licensed professional who can advise whether your decision is appropriate for you. Guests appearing on this podcast may have a commercial relationship with the companies mentioned.