Detroit in Black and White

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-24

[00:00:26]Good evening.

[00:00:28]Welcome to Detroit in Black and White Out Wednesday edition. I'm Adolf [ __ ] Jim Nardoni. It's me and you today this evening.

[00:00:38]>> Well, I'll try and keep up with you. I I rarely do, but I give it my best shot.

[00:00:41]Good evening, Derek Henry. Good to see you.

[00:00:44]>> Well, you can listen, you can uh keep up with me. There's no question about it.

[00:00:50]You know how to talk that talk because I don't, you know, I'm just a young boy. lonely and blue as they say in the song.

[00:01:01]>> I'm glad you brought that up. I saw a little article with you uh talking on the uh well, not a little article, a little news story, I guess, on uh WJR.

[00:01:11]You were talking to Kevin Deetsz about Detroit. So, it was a pretty good uh little snippet.

[00:01:18]>> It was about it was about uh these takeovers.

[00:01:24]Why in the [ __ ] world? And we going to talk about it tomorrow. Uh tomorrow we got former police chief James Craig coming on. I want to get his uh perspective on what's happening with our kids. We got a 19-year-old dictating to the Detroit police what he going to do or not do. How in the [ __ ] we get into a a a negotiation with a 19y old? Tell me.

[00:01:55]>> He should be He should be in college.

[00:01:58]This tells you who's doing this.

[00:02:02]We got a 19y old leading a 14 to 15 years old because the average 19, 18 and 19, they either working or they in college somewhere or they out on a date on Saturday, whatever. They they they not running around uh like a wild bunch.

[00:02:30]>> Well, we're going to get our our viewers thoughts. Good evening, Stephanie Jackson, Hazel Park, Taekwond do. Good evening to you, Les Moore. Hello, Les Moore. Duela. So, we have a guest coming on 8:45, Dr. Ysef Bunchie Shakur and I'd like to get his take on it along with all our viewers tonight, but you wanted to touch on the Mike Dugen situation.

[00:02:52]So, >> Oh yeah. Uh listen, uh Mike Dugen um campaign was doomed from the beginning.

[00:03:01]Remind me of an old movie Spartacus when he found himself surrounded by two uh Roman legions. He said, "We're going to march on Rome." That's what he had to do. He He went for the gusto. I'mma go independent.

[00:03:20]He looked at other places, but with uh but Michigan is not Maine. Michigan is not Vermont. Michigan is not Minnesota and to an extent Wisconsin.

[00:03:32]Uh we just that I think the last independent that won a statewide uh race I think was uh a a Supreme Court justice. I don't know if it was uh Kavanaaugh who's retired the the the brother the late Mayor Kavanaaugh or uh Charles Leaven uh akin to the Levens. But that's about the only person we had had as an independent that ran statewide. Uh his base his base was Detroit. He was banking on uh Detroit voters, black voters to to come with him and and overwhelmingly vote independent.

[00:04:23]People didn't want to split the Dem. You had to split the ticket. Most people are comfortable with uh a straight party ticket, Republicans, Democrats. So, he was doomed from the beginning. Plus, he couldn't afford to put a lot of money into uh Detroit and not put that money elsewhere where he is not a well-known commodity. So he was whatever money he spent he he did a Perry Johnson. He just but he he just threw his money away.

[00:05:02]>> Well I have some thoughts on that. Thank you Janet for sharing. Thank you for joining us. Uh Les says good riddens to Mike. He bankrupted Detroit and fled.

[00:05:10]Hazel Park Taekwond do has probably identified uh maybe he was lobbying for a job. I think he has higher aspirations and I'm gonna tell you where I think they are. Good evening, Janet. Good to see you. Um, there was a time that this is the time. Sorry I'm old eyes here.

[00:05:30]You need that 84 1984 gang squad unit to get them together. Um, you definitely need a force out there. Maybe some deputies are out there willing to help Hazel Park. Um, I don't know. Um, our youth have no faith in this system and their future, obviously.

[00:05:50]And I think we we already said hello to Stephanie Jackson. Um, here's what I think. All right. He's he's came out >> problems here. Okay.

[00:06:02]You you you blacked out for a minute, Jim.

[00:06:05]>> Yeah. I was having a little trouble signing on today. It's that good oldinity. But here's what I think. I think his position and he's talked about it in his press conference is he thinks the Democrats are going to roll and I think he and I think that he's looking longterm. I I really believe this that uh a Michigan Democrat has a good opportunity to be the next president of the United States and he's looking big picture and I think he wants to go to Washington. I think he's looking >> what Michigan Democrat >> the current governor I think has a inside track to be uh if you look at all the candidates from the Democratic party hello G money.

[00:06:46]They need a moderate. They need a Joe Biden 2.0 to win the election. Uh it's not going to be California. It's not going to be Illinois. It's not going to be a Gavin Newsome or or JB or or even Andy Basher.

[00:07:01]>> Well, it might be the guy from uh Pennsylvania, Josh.

[00:07:05]>> I I don't know if he's >> I think he's >> Go ahead.

[00:07:11]>> I think it's time for a woman. And I think Hello, Joe Sheridan. I think I think she's got a a clean path to the White House. I think people think they can think I'm crazy all they want, but she's got a reputation of working with business, right? She's a >> Oh, man. You mean you mean I might have the next president of the United States uh uh uh dogging me out?

[00:07:38]>> I think so.

[00:07:39]>> I dog her out that as governor, she not she's not very loyal. I you know I she's smart. Uh she she understands the uh politics and uh you might not be wrong.

[00:07:56]I thought >> she's hiding in the background.

[00:07:58]>> I thought Harris when she uh picked her vice president, she should have picked somebody like Roy Cooper out of North Carolina or Shapiro or uh the governor of u Kentucky. She didn't. She picked a little milk coast guy out of Minnesota.

[00:08:19]He brought nothing to the table. And uh Dugen uh he it you know I I just thought he was doomed. You know, people might say, "Ah, uh, you know, when he announced that he was running, oh man, he gonna have a coalition of everybody, Republicans, libertarians, you name it, he has them." Now, the only person I ever seen bring uh brought all these groups together was uh Jeffrey Figer in 1998 in the primary where he beat uh the favorite Democrat nominees, Larry Owens. You remember Larry Owens?

[00:09:02]>> I do.

[00:09:03]>> Yeah. He he he killed Larry Owens. But when it came to the general, these these people went home, you know, or didn't or stayed home, you know, the UAW wouldn't give him any money because he had attacked them. He had attacked everybody and, you know, so he was left with on the island by himself. He was like Long John Silver. They threw him off the boat.

[00:09:32]So anyway, Eric Eric Brown says the current governor of Michigan. I didn't say she was going to be the next president of the country, Eric. I didn't say that I was supportive of her bid for the presidency. My only point is >> who's out there?

[00:09:46]>> Yeah, she's she's running. There's no question that she's gonna run. Will she get elected? If the if the Republicans keep going the way they going, I think whoever the Democrats put up and they run it right, uh they'll win. Now, if if Trump insisting on trying to uh pay off his cronies and stuff and you and and he got Republicans turning on him, they he was gloating that he got a couple people out. they they lost because he endorsed somebody else, but they can still wreak havoc on him for six, seven months to to somebody new take take their place. So, he he he really didn't win anything and he just he just been digging a hole deeper and deeper. Uh I don't feel sorry for Dugen.

[00:10:44]Dugen got it made. You know, the rumor now is that uh he's trying to uh win the uh position of uh you be the permanent president of the United United States of Michigan. And uh he not qualified to be uh in higher ed. He got a law degree. He never practiced law. that when that he uh he never been in the classroom, you know, what is he going to do? Go to Michigan and only thing he knows how to do is lay people off and and and give contracts to his cronies. And he's going to bring that little group of people that he took from the county. They went with him to the prosecutor's office.

[00:11:35]They went with him to the DMC. They went with him to uh right there to the uh uh uh the 11th floor in Detroit and now they wanted to go to Lance and I call them locust. You know what locust do the crops? They eat them up. He ate many crops up. Unfortunately, he can't get to uh he can't he can't get to Lancing. But Anna Alba, that'd be a big prize if he could if he can snatch that seat. That to me, that's bigger than being the governor.

[00:12:11]>> He has a plan. Let's just say he has a plan. Jan Jan Overall says, "Thank you, Mr. Mongo." Um, Eric says that the departure, the sudden abrupt departure, it's awful early in the game, Eric. I agree with you. Something's fishy. I think he has a plan. Miss Suzuki says, "With everything being built under that ballroom, next president." I think Miss Suzuki is thinking that u maybe the the current president plans on being the president for a while. Um we don't know.

[00:12:39]Miss Sheila says, "I know you're right, Eric." And Whitmer met with Trump herself a few months ago. Hello, Janet.

[00:12:48]>> One more thing. Miss Sheila said something about uh Sheriff Christopher.

[00:12:52]I guess you're speaking of Chris Swanson who was on the show and he was interviewed by Adolf and Allan Langel a few weeks ago. He was a pretty he was he was a pretty nervous guy. He made me I was watching and he made me a little nervous.

[00:13:05]Smart guy. Um little >> well Doug another thing what Dougen should do he instead of being an independent he should be who he is.

[00:13:18]He's a Republican.

[00:13:20]So he more Republican than he is Democrat.

[00:13:23]>> Thank you. Power words.

[00:13:25]>> So he might he might he he he he might uh uh be better off. Now my problem with Whitmer is she might get caught up in that $40 million whatever money they gave this this woman who's been indicted and going on trial. How much money was it? Uh Jeff, >> I thought it was 20 20 million.

[00:13:49]>> 20 million.

[00:13:50]>> I'm not sure.

[00:13:52]>> What's west a million? You know, >> she's got plenty of challenges to overcome. The uh nursing home deaths, uh the co locking you out of the Meyer store, except uh you know, flying to Florida. There's plenty of challenges that she has, but they all have challenges. I I'm not saying that she's the best candidate. I just I think she's making a move to stay out of all of the nonsense going on right now so she can at least potentially >> seek that position.

[00:14:22]>> I one of our viewers, one of y'all need to come on. Eric, you need to come on and uh uh expand what you was talking about.

[00:14:34]>> And our guest Dr. Shakur is here. Adolf, should we take a break and then bring Dr. Shakur? Yeah, we can we can do that.

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[00:15:37]Well, we're back and we got our guest Dr. Yousef Banchi uh Shakur. How you doing?

[00:15:46]>> I'm good, man. How about you good brothers?

[00:15:48]>> Well, we doing all right. Uh before we start talking about what you got planned for Detroit.

[00:15:56]Uh Jim, you you the one pos that question. Go ahead.

[00:16:00]>> Which question?

[00:16:02]>> About the young folks.

[00:16:04]>> Oh, well, I I was interested to get Dr. Shakur's position on what's going on in Detroit with the young the young kids the shooting the 14-year-old that was shot by the 16-year-old u you know we had u Dr. Cornell West on the show year and a half ago maybe and he talked about self-hatred and that always stuck with me and I kind of like your thoughts on not just this particular incident but but why we aren't why aren't we giving the resources that these young people need not just in Detroit all across this country so that they they can make a good life for themselves and and you're doing that and we appreciate that but I just want your thoughts on what we can do in the here and now.

[00:16:46]Uh that's a great question. I think uh Dr. Cornell West uh alluding to the impact of self-hatred and self-hatred is also fed by what's what many of us call antilackness and the antilackness has shaped um not only the young people but the the black adults in their lives where it has devalued them. So when you're when you have been devalued it's easy to take someone else life. So, using myself as example, um, as a former gang member, no one no one taught me that the guys I grew up with or or or go to school with could be my potential friend or my brother. I saw them as a potential enemy. And that self-hatred that I've hated myself propelled me to hate those others. So, you know, you look at the incident know downtown in general like the violence is and the reality unfortunately the violence is okay as long as it happens in the neighborhood once once once it it it escapes the neighborhood and begins to to triple down downtown then then it's a a dynamic or it's a it's an issue and it's a result of the the um the lack of resources. You know, if you show me a strong productive community, you going to see a community of resour resources.

[00:17:58]If you show me a violent unproductive community, you'll see a committee without uh without resources. I mean, it's that it's that simple. Without resources, it it'll change overnight.

[00:18:10]>> Yeah. I It just unfortunate. Uh like I told somebody, a lot of these kids, General Motors moved downtown into the Ren Center. First thing they did was close the movie theaters. How did a a city as big as Detroit don't have a a movie theater? They don't have not one somewhere, you know? They they they at one time they had skating downtown. They had uh in Cath Marsh they had some basketball courts and stuff and and kids never had a problem. Mhm.

[00:18:48]>> Now they don't have they don't have any of that and and they come downtown.

[00:18:54]There's nothing for them to do but run around and and run across the street, you know, taunt each other that and and play and play tag with the police cuz you know police come at them, they run, you know.

[00:19:14]How do you deal with it? But do you do you negotiate with a 19year-old like he he control an army and he's telling a city, "Well, I can post this when I want to. You know, you can't stop me."

[00:19:31]>> Dr. Shakur, before you start, can I interrupt you just for a second? I hate to do this, but I want to give you the proper introduction. We weren't able to do that. We introduced you, but we didn't say that you're the co co-executive director of Michigan roundt for just communities.

[00:19:45]Um, you also are the author of Window to My Soul. You wrote a book. In 19 years old, you were in prison for a crime you didn't commit. Um, and then you had a relationship with your dad. Can you tell us about how I mean I I want people to understand where you started and where you are now. And I think it's a it's it's a fascinating story. you know I um University of Michigan Derburn where you're a graduate where you completed your bachelor's and your master's degree and you're also you have a PhD from uh Union Institute is that right >> yes >> uh in public policy but but there's a fascinating story uh on on I guess it's a U of M Dearborn website I don't know if it was a newspaper whoever did the story but it you have a great story from beginning to now can you can you share that with our viewers I'm sure They'd love to hear the whole story.

[00:20:39]>> Sure can. Sure can. Um, first make correction. I I was the co-executive director. Now I'm the ex the executive director. I'm the first black and first formally incarcerated to hold that position in 85 year history of the Michigan round table. U I'm a native to Detroiter grew up on the lower west side actually like literally right down the street from Northwest High School. Um if you go Google my neighborhood is uh the official name of is called Northwest Goldberg. as a child growing up, we we we had never heard that name.

[00:21:09]>> Northwest or Northwestern Goldberg, right?

[00:21:11]>> Northwestern, it depends who you talk to. Um, for me growing up, we called the zone 8 after the zip code. Um, I I grew up in the phenomenon of what I call like the unfortunate reality of of single mothers raising kids in in in the community and whatnot. My father would end up getting incarcerated when I was 10 years old. And this struggle occurred between me and my mother where I began to want to engage in the streets. Uh the streets became very very attractive to me as a young boy. As a result, um this this term that I coined, I became a a street aholic.

[00:21:46]Um co-founded the gang zone 8 in in in my neighborhood. Um by the age 13, my mother made me a war state. Um this is during the the epidemic where a lot of killing was happening of of of youth and my mother know made that decision made me a word of state that not because she believed in incarceration but she was trying to save me for myself. Um few years later I would end up getting incarcerated for a crime I didn't do it was gang related you I was part of the gang but that particular crime I did not do. Uh while in prison my mother prayers are being answered where I meet my father in prison. um I knew of him but as a father that's who I met in prison and we then and that relationship was uh born out of letters and when I got to prison I was functionally illiterate I could barely read or write and you know God being the best planner 6 months later we would be at the same prison and that 6 months uh or we would be there for like four months together and he began to paint a picture in my mind of how I could uh redeem and transform myself the same way he had did. Um the reality prison did not re rehabilitate me. It was left at the prison. I have came home doing the same thing before because u particularly when I was in prison at that time um Engler had took out all the educational programs only you can get a GED. There was there was nothing you're just doing pretty much time and fortunate my father taught me how to same way Malcolm Malcolm X did.

[00:23:10]Um he told me that the greatest gift that a father can give his child is precious time. And up to this point, I've neglected you and doing and giving you my time. From this point on, I will do all I can. Uh, five years go past and we would end up being in the same prison again. And at this time, I was close to going home. Um, he I was no longer a boy. I was no longer lost. I I had become a man. I was growing to become a a greater man. And what he taught me, I began to help influence other other folks. I mean, reality, you know, we think cuz you go to prison that you that you guaranteed to come home. that that is not reality. We we assume that every every man particularly every black man that go to prison is going to come home like Malcolm X. That is not reality.

[00:23:53]Fortunately enough, you know, I I had an example for me how to become a better better person.

[00:23:59]And as the last time I seen my father, they were transferring me to another to another prison really was walking me uh to to the gate. and he looked at me and with with tears in his eyes and he said that uh they can keep the lion cage but the cub must go free and when the cub goes free part of the line goes with him so even though my father is still in prison he's going on 42 years in prison you see my father in me today as a result of what what he contributed to me I I served nine years I've been home 25 years I got my social degree from um Wayne Community College I got my bachelor's from University of Michigan Dearbornne. I got my masters from the University of Michigan at Arbor and I got my um my PhD from the from Union Institute Institute University and on that same you know I wrote wrote a couple books have a documentary that's currently out about my life.

[00:24:54]>> Um I opened up the Urban Network.

[00:24:56]>> Why don't you talk Why don't you talk about the documentary called >> Road to uh Redemption?

[00:25:03]>> Yeah. Yeah. So So it's what I just said.

[00:25:05]It's the visual of that man. That's the visual of the book. Again, I wrote like the greatest thing I could contribute to my community was a book. That's the greatest thing that my father gave to me um to help impact Holy Cross Baptist Church Zone. Yeah. Right around the corner. Um I mean you know to open up the question around know violence like like violence have become such a norm but we we don't talk about the social violence the economic violence that's impacting people to become violent human beings as a result of being socially neglected.

[00:25:37]And so this is what this documentary does. It takes you deep inside of um some I'm pretty sure you guys have talked about on your show or alluded to it. There's two Detroit. There's a black Detroit and there's a white Detroit and and it's and it's been that way for for a long time and we see it more glaring now than ever before. The the lines are drawn very very hard and I mean like you know we talk about how Detroit is the rebound but this documentary tells you the story of those who who have been neglecting who've been left out but they still have found a way of making like my neighborhood has g been gentrified by Henry Ford Hospital. has been gentrified by Mottown um in terms of the resources that they've got but not created a balanced community and that's what you know that's the power of the documentary to be able to show what what hope and what transformation looks like.

[00:26:24]>> When when is that uh uh premiere >> it'll be um June June 25th at the Charles Wright Museum. Um it's a world award-winning documentary for the last year been in uh numerous film festival locally internationally has won over over 20 awards.

[00:26:44]>> Yeah.

[00:26:46]And did you ever uh imagine that you would be at this stage of life you you've been made a an executive director of an organization that you know that if you would have told them 10 years ago that they was going to make you the man.

[00:27:04]Uh they they folks would have said you you out of your mind. But here you are.

[00:27:11]You know, you you you served time in prison, walked out of there, and usually a lot of folks that that walk out of prison, walk right back into it because they that's like home. I know I know several people they they can do they they they can't stay out. They got to go back, you know. I say, "Yep, you must miss people, you know." Oh, well, they they was doing what they was doing and and they feel powerless when they come out.

[00:27:42]>> No, that's a great question. Um, the younger me, no, I did. I I mean, unfortunately, I thought I'd be dead, you know. I mean, this this is what this is what they've had told me continuously and I I was able to break that that myth and um you know, even breaking that, right, I still didn't foresee me at this stage and that's the evolution of life.

[00:28:03]um the evolution of the the continue the knowledge that I gain uh you know the trans the continued transformation like I think that the name of the game is about making an impact and sometimes a lot of us get get complacent where we make it about ourselves and not about people and anybody meet it's about the people that I serve the community uh that that I live in that I'm I'm an instrument in that and so being executive director of the Michigan round table but for just communities is being a tool to continue to advocate and fight for a just a just society.

[00:28:35]>> Well, tell folks what the uh Michigan roundt is all about.

[00:28:40]>> So against the 80 uh we're the third oldest um social justice organization in Detroit behind the NAACP in the Urban League just get to give context. Some people maybe be familiar. It used to be called the Michigan round table of diversity and inclusion. Uh we changed our name not because of what's going on with Trump or anything, excuse me, but to get back to our roots. Um we we have what's called the Mamakura Community House located in zone 8. It's a community center. We we do we have a community fridge. We do uh feed community members twice twice uh twice a month. We do an annual backpack event.

[00:29:15]This August will be our 20th year. We have our our program where we engage um police and community. Uh it's you know it's it's living up to the the standard what King talked about building a beloved community. Um you know we think we think the opposite of povery is uh wealth and actually the opposite of povery is justice and that's where uh you know the intersection where the the round table exists building bringing in a just world a just society.

[00:29:45]>> Yeah. Jim why don't you read some of the questions from our view.

[00:29:48]>> Okay.

[00:29:49]>> Let me get my glasses out. But I I have a couple questions I want you to think about, but I'm going to read some other questions. I want to talk about your backpack giveaway. I want to talk about what's inspirational to me is all your reading that you did when you were incarcerated and how that developed. And another thing changing the mindset of those in corporate leadership. What I really liked about that comment was slogans aren't commitment. And I want you to touch on those, but we're going to get to a couple of our guests.

[00:30:17]>> Team takeovers in various areas.

[00:30:18]Chickens come home to roost. Dan Gilbert's Hudson Center is shaped like a white hand. Thank you, Les. Shows how a person is shaped by social and economic forces. Holy Cross, you touched on that.

[00:30:32]I think what's really relevant is in 2011 the median home price in zone 8, as you identify it, was $6,388.

[00:30:42]>> What does that tell you? $6,388 was the median home value in zone 8 14 years ago. I mean, it tells you the the quality of life and how it has been u shrked and the reality like when we talk about um Detroit and and who's doing well and there there's been numerous of people who who've been left left out and again and this is where a Michigan roundt and numerous other organizations are standing standing at at the margin like we we like democracy should not start with with those who have the most.

[00:31:14]Democracy should start addressing those who have the least. And going back to the question around violence, like we have violence in our in our in this country because it's a violent country.

[00:31:22]>> I agree.

[00:31:23]>> It is a violent country. And so you have young people do duplicating what they see, what they're trained to do. But it's only when we see uh black kids do it that it's a problem. When white kids do it, it's not as as a problem because they're not demonized. Violence should be evil across the board. But also the result of of of giving a damn and helping folks is how we balance that out.

[00:31:46]We have a community fridge on Kirchville. Miss Suzuki. Thank you, Miss Suzuki.

[00:31:52]Did I say shows how a person is shaped by social and economic forces? We talked about that. Um, you read my mind with regards to introducing Dr. Shakur. Yeah, we need to give Dr. Shakur his props here. Um, resources are synonymous with culture. You can change a culture, the behavior improves. That's a great point.

[00:32:11]This is a result of Detroititers's politicians continuously putting their heads in the sand. Miss Suzuki, a great survival situational ship. Miss Sheila, Dr. Yousef, I agree. Major and urban areas have been denied access to proper resources. It's purely by design.

[00:32:30]Do we even talk about it when nothing is going to be done about it? It's by design. Thank you, Goney. Some of the young people are the great grandchildren of zone 8. Mack and Bwick red zone residents.

[00:32:42]The doctor said what he said and the truth that can't be negotiated. The 2024 autopsy, the Democratic Party campaign shows that Dems remain on chaos. It also validates that they continue to take the black vote for granted. Belair Theater is in Detroit. Less. Thanks, Les.

[00:33:00]>> Well, how many people can go? I know where Bella at. How many how many kids can uh access to it if they come down?

[00:33:09]You you should have a a theater downtown. You should have stuff that uh young folks can do. That's >> Well, up you want I mean, not only did did we have it in the Renaissance, we had the Adam theaters downtown.

[00:33:24]>> Yes. And they all closed them all. Yes.

[00:33:27]>> You know, and they and you know, you got clubs. Well, well, you can't get in a club under uh 21, you know, and I, you know, something got to happen and and and and then we we we declare war on these black kids. Yeah. They come down and and now everybody's uh so how can we stop them from coming down? I told somebody when I back when I was in uh high school when Northland a mall was a uh outdoor mall one summer white kids every every weekend they they wreak havoc running around uh going through stores. They was doing the takeover back then. But you know what?

[00:34:16]And and they they didn't panic.

[00:34:18]Authorities didn't panic. you know, uh they they got it under control. But that, you know, kids will be kids. That that that's the attitude. But this attitude here is they a threat to our way of life cuz they they came downtown.

[00:34:35]And you want to address that?

[00:34:38]>> I mean, yeah, that's that's a form of anti-blackness. You know, you see whether it's the reality, the perceived reality downtown is is is white. You know, I mean, some joke call it Gilberttown, right? And the takeover is whether we agree or disagree is is an outcry. It's an outbur to your point of the lack of opportunity to do something.

[00:34:57]I mean, not only did you have uh Adams downtown, you had the Mercury that was on the west side, you had Northwest Theater on the west side. I mean, you had numerous things throughout throughout, but all those things >> on Grand River, the on Grand River. I know all them because we went to we caught the buses and went to those uh places. I mean and so so I mean I hope folks can listen what's being said. Um the the social dynamics of what's being taught to is if you if you don't if you don't give me um opportunity I'm going to create one. You may not like how I created and but the go but your job is should be should be to examine if we say kids are our future and we love our kids then let's examine why are they behaving this way and that will speak loudly because also it would challenge the social power that exists but nobody wants to talk about those things and because it's much deeper than than I mean you guys know what it is but because it now it's a eyesore we want to blame the kids but not the social reality Yeah, this we're going to have a long hot summer and how many swimming pools are open in the city?

[00:36:07]>> Yeah. Well, go that. Do you remember the um the swimmobile? The swim mobile used to come out.

[00:36:12]>> That's right. I forgot about that was that feels like a hundred years ago, >> doctor.

[00:36:19]Our age, right?

[00:36:21]>> Go ahead, ADA.

[00:36:22]>> Yeah, but yeah, we are telling our age and you know the libraries are not open.

[00:36:28]a few are you know uh they have bookmobiles >> are they?

[00:36:34]>> Yeah.

[00:36:35]>> Yeah. So no kids don't have anything and I don't know how uh city leadership can say oh we we gonna do something do what they said midnight basketball most of these kids need to be at home at midnight.

[00:36:51]>> Eric Brown one of our colleagues is joining us. Eric why don't you go ahead and take the floor.

[00:36:56]>> How you doing Dr. Shakur, much respect to you.

[00:36:58]>> What's up? What's going on, good brother?

[00:37:01]>> You know, we met on numerous occasions, been over to the house and helped put lunches together to pass out to the community. So, you're doing a great job and congratulations on your role as the executive director of Round Table.

[00:37:12]>> Thank you. I appreciate you, my brother.

[00:37:17]>> You got a question, Eric?

[00:37:19]>> Yeah. You know, you you were talking about the situation and the team takeover. I mean, it's happening all over the country.

[00:37:27]And you know, I did my show this past Monday talking specifically about it.

[00:37:32]And I think me and Adolf were on the same page as well as um Jim. I think that the leadership in Detroit gave control to the youngsters when they met with them. You know, you can't meet with a minor prisoner without their parent being there. And I think that when she had that meeting with them, it should have been with the parents as well. Mhm.

[00:37:53]>> You know, you you sound like my wife who was a retired educator and and and and she questioned how did how did they meet with uh these juveniles uh without parents sitting there? Uh plus, why would you meet with with with with these kids and you didn't have anything? You know, it's like uh inviting a a hungry person to the table. There's no food there. But you say, "Oh, I'mma I'mma cook it. I'mma I'mma do this and I'mma do that and and I I can't blame the kids saying, "Listen, I don't you you just blowing smoke."

[00:38:33]And uh and and here we are, but probably this weekend you're going to see it someplace else. You know, I I What do you do? You can't You crack down. you call in every cop you got that don't solve the problem just create uh just it just create more chaos you know it's it it just Detroit when you said it's two Detroits no it's four Detroits not only a black Detroit white Detroit there's a rich Detroit and a poor Detroit >> and that goes back >> and we and we see it all the time. We see three schools they brag about and the rest of the schools are in shambles.

[00:39:25]I say if you can put your resources in three schools, why can't you put your uh resources in other schools? When I came back to Detroit, we had 200,000 kids in the uh public schools. We got less than 35,000.

[00:39:41]Now they all all over the place. Plus people not having all these kids like they used to. How do you rebuild a neighborhood?

[00:39:51]Uh, and the only places they got to uh to go grocery shopping is a gas station.

[00:39:59]Hey, you Yeah, it's I I say we got four Detroits. Everybody's Detroit uh the rich Detroit and the white Detroit has been threatened with these team takeovers.

[00:40:13]And they What can we do? Yeah. What What can we do? We can Trump put 1 point something billion dollars slush fund together. That money could go into some of our cities and stuff. Instead, it's it's going to his flunkies and probably he probably applied for some of that too. So >> I think I think that Dr. her arrest the money oligarchs back to his point changing the minds of those in corporate leadership and I think not in a way that that uh you know the oligarchs of Detroit supported Mike Dugen on his right and all of those people have lots of money I don't want to say billions but they may have billions collectively they sure spent their money trying to get uh the mayor elected why aren't they spending their monies in the neighborhoods is the question >> well I mean to answer that But unfortunately the so-called leaders have been bought off. U many of the act community activists are nothing but uh community me mercenaries. Uh they've been bought off as well. So when you when you lose your your your morality, when you lose your um your value system, I mean those who are really holding the front the front lines, they they've been ignored or they've been know written off as crazy. And I think those of us who are holding front lines have to consolidate ourselves. know, even those who appear to be on the right side of history is full of [ __ ] Um, when when you when you get down to the get now, and I think this is an opportunity to a rebirth of of a movement starting from the grassroots. Um, I know the reality too many of us, I mean, I work for a nonprofit. I am executive director at the nonprofit, but that's not going to solve our issues in in the grand scheme of things. We we need to get back to the basics of of grassroots. And once once we re relaunch a grassroot movement with with grandmas and granddaddies and the parents and the kids at the forefront with the right mentality, we we'll get the change. You know, the the change that we seen in in the society has always came from that type of cloth.

[00:42:18]>> But that being said, Dr. Shakur, you know, less brings up a great point with regards to the money and the oligarchs because you can't get back to to the grassroots because those with money will always control the narrative.

[00:42:31]I mean, particularly in where we at right now, um, we we we brought into it again. You guys have everybody has a platform now, right? But we have to be able to get back. What's missing is values. You know, everybody run their mouth, but nobody has the values to govern how we how we want to run our mouths. Like, if we're all talking and we're all chasing the land, the land the landline, you know, we're we're going this is more chaos on top of chaos. And because the people are are being dependent on on individuals who are not qualified, we have to get back to creating a system where we're producing the right type of leadership and we're not dependent on them because ultimately the people is the leadership. We have to cultivate that with the people and we get behind the people.

[00:43:15]>> Well, one of my old friend who no longer is with us, Brenda Hill, said most of these people are are radio revolutionaries.

[00:43:24]They talk big time on the radio, but they not out in the streets trying to make change. And we got we've done had uh organizations in Detroit for over hundred years or so. the Urban League, uh, the NAACP, uh, New Detroit, then New Detroit when when there would be I I'm still trying to figure out at at one time the Urban League was a powerful organization that that dealt with housing discrimination.

[00:43:58]uh the NAACP um they helped break down barriers of of racism and stuff that was uh in this city. But it it doesn't seem that you know these these organizations they there but what do they do?

[00:44:18]>> But you got a you have a bigger problem now Adolf Dr. Shakur and Jim because you have all these keyboard warriors, you know, they hide behind screen names, talk a lot of junk, but then they're they are not in the community to change the community, >> right? But I think it's it's it's the it's both. It's a both end and I think for me flipping it back like so know the premiere is June 25th, the documentary, it it talks about those type of things.

[00:44:48]And then on June 26, we're doing a comm a free event for people in the community, right? And and this is this is the duality of this struggle. Like duality again where what where I'm I I'm tasked with running an organization. I'm tasked with fundraising for an organization, but also I'm tasked with being my authentic self. My I'm tasked with serving people. So again, if I if I if I have event that's just for, as Adolf said, for for the rich, but I'm not doing nothing for the poor, >> that's a contradiction, and and we all live with contradiction. But the challenge is, are you are you willing to confront your contradiction? Are you willing to face that to resolve that for the for the people that you're trying to serve? Because ultimately, the people I'm trying to serve is the ones I want on the 26th. The people I'm just trying to shake hands with the ones I want on the 25th.

[00:45:36]What what uh is this a documentary? What it cost? Is it free?

[00:45:41]>> So again, on the 20 the 25th, that's a premiere. That's that's a char a paid event. And then on June 26, that's that's a free event for community members particular. We want mothers who have raising sons. We want fathers, we want community, all folks that that need to need to be there who's trying to get activated, the kids that that that's that's troubled. uh we consider viting the opportunity to to have a dialogue afterwards to create a um a plan of action to address some of the things not not only just recently but just in general.

[00:46:13]>> Yeah, we you you got to come back.

[00:46:17]>> I'd love to come back man >> before he goes couple of our comments.

[00:46:21]Ad off can we?

[00:46:22]>> Yeah, go ahead.

[00:46:23]>> Hazel Park Tru keyboard warriors just kid donuts and coffee. Thank you for joining us. Thanks for being a part of the show. I was expecting footage of Detroit in black and white, not some old heads. He must be talking about you and me, Adolf. So, >> well, I'm old head. I I don't have a problem.

[00:46:39]>> The bottom line is the oppressed have no military.

[00:46:43]People who don't have money always hating on us that do to brag. Nobody's hating. I think to brag, I get I get your point. Um I I I think we're looking for solutions and and maybe Dr. Kirk can hit hit on this for just a second. I I've always argued that it's a public private partnership that can that can solve the problems of the big cities.

[00:47:06]It's not one or the other. It's both.

[00:47:08]>> I agree with that. I I think again I think what's missing there there's an unedge like know our current well some people say leadership or misleadership is ser is leaning more to towards the wealthy than not challenge the wealthy to use that wealth to to to better the community. to your point, finding that balance. Like you don't have to be you don't have to be from poverty to help a [ __ ] You just got to give a damn. You got to be authentically willing to to reduce yourself to be over what's going cuz cuz at the end of the day when we go when we go use the bathroom, we all we all men. We all standing up. I don't know if you wealthy, unworthy, right? But until we start talking, then we get to know each other, right? But this what is your values and and we don't have to be in agreement. But if we can believe about making the world better, then because it's actually through disagreement that we can find harmony.

[00:47:58]>> But we have to have the warriors at the table that's not going to compromise.

[00:48:01]And that's the biggest problem. We got people that's compromising.

[00:48:04]>> I don't think anybody hates people for having money. We talked about on this show in the past in 2013. Some of those money people helped save part of the city of Detroit. They they put money into public safety. They put money into communities. They saved the DIA. all those things. So, nobody here's hating on people that have money. Where are your resources going is a question. I'm sorry, Adolf. Go right ahead.

[00:48:27]>> But what people hate is uh the city has uh put all these incentives for uh young folks from the suburbs to move in. They was giving them money uh getting them uh first crack at uh reduced rents and everything else.

[00:48:47]That's what people resent. And what about the folks that haven't done been here and I stayed here and uh and they get left out. They get left out. You know, we we we get uh shopping downtown and not and it's not a lot, but they get nothing over in the neighborhoods. Now, our new administration said they going to build a thousand new homes and stuff, and I'm waiting to see how that going to play out. And so, you know, >> so do again, Dr. Shakur has an event on June 25th at the Charles Wright Museum, uh, at 5:00 PM. Teresa, can we get that up? Redemption Road. It's hosted I saw it. There's an is it an actor? That's >> Oh, yeah. Yep. Uh Tim Timothy Starks will be will be our host.

[00:49:37]>> Timothy uh Starks will be the host. And Dr. Shakur is the director, executive director, my earlier mistake of the Michigan roundt for just communities and he has a fascinating story and we hope to have him back in short.

[00:49:52]>> Yeah, I would love I would love to come back on man. I would after how after after you play and etc. We we can come back and talk about it.

[00:50:03]>> Yeah, it would be my honor and pleasure, man. Thank you guys for having me on.

[00:50:06]>> Thank you. uh a school a school district need need somebody like you to uh advise them cuz they don't have it over there.

[00:50:16]I'm telling >> and if you if you need inspiration check out check out Dr. Shakur story a great story a great story >> I appreciate it anybody want to learn more they can go to uh mir.org org to learn more about where you can get tickets and just about me and the organization in general. I appreciate you, brothers. We'll get that on our website.

[00:50:37]>> All right, guys. Peace.

[00:50:40]>> That that can be a movie.

[00:50:44]>> I agree.

[00:50:45]>> That's a guy that never quit quit getting getting better and better and uh this is what we see. And that >> his life can um be a movie and I'm not sure if either one of you have met him personally or in you know live in person but he has a heck of a story and to hear him tell it face to face is just amazing.

[00:51:03]>> Yeah it is. Uh Miss Shaya how you doing?

[00:51:07]>> I'm making an effort. Gentlemen I want to thank you for having Dr. Shakur on your show. That was a wonderful uh presentation that he gave and I definitely will be at the premiere. But I I want to share something with you guys about the fact that um the mayor did meet with some um youth and I think those are more the children that wanted solutions so they can be teenagers, you know, because nowadays kids can't even be teenagers. take the key they girlfriend to the park and relax without being bullied and all that kind of stuff. I think they want to be safe and the ones that she met with is the ones that wanted to be safe. Not that's just my eyes looking at those those kids wanted solutions. Now the ones that caused that chaos, I bet you they wouldn't meeting with the uh mayor if that makes sense to you.

[00:52:09]>> Oh, it makes sense. And uh the the city don't have solutions. Like I said, you you you invite a hungry person to the uh uh dinner table and you got no food to serve them only that we gonna cook it >> and you give them false hope.

[00:52:27]>> Yeah. Right. You know that that work that way.

[00:52:32]>> I got you. But my my thing, >> let's just try to do whatever we can as individuals to help our city. Whatever it takes and the ones that the uh shareholders like us that's here, we still trying to fight through it and help them out. If that makes sense.

[00:52:52]>> That makes sense. And >> push back. Um Sheila though, you know, you say that those that met with her initially, my only push back on that is that if you know, the stuff is all over social media. So they were the ones concerned about fixing the city, they were aware that social media with regards to last Saturday and last Sunday. So they wanted to be the U fixers, they should have been downtown last Saturday and Sunday trying to get those youngsters not to do what they were doing last night.

[00:53:19]>> No, you can't. Eric, if you were down there, and I was down there one of the Saturdays, uh, the kids, the police couldn't control them. So, the kid ain't going kids ain't going to uh control another kid.

[00:53:35]>> No, they was asking for help. They was ask, "Hey, but guess what? This weekend is a weekend full of a whole lot of drugs. A a lot of bars staying open at 12:00 noon. I don't know if y'all know about that movement, but that movement is is some kids really having uh a good time all night long.

[00:54:00]>> Yeah. The the the bar is going to be open. Well, it's legal if they want to.

[00:54:05]They stay >> 12:00 noon. Look, >> look. Masonic Temple is open to 12:00 noon.

[00:54:14]>> What's that? What's that bar behind um uh the uh Mottown on a um Holden Street?

[00:54:22]It's a like a a warehouse that's going to be open to 12:00 noon. So, I'm I'm saying to say it's going to be a lot going on this weekend.

[00:54:34]>> Well, well, I I'm I'm taking notes because I can go. No, but anyway, you right. This technical people, they from all over the world.

[00:54:45]>> Yes.

[00:54:46]>> All over the world. And with >> And they doing a bunch of drugs.

[00:54:51]>> Yeah. Well, >> the movement is drug infested.

[00:54:56]>> Yeah. And they gonna be up all night at Masonic Temple and whatever. That club is a warehouse behind um the um you know the Mottown Review on some Holden Street right behind. There's a several clubs I know that stay open to 4 or 5 anyway.

[00:55:17]>> I said 12 noon.

[00:55:19]>> Yeah, but I don't know how anybody can get be a drunk for 12 hours. Well, >> that ain't drunk. That's something.

[00:55:26]That's That's speed and all the other stuff. Adolf, that's how they keep.

[00:55:29]>> Yeah, they up all night. They up all night and they partying. You hear me?

[00:55:35]>> Yeah.

[00:55:35]>> Reed knows what's going on. The Marble Bar. Thank you. Oh, that's the name of it. Marvin >> Kenneth Reed is he's our he's our go-to.

[00:55:43]He's the encyclopedia black and white.

[00:55:46]>> But see what's going to be interesting what's gonna be interesting is next weekend during the Grand Prix when you have a different type of crowd from all over the world.

[00:55:54]>> Well, listen, somebody said and I and I heard this before that the mayor should have her own round table with the parents and stuff.

[00:56:04]>> I show up. Somebody told me they need to have a teen summit, you know.

[00:56:11]>> That that makes sense. I remember back with the school girl race in the 80s, Coleman Young had a a a a community summit. He had corporate uh neighborhood people, educators, etc. and they dealt with what uh the the the problem that was happening to our uh girls that was walking to school uh early in the morning. So, they got to do something and it and it's not promising uh making promises. It's about uh having solutions to uh what we going to have downtown for these kids or in the neighborhood. It's going to be downtown.

[00:56:54]It got to be more than uh a basketball court. You know, we gave $40 million to the Pistons to build a training facility. Uh the owner gave us a basketball court in Ruth Park.

[00:57:10]That that that's the that's been our problem.

[00:57:14]>> And Warrior brings up a good point. You said, "Rememberwami's hip hop summit? Who benefited from that?" It's no different than in the NW NAACP when they buried the n-word and then a week later the mayor who was at the burying of the n-word was using the n-word.

[00:57:33]>> Well, he dug it up. So, you know, >> and Spartan Warrior thoughtwami Summit was cool. Thank you, Spartan Warrior, for being a part of the show tonight.

[00:57:42]Uh, what can the kids afford downtown Spartan Warrior again? Stephanie Jackson, God bless all. Thank you for that uplifting, upbeat comment there, Stephanie. We appreciate you. Uh Les talks about there was there was a hit uh with there was a a month or two old baby in a car and a man and woman were killed. I believe that was on the on the east side.

[00:58:03]>> Yeah. Mckin Street over on the east side this past Thursday.

[00:58:06]>> Not getting a lot of press. Nobody's talking about >> I I I that as a a former newspaper reporter, I think I figured out who who killed him >> cuz they left little baby.

[00:58:18]>> I knew you say that.

[00:58:21]>> Yeah, that listen and it it that just the way it is, you know. Well, that was a that was a um that was a social media that was a social media um hit from what >> it don't it don't it don't take a a rocket scientist to figure out who who did what you know and and people already uh know uh who who who who pulled the trigger on that. And the police said, "We got no uh suspects."

[00:58:58]>> Okay.

[00:58:58]>> And see the other story that that's um trending right now, you had that 22 year old guy that got shot and killed at the gas station. 25 year old guy killed him. They beefing over 16 year old girl and a 22 year old deceased was a father of the five-month old baby. So, wherever the parents at with regards to allowing a what 21-year-old guy to be dating their 15 year old daughter and impregnating her.

[00:59:28]>> Did you say 15 or 16?

[00:59:30]>> She was 15 at the time she got pregnant.

[00:59:32]But there was also the the other the the the um third person is a 25 year old man. So, she was dating both of them.

[00:59:41]>> So, how your daughter dating a 25 year old man when she's only 15 16?

[00:59:45]>> Exactly. Warrior identified that.

[00:59:49]Yeah, the parents parents got to be >> no supervision.

[00:59:54]>> No supervision.

[00:59:56]>> Well, >> yeah.

[00:59:58]>> Where are the parents? That's the question.

[01:00:00]>> Spartan answer.

[01:00:03]>> Your final comment, Miss Sheila.

[01:00:06]Well, what I have to say about our kids in our community, we got to deal with their social emotional behavior and also get them some trades so they can be independent individuals and don't have to depend on anybody else if that makes sense.

[01:00:25]>> Okay, that's good. Thank you. And Eric, your your final uh thought on this?

[01:00:32]Well, my final thought is Facebook reminded me that this past Monday was the one year anniversary of my show. I had no idea. So again, thank you Adolf for the opportunity and thank you Facebook for reminding me.

[01:00:44]>> Well, that's why I don't have Facebook.

[01:00:47]I don't need a computer to tell me something.

[01:00:51]Well, thanks Eric. And and the name of your show >> Reality Strikes >> on what day?

[01:00:58]>> On Mondays, but I will not be I will not be airing it this Monday. But on June the 1st, I will have Jimmy Green of Jimmy Green and Associates on as my guest >> because he uh he was a former supporter of the mayor and we might get some insight on why the former mayor dropped out of the race.

[01:01:16]>> Okay. Okay. Good. And and uh Jim uh your final thought.

[01:01:21]>> My final thought, Janet, overall thank you for the great show. Thank you to all our guests. Thank you for uh our guests that are commenting and thank you to our guest Dr. Ysef Bunchie Shakur. Uh a fascinating story from from a brilliant man. Uh Dr. Shakur. Uh June 25th at the Charles Wright Museum.

[01:01:40]>> And and and you're right. Uh uh Jim, I'm glad you uh uh introduced him and and talked about some of the things that he did cuz I just went straight to my journalism mode, you know, like like he a question and answer, you know, and he has he has great credentials, but it's just where he came from, you know, where he didn't know how to read. He he was semi illiterate and he got educated and when he was talking about meeting his father in jail my mind you know >> I remember the HBO show. You ever see Oz?

[01:02:27]>> I never did.

[01:02:28]>> Yeah.

[01:02:29]>> You see? That's a classic joke. is a classic prison show where the grandson met the father and the grandfather in >> in prison. Yeah.

[01:02:41]>> As that as like man I said that is that is true you know. So yes, and he had a father who who unfortunately was uh incarcerated too, but had a father that became a father there and and and g and gave him and gave him whatever he gave him. He he he it's magic because when he left out of there, he got it together.

[01:03:12]>> Yes, he did. So yes, I uh he has a fascinating story. We need to get him back on. I want to thank everybody that uh participated uh in in the show and you know and I'm not uh anti- young people.

[01:03:33]I'm just that, you know, I don't think we need to be negotiating with kids, but what we need to be doing is uh have solutions to uh what they lack here in the city. It's like your own kids. You feed them, you clothe them, you educate them, plus you make sure they uh enjoy life, too.

[01:03:58]Uh so that's what we got to do to our kids in Detroit. you know, you educate them, you make sure that they quality of life is is is just like everybody uh other kids out in and other places and and we don't have that. And they letting us know, you know, we can screw things up if you don't get your act together.

[01:04:22]We'll be back here tomorrow. We gonna have Chief James Craig, former Chief James Craig talking about that, you know, cuz he told me he got if he was a police chief that he would do some stuff differently that uh that we'll see.

[01:04:42]See you tomorrow.