BFHS 6/3/26: Cap Casualties

Added: 2026-06-03

[00:00:02]All right, rise and grind. Matthew Fairberg, I'm all I'm all settled in to my messy workplace.

[00:00:10]This space is cluttered. So, let's have a quick show today so I can uh maybe clean this up before really diving into the workday. How does that sound? A June edition of the Baker Fairburn Hockey Show.

[00:00:24]Wednesday, June 3rd, 2026. I am your host, Chris Baker. You can find me on X at Savers Prospects, sometimes tweeting about Jake Rashard, who was brought into the fold on an entry- level contract. There was a 22 plus minute video of all of Jake Rashard's goals scored during his time at Yukon. Nice little offseason highlight package for Sabres fans over there on the uh Twitter feed. You can go check that out. And the guy that I'm talking to blindly, if you're listening with me as always, his name is Matthew Fairburn. Matthew is a Sabres writer for theathletic.comsabers.

[00:01:04]Get over to the athletic. It's June.

[00:01:07]It's draft season.

[00:01:09]The Bills will be heating up before you know it. Shiny new stadium over there across from the old barn in Orchard Park. Lots happening over at the Athletic, including comprehensive coverage of the Stanley Cup final with Vegas getting uh the early edge on Carolina on Tuesday night. Exciting game, Matthew Fairburn. I don't know if you watched that game at all last night.

[00:01:33]>> I had to tuck in early to make sure I got a good sleep score for this podcast here. So, I missed the exciting finish there from from Vegas. I didn't have the greatest sleep score because I was watching the game last night, but I'm here on time. And you're on time today, too. It's a new Matthew Fairbird >> offse, man. Offse. Yeah, I've got my >> semi-preferred sleep schedule is waking up early before 6:00 a.m. and getting a start on the day. But during the season, it's not so easy. You know, with the uh getting home from the rink at midnight some nights, it's it's hard to find that rhythm. So, it's nice here a couple weeks into the offseason to be back in back in rhythm.

[00:02:16]>> No, love to see it. Love to see it. I I went down, you know, I got everything set up here. Went down, got the coffee.

[00:02:22]I can usually putter around and Matthew's big face is on my computer screen when I sit back down at the desk.

[00:02:28]I was surprised. But um if you were surprised, like this video, subscribe to the Savers Prospects YouTube channel, hit the notification bell so you know when a new episode is ready to go and you can find the Baker Fairburn Hockey Show on Apple, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts and leave a fivestar review if you could. That would be greatly appreciated. All right, Matthew Fairburn. It is June 3rd, but there's always things to talk about with the Buffalo Sabres, and clock's ticking on a lot of things here.

[00:03:02]The draft's going to be coming up in a few short weeks, free agency to follow, and all signs point to the Sabres having a different look next season. I guess it's just a matter of how different will the Buffalo Sabres look come training camp in the fall. So this week over at the athletic, Matthew reviewed the current and future cap implications with a focus on some of the difficult decisions that Yarmmo Kalinan and his staff need to make ahead of next season.

[00:03:36]And you know, when you break it down, nearly a third of those with contracts for next season kind of have questions surrounding them as potential cap casualties. So, look, last week Matthew and I spent a lot of time talking about scenarios that involve Alex Tuck being retained by the Sabres. Clock is ticking on the Tuck situation.

[00:04:03]And I suspect a lot of today's discussion will be centered around what happens if Alex Tuck walks. But Matthew, it it probably starts with identifying, you know, the core pieces and building the schematic out from there and and maybe, you know, talking about some of those potential cap casualties that you identified this week over at the athletic.

[00:04:27]Yeah, I would say it's pretty easy to identify the core pieces that are not moving under pretty much any circumstance.

[00:04:40]And there's not a lot of them, which is part of what makes the the offseason so interesting is that they could go in a number of different directions to try to reshape this roster, excuse me, and make it work because Tage Thompson's contract is too good to trade. You're keeping Tae Thompson, he's your difference maker up front and he makes 7 million bucks. Too good of a contract to trade. Rasmus Alene isn't going anywhere. Um, contract isn't, you know, an insane value, but he's your best player. Matias Samuelson not going anywhere after the season he had 4 million bucks, really great contract, big part of what you're doing. Zack Benson, I would say, not going anywhere.

[00:05:31]Um, I would say even if he, and I don't suspect he would do this, but even if he wanted to pull a JJ Purka, uh, the answer would be too bad. You know, they have team control for a long time and he's not going anywhere. Josh Don locked up, not going anywhere. So, that gives you five. And I think those are the five absolute no-brainer.

[00:05:58]They're not going anywhere. And then I feel like >> a next group, right? Like a next cluster. Yeah.

[00:06:03]>> I feel like there's another tier that's like, well, probably not. But if you were really compelled, I put Owen Power at the top of that group. Like he's almost in the first group. But it kind of depends on what else is happening, right?

[00:06:23]If there's an insane offer for Owen Power, you know, I think you think about it, but you don't think about it unless you have Bow and Byum committed to signing long-term because I think when you think about that top four, keeping the whole four together is a nice idea. Keeping three of the four together is essential, I think, to what they will be next year and in future years. and they have three of them already locked up on fair deals. I think P's deal will actually continue to age quite nicely. So P's almost in that group, but it's sort of dependent on everything else. Then you have the group of young prospects that you're only moving if you're acquiring like a star level talent, right? a legit top of the lineup center most likely. I mean the right winger I guess could compel you, but that's Osceland Koulik and Helenus.

[00:07:33]Those three are sort of in that group of guys that you don't necessarily want to trade, but you'll probably have to if you want Robert Thomas, Nicoisher, one of those level of players if they become available.

[00:07:53]Beyond that, I feel like we have some interesting conversations. Unless you feel like I missed anybody in the quote unquote uh untouchable or like that feels like your most valuable cluster of players. I think I named nine guys and four of them aren't moving unless it is a ridiculous deal. And beyond that, everybody else, if you get a phone call, I think you're listening long and hard on just about everybody else. And we can debate the order and, you know, put these guys into different categories, but to me, those are your nine right there that could represent kind of the future of what you're doing.

[00:08:45]>> Yeah. No goalender on that list.

[00:08:48]not a whole lot of um you know I would say bonafide maybe twothirds of a top line are on that list if you include Benson up there with Thompson and those are two guys that I can easily see playing wing next season uh whether they're together you know opposite each other on what we would call the top unit or not we could debate that down the road a lot depends on how Yarmmo and his staff act in the next couple of weeks here but no the only guy I think you nailed it the any guy, you know, power.

[00:09:18]I get really, especially after seeing him in the playoffs, I get really um intrigued about how he's going to look next year and moving forward. I think you also nailed it when you said that that contract could age well. That's where I, you know, overwhelmingly lean in that direction.

[00:09:40]>> Five, you could bump him up. But but the reason that I think you nailed it by keeping him maybe in that that fringe of that group or you know overlapping um is that in it's all about the return that you can get for him. And we said this a year ago that there would be 31 teams likely saying yeah I'm in. If you're you're looking at moving Owen power I'm in. you could get a substantial return for a player like that. And with your top pair locked up, who you were already included on this list, Dene and Samuelson, you know, I I think that that doesn't firmly put him in there. But I mean, I for all intents and purposes, he's in that core moving forward. That's kind of wanted to just add a little layer to the discussion with Owen Power. I mean, I think that he's going to be good to go moving forward.

[00:10:31]>> And it's hard to move him, you know, based on the Bow and Byum conversation that we teased last week that we'll probably dive deeper into here. Like, he has one year left on his deal. He's staring down unrestricted free agency. I don't think you can move all in power without Bow and Bum locked up. And I feel like this has been an ongoing back and forth kind of debate of who you would rather have long term.

[00:10:58]I would rather have Owen Power right now locked up $8.3 million and I think Bow and Byum is the fourth best of the group right now. So, or you know, when I think about potential down the road, like maybe there was definitely games where he was a top two, there was games where he was their best defenseman, but on the whole and where I see it going from here, like I was encouraged by what I saw from Owen Power this year. And the fact that you already have him locked up is a big difference maker for me when it comes to deciding how this shakes out. If there's a 10th guy to throw in here who I forgot, it's Sam Carrick and it's a different category, but he makes a million bucks and he's probably not going anywhere, right? Like if you're reserving roster spots.

[00:11:53]>> Yeah.

[00:11:53]>> Uh that's a good contract.

[00:11:55]>> I mean, if you had to if he was a throwin in a deal, he's certainly not in the same category because we're sort of talking about the core that you're building around. But when you're talking about 26 27, I'm reserving a spot for a guy that makes a million bucks and can anchor my fourth line. Showed a lot of good things when he was here.

[00:12:16]>> It's fascinating thinking about Byum and you have the tuck thing lingering right now. It's it's you know you've you've heard Yarmmo talk about building from the defense out in the past and it makes you wonder you know the dollars aren't exactly the same but if he had one choice knowing that philosophy exists where he really is kind of defenseoriented it seems when putting his roster together. He hinted at that. But I mean he mentioned it I think in his end of season presser I wonder who he would choose like if he had one main priority is it and it's not the same again because you still have Bowen Byum under contract but long term is it Bram or Tuck that he would elect to lock up and just go to market because I think with the cap going up you can commit a lot of dollars to your blue line it's not ideal but you can especially if you have some young horses for you know a good chunk >> well you have you've got Samuel and so cheap that you can make up for it in other ways, right? You can I I think about that up front. It's like, okay, you could overpay a little bit on somebody because Ta Thompson makes seven when he probably should be making 10, right? And you know, that helps balance things out a little bit. It's just the short-term pain that they're going to be dealing with with the cap this season that is going to force some difficult decisions.

[00:13:47]And you want to make sure the decisions you make this summer aren't ones that you're going to regret next summer, two, three summers from now. And I've been thinking about this more in terms of like it's not so much we had the conversation about Alex Tuck's longevity and that doesn't concern me as much as it concerns some other people about the type of player he could be at 35 36. But what I look at is the opportunity cost, right? Because if you're locking him up to 9 and a half or close to 10, you know, what are you missing out on next summer, the summer after that? The cap keeps going up. I mean, it's crazy to think about, but Conor McDavid's a free agent in a couple summers. You know, Austin Matthews is a free agent.

[00:14:41]Not to say those guys are going to hit market, but they could become available, right? And other players like that. You know, we're going to see a changing landscape. there's going to be opportunity to acquire players. And so, not that you want to leave 15 million open to maybe get Conor McDavid, but you do want to keep yourself keep your, you know, keep yourself flexible as much as you possibly can.

[00:15:05]And I think >> you can do that with Tuck at the right number because, as we've discussed, he would be tradable. You can certainly do it with Byum at the right number, but I think what you're what you're probably hinting at here is that they're entering into a similar spot with Byum that they're currently in with Tuck. And with Tuck, if he walks away, I will blame nobody.

[00:15:39]Like if he walks away and the Sabres get nothing, that's life. Like his situation was unique in that his connection to this franchise, his connection to the Jack Eel trade, what he meant in the locker room. Now, maybe if there's somebody to blame, it would be the previous GM, you know, not stepping up with a serious enough offer to get him locked up before the season. But even that, I limit the blame a bit because Alex Tuck was sitting there wondering if he could win, right?

[00:16:19]>> The the Sabres hadn't won. And I think he, you know, the fact that he took it this far leads me to believe he was willing to take it this far all along. And so it might have been hard for Kevin Adams to lock him up. But I do think there there wasn't a real, you know, highlevel offer um in the neighborhood of what we're talking about. I don't think that was made necessarily last summer. But that's such a different situation because of what he's meant to the team on and off the ice. Byum, like if you let Byum get to that point, then it it starts to feel like you should have seen it coming, right?

[00:17:07]Because last summer, even though they can't negotiate a contract until July 1st, you know, or agree to a contract until July 1st, Yarmmo should know where Bo Byron stands. He was here last summer for the whole saga of will he, won't he sign, is he going to get traded.

[00:17:29]He signed the two-year contract to get to unrestricted free agency. So, if you can't get a real firm commitment, I do think you have to entertain the idea of moving that contract. And that leads us into the this second piece of the conversation, which is which big cap hits could move. Byum's a logical spot to start because he's one of the bigger numbers. like him and Norris are the two biggest numbers that I feel like you could think about moving and neither one is an ideal piece to move like for different reasons, but Byum played great this year. He's awesome in the room. He's a great leader. Showed up as a guy that kind of elevated in the playoffs, at least in the first round against Boston. And so theoretically, there's a lot of value out there for him. And the only way you think about trading him, I think, is if you're uncomfortable with his commitment level to signing a long-term deal, which you should get a pretty good idea of by around draft time, I would think. And that's going to be up to the player. But do you want another situation where you're letting a core piece type of guy, you know, walk to free agency for nothing and trading him at the deadline doesn't make any sense because you're going to be in the playoff race. So, I guess you have to just decide if you're comfortable potentially letting him walk or taking it down to the wire.

[00:19:10]And it's a sim, it's basically the exact same conversation we had with Tuck last year, right? Like you have to figure out how come because we thought about the idea of moving Tuck last summer if those initial conversations made you feel like I don't know like and you can wait like you could wait to trade Byum until August, you know, it doesn't have to be a um >> doesn't have to be a June move. So you can get down to brass tax of the negotiations in July, but you do have to think about that. I feel I can weigh back and forth the the riskreward of letting him drag this out for the whole year.

[00:19:48]>> Yeah. If Tuck leaves this off season, you can't have that happen two years in a row where you hold your player, it's an own rental and you lose him. I I think that look Yarmmo has said that he wants to block Byum up.

[00:20:07]He may also he can say that also fully knowing that he's likely not going to be able to.

[00:20:14]We saw Byum change his agent last year and I understand you know it's Darren Ferris and Ferris has a documented track record of advising his clients to go to unrestricted free agency. doesn't mean Bo will, but and by the way, Bo made that change before the Sabres had made the playoffs.

[00:20:39]How does making the playoffs change Bo's position on his long-term desire to stay in Buffalo?

[00:20:49]I don't know, but it may not be much.

[00:20:52]>> It's tough to know. It was the first thing out of his mouth when I asked him, >> you know, what he's going to weigh when it comes time to decide whether he's willing to sign in Buffalo long term.

[00:21:05]And, you know, he was kind of like, I signed my contract last summer. I didn't think I'd have to talk about this for a while. And I I didn't have the microphone anymore, but I thought about saying, you know, should have signed more than a two-year deal. Like, that's kind of how this works. It's been a year. But he mentioned he doesn't want to lose anymore. Like that's number one.

[00:21:24]But then he also mentioned, you know, personally, you have to think about stuff like your role and then, you know, different things like that and your fit. And when I hear role, I think, is this still a guy that in the back of his head wants to be the top dog somewhere? he wants to be running the top power play or wants to be on that top pair or at least wants to be paid and recognized as a top pair level defenseman. Whereas right now I feel like obviously Rasmus Alien is the top dog, but I actually do feel like the top two pairs share the responsibility of being the top pair. Like >> look at the minutes all year when they were rolling the top four guys out there. the the minutes distribution was minor separation based on special teams >> and Bum got to run the second power play for a good stretch of the year. Power and Bum were getting a lot of the tough defensive minutes, you know, a lot of the tough matchups.

[00:22:31]That's where I when I think about power by now compared to Power Byum a year and a half ago.

[00:22:39]You know, I used to be in the the spot of, well, power could get you more, right, in a trade, and, you know, there's probably not a great deal of separation. Now, I'm in the spot of, you know, and Bum hasn't said too much about his role, but we've heard some of the the reporting and then he did mention it in that answer, right? Like, you have to think about your role and then you you can kind of connect the dots. Like power is already locked up.

[00:23:10]Power was moved off of the second power play and you didn't hear a word, right?

[00:23:14]Like power for the faults and the criticism that he's gotten. You know, I feel like you just know what you have there and there's no question like he's locked up. And when Byum is in a a gray area here, like it's definitely a a phone call you have to take. And it's a good n like 6.25 is a good number for him if you keep him. You know, I don't I don't see a major problem with keeping him.

[00:23:48]But to your point, letting him walk for nothing and having that happened to you two years in a row, that's tough. So it feels like if you move him, do you make a stronger push to keep Tuck in that case? Like if you can get rid of that money? Well, I I almost see it the other way. So, just on Byron, by the way, being in a situation where he can win, he plays a big part in that team winning if he stays.

[00:24:19]Your most recent memories of the season were the top four being the engine.

[00:24:25]And I think that that's just kind of an interesting layer to that whole I want to win discussion. It's like Bo, you play a huge part in this system with these four defenseman just rolling them out and you can probably do it for a couple more years in the way that they did it with those four and and sprinkle in some of the young guys maybe like a Murka if they keep him everything else.

[00:24:46]But what I will say though to your point is Tuck's that big domino. I see it the other way because you were asking basically if you lose Tuck then you sign Bo. Not necessarily.

[00:24:58]If you loose tuck. You have a void to fill in your forward group, particularly in your top six, particularly with that probably on your top line. And Bo Byum might be one of the best ways that you can fill that void if you move Byum out.

[00:25:16]>> I I think you're right. And I one more thing on Bo because I I thought of it while you were talking there about the winning piece, right?

[00:25:25]>> He's a major part of why they won last year. I in my head I'm thinking look at some point this is similar to the conversation we had with Tuck. like unrestricted free agency, the idea of it is great. Once you get there, who's lining up and if if it really is about role and it's about top power play or top pair, I think a real question, and this is probably not a question that Bo Byum's asking himself, but a question I can ask is, is a team with Bo Byum on its top pair going to win? Like, will those go together?

[00:26:05]>> Matt, you read my mind. Like he has to be really good.

[00:26:09]>> Like is he that guy?

[00:26:09]>> He's going to get paid to be in that role. Yes.

[00:26:12]>> He's not Dene, right? He's not D.

[00:26:14]>> I don't think he is that guy, honestly.

[00:26:16]>> Yeah. So, like will those two things go together? The role you want and winning?

[00:26:20]Maybe not, right? Like I I think you could end up being >> a top pair guy and running the top power play on a team that's not very good. And on the teams that are really good, they probably have a guy. That's why they're really good. So yeah, I think that part of it is is tricky and at some point you just have to have that realization as a player like what is more important winning or you know and I'm a little I I don't know what the dollars look like on Byum on his next deal. But if he hits unrestricted free agency, they could look they could look really good. Also, is the threat of unrestricted free agency gonna put a dent in his trade value potentially depending on where he goes? Unless he goes to a place that he feels pretty good. But if Darren Ferris, like I'm looking at it right now, he's in a place where he's winning. He's in a place where to my eye he's pretty happy or at least he was, you know, this year.

[00:27:20]What if he go, you know, gets traded to a place like where he's not so confident? I mean, San Jose would be a place where theoretically that role is available to him and there's a young group coming up and and maybe he can win. There's other places that you could pinpoint, but if he goes into a place where he's like, I'm not so sure about this. I got to get a feel for it, you know, does that put a dent in his trade value if he's not committed to an extension right when right when he moves? So, it's interesting, but you you rais a good point that if they lose Tuck, moving Bum is probably one of the ways, not the only way, but one of the ways they could get to a top six or really a top line forward. And I think you're talking about a center in that case because in a way the way you fill the void of losing Tuck is moving Tage Thompson to right wing.

[00:28:17]>> Yep.

[00:28:18]>> And you have Ta Thompson, Josh Don, Jack Quinn as your top three guys on the right side. Pretty good. Not bad. But then you need to figure out the middle and you need to look at it and say, is Josh Norris that guy up top? You know, you have Norris, you have Mloud, you have probably Consta Helenus. I I think he's the one that I I'm like ready to say is a center as the group looks right now.

[00:28:55]If they add a better center, then maybe that conversation could change, but you put Oscelin on the wing and you know, you still have to find room for Yuri Koulik in this scenario. And you still probably need a better number one center than Josh.

[00:29:13]>> It's not just moving out money this off seasonason. It's moving out bodies with the tuck thing, right? But it's also mobilizing and rebuilding your forward top six really. I like I you know what my offseason is because we talked about it a little bit already yesterday, you know, but um because you mentioned the right side, your right wingers look good. I think they could afford to do some work on the left side, too, and we'll get to that, but >> I think the left side is where they had the most trouble figuring out the guys.

[00:29:47]And finally, I mean, when Payton Krebs is on your top line going into the playoffs, then you have a little bit of a problem. And Pton Krebs made that line work for a long time, but like that is not an ideal situation for a playoff team in my opinion. So, yeah, they figured it out with Benson up there. But I would say, you know, you have Benson among your left left shot wingers.

[00:30:12]Benson, Zooker, Krebs who can play a little bit of center. Osland I think for now Osland for me is a winger because until he figures out how to take faceoffs, >> well that too, >> he's been really bad on faceoffs. He's great defensively. like he can handle the center ice position, but you you want like he just needs to be better on draws and I don't know if that's going to happen in one summer. Maybe it will. Um but yeah, also there's just not room for him in the middle at the moment. like but those top you know it's not a bad situation but it does feel like if there's a spot to upgrade and slot guys appropriately but it's so weird the way this this offseason works is every conversation brings you to another another conversation right like we're talking about Bo Byum and moving out Bo Byum opens up the conversation of okay who's taking his spot are you betting on Kessle ring or you going out and getting somebody And let's not forget, by the way, that they almost acquired Colton Pareo. Why did they almost acquire Colton Pereco?

[00:31:26]>> Cuz I think Yarmmo knew >> he knows about Bo, right? Like it >> right. That's like it's or he has another like it's either Bo or or Power, right?

[00:31:38]And I think because of the reasons we laid out, power doesn't seem very likely as a guy that you know, but like you weren't acquiring Pareco and keeping the other four long term.

[00:31:51]So obviously there's uh you know already in the back of his head he was planning.

[00:32:01]He wasn't just loading up for this year.

[00:32:03]He was thinking about next year and beyond. Like that to me was a bow and bum >> situation that we can't really forget about.

[00:32:11]>> And then up front, you know, you you have the same kind of domino effect.

[00:32:14]It's like, okay, if you how do you feel about Zooker in those top three wings or you know, >> man, there's a lot of decisions these guys have to make.

[00:32:24]>> There's a lot of decisions and they have to do it pretty quickly here. Like I think Yarmmer already knows what his ideal offseason looks like. Let's just kind of settle in. I think because I don't want to go through the eight names. I think it was eight that you had listed in the athletic one by one. I think that some of those names are going to come out in the discussion as we talk about scenarios.

[00:32:44]And I think the scenario that we really need to dive into today is what happens if Tuck walks.

[00:32:50]And it's funny that we've already kind of teed it up because I think that what happens if Tuck walks, it does involve Byron removing and fans will be like, "Whoa, wait a minute. You're going to have an off seasonason where you lose Tuck, his penalty killing, his points, his veteran leadership, and 25% of your defensive engine that was the key driver to a playoff birth." Yeah, I think so. I think so. Um, with all things considered, for all the reasons I think that we just talked about with with Byum and his contract situation, excuse me.

[00:33:31]And you had mentioned like some like a destination. You mentioned San Jose. Not the not the best fit for me, but when you look at St. Louis, I almost wonder like I could see a Byum fitting there. Now, again, if Byum likes St. Louis and could win there. That's a whole other issue, right? But when you look at their defense and their cab, I think he fits there. LA is another team where I think he really would fit.

[00:34:01]Dowy, long in the tooth, replacing that mobility, a defenseman that gets involved in the offense, and you look at their defense, and I mean, we saw what they did last year. That was their weak spot of their team. I don't think there's much question about that.

[00:34:15]Just a whole changeover going on in LA.

[00:34:17]I think he fits in LA. I don't know if I see necessarily like, you know, you doing Quinton Biffield for Bo Byron.

[00:34:23]>> That'd be nice.

[00:34:24]>> I I know. I'm just saying like, but I don't >> probably have to throw in one of your one of your prospects, right? Like you gota I think you got to sweeten the pot if you're the Sabres to get by.

[00:34:33]>> Probably. But it's like the Robert Thomas thing, you know, back to St. Louis. It's the Robert Thomas thing for me.

[00:34:40]If you lose Tuck, you use Byum to get that offensive punch in the form of a I would say a number one centerman.

[00:34:50]And then you have to move out some other money on from players on your list, guys that have term, Greenway, etc. And you go after a left winger.

[00:35:03]I think that's kind of what my off seasonason looks like. again in this scenario where Tuck walks at first domino falls it doesn't fall in Buffalo's favor maybe it does because I think that the same thing that we talk about like if I if I'm telling you that Yarmmo says that he wants to sign Byum long term but he both things can be true he may also know that Byum won't sign longterm could be doing the same thing with Tuck he's got his number he'll sign him at a number but the business decision they know the number that Tuck wants precludes Tuck from coming back. Both of those things can be true with both players. There is a scenario, I guess, is all I'm saying, where both of those players aren't on the opening night roster next season.

[00:35:46]>> Probably not ideal.

[00:35:49]>> Not ideal, >> but it could end up being ideal if you pull off, you know, some of what you've talked about there. There is another option I feel like involving the top player on Chris Johnston's offseason trade board and that's Vincent Troche. It's sort of leveling down from the Robert Thomas discussion and putting yourself in a spot where Troche who is he makes 5.625 through 2029. So that's two more seasons, >> 53 points in 67 games. You know, not quite what he was, but still a really useful player. You replace some of that penalty killing. And while you don't get a top line center, you get another, you know, another guy that can handle that.

[00:36:46]Uh, you know, probably a second line center, uh, at least for, you know, the couple years that you have him. and you're not committing as many dollars.

[00:36:56]Probably more importantly, you're not committing as many resources, right?

[00:37:00]You're probably sending a first round pick and a little something else like does a first round pick and and Brody Zeamer get you Vincent Trochek maybe. Um I don't think you're including one of those top three, you know, big young center.

[00:37:16]>> Not for Troche. No. And so it and then you can probably keep buy you know just from a dollar standpoint you have to move out some other stuff to make it work but not a horrible idea to sort of you know and a guy that has you know playoff experience played with Ta Thompson at the it's interesting like he he will have a 10 team no trade list and a year ago that would have been a non-starter in all these conversations. Now, I feel like these are at least conversations for these guys, right? Uh he was the one who was talking about how his son said he was going to stay, right? Cuz he had a he's like if he gets traded at the deadline, his son was like, "Well, you can leave, but I've got my hockey team here."

[00:38:03]>> Yeah.

[00:38:04]>> So, like, you know, obviously I think you could find him a good hockey team, uh, you know, to play on. I think it would it would not be a jarring move to move, you know, 6 hours north uh compared to what some other moves might be for him. Heck, he'd probably be playing against his old hockey team at some point uh in a tournament. So, um I don't know. It's an interesting idea and not as because I think the the other problem that you run into in early June when you're having all these conversations is you talk about Robert Thomas, you talk about Nico Heir, an idea I like a lot because he's got one year left on his deal and yeah, he's going to want a huge extension, but you've got space for it after this year.

[00:38:48]So, you know, not a huge concern to me that he wants that and that, yeah, Thomas is a is a better option because Robert Thomas, I think, is a you I I think you could make an argument. I don't know for sure that he is, but I think he is a potentially a slightly more valuable trade asset than Quinn Hughes was, which sounds crazy because Quinn Hughes is one of the best players in the world. But Quinn Hughes was coming into a situation where you knew you only had him for a year and a half. That's all you were guaranteed as the Wild acquiring him. And I bring that up because the Quinn Hughes package was significant but actually in my opinion not like overwhelmingly valuable. Like the Conucks got a lot of pieces but they got a late first round pick.

[00:39:48]They got a really good prospect on defense in Boo and then they got Rossy's like a Jack Quinn, >> right? Sort of a guy that hasn't lived up to it. And >> who was the Was it Ogrren that they got?

[00:40:06]>> Yeah, sort of.

[00:40:08]>> I like Ogrren. I mean, >> another another solid prospect, but another little bit of an unknown, right?

[00:40:13]Like they did like the Sabres could put together a package that I think might be better. You know, if you offered up Murka, your first one of your centers, and Quinn, I think that's as good of a package.

[00:40:29]>> Mhm.

[00:40:30]>> If not better, depending on which center goes. And you get Robert Thomas. And the reason I think Robert Thomas is a better asset is because of the contract at, you know, low8 million cap hit.

[00:40:45]>> Yeah. locked up at 26 years old. I believe he still is.

[00:40:50]>> And 26 and it's 812 8.125 for multiple years. I mean through 2031 a franchise centerman potentially >> a number one center >> a number one. Yeah.

[00:41:02]>> Like a legit like because we were talking about this yesterday on the phone like how often do number one centers become available? Now how often does a Quinn Hughes level talent become available? Not that often. I get I I don't mean to diminish the return Vancouver got because it was a good return. It was a solid return, but it wasn't a return that was like, whoa.

[00:41:22]Like, >> no. If if Quinn Hughes had the same term on his contract, that's your point. If Quinn Hughes had the remaining years, Thomas has five more years left on his contract. If Quinn Hughes had that, the return looks radically different, >> right?

[00:41:37]>> Radically different.

[00:41:38]>> He may not get traded at all. But I mean, you could even go back to Jack Eel and think about it and say like he had term on that deal. I forget how many years were left when they moved him, but he had some term and I looked at the return, you know, you look at the return in hindsight and think it's okay.

[00:41:59]Like, >> yeah, that hindsight.

[00:42:03]>> Yeah. You know, like Osland is a nice piece that they got with that first round pick, but it was a middle of the first round. Tuck good player, you know, but not a star level player like Eel is. Krebs at the time was supposed to be a big-time prospect. He's become a useful player, but not a top of the lineup differencem type of player. So, >> a guy that probably gets forced out if Danforth is healthy next year.

[00:42:31]>> Yeah. another money decision that they have to make, right? If Krebs is if Krebs is going to be 3 million or more, you know, is it time to to see what you can get there? And every one of these conversations leads you to a point of like, man, like how many trades is Yarmmo going to have to make over the next month to make this all work? Probably a lot, right? Like they're going to have to trade a lot of players out bodies.

[00:42:57]>> They got to clear out space.

[00:42:59]>> They got to clear out dollars. They got to clear out room in the lineup. Like we could sketch out a lineup right now if Tuck walks and it's still kind of hard to find a spot for Yuri Kik.

[00:43:09]>> It is. It is.

[00:43:10]>> So if is Yuri Kik going to play and if he is like where is he going to play?

[00:43:15]You got to find that room. and how much, you know, we're having this conversation if Tuck walks, if they trade Byum, like at that point, you have to keep Zooker, right? If you lose those two, because it's like you need to keep some of that veteran >> presence in the room and some of that leadership. But Zooker is another one that he wasn't on my list of, you know, eight to 10 guys that I'm absolutely keeping because $4.75 million is a lot of money. And depending on what other decisions you make, I I think in an ideal world, you'd keep him because of what he means in the room and because he was still pretty useful player this year. But you have to be wondering about that that age curve. It's kind of what's funny about the the tuck conversation about like, oh, you can't pay this guy like in four or five years. Like, what's it going to look like? It's like all you guys like Jason Zooker a lot, right? Like he's still contributing uh at 34. I think he'll be 35 next season. Um I think Zooker and I are the are the same age. Uh he might be a little bit older. No, he's like a month older than me. So yeah, he'll be 35 in the middle of next season and still a 20 goal guy. Um, now I get it. Tuck's going to make double what Zooker makes right now, but 4.75 is a decent chunk of change, especially on the salary cap that Zooker signed it on. So another guy that I'm sitting there looking and saying, you know, man, Yarmmo has a lot of decisions to make here. Like he's got a lot and and so much of it is going to be about fitting the lineup together. Like if Tuck walks the the lineup I sent you yesterday off the top of my head because I'm not looking at it in front of me.

[00:44:55]Benson Norris and this is before like any sort of earthshattering moves that will basically have to happen but Benson Norris Thompson up top. Um, Zooker, Mloud, Quinn, if you keep that together, Osland, Helenus, Don, Malenstein, Carrick, Danforth, and there's no Krebs and no Koulique in there.

[00:45:23]>> Yeah. And there's no real depth after that, though. Also, by the way, >> well, another issue, one of their strengths this year was some of the competition and depth that they had. And and again, even in that lineup, there's some assumption like Malenstein, right, who's an unrestricted free agent, >> being able to keep him.

[00:45:43]>> If you can't keep him, then you have to keep Krebs, you know? And that's assuming Greenways out. like we're already kind of assuming they're going to find a way to move that four million because it seems like they don't really have a choice like with their cap situation to be paying that player that amount of money.

[00:46:02]But yeah, even and that forward group is I mean you do have depth and that you have Koulique not in there, right? Like you have him kind of ready to >> to jump in wherever, but yeah, there's not a ton beyond that that next layer. So >> there could be some there could be two it's a series of potentially large trades like not small fringe working around the edges moves there is potential for some big big trades here with Yarmmo and you mentioned that's one I don't really focus on that but it's possible for sure um yeah but you know you mentioned that potential return or you a sketch of a return for Thomas if the Sabres were to step up. You know, I' I'd like to redress that return with Byum included, just to see, you know, what we think that looks like and how competitive an offer that includes Byum can get from Buffalo's perspective. Considering you got to, you know, you want to clear out some cap dollars, you got to clear out some space in the locker room, >> you know, like it it gets really it gets really interesting. But that's where >> Thomas is a letter guy, by the way. like if you're moving out leadership, bringing in >> some of that, you know, I think he he can do he can do it all. Like I I would there's very few players that that type of package would make sense for Thomas is one of them. I would put Heir in there. Now, I think the package might be a little bit different for Hishir because he's not extended on such an affordable deal, but another guy that I would I would swing for the fences on if you know they can't agree to a contract.

[00:47:46]>> He sure looks more like a Quinn Hughes type of not maybe not the same value, but a similar structure of the deal. Um, >> you're getting less time with >> Thomas. Thomas, you have to give them something that's useful immediately.

[00:48:01]you know, >> well, >> and you're right about Yeah, that's a good point about you.

[00:48:05]>> We have that, you know, that framework, that sketch of a really aggressive Thomas offer, but I do think it's a good point by you that you move some different pieces in and out and it changes things like what does it look like if Byum's in there? What does it look like if Brody Zemer's in there? you know, he's a name that, you know, I've mentioned in a couple of these, but I because I think he's increased his value to where he's sort of a fringe late f like he's of similar value to their late >> pushing first round value in a trade.

[00:48:33]And when you talk about St. Louis, he played an entire season on the same line with Jimmy Snugrude, who is one of the guys that they are clearly you if if you ask Steam who his core is in St. Snugger's like right at the top of the list >> and that's pretty close to I mean that's not a bad drive. Uh it's a pretty close you know you're right there in the the Midwest. I think it's like a eight eight-ish hour drive um from Minnesota.

[00:49:05]He's their type, right? Like you have to be thinking about your trade partner here. That's why like >> it's interesting everybody says which of these centers would you want to trade?

[00:49:15]That's all well and good, but if St. Louis is going to be compelled to trade Robert Thomas, they probably want Helenus. Like, >> he's their he's their three.

[00:49:30]He's the one who has the cleanest bill of health.

[00:49:32]>> He's most durable. Yes. And he's had hell of a spring.

[00:49:36]>> Yeah.

[00:49:37]>> You could debate upside. You could debate, you know, short-term, long-term, who's the best player out of the three.

[00:49:44]I think you could make a clear case that it could be him, but I think you cannot debate like the bill of health right now like and the the durability.

[00:49:52]>> Look, a trade that involves Helenus and Byum hurts Buffalo big time.

[00:49:59]>> Absolutely. Yeah.

[00:50:00]>> And that's but that's how it has to feel >> if you're going to get a number one center with five years left on his contract.

[00:50:08]I'm not say listen I'm not advocating Yarmmo you got to do this even in the context of this entire 50 plus minute discussion where I'm talking about Bo Byram I'm not saying they have to trade him I'm saying he becomes a very valuable asset if you believe you're not going to be able to sign him because the longer that you hold him even though you mentioned August earlier I think your ideal window if you know you can't sign Byum you your ideal window is right before you can sign him like the next three or four weeks. The longer it goes, the more his value potentially diminishes in trade.

[00:50:44]>> Well, the more your options might diminish, right? You know, >> don't you want to get Don't you want to get like if you don't know if you know you can't sign him, don't you want to get a move before other teams start planning for their future?

[00:50:57]>> That's the big piece. That's where in August, you might lose some trade partners, right? You might have teams that, I mean, it might sound crazy, but you might have teams that draft a guy, right? Like San Jose might draft a guy and they say, "You know what? We're going to play the long game here." You might have other defenseman move, right?

[00:51:19]You might have a Morgan Riley get traded. And I don't think Morgan Riley, I don't know if he's quite a Bo Byum at this point in his career, but it's enough to compel somebody to say, "We've already got our, you know, seven plus million dollar defenseman. We're going to we're good. And all it takes is, as we saw last summer, Bo Byum, if it were easy to move him, he would have moved.

[00:51:42]>> Mhm.

[00:51:43]>> And part of it is probably the contract.

[00:51:46]He's probably easier to move now because of the season that he had, but it's not a cut and dry situation. And so yeah, the the the few week window you have, I think always before the draft is the easier time to do these things because there's just more available. Teams haven't totally filled out their balance sheet and they haven't committed to certain guys and there's more on the table. They could move draft picks. They could, you know, do different things in that regard. So, do you like I I'm thinking about the other piece of this is like replacing Byum like if you're if you do end up trading him.

[00:52:33]>> Mhm.

[00:52:34]>> Or if you're waiting it out like because and you lose him next summer.

[00:52:38]I keep thinking about the fact that Yarmmo went after Colton Pereo.

[00:52:43]Do we expect him to go after another guy like that? Could you circle back on? I don't know. Would you be willing to circle back on Perico? Like, >> no. But I know there's two names when it comes to like the guy that I want for left wing and the guy that I think you want for defense are names that we've talked about at various points in the past on this show. There's one name that I think you'd probably circle back to in that scenario, right?

[00:53:07]I would think Conor Murphy on the free agent market is I mean the irony the guy up front is Bobby McMahon that we've discussed and the guy >> you're shocked if you're listening to this show >> and the guy on defense is is Conor Murphy probably discount versions of the guys you're losing right in Tuck and Byum in those scenarios like I would think McMahon will be a five plus million dollar player Um, >> and >> half of what you're going to pay Tuck >> and Murphy's what, four is, maybe a little less.

[00:53:46]>> Um, you know, that's an option. Kessle Ring is an option, but I don't think you want to jump right to Kessle Ring without having another layer of competition there. But and Kessle Ring is another one that I think he can be a UFA next summer if he just does a one-year deal.

[00:54:08]>> Yeah.

[00:54:08]>> So, which is probably the likely outcome if you're keeping him is you just give him his qualifying offer and let him play it out. So, you could take the gamble and put him in your top four or but again, if you believed him to be that guy, would you be swinging a deal for Pareco? Like the Pareco, look, we're still early on in getting to know Yarmmo and what he thinks of this roster, what he really thinks of it. And I feel like the Pareco deal is one of the biggest hints as far as what he was looking at, what he was planning for. And it does tell you something about, you know, how he view he does view that top four is really important. That doesn't mean it's going to be the top four that we saw this season or or in the playoffs. So, they got a good long look at Kel Ring.

[00:55:02]Prao was not just a short-term boost to the lineup, although he would have been. You imagine if they had, you know, basically Byum Timonss as their bottom pair and power, they might still be playing. Um, probably not, but maybe. I mean, Pareco would have been a nice nice addition.

[00:55:23]So, a lot of uh >> tells me to come >> already knows and that's why it's worth talking about Byum in a different light than I think maybe A lot of Sabers observers are ready to and yeah, you know, and the Bobby McMahon thing, you know, yeah, maybe at some point I'll let it go. Um, it's interesting. I don't know how many goals did Tuck have this year.

[00:55:55]>> Get 33.

[00:55:57]>> 33. Bobby McMahon had 29.

[00:56:02]Tuck has a lot more value. Okay. But Bobby McMahon turns 30 in just a couple weeks here.

[00:56:10]>> This was 29. Same age.

[00:56:12]>> Similar goal production for half the value likely if Tuck walks.

[00:56:21]>> He's probably in that mean >> he's probably in that like Kefir Sherwood >> five and a half range, right?

[00:56:28]>> What was that contract for?

[00:56:29]>> Five and a quarter somewhere around there.

[00:56:32]Kefir Sherwood because Sherwood had like a similar age breakout.

[00:56:38]>> 5.75 he got.

[00:56:39]>> Oh wow.

[00:56:40]>> Okay.

[00:56:41]>> But you know he's also signing in a high tax state. So I don't know.

[00:56:47]>> Yeah. And again I'm only talking goals.

[00:56:48]I'm not talking >> but he's 31.

[00:56:51]>> Yeah.

[00:56:53]It's it's again these are just discussions you know. There's a lot of ifs on all this, but worth having the discussion. You know, one name that we haven't talked about again, we didn't talk about him much last week, Jack Quinn. Like Quinn right now, I'm holding him. His money's not hurting you. He was a 50-point guy this year, hit 20 goals.

[00:57:12]There is a world, there is a reality where Jack Quinn is this year's Matias Samuelson. And what I mean by that is the guy that fans wanted to get rid of.

[00:57:21]You know, there's no buyout discourse right now with Jack Quinn, but seems like he's one of those usual suspects that comes up. You know, move Greenway, move Quinn, move, you know, he could be the guy that busts out next year and shuts everything down in terms of the the critics like Samuelson did this year. It's possible. Not guaranteed it's going to happen. It's possible. 20 goals and 50 plus points for the number he makes.

[00:57:47]>> His number's not hurting you.

[00:57:49]>> His number is helping you. I think >> his his number helps you. And like that's where you then start talking about Mloud and 5 million replaceable and dollars out and value around the leak.

[00:58:05]I'm just the other guy I want to talk about that we because we've talked about Mloud and sort of the the reason for why you would do that. The guy I can't really figure out is Norris.

[00:58:18]>> Norris. I was Yeah, it's hard.

[00:58:20]>> Like Norris is I think one of the hardest ones to figure out because I don't think he's been anywhere close.

[00:58:29]I mean, I don't How many games would you say you watch of Josh Norris and say that's an eight million player since he's been here?

[00:58:39]>> Not many.

[00:58:40]>> 10 or less? Probably >> 10. Yeah. Most of them were right after he came back from his injury, you know, last year. The first one.

[00:58:48]>> Otherwise, he's looked like in the playoffs, I would say he looked like a a $5 million player, right? like a guy that was sort of like in that Mloud range where you're not really >> got better at the end. You agree that Norris got better at the end?

[00:59:03]>> Yeah. I And I saw a competitive streak in him in the playoffs and I don't know how much the goal scoring like was a result of playing through some stuff, but the reality is he's playing through stuff a lot. So, what makes him so complicated to me is that there's a world I could see him starting next season as their number one center. And it's not ideal, but it's not the worst.

[00:59:28]Like, he does have the potential to be that player. He's a great skater. He's good on both sides of the puck. And he does have a history of being a really good scorer. I don't know how much the injuries have zapped some of that already.

[00:59:38]>> Yeah. But the other part that makes it complicated is theoretically you'd love to move the money, but is the time right as far as the value of what you would get back in return? Like you don't just want to dump it for no reason, right? I don't think which some fans might be in that boat, but he does leave a hole in your lineup if you just dump the money for nothing.

[00:59:59]>> Ideally, your younger guys that can play center would mature a little bit more.

[01:00:03]>> Exactly. They're not quite ready to That's where the Mloud conversation is an easier one to have for me because then you're asking a guy to become a 3C >> instead of asking a we have to remember that Helenoose Oseland and Koulique all of them like not one of them has played a full 82 game NHL season yet. Asking one of those guys to be a top six center is a big ask. Like a really big ask. And is that something that makes you a Stanley Cup? Like how many Stanley Cup teams have rookies, true rookie? I mean, they won't be, I guess, qualifying rookies, a few of them, but like Helenus will.

[01:00:47]>> Yeah.

[01:00:48]>> Uh, and you know, Koulik and Osland will be secondyear guys with injury questions. Like it's a big ask, you know, to be that young up top. That's where the Norris part is difficult. Now, if you're bringing in Robert Thomas, you can move >> Problem solved.

[01:01:03]>> You can move one of Norris or Mloud, but probably not both.

[01:01:07]>> And by the way, we're an hour in and I want everyone to know, so a lot of what we talked about today, like with the Robert Thomas thing, was um if Tuck leaves, you can also move by. If Tuck is retained, you also move by in this scenario. I think honestly you need money >> and and and that was the Yes. And and that's kind of by the way I so I kind of flipped the script on Matt.

[01:01:35]>> So full disclosure we talked a little bit yesterday and the day before and kind of conversation developed. You know, Matt and I spent a lot of time talking about this team. And frankly, those discussions are better than the podcasts.

[01:01:47]And that's where I ended up yesterday was, you know, you work around the edges, Krebs goes out, you know, Greenway, you might have to incent someone to take Greenway, get a pickback, you know, late third, something like that. San Jose has a shitload of them. And like it's always San Jose, right? But um but I was basically saying, okay, yeah, retain talk at your number and you use Byum to make the big splash. The big splash is your centerman. And then you're really cooking with gas and you're doing all of these things. You're retaining maybe twothirds of that youth cluster that Helenius Austin kic and you're doing all these things. That's kind of where I was yesterday. But, you know, 25 30 minutes in today, I'm saying, wait a minute, you move Byum either way >> potentially. I mean, if he's not willing to sign, that starts to become >> top of mind.

[01:02:45]>> And so many of these conversations are like the Norris conversation is a is a funny one because >> I just don't, man, I don't think that I think the league has a lot of pause about taking even though the cap's going up and everything else, >> they have to, right? What value does he have? And >> would he pass a physical?

[01:03:04]>> Another fair question, you know, like and I don't the the number isn't like, you know, it's not Jeff Skinner where it's like, man, this number's huge and he's kind of useless now.

[01:03:17]It's a slightly smaller number on a bigger cap for a player that when he's healthy is useful. He's not >> I like him if he's healthy. I like him.

[01:03:25]But that's a big if.

[01:03:26]>> That's a huge if. And it's actually less of a problem after this year. So many of these problems are shortterm. So it feels like Yarmmo has sort of two paths he can take. There's the one that is like how can you do everything possible to keep as much of the band together as possible, right? And try to run it back with as similar a group as you possibly can.

[01:03:52]That is one conversation, right? That involves trying to keep Tuck hanging on to Byum at all costs and working around the edges. Kind of like you said, not super easy. You move out Greenway, maybe let Krebs walk.

[01:04:10]>> Mloud is working around the edges, especially if you get Robert Thomas.

[01:04:14]That's a big edge to work around.

[01:04:16]>> Mloud could be working around the edges.

[01:04:19]You know, there's there's some things you can do. Then there's the other path, which is how do you shake things up? to take a step, make some really hard decisions to take a step. Letting Tuck walk would be a really hard decision.

[01:04:35]Maybe not that hard though. Like when we sketch all this out, we were talking yesterday and and by the end of it, I thought, man, Tuck might that might be it. Like you might that makes some of the decisions a little bit easier if you free up that money, right?

[01:04:51]>> Yeah.

[01:04:51]>> But leaves a huge hole in the lineup and in your locker room. the the probability the likelihood is that if Tuck walks then you know you get Benson done and you try to extend Byron to the best ability that's the that's the likely scenario likely my point in the Byron thing by the way is you know you talked about setting yourself up and having flexibility you know the more you put a broom in there the more you protect your young assets and you keep them and it gives you more flexibility you're not going to keep all of them no matter what. But I don't know. I just think that there there's going to be there's going to be a lot of folks listening to this that don't see a scenario where you move tuck and buy and I get it. But it's >> it's a lot to possible, >> but you need to bring in it's risky because you need to bring in >> I almost feel like if both of those guys are gone, you need to be bringing in Thomas or Heir.

[01:05:50]>> How are you going to get them?

[01:05:53]without a brom. That's what I mean. Make use to make the splash.

[01:05:58]>> Well, and wouldn't you I mean, we are we talked last week we we can't boil the ocean. I feel like the title of this episode will be boiling the ocean because we are we're covering a lot of ground here, but I it also gets me thinking that everybody's talking about these three centers and trying to rank who's the most valuable asset and this and that.

[01:06:17]Don't you think it's potentially smart business to move one of them this summer. Like >> you have you're gonna have to at some point >> kind of my point, right? At some point you're going to probably have to move one of them. And do we think probably Koulique doesn't fall into this category?

[01:06:41]But how many times do you see these young I'm not saying you know these guys are overhyped but one of them might be right in reality in terms of what they're going to become. They're not going to the idea of all three of them becoming superstar level talents is a nice idea.

[01:07:01]It's probably not the reality. So being able to correctly identify which one won't or you know which one you don't have room for. Mhm.

[01:07:11]>> That's part of the skill of being a good general manager. And now might be a good time. Probably not for Kik, like not the ideal time to trade him when he's coming off the season that he is health-wise, but I still have a I mean, totally different conversation, but I still have a very high opinion of of Koulique as a player as long as he's good to go. Um, but yeah, that's another piece of this that like moving one of those guys might not be bad business. you know, it might be a good idea to it's all about asset management. You brought up the Kings earlier >> and they're a great example of like they had the number one prospect pool forever and it was going to be this next wave of great young talent and now this is the time when that should make them a perennial Stanley Cup team and some of those guys just didn't pan out, right? You know, some of them became good, not great players and they held. You know, if you hold for too long, sometimes those assets aren't what you think they are.

[01:08:10]And that could be the same case with even your veteran type of guys like Byron. You know, you hold for too long and now you don't have trade value the same way you would this summer. So, >> really interesting uh decisions to come and I'm sure Yarmmo and his staff are boiling the ocean as well on a daily basis trying to figure this out. But also, I think to your point, I think Yarmmo does have a pretty good idea. I think he's probably been thinking about this since last summer and throughout the season, evaluating how it's all going to fit together and how he can make this work. But, man, what a beautiful piece of clay he has to work with with this roster because he does have a lot of assets, a lot of options, a lot of different roads he can take to extend this window as long as possible.

[01:09:01]>> Yeah, I I want some of these things to happen. It's easier to do podcasts if at least we have one move made because then things get a little more >> things get a little more narrow, you know, and um yeah, it's it's difficult to do these shows because it can go in so many different directions. The conversation just spiderw webs.

[01:09:24]We need that first firm crack like the uh I don't know. We'll see.

[01:09:34]We'll see where it goes. Um, that's exhausting talking about it actually this early in the morning, you know, starting a discussion like this at 10 after 6 >> with a little score.

[01:09:47]>> It does get the brain going. It does get the brain going.

[01:09:49]>> I also just realized we we sort of coordinated for uh we we have kind of a similar color palette going here. See, with the second straight episode >> is see like with the light like I can never tell what your colors are. Like I misread the color of your hat.

[01:10:08]>> This is like the same color of my hat the one time. Like a seafoam.

[01:10:12]>> I don't know what color your shirt is.

[01:10:13]What do you got? White and blue there.

[01:10:14]>> White and blue. Yeah, but I can't ever see your colors and I'm not color blind, but it's just a stupid ring light. And uh whatever. Who cares? No one cares.

[01:10:24]>> Matt hour 10 minutes >> on June 3rd. We did boil the We did boil the ocean. Um, >> let's get out of here.

[01:10:34]>> Couldn't be done, but we did it.

[01:10:35]>> Yeah, right. Let's Let's do some plugs.

[01:10:36]Let's do some plugs and let's everyone yell at me for wanting to have an off season that removes Tuck and Byron. I don't I'm kidding. I don't want that. I don't want anything, frankly. I I just want things to talk about. And boy, do we have it. Let's do your Let's do your plugs.

[01:10:51]>> Yeah, people can go to the athletic.comsabers.

[01:10:54]People can head to our YouTube page and check out the show there. Like, subscribe, do all those fun things.

[01:11:02]We'll be talking to you again soon.

[01:11:04]There's still more ocean to boil.

[01:11:07]Two se two syllable response.

[01:11:10]Listener question from our friend Spike in Ohio. One major offseason move. Got to consider acquisition costs, etc. Thomas or Volstead Thomas.

[01:11:29]Same here for Matthew Fairburn. You heard him. Get over to the athletic, subscribe, comment on his stories, share his stories with your friends, and it might get them to subscribe themselves.

[01:11:43]For Matthew Fairburn for the production crew, who whatever. I emptied the holster. I don't have anything cute from the production crew today. I'm Chris Baker. Enjoy your Wednesday and the rest of the week. We'll see you again very soon.