AI Porting Software? Proton Habits? Linux App Summit? All Q&A | Dual Boot Diaries ep. 39

Added: 2026-06-01

[00:00:00]Will, we're doing something unprecedented here.

[00:00:03]>> You're in a hotel room.

[00:00:06]>> Yes, I'm in a hotel room sitting in Taipei, Taiwan. But >> we've done hotels.

[00:00:10]>> We're doing a cold open.

[00:00:12]>> What?

[00:00:12]>> Oh, yeah. Cold open.

[00:00:13]>> Yeah. Yeah. Cold open. We've never done a cold open before >> and Yeah. No, I don't I really don't.

[00:00:20]Usually we come in with Okay.

[00:00:22]>> Hey, welcome everybody to Expedition Hand or not Expedition Handle. Gez, Doo Diaries.

[00:00:28]It's like Russ is standing there with you right now and he can hear what you're saying and you you're only thinking of him and you're not thinking about me anymore and you're just like, "Man, I wish I was podcasting with Russ right now."

[00:00:38]>> I know, right? Yeah. That's what I'm always thinking.

[00:00:41]>> Any Anyway, >> I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm joking.

[00:00:43]I'm joking.

[00:00:44]>> We We We have some news that we decided to record a little section here and put in front of the podcast that we actually recorded last week. Look, it's best not to think about the time too much because it'll make us a little crazy because we recorded this one before we recorded last week's, but we're recording this after we posted last week's, but before we posted this week's, but it's after, importantly, the 400th episode of The Full Nerd, which happened on Tuesday of this week when we announced >> Oh, yeah. It was still this week. Yeah.

[00:01:17]>> Yeah, it's still this week. It seems like a 100 years ago to you, but for me, it's just like two days ago. Um but we announced that uh my time with PC World is coming to an end. So uh budgets have changed and freelance budgets have changed and uh you know and as a result uh Tuesday was my last regular full nerd episode and um we're going to get a few more dual diaries episodes.

[00:01:42]>> This is episode 39 that you're listening right now and episode 40 I hopefully will be recording here at Compyex with somebody. I have a couple people in mind, but I I don't have anything lined up. So, maybe there's a chance there won't be one. Anyway, I guess you'll see.

[00:01:57]>> We'll see.

[00:01:58]>> Either way, when I come back home, Will and I are going to have four more episodes left of the Dual Food Diaries >> because we're we're wrapping it up.

[00:02:07]>> It's going to take four episodes for Adam type rm space- rf asterisk and delete everything from his Linux petition. Um, my Windows partition already gone, it turns out. Who knew?

[00:02:18]>> Who knew? Uh, also I need to se save save up all my Neri jokes, you know, just so I can get them out uh before the end. But no, >> we won't have Neri to kick around anymore.

[00:02:29]>> Yeah. No. Um, this is sad.

[00:02:32]>> An old guy reference. Yeah, it is sad.

[00:02:34]>> This is sad. We're having fun. I've been enjoying DB Diaries. Like, it really has taught me a lot. Like, it's been fun that we've been able to do this journey together. Like, I love working with you.

[00:02:43]of course will, but also doing something different where actively learning something and showing everyone at the same time of what we're what we're doing was very scary when we went into this and I didn't think it would work, but everybody has has loved it. So, >> it's it's been fun because I think it actively pushed both of us out of our comfort zones um in in in maybe different ways, but but kind of the same way in a lot of cases. And um I mean I don't think anybody's going to be subscri sub subscribed surprised that it's a little late here. Uh that my Linux journey isn't in fact coming to an end. And um hopefully by the time you're back in San Francisco, I'll have something to share about what I'm going to do next. Uh but it's going to be there's going to be a Linux podcast in my future for sure.

[00:03:33]>> Yeah. Yeah. I there's more to talk about. We're we're not going to get into the details here, but of of the last four episodes, >> we have something that we're planning for the last one. Uh we do have a guest that that has been needing to be on and we're going to force him to to come on because hey, we're running out of runway here. Uh and then I think yeah, we got some other ideas in there to do the for the final four. Uh but yeah, it's it's coming to an end, but it it does for Dualoot Diary specifically, but not for Will. Will's going to be doing a ton more Linux stuff. To tell you the truth, I like I'm I'm want to continue to do Linux stuff, but I I don't know what form it's going to take quite yet. So, you know, we'll see on that. But Will's got some really cool stuff lined up. I'm >> excited.

[00:04:17]>> I've got I' I've been scheming. Um we have a couple programming notes for Dual Boot Diaries, though. Like I said, four more episodes. Uh we're going to do at least one Q&A in there. So, if you have questions, if you last call for questions, uh you can email them to the full nerdpcorld.com, or you can go to the full nerd discord, which is linked down below, and go to the uh uh DBD questions channel, and post them in there. Uh questions only.

[00:04:43]We're back in We're back in full rules mode now. It was no rules for a minute there, but now >> only for the full nerd. Only the full nerd had no rules on episode 400 diary.

[00:04:51]It was no rules week. Yeah, you say that, but I don't think so. Uh, anyway, you can post your questions in there.

[00:04:58]We'll definitely get to them at some point uh before the the before we wrap this up. Um, but yeah, it's been a lot of fun. I I've learned a lot. I've gone way outside my comfort zone. Uh, and then I nestled back into my comfort zone. And it turns out that my my comfort zone is uh free and fair oss that you can, you know, you can make your own choices on and and you don't you're not you don't have the sweet loving embrace of of Satchinadela coming down to make sure that your experience is increasingly worse from update to update. But we maybe they'll get better at that. Who knows? We'll talk about that too, I'm sure. Um, but in the meantime, I guess we should probably start the episode, right?

[00:05:36]>> Yeah. Yeah. So, we have a this episode that you're about to listen to is all questions, ones that were asked before this episode, obviously. So, >> yeah, we get your new questions in for the for the end. But yeah, there's there's some really good ones. I don't actually, tell you the truth, we recorded this last week. I don't even remember the questions, but they were probably good.

[00:05:56]>> They were smart and the people who sent them in were beautiful and probably smelled nice. Uh, I but I can guarantee you I definitely raged Nerie a little bit in this episode just because I so >> I'm sure there's somebody's kept a spreadsheet sheet. We've done 39 episodes counting this one. The number of times you didn't slag on Neri at least a little bit was only in the ones where we didn't know what Neri was.

[00:06:19]>> Yeah, probably. So, >> so >> I'm waiting for the next season of Dualoot Diaries where you try Neri and then uh you you come back with with uh with eating that humble pie over and over and over again.

[00:06:33]>> Yeah. Yeah. Who knows? May maybe that'll be season two. Anyway, uh let's start the show and Will is going to go to bed.

[00:06:40]I just got up and I have stuff to do at Computex. Uh so yeah, here's the actual show.

[00:06:52]Welcome everyone to Dual Boot Diaries, episode 39.

[00:06:56]That's 39 of the Dual Boot Diaries, a weekly podcast where two longtime Windows users try to learn to use desktop Linux daily. I'm one of your hosts, Adam Patrick Murray.

[00:07:07]>> I'm your other host, Will Smith, and uh we're not Linux experts, although we're getting there.

[00:07:11]>> Yeah, baby steps. uh we are uh going to do this until such time as we're comfortable enough with either Linux or Windows that we just jettison the other one from our life or maybe we're like you know what I'm done with computers I'm moving to a cabin in the woods I'm going to get out of here I'm going to get I'm I'm going to get I'm going to get real into whittling Adam >> okay >> yeah that's how my week went >> we're recording this out of order so I forgot we're actually doing the next week episode before we do the this week >> spoilers you want to tell people Wow that's crazy I believe been transparency. Radical transparency.

[00:07:44]>> Yeah, we're actually recording 39 before 38 has even ever been recorded.

[00:07:48]>> Stuff could happen in 38. It's going to be wild. It's going to be off the hook.

[00:07:52]We're not going to mention it today at all, though.

[00:07:54]>> Well, that that that's because uh the the day that you're listening or that this comes out, I don't know if that's the day you're listening to it, but hopefully you are. The day it's coming out, I will be in Taiwan. Yeah.

[00:08:05]>> I will be >> uh you know, over getting Yeah. getting ready. Well, what is the time of day?

[00:08:11]So, it releases at 3:00 a.m. East Coast time and then 900 p.m. or 9:00 a.m.

[00:08:16]Pacific >> on video form.

[00:08:19]>> Oh, yeah.

[00:08:20]>> So, then yeah, it'll be it'll be my evening. Yeah.

[00:08:22]>> I'll be in the evening some night market and be like, "Oh, hey, Dual Boot Diaries posted."

[00:08:26]>> Uh, and so yeah, >> you're going to go I here's the thing. I want you to walk around the night market >> with the with the little stick camera and a microphone and be like, "Hey, any Linux users here? A use Linux?

[00:08:40]You got that Linux? I do.

[00:08:41]>> What's your favorite dro? You auntu?

[00:08:43]Yeah. Chucklehead.

[00:08:45]>> You laugh, but I bet Linux is pretty pretty well used in >> I would be shocked if it's not.

[00:08:52]>> Yeah.

[00:08:52]>> Now, the the one thing I actually wonder about that though is the the complete lack of penetration of AMD graphics cards there.

[00:08:59]>> True. So, maybe you're actually you're very right. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:09:02]>> This could be moving the needle for AMD in Taiwan, though.

[00:09:05]>> Maybe. Maybe. I don't know. But uh >> cuz I I feel like I've never been to Taiwan, but my assumption from what I know of people from Taiwan and people who go to is that the Linux people fit right in there.

[00:09:15]>> Yeah. Very makery, very reuse, >> scrappy, >> re recycle, you know, like >> reduce, reuse, recycle.

[00:09:22]>> Yeah. All that all that stuff like >> the Jack Johnson song about that.

[00:09:25]>> Okay. Uh I maybe he's big in Taiwan.

[00:09:28]>> I don't think so. You never know. You never know.

[00:09:31]>> Santa Cruz.

[00:09:32]>> I know. Yeah. Okay. Does he think he uses Linux? Some of my friends I can ask one of my one of my daughter's friends parents was that in his wedding apparently >> really weird.

[00:09:43]>> All right. Did he play his own songs at his wedding?

[00:09:45]>> I don't think so.

[00:09:46]>> That would actually >> I would bet he had a bunch of like Rump Shaker and Bust a Move and stuff like that like '90s hip hop.

[00:09:52]>> Yeah, that would be funny.

[00:09:53]>> That would be my bet.

[00:09:54]>> Uh anyway, yeah, I'm in Taiwan. Look forward to all the the fun antics that I get up to over on the PC World YouTube channel. That's where I'll be posting the videos. Uh, I will be doing an episode of The Full Nerd live from the show like usual. I will be doing an episode of Expedition Handheld with Russ who will be there in person with me.

[00:10:13]What? It'll be our first in-person podcast.

[00:10:16]>> You guys have never met before.

[00:10:17]>> Well, we No, we've definitely met uh for sure. And we did the we did the intro or the teaser of Exhibition Handled in person at CES. So, >> you could have faked that though.

[00:10:27]>> Could have be really good faking. Maybe Alex was so good.

[00:10:31]>> Alex is really good.

[00:10:32]>> Yeah. Anyway, uh and then I plan to do a podcast from the road of of this podcast with a special guest.

[00:10:42]>> Who's the special guest?

[00:10:43]>> I don't know. I don't I do not have them lined up.

[00:10:45]>> Oh, okay.

[00:10:45]>> I don't I have a couple people in mind, but half of them I don't know if are they're actually going to be there. So, yeah.

[00:10:51]>> It seems I'm going to go and say it's funny. I've gotten a couple of emails lately about events. One of them was asking me if I was going to be at Summer Games Fest, >> which like usually people get down to my tier on the Summer Games list, hey, are you there for meeting list? It's not not a lot of people are showing. Yeah, I've I've gotten the same similar vibes about Computex this year. I like a lot of the normal Computex people seem to not be going to Computex this year from from conversations.

[00:11:14]>> Then le less uh >> less competition for >> less competition for me to to do. Sorry, I'm I'm fuddling with the the knobs over here. Uh any Oh, no, don't hit that. Uh, it that does show up in the recording.

[00:11:26]>> Oh, it does. Oh, what? This one right here >> or this one?

[00:11:29]>> All of them. Yeah, like this.

[00:11:32]>> Yeah.

[00:11:33]>> Anyway, hot Linux news.

[00:11:36]>> Actually, no, we're not going to do news. We're doing Q&A. Yeah, because once again, I'm gone.

[00:11:41]>> You're not even here right now.

[00:11:42]>> I'm not even here right now. How am I doing this? Maybe I am.

[00:11:45]>> It's a ghost. Are you a ghost?

[00:11:46]>> No, I think I'm your open claw.

[00:11:48]>> Can I put my whole hand? Whoa. I just put my hand through his face. He's a ghost.

[00:11:52]>> Yeah. I I can't I can't hold three fingers in front of my face.

[00:11:57]>> Why not?

[00:11:57]>> I don't know. Because I'm AI.

[00:11:59]>> No, I heard if you put your hand in front of your face, then you're a ghost.

[00:12:02]If If you like see can see your veins on your back hand up close or something. I don't remember how it works. You got to get them real close, though.

[00:12:07]>> All right, we're I ain't doing that.

[00:12:09]We're off to a great start. Uh we got some questions that we gathered from Discord.

[00:12:14]>> Yeah. If you want to get some questions in and maybe we'll answer it on the next Q&A episode, then get it down in the get down in the description. There's a link to the full nerd network Discord and then there is a dbd_qu questions channel in there.

[00:12:29]>> Yeah.

[00:12:29]>> And uh hopefully maybe we'll get to read on the show >> or you can email them to the full nerdpcorld.com.

[00:12:35]>> True. Yeah. I I should check that that inbox during the adbreak to see if there's anything to address here. Uh the first one comes up from Adam Patrick Murray.

[00:12:44]>> Oh, >> friend of the show maybe.

[00:12:46]>> I think that's just you, dude. Uh the So the I'm gonna try to put this in a form of a question. So it's a question, but >> I see the question here. Just can I just read it? It says near question mark multiple dees question mark.

[00:13:00]>> All right. Well, I've got multiple questions here. The first one is I know I know. But the the the first one is a reference to last week's episode which was 37.

[00:13:08]>> You're still shook from that as I understand. I still shook from that and there there were multiple people who got in the comments saying, "Hey, I I have multiple dees loaded on my system. You just need to to >> be thoughtful >> be thoughtful about how you set it up."

[00:13:21]And then there was multiple people in also being like, "Hey, th this way lies pain and and punishment because different dees will store different things in different places in your your folder structure." And I was just like, I don't I don't know what to to believe.

[00:13:37]Will what should I believe?

[00:13:39]>> Uh I would say believe the experts.

[00:13:41]>> Okay.

[00:13:42]>> Um >> do we do you know what we can call?

[00:13:44]>> Okay. So yeah. So the problem with um the problem with having multiple dees installed like >> desktop environments >> desktop environments. So for example if you have Gnome and KDE installed on the same machine weird things happen because some programs are written in such a way that they use basically they use different frameworks. Gnome and KD use different frameworks for drawing windows like the chrome around the windows and how menus are presented all that stuff.

[00:14:12]All the things that you think of as like system level choices about user interface are I think it's QT and and GDK is that right or QTK I can't remember is what I can't remember what the Gnome one is. Uh I think it's yeah it's GTK. Um, and those are used uh like some applications for example like you'll notice when you download Firefox or Chrome, you don't download a QT or a GDK QTK GTK version of Firefox or Chrome, right? It just works. And my understanding is that when you get in a situation where you have both of those libraries there, those in between softwares get real weird. And then there's also a bunch of other stuff like it's less now because every I think everybody's like all the main dros are kind of settled on systemd but like if you're on a on a non if you're I guess I guess that doesn't matter for this because for the desktop environment the systemd stuff is already chosen by the dro so you're fine never mind.

[00:15:11]>> Yeah >> disregard that last part.

[00:15:13]>> I don't know it just it it it's weird to think that uh it would cause issues. I mean, I I get it. Theoretically, why it would cause issues, >> but also your your testing with the multiple desktop environments that you did recently that that shook everybody, shook the world, really.

[00:15:30]>> People had a lot of thoughts.

[00:15:31]>> Yeah. Uh was like I I I guess I was I was surprised. I was surprised and I was like, well, I kind of want to what what if I could have Fedora, which I enjoyed it right there.

[00:15:42]>> And then well, actually, I don't have it on this laptop. That's >> No, that looks like Windows. We'll talk about that. We talked about that in episode 38.

[00:15:48]>> Okay.

[00:15:49]>> So, but we have >> I can't wait to hear that conversation.

[00:15:52]>> Uh but yeah, so I like Fedora as a base, but what if I wanted to experiment around with different desktop environments?

[00:15:59]>> Yeah, >> because really like that's kind of what I learned at the beginning of this is that a lot of those choices are desktop environment based rather than the actual DRO based. So, I don't know because it like I'm still in that middle ground of like I like I like Gnome, but I I was liking Pop OS uh Cosmic.

[00:16:18]>> Yeah.

[00:16:18]>> And I was like, I really want to go back and try Cosmic, but I Oh, I got to load it up on a different computer, different partition, or I guess I got to I guess I can put it on a VM, whatever. I don't know. But I want to feel what it's going to be like to just use daily. And so, it would just be so easy to be able to pick a different desktop environment from from login. Yeah. And then you just use that one.

[00:16:39]>> Well, so it's it's weird because like getting it working, right, took installing the main like plasma desktop package, right, which downloads all the dependencies for that. But then there was a bunch of stuff that I had to install manually on top of that that wasn't a direct dependency of the plasma desktop, but that it was required to like do things like change the resolution on my monitor and which monitors were turned on and off and stuff like that. Um, it's it's funny because like we talked about this on last week's episode, too. I switched the boot loader on my desktop PC and I did it like I I I mean, well, I mean, you heard this already, but we went through and recorded the like changing that over was as easy as changing a package, but now I'm in this weird spot where I have Grub still installed, and I'm not sure if that should stay or if it should go. And hopefully I got notes after last week's episode that told me what is safe to do.

[00:17:32]And I would have already done that if we weren't recording this episode before the next episode, which is confusing.

[00:17:36]And now I've gone crosseyed.

[00:17:38]>> Yeah. Yeah. I I can't even keep the thread.

[00:17:40]>> Uh anyway, it just it's it's always interesting to see when there is a a list or a bunch of comments of people kind of disagreeing about something. I so so for me I think that the the other thing is you have to remember people who've been using Linux for a long time probably have more baggage than the newer folks >> like personally or >> Linux related stuff.

[00:18:05]>> So like this is this is a lot of just as on the Windows side where people are like well you got to reinstall Windows every year or else your performance is going to go to hell. like those are those bits of common wisdom and like best practices may have been true 10, 20, 30 years ago in some cases and less so now, right? And and I feel like that's that's probably the case. Now, it's also possible that I'm going to do something tomorrow that's going to jack up my computer. I'll be like, "Oh man, I got to reinstall Linux again because I had two D's installed and now we now I've done it."

[00:18:39]>> You double D's. I can't believe >> I think I I I think like I said I feel like Gnome and KDE having both of those installed is is asking for trouble because Neri is so light and uses quick shell for all of its window chrome and all that stuff. It's a little it feels a little bit less risky to me because there's less overlap but I I I don't know for sure and I'm not enough of an expert to make a informed conversation here.

[00:19:02]>> Wow. Nery Stan over here also my so my second question is >> I just like the most performant desktop environment. Yes, that's where I'm at >> as of the testing, but you've only really tested limited testing.

[00:19:13]>> The numbers have been divis decisive from so far.

[00:19:17]>> If you're if all you care about is Shadow of the Tomb Raider performance, >> let me tell you about Neri.

[00:19:22]>> Uh, well, speaking of Neri, my other question is, am I being too harsh on Neri? Yeah. And the team over there are Yeah.

[00:19:28]>> Yeah. You're being a knucklehead. Wow.

[00:19:30]You're missing out on something really good.

[00:19:31]>> But it is it is really funny.

[00:19:33]>> But which part?

[00:19:33]>> Every every week to be like, "Oh, hey, is that a Nerie issue?" And you're like, "Oh, yeah."

[00:19:38]>> I mean, they usually aren't though.

[00:19:40]>> I just don't know, man. Check the tape.

[00:19:42]Look, you you you have a long established anti-neerie virus bias. You just hate tiling window managers. I was going to say you should try XFCE on your old Garbo laptop because it's specifically designed to be incredibly lightweight for old computers.

[00:19:58]>> I mean, Fedora on that that Thinkbook has been fine.

[00:20:00]>> You described it on the full nerd last last week as kind of chunky, but okay.

[00:20:05]Yeah. No, I mean there's definitely certain things like electron apps that will weigh it down.

[00:20:10]>> What if it could be fast?

[00:20:11]>> Yeah, but I think it's the electron >> ninja, >> right?

[00:20:13]>> You're an electron. I'm just saying you could maybe that maybe having a lighter weight window manager desktop environment might help you uh >> I don't >> get a little more juice out of that out of that that old uh turnup field.

[00:20:24]>> Well, it does it does have slots for multiple SSDs, so I could do >> you you have slots.

[00:20:29]>> I'll do that. Let's get to actual questions from the the people. I just I can't believe you took wasted a question on giving me about Yeah, that was only one of uh question comes in from Peda, friend of the show Peda over on Discord.

[00:20:44]From which Mecca anime/manga is the countdown before the episode starts?

[00:20:49]It's kind of epic. So, I actually got a lot of comments on this one, but this is this is actually not our thing. This is when when I I set the the YouTube video to go live. I have it premiere. So, it's like a thing on YouTube where you can have it premiere. Uh, meaning it's a pre-recorded video, but it get it plays at the same time at at a specific time like it was live. Like live to tape is another way to say that. So, when you said >> tonight show >> really >> they do live record some reason. I thought No, I thought that >> Oh, broke my >> my heart.

[00:21:26]>> You think Jimmy Fallon's up at midnight every night telling jokes? No.

[00:21:29]>> He's got stuff.

[00:21:30]>> That's part of his job. There's like MC's that get on the radio at like 3:00 a.m. in the morning.

[00:21:33]>> Those are DJs. Those those aren't real people.

[00:21:35]>> Okay. Anyway, uh and so yeah, in in the in the YouTube dashboard, you set how long you want the the pre countdown thing to be, which I always do the minimum, which is a minute, and then you get to set the >> styles. Yeah, there's like themes. And so this one's called Sci-Fi. I think most of the people who use those built-in tools like just default to the default, but I like the sci-fi one because it does look like an anime. And I'm like, I wish I could take credit for it, but it's not. Uh, it's not our thing. It's actually something built into YouTube. So, yeah.

[00:22:10]>> Well, that sounds cool.

[00:22:12]>> Anyway, uh, next question from Voice Ko, friend of the show. Friend of the show.

[00:22:18]Have you checked out the Linux App Summit? There are some interesting open source related presentations.

[00:22:24]No. Have you?

[00:22:26]>> I'm checking it out right now.

[00:22:28]>> Uh h how often do you find yourself watching open source presentations?

[00:22:33]>> Almost never.

[00:22:34]>> I think we should have I think we should maybe hold this question for when we have Brad Shoemaker on.

[00:22:40]I feel like he's probably the guy who would watch an open source presentation.

[00:22:44]>> I'm gonna tell you.

[00:22:45]>> No, you think I'm way off. So, look, I realize that we're talking to a substantial number of you right now through the power of YouTube.

[00:22:59]99 times out of 10 out of 100, if I want to get information, I would much rather just have a written article than have to have a video.

[00:23:09]>> Really?

[00:23:09]>> Like how-to information? What? I hardly ever watch videos, >> dude. Like, like this is an hourong presentation at a Linux summit. Could have been an email.

[00:23:17]>> Really? You don't want to see? What?

[00:23:19]You're reading the transcript?

[00:23:21]>> I will. If they give me a transcript to read, I will absolutely do that.

[00:23:24]>> But honestly, they could just slide the share the deck in the notes and I'd be good. I just want something I can skim through real fast.

[00:23:30]>> Okay. Wow. Yeah, >> I know. I know.

[00:23:32]>> Even if it's something that you're like super interested in.

[00:23:35]>> I look I'm going to go and tell you what stuff that I'm interested in enough that I'm willing to watch an hourong video for.

[00:23:40]>> What if what if next year they announce Neron, a convention for Neri? That's not a thing.

[00:23:45]>> And there's going to be there's going to be speakers.

[00:23:47]>> Yeah. I'm going to be speaking at that clearly. So I I um >> You wouldn't you wouldn't tune in for the the sessions and and watch them?

[00:23:56]>> Like like what's new in near?

[00:23:58]>> No, I I if somebody writes a a three paragraph summary of each of those sessions, I will read that all day long.

[00:24:05]>> But I'm not going to spend six hours watching the the sessions. Like honestly, even when I go to conferences where there's good sessions, often I'll watch the I'll I'll spend the time at the conference talking to people and then I'll go watch the sessions on like 3x speed later on YouTube.

[00:24:20]>> I mean, yeah, it's true. I like for me, I think the problem I have, and they did share a couple links, thank you. Uh in in the chat, is that it's titled Linux AppSummit 2026 day one.

[00:24:32]>> Yeah.

[00:24:32]>> So, the YouTube video is is like literally just Yeah. It's like a recording of it. It's 7 hours long. It has no chapters. It doesn't say maybe in the description. Yeah, even in the description it doesn't say. Oh, here we go. Somebody scrubbed it and put time codes. So, we have lenient pottering adding trust to Linux based OSS.

[00:24:55]Uh, breaking architecture barriers, flat pack and portals, a system of designing local first genome apps, streamlined application. Okay.

[00:25:04]>> I would watch the the x86 gaming on ARM one probably and that's it so far.

[00:25:08]>> Yeah. But also like I think that this feels like it's for developers, right?

[00:25:12]>> Yeah. That I mean that's what the Linux app summit would be is a a a thing a conference for people who make apps for Linux.

[00:25:20]>> Yeah. And may maybe some I mean maybe some interesting crossover but yeah I I don't know. So no. Am I interested? No.

[00:25:28]The only time I I've ever really watched a summit kind of thing that was Linux based was that there was uh Ubuntu had whatever their yearly thing is and there was a a person who had some sort of history around graphical interfaces like talking about oh hey here's how we do UI better or not how we do UI better but here's how we evolved UI over time and that one was interesting that that wasn't just Linux- based it also wasn't just based. Yeah. Yeah. So that was a cool talk. But yeah.

[00:26:02]>> Yeah. But but like for example this morning uh Marchin Winry who who wrote um I think the definitive book about keyboards and keyboard history technology.

[00:26:12]>> Okay.

[00:26:12]>> Um it's called shift happens I think. I can't remember. Um, but he he did a blog post this morning that's like I don't know it was like a 30 minute read of ways you can use ways you can program your keyboards to do interesting helpful things for you. And his like he was looking at a bunch of those kind of aftermarket uh key keypads like that are like eight or 10 or 12 or 16 buttons and maybe some knobs and stuff like that aren't exactly Stream Decks but are more mechanical keyboards >> like the Cooler Master one. Uh, no. The Cooler Master one's more like a stream deck. I'm talking about like um Oh god.

[00:26:49]The the what's the one with like 16 buttons and the big giant knob on the side. That's the That's the one that I think of as the famous one in this category.

[00:26:55]>> I can't think of >> but it's it's basically like a small mechanical keyboard with the QMX firmware and you can like either bind specific actions to the thing. You can make it real scripty. You can do layers and all that kind of stuff. and he did this whole big long blog post about different ways that people use them because his thing is he goes out and interviews people and finds out how they use their computers and then and then talks about um like that in an almost anthropological sense, right?

[00:27:20]>> Um if that had been a 45minute video versus a 45minute read, probably wouldn't have read it.

[00:27:28]>> I we're different. I I definitely would rather watch it. uh voice ko like let us know is there can you send any timestamps of interesting presentations stuff that you got out >> that RMX86 thing looks interesting I wonder if that's got the FX stuff in there >> yeah I do wonder if that's interesting >> uh but yeah I also how many of these things happen do you think like big Linux presentations summits and >> I think Linux apps for consumer like desktop use are probably relatively few But there's a bunch of things like like like there's Pyon which is a con conference for Python developers, right?

[00:28:08]There's like there's all of these sorts of things. There's I it's funny. I don't think that there's an OBS thing. I'm kind of surprised that there's not an OBS con.

[00:28:15]>> Wouldn't that just be a Twitchcon?

[00:28:17]>> Well, no. No, because OBS is like people use OBS for a bunch of different things that aren't just Twitch. Twitch is just Twitch is just one of the larger more popular usage uses usages.

[00:28:27]>> Okay. Right.

[00:28:28]>> Yeah. Next question comes in from Ensol, friend of the show. So, how do we feel about AI doing the work to port non-native software over the he links a uh Freronx article which I'll I'll put down in the description and it the rest of the question if Adobe won't do it despite their grip on the market this feels like the direction things may head. So yeah, essentially people are using AI to port over not port but make translation layers work for uh for Lightroom classic. In this example, it was an open source developer with the assistance of Claude code has managed to get Adobe Lightroom CC software working on Linux under wine. So number one that that it's interesting like as somebody who's really stuck in the Adobe ecosystem like it it's interesting. How do you feel about having AI make the translation layer?

[00:29:25]>> I feel like um look this is one of those difficult situations because I feel like if you're if you're writing if you're vibe coding like you shouldn't vibe code stuff and then submit it to random open source projects, right? like especially there's a bunch of open source projects that have explicit rules against right including AI software for a whole host of good reasons and I I know I've talked to a couple of developers and a couple of maintainers who are like yeah the number of submissions I get that are clearly AI code that are just absolutely garbage that maybe work but won't pass unit tests or whatever is really really high. Now, having it figure out the wine translation layer for a specific piece of software like I that I I don't feel quite as bad about. Uh I haven't looked at this to see if it looks like an absolute nightmare, though. Yeah. So, in that article, there's a link to the the GitHub.

[00:30:22]I just got to read one of the lines from the article. Quote, Claude Opus 4.7 working anonymously ended up doing much of the heavy lifting after being prompted, get Lightroom CC working on Linux, then publish a repro reproducible receip.

[00:30:40]End quote.

[00:30:41]>> Yeah.

[00:30:41]>> End quote.

[00:30:42]>> And this is for the Lightroom CC, not Lightroom Classic. Just for the record, like this is the modern Lightroom desktop, not not the old standalone one.

[00:30:50]>> Yeah. Uh um so I I I don't I'm of two minds because the first part of me was like, "Yeah, screw screw Adobe." Like like let's have somebody just do their work for them or, you know, get get access to this. It's like it almost feels like rebellious in nature a little bit, but it's also using AI to do it. So I don't know. Yeah, it's it's hard.

[00:31:17]>> I I think so. This person started with the files basement wine fork that fixed the C CC installers uh checkin so that you can you can launch the actual like authentication so you can get so they're not using a pirated version it seems like.

[00:31:32]>> Um I I'm I'm like I I don't know like this feels this feels more this feels less bad than hey talking to a maintainer who's getting spammed with a bunch of AI commits, right?

[00:31:48]I I still not sure I think it's a good long-term solution for the problem, which is that Adobe should just release their freaking software on Linux.

[00:31:56]>> I mean, I I I really don't think they are.

[00:31:58]>> No, they're never going to.

[00:31:59]>> Yeah. Yeah. Like I I think that that ship is too a ship's too big to turn.

[00:32:04]>> I don't know. I mean, look, if Microsoft market share keeps eroding, maybe they'll they'll consider reconsider.

[00:32:11]>> I I I think it's more likely that people will just move off. Like I think I had told you recently that there was an update for >> um Da Vinci Resolve that added >> Oh yeah.

[00:32:22]>> Uh Light Lightroom Lightroom like features for video or I'm sorry photo organization. So >> yeah, it's funny. The other thing I looked at was Blender, which has a pretty surprisingly robust video editor in there now, which they built because Blender's whole thing is that they dog food their tools. and they were like, "Well, we needed a video editor to to be able to make, you know, movies with Blender." So, we made a video editor and like it's a it's better way better than I expected it to be. Anyway, >> yeah, interesting. Interesting. For sure. The next one is from SNA1 1975.

[00:33:01]I asked Copilot why I could not print again on my ancient HP 1018 printer after successfully tested it before, and the answer opened a new can of worms. It appears that several printers do not come with firmware on board, but it is re-uploaded by the driver every time it starts. Who knew? This is why printing on Linux can break a man. Wow. Okay. I actually did not know this. Did you know this?

[00:33:26]>> Yeah. This is this is part of the modern nightmare that is printing >> is that like this is this is why buying this is why everybody loves that cheap laser from Brother like the $80 laser printer from Brother is because it doesn't do most of this nonsense >> because the firmware is on board. It turns out they just have like look there's a there was a there was a whole bunch of hostbased printers and scanners and combos and stuff for a long time you had to plug into a computer with USB and like they would drag glom CPU cycles from your computer to run.

[00:33:57]>> Uh this is this is I guess better but I don't know like this is why you buy network printers instead of USB printers is the is the real answer to this question.

[00:34:07]>> Oh >> because a network printer has to have CPU and and firmware and everything.

[00:34:11]It's running all the time.

[00:34:13]versus these US these cheap USB printers which literally are just like a couple of motors and an ink squirter and a USB connection to your PC.

[00:34:23]>> Dude, the amount of printers I still see on the side of the road every day, not every day, every week I'll see at least a couple printers on the side of the road where it's just like, oh, another printer on the side of the road.

[00:34:36]>> Well, and the like the planned obsolescence is obviously a big part of the problem, right? where like you you use it for a while and then they change the ink cartridge format and then or the or the toner cartridge format and all of a sudden your your replacement printer ink or cartridges or whatever cost two times what they used to. But but there's also a bunch of other shenaniganry in terms of like, hey, you know, it it does the thing that it tries to trap the old people into into buying uh uh toner and paper from from the vendor from the printer vendor, right? Oh, hey, hey, Adam, I noticed you're I'm almost out of ink. Do you want to get some more? You can just hit the button on your printer and then it'll send you a QR code that you can scan and go straight to the store and put your credit card in and we'll say it'll just cost you three times as much as it normally does. It's it's a lousy market.

[00:35:27]>> Yeah. I mean, this is aside from Linux stuff, but like I I wonder how much of the volume of e-waste is just printers.

[00:35:37]>> Printers. Yeah. Oh, it's probably I >> It's got to It's got to be large, right?

[00:35:41]>> Yeah. Yeah, but it's less than like TVs and stuff like that. Like when I take stuff to the e-waste in Pacifica, I I often see like a 55 or 60inch TV just in the big bin.

[00:35:51]>> A CRT? No. No. Okay. I was about to say you need a forklift to move that. Like I'm talking about a flat panel, like a 65 in LCD flat panel.

[00:35:59]>> True. And those were thick thicker at the time, too.

[00:36:02]>> I mean, I've I've seen ones that were thin enough I could lift it out by myself.

[00:36:05]>> Really?

[00:36:05]>> Yeah. People throw out all sorts of stuff. It's wild.

[00:36:07]>> Okay. Well, >> yeah. It's mostly phones though would be my guess. Like maybe not by volume but by number of items. Yeah, >> it's phones for sure.

[00:36:15]>> Yeah. Well, because there's burner phones, dumb phones over the history.

[00:36:18]>> People buy phones every year and like you know for a long time they just there was no like you couldn't give them back to Apple or and or Google or whatever to get a new one and then make it their problem. So yeah.

[00:36:30]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:36:31]>> Yeah. Those ones have to go somewhere.

[00:36:33]>> You know what? You know where else we got to go?

[00:36:35]>> Uh take a quick break.

[00:36:36]>> Take an ad break. We'll be right back after these messages.

[00:36:42]>> Hey, thanks for that word from our sponsor.

[00:36:44]>> Yeah, it was great. It was great. Just like the rest of these questions. So, I did go and check the the the electronic mail.

[00:36:51]>> Yeah, the electronic mail. We we got a couple questions sitting in there for a bit. So, we're going to answer these.

[00:36:57]The first one comes in from Lorenzo.

[00:37:00]Hello.

[00:37:00]>> Thanks, Lorenzo. When looking at a DRO for a mature desktop for someone like me who has never had direct experience, >> what >> what do you think they mean by mature desktop?

[00:37:09]>> I I don't >> you think they mean like for >> specifically for people over 50?

[00:37:14]>> Is it like is this like when I went into that mature game store that time and I was like, whoa, these are not one of the I thought we were going to see Call of Duty in here.

[00:37:21]>> Those people aren't wearing pants.

[00:37:23]>> Okay. Yeah. I I'm you know, no. I'm not going to ask if there are waifu dros because I'm sure the answer is look you can you anything can be a waifu distro if you try hard enough.

[00:37:34]>> True. Yeah, maybe that's Adam OS. Uh anyway, looking for a distro for a mature desktop for somebody like me who has never had direct experience of Linux. I found Mint and Zorna OS recommended.

[00:37:48]Have Will or Adam thought about running either? If they have considered those distributions, why were they deemed not suited for the podcast?

[00:37:57]Uh we looked at some of them. I we tried mint early on.

[00:38:00]>> Yeah. Mint. Like I uh used Pop was my first one.

[00:38:04]>> Yeah.

[00:38:04]>> And then and then I tried out Mint.

[00:38:07]>> Like it wasn't bad. I guess it was just close enough to pop at that time that I was like, "Okay, I don't see anything different." And also by default like the the main version of Mint was uh KD Plasma. And then once I figured out the difference between KD and Gnome, I was like, "Ah, I'm a Gnome person." So, but Zoran, I mean, I I've Yeah. So, I mean, Mint's awesome. I I've never used Zoran, though.

[00:38:31]>> So, I mean, I think the thing that we both realized So, so the thing that we both realized is that the DRO was less important than the soft like the DRO is a is an ethos, right? So, like on Arch, it's hey, everything's they're running the latest versions and it's uh you use systemd and and a couple other core ideas, right? Like that you should be engaged with maintaining your computer.

[00:38:54]Um, I think that the the core ethos of Mint is, hey, and and POP is, hey, we want to build something that's an easy transition for Windows users or Mac users, which is fine. Wasn't really what I was looking for for the podcast because if that transition's too easy, it turns out we have fewer episodes of the show to do. Uh, well, yes, but I I don't know. Like, for me, I guess the it's not like I left Pop OS because it wasn't able to do what I wanted. I like I started I just started dro hopping.

[00:39:25]>> Yeah.

[00:39:26]>> So like it was just a a part of my like my journey was to say, "Oh, wow. Look at that one. Oh, look at that one."

[00:39:31]>> On the Bachelor when the Bachelor goes out and kisses all those girls, you were out kissing all the different dros.

[00:39:38]>> Okay.

[00:39:38]>> And then you came back and you were like Fedora, it turns out, was the one in the hot tub that I liked all along.

[00:39:43]>> Yeah. And I I I kissed Mint for for a hot minute. I was like, "Okay, nothing wrong with you. You're you're a very nice you're a very nice Dro. Maybe a little more mouth than I was hoping for.

[00:39:53]>> Nothing wrong with mint at all, but yeah. Okay, that's funny. Uh Zoran, like I have >> Zoran, too. I don't remember.

[00:40:00]>> No, I I never kiss Zoran. I I was getting confused because I What was that one that you used that had weird >> package stuff? Okay, so this is not the same thing. I I thought it was the same thing.

[00:40:10]>> Nick is different.

[00:40:11]>> So like Zor and I I have been interested in >> that looks like for Max.

[00:40:17]>> Yeah. Well, I mean they've got they've got different ways to present it. No, I mean like like they got Gnome. I mean the you know this looks like a KDE kind of thing.

[00:40:25]>> Oh, that look that could be a Neri or something there.

[00:40:26]>> Yeah, who knows?

[00:40:28]>> Uh anyway, I I also thought it was funny on the the main page for Zoran there's a quote from PC World. Quote, "When speed is of essence, Zoran OS really shines."

[00:40:38]And I have no idea who wrote this.

[00:40:40]There's it's not clickable. There's it's not attributed to anyone at PC World. So hopefully it's a real quote, but now I'm curious. So, so the interesting thing, so for me, I ended up going with Cashy um because a a lot of the work that's happening that I was particularly interested in and a I wanted to learn how things work, right? Like this is part of my goal with this whole project was I wanted to get good at Linux in the same way I've been good at Windows for a really long time. I so more than just have a computer I could use to browse the web and do my taxes and all the things that we use our computers for. I wanted to have fundamental understanding about how things work in Linux. And like the that process is slow, but I'm getting there. I feel like I'm I'm at the point now where I like when something breaks, I kind of instead of having no idea how to fix it, now I have a pretty good idea of where to at least start and then can dig in from there. Um I and I feel like using some of these the the friendlier uh friendlier kind of gentle on boards for Windows users to Linux maybe defeats the purpose of that.

[00:41:45]>> Yeah. So >> that said Cosmic really owns so you should try Pop.

[00:41:49]>> Uh I think I think I found the PC World article. Uh >> is this like five hot new Linux distros that are going to blow your mind?

[00:41:58]>> No, I I don't know. I can't find the direct quote. uh just by quick search, but this is a contributor to PC World, Arie Arnold. I actually don't know who this person is. Written in 2024 >> uh comparing a couple different dros.

[00:42:14]>> Okay. Yeah, I don't know who this is, but like of the ones that are still on my list, like if I were to go back into and start dro hopping again, that would definitely be on my list.

[00:42:24]>> Cosmic or Zoran?

[00:42:25]>> Zoran.

[00:42:25]>> Okay.

[00:42:26]>> Uh well, I mean like I definitely want to try out Pop OS. like it continues to to call to me to beckon. Uh but mint I don't know. Yeah. I like I feel like mint is in a good stable place which is maybe something a lot of people appreciate but it also just there was nothing about it that I wanted to kind of go back and and dig into. I I like like the interesting thing to me about the Zoran pitch is hey we're building this on iuntu so instead of Arch or Fedora or Red Hat right and as a result you're going to have an easier ramp to getting your like electron stuff working and like you can use the just the Slack version that runs on Ubuntu and and stuff like that which is which is compelling if you if you don't want to have to fool with stuff like the AUR and whatever. I mean that honestly that's why I almost stuck with Iuntu because I was like hey there are so many people using Ibuntu that it must be easy to to find documentation to find other people who are running into issues they might be having and like even though Fedora is not as widely used as Ubuntu like like it still is huge like that matters to me like I it's easier for me to search for Fedora stuff and find a lot of Fedora information because Fedora is so widely used. Not that Mint isn't, but because Mint is a variation of Ubuntu Ubuntu, then you can kind of understand like, oh, okay, it I don't know.

[00:43:59]>> Well, yeah. Yeah. And and like I said, if your goal is, hey, you want a computer that's free of Microsoft, that's one thing. But if your goal is you want to learn about Linux, then maybe those those, hey, we're going to make this easy for Windows users, distros aren't necessarily your jam.

[00:44:15]>> Well, I'll tell you what. Which one am I gonna give to my grandma? I would put her on mint probably.

[00:44:20]>> She wants a mature desktop OS.

[00:44:22]>> Like, yeah, something that's just not gonna f around, you know, just like, hey, it is what it is, and it's it's rock solid.

[00:44:28]>> Give her pop.

[00:44:29]>> I I the Cosmic thing. I know. I know you can probably >> still use different desktop environments, but I feel like they're putting so much work into Cosmic that I bet >> I mean, I shouldn't say that. I don't know.

[00:44:40]>> You've asked for, you think?

[00:44:43]>> No. Yeah. No. Cosmic, I think, is just too too much for Yeah.

[00:44:47]>> I mean, even the wallpaper, like it's got the cosmic.

[00:44:50]>> I mean, you think it's too sparkly. It's like over stimulating for the geriatrics.

[00:44:54]>> Yeah.

[00:44:54]>> Wow.

[00:44:56]>> I didn't say that. Uh, next question that came in to the email box was from Curtis. Said, "Hey nerds, what is your favorite flavor of Unix?"

[00:45:05]>> Uh, BSD >> Open.

[00:45:10]>> Isn't Linux based off of Unix?

[00:45:11]>> Solaris.

[00:45:13]I don't know. I'm just naming Unix this way. Bell Labs.

[00:45:16]>> Wait, but you've used AT&T.

[00:45:17]>> Yeah, I've used BST.

[00:45:18]>> Yeah. Okay. So, you've actually used >> PSD is not Unix.

[00:45:22]>> Well, then what is Unix?

[00:45:23]>> Unix is a proprietary uh uh operating system that was made by Bell Labs in the like >> So, it's not a DRO. It's like a kernel.

[00:45:31]>> This is a Brad Shoemaker question. I'm not I'm not the hold this until Brad's around.

[00:45:36]>> Uh Unix is >> actually my favorite version of Unix was the one in Jurassic Park. That's That's >> I thought she sat down at the terminal and she's like, "Oh, I understand this.

[00:45:45]This is >> I know this." She It was a Sun workstation with a weird prototype 3D Gooey that I don't think they ever I mean, actually, that's not right. I bet I can install the 3D guey for that for that. This is Unix. I know this.

[00:45:59]>> What was What was BOS?

[00:46:01]>> It was not Unix also. It's a Pix compliant OS from >> That was based on what was it based on?

[00:46:08]It might have been its own original thing. They might have written the kernel for it and everything. Uh, but Unix, so there's a lot of stuff that Unix's likes are. Linux was built as a Unix clone for Windows. There was licensing stuff around Unix and who owned Unix for a really long time.

[00:46:25]>> Um, because the company uh um the company that bought it initially then got split up into a bunch of pieces and felt like there there's there's scene drama around what is a Unix.

[00:46:36]>> Scene drama. Love it. Uh, >> that's the episode we should do with with Brad Shoemakers. Just scene drama.

[00:46:42]>> We we've tried that before. People get really upset.

[00:46:47]>> Uh, so yeah, it was a silicon graphics 3D file system navigator for ERIC, which was another uh Unix variant that was run that ran on SGI workstations.

[00:46:56]>> I mean, it looked cool as hell. Like when she was going into the different I I assume those were like f file folders like like they had like a spotlight and it would just like zoom in. Imagine if you had that animation every time you would go into a subfolder.

[00:47:11]>> Well, like there have been a lot of people that have done those projects over the years, right? Like there was the thing that you could do where you could use Quake to manage your file system and if have you never seen this?

[00:47:22]Maybe it was Doom. What?

[00:47:23]>> But you load up the file system in a first-person shooter and you're like each folder is a room and in the room there are objects that represent the files and if you shoot the files then they get deleted. But what else can you do with it? You can pick him up with the E button and carry it to another room.

[00:47:38]>> Uh, >> okay. That's actually pretty fun.

[00:47:40]>> Yeah, it's amazing. It's a really good way to completely jack up your computer because you like you accidentally like, "Wow, I'm having fun." You do a desktop and like you wipe out your Windows directory and next thing you know, >> Actually, that's that sounds like a fun way to to delete a partition.

[00:47:54]>> If you were going to delete a Linux partition, that would be a good way to go about it.

[00:47:58]>> That's hilarious. So I want to say yeah that it's called file system visualizer FSV >> because it needs an acronym for sure.

[00:48:09]>> Yeah. I want to see if you can get it for Linux. It's on Source Forge. You have to be running X Windows though. I wonder if I bet it doesn't work on Wayland.

[00:48:18]>> Oh >> yeah, >> that would be hilarious.

[00:48:23]>> Yeah, >> 3D file system visualizer. I don't think you can run it on on Wayland probably.

[00:48:27]>> Maybe maybe Mint. Maybe you can >> run that.

[00:48:30]>> Uh, >> hold on. I'm going to parro it real quick.

[00:48:32]>> Oh, no. Oh, live live searching for >> live.

[00:48:36]>> What do you What do you got in here?

[00:48:37]>> Uh, library help mapping IDs. FS verify.

[00:48:42]>> I don't think any of these are it.

[00:48:44]>> These don't look Oh, fs file system versioning.

[00:48:47]>> Virtual virtual black hole file system that behaves like what?

[00:48:51]>> That seems like a bad idea.

[00:48:52]>> Virtual black hole. Why would you want that?

[00:48:54]>> Sometimes you just want a place that you can send stuff. Oh, it's just dev null.

[00:48:58]So yeah, you can do that.

[00:49:00]>> Is that to delete something?

[00:49:01]>> Uh, next file viewer look like for window maker. Nope, that's not it.

[00:49:05]>> Dude, there's some wild stuff in this parro man.

[00:49:08]>> Well, paru's this is just the >> Anyone can put stuff in there though.

[00:49:12]>> No, no, not exactly. Like these first few are part of the core cache repos.

[00:49:17]>> Yeah, >> it's the aur that's a little wild. Yeah, >> this is wild west, man.

[00:49:21]>> Fast system versioning. Now I don't see the there's a next file viewer lookalike for window maker. That's weird.

[00:49:28]But yeah, I don't I don't think you can install. That's b That's a bummer.

[00:49:31]>> Yeah. Well, if if somebody knows how we can do that.

[00:49:34]>> Yeah, let's get let's go.

[00:49:36]>> There there's your other desktop environment was what is it called? FSV.

[00:49:39]>> I'm just going to run ERICS on my Windows computer now in 2026.

[00:49:43]>> Is there anything that runs Unix that I would have not have realized? Like, oh, hey dog, that that clock over there actually runs Unix. You use it all the time.

[00:49:50]>> Well, no, that all that stuff's running Linux now because Linux is way easier and runs on way more hardware. The Unix stuff was usually for like like so if you were trying to build a web server in like 1996, the way you did that was by buying a Spark machine for $100,000 and putting your web server on that which was a Unix machine. Okay.

[00:50:07]>> Because the tools for hosting the websites didn't exist until for PC until later when the LAMPstack the Linux Apache uh MySQL and I don't remember what the P was but >> Paru.

[00:50:19]>> No, it wasn't Paru. What was the P >> provider? No, no, but th those provided HTTP uh uh server that could serve web pages that you just could run on any PC.

[00:50:31]>> Okay.

[00:50:32]>> Yeah.

[00:50:32]>> Yeah.

[00:50:33]>> Interesting.

[00:50:33]>> Like Linux exists because the BSD licensing drama I mean the the Unix licensing drama was such that Lionus wanted a a Linux a Unix clone for wind for for Windows compatible PCs.

[00:50:48]>> Okay.

[00:50:48]>> X86 PCs. It's >> pronounced Linus. You're a limit.

[00:50:52]>> Uh, thank you for the questions in our email box. If you want to write in to our email, it's the full nerd at podcast. No, the full nerd at pcworld.com.

[00:51:00]>> Yeah, exactly.

[00:51:01]>> Not podcast.com.

[00:51:02]>> Podcast.com is a different >> the full nerd at PCWorld.com.

[00:51:05]>> The next one comes in from Discord from friend of the show, Great Mighty Daddy.

[00:51:10]I had a friend give me a laptop that they are no longer using. It's a firstg Surface book. Was thinking of putting Linux of some sort on it. A little research indicates there's something called the Surface kernel that helps make sure things like the pen and touchcreen work. Any recommendations or thoughts on putting Linux on a Surface device like the Surface Book? So, my first question is, is that uh what processor is that running? What?

[00:51:34]Because I know there was the the ones that ran ARM in that early version, early push of ARM.

[00:51:41]>> I think the Surface Book is the one that looked like a laptop the whole time.

[00:51:45]>> Oh, that you could detach like the detachable. Gordon loved these. I actually we have a couple over here.

[00:51:51]>> Norm Norman Chan at when I was at Tested, we would get these in and Norm would like be like, "I got a new laptop.

[00:51:58]I'm good. We're not like this is the best thing I've ever seen." Um the first one was a Skylake, I think. So, it's a 6300U, which is probably fine.

[00:52:06]>> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. So, yeah, cuz I was wondering, I was like, man, is that is that armbbased? What what were those early ARMbased tablets?

[00:52:13]>> Those were terrible. Yeah, but what was the um what was the name?

[00:52:17]>> Cortex A8s or something.

[00:52:18]>> No, no, but what was the name of those?

[00:52:19]>> They were Surface RTS.

[00:52:20]>> Surface RT. There we go.

[00:52:21]>> Yeah, that was that thing was awful.

[00:52:23]>> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Uh so it's not that.

[00:52:25]That's cool. Um and you want to put Linux on it.

[00:52:28]>> I think that's fine. There's a there's a pretty robust community. Um, uh, there's a pretty robust community of people doing Linux stuff on Surface Books, getting the things like the pen and the and the different levels of like because the neat thing about those pens on the Surface tablets was that they were really pressure sensitive like you could do actual art on them.

[00:52:50]>> Oh, >> like in the same way you do on a Wackom or something like that. Were those Wackom or No, >> no, no, they was their own thing or it was a different it was a digitizer they bought, but they did a good job on the software and the hardware and it and it worked really well to the point that like I want to say like a bunch of web comic folks really engaged with those and and like them because they let them work work remotely and travel and stuff.

[00:53:12]Um the I I haven't spent any time at all looking at that stuff. I haven't I haven't I probably have a Surface RT at home someplace, but that was the last time I engaged with the Surface in any kind of meaningful way.

[00:53:23]>> Uh yeah, I bet it's not that hard to get the touchcreen working in an appreciable way. Yeah, the pen, who knows? I mean, because then also the DRO would have to have some sort of tools.

[00:53:35]>> There's plenty of tools for pen support and all that stuff.

[00:53:37]>> Like KDE has a if you if it detects that you have a pen compatible digitizer >> pops up a tool a pen a pen setting thing in your settings panel. You might have to install it.

[00:53:47]>> My other question would be because the the whole thing with the Surface Book is that it's a tablet that then you essentially dock into a keyboard, a full size keyboard.

[00:53:56]>> Yeah. Which has a battery, but I thought there were versions that had a discrete GPU.

[00:54:01]>> You could get a dock with a discrete GPU. A keyboard with a discrete GPU. The whole thing. I don't I don't know if they have that, but >> I don't My guess is that the Surface support stuff is better on the Surface tablets than it is on the Surface Book, but I don't know for sure.

[00:54:18]>> Well, because I my guess is those like sure maybe some some journalists like those, but my guess is those didn't sell very. I don't know if I've ever seen one.

[00:54:26]>> Really expensive.

[00:54:27]>> Have you seen one in the wild?

[00:54:28]>> The surface. There's one, right? There's one in the other. No, no, but this is this is testing hardware testing lab has like >> somebody put veneer on it on it.

[00:54:37]>> Yeah, that was Gordon.

[00:54:37]>> Gordon class.

[00:54:38]>> So, not journalists. Have you ever seen not journalists using it?

[00:54:42]>> I mean, I don't usually see other people, normal people using laptops.

[00:54:45]>> Really? You go over to Blue Bottle and it's just MacBook heaven over there.

[00:54:49]>> I don't look at what kind of computer like I don't want to know what kind >> I always like looking at business. No, I >> No, I like to gauge a temperature. What What are the What are the coders around here?

[00:54:57]>> That's not That's all that matters. or cold depending on your your flavor.

[00:55:01]>> I like cold coffee actually.

[00:55:02]>> Yeah. I I um So for a while when you'd get on an airplane, you'd see a couple like it would be like 80 MacBooks on the airplane and like two people using weird Surface tablets.

[00:55:14]>> Yeah.

[00:55:15]>> But now now I want to see if I can dust this off and get it working with Linux.

[00:55:19]>> You you absolutely should. I think it's a great idea.

[00:55:21]>> This my my new podcast.

[00:55:22]>> Definitely not a waste of time.

[00:55:23]>> What's what's in the pile of hardware that I can put Linux on?

[00:55:26]>> What old crap can I run Linux on?

[00:55:28]>> Yeah. Oh, hey. This week I put Linux on what did I put it on? I don't know. A compact pursio.

[00:55:34]>> That's not a real thing. Those are two not words.

[00:55:37]>> Oh, I thought it was >> I I just think um No, it was a real >> Okay. I was like maybe >> compact were desktops, though I think usually.

[00:55:43]>> Oh, really?

[00:55:43]>> Um the uh >> Hey, I could do desktops, too.

[00:55:47]>> So, there's a whole the recommendation to give actionable advice here.

[00:55:53]When I was looking at tips for I think the Zoom upgrade, fixing the Zoom battery, I stumbled onto a Surface Linux like part of that community was a Surface people, people who are making Surface machines work on Linux. I don't remember where it was. I don't remember what the URL was, but your people are out there. Go find them.

[00:56:18]>> Yeah, go find your people. Uh, also let let me know what dro you're going to do because like I said, I I literally have two on the shelf over there. Yeah, I I I would I would try this with you and if if you could teach me a thing or two, maybe that works.

[00:56:32]>> Uh, another question here from Voice Colo kind of piggybacks on that one front of the show. Have you tried using a touchcreen with Linux on your computer? KD Plasma 6.6 and Gnome 50 have made it work smoothly. Uh, so Will next to me has a a Framework 13 that you just tried to touch the screen.

[00:56:50]>> It's not a touch screen.

[00:56:51]>> It's not a touch screen. So, uh, but the new Framework 13 Pro >> does have a touch screen.

[00:56:57]>> Um, >> I can't take the orange thing off.

[00:56:59]>> Yeah, you can.

[00:57:00]>> I like that.

[00:57:00]>> Yeah, that is nice. Uh, so yeah. And and I've I've used the touchcreen on on devices like even that that Lenovo I have the the old >> junker Lenovo has a touchcreen and it and it works like like do I do a lot of things with the touch screen? Am I doing pen on it? No. For me, the touchcreen is mostly just like like putting my hand to the side and then just Yeah. scrolling with my thumb. Like that's usually my the extent of my touchcreen uh ability.

[00:57:27]And for that, I've never had an issue.

[00:57:29]>> I I So, let's see. I've had three or four different laptops I've used over the course of >> the Dell had a touch screen.

[00:57:35]>> The Dell and the Asus both had touch.

[00:57:37]>> Oh, the did too. Okay.

[00:57:38]>> Um I've never ever used them >> really. I just You're not a touch screen person. fundamentally do not like touchcreens on a laptop >> because my hands here, my thumb is perfectly placed on the trackpad. That's all I need. And also, I mostly like maybe not on that Asus, but ever since the Asus, I've been using the tiling window manager and I just don't take my hand off the keyboard if I don't have to.

[00:57:59]>> Okay, true. Well, but look at this. I I'm on the the Zoran homepage and I I put my hand to the side and I'm just I'm sitting there scrolling. Man, >> I'm on the Wikipedia entry for the Surface Book and I >> No, but you're having to move your whole hand. I'm just using my thumb.

[00:58:12]>> You're a thumb.

[00:58:14]>> I'm I'm like, look, the acceleration is better. It feels better. I don't know, man. I don't I I don't truck by touch.

[00:58:20]Plus, no groy fingerprints on my screen, except for where I did them to try if there were fingerprints on my screen.

[00:58:26]Yeah. Well, you know that that happens.

[00:58:27]>> The side of your computer is all greasy.

[00:58:29]>> You know what? Uh yeah, you're just a friend of uh Steve Jobs. He says nobody wants to to >> people don't want touch screens. Yeah.

[00:58:35]640K of RAM. Uh it's three it's we're going to introduce three new devices today and nobody likes touchcreens except for on their tablets and phones and watches and also on your AirPods now and uh probably for your face at some point. I don't know. What about your car?

[00:58:53]>> I have a friend who has a a baby about to turn one.

[00:58:56]>> Okay.

[00:58:57]>> And >> is it a cool baby or is it a demon baby?

[00:58:59]>> It's a cool baby. Okay.

[00:59:00]>> It's like a real cool baby. Way way cooler than I am.

[00:59:02]>> Does it have like cool glasses or anything or is like >> uh No. Yeah. No. Just it's just a cool baby. Okay. Anyway, uh why would you even question this baby? This >> rude.

[00:59:13]>> Like I just want to know if the baby's cool, man.

[00:59:17]>> Of course it's cool. How do you know it's a cool baby?

[00:59:19]>> You talk to the baby.

[00:59:20]>> Yeah. I gave it my Game Boy Advance that I reshelled and it its face just lit up and just was like cloud.

[00:59:26]>> What's the baby going to do with a Game Boy Advance?

[00:59:28]>> I don't know, man. I'll show you the photos. Like that was one happy baby.

[00:59:31]Okay.

[00:59:31]>> Anyway, uh >> probably thought it was a phone stupid because they're a baby. I mean, like a lot of people, uh, my friends are trying to limit screen time for for >> It's a fool's Aaron, but >> it's hard, right? But even this almost one-year-old >> Yeah.

[00:59:47]>> like sees something every time he sees my watch, which is not a touchcreen, he goes up and and and tries to tries to press it. Like, it is so crazy >> to to think >> you have to attach your TV to the wall cuz the children will climb the walls to touch the TV. But like what is it about human nature that is so into touching interfaces?

[01:00:08]>> Nature. It's just that it's the only computers they've ever been exposed to.

[01:00:11]So you give a kid a tablet and they think that the only thing you can do with any screen is to touch it.

[01:00:16]>> And then as a result you walk up >> and they're like, "Well, that's a screen. Why can I not touch that? That's a screen. Why can I not touch that?"

[01:00:22]>> Well, it's because Framework didn't they couldn't make the plastic frame and the touchcreen work.

[01:00:26]>> Yeah. Separate thing.

[01:00:28]>> Does the new laptop have the plastic frame around the screen or not so much?

[01:00:31]Uh, I believe so. Yeah, I think it's I mean that's I mean if they didn't that would be weird. That's a that's a framework thing. Uh 13 Pro. I do we do not have it in >> it's a framework. Oh yeah, it does.

[01:00:42]Okay.

[01:00:42]>> Actually, it looks like the exact same frame.

[01:00:45]>> Oh, nice.

[01:00:45]>> Just by eyeballing it. So that is nice.

[01:00:48]>> Interesting.

[01:00:48]>> Uh but it's it's touch screen. No, it's not interesting to you. You don't even want to touch it. It'd be it'd be wasted on you.

[01:00:54]>> I mean, look, maybe I'm a touchcreen guy. Maybe there's a touchcreen guy inside me just trying to get out. It's like, "Oh my god, if only I had a touchcreen, I could get out of here."

[01:01:02]>> Oh god. All right. Uh, we need to wrap it up and get out of here because I'm >> It's getting a little punchy.

[01:01:07]>> Yeah, getting a little punchy.

[01:01:08]>> Got one more question.

[01:01:09]>> We got one more question from Friend of the show, Scribe Fix.

[01:01:12]>> Which versions of Proton do you run?

[01:01:15]Just Proton Experimental as default?

[01:01:17]Proton Cachios as default uh on Cachi?

[01:01:21]Does it matter? That is a great question.

[01:01:23]>> It is a great question.

[01:01:24]>> I I think we should answer this multiple different ways. Okay. First off, Steam Deck. You have a Steam Deck. Do you still use >> Steam Deck? Yeah.

[01:01:32]>> Okay. What do you What do you do on the Steam Deck?

[01:01:34]>> Default like default like >> if it works like the my Steam Deck is set up as defaults.

[01:01:42]>> So, um whatever Steam Deck ships, that's what I run. And if I have a game that doesn't launch, then I'll usually try experimental and then hot fix. And then sometimes I I have in the past in installed the Glorious Egg roll version, but I don't think that I currently have that installed.

[01:01:59]>> Okay. I I do the same thing for not only my Steam Deck, but even my other Steam OSbas based handhelds. For me, it's less about it's more it's more of a tool of troubleshooting. Am I having an issue?

[01:02:13]Yes or no. Then I'll go in and mess around with it. But if I'm not having an issue, then that's just what I'm going to use.

[01:02:19]>> Yeah.

[01:02:19]>> Right. Yeah.

[01:02:20]>> Like like like are we doing it wrong?

[01:02:22]Maybe we're losing out on performance or features or something.

[01:02:26]>> I don't care.

[01:02:27]>> You don't care.

[01:02:27]>> No, I'm fine.

[01:02:28]>> Okay.

[01:02:28]>> I just want the game to work and not have to think about it too much.

[01:02:31]>> If I'm playing a game on my Steam Deck, it's cuz I want to play a game, not because I want to fool around with them.

[01:02:35]>> True. True. Well, that's why you should come on Expedition Handheld. Why? What?

[01:02:39]What happened?

[01:02:40]>> No, no. I'm just saying you're going to love me on Expedition Handheld because you'll be like, "Hey, >> actually Russ is is a default guy."

[01:02:46]>> Yeah. Well, >> like as a as somebody who works on games that are in progress, keeping defaults is important, right?

[01:02:54]Because you want your machine when you're testing stuff to be representative of the broadest possible spectrum and running defaults is the easiest way to do that.

[01:03:00]>> Okay.

[01:03:01]>> Now, the moment I started running Linux, all that went out the window.

[01:03:03]>> Yeah. Uh what about what about Cache?

[01:03:06]Your your desktop at home, you do a lot of serious gaming there.

[01:03:10]>> What do you do for the Proton version?

[01:03:12]So by default, Steam ships on Cashachi with the Proton Cache OS forks, which is generally what I default to.

[01:03:20]>> Where did you get Steam from >> Paru or?

[01:03:23]>> No, no, no. When you do >> or was it B in Cashy, like just built in?

[01:03:28]>> Cashy hello has an option in there that's like, hey man, do you want to install install gaming packages? Oh, and I'm like, oh yeah, sure. That sounds great. And I hit that button and it got the it got the proton cachy forks and steam and I think it even called does it include heroic too? Yeah, it includes heroic too.

[01:03:45]>> Okay.

[01:03:46]>> Um so like the the TLDDR is heroic is really nice for this kind of stuff if you don't want to have to fool if you if you want to run different things with like command line options and all that stuff without having to like go into each one manually. So like if you want to run everything through Gamecope and your Steam doesn't do that by default unless you're on a handheld. So like using heroic to do that makes simplifies that process pretty pretty dramatically.

[01:04:16]>> Or if you want to add uh Steam Deck equals zero to every line just in case.

[01:04:23]I still hate that one.

[01:04:24]>> Yeah. Uh so so I I generally try to use the defaults and then like I said if the proton cachy fork doesn't work then I switch to experimental. I switch to whatever the latest steam one is then I switch to experimental. These days with 11.0 and beta I'll sometimes try that and then I do the hot fix if nothing else works.

[01:04:43]>> So why does cachy fork off proton and have their own?

[01:04:47]>> So it's the same reason glory roll exists. There's stuff in there's stuff in the cache and glory and proton GE versions that Valve can't ship because it's not because the licenses are weird.

[01:05:00]>> And so it's like video codecs and stuff like that.

[01:05:03]>> That's only for like older games, right?

[01:05:05]>> It depends. shows up. You'd be surprised where shows up.

[01:05:09]>> Um there there's there's other optimizations and stuff like that.

[01:05:12]There's a whole like if you go to the Cashy um GitHub page or GitLab, I can't remember if they're GitHub or GitLab, but you can go there and see the stuff that they do for their forks of Proton and it's like how far behind is it?

[01:05:26]>> Not at all.

[01:05:27]>> Not at all.

[01:05:28]>> No, that's it's a rolling dro.

[01:05:30]But I mean it still takes work to be like, oh, hey, here's a new Proton like we're almost on Proton 11, right? Isn't that the one that's in beta right now or something?

[01:05:40]So like I mean they're trying to do the work at the same time.

[01:05:46]>> Yeah, probably. So they say they even say on the proton cachy uh page, hey, you should probably just use the one provided by the Steam client. Uh and then there's a Steam community post. I don't I don't >> That's interesting. That's they're like calling out specifically, hey, you should be using the Steam what's built into Steam. I mean, their whole thing is saying, "Hey, don't bo bother Valve with problems that are a fork of their software."

[01:06:11]>> Oh, well, I mean, >> which is like responsible, >> but yeah, I don't I don't I just I honestly almost certainly just use this because it's the default and it works like 99% of the time. Uh, the other thing I do if I have a game that won't run is look at Proton DB because Proton DB is an incredible resource. They have per game recommendations. people can upload the configurations that they've had that work, including things like which DRO they use and what desktop environment and what driver they're using and all that kind of stuff. And it's it's and then also what command line options and what versions of Protons work for Protons what versions of Proton work for them.

[01:06:47]>> I like Yeah, I I typically haven't had to do that though.

[01:06:50]>> It's unusual.

[01:06:51]>> Yeah. Uh the places that I've had the most problem lately are uh newer stuff like Pragmata, which funnily worked when we were testing it out pre-release and then didn't work postrelease.

[01:07:02]They changed something in the way it launches.

[01:07:05]>> Um >> on Ner on KDE as well. This is the other benefit of having the KDE dual boot is I switch over. So when I like hey shut up about your Ner hate. um >> got me >> the um what was the other thing that I had trouble with? Um >> I don't remember.

[01:07:24]>> Well, yeah. I mean, yeah, >> but Oh, I've also had a weird thing, and this is an eerie thing, so you can get get ready. Uh sometimes indie games, especially low poly ones that are designed or like low pixel art ones that are supposed to be run at low lower resolutions, show up in like a quarter of the screen and you have to full screen them.

[01:07:43]>> You've mentioned that before.

[01:07:44]>> Which is like a two second fix. It annoys me that I can't just make that work right out of the g out of the box.

[01:07:50]>> Could you do it through Heroic?

[01:07:52]>> If I did it through Heroic and launched everything with Gamecope, it would probably work. Yeah.

[01:07:55]>> Okay. Yeah. Interesting.

[01:07:57]>> Game scope solves a lot of these problems. It turns out >> uh last question in in this is does it matter?

[01:08:03]>> No. If the game works, it doesn't matter.

[01:08:06]>> Don't worry about it. Enjoy your game.

[01:08:09]Play your game. Have fun. Drink Pepsi.

[01:08:12]Be a kid.

[01:08:13]>> Yeah. I don't know. There is there is a little little voice in the back of my head that's like, "Yeah, dog." But you could be missing out on something.

[01:08:21]>> Yeah. Look, >> either performance or features or something. You could you could be missing out.

[01:08:26]>> We went and had we we went and had uh we went to the Vietnamese place down the street for lunch.

[01:08:31]>> Yeah, we did.

[01:08:31]>> But the other Vietnamese place a half block later could have been doing a special on the fivespice chicken and we were we we missed out on like the best five-speed chicken we've ever had.

[01:08:40]>> I mean, it it is a better boni for sure.

[01:08:43]I think that bomb me is definitely better than the one that you had today.

[01:08:45]Yeah, for sure. Yeah, but you're always missing out on something like like you're always going to miss out on something. You can't make you're going to make yourself create this the path that you're walking here. This way lays madness. Just if the thing works, enjoy it. Spend your time there and then when the time is up, go do something else.

[01:09:04]>> Wait, so you're saying I missed out on a cheaper bum me?

[01:09:06]>> Yeah. A better cheaper bum me. You screwed up.

[01:09:08]>> Dang it.

[01:09:09]>> Yeah, you got played, son.

[01:09:12]>> Yeah. All because Doug wanted to go to the place with the noodles.

[01:09:15]>> I I will say >> Doug >> the old like look this is lucky lucky for you, you know, running on a really high-end hardware and 9800 X3D with a 5090.

[01:09:27]>> Yeah.

[01:09:28]>> On a handheld, you need every ounce of performance out of it.

[01:09:31]>> It's fine. Smooth 40. Just move on.

[01:09:34]>> Okay.

[01:09:34]>> Just enjoy yourself.

[01:09:36]>> Yeah.

[01:09:36]>> Like don't don't look you sweat over the small stuff. It makes you crazy.

[01:09:42]This is this is how you end up on Reddit posting about oh man look I found a command line thing that gives me two frames a second more and whatever and like yeah two no you know what sometimes yes sometimes bigger bar is good enough it turns out medium bar is fine >> medium bar is fine there we go >> medium bar is fine yeah welcome to PC world medium bar >> medium bar is fine don't even know what that means >> don't stress about the bars like this like so much of what we do >> that's our job >> no No, no, it's not. Our job is not to feed people. Like people people want validation on the things that they spend money on, which I get. Like that's a natural human instinct to like you spent $800 on a video card. You want to make sure you got the good one and not the crap one. Now I got bad news because half of the $800 video cards out there are the crap one. But does it play your games? Does it work? Yeah, it's fine.

[01:10:32]You don't have to you don't have to engage in like internet tribalism to make you feel better and to justify your purchase. Just go play a game and have fun, man. That's that's our people's equivalent of touching grass. I'm telling you, like you want to Hey, I I had some Subnautica crashes.

[01:10:52]>> Oh, >> did we talk about this last episode?

[01:10:55]>> Oh, we might. Yeah, we probably did.

[01:10:57]Yeah. Yeah, we probably talked about that.

[01:10:58]>> Yeah, but I had some I I had some Subnotica crashes on Windows.

[01:11:04]>> Whoa. M's fighting words. And I went into the Steam forums, which is always a mistake. Always a mistake to go into the Steam forms.

[01:11:10]>> I don't go I know not to go in there.

[01:11:14]>> People I think the internet has angrieded up people's blood at such a high level that like they're just not that the discourse is just completely unhinged.

[01:11:24]>> I mean that iswhere for a lot of things.

[01:11:26]>> Everywhere. Yeah. Like hey, what's your skincare routine? Well, let me tell you.

[01:11:32]>> Let me tell you how wrong you are.

[01:11:34]Everything you know about skinincare is wrong. Adam, >> I just put cucumbers on my eyes.

[01:11:40]>> What is this? The 50s? Are you Italian?

[01:11:43]>> What? No, they put olives on their eyes over there.

[01:11:46]>> Oh, that's only when they're dead. It's coins then olives.

[01:11:49]>> Really?

[01:11:49]>> No.

[01:11:50]>> Oh god.

[01:11:54]Great show this week. We'll be back next week with another one. If they keep letting us do this, >> man. This is why this is why they they send me to Taiwan, you know. This is why we don't usually record this in the afternoon after the full nerd.

[01:12:05]>> They're a little punchy.

[01:12:06]>> Listen, if you stayed around to the end of this, you you got some some good good stuff.

[01:12:10]>> You learned about the olives and the Italians. Good stuff.

[01:12:13]>> Don't write write to Adam about this.

[01:12:16]>> Uh you could write to me over at the full nerd atpcorld.com.

[01:12:20]You could watch the video version of this podcast over at the Fullner Nerd Network on YouTube or on Dub Spotify >> and your skincare routine. I'm going to go ahead and find out like somebody somebody is going to look at the video of this and they're going to see exactly when I looked into the wall haven wallpaper selector and I typed waifu just to see what would come up. I made a face. Let me know when it was.

[01:12:43]>> Yeah.

[01:12:45]Uh if you want to listen to us uh through RSS feeds, well, we should be on every major podcast provider. There are a couple minor ones that uh people every every once in a while creep up and they're like, "Hey, you're not over here." Okay, let's let's check it out.

[01:13:00]I'll figure it out. Let us know. Uh if you want to join our our cool people over on Linux talk, then go over to the link in description. We have a Discord called the Full Nerd Network Discord. We have a Linux channel in there. We also have a Dual Boot Diaries questions channel. You can put only questions in there. Please hopefully get read on a future episode. And yeah, Brad has Brad and Will made a techpod. I also have the full nerd and expedition handheld podcasts all around. Um, how many times should I ask people about their Linux strategy at Compyex?

[01:13:35]>> I think you should literally walk around with a camera and a stick microphone be like, "Hey, what's what's your Linux?"

[01:13:39]Oh, you're talking about vendors. Like seriously, >> like Yeah. Yeah. like actually at the show >> I would ask everybody that makes sense for Yeah. Like I would ask I'm curious if if the motherboard vendors have uh strategies for supporting their hardware and Linux.

[01:13:54]>> Oh actually maybe yeah maybe I should record like a super cut of people talking about Linux >> like is MSI engaging with the open source with like HWON and stuff like that to get low-level support out of the box for their motherboard sensors? Same thing for Asus and Gigabyte and those companies. I would love to know um if people are thinking about doing more documentation and stuff like that if the rising the rising tide of Linux desktop use as evidenced by the latest Steam survey is is making them kind of sit up and pay attention.

[01:14:27]>> I hope so. I hope so.

[01:14:29]>> Uh and yeah to see all that cool compy text coverage.

[01:14:32]>> But also you should walk around the night market and be like, "Hey yo, does anyone here use Linux?" They'll be like, >> "And then when you're in jail, you can call us and we'll be like, I can't get you out of jail in Taiwan. I don't know how to do that. I'm sorry."

[01:14:42]>> Yeah. Uh anyway, PC World YouTube channel, you're going to see all the the Compyex coverage and maybe a Linux video.

[01:14:50]>> Yeah, I hope so.

[01:14:51]>> We'll see. Uh and hopefully the episode that we're we're going to do on the road for Dub Diaries will be interesting. I can light up an interesting guest. Yeah.

[01:14:59]>> Yeah, we'll see. Cross your fingers.

[01:15:02]Anyway, thanks everybody. Thanks, Will.

[01:15:04]>> Hey, thanks Adam. This was fun. I I mean I I'm just jealous of your headphones this whole time.

[01:15:08]>> They're pretty good. Look how orange they are.

[01:15:09]>> That is pretty good. Yeah, >> these are uh Moonrop Moonrop.

[01:15:14]>> Moonrop old fashions, I think.

[01:15:16]>> Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Love it.

[01:15:18]>> I got them to go with my Zoom Linux's number one HD audio player.

[01:15:22]>> Yeah. Oh, >> it has a radio.

[01:15:24]>> Did you put dual diaries on here?

[01:15:25]>> No, of course not. I don't put podcast on.

[01:15:27]>> We need to get out of here. We Yeah, >> I don't have a podcast.

[01:15:29]>> I got to talk to you.

[01:15:30]>> The podcast client doesn't work anymore.

[01:15:32]>> Really?

[01:15:32]>> No, that's because they're Microsoft service.

[01:15:34]>> Okay. Well, we talked about it last week on the episode. You don't remember? Were you not paying attention?

[01:15:37]>> Episode 38.

[01:15:38]>> Good God, man. I told you all about how awesome the Zoom software XU is for Linux and Windows, I guess, too.

[01:15:45]>> Okay. All right.

[01:15:46]>> I guess we're weren't listening. Thanks.

[01:15:48]Always.

[01:15:48]>> I'll have to go back and listen. Uh, always be listening and we'll see you later.