Is It Worth Having Kids in Singapore? Money, Sacrifice & Education ft @LazyCabbie

追加: 2026-05-24

[00:00:00]Why do we have children? Otherwise, we'll be in Paris in Bali already. Why would we torture ourel? Because it's torture us to have kids. The kind of stress.

[00:00:07]>> Yeah. And we chose that. The worst thing is we choose to have kids.

[00:00:10]>> Two children can be smart. Maybe child A is 30% naturally smarter and hardworking than child B. But if child B has tuition in all subjects, access to the best hacks when it comes to taking exam, it's more likely that child B can get into a good school.

[00:00:23]>> So, do I regret? No.

[00:00:31]Hello everyone. Today there is a hot topic that is being discussed by a lot of people in Singapore that I would like to cover as well and that's the topic of marriage, parenthood, total fertility rate. But unfortunately I don't have experience in this field because I'm not a parent yet. So that's why today I've invited Eddie from Lazy Cabbie. He is a father of two uh and he has two jobs.

[00:00:54]one is a grab driver and also a content creator as well. And I thought it'd be great to hear his experience about parenthood. So, thank you so much Eddie for coming down to share your journey.

[00:01:04]So, what I'd like to caveat first is I might ask you some questions that seems a bit basic to you because after all, I'm not a parent. So, if you feel that these questions are a bit dull and all that. So, thank you for your patience and understanding in advance.

[00:01:17]>> Don't worry, I'm a first- time parent also. So, we all learn along the way.

[00:01:21]>> Yeah, >> that's great. I guess maybe perhaps what would be useful as a starting point for us today is if you can share your background because most people already know you as a YouTuber Grab driver but perhaps maybe from the parents side they might not be familiar with your background in that sense. So if it would be good if you can share a bit more about how old you are when you got married and then how many children you have and a bit more about your family setup that would be a good introduction.

[00:01:48]>> Okay, I can do that but don't ask me when I got married I can't remember.

[00:01:52]Don't show it to my wife.

[00:01:56]Very poor. It is. But but um we've been married for for a long time. I would say a long time.

[00:02:03]Two kids. One now is secondary school and one is in primary school.

[00:02:07]>> Yeah. So P5 and SE one.

[00:02:10]>> Yeah. P5 and SE one.

[00:02:11]>> So uh family unit of four.

[00:02:13]>> Yes.

[00:02:14]>> So Yep.

[00:02:15]>> So in your house the current setup is like uh you're staying with your wife?

[00:02:20]>> No. I'm staying with my mother-in-law.

[00:02:22]Oh yeah. So there's like uh quite quite quite a number of us in the house.

[00:02:26]>> All right. Five five people I guess and then staying in a how many room?

[00:02:31]>> Uh it's a four room flat but you know the old olden um flats they are bigger.

[00:02:36]>> Oh >> yeah. So their kitchen is like almost like your whole living room down the PTO is very big.

[00:02:41]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:02:42]>> Yeah. So we lucky like the room itself is like can put two king-size bed.

[00:02:47]>> Oh that's huge.

[00:02:48]>> Huge. It's huge. Last last time the flats are like that one. Nowadays, uh is is much more smaller, different.

[00:02:54]>> I guess the ones behind here probably not as >> I don't know. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, I don't know.

[00:02:59]>> Maybe can you just give me a background about like how you met your wife and then how you all went about deciding on this topic of having children?

[00:03:08]>> How I met my wife? Uh we we we know each other from our JC days.

[00:03:13]>> Oh >> yeah. So uh that time we we went steady and then we broke off.

[00:03:19]>> Okay. because that time young so play around I was jamming a lot >> so friends more important >> yeah so not the priority then that we we went our own way >> I think for many many years we didn't contact each other >> okay >> yeah but somehow I think >> maybe 10 years down the road we managed to find each other I don't know how so okay >> out of nowhere >> so that time I I think I was in UK already I was going to UK or something >> so yeah then We sort of like went into a longdistance relationship.

[00:03:52]>> Oh >> yeah.

[00:03:53]>> And after that I came back Singapore. I wanted to do the bar thing, you know, because I have a law degree.

[00:04:00]>> But uh I ultimately went to Hong Kong to try to get the uh bar license.

[00:04:06]>> But then Destiny call >> family planning. Then we decided to either she give up her career, can't join me in Hong Kong, >> right? Or I come back to Singapore and give up my dreams.

[00:04:19]being a full-fledged lawyer. So I I I chose the letter that I came back to Singapore.

[00:04:24]>> Oh, okay. Okay.

[00:04:26]>> When you were deciding to get married, do you guys have this conversation of should I have children or not? And then how how many?

[00:04:34]>> There is no um formal or um explicit discussion on this topic.

[00:04:42]>> Okay.

[00:04:42]>> But somehow there's a mutual understanding that we will have kids.

[00:04:46]>> Okay. There's no like agreement beforehand. Will you have kids? It's not we don't know.

[00:04:51]>> But I think that's a kind of understanding. Is it because our background the era you know that the era we grow out is like natural for us to have then have you know career family kids that kind of natural progression.

[00:05:04]It's really inbuilt in so it's sort of like given thing.

[00:05:09]>> Okay. So you all didn't decide how many children you want?

[00:05:13]>> I I did myself personally. Yeah, I wanted as many as possible. I cannot.

[00:05:18]This is Singapore. Yeah, because I love children.

[00:05:21]>> Oh, >> yeah. But Singapore how to. So, actually the time when we had the first one, we say enough already because it's very expensive.

[00:05:29]>> So, I say okay, maybe one is enough.

[00:05:32]>> Yeah. We didn't plan on two.

[00:05:35]>> Okay.

[00:05:35]>> Yeah.

[00:05:36]>> Second one um accident, I guess.

[00:05:39]>> Uh second one is Yeah, you could call that an accident.

[00:05:42]>> Okay. Okay, >> because the age gap you know already sec one and P5 >> it's not it's not that it's not that big one it's just three years >> actually it's not really truly unplanned >> okay >> because there was an incident I remember until now >> uh there was a time when my son was still alone yeah no sibling I saw him playing with himself in front of mirror >> talking to himself and entertaining himself and then my wife and I was saying like wer poor thing you know like >> when we were not around working he's all alone with the armor >> you you know, so it would be so nice that we thought that to give him a companionship.

[00:06:17]>> Okay.

[00:06:18]>> Yeah. That's when we start to think maybe we could try a second one.

[00:06:22]>> Oh, >> yeah. We tried.

[00:06:24]>> Couldn't get it for one year plus.

[00:06:26]>> Okay.

[00:06:27]>> We gave up and then you came.

[00:06:29]>> Nice. Congratulations.

[00:06:32]>> You cannot force one. I know that.

[00:06:33]>> Okay. Okay. That's good. So, it's kind of like you didn't start with I want two children. It's more of like you have first one first and then you think about it.

[00:06:41]>> Yeah. along the way then it's somehow like yeah >> m okay okay okay but do you know that for my generation at least because maybe perhaps due to the internet we have a lot of sources we can read up about these type of topics and we have friends who are more open and they are always sharing their journey so what many of us realize is parenting is actually a huge sacrifice in many aspects finances time stresses involved the lifestyle changes as Well, >> so before you became a parent, do you actually think through all these sacrifices or do you were you aware about it?

[00:07:18]>> If you talk about me myself, I didn't really think it through.

[00:07:22]>> Okay.

[00:07:22]>> Yeah. For me is love is blind. I I I just like want to start family with my wife. That's it.

[00:07:27]>> Oh, >> everything else is like whatever come come up and just deal with it.

[00:07:33]>> Oh, >> my wife has more that kind of consideration that you just mentioned.

[00:07:37]Okay. like wow what will happen my career how and all this >> so for her she had to think a lot more >> okay >> um I don't know is it a guy or girl thing or is it personally I just like I just want to start a family and we we see how things go from there >> I guess maybe from a woman's perspective although I'm not a mom so feel free for those who are moms to add in your comments also I guess that there's a bigger impact on us first from the health perspective because there can be I mean it can be quite taxing on the And then secondly from a career perspective as well. So >> because you all need to take long maternity leave.

[00:08:12]>> Yeah. Correct.

[00:08:13]>> Destructive depending on your work environment also.

[00:08:15]>> Yes. And to add on I think that there's also a fear of discrimination from from employers.

[00:08:21]>> Does it still happen? I don't know. Last time Yeah. You you could easily be let go. I heard of it before.

[00:08:28]>> Okay. In my experience because I just came back from a career break when I was interviewing then there was this HR that asked me oh I see in your resume cuz under the career break section I wrote take care of spend time family he said that spend time family so do you have young children this job might need to travel one you know oh okay okay yeah so I just answer him the truth which is I don't have uh kids at this point in time and then especially those who left the workforce to be a full-time parent for a while I want to come back it might not be as easy.

[00:08:59]>> Yeah. I mean mentally it's going to be very tough for you for for the housewife to transit.

[00:09:05]>> Yeah.

[00:09:05]>> I mean is I feel being a housewife is more difficult than 9 to5.

[00:09:10]>> Oh, how come >> you facing a toddler 24/7 >> is really is really hard because I tried before.

[00:09:19]>> Oh >> yeah. Because that time my wife was like um having those um postpartum what what you call that after after giving birth you have that kind of stress and all this >> okay >> postpartum stress I don't know what forget what you call it so she he cannot function properly >> in terms of work in terms of her feelings so I need to come in and take over her duty >> you know as taking care full time for the kids >> who the kind of focus you need uh you know every 2 three hours you need to feed the baby uh then because you feed already right 2 hours later you need to feed again.

[00:09:57]>> Okay.

[00:09:57]>> Because the cycle restart >> so it's never ending.

[00:10:01]>> Okay.

[00:10:01]>> Then she will keep crying change diaper is wow.

[00:10:04]>> So imagine doing this 247 easy or not for new mother is very difficult to transit.

[00:10:10]>> Yeah. So I think to transit from 9 to 5 to housewife I mean as a new mother very difficult but to come out is uh like a wow I'm free. I come out and work already. Somebody will be taking care of my kids. It's like freedom.

[00:10:30]>> Depends also because I do hear of some moms when they go to work then they feel like oh no I leave my kid behind and there's this like >> very subjective.

[00:10:37]>> Yeah.

[00:10:37]>> You see how because yeah some is is the kind of not say frustration but you know um very sink know to look after children. It's not easy.

[00:10:48]>> So I understand your setup now. You are a dual income family. you and your wife are both working. You're taking care of your mother-in-law and two children, but if you can just give a bit more details about the setup from the beginning, that would be great because I understand probably it wasn't always this way. Was there any time whereby either of you stopped work? Did she try to be a full-time parent for maybe one year or so? Can you just walk us through that?

[00:11:11]>> She she tried too.

[00:11:12]>> Okay. because of the um time commitment to to but it's very difficult because the income is not one one person income is simply not enough to cover both of us.

[00:11:23]>> Yeah. And and the sudden increase of cost.

[00:11:25]>> Okay.

[00:11:26]>> Yeah. We don't have a lot of savings also to dig into during that time also my company has problem.

[00:11:32]>> So we need all the help we need in terms of finance. So stopping work means cutting off that income stream. So, >> so she need to sort of I mar much on to keep on working while taking care of the kids.

[00:11:44]>> So, that's why I come into the picture while doing my own business. I'll come back work from home and settle everything, >> fetch them, uh, you know, from preschool feeding them and all this.

[00:11:55]>> Yeah. So, uh, luckily my mother-in-law was a big help.

[00:11:59]>> Without her, I cannot.

[00:12:00]>> Yeah. Because my mother was helping to look after my sister's >> Oh. uh children.

[00:12:07]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:12:08]>> Yeah. So, she's already occupied.

[00:12:09]>> So, luckily my mother-in-law father-in-law is willing to help.

[00:12:13]>> Yeah. That that really Yeah.

[00:12:15]>> Yeah. That's a huge blessing. On this note though, because you talked about additional help and I think that for me, I was very lucky. So, when I was young, my grandparents raised me. So, I stay with them from Monday to Friday and then on weekends I moved back with my parents. But these days, it feels like among my friends, everybody has a domestic helper of sorts. Has that been a path you considered before? And also do you think it's possible to have a family without a helper?

[00:12:40]>> Can be done definitely without a helper.

[00:12:42]But helper is a big help.

[00:12:44]>> Yeah. Because some mundane things some very um kind of like >> um mechanical things you can leave it to her. For example, uh you need the the the milk bottle to be sterilized. Yes, it's very standard one. You just boil the water and throw the thing just need to be sterilized. But it's very manual, >> right? for example uh helping to uh wash the diapers and all this because using those napkin not no diapers.

[00:13:07]>> So these kind of things is a big help.

[00:13:09]>> Yeah. So that time we had a helper to help us.

[00:13:12]>> Yeah. To do all these manual kind of things.

[00:13:14]>> Yeah. Without which will be even tougher for me. Okay.

[00:13:17]>> Yeah. Because my mother-in-law is already cannot do all this manual manual thing. He can help to supervise only.

[00:13:24]>> Yeah. But of course then there's additional cost because it's it's not cheap to get a helper.

[00:13:30]>> Yeah.

[00:13:31]But having a helper is also not straightforward. I mean, I'm not sure if you had a very good helper or what, but I do recognize that for some people it's like you're doing two jobs because if you go to work and then you manage people at work or at least manage your boss and customers and then when you come home then you have another person to manage and it's not all the time whereby you get someone that is aligned with your working style. Maybe they like to use their phone a lot. maybe they might have other issues and I do hear of stories like maybe they they create problems and stuff like that. So what what do you think about that?

[00:14:03]>> You actually you're right to say that is like managing another >> HR thing you know because it's a relationship. Uh so helper is more sensitive because she actually live in your >> house. So you need to be very careful with how you do with her.

[00:14:21]>> Yeah. So for us like we have good helpers as in very very responsible, very respectful. She know what to do. We also have helpers that is like like just now you say just on the phone on the job >> and you can't stop her.

[00:14:33]>> Yeah. So it's really depend on luck and how you deal with them. Yeah. So for helper wise I really cannot advise much because I I'm very hands off.

[00:14:42]>> Okay.

[00:14:42]>> Yeah. I'm not the one that deal with them because you you you need um some somebody else to at times my wife handle them. So I assume among you and between you and your wife, she's more detail oriented than you.

[00:14:53]>> Uh definitely for me is anything goes. As long as you done the job, I I don't care.

[00:15:00]>> How do you see your role as the man in the family? Like how do your maybe split responsibilities when it comes to income, household, uh caring for kids?

[00:15:11]Because in the traditionalist context men is right and then head of the household primarily focus on provision but these days it feels like there are more fathers who are becoming more hands-on spending time with children a bit more stepping up in terms of housework as well. So the roles are evolving and all that. So just curious about your own perception and how you see your role. M >> actually this one quite a big question uh because um yeah you want to shoulder everything as a man if you can have the income to shoulder everything why not >> if I have the money I'll get two helpers >> if I the money I I I just buy the best uh things to help out like instead of the hammock >> they need to manual uh you can invest those uh you know those baby that sleep hammock >> the spring thing manually I think you got this if you got money buy those um automatic one you you will bounce by yourself all these >> yeah I mean that is provided you have the the resources yeah but when when you talk about child bring out a child it's very expensive >> yeah if you fall on one person be it financially being in terms of effort or emotionally if all fall one person cannot >> really cannot >> yeah so you that kind of um things that you to bear is too much for for one person to do it really. You need to split it.

[00:16:39]>> Okay.

[00:16:40]>> So um for example sometimes I do whole night night duty >> I cannot really next next day I say so my why will take over not because oh it's agreement that you do this or do that it's because out of necessity >> simply cannot do it >> if you don't do it I don't do it the who will suffer >> the kids will suffer right >> yes so it becomes like um >> I would say out of common sense >> then you become speak everything wrong.

[00:17:05]Oh >> yeah like do you have the capacity to do one more night have okay then you do first until you okay then I take over to the next few she because maybe I project I cannot do now >> you know first so it's kind of like a mutual understanding kind of thing >> yeah finance wise uh not nothing much to say because I pass all my money to my wife then she will handle the rest >> okay >> yeah so finance wise I I I believe because the cost is really a big jammer >> one can of um milk powder that time 10 years ago was about $70 $80.

[00:17:39]>> And that one can last how long?

[00:17:41]>> Maybe 3 weeks I think two I can't remember around there. Very fast gone already. So you need to keep buying keep buying and keep buying.

[00:17:47]>> The diapers also.

[00:17:49]>> How much were the diapers?

[00:17:51]>> I 20 $30 I can't remember.

[00:17:53]>> Okay. It used up within a week.

[00:17:54]>> Yeah. Very fast. It's very fast. Uh and and also not not to say the the other things like you keep visiting the PD.

[00:18:02]>> Yeah. I mean the the doctors. Mhm.

[00:18:04]>> Yeah. Supplements and all this. Then you need to bring him or her to even so small we bring her out >> to expose our child to nature to go zoo this and that.

[00:18:16]>> Okay.

[00:18:18]>> So the cost suddenly jump out so high you pay.

[00:18:21]>> Yeah.

[00:18:23]>> Okay. Yeah definitely I think finances is one of the issues also but >> what I can say is you can't >> how to say in English >> you cannot estimate the cost.

[00:18:32]>> Yeah. You can say put a rough thing. I need to put aside 30,000.

[00:18:36]>> It doesn't work that way.

[00:18:38]>> Suddenly your kid maybe slow in pointing fingers.

[00:18:42]>> What is he going to do? Because right this is a milestone.

[00:18:46]>> The GPS say why is he not putting finger? That means you will affect his speech next time.

[00:18:50]>> Oh >> then you need to go speech therapy additional $1,000 per month and then you need to go special things. Okay >> along the way you will add up. So these are things you cannot plan for and then the cost will kind of like snowball.

[00:19:04]>> Sounds unpredictable.

[00:19:06]>> Yeah. Very. It's very uncertain and yet you there's nothing much you can do but to give only.

[00:19:10]>> Okay.

[00:19:10]>> Can you say I don't want >> you need you still need to bring him to see therapist and all this.

[00:19:15]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:19:16]>> Yeah.

[00:19:16]>> Wow.

[00:19:17]>> And these are things we first time parent we don't know.

[00:19:19]>> I say why what has got what has not pointing finger got to do with a m.

[00:19:26]>> Oh no I also learned this for the first time.

[00:19:28]>> Checklist. Checklist. Yeah. Are they responding to sound? Are they looking?

[00:19:33]>> Yeah. Are they responding to certain cues? All these amounts we need to keep track. If not, then we have to go for further test or something.

[00:19:40]>> What were some of the unpredictable things that you faced being a parent?

[00:19:46]>> Uh unpredictable.

[00:19:48]>> Yeah. So, for example, this topic about the pointing fingers, that was one example. I don't know if yours or was a friend. Oh, it's yours. Okay.

[00:19:54]>> Yeah. So turns out that uh she's she's um kind of kind of like I can't remember the actual cause but some babies are like that they are slower.

[00:20:04]>> Yeah. So we need to bring him out >> to see and encourage to point.

[00:20:08]>> Uh then from there he pick up very fast already.

[00:20:10]>> Oh >> yeah. Because as parents sometime we don't know.

[00:20:13]>> Yeah. And sometime we just pass the phone to them thinking that okay we keep them busy.

[00:20:17]>> Yeah. Which is not good. Then we found out oh that's not the right way to we kind of like styify his development and all this.

[00:20:23]>> M. Yeah. So, >> wow. A lot of trial and error and and learning >> a lot. That's why the first kid, the elder one is guinea pig.

[00:20:33]>> Because first time parent, >> second parent, you know, already.

[00:20:36]>> I mean, I mean, second, the second ones, you know, already.

[00:20:39]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:20:40]>> Yeah. I mean, if I were to kind of summarize what you share, it's like it feels that it's it really requires a team effort. So, it's not like one person do everything in terms of finances or housework. You have to split it up properly between yourselves. So I really kudos those that do it alone one.

[00:20:56]>> Oh >> single mothers who are really heads off.

[00:20:59]>> Great.

[00:21:00]>> Yeah. Cannot really very very difficult.

[00:21:03]>> How do you and your wife split the housework and chores at home?

[00:21:08]>> Uh split >> like like what?

[00:21:11]>> Uh for example, she will sweep then I'll mop.

[00:21:14]>> Oh >> yeah. Because I I I saw him doing also like Korean.

[00:21:19]>> Yeah. So we just like mutual understanding.

[00:21:22]>> Okay. Okay. Then I'll cook, she'll wash, then the next day she'll cook, I'll wash kind of thick turns off.

[00:21:27]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:21:27]>> Yeah. Sometime bit lazy say I don't feel doing she do.

[00:21:31]>> Okay.

[00:21:31]>> Give and take kind of thing.

[00:21:33]>> That's nice. Like I think there's a very good teamwork and effort going on there.

[00:21:36]>> Yeah. You need a kind of chemistry.

[00:21:38]>> Yeah. It's not you thought it's nothing, right? It can balloon into something big.

[00:21:43]>> Why you never do anything?

[00:21:47]>> It happens. Okay.

[00:21:48]>> And again snowball kind of big thing.

[00:21:50]>> Yeah.

[00:21:51]>> Yeah. It's good you brought up this topic about things snowballing, you know, resentment and all that. And what I and what I fear also um because what I read online, what I heard from people is that sometimes with the introduction of children, the marriage quality actually declines if not handled correctly. So for example, what I read online is sometimes the couples they end up having strained relationships or maybe facing what we call date bedrooms. So that means to say there's no more intimacy in the marriage anymore. And as I think about that, I feel that it's both scary and also incredibly sad. So for yourself, how did you navigate this transition into parenthood with your wife to prevent this type of problems from happening?

[00:22:36]>> Actually never thought of this question.

[00:22:37]I don't even know this is a >> Oh, okay. That means you're very lucky.

[00:22:41]>> It's no maybe first time parents because we like just we sleep together with the kids.

[00:22:45]>> Okay.

[00:22:46]>> Yeah. So the kids will sleep with us either in the court.

[00:22:51]>> Yeah. Or when she's older then sleep in between us.

[00:22:53]>> Okay.

[00:22:54]>> So we can actually look after them when we are sleeping.

[00:22:57]>> Yeah. But we still like talk in there >> and all this.

[00:23:00]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:23:00]>> Yeah. So so it's it's like >> um when you say about as being arranged by by that baby thing >> maybe the relationship quality become less good because maybe they quarrel more. They cannot handle the the stresses as you described earlier. It's very stressful, right? To have a stressful job, stressful roles as a new parent and then still maintain the couple relationship because the main advice I get from many successful couples is that you should prioritize your marriage above like the kids in a sense that it should be the main thing because when you have a happy marriage then you have a happy family and happy children. So that's the advice I've gotten. So I'm just curious to hear how you execute that and navigate >> that point is a good point but that one is more like a consequences.

[00:23:44]>> Okay. not the the means to do it.

[00:23:47]>> Okay?

[00:23:47]>> Because that one is like, oh, if you do that then you have a happy kids, right?

[00:23:51]So it's like a reverse thing for me. For me is everything is the kids first.

[00:23:55]>> Okay?

[00:23:57]>> So the family nucleus will circle around the kids.

[00:23:59]>> Okay?

[00:24:00]>> Uh whatever the kids observe and see, he will model you.

[00:24:05]>> So that means if you never do a housework when he grow up, he never do a housework.

[00:24:09]>> Oh, >> my daddy never do what?

[00:24:11]>> Oh yeah.

[00:24:12]>> So whatever you do, he'll model you.

[00:24:13]Okay.

[00:24:14]>> So what I want my kids to become is what I do now.

[00:24:17]>> So if I never celebrate birthday with my mother-in-law, he won't learn why is respecting elderly.

[00:24:23]>> M >> so whatever we do our our our actions our decision will center around what will the kids model from us.

[00:24:34]>> Okay.

[00:24:34]>> Yeah. Then from there we work it out. So sometimes, yeah, I understand when we are newly married, honeymoon period because it's very easy to compromise just two heads.

[00:24:43]>> Yeah.

[00:24:44]>> Right. Very cool head. But when you got a newborn coming in, then the tension is is there's a power struggle.

[00:24:51]>> Okay.

[00:24:52]>> Tension between the man and the woman, right? Uh uh what should you do? Should this? No, I think this is correct. No, that's correct. Those who is going to compromise in this. So you lead to argument. When you argue, >> who is the one looking at you? the the young child eyes they don't understand they only hear noises and tension >> so they grow in an unsafe environment >> so yes we went through that that time also is a difficult period my company fell so there was a lot of argument in all this then I can feel my I can sense that my kids are going through a difficult time trying to process what is going on why my daddy suddenly become so upset about every little simple simple thing so we change from there Oh >> yeah. So then other that it become like what you say at the end the consequence become happy family happy child.

[00:25:42]>> That's why I say is to me that one is more like an afterthought rather than the >> all right.

[00:25:46]>> Yeah.

[00:25:46]>> Okay.

[00:25:46]>> I'm not saying my way is correct but this is how it turns out it work for us.

[00:25:51]>> Yeah. But it's also kind of like you got yourself together first then after that you that also positively influence your relationship >> because it's is your mirror >> like um why my son keep looking at his phone one wherever you go.

[00:26:06]>> Oh >> because he model you are the one who always do that.

[00:26:09]>> Oh >> but my daughter why always read books one.

[00:26:13]>> Okay.

[00:26:14]>> Model from who?

[00:26:16]>> Model from um actually that time we also try to read books.

[00:26:19]>> Okay. Because we know already first key is guinea pig.

[00:26:22]>> Yeah.

[00:26:23]>> Then we know already first time parents.

[00:26:26]Oh, good excuse.

[00:26:28]>> Yeah. I think children they they learn from example. It's not like you can tell them something. They just watch what you do and then they follow.

[00:26:33]>> They observe. Yeah. They observe. They are very good observer actually.

[00:26:37]>> Yeah. And what you want them to be is what you are doing at home. It starts at home I believe.

[00:26:43]>> Yeah. Speaking of this, I did attend a talk by this author called Nera. He talks about um distractions, habits and all that. And then someone in the audience asked about like how do I prevent my child from being addicted to technology and then they his reply was that oh then you have to model your behaviors yourself because if the child would see you use the phone then that's when they would do start habits like do scrolling also but talking about technology because I feel that being a parent now is different from last time because now there's technology and it brings about things like distractions and also maybe topics like cyber bullying and all that. So as a parent, how do you navigate all this not only new journey of parenthood but also new new style and new challenges that your previous generation didn't go through?

[00:27:27]Um if you talk about technology is something that we cannot run away. In fact schools now are already giving them this uh l what you call that a yeah tablet.

[00:27:38]>> Everyone have to learn how to use it.

[00:27:39]They have to set up Gmail account. They need to have Tik Tok even to learn about live teaching.

[00:27:44]>> Okay.

[00:27:45]>> Yeah. And all this. So technology cannot run away. But this one long time ago uh we have a big discussion among um my wife and I. So our conclusion was that we had to attack the root discipline >> meaning the regulation must be self-regulated the kind of discipline that he has not from hey >> what are you playing for >> and all this so it must be self-regulated how do we do is we started with rostering >> okay >> we we teach him from very young age how to do his own time table >> oh >> so we wake up after breakfast and all this you take out the paper he will plan his Okay.

[00:28:24]>> Well, I want to then he will also learn to negotiate with me like mommy why do I work?

[00:28:29]>> Why not? Then he know how to negotiate.

[00:28:32]>> M say but I want to play. Okay. Fine.

[00:28:35]Let's compromise. Then we learn about compromising. So from very very young age I would say preschool time he already start playing planning those uh baby time table.

[00:28:44]>> Up to now he do a full time labor from morning to night. So he will feel productive.

[00:28:48]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:28:49]>> And he plan his own time is responsible for his own work.

[00:28:52]>> Okay. Okay. So very angry where okay >> I mean the the advice you give about empowering the kid to plan his own time table and all that's very good and I think that that reduces the effort and load on the parents part and as I think about topics like we talk about technology ownership about time even the way you work with him like it seems to be more negotiation based versus like >> authoritative >> authoritative then that made me reflect also on how parenting has evolved because these days when I research about this topic there's things like gender parenting and all that. So I wanted to hear from you in your own experience. Do you feel that being a parent like now is different from say your parents era or like maybe even 20 years before you?

[00:29:35]>> Very hard to compare >> because my my parents is very kong style one. Okay.

[00:29:39]>> Really use the sleeper and white one.

[00:29:41]>> So it's very very different type of background. So >> okay.

[00:29:44]>> So compared to now like you said we are all very well informed.

[00:29:47]>> So very hard to compare. Yeah. And for them being illiterate they don't study much. Uh for for us is more on building character than academic >> building resilience um building um kind of like >> beside resilience is um I don't know character building kind of things. So now is that's why nowadays I try to inculcate this kind of value in my kids but on top of that still need to incorporate other things >> like you say technology socializ uh socialization skills cyber bullying uh bullying and all this >> so it's is a lot more layers than last time I think last time is very quite straightforward >> okay >> now it's a lot of things there >> yeah because friends are not only in the physical space >> online space alo how you do with Yeah.

[00:30:35]>> And all this >> seems to be more like my mom always ask me right you eat already know she's just concerned about food and whether I'm of healthy weight you know whether I bathe uh and do my homework but nowadays there seems to be more thought that is put into being a parent. Yeah, definitely.

[00:30:53]Um and and no only thoughts on I mean translate into what what just now you say gentle parenting helicopter parents I'm not saying is not good actually my my family unit right we have this system like uh good and bad >> okay >> so we mix it up >> we confuse the kids in a sense that in a healthy way >> so we still have authoritative figure like me >> and the more authoritative kind you do this you do this you don't you get punishment >> and so there are consequences my wife the gentle parenting oh you eat already this right so why because in the future when you come to work you meet all type of people >> okay >> when you got authoritative supervisor then how I cannot work it's not >> my dad like that so I know how to deal with this kind of situation >> yeah but with logic right but then he comes home he knows that it's a safe space >> he still got a love from both parents >> okay okay >> yeah so I want him to expose to this kind of like >> not so straightforward kind of world Yeah.

[00:31:53]>> Yeah. But you there's a lot of nuances in in in in relationship and I I feel all these start from home.

[00:32:00]>> Okay.

[00:32:00]>> Yeah. All this start from home.

[00:32:03]>> If it feels like you put a lot of emphasis on character building, social skills, you know, technology like what you described very important.

[00:32:10]>> Everybody got degree now. What set you apart?

[00:32:14]>> Correct. If you don't know how to negotiate, you going to eat.

[00:32:16]>> Yeah.

[00:32:17]>> Right. If you don't know how to talk to people and and open you cannot open doors, you'll be stuck there even though you are a star student.

[00:32:24]>> Yeah. Your your mentality is very similar to my dad. I think this entrepreneur parents thing. They put a lot of emphasis on >> soft skill.

[00:32:30]>> Yes. Hell a lot of emphasis on soft skill. My father's entrepreneur. So he puts a lot of emphasis on soft skills on socializing. In fact when I'm young he would say like how come you don't socialize more and because I'm more introverted. So that's why he feels that that's very important all the soft skills and things like that. So that's the I think something quite something I see a lot more commonly among parents who are entrepreneurs and or came from that background.

[00:32:56]>> Interesting observation. I never thought of it like this >> because if you think about parents who are professionals like they got to where they are because they studied then they would view academics as the most important thing because that's what got them to where they are. But if someone who has gotten became successful through entrepreneurship or most of his life experience is from there that's when he would lean on those skills more because that's what helped him to be successful.

[00:33:20]>> You're right. In some way for me I feel that academic uh all these uh you can catch up on >> better in life.

[00:33:26]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:33:27]>> You can go private institution you can still catch up in terms of academic soft skill how coaching >> coaches and all this very hard but if you start from young it's easier to nurture.

[00:33:37]>> Okay. Okay. Yeah, >> your perspective is actually quite unique. So just yesterday, I mean I didn't just interview you. I did quite a bit of homework before arriving to this conversation. So I was talking to my friend and he's saying that oh nowadays um studies is very important because it takes a lot more effort to get into a good school as compared to maybe 20 years before. So for example, two children can be smart. Maybe child A is 30% naturally smarter and hardworking than child B. But if child B has tuition in all subjects access to the best hacks when it comes to taking exam is and all the financial support is more likely that child B can get into a good school.

[00:34:22]Furthermore, parents can hack the system these days. For example, you can send child B for water polo. Water polo is quite a I would say a bit more expensive type of sport, right? So by building up this kind of water polo skills then they can also have another pathway which is the DSA. So the child is coming in with like backing resources versus child A who may be smarter and more hardworking but probably don't have that kind of additional resources as well. So that's what my friend explained to me and I'm just wondering from your perspective because this seems like a reality in Singapore whereby it's not just about values in terms of hard work as well.

[00:34:56]there there is an element of someone being able to get access to more tuition, more enrichment, having a leg up in this competitive education system.

[00:35:05]So I'm wondering from your perspective like as a parent like how do you view it and there's no right or wrong answers. I just wanted to hear your own views.

[00:35:12]>> I think unfair advantage definitely exist.

[00:35:16]>> For sure those with resources um that can provide uh tuition after school kind of enrichment. Right. sure have an unfair advantage but that is only one part of the story >> because Singaporeans a lot of people have that resources but still what makes the difference >> have you ever thought of that >> the difference between uh let's say we go to a top enrichment class right where the not only the franchise is good no the individual classes with the best teacher you must choose that one >> those are the the nuances that you need to go to know so if let's say I go to the whole class 10 people why only that one can be kid is is not the other parameters are all fair same teacher and all this the difference is supervision parents parental involvement >> okay >> a lot of people have this conception that I got all the resources I all that money in tuition enrichment sure can go A1's and all this right >> I thought by P5 all blank out >> P6 die already >> is a misconception because that is not enough going to tuition is only half the story, come back, they need to revise.

[00:36:27]>> Oh, >> and children being children, they will not say, "Mommy, I don't want to play.

[00:36:31]Let me sit down and revise what I just learned."

[00:36:33]>> Will they do that?

[00:36:35]>> You need somebody not on camera to supervise them. No, >> there sitting beside them.

[00:36:41]>> You don't need to know the techniques and the method.

[00:36:44]>> You just need to be there and present.

[00:36:45]>> That makes the difference between the A1's and >> even everything else aside the same.

[00:36:50]That's the main difference.

[00:36:52]>> Okay.

[00:36:52]>> I personally can see the difference.

[00:36:53]>> Oh, okay. Yeah. Because P5 I we have the same misconception. Just go tution d everything >> cannot work. Why? It's the best teacher.

[00:37:03]>> P6 I spend a lot of time just sitting down there with him doing nothing. No, >> no phone.

[00:37:09]>> I cannot even use my phone. I I need to let him know by action that daddy is here >> in this battle with you. Don't worry.

[00:37:17]>> So you feel motivated. You don't feel pressured.

[00:37:20]>> You feel that somebody is with me to go in the battlefield with me. Okay. Okay.

[00:37:24]>> And then he revise >> because learning technique is different from getting it drill in your head.

[00:37:31]>> You need repetitive work.

[00:37:33]>> Okay.

[00:37:33]>> To get it in.

[00:37:34]>> Yeah. So that's another side of the story. So yes, we resources. I think a lot of Singapore know not a lot of problem. Maybe you'll be selecting which topic uh subject. But the other one is whether you have time >> to spend with your kids.

[00:37:47]>> Like to find don't have time. I'm a taxi driver. Okay. I mine is flexible timing.

[00:37:52]Oh, all right. It's very nice of you to accompany your son this way. I think that during my time for PSLE, I mean, it was a big thing, but it wasn't this huge like what it is now. And I can see that a lot of parents are quite stressed about it. So, how do you feel when your child was going through PSLE? I >> I'm not as stressed as my my wife actually. For me, it's like if you don't do well, it's okay. It doesn't define him as a as a as a person, you see. So, I will always remind him that it's okay, right? If you don't do well next time you you in other because you've got another O level you can try that >> but I always explain to him that if you do well now it's easier in your secondary school. So my wife is another creature all together saying you must do well he's more you know because it's the future of his own son.

[00:38:39]>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For sure.

[00:38:40]>> So he's got stressed out and he project.

[00:38:43]>> Yeah. He can feel the stress. So we kind of like need to balance it off.

[00:38:47]>> Yeah. So for us it's like also first time parent we don't know. We just go along the way.

[00:38:50]>> Okay.

[00:38:51]>> Yeah. A lot of things just mother in the water and and and listening to other parents talking the forum. What do they do?

[00:38:58]>> Their child like like totally rebellious, don't want to do anything because they give up really, you know, you got all kind of situation.

[00:39:04]>> So everybody is like fighting their own battles, you know.

[00:39:06]>> Yeah.

[00:39:06]>> And don't know what to what they're doing because first time.

[00:39:09]>> Yeah.

[00:39:11]>> So yeah. So, so, um, I guess that's why we also wanted to film this podcast so that we can hear from someone who has experienced this before, but just now you described this whole idea of you come home, you need to spend time with kids and all that and you can't use your phone and I think about that in contrast to a lifestyle of a dink dink, dual income, no kids, family. It feels like they maybe don't have to make so much sacrifices in terms of the time that they have like they after work time they have a very stressful job uh and everything and then after work their time is really their time. It is not spent with the children they can spend it on their relationship they can spend it on themselves and they don't have to deal with the pressures of someone not doing well in things here or maybe uh being caught by some school and things like that. So in a sense they only have one job instead of two jobs. So I guess this lifestyle change is something that a lot of millennials are thinking about which makes them worry about oh if I become a parent why I lose my lifestyle why I lose my freedom. So I would like to hear your thoughts on it as someone who has experienced both like the dink life and then after that became a parent.

[00:40:20]Sometime we have conversation with our uh with my wife and I like wow why do we have children otherwise we will be in Paris >> in Bali already torture ourselves because it's torturous to have kids the kind of stress >> yeah and we chose that the worst thing is we choose to have kids >> so do I regret no both of us didn't regret the decision >> yeah I mean the the the happiness we get from the smile from our kids when you come home. Yeah. The way they grumble and about their life, school life, we we feel happy somehow. So that's a trade-off. Definitely.

[00:41:02]>> Yeah. Definitely is like the the lifestyle will be so different.

[00:41:06]>> Yeah. Maybe we won't be maybe we have a lot more savings >> because the money dump into it is like a long-term thing.

[00:41:13]>> Yeah.

[00:41:14]>> Yeah. And and um the stresses uh keep going. Where is she? Is he okay? Is he injured? Where where is he now?

[00:41:22]>> Yeah. The kind of stresses.

[00:41:23]>> Yeah. So, but if if let's say if I sit down and think carefully, no kids, just think.

[00:41:29]>> Okay. Then what are the conversation between us?

[00:41:35]>> Which holiday to go next?

[00:41:36]>> Uh every year just repeat rinse and cycle. Which movie to watch? Where where shall we go cafe hopping? Unless you got a pet law.

[00:41:45]>> Which groomer is good? uh which breed do you want another one the conversation will be totally different >> okay >> yeah so I I'm not saying that which one is good which one is bad but I feel that my life now is is is for me is very good it's perfect >> even though there's a lot of stresses a lot of this thing yeah >> because you compare it to the happiness that you get in return >> I cannot get it for any where is the substitute for this kind of happiness or joy >> that's that's something I find it maybe hard at this point to visual realize because actually when I was interviewing different parents then I heard someone complain about oh weekend I need to send my kid to Chinese tuition or something and I recall when I was young I went for Chinese tuition and while waiting for me my father had like one two hours plus that he have to walk around shopping center and stuff like that so after a while I felt a bit insecure so I went to ask my father like was it very boring for you is it you didn't like that you have to send me to tuition on weekends and then you cannot do the things that you like to do like go out with your friends and all that and he actually said that no actually time with you I really enjoy it I really enjoy those those those memories then now don't have really and stuff like that so he it is quite similar to what you describe about this kind of joy so but for me I don't have children yet so I don't understand what is this this joy about so can you explain like to me a bit more like what is this everybody says like they never imagine they can love someone so much they they never they feel that this kind of joy you cannot get anywhere else so but I strugg struggle to visualize it yet. So, it's good if you can add more details.

[00:43:21]>> I I I really got no details to give you because I cannot describe it.

[00:43:25]>> I also don't understand it.

[00:43:27]>> Like sometimes you work so hard really you you think for bloody hell I work so hard drive 10 hours a day for what?

[00:43:34]>> Tomorrow I'll die.

[00:43:35]>> Nothing really. Even I got 1 million and bank is tomorrow I'm dead everything will be gone.

[00:43:42]>> But now I got kids already is a different mentality, right? I work so hard for what? Oh, my kids are waiting for me at home. Come back heart and let's talk about life.

[00:43:51]>> Yeah. Let's talk about what what what's your thoughts on this?

[00:43:54]>> Somebody that I don't need to put a mask.

[00:43:56]>> I can talk heart to heart >> and he can, you know, talk about his games, his friends. Very naive, very innocent.

[00:44:05]>> That kind of joy.

[00:44:06]>> Oh, >> yeah. Is very different kind of joy from going out with friends, BFF, going holiday.

[00:44:13]>> Yeah.

[00:44:14]From what you say, it's like a safe space where you can be yourself and where you have someone that you gives you purpose.

[00:44:22]>> Yeah, I think purpose. You're right.

[00:44:23]More on the purpose kind of thing.

[00:44:26]>> Okay.

[00:44:26]>> Yeah. Like, okay, now I know why I'm why I keep walking despite it's so difficult to keep walking.

[00:44:32]>> My purpose is my my kids and my family.

[00:44:36]>> Yeah. Is that a joy? I don't know.

[00:44:39]>> But definitely I don't feel like a burden. I think I'm curious did becoming a husband and after that becoming a father these two stages did it change you as a person?

[00:44:51]>> Oh definitely definitely because husband is more for me like companionship.

[00:44:58]>> Mhm.

[00:44:59]>> Uh kind of like partnership that you can rely on.

[00:45:05]>> Yeah. If everything fail, you still have your wife or your partner, >> right? H uh from husband to father then it's totally different the responsibility kind of like you don't live your life anymore on your own >> you leave your your life for somebody else >> meaning you say last time like okay I just want to drive fast >> your own life >> y me my wife works she got he's an adult she can still yeah so you just leave your own life right you just drive fast some people may like just waste their life like maybe going to license and all this because it's their own life or call it unhealthy life.

[00:45:39]>> Yeah. Or unhealthy life. Or some are risk taker >> like as as if they alone they just w they go and do those very dangerous kind like hiking those very dangerous skilling mountain and all this right because they living their own life which is great. I'm not saying it's not good it's great but once you have a kid you don't leave your own life really you leave for somebody's waiting for you at home. So you need to think twice.

[00:46:05]>> Should I do that or they will not have a father tomorrow?

[00:46:10]>> So you need to think twice.

[00:46:12]>> So that's the major transformation change in my sheet. So you when you do things your decision your your whatever you do sort of like you need to reflect >> like oh my financial decision uh will it affect my son's university fees >> Mhm.

[00:46:26]>> soal or um the food that I eat uh my regular lifestyle that I always have supper one day will I burden my kids they will have to take care of me when they are young so I better be fit and strong >> so they don't I don't burden them next time. So because I live my life the extension to my own kids.

[00:46:47]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:46:47]>> Yeah.

[00:46:48]>> Then if you compare let's say if you think about your own childhood and how your parents raised you versus how you're raising your kids now. What do you think you had decided to consciously do differently? Because I wouldn't think that any parent is perfect and probably for many of us we picked up things that are good and not good from our own parents as well from the way they did things. They all first- timers and trying, right? So, I just wanted to hear from you like was there anything that you saw in your >> parents relationship or the way they handled children that you feel that okay this is something that I will modify and do differently.

[00:47:23]>> I think the main thing is financial literacy. Okay.

[00:47:25]>> I don't have that in my younger days.

[00:47:28]>> All I have is please save up.

[00:47:31]>> Very very generic. No guide book, no 101, >> just please save.

[00:47:36]>> Okay.

[00:47:36]>> Okay. So, I don't do that to my kids. I actually tell them about investment although I know about investment. I just tell them read out Warren Buffett what is you know those simple thing that I find on JBP and introduce them to the world of Google stocks and all this >> about importance of saving up 101 and financial literacy as in like don't spend beyond your means uh what is compound interest and all this >> because those things you don't learn from school >> they teach you economics demand supply but they don't teach you about savings spending spending expenditure cost and opportunity cost and all this You have to learn it from somebody. And who is that? Somebody.

[00:48:17]>> Parents.

[00:48:18]>> Yeah. Either parents, your wife, I mean your spouse, or from I don't know some scammers. Maybe you learn from scammers.

[00:48:25]Yeah. So that is the thing I want to kind of like do it differently from my parents.

[00:48:31]>> Oh. So financial literacy. What about the emotions side of things?

[00:48:35]>> I think emotion side is okay. They they they handle it pretty well.

[00:48:39]>> Yeah. uh they restrain their emotions so that they let us feel like okay >> uh we are in a safe place.

[00:48:44]>> Yeah. So we always wanted to go home.

[00:48:46]>> Okay.

[00:48:47]>> Yeah. It's like even though we are going out with friends, we want to come home.

[00:48:50]>> Yeah. So I want to use the same thing on my kids as well.

[00:48:54]>> Okay.

[00:48:54]>> Yeah. And also the good and bad parents.

[00:48:57]>> One good one bad who is the one who always punish >> good cop bad cop.

[00:49:02]>> So we use the same thing because like then they know the world is not so straightforward. M >> you don't take things face value.

[00:49:09]>> Yeah. They know how to handle already.

[00:49:12]>> Okay.

[00:49:12]>> Next time. Yeah.

[00:49:13]>> So, ending off this discussion, I'm just curious. Let's say you can go turn back the clock again. Will you still choose this path to be a parent of two kids?

[00:49:23]>> Of course.

[00:49:24]>> Maybe more.

[00:49:25]>> More.

[00:49:27]>> I love kids.

[00:49:28]>> Okay.

[00:49:29]>> Yeah. I I love playing with young, you know, when they are still a baby so chubby. I can squeeze your face. play with them and now they grow they cannot hug they don't hug anymore.

[00:49:40]>> Yeah. But the thing is very hard the reality in Singapore unless you know you have a lot of resources.

[00:49:45]>> Yeah.

[00:49:45]>> Yeah. So I simply can't unless I retire retire in elsewhere then maybe I get more kids. Yeah. But by then the problem is what we are already.

[00:49:55]>> So the pregnancy procedure for older folks is different more expensive epidural and all this.

[00:50:01]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:50:01]>> Yeah. No epidur is young people. 35 you straight away need.

[00:50:05]>> Oh, >> the risk is higher.

[00:50:08]>> Okay.

[00:50:08]>> And you cannot last minute.

[00:50:09]>> Oh, okay.

[00:50:10]>> You need to book beforehand one last.

[00:50:12]Okay. I want so no more. So you need to make decision. So and and the cost of uh uh delivery is much higher than your younger.

[00:50:23]>> Oh, how come inflation?

[00:50:24]>> No, because a lot of tests you need to go through >> to make sure that kids will be healthy when he's born because they're older.

[00:50:30]>> Mhm. M your body is different really.

[00:50:32]>> Okay. Okay.

[00:50:33]>> So the older you get the more expensive it is.

[00:50:36]>> Okay.

[00:50:36]>> Yeah. So we don't see ourselves >> having more. Maybe cats and dogs.

[00:50:43]>> Yeah. And back to the topic if is it still worth it to have children? I think you kind of answered that in your case is something worth it for you. So what would you say to millennials genzies who are watching this who are thinking like okay I'm going to get married soon. Should I take this step of becoming a parent or do I want to be a dink or maybe stay single forever? Like how will you advise them as a wiser person who has been through more things in life about thinking through all these things?

[00:51:12]>> Wiser I don't think is a very stressful this word but true experience I feel that don't stress so much. Why stress so much?

[00:51:23]>> If you love each other just get married >> right? If you're getting bored just talking to each other about movies, about cafe hopping, then talk about kids.

[00:51:32]>> So just what do you mean? Like how to say sometime you plan a lot of things.

[00:51:37]>> Mhm.

[00:51:38]>> Doesn't mean you'll turn out to be like that.

[00:51:40]>> I got friends plan. Let's have kids for a few years.

[00:51:44]>> Oh no.

[00:51:44]>> They even try IVF and everything. It's not what you want, you get it.

[00:51:48]>> Okay.

[00:51:48]>> Uh for me a lot is >> destiny.

[00:51:51]>> So just no stress.

[00:51:54]>> Yeah. Be it dink or whatever if the lifestyle is great then why change it?

[00:51:59]>> Yeah. Unless you are getting old you're worried >> okay >> 35 next year oh the cost will go up how much what by a lot you need to think carefully >> uh then it's a different story then both of you need to sit down and ask yourself not your spouse what you want because at the end it affects you.

[00:52:19]She may have touchwood something happening then become you have to take care of your spouse >> and the kids >> not every day is rainbow things happen >> what's going to happen >> yeah so you need to ask yourself be truthful to yourself is it you really want or is it because of other factors >> yeah then you will not blame anybody because it's own choice >> that's why I feel that in the past maybe people have this mentality of like it's just what people to so they just have children but it feels that it's more responsible like what you said to to go through all these considerations. Yeah.

[00:52:58]>> Yeah definitely I mean it's something to definitely have to discuss because it's a big decision you affect the the the both bank accounts >> will be affected. So you really need to talk it through but it's not like a I mean it's like don't be so you know >> don't be too controlling about the process.

[00:53:22]>> Yeah. You may have planned everything as I said it may not turn out like that.

[00:53:25]>> Yeah.

[00:53:26]>> Yeah. Say I don't I don't then hey suddenly one pregnant what happened?

[00:53:31]>> Yeah it can happen also. How? Yeah.

[00:53:34]>> Yeah. Got it. Thanks for sharing your experience today, Eddie. And I think that this will be a very helpful conversation for people who are thinking about why some people want and don't want to become parents and also making a decision for themselves like is this the path they want to go through as well. So Eddie, how can people stay updated with your life? I know you post quite a bit about your family stuff on your various platforms as well. Do you want to share a bit more about how those who are interested in you can actually stay updated in the things you're doing?

[00:54:02]>> Yeah. Uh beside YouTube, I also regularly on uh IG >> and Facebook.

[00:54:09]>> Okay.

[00:54:09]>> So I post like stories, reals different from my YouTube stuff.

[00:54:13]>> Okay.

[00:54:13]>> So Lazy Kabie also.

[00:54:15]>> Okay.

[00:54:16]>> IG and and Facebook can find me there.

[00:54:19]>> Okay. So I will link all his YouTube and uh videos and social media in the description below. So thank you so much for your time, Eddie.

[00:54:26]>> Any closing things you want to say?

[00:54:28]>> No, just be happy.

[00:54:31]>> Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

[00:54:32]>> Bye-bye.