BEING QUEER AND BLACK IS EXHAUSTING

Añadido: 2026-05-07

[00:00:00]It is not a coincidence that vast majority of black men in pop culture are really attractive. I'm trying so hard to give white men a chance, but people like that are just making it too difficult. I don't think a black que man can be seen as a twink.

[00:00:20]Hi everyone. How are we? I hope you're well. I hope you're safe. I hope you're hydrated, well rested, and everything in between. July the 3. It's a statement.

[00:00:32]For those of you who do not know me, my name is George Hwood. And for those of you who do know me, what are you saying?

[00:00:39]It's really good to see you. I hope you feel the same way. Yeah, let's get into it. I really want to have a conversation around like standards for black queer men. There's so much ongoing discourse all the time about like what is deemed as attractive for a black queer person and what isn't, you know? And I kind of wanted to like dismantle it a little bit and kind of like break down how I feel, what I think is appropriate for me to say. There's a lot of things that I feel like I shouldn't be the person to be talking about it with or I shouldn't be the person discussing it. You know, I am I am light-kinned.

[00:01:16]you know, I I don't I can't talk for every black person. That wouldn't be fair, you know, like I am I am these lights make it worse. But I am like I'm extreme. I'm really light. I'm really light. But I also don't want to use that as a way to like discredit my blackness.

[00:01:33]But yeah, so I don't know how I'm going to break it down. I'm just going to kind of I'm just going to talk I'm just going to talk and go from there. It's really weird. So like background story. So I'm from Gstershare, right? Gstersha is very very white, very white and very straight. So like being black and queer is a bit of a mismatch, you know. I know very very few out heavy on the out queer black people in the area. I don't know whether like the culture doesn't really embed it. I feel like and it's so interesting spending so much time in London over the last few years. It's been like a different life. It's been like a different world. It's mad how somewhere not that far away in the grand scheme of things is so much more different to what it's like where I'm from, you know, and I guess like also like because of that lack of representation, there isn't really that many conversations taking place, you know, like becoming aware of like the jaw burden or becoming aware of intersectionality was accidental. I didn't intentionally go looking for it.

[00:02:38]I think the BLM movement really shifted my perspective. I think BLM really changed the way in which I think. I think it really opened up my eyes. I think it allowed me to understand more than I ever did before.

[00:02:53]And I'm so grateful for it. Like it's it's changed my life to be honest. Do you know? I think it kind of stems from the basis of there not being that there not being well there is now I kind of spoke about this before but there not being one a crazy amount of black queer representation and like not that much being around when I was younger you know like when I talk about queer representation I struggle to roll it back from being a kid because when I think about it it's very much I mean it's Kurt it's Kurt from Glee and it's Justin from Ugly Betty you and maybe like some odd random characters appearing here and there, but other than that, like it's it's really minimal. And it kind of makes you as a black person question your worth and your ability, you know? I think that's why a lot of black people struggle to come out. I think that's why a lot of black people struggle to appreciate who they are and what they are because they because they don't because they don't know how to navigate it. They don't know how to navigate it because the resources aren't there. We have we specifically have stuff in place to facilitate people who are queer and black because there really isn't much at all. You know, it shouldn't be a thing.

[00:04:07]It should just be a thing where like we can all thrive as people, queer people, black people, what not, but there's always like um there's always a fine line, you know. You know, straight black people don't always necessarily rate us and gay white people don't necessarily rate us. So, we're just kind of there like what now? What next? When you don't have that knowledge, when you don't have that level of understanding, I think that's what allows you I I think that's what allows like mistreatment to to be taken place. Yeah. Like I I think obviously like as a child like I got like really picked on for being flamboyant and for being gay and whatnot even though I wasn't out until I was 18 years old. It's weird because like I'm not someone who was like in denial. In my head, it was just very much like I am not coming out until I'm no longer in a school setting.

[00:04:57]Like I'm no long I won't do it because gossip is is horrific and cruel and I've seen it happen to people and it's not cute. You know, I wasn't I wasn't willing to let that happen to myself.

[00:05:06]And I was always I think I I think the reason why I am somewhat mentally sane for the most part is because I don't have I wasn't in denial or anything like that. I was just like, I just need to power through until education is done.

[00:05:19]Uni is a very different vibe and thankfully it was great with that regard for the most part. So, I can't complain.

[00:05:25]But it was just very much like, okay, I need to power through until I finish school and then I can do what I want.

[00:05:32]And I think I probably lasted about 3 months. So, yeah, pretty swell. But I do always wonder, would this same treatment be given to me if I was white? Would the would the idea of being gay be so heavily associated if I was a white boy? You know, I feel like white straight men are given the grace and the allowance to be a bit more flamboyant and to be a bit in touch with their feminine side without there being a repercussion. You know, black straight men are still deemed to be this like fixated version, this this outdated this outdated depiction which like has no substance, you know? Like I think it hurts a lot when it's from our own community. You know, blackness isn't just one thing. Like it's not just one perspective. It's it's wide. It's, you know, it it's across the board. And I think a lot of people unfortunately aren't open-minded enough to appreciate and acknowledge that like being a black person isn't linear. You know, being a black queer person isn't linear or being a black person in general. And I feel really sorry for people who like are expressive or dare to be different and they're ridiculed for that. Someone who I think that comes to mind is Dami Hope. I I love Dami Hope. If you haven't seen that interview with Paul Brunson, watch it. It was so sweet.

[00:06:54]You know, I wouldn't class Dami Hope as a feminine man, but he definitely like he definitely is creative and daring and doesn't stick to conventions.

[00:07:06]Like why is going against the odds deemed as gay? You know, why can't a black man be creative and be somewhat different and just be known as straight?

[00:07:16]Why do they have to be gay just because they don't match the mold that you've created for them? You know, I feel like it can be quite unsafe for straight black men, especially straight black men who want to dare to be different because outside noise is so focused on projecting insecurities that they just can't keep quiet and it's just it's just lame. I think there's also like this idea of like desiraability, you know, and I guess like white validation, you know, like as a like I've said this a lot, like my my type, my preference as a young black boy was white men, you know, um I was so I was so and this isn't the case for every black person, but I was like I was really insecure. I really didn't rate myself right. And the only way to make that insecurity probably even worse was to be with white men. You know, even the thought of being with someone who looked somewhat like me or had a culture or a background like me like genuinely like made me feel ill, you know, because I I I hated myself so much that it was just very much like, okay, let me get as far away as possible from what is anything like me. Okay, obviously I'm half what, but like the world doesn't see that. I mean, actually, that's controversial.

[00:08:30]Jo, don't say that. But like, you know, that's not that's not my core focus. It was almost like whiteness was deemed as superior.

[00:08:39]You know, whiteness was um uh referred to as the top of the hierarchy. You know, it was what it was what was desirable. And I think my um desire was apparent. You know, my uh validation was apparent. And I think when that's apparent, that's when you can be taken advantage of. like the amount of the amount of white men who have like said the worst things to me and I've just like shrugged it off, you know? I remember I dated this white boy in my early 20ies and he told I remember he told me that he he only liked men of color because all white boys look the same.

[00:09:18]I said, "Oh, you're one of them. Say nothing." You know, and it's so weird because obviously I'm in a place now where like I've had done the growth.

[00:09:26]I've done a lot of acceptance. Uh, and I do really love everyone. I think my my preference probably is men of color, but like I do appreciate a white man, but like I've tried dating white men again recently and they're just making it so difficult, bro. Like so difficult. I'm like, it doesn't need to be this difficult. So I was on Hinge, right? God forbid. I'm swiping through Hinge. I match with this guy and he seems all right. He seems okay. He says to me, he goes, "Jord, what is your ideal date?" I said, "Oh, well, I would like to go for maybe like a walk and a pub grub. I'm easy. I'm I'm easy and cheap. Do you get?" To which my Caucasian match on Hinge goes, "Oh, my ideal date would be braiding your hair.

[00:10:20]I'm trying so hard to give white men a chance, but people like that are just making it too difficult. What do you mean? What do you mean your ideal date is braiding my hair?

[00:10:34]Weirdo, bro. I don't think I've ever dabbled with like normal white men and I get quite annoyed because like I'm the being of an interracial relationship, right? Both of my parents in interracial relationships. All of my siblings apart from one are. So are my cousins. So I'm just thinking, what is it that I'm doing wrong to not find normal white men? Why can't I find someone that just isn't tapped? Why can't I find someone that just like talks with like a person? The thing is, yeah, as a black person, I don't want like I don't want like another race to be talking to me like, oh, I'm talking to like um so and so, a black boy. Just be like, I'm talking to Jord, you know? I'm with Jord. I like Jord. I rate Jordan. I want Jord, you know?

[00:11:17]And I feel like a lot of people are very much like, "Oh, it's not about race." I actually don't want to make it about race. I genuinely don't. But like when you've got my man talking about doing braids for a first date, it gets a bit techy, you know? But it's also like kind of difficult in a way. I suppose kind of difficult because like there's always the comparison, you know, like obviously I'm I wouldn't say I'm I wouldn't say I'm I'm not mask. I'm not mask. I wouldn't say I'm super fem, but I'm definitely more feminine than masculine. And that doesn't that doesn't bother me. I have no issue. It's just the way I am. It's how I'm accustomed to. And then when you like dive into that, there's like the comparisons, right? I feel like the comparisons between white and black gays are very apparent, you know? Like I do I do really think that like as a as a black queer person, you have to look a very particular way to be deemed as attractive. You know, white men have the luxury of realistically not looking that great and still being seen as sexy. As a black person, you need to have a beat face, body tea, you know, all these boxes need to be ticked. And even then, you're probably not going to be seen as attractive as your white brother down the street, you know? Like, I don't think I'm an ugly person. Like, I don't think I'm an unattractive person. Yeah.

[00:12:41]Not saying I'm like God's gift, but like the culture doesn't make me feel that way. The queer culture and the community doesn't make me feel that way. Yeah.

[00:12:48]I've had it where like I'll be like talking to to a guy or whatever and I'll see them like literally walking away to talk to my man on the right who literally is given like human version of Patrick Star and I'm thinking do you know what I mean? It's almost like whiteness is um not only superior but also like is like the end point, you know? And that that's why like when I like see black men that are with white boys, I'm like, do you know if you really rate them fair, like if you actually really rate them fair.

[00:13:23]But like when there's like a consistent pattern when there's a consistent pattern of you continuing to avoid black men, especially when you're surrounded by black men like, okay, for someone like me, yeah, I don't really I don't think you can be that pressed. Like obviously where I live is so white. When the black boys are with white boys, I'm like, you're not fair. There's actually none of us. There's actually none of us.

[00:13:45]So, I get it. But like when you're like in big man London, when you're in like big man London, and when you're in like big man Bristol, big man Manny, and you're still like Caucasian central, make it make sense.

[00:13:59]Obviously, if someone has a type, they have a type. You can't help that. And I'm not trying to like bring that down because I get in trouble when I talk about that. You know, we can't argue with what people like, but like I'm not being funny.

[00:14:18]Like, when you look like that, then that it's like, come on, something's up. And even if we look at it from like the the pop culture perspective, the pop culture space, right? It is not a coincidence that vast majority of black men in pop culture are really attractive. You know, it's not a coincidence that Frank Ocean, probably the most successful queer black artist of this century, is really attractive. Same for Leon Sex, you know.

[00:14:50]Same for Ricky Thompson. Same same for Leighton Williams. Same for Shy Gatwa.

[00:14:54]It's not a coincidence these men are attractive. These men are really attractive and and talented as well.

[00:15:00]Heavy on the talented and attractive, right? But would that still be the case if they weren't? If they weren't attractive, would they still be as successful? I I I honestly don't know. I don't know. I hope so. I think they're all great. There isn't really much leeway. There really isn't much space to be like mid, you know, as a black person, as a black queer person. If you are quote unquote mid, if you are quote unquote below exceptional, like you're still less attracted than the ugliest white man on the planet. It's just the way the cookie crumbles within the black gay community. Yeah, there's a lot of fem shaming. There's a lot of fem shaming because I think black men are supposed to be strong and masculine in a particular type of way. So when a black man doesn't fit that mold, they're ridiculed. And like I think the thing that makes this even funnier is black DL men, they love fems. Oh, like honestly there is honestly there is not a group of people that love the fems more than black DL men. I'm kidding you not. So for our community to be so pressed about fem queer black people, but secretly for most of you man, those are the those are the people that you're like belling at 3:00 a.m. in the morning. It's giving hypocrite.

[00:16:24]It's giving hypocrite, babe. I'm also like becoming quite concerned about how like DL culture and desire is quite prominent within the community. I didn't realize that like the DL term actually originated from African-Americans. I didn't know that till recently. I have a friend called Yeah, I have a friend a really popular YouTuber Daquel Dante who talks about it. And it's really interesting when you actually like deep it. And I think this like this DL culture, the DL culture within black commu within the black community is rooted within tradition, you know.

[00:16:55]tradition, religion, and hyper masculinity, you know, like I think there's so much outside noise that prevents a lot of black men from coming out. You know, our culture our culture doesn't embrace it, especially our elders. I think there's this idea of being like seen as less of a man. You know, I feel like a lot of a lot of black men feel like if they were to actually accept their sexuality, they would be they would be emasculated, you know, because I genuinely honestly ever since like being in London, I genuinely can't get over how many black men are DL. There's so many of them. Like so many. And I think because my friends for the most part who are black and queer are quite lucky, but that's my circle.

[00:17:39]When I'm not around that I'm just I'm just gobsmacked. Like it just like it really it really like I don't know it just really shocks me and I just think like what can we do as a culture? What can we do as a unit to like you know embody this message that like your querness and your blackness both have significance. I really hate this idea about how you're supposedly meant to pick between being queer and black. Well quite clearly I'm both. So like what like why would I take one away? You know, you know, backwards thinking black people will make it out that being quit is the worst thing possible. You know, whilst like my man's got like four baby mamas, can't maintain a job, like hasn't got a driver's license, and you're trying to chat to me.

[00:18:27]Reel it in.

[00:18:29]It's not cute. This DL culture like kind of it impacts beauty and desiraability, you know? Like how many black imagine how many black men could like be more creative or more like fun presenting with more color if like the culture was more accepting. Like you're telling me that every man in London wants to wear a tracksuit. You're telling me every man in London wants to like be spreaded Nike and Adidas from head to toe? I don't think that's the case, you know? But like as a young person, even like for the most part, most black straight people I'm around are pretty cool. So, I'm thinking to myself, in like 20 or 30 years, will there be like a switch up?

[00:19:07]Will there be like a transition where like black people, black qu people are able to be them true selves? But at the same time, I'm thinking that doesn't really help people now who are like older, you know, I I'm 27 years old yet. 27 years old and I've been out since I was 18 years old. I can't imagine what life would be like, you know, if not. But then I have to appreciate and acknowledge I was given the space to feel safe. My family and my friends gave me the space to be safe.

[00:19:36]That opportunity doesn't arise for every black queer person. I'm also really intrigued by the debate about like whether or not like can black men be twinks, right? I don't think a black queer man can be seen as a twink. Like the twink architect is rooted in like whiteness and boyishness, thinness, cultural aesthetics which are not associated with black men from young before we even get a chance to think twice about what we like and what we don't. Like as black people, as black children, we are we're adulified, you know, without even without even having a chance to even figure out what we like and what we don't. we very rarely get like casted and viewed as like cute and soft and boyish whereas like though that that's given to white men like you know they they they have that allowance. I think a contributing factor towards is the racialization in like queer spaces.

[00:20:24]And obviously like this isn't me saying that like a black queer person doesn't embody like being a twink, you know, as a black man you can like embrace like softness and slimness and femininity. But the idea of being a twink or like the twink label doesn't land as much as it does with a white man because of the way that society racializes beauty if that makes sense.

[00:20:50]Like I remember even once, right, I was with a guy and I'm like quite I'm quite a slim boy and I remember the guy saying to me, "Oh, you've this is so cringey.

[00:21:01]This is this is for context, not to like not to shade." The guy said to me was, "Oh, like you like you have like a body like a twink." And I'm thinking, "What do you mean like a twink? Surely you just say I'm a twink. Do you know what I mean?" And I'm thinking, and this guy, this black man loves white men. And I'm thinking, are you just saying that because you don't see me as a twink because I'm black. Do you know what I mean? I was young as well. I was in my early 20ies. So, I'm just like, what is it about me that isn't twink approved? you know, and I don't want to be like the negative Nancy saying that they that that's not they can't do so, but I just like I just don't think it lands the same. But obviously like I don't want to like I don't want to be like super pessimistic obviously like there's so much beauty and so much greatness within like being queer and black, you know, like I don't want to take that away. I just think it's really important to be conscious and aware of what we of what goes on within our community and what we need to like aspire to change whether that be DL culture, fem shaming, preconumptions which we need to shift that have been outdated, you know, so young. I'm so young and I'm so excited to see perspectives shift, things shift, you know, and hope. Yeah, I don't I feel like this was just kind of like my overview on like what I think, what I feel, but I'm open to interpretation. So yeah, guys, my name is George Hwood.

[00:22:29]This is the Winning Side Podcast, and thanks for joining me. I'll see you soon.