How El Salvador's Bitcoin Ecosystem Launched a Tech Company in 28 Countries | Edgar Borja

[00:00:00]And that's how I met the investors, you know, the people who are just walking around uh one of them here in El Salvador.

[00:00:06]Actually, both of my investors I met them here in El Salvador because of the Bitcoin ecosystem.

[00:00:12]And you know, just from from an equal uh to using the machine to then if they uh if it sparks some interest explaining how it how the business model works, how our company works, and then continue to build on the relationship. So, is it super easy?

[00:00:27]You know, nothing worth it is super easy.

[00:00:31]But, if you're willing to put the legwork and to and to really, you know, make an effort being from El Salvador in the Bitcoin ecosystem is has been extremely beneficial for us.

[00:00:47]>> [music] [music] [music] >> Edgar, it's been a while since we've had you on the podcast. It's great to have you back here.

[00:01:12]>> Thank you, Mike. I mean, it's it's really a pleasure to be here. I really really thankful for the opportunity.

[00:01:17]>> Uh it's crazy all the the growth that you guys have seen since since we last spoke to you all the cool things that you guys have going on at K1. And I love the fact that K1 is a company that was born in El Salvador out of the Bitcoin law being passed here. You know, built by Salvadorans and now you guys are exporting around the world. So, I love seeing that.

[00:01:40]>> Yes, thank you. Now, K1 machines are in 28 countries around the world.

[00:01:45]>> Wow, 28.

[00:01:47]>> 28.

[00:01:47]>> That's impressive. So, for people that aren't familiar with the product or those who you know, are only familiar with the old models, give us kind of some updates and what is K1? Like what What is your guys' mission as a company? And then you can talk about some of the new like educational things too that you guys have.

[00:02:07]>> Yeah, absolutely. I mean, our mission is just to make Bitcoin accessible to everyone.

[00:02:12]That has, you know, that works on multiple fronts.

[00:02:15]Because our machines are the easiest way to buy Bitcoin in the world. Basically, you know, we've been around the world now and it's the easiest way to buy it and we continue to make it easier. One of the new things that we're really really excited to launch this year.

[00:02:29]We're already testing it in a couple of places is that the machine allows you now to buy Bitcoin on the Lightning Network, but also on chain with the lowest fees, you know, possible.

[00:02:41]Can you imagine, for example, buying Bitcoin on chain using a coin?

[00:02:46]And it and it works.

[00:02:47]That The hardest part was getting it to work.

[00:02:50]>> [laughter] >> But then, you know, we're also launching self-custody for the machine.

[00:02:55]>> Just just to be clear. So, are they actually buying it on chain or are they buying it on Lightning?

[00:02:59]>> No, no. You can buy it on chain.

[00:03:01]>> You can buy it on chain?

[00:03:02]>> Yes, we The machine Technically, the machine has a limit of 1,000 sats.

[00:03:06]>> Uh-huh.

[00:03:06]>> So, for example, the the owner of the machine now has full custody of the Bitcoin before the the machine needed to be connected to a third-party custody provider like you know, Strike, Blink, OpenNode, different different vendors that have this feature. Now, the machine itself has a wallet. So, if I go into the machine's liquidity, I see that there's two QR codes. So, the owner of the machine simply tops up the machine itself. The machine has its own wallet.

[00:03:37]>> Okay.

[00:03:38]>> And then you can just make it available for everyone.

[00:03:42]Now, let's see we can set it in Italian, German, Japanese, English.

[00:03:47]There we go.

[00:03:48]>> Nice.

[00:03:49]>> So, now we can do a small purchase.

[00:03:55]We can do a small purchase on chain even, which before used to be only lightning, so I'm going to drop in $1.

[00:04:03]And then just a quarter.

[00:04:07]You know, or it could be a five, a 20, even a 100.

[00:04:12]So, what I'm going to do, I'm going to prepare from my wallet. Let me see. I'm going to use my blue wallet this time around to create an on chain uh Bitcoin QR code.

[00:04:26]So, okay.

[00:04:29]And Bitcoin is so cheap today.

[00:04:33]It's discount day.

[00:04:34]>> Discount day, yes.

[00:04:36]>> Yeah, so that's an on chain QR code. I don't know if you need it. Yep, you got it.

[00:04:41]So, just tap on continue here.

[00:04:43]This machine is set up and then it'll give me a detail saying, "Okay, you're buying $1.25.

[00:04:53]The machine has a fee right now 0% because it's for a demo, but the machine owner sets the fee they want.

[00:05:00]And then it details the on chain fee.

[00:05:03]Apparently, the fees are a little bit higher right now. 40 cents, so some movement on the on the blockchain.

[00:05:10]But, after seeing this detail, I just click on continue.

[00:05:15]And then after a few seconds, I get the transaction.

[00:05:21]And I can check it from my from my phone.

[00:05:25]Should appear there within a few seconds.

[00:05:28]As we know, an on chain transaction takes >> Yeah.

[00:05:31]>> on average 10 minutes to confirm.

[00:05:33]However, something that's very important for us is the machine to be a safe place to buy Bitcoin. So, every transaction built uh or sent from the from the K1 machine is RBF disabled.

[00:05:47]That means that after the transaction is sent, it cannot be replaced by, you know, the machine owner or anybody else saying I want to spend more Bitcoin to get it uh to go somewhere else.

[00:06:00]So, it's as good as done.

[00:06:02]So, it's I just bought a dollar you know, let me see how much did I get did I get in the end?

[00:06:09]80 cents.

[00:06:10]By spending a dollar and something. But, it was on chain and the fees are high.

[00:06:14]>> the on chain fee. So, if you did it through the lightning, it would be obviously a lot cheaper.

[00:06:17]>> Yeah, it would be probably, you know, close to one or two sats.

[00:06:20]>> Yeah.

[00:06:20]>> Or if we did a $20 purchase, for example, or a $10 purchase, I could do it on chain for the same fee.

[00:06:27]>> Yeah.

[00:06:27]>> It won't it won't change.

[00:06:30]>> So, I'm a little embarrassed to to admit this, but I'm not familiar with the creating the the receive QR code. I've never done a transaction like that. Is that common in all the wallets now?

[00:06:43]>> Uh pretty much. I mean, as long as you have >> I guess I just use Bitcoin in a very simple way. Just making purchases with it. So, >> No, actually, you know, for daily transactions, it's it's normal just to use lightning. That's what we expect.

[00:06:55]But, even on lightning wallets like Blink, which is, you know, my one one of the best wallets and the one of the most commonly used ones.

[00:07:02]>> Hey guys, just a reminder, the best way to really understand how Bitcoin is impacting El Salvador and what's happening here is to get some boots on the ground and come visit. And uh of course, we're excited now to have locations both in El Zonte and uh Punta Mango, where we have a guest homes there that you can rent that everything can be done in Bitcoin. So, we have the Bitcoin Beach Suites in El Zonte, and we have Punta Manga Villas in Punta Manga, and you can find all that on the Stay at Bitcoin Beach website. So, make sure that you check that out. And if you're planning on coming down, uh Uh, make sure you're staying at a place where Bitcoin's going to be welcomed and that you'll be surrounded by other Bitcoiners.

[00:07:46]>> You can create a lightning QR code which will work on the machine. And a for even >> to receive.

[00:07:51]>> Yeah, for even lower transactions. Like we could buy 5 cents right now on lightning.

[00:07:55]But Blink also has the option to do uh on chain.

[00:07:59]Or if you have even a hardware wallet or a or a cold wallet, a cold wallet can display a receive QR code. So now you can buy Bitcoin directly to your cold wallet.

[00:08:09]>> I guess I'm confused.

[00:08:10]>> I guess maybe I'm conf- getting confused. I guess that does make sense.

[00:08:12]It is the standard way. You always show a QR code, but I'm guess I'm just not used to it being like that on the >> Not from a Not from a machine, definitely. No. Because it usually it's much more complicated than that. We just jumped over, you know, so many steps.

[00:08:29]>> So that just makes it It's just like you're doing a peer-to-peer transaction.

[00:08:32]>> Exactly. And and that's what you're doing. Yes. That's what you're doing, exactly.

[00:08:36]>> But And and I'm I'm even try I haven't bought from an ATM in forever, but I'm trying to I remember it being and complicated. I remember it being a complicated process.

[00:08:45]>> But it doesn't need to be.

[00:08:46]>> Yeah.

[00:08:47]>> So that's that's the barrier we're breaking, you know.

[00:08:49]>> And and no KYC?

[00:08:52]>> That can be enabled on the machine. So depending on the regulation as, you know, we are technology manufacturers and we sell machines to South Africa, to Bolivia, to Japan. Each country has their own regulation. KYC can be enabled in the machine after a certain margin.

[00:09:09]Uh or after a certain amount. And that can, you know, look like a a simple as a uh you know, typing your phone number, you get an SMS, and then you you confirm your identity up to, you know, some other steps as well.

[00:09:22]>> Okay.

[00:09:23]Interesting.

[00:09:25]And what Do you guys have any um insight into what percentage of the people are doing on chain versus lightning? I I if they're if they're self-custodial, you don't have that information or maybe you do. I don't know how >> Well, until right now every machine has been lightning only.

[00:09:46]Every one of our machines, because they were designed for small transactions.

[00:09:49]But now you can you'll be able to do on chain even for small transactions. Which gives you another level of uh anonymity and another level of self-custody, because you're not I mean you don't need channels to, you know, the network or or to a node that's well connected. I mean it's you're just broadcasting signed transactions from the machine to the network.

[00:10:13]So, it's going to be this new software update is going to be available for every K1 customer, anybody who has bought a machine from us in the last 4 years. It's going to be completely free.

[00:10:23]Right now we already we are already beta testing it in a couple of places. And it's going well, you know, people the people who understand the power of, you know, a machine doing on chain and lightning in a completely self-custody way.

[00:10:39]Uh I think it's going to to be to be turning some heads.

[00:10:42]>> No, I I love that. And you're saying you can update your old machines. They don't have to upgrade the hardware. They're >> No, no, no. The same like for example, we one of the places where we're testing the the the new software is in Berlin, Usulutan here uh with the Bitcoin Center.

[00:10:58]And they recently received uh one of our earliest machines as a donation, you know, the the the people who owned it donated to the center. It's it's one of the earliest versions of our machines.

[00:11:10]We update upgraded it for them and it's now working with the latest software. Uh so now they can do on chain and lightning at the Bitcoin Center.

[00:11:19]>> I love that. I love that.

[00:11:22]So, are you seeing any new demand with with this new feature or is it so new that people don't you're still trying to get the word out?

[00:11:32]>> Well, we're just uh letting people know right now. So >> [laughter] >> Now, we've been we've been talking to right now it's been a closed beta.

[00:11:40]So Berlin and then one more place where we're testing it that's close to us as well.

[00:11:47]Because it's very early.

[00:11:49]But so far we have had a great feedback. And we'll be we haven't announced it really on our social media.

[00:11:56]But we really We're really looking forward because it also broadens the market for K1. You know, now before it used to be a lightning machine. Now it's it's a Bitcoin machine. You know, if you have a an on-chain invoice, if you have a P2SH, you know, pay to script hash, if you have a cold wallet, if you have a bolt 12 invoice, if you have a lightning address, you know, it works with everything now. So it it it really broadens our scope. And you know, being able to give back also you know, and support the people who have believed in us for the past four years is also an incredible feeling to us because we are enabling them to serve a broader audience as well.

[00:12:37]>> I love that. And do the K1s continue to be buy only machines?

[00:12:43]>> Yes, for now they continue to be buy only machines. Although at the last adopting Bitcoin conference, we demoed a module that was basically it's it's a separate module that allows you to withdraw cash from the machine. That's still in development. We did some demos at the at the adopting Bitcoin conference. And so we expect that to come later this year.

[00:13:08]>> And because of the like the physical structure of your guys machines, they're they're primarily in businesses where you have employees. They're counter top machine. They're they're not something that you would just leave, you know, sitting out open to the public without some type of supervision. But I'm just curious if you've seen anybody come up with any like kind of cage for it that they put it outward facing or anything like that that that that makes it no need to have any employees?

[00:13:38]>> Yeah, actually I think that the most what do you call it lockdown machine that I've seen was from one of our friends here in El Salvador actually.

[00:13:47]In San Juan Tepezontes. So, greetings to Harrison if you're watching.

[00:13:53]He set up his machine. He has a what we would call here in El Salvador tiendita. You know, tiendita de pueblo, the little corner store where where he sells, you know, from sandals to milk to Bitcoin.

[00:14:06]And he just basically built a metal structure around the machine and people come and they just help themselves at the machine. But yeah, the machine is designed mostly with the same security constraints as a cash register. So, it needs to be under supervision and that's the idea behind something like this.

[00:14:22]Obviously, you're not going to have, you know, $30,000 or, you know, $100,000 in here. It's designed for small amounts.

[00:14:29]And just as a as an approachable way.

[00:14:31]>> And just to be clear, you'll never have dollars in there. You'll have sats in there. So, >> I mean, when people use it to buy, you know, sometimes you get >> I guess the dollars they have in they put in, but it's yeah.

[00:14:41]>> Exactly. Exactly. But it's it's not designed for large amounts. It's designed to be approachable, to be less expensive than other machines. So, you can have it in a coffee shop. You can have it in a little in a little little corner store where maybe a full-size ATM would not necessarily fit or be the best option.

[00:15:00]>> So, for all you small business owners out there, if you want something that will, you know, drive Bitcoiners to your location, be a conversation piece, and also just help drive Bitcoin adoption, this machine is perfect for that.

[00:15:16]>> Absolutely. I mean, it's the easiest way to buy Bitcoin in the world.

[00:15:20]>> I love that. Have you seen any stores um I'm trying to think how how that would would work. I'm wondering if you could rather than um having something that disperses Bitcoin allow them to use this like if people want to pay in Bitcoin and they could just pay in you know, if their bill is 20 $20, they would could pay $20 worth of Bitcoin into the machine.

[00:15:47]>> Yeah, absolutely.

[00:15:48]>> happen or is that >> Yes, there are some places where you know, people uh for example, stores that do want to attract Bitcoiners or who want to uh teach people how to use Bitcoin, you know, how do you use how do you use it in the real world. Some people will say, "Hey, we have a 5% discount or a 10% discount if you pay for our services or or if you pay for a cup of coffee in Bitcoin." And the machine is right there, so you can just go, you know, use the machine and then immediately get 10% discount for your purchases. So, it's a way to educate the people who have never used Yeah. digital payments even or I've never used Bitcoin at least.

[00:16:23]>> I love that. I love that.

[00:16:25]So, I know we have some some uh videos and some uh some pictures of of the stuff that you guys have going, but tell me about your trip to Bolivia. I know you guys sold a number of machines down there and I'm curious to hear what's I I This is the first time that I've seen this well, when we were preparing yeah, half an hour ago, I saw this photo and I was like, "What? I didn't know this was going on in Bolivia." So, tell us a little bit about your trip down there and then what you're seeing in the the Bitcoin scene in Bolivia when during your trip there.

[00:16:59]>> Yeah, I mean, I had a a short trip to Bolivia. What there is a very >> I mean, this is they did a great job.

[00:17:06]This isn't like >> No, it's a beautiful place.

[00:17:09]>> halfway done. I mean, they went all out.

[00:17:11]>> Yes, yes, definitely. Greetings to my friends from uh from Bolivia. You know, they are uh it's called uh Kiosko Bitcoin in Bolivia. They have uh basically this nice boutique clothing, you know, high-end clothing shop, but also at the same time they have a a coffee shop in the same space.

[00:17:35]And then they have a Bitcoin education space and they do Bitcoin events with people from around.

[00:17:41]So, they [clears throat] have they are starting basically their own network of Bitcoin ATMs and you know, it was between you know, buying one machine for that place or buying a group of K1 machines which are, you know, lower cost of entry. And then having be being then being available around the city. So, I was in Cochabamba for it was a short trip, but it was very productive, you know, we were able to collaborate with the people on the site, share some Bitcoin education, get them, you know, up and ready with the machines, but also seeing the the reality of country where the economy is going through a difficult time. Just one of the things that I learned, you know, the hard way is that if you go to the ATM to get you to the regular ATM to get money out, you get the bank rate, but then if you go on the street to trade your dollars, you get a different rate.

[00:18:32]Right now the banks will give you six bolivianos for $1.

[00:18:38]And when I was there the rate on the street was 10 bolivianos for $1.

[00:18:44]So, >> So, anybody who's traveled to Argentina is kind of familiar with that.

[00:18:50]>> Yes, so >> you use like a credit card there, you get the do you get the bank rate?

[00:18:54]>> Exactly. Exactly. Anything you pay with your credit card you get charged directly to your account. It's it's the bank rate. It's the official government rate.

[00:19:01]>> Yeah.

[00:19:02]So, I'm assuming most everybody's doing things in in cash then.

[00:19:06]>> Uh if you're a tourist, yeah, you'll do you'll you'll want to do everything in cash.

[00:19:11]Uh they are having also trouble, you know, with the global financial system.

[00:19:15]So, the government had to set up an internal payment network using QR codes, you know, from account to account without going through uh through the banks or through the through the traditional channels. It's just a government-sponsored They just call it pain with QR, but it's, you know, from your Bolivianos bank account to your to somebody else's Bolivianos bank account.

[00:19:37]Uh they basically needed to build a a side channel for their infrastructure.

[00:19:43]Uh so, a lot of people are interested in Bitcoin as a way to protect their wealth long-term, you know. We are, you know, we were just talking about Bitcoin volatility and today is a is a good day to buy Bitcoin.

[00:19:54]But, imagine your currency crashing every day, you know, and every week, you know, it's going to be lower and lower and lower and lower. So, people are looking for a lifeboat, and that can be Bitcoin. And uh this this organization is is is doing that, you know, making it available.

[00:20:09]We're really happy to to be able to partner with them uh to do that.

[00:20:14]>> So, while you were there, did you like see people come in that were like first-timers that were like, "Hey, I'm looking for a way to you know, guard the this value of an accumulated?" Or what? Did you see any activity? I know you were there for a short amount of time, so.

[00:20:28]>> It was a short time, and it was more uh like working directly on the machines than with the staff. But, I I I was able, you know, to talk to the staff to hear from them what they're seeing in the people, and also to to talk to them, you know, about some of the uh strategies that we have used in El Salvador and also in other places to teach people about Bitcoin, you know, from uh you know, one one of the tools we use is giving them an and I was able to get one in Bolivia to get a a silver coin from the country.

[00:20:55]So, Bolivia, just as most of uh Latin America used to use silver coinage. And actually, I do have a little silver coin here that I always carry in my pocket. So, this is one of my educational tools.

[00:21:09]>> Mhm.

[00:21:11]>> So, I have a a little silver coin from El Salvador and I use it to to teach and and to tell a story. And this is, you know, part of the what I was talking to the the people in the staff from Bolivia. I told them, "This coin it's just the same size as a as a US dime, but it's silver.

[00:21:33]And my mom would tell me, 'When I was little, we would take a pesetia.' That's what they called it, like a little peseta, pesetia. And we could buy three pupusas and a cup of coffee and we would have enough for a pastry.

[00:21:45]And nowadays, if you, you know, this is worth three three pennies.

[00:21:49]You cannot buy, I don't think even a piece of candy with three pennies.

[00:21:53]But if you look up the the silver value in this, it's over $5 in silver.

[00:21:59]And if you have $5, I mean, you can absolutely get three pupusas and a cup of coffee and even a little pastry.

[00:22:06]>> Yeah.

[00:22:07]>> But nowadays, that's not the case.

[00:22:09]So, that's how we teach about, you know, hard money versus, you know, color uh color pieces of paper, which is what we have now. And uh I I It was mostly working with the staff, you know, giving them tools, sharing experiences. And besides, you know, doing the the technology work, upgrading the machines, connecting, you know, to the for the machines to be able to accept Bolivianos, which took a little bit of time, but, you know, our friends were really patient in helping us get everything set up.

[00:22:41]>> So, do you have it set up now that that they can take the the paper currency there in Bolivia?

[00:22:46]>> In Bolivia, yes. So, those uh right now they have eight machines. Six of them will accept, you know, the they're ready for paper currency and the other two are only for coins. That's how they requested them.

[00:22:58]>> Yeah.

[00:22:58]>> And then, you know, you can put in a five Boliviano coin or, you know, a a 100 Boliviano notes, and people are starting to use them. They had a few events even last year when they were even doing only coins. And they had a lot of activity with people curious. I mean, I mean when the boat sinking, everybody's jumping to the to the life raft, right?

[00:23:20]So, lots of lots of people interested in learning about Bitcoin through one of the machines.

[00:23:27]>> And did you get any sense while you were there of what the the government's attitude towards Bitcoin is in Bolivia?

[00:23:34]>> Not really. I mean, what um what I learned is that right now there's not an official posture, you know, neither on favor and at least not against for now.

[00:23:45]Um >> Which sometimes is the best [laughter] way to have it.

[00:23:49]>> I mean, that would be ideal, you know, if the government let people, you know, use the money they prefer. Obviously, there's a strong incentive for the government to to determine which money the people use.

[00:24:01]But uh at least right now there's no there's not a lot of uh regulatory hurdles. I mean, it's pretty simple to to start using Bitcoin.

[00:24:11]>> Awesome. Yeah, now I'm uh now now I want to go visit that uh business and and meet the folks behind it.

[00:24:18]>> Yeah, absolutely. They're great people.

[00:24:20]>> to see that that's happening there in Bolivia.

[00:24:22]>> Yes.

[00:24:23]>> We obviously we work with you know, a lot of different places throughout Latin America. Um and I was not aware of this. So, I love I love hearing about stuff out of the blue.

[00:24:34]>> Yeah, it's it's a strong uh you know, concerted effort that they're doing.

[00:24:39]And we're really just happy that they selected K1 as their technology solution and just continue to support them throughout the way. And there's other efforts going on in Bolivia. I was able to talk to uh to some of the other uh Bitcoiners in the area. Uh even even the guy who from the I coin collector from whom I got my Bolivian silver coin, you know, for for my for my education stack.

[00:25:05]Um he told me, "Yeah, I'm a Bitcoiner, too." You know, because if you if you understand how money works and you see your money sinking, you know, and so we're just creating more opportunities for people to learn about it.

[00:25:18]>> So, besides traveling and selling machines around the world, I know you become a a TV star recently.

[00:25:26]Paco, maybe you can play that clip from So, just just to to set the stage a little bit, you participated in an accelerator that was hosted here in El Salvador. I think the the people hosting it were from Turkey or were from maybe all over.

[00:25:43]>> Yeah, people from all over. At that moment, the the CEO was, you know, a Salvadoran that moved to well, a Salvadoran descendant born in Portugal. And there were people from Eastern Europe involved. There were some people also from Korea, people Salvadorans, some Americans.

[00:26:03]>> But but the I was talking about the ones who were actually running it. But the um and then they brought together all these companies from from around the world that were not not necessarily in the Bitcoin space, but they were in the tech space and in general.

[00:26:15]>> from the Bitcoin space and some others just from the tech space. Yes. And it was hosted here in El Salvador. It's called X Founders.

[00:26:21]And I was you know, K1 was part of the the that batch, you know, for that season.

[00:26:28]>> Was it 20 or how many how many businesses did they bring? Like 15?

[00:26:32]>> No, we were eight businesses.

[00:26:34]>> Okay, eight.

[00:26:35]And you guys all live together during that time, right?

[00:26:38]>> Uh pretty much, yes. For 1 month in the one of the hotels in in downtown San Salvador in well, in in >> I'm sure you had to go back and forth home and see your wife and >> Yes, yes. I had the privilege that since it was in my home country and just, you know, a 15-minute drive from home, I got to go home most of the nights. Sometimes I needed to stay overnight because >> Because you guys are working all night?

[00:26:58]>> Yes. We we did some, you know, what do you call it, you know, uh I don't know, just coding until we get it done. Uh But it was it was really fun. I learned a lot and and I'm happy that, you know, part of parts of the things that I learned have been even beneficial because I've been able to reproduce that training as well. So, that's it's been really cool.

[00:27:19]>> Well, let's have Paco play the clip and then I want you to kind of elaborate on what things looked like on a day-to-day and and for people that are considering that have businesses that are considering going into something.

[00:27:31]>> Absolutely.

[00:27:36]>> My name is Edgar Borja. I am the CEO and founder of K1 Technology. We are building the easiest way to buy Bitcoin in the world.

[00:27:43]>> Edgar, the diplomatic glue.

[00:27:46]>> Edgar from K1 has such vision.

[00:27:50]>> So, when I first met Edgar from K1, I was just mind-blown from first second, right?

[00:27:56]>> I have a huge amount of respect for what [music] Edgar has built. And this thing is just one piece of the puzzle. We're K1.

[00:28:03]Bitcoin for everyone.

[00:28:07]>> So, for for people that are kind of just curious as to what this is involved cuz I was actually the one that called you and said, "Hey, I met these guys actually in Seoul at the Seoul Bitcoin conference and they were looking they were talking that to me about the fact they were coming to El Salvador to host this accelerator that they also film and they premiere. I don't know if they I think they just show it on YouTube.

[00:28:32]>> Yes.

[00:28:33]>> Um but they had quite a few views. They've done this in other places and they've helped companies get investment and you know, make those connections. And so, I I thought of you.

[00:28:45]I was like, "Okay, maybe this would be a good fit for Edgar and then and where you guys were at with your company. So, tell tell us a little bit about that process of participating in an accelerator. What are the upsides? What are the downsides? What are the things that people should consider if they get an opportunity like this?

[00:29:02]>> Yeah, absolutely. So, I I think yeah, as as you mentioned, you know, I found out about them from you and then later on I got the call from their team.

[00:29:13]So, it was Nelson who was on the like one of the first people in the in the video and part of his staff.

[00:29:22]And they told me, you know, we are going to do a reality show and it's going to be about companies in the Bitcoin ecosystem and we'd like you to be one of them. So, but first of all at first, you know, I was a little, you know, I wanted to find out more about them.

[00:29:38]Fortunately, this was the third season.

[00:29:39]So, the first two seasons had already the first one was had been completely published and the second one was being released at the time. So, I was able to get a sense of what the reality show was about cuz I told him, you know, if it's about if they're going to be filming me under the covers of the bed and taking a shower, I'm like, I'm not really interested.

[00:29:58]No, I'm I'm not into that. But no, you know, it was more of I mean, their goal in the end is for the companies who sign up to be able to, you know, score investment with real investors. So, they will not show anything that makes you look you know, silly or sometimes silly, but you know, within within reason within reason.

[00:30:18]So, it was a very professional experience. We had we were in the in the hotel for about a month. I was able to go back and forth, but the rest of them were in the hotel for about a month.

[00:30:31]And then because we're local, we also had the the whole filming crew come to the K1 office which a short clip was shown in the in the in the preview.

[00:30:41]And you know, it's just the level of production is unlike anything I had ever seen here because we had I think a when they visited the K1 office, we had 15 people, you know, from the director to the drone operator, uh the light the lighting people, the cameraman, uh the sound team, you know, like we were just talking to to my partners and we said, you know, if we had paid for a team like this to come and film a day in the life of K1, it would have been, you know, >> I mean, that's impressive that they had that level of production cuz we've done a lot of, you know, filming with with different entities and outside of 60 minutes, like nobody brings in a team like that. Usually, it's like two people. You got the cameraman and one other person. So, the fact that they had 15 crew members >> Yes. Yes, I counted them. And then, I bought some of the choco bananas for them afterwards. So, >> [laughter] >> yeah, I had to share culture.

[00:31:41]>> Yes.

[00:31:42]>> Um yeah, I mean, we did takes, uh as I said, you know, at the hotel with even challenges. We went to the Santa Ana volcano. You got to see, you know, that your determination and uh we did uh also in downtown San Salvador at the National Theater. We had the final the closing activity was a pitch day.

[00:32:02]So, we used one of the side uh it's called a piano room in the in the in the theater. It's a beautiful room and we had, you know, a big screen and the cameras and everything. It was really interesting.

[00:32:15]The connection the connections we made during the during the boot camp were, you know, really strong. Even, you know, talking to investors, talking to fellow uh founders, sometimes, you know, just sitting across the table. If you're going to be, you know, with everybody for a month, you know, you sit across the table from them, start talking about their startup, then you tell them about your ideas, and then, okay, well, you can do this, you can do that. And it's people who are, you know, in the hustle, people who are working on this every day.

[00:32:41]>> And people understand the like the pressure and the headaches and the the joys and the sorrows that come with with being a founder.

[00:32:48]>> And all of us were founders with active companies. So, we were, you know, doing the TV show full-time, and then we were working full-time as well.

[00:32:57]So, you got to say, you know, people, you know, "Oh, I need Hold on, I need to go make a call because uh football club Barcelona wants to use our product." And and it's, you know, exciting and and and stuff like that.

[00:33:08]So, we were able to, you know, support each other, you know, sometimes help with our decisions, and then get help during our decisions. Then had we had access to coaches.

[00:33:17]Uh a lot of the coaches were, you know, really great people with uh great trajectories.

[00:33:23]Then, obviously, you know, it's there's always, you know, a little bit of this that you know, I'm not fully agree with this, but most of the time, you know, it was in my mind, it was a a very positive experience, and I really really liked it. It helped us understand how in in the end, it was how to pitch better.

[00:33:43]>> Yeah.

[00:33:43]>> How to pitch better, you know, what are the questions that investors are going to get. And we got destroyed, you know, by investors, but that's that's how you rebuild stronger, right?

[00:33:51]So, we got >> an entrepreneur, you don't necessarily know. You're seeing things one way, and so to have somebody come in and say, "No, this is the way investors are going to look at it."

[00:33:59]>> Yes, absolutely, because >> helpful.

[00:34:01]>> as an entrepreneur, you might be you know, really excited about something.

[00:34:04]Like right now, I'm really excited about the new software update and everything.

[00:34:07]But the investor comes and say, "Okay, how is that going to help you sell more units? How are you going to make my investment, you know, uh increase in value through the work that you're doing right now?" And that's that's how we understand it now. Something that, you know, some of the pieces were absolutely there, you know, being ourselves, you know, the founders of the company, we have invested into it as well, and we want to see those returns.

[00:34:29]But it's not the same when you go asking for $2 million and and that $2 million needs to turn into $20 million. So, you need to to show the pathway here. You say, "So, here are the seven steps that will take us from $2 million to $20 million."

[00:34:42]And then, being able to articulate it using the language and to practice, you know, pitching to because an investor might be here one day, then the next week you get two more investors that drop by. We had a lot of help from the Stocknet Foundation, which is, you know, another entity that was also part of the of the event. So, it it was it was really really good.

[00:35:03]>> I know when I talked to the the the folks kind of behind it in in Seoul, they were saying that, you know, part of the reason the big part of the reason they decided to bring it to El Salvador was because of the Bitcoin adoption here. And so, for me, it was so exciting to see that you have this, you know, worldwide show accelerator kind of reality TV thing wanting to be based in El Salvador and to have that be the hub because El Salvador was seen as one of the most exciting places where things are really happening.

[00:35:34]>> And it continues to be seen like that, you know. I it really helped us, you know, the the what do you call it? I don't know if it's the branding behind El Salvador or just the the history of the transformation. When we bring one of our products, even, you know, nowadays outside of TV show in in in the real world, when we bring a Bitcoin product made in El Salvador, it has a a a a weight to it, you know, because >> People are more likely to to want to hear from you and to to actually take a serious look at you cuz they're excited to participate in some way with what's happening here.

[00:36:10]>> Yes, absolutely. You know, people now associate El Salvador with a positive outcome with Bitcoin, which didn't happen before. And that has been very helpful for our company as well. It was during the show and it continues to be now.

[00:36:23]>> I've heard that before from people talking about when they'd go to Bitcoin conferences, they'd say, like, when people hear from you in El Salvador, it's like all of a sudden you're kind of a minor celebrity, even though nobody, you know, they don't know who you are, but they're like, "Oh, you're from El Salvador." And they, you know, they want to hear the story.

[00:36:38]>> Yeah, it's it's really fun. Actually, you know, one of the craziest things happened at one of the Bitcoin conferences uh from, you know, the Bitcoin conference. I think it was it might have been the one in Miami.

[00:36:51]At the end of the conference, we had some t-shirts made, you know, uh Bitcoin El Salvador, surfing, you know, all of little drawings and sketches around.

[00:37:01]People were bidding for our t-shirts because they wanted to take home as a souvenir the Bitcoin El Salvador t-shirt. I I just got another shirt in exchange for mine, and I keep it, you know, as a souvenir for my friend Shawn from New Zealand, who also took one of our machines back to New Zealand.

[00:37:17]Uh and he said, "I want your shirt because it says Bitcoin and it says El Salvador." So, people are really excited about El Salvador and Bitcoin.

[00:37:25]>> Yeah.

[00:37:26]So, let's talk a little bit about some of the other things that you guys are are working on. You're not just doing ATMs. You guys are focused on education.

[00:37:34]You guys believe that that's an important part of Bitcoin adoption. So, um give us the lowdown on some of the new things you guys have coming out.

[00:37:42]>> Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think it all it's uh from our side at least, it's a it's an effort to help Bitcoin be accessible.

[00:37:51]And making Bitcoin Bitcoin accessible means, yes, you know, here's here's a nickel. You can just put the nickel in the machine and you get Bitcoin.

[00:38:00]But then, uh it's also about creating resources.

[00:38:03]A lot of our customers, people who buy our machines, are educators.

[00:38:07]I think over half of our machines right now are being used by uh either, you know, part-time or full-time as educational machines.

[00:38:15]So, we're always looking for ways to to empower these educators to make it easier for them to uh to share Bitcoin with with the rest of the of the world, people who don't know them. One of them, the one that's on screen, is Aprende Bitcoin con Crayolas, Learn Bitcoin with Crayons. So, this is an a workshop. It's about a 40 to 60 minute workshop we have created where you just need a box of crayons and a piece of paper on the you know like right now here we see Evelyn from Bitcoin Berlin.

[00:38:52]Yeah, absolutely. Great project going on in Berlin, a Bitcoin education center.

[00:38:58]And I was able to to lead the workshop for them. So, basically we have on the on the left there where that's our blockchain, you know, that's a a blank piece of paper and everybody in the room gets a crayon.

[00:39:10]And that's your private key. You can sign blue and everybody can read blue but nobody else can write in blue cuz that's your private The the public key is just whatever you write, you sign it blue. That's your signature, but nobody else can do it. Everybody can see it, nobody can copy it, just like in Bitcoin.

[00:39:32]So, we do there's about right now I think we have like 12 exercises within you know you know from a simple uh private key signing as I was describing to a multi-signature transaction where you have two or three colors being the recipients and you can say oh this I'm sending some Bitcoin to blue, green, and red and two of them can be in agreement to spend it and then we teach people you know how to protect your private key and then they are start they start to be able to separate the concept of okay, so my private key is my secret. It's not the physical hardware wallet that I have or it's not the app that's running on my phone. You know, it's the secret is is what I have to keep.

[00:40:15]So, by being by making it tangible, uh people are able to to understand it and to practice it and then, you know, we can even do like little if the group is too big, we we can separate and say, "Okay, so this table is going to work on this piece of paper." So, it's really approachable because the consumables are crayons, which everybody has access to, and paper, which everybody has access to, and then you can go on to really advanced concepts. So, uh this was a really great class. I mean, uh kudos to the Bitcoin Berlin team.

[00:40:48]These are Salvadoran students from ages 13 and up.

[00:40:53]All of them were engaged in the class, participating. You can see that the the kids feel valued. They they feel empowered to be there, to share, to, you know, to speak up, to say, uh even to make mistakes and learn. So, there I was really um I felt really privileged to be sharing with them. So, it was a really great class and it's we're preparing it in a way that can be uh easily reproduced in different places and we're just making it uh free for everyone. It's Creative Commons. Just, you know, don't go and sell it.

[00:41:30]>> [laughter] >> You can just continue to to reproduce it for free. Yeah.

[00:41:34]>> No, I love that.

[00:41:36]And then you also have a game.

[00:41:39]>> Yes. So, this is another of the tools and we're also sharing this with you know, our clients who have bought some of our machines and also some of the educational projects.

[00:41:50]I have some of the game pieces here.

[00:41:52]This is a board game called Merkle Root.

[00:41:55]And the idea for this is if you're doing a Bitcoin meetup, you know, how do you break the ice? How do you start? Or while you're waiting for everybody to show up, especially if it's in Latin America, you know, you say, "Hey, it's at 6:00 p.m." but people start coming in at 6:30. Some of them might be early.

[00:42:10]So, what do you do in the meantime, you know?

[00:42:12]>> The key is you just tell the Salvadorans a half hour before you tell everybody else.

[00:42:15]>> Yeah, you know that.

[00:42:16]>> [laughter] >> But then there's some Latinos for whom it's an hour later.

[00:42:21]And then you get in trouble. No. So, what we do is that we have created this board game that teaches you about Merkle trees.

[00:42:28]Merkle trees are, you know, it's it's an algorithm that's used by the blockchain to be able to summarize the transactions and be able to validate. How how can each block be validated quickly? It uses a Merkle tree algorithm, but we just make it easy. It's just colors.

[00:42:45]As you can see at the top, there's a bunch of leaves in different colors.

[00:42:52]Those key Those leaves are the the mempool. So, all of these are transactions that everybody can see, and you have different colors. And then your job is to find the Merkle tree branches, or just, you know, the branches.

[00:43:05]Let's say, for example, in that picture, we see that there's a pink and blue and green leaf at the top. So, you have to find a piece that is pink and green, and that will go in the first position on the board.

[00:43:19]And then it's a a speed game. I think we played it.

[00:43:22]>> Yeah, we played it at the um Plan B conference.

[00:43:24]>> Plan B conference, yes.

[00:43:26]>> They had it in the the lounge there.

[00:43:27]>> Exactly. And we did a tournament there.

[00:43:29]Uh we were teaching it to people. Uh so, the thing is you have you have to match the first four the first four like the top four branches have to match the mempool.

[00:43:38]Then in the second level, the the second level of branches, they need to match the trunk from the previous, just like in a Merkle tree, you know, you hash two two transactions into one value.

[00:43:50]Then you hash those two values into a new one, and then you continue to do that until you get the Merkle root, which is one of the data points that's used for the, you know, who who gets to mine the block first. So, you using this game, you can teach the people, "Okay, so you are hashing right now." Which means you know, taking a lot of values and turning them into one. And if you find the last one, then that means that you mined this block. So you win one point. And then usually, you know, the game once people get get going, it can end in 30 seconds because they're, you know, matching the their pieces really quickly. And then we do several rounds.

[00:44:27]At the Plan B conference, we had a tournament. We had eight people playing at the same time, you know, going against each other. And in the end, we had just the two finalists, and it was really exciting. And the winner got to take, you know, their own game set for free.

[00:44:43]We were able to send also game sets to several education-focused organizations.

[00:44:49]And we're getting some good feedback from them, you know, people are using it.

[00:44:52]We wanted to make a game where you can explain the rules in 30 seconds. So it doesn't even take a minute to teach.

[00:45:00]And then you don't need to tell them, you know, "Okay, so now we're going to talk about the algorithm and hash, you know?"

[00:45:06]We had a 3-year-old player. And she was doing well. You know, she She was doing okay. She didn't need to know about Merkle trees.

[00:45:13]It can be just a game. But if you want to elaborate after breaking the ice, you can start telling, "Okay, so this is how this connects to Bitcoin."

[00:45:21]And this is, you know, what's important about this and why validation and why And then maybe you do, you know, one round of the game and then you teach a little bit. And then you do another round, and then you teach for 15 more seconds. And it continues to keep interesting. So it's a non- other of the tools that we're building for the people who want to build or or who want to create a Bitcoin education space.

[00:45:43]>> I love it. I love it. I love how you guys are not just focused on one thing, but you're looking at the the bigger picture of it all.

[00:45:51]>> Yeah, I mean, our goal is just to to to create tools that make Bitcoin easy to use, you know. It doesn't need to be complicated. Bitcoin, I mean, cryptocurrencies in general, cryptography is very complicated.

[00:46:05]I can tell you because you know, getting the machine to to be able to work on chain and on lightning at the same time with self-custody, it's complicated.

[00:46:12]>> Yeah.

[00:46:13]>> But we don't need it to make it complicated for people who are using it for the first time. You know, if they want to go on and be Bitcoin developers, which we need more of, that's absolutely fantastic. But if they just want to use it for their daily life and you you know, you can contribute to making it exciting and easy to understand and say, "Oh, okay, so that's how the private key works.

[00:46:32]Okay, so that's why you know, you need to mine faster and that's why you can so then we can create tools that help, just with colors, you know, none of this is language-based, the the board game.

[00:46:44]Of course, you know, the instructions are in English and Spanish, but you can play with this you can play this game with somebody who doesn't speak your language.

[00:46:51]You can just show them, you know, where it goes and then you can have a multilingual uh board game around and it's easy.

[00:46:58]>> I love that.

[00:47:00]So, for people who are interested in in getting machines, I'm assuming you have it available in lots of different languages, lots of different currencies.

[00:47:10]I don't know if you want to give the specifics on that, but um is there any is there any major countries that you guys are not able to service or is it I don't know with the the different size bills and different things if there's challenges there, but who who uh who should buy one of these?

[00:47:31]>> Everyone. Now, uh so, that what you just mentioned is one, you know, it's one of those things. One of the major challenges for us was the size of the bills.

[00:47:40]>> Yeah, cuz some countries have bills that are huge.

[00:47:42]>> Yes. Yes, absolutely. And you know, if if you're not in into, you know, vending machines and and cash devices, I know you you had some experience with that in a previous >> Yeah, I had a we had a vending part part of our our operations our company was was vending and so I know all the things that can go wrong in those and how they get clogged up and the yeah, jammed up and all that.

[00:48:07]>> Yeah, so one of one of the biggest challenges we were able to overcome in the past 6 months was being able to accept wider bills.

[00:48:17]You know, this this machine in particular is has a bill acceptor that's designed for the US dollar.

[00:48:21]>> Yeah.

[00:48:22]>> So any bill that's the same size as the US dollar, you know, Mexican bills um Guatemalan, Honduran, a lot of Latin America is designed similar to the US dollar will work here.

[00:48:35]But European notes Canadian notes uh Bolivian, which was one of the issues, you know, they're wider.

[00:48:44]And the yen is >> [laughter] >> uh like an A4 piece of paper. Uh no, not that big, but anyways, it's quite big.

[00:48:51]So we were able to launch uh or to integrate a new bill acceptor into our machines and that one can take almost 100 different currencies. So this one can take about eight currencies, which is, you know, it was limiting our market.

[00:49:07]Also part of what we learned during X Founders was, you know, you you need to broaden the the scope of your market. If you tell somebody, "Hey, I'm from Canada. I want to buy a machine." "Oh, I'm sorry, you can't because your bills are too wide."

[00:49:19]Investors don't like that and absolutely, you know, as as a company owner I we don't want to say that. We want to say, "Yes, we support support it." And if they say, "Hey, we In our country the lightning network is not really popular. We only work on chain."

[00:49:30]"Yes, we support it."

[00:49:32]So our machines can now take coins and bills from over 100 countries.

[00:49:38]And uh yeah, you can buy them online using uh Bitcoin.

[00:49:43]>> And you can switch it to the languages in the different places.

[00:49:45]>> Yes, so the software is already multilingual.

[00:49:48]Uh this one is, I think, six languages right now.

[00:49:52]And Japanese being the most difficult looking and then, you know, but we continue to add languages. You know, it's just a software update away.

[00:50:01]Recently we added Portuguese, if I'm not mistaken, was the latest one. So, that's coming up. It's going to be in this release soon.

[00:50:09]And it's I mean, with AI, translation is is really simple nowadays. So, we we continue to add languages as they are requested as they are requested.

[00:50:18]>> able to get the the currency feed into the machine for the the conversion depending on what currency they're using also.

[00:50:27]>> Exactly. Exactly. So, the machine queries a couple of different because the machines work basically one of our goals right now is for the machines to be what what would be the word?

[00:50:38]Self-governed, self-reliant, you know, not depending on any third-party service.

[00:50:45]>> Self-sovereign.

[00:50:46]>> Self-sovereign, yeah. I mean, we're actually we're trying to align with Bitcoin principles even more.

[00:50:51]So, the machine will query the price of Bitcoin in its program currency.

[00:50:59]In the case of Bolivia, for example, it needs to query both prices and then, you know, figure out that there's some options to configure there so that you choose, you know, which like if you want to use the real price or the artificial price.

[00:51:11]>> The owner of the machine can can do that.

[00:51:14]>> Yes. Absolutely. You know, there's a there's a dashboard for the machine where the owner decides what they set.

[00:51:21]Uh and they continue to I mean, we we continue to to build more features just to make it, you know, any any gap that we find that's not being served, we we try make an effort to to to continue to resolve those problems. I think we're I think this machine is the first uh self-sovereign Bitcoin ATM in the world that it on both networks. I mean, I I've done the research.

[00:51:50]We haven't seen any other Most Most of the machines are, you know, part of a network or designed to be controlled by a central node.

[00:51:57]This is more aligned with the Bitcoin principles. So, we're creating tools for mass adoption and that needs to be for those tools to be reliable, for those tools to be uh resilient, they need to be self-custody. And that's what we're building.

[00:52:13]>> Ah, I love that. So, for people who want to buy one now, what what's the process?

[00:52:19]>> If you want to buy one, you just go to k1.sv.

[00:52:22]And then there's a shop button there.

[00:52:25]And you can select either, uh for example, a coin-only machine. They all look and they have the same enclosure size, so they're all the same size.

[00:52:33]But what changes is the cash devices.

[00:52:36]So, a coin-only machine >> will be cheaper than >> cheaper, yes.

[00:52:40]Uh then there's This is like the middle uh model. It has the bill acceptor only for US dollar or US dollar-size bills.

[00:52:49]And then the the the newest machine, we call it the K1. So, the first one will be K1 Mini. This one is K1 uh Mini Plus. And then we have the K1 Mini Global, which takes currencies from about 100 countries.

[00:53:02]Uh they um and that one all all three of them are available online at k1.sv.

[00:53:09]>> Have you had any issues with the coin sizes in any of the countries or is that something that's more uniform?

[00:53:15]>> You know, the coins are actually easier because the the machine ha- will detect, you know, the size and weight of the coins and then the metallicity too, you know, with a little, you know, magnet-like uh detector.

[00:53:29]And the coin the the coin acceptor can be trained on site. So, let's say that Bolivia, for example, launches a 10 bolivar coin a a 10 boliviano coin because, you know, the five one is not enough.

[00:53:43]So, the coin can be the coin acceptor can be retrained on site with, you know, a couple of button presses.

[00:53:50]So, that part is easy. Uh the bill acceptor is a little bit more complicated. That's actually the most complex part of the of the machine because, you know, it needs to do, you know, UV scanning, IR scanning, visual light scanning. So, that requires a little bit more processing, more power.

[00:54:10]So, coins are easier than bills.

[00:54:12]>> That makes sense.

[00:54:13]>> Yeah.

[00:54:14]>> So, they can go to the website and then they can be shipped worldwide.

[00:54:18]>> Yes, so we ship worldwide. Uh right now, we have shipped machines, you know, let me see, Australia, New Zealand. We shipped some machines to Eastern Europe recently.

[00:54:31]Um South America as well. So, yeah, we ship all over the place. Just shipped a machine to Canada, too. So.

[00:54:40]>> And you guys have any issues with with customs? I mean, they're they're an innocuous looking machine.

[00:54:46]I'm assuming most people wouldn't even know what they are, but I don't do you run into anything with it being a ATM?

[00:54:53]>> I mean, they are not technically ATMs cuz we we use the ATM word for short, but they're actually more in the category of vending machines. An ATM by definition, officially, it's a machine that dispenses cash.

[00:55:06]So, eventually, if we have, you know, the the two-way machine, that will be officially an ATM.

[00:55:12]>> Okay.

[00:55:12]>> This machine a machine where you where you drop a coin and you get something in return is more a vending machine. Yeah.

[00:55:19]>> I like that. I like that.

[00:55:20]>> And that's also >> it simple.

[00:55:23]>> Yeah.

[00:55:24]And then we might we might have a cash dispensing unit uh as as I mentioned, you know, a module, but this will be, you know, a vending machine.

[00:55:32]>> Yeah.

[00:55:33]>> Uh we call it, you know, the Bitcoin candy machine. You put in a dollar, instead of getting a candy, you get Bitcoin.

[00:55:38]>> Yeah. I love that. I love that. So, where can people follow you and find out about, you know, new things you guys are coming out? And then also I'm assuming since you're a growing company that you guys are are looking for investors. So, if investors are are looking at investing in an up-and-coming Salvadoran company, how can they contact you?

[00:56:03]What's the best way to get a hold of you?

[00:56:05]>> I mean, if you want to follow us or reach out to us on social media, it's K1 El Salvador.

[00:56:11]We're most active on X, which is where most of the Bitcoin ecosystem moves, but we're under the same name on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, so just K1 El Salvador or @K1ElSalvador.

[00:56:25]And if you want to reach me personally, it's [email protected].

[00:56:29]>> Okay. Well, Paco, can we put that in the show notes so that people will have that?

[00:56:33]>> Yeah, absolutely.

[00:56:35]>> Do we miss anything?

[00:56:36]>> Let me see. What else can we talk about?

[00:56:41]We I I don't know if your audience is more technical.

[00:56:45]You know, we could go on about, you know, the challenges of doing a self-custody ATM, but if that's not the the >> Well, I'm not very technical, so I think I don't really bring those issues up for the audience. So, we'll leave that to another day. But, I would like to finish off with just your take as a Salvadoran entrepreneur on the business climate in El Salvador.

[00:57:09]And is Bitcoin actually working in El Salvador? Is it bringing benefits to the people? You hear a lot of negative stuff in the press. There's even been some Bitcoiners that have moved here and then left cuz they've been like disillusioned. And so, I'm I'm curious to hear from you as a Salvadoran what what your take is on it.

[00:57:29]>> Yeah, absolutely. As a as a Salvadoran, I can tell you, no. Our company, our product uh launched on the day the Bitcoin law was announced.

[00:57:39]We traveled down here to Bitcoin Beach to test one of the Bitcoin ATMs uh you know, in one of the in one one of the shops.

[00:57:48]And after seeing the the friction in that experience, we decided to create the simplest way to buy Bitcoin in the world. And we have had a good reception here in the country, mostly abroad because Salvadorans tend to be, you know, very um we like no nobody's a prophet in their own land.

[00:58:06]>> Yes. Yes.

[00:58:07]>> But from the the whole Bitcoin ecosystem, we have had a great reception. And being from El Salvador has been beneficial to our company brand and to our to our identity.

[00:58:18]In regards to the business climate, there are challenges, you know. El Salvador is a developing country. It's a developing economy. We right now we have uh we have um raised funds from two different investors. Both of them were from outside the country.

[00:58:35]Uh the the startup ecosystem is just starting to bubble here in El Salvador.

[00:58:43]We I had the opportunity to be at the Foundry Labs meetup last week talking to some of the uh startup uh founders that are, you know, in the in the very initial stages and telling them about this experience, you know. Yeah, I mean, you're going to be doing the pitch. I I told them they didn't believe me, but then I I I I did the numbers for them, and then they were like, "Wow, he's he's real he's real I mean, he means it.

[00:59:06]We're real." How many times I've done the key one pitch?

[00:59:09]It's about 5,000 times.

[00:59:11]>> Wow.

[00:59:12]>> Because my pitch is, you know, here's a nickel. Do you want free Bitcoin?

[00:59:17]And then, you know, lead people to the machine. So, at every conference, you know, from start to finish, you know, doing it 100 times per day, we've been in over a dozen uh conferences.

[00:59:28]And that's how I met the investors, you know, people who are just walking around.

[00:59:32]Uh one of them here in El Salvador.

[00:59:34]Actually, both of my investors, I met them here in El Salvador because of the Bitcoin ecosystem.

[00:59:40]And you know, just from from an equal uh to using the machine to then if they if it sparks some interest, explaining how it how the business model works, how our company works, and then continue to build on the relationship. So, is it super easy? You know, nothing worth it is super easy.

[00:59:59]But if you're willing to put the leg work and to and to really, you know, make an effort, being from El Salvador in the Bitcoin ecosystem is has been extremely beneficial [clears throat] for us.

[01:00:10]>> I love that.

[01:00:11]Any Any final words? Anything else that you want to leave people with?

[01:00:15]>> Yeah, I mean, if if you're founding a company, you know, don't give up. It's hard, and sometimes it's not hard, sometimes it's very hard.

[01:00:23]Uh but if you really uh one of the one what I was just sharing a few days ago with the Foundry Foundry Labs team.

[01:00:32]And one of the things that I learned at the X Founders reality show, you have to fall in love with the problem you want to solve. If you fall in love with the solution you're building, I mean, you might have, you know, the greatest tech, the you know, beautiful UI. You might have, you know, whatever you want.

[01:00:51]But if if it doesn't solve the problem, if it doesn't fix the problem, then what you have is you know, it's just it's just a toy.

[01:00:59]Might be good for you for a while, but then it just fizzles off.

[01:01:03]But if you fall in love with the problem you want to solve, and you work for it, and you breathe it in, and you understand how it hurts people, you know, why people want this problem being solved, and then you don't you don't care about your solution, you care about their problem, then you're just going to be empathetic to to them and you'll be able to create something that helps people.

[01:01:27]If you're helping people, people will give you money for it cuz they they want that problem solved and you have the solution, then you know, the investment will be will make sense.

[01:01:39]The your customers will pay you for your product because you have built something of value. You have built wealth.

[01:01:49]You know, you cannot make money. Well, sometimes I guess some governments can just decide to make money.

[01:01:56]Uh but as as as a as a as a business founder, what you can create is wealth.

[01:02:02]And the way you create wealth is by creating something that people want. So, if you fall in love with a problem and you and you solve it to the best of your abilities, people will want to support you by giving you money. And that's that's the way to grow a company and that's the way to grow even as a person, I think, by finding people to help.

[01:02:21]>> Love it.

[01:02:22]I think that's a perfect note to end on and uh look forward to to having you back uh on here again next year and hear all the the new exciting things that have happened.

[01:02:31]>> Thank you. Really appreciate the opportunity.