One Killed for Sorcery, the Other for Experience | Deadly Women

Added: 2026-05-12

[00:00:01]She claims to have a special gift.

[00:00:08]She could foresee the future.

[00:00:13]That made people admire her, and she relished that.

[00:00:19]They thought that she was possessed with some power of the occult and the beyond that made her this amazing prophet of doom.

[00:00:29]Tillie Gburek is special, but not in the way her customers think.

[00:00:36]Tillie was on a killing spree.

[00:00:40]She was enjoying killing people.

[00:00:50]An immigrant neighborhood in Northwest Chicago, 1911.

[00:00:58]Little Poland, the area where Tillie was, was a was a several square block area of pretty much just Polish people who were fairly fresh off the boat.

[00:01:12]It was said that uh there were more Poles living here in Chicago at one point than there were in the entire city of Warsaw, Poland.

[00:01:19]Like many in Little Poland, Tillie Gburek lives a precarious existence.

[00:01:32]It's made worse by an idle husband.

[00:01:38]Did you bring my beer?

[00:01:39]>> I didn't bring the beer. I have no money yet.

[00:01:41]>> stupid woman!

[00:01:43]Husband was a drunk and and was a pretty lazy and really just didn't do much of anything. And uh so she ended up supporting them because he only worked every once in a while at odd jobs.

[00:01:55]>> Useless woman.

[00:01:57]Each year of Tillie's unhappy marriage is making her more bitter.

[00:02:04]It was unkindly said about Tillie that she was greasy complexioned, ill-mannered, uh just a thoroughly unpleasant kind of woman to look at.

[00:02:15]And she was made hard by the times that she lived in.

[00:02:21]When Nanny had no idea, she's thinking of how to get out.

[00:02:29]26 years of a tough marriage to a man that had caused her so much grief. And finally, I think something snapped within her.

[00:02:41]One evening, after another long day at work, It's about time you come home.

[00:02:48]You are going TO WORK. I'M SICK OF YOU.

[00:02:50]WORK.

[00:02:51]YOU.

[00:02:52]Tillie stands up for herself. Tillie, what are you doing?

[00:02:57]Stand. You get taken. Get up.

[00:03:00]GET UP.

[00:03:02]I'M SICK OF YOU.

[00:03:04]TAKE THIS. SHE HAD SPENT HER WHOLE life being a downtrodden, beaten kind of person.

[00:03:11]And finally, now she had some power.

[00:03:18]It took a long time for Tillie to stand up for herself, but when she did, she became a new person.

[00:03:31]At age 55, Tillie wants a new life, a new look, and a new career.

[00:03:45]After Tillie broke out of her shell, she had to construct a scenario where she looked like somebody important, that she had a talent no one else did.

[00:03:57]That talent is predicting the future.

[00:04:05]When you go into a dress shop and you order a black dress, obviously a mourning dress, and a shopkeeper asks, "Oh, I'm sorry, when did your husband die?" In two weeks.

[00:04:18]In two weeks.

[00:04:24]This really changed her status in the neighborhood because someone who was a a seer or prophet was someone you didn't want to mess with.

[00:04:34]Writer Troy Taylor says Tillie's self-proclaimed psychic powers gave her something she'd never had before.

[00:04:44]Respect.

[00:04:47]Throughout her life, Tillie was just a plain, ordinary person who who had no real claim to fame. It wasn't until she made these psychic predictions uh of who was going to die that she was really set apart from the rest of the crowd.

[00:05:06]But Tillie's predictions are worthless unless she can make them come true.

[00:05:21]Poisoning is a method women frequently use to dispatch their victims.

[00:05:29]It suited Tillie's personality because she could be in control, she could get close to her victim, she could decide when, where, and how they died.

[00:05:43]Sit.

[00:05:48]Tillie has given her husband of 26 years a lethal dose of arsenic.

[00:05:55]Keep eating.

[00:05:57]Good.

[00:05:59]What it does causes paresthesia. In other words, it causes damage to the nerves in the hands and in the feet.

[00:06:08]Headache, vomiting, uh a feeling of being ill with the flu.

[00:06:14]More. More.

[00:06:15]This is particularly distressing because once it starts, it doesn't go away. It's there day and night, day after day after day.

[00:06:32]In the midst of murder, something unexpected happens.

[00:06:41]Tillie begins to enjoy it.

[00:06:48]She had this very perverse, sadistic glee in watching the death throes, the agonizing death throes of her victims.

[00:07:05]This sadistic glee is the catalyst for Tillie to begin another new career. She was married to her first husband for 26 years before suddenly becoming an overnight serial killer.

[00:07:26]Uh we know it was at least nine, and the newspapers believed it could have been as high as 20.

[00:07:38]20?

[00:07:39]40?

[00:07:41]60?

[00:07:42]A grieving widow beyond suspicion.

[00:07:47]Tillie Gburek has murdered her first husband.

[00:07:51]$200. That's $1,000, man. Now she's cashing in. Hey, are you sure, man?

[00:07:56]>> that's fine. Just give me the money.

[00:07:58]Okay.

[00:08:00]He had an insurance policy, which at that time in the late teens, that that was a lot of money in a poor immigrant neighborhood like Little Poland.

[00:08:09]I think Tillie's first murder was mostly out of convenience. She was tired of her husband, she didn't want him around, and it just so happened that she got $1,000 out of the deal.

[00:08:20]After that, she saw a way to make a living.

[00:08:28]She barely waited until the ground and the earth had settled before she was marrying her next husband.

[00:08:38]This husband dies, too.

[00:08:42]And so does the next.

[00:08:48]Both deaths are predicted by Tillie, and both provide lucrative life insurance payouts.

[00:08:57]But most of the the uh the Polish people who lived in the neighborhood um were very very religious people, very and superstitious people.

[00:09:07]Nobody really was brave enough to go and and tell the police that they thought there was something going on.

[00:09:14]With each death, Tillie's reputation as a fortune teller grows.

[00:09:22]Dare to cross her, and you'll be the subject of a terrifying prophecy.

[00:09:30]future death She would very often whisper in their ear, "You're going to die soon."

[00:09:40]And apparently, all of her predictions were coming true.

[00:09:45]There was one young woman who did notice that Tillie had seen several men die uh in her home, and uh was suspicious, and of course then she died herself.

[00:09:58]By this time, no one in the neighborhood is safe.

[00:10:03]She also got into an argument with some parents of some three little children who also mysteriously died.

[00:10:11]She even poisoned a neighbor's dog that was barking and causing her to lose sleep at night.

[00:10:19]I think Tillie enjoyed the power that wielding life or death over another human being gave her.

[00:10:28]And she enjoyed it.

[00:10:30]It was one thing to kill a husband for his life insurance. It's completely different to kill someone that had angered her.

[00:10:39]The suspicion nobody dares voice is the link between all the deaths.

[00:10:47]Tillie's famous stew.

[00:10:51]Tillie was an accomplished cook.

[00:10:54]Uh it was said that uh she could uh whip up a fabulous meal.

[00:11:05]Perhaps that is what attracts her fourth and final husband.

[00:11:10]Joe Klymac.

[00:11:12]Joe Klymac, who kind of strikes me as being a little clueless.

[00:11:17]My I guess that we today we would say he was very laid-back um and didn't pay much attention to local gossip.

[00:11:25]Joe doesn't realize the woman pretending to nurse him back to health is actually killing him.

[00:11:34]It wasn't till his brother finally said, "You know, I think there's something wrong with you." uh that he realized that he was getting sick. More soup?

[00:11:43]In fact, he never did anything. It was his brother who thought there was something suspicious going on after asking around the neighborhood and finding out that Tillie had already buried several other husbands.

[00:11:56]And for every husband who eats a deadly serving of stew, there's an insurance policy for Tillie to collect on.

[00:12:23]When Joe Klymac's brother alerts the police, they're just in time to prevent Tillie claiming her final victim.

[00:12:34]Joe was probably one bowl away from death of of Tillie's stew.

[00:12:40]When the police showed up at their home on Winchester, it was simmering on the stove.

[00:12:51]The bodies of Tillie's previous husbands are exhumed.

[00:12:57]They each contain enough arsenic to kill four people.

[00:13:03]In the good old days, it was actually quite easy to get away with murder.

[00:13:08]In today's world, with modern forensics, with knowledge of heavy metal poisoning like arsenic, I would say that after one death, we would be on to her.

[00:13:23]On trial for murder, Tillie Gburek becomes a household name across America.

[00:13:32]Her transformation from an unknown working woman is complete.

[00:13:38]She really seemed to enjoy the attention um and I think that that was a big part of why she did what she did.

[00:13:50]She was in the spotlight and she ended up with a life sentence in prison.

[00:13:58]The woman who was so eager to predict a death won't admit to causing any.

[00:14:12]To this day, the exact number of Tillie Gburek's victims is a mystery.

[00:14:21]The number of dead that Tillie left in her wake is a pretty amazing number. Uh we know it was at least nine and the newspapers believed it could have been as high as 20.

[00:14:34]She does definitely rate up there as as I would say that probably the deadliest woman in Chicago history.

[00:14:48]When love goes wrong, there's always casualties.

[00:14:55]I can't imagine what was going through Penny Boudreau's mind in those moments on that dark road.

[00:15:03]I had a daughter roughly the same age.

[00:15:06]It hit home. It was it was awful.

[00:15:13]One cold night in Nova Scotia will forever chill the bone.

[00:15:23]I can't imagine what she would be thinking.

[00:15:27]And frankly, I don't want to.

[00:15:29]I I don't want to think like Penny Boudreau.

[00:15:35]I'm just here to reach out to my daughter, Karissa.

[00:15:41]It's the saddest moment imaginable.

[00:15:45]A mother begging a nation to find her child.

[00:15:50]Please, just reach out to someone.

[00:15:53]Please call us. People saw this woman who was being traumatized by the fact that her child was missing um and they wanted to help.

[00:16:05]12-year-old Karissa Boudreau has been missing for 2 days in terrible cold weather.

[00:16:16]If there's anyone out there who's seen her, please call.

[00:16:19]Her mother, Penny, is desperate.

[00:16:24]She was very tearful. She spoke of wanting her daughter to come home.

[00:16:28]We all love you.

[00:16:31]But it is all a lie.

[00:16:38]Journalist Lisa Brown was at that press conference.

[00:16:43]The winter of 2008 in Bridgewater, Canada.

[00:16:50]Penny appeared to be a very upset, distraught mother who was concerned about her child.

[00:16:57]That's certainly what the community as a whole saw.

[00:17:08]What the community doesn't see is an angry mother constantly at odds with her daughter.

[00:17:16]We are not going home. Just let me out of the car. I'll walk home. You are not getting out of the car. You're ruining my life. Oh, I'm ruining your life.

[00:17:26]Penny's parenting is going badly. You're making me You're making me crazy. You are pushing me. OH MY GOD, JUST LET ME OUT OF THE CAR. When her 12-year-old daughter would be upset, screaming and yelling as 12-year-old girls are prone to do, Penny got right there with her. Mama, I want to go home. You keep PUSHING ME, I TELL YOU. Acting like another 12-year-old, screaming and yelling. Stop screaming at me. YOU JUST KEEP PUSHING ME. I HATE YOU. I hate you.

[00:17:55]This cold night, the arguments will stop.

[00:18:01]She finally drove to a rural road right outside town.

[00:18:07]And told Karissa that if she wanted to get out, now was her chance.

[00:18:17]Karissa got out of the car and Penny tackled her.

[00:18:29]Penny took the twine FROM HER POCKET.

[00:18:35]AND SHE WRAPPED IT AROUND KARISSA'S NECK. She would have attempted to gasp for air at the same time looking into the eyes of her mother.

[00:18:51]Penny reports her daughter missing.

[00:18:56]Initial indication was, "Okay, this is an upset child. She may have run off and she may be hiding with a friend."

[00:19:04]It starts as a routine case for Bridgewater police officer John Collier.

[00:19:12]Usually with our efforts, we are able to locate the young person within 48 to 72 hours. Her friend Sarah is worried sick.

[00:19:21]This didn't happen. Please, just reach out to someone.

[00:19:26]Let us know. The press conference yields few leads.

[00:19:29]>> If there's anyone out there who's seen her, please call. How could it?

[00:19:34]The fact that Penny went in front of a camera and made pleas to the public as the broken-hearted mother I just want to tell you lots of people who love you.

[00:19:45]speaks to her evil nature.

[00:19:55]>> Two weeks later, Karissa's body is found.

[00:20:01]Where and how her mother left her.

[00:20:13]Karissa was found with her jeans pulled partway down one leg, on one leg off, her underwear were down.

[00:20:23]She didn't think the body would be found for quite some time and she believed that people would think that Karissa had been sexually assaulted and that would aid her case.

[00:20:43]Bridgewater is in mourning.

[00:20:47]And in panic at the thought of a sexual predator on the loose.

[00:20:54]This is a community that had not experienced any kind of crime like this.

[00:20:58]Or disappearance like this.

[00:21:00]There was that who did this? Are they are they living amongst us?

[00:21:05]And uh is it going to happen again?

[00:21:19]In January 2008 the Canadian town of Bridgewater, Nova Scotia is shocked by the brutal murder of a young girl.

[00:21:33]There were numerous concerns within the community that uh there was possibly someone who was out there sexually assaulting children.

[00:21:44]But the truth is far more disturbing.

[00:21:57]Look at myself in a state of fright.

[00:22:00]The victim Karissa Boudreau was like any other 12-year-old.

[00:22:09]And so is her mother.

[00:22:12]What the hell have you been saying about me AT SCHOOL? YOU BETTER NOT HAVE BROKEN MY STEREO.

[00:22:15]>> OUT OF THE QUESTION. PENNY'S extreme immaturity is highlighted by the fact that when her daughter would be upset and maybe screaming and YELLING PENNY, rather than acting like the adult, would start screaming AND YELLING ALSO.

[00:22:40]HER BOYFRIEND, VERNON MCUMBER, is tired of the constant arguing.

[00:22:48]Well, that was real constructive, WASN'T IT? DON'T YOU START. I'm supposed to stay in, put up with all this crap?

[00:22:54]WELL, I'VE HAD ENOUGH.

[00:22:56]I'm leaving.

[00:22:58]Vernon, don't say that.

[00:23:00]I'm serious.

[00:23:02]Either she goes or I go.

[00:23:10]He did not mean it by the way of ultimately you should murder, but he meant that she either has to go back to her father or the relationship is over.

[00:23:20]Penny doesn't take any chances.

[00:23:24]To keep her lover she murders her flesh and blood.

[00:23:32]How could you do that? I DID THIS FOR HOW COULD YOU?

[00:23:36]It's a shocking choice that no one can imagine.

[00:23:41]Penny, talk to me. Until there is a surprising breakthrough.

[00:23:46]The neighbors of theirs actually overheard uh Penny Boudreau and Vernon Mcumber arguing in their apartment.

[00:23:52]You gave me an ultimatum.

[00:23:55]I had nothing TO DO WITH THIS.

[00:23:57]You discussed me.

[00:23:59]Mr. Mcumber, of course, making certain statements to the fact of Pen, Pen, why did you do this?

[00:24:04]I did it for us. You said her or me.

[00:24:08]THAT'S NOT WHAT I MEANT, YOU CRAZY [ __ ] You were looking at potentially the mother and Vernon Mcumber being involved in in in Karissa's death.

[00:24:20]Both are arrested on suspicion of murder.

[00:24:25]Although Vernon believes Penny is the murderer he says nothing.

[00:24:39]Without a confession, police pin their hopes on an elaborate sting.

[00:24:48]They had put the undercover operator in first with the boyfriend.

[00:24:55]Became a confident of him.

[00:25:00]Indicated to him that he was part of a cross-country crime organization originating out of Montreal that they could possibly use his help in around this area.

[00:25:22]Once released, the couple is eager to make some easy money.

[00:25:28]Understood.

[00:25:30]They very quickly felt that he had nothing to do with it and then switched the investigation to centering on Penny Boudreau.

[00:25:40]Penny confides to the fictitious crime syndicate.

[00:25:45]Every couple of months they come back and they tell me they found something new.

[00:25:49]Her fear that the police are on her trail.

[00:25:54]You know, I just wish that police vault would blow up or burn down.

[00:25:58]Well, if you get picked for this job, maybe something can be arranged.

[00:26:05]The undercover cop offers her a deal.

[00:26:10]If she kills for them, they will get rid of the police evidence.

[00:26:17]I can do this.

[00:26:20]How do I know you're not going to chicken out at the last moment? A lot of people do.

[00:26:24]I told you I've killed before.

[00:26:27]I can prove it.

[00:26:29]I'll take you where it happened and show you things only I can know.

[00:26:32]Okay. Let's do it.

[00:26:41]Penny walks straight into the police trap.

[00:26:46]And before hidden cameras reveals more than could be imagined.

[00:26:54]She reenacts her brutal crime.

[00:26:59]It was chilling to watch the video tape of how cavalier she discussed the murder of her daughter.

[00:27:19]She wanted to talk about what she did.

[00:27:22]She was proud about what she did.

[00:27:31]And too stupid to remain quiet about it.

[00:27:35]Okay.

[00:27:40]Penny Boudreau seals her own fate.

[00:27:46]She pleads guilty to second degree murder.

[00:27:50]And is sentenced to life in prison.

[00:28:00]There were like 100 people there.

[00:28:02]They stood outside and they jeered and they shouted and they they shouted obscenities at her and they called her names. We've never seen that here.

[00:28:10]People were just angry.

[00:28:14]Tragic thing is a 12-year-old child who hadn't hurt anybody is no longer with us.

[00:28:23]Penny Boudreau is a monster.

[00:28:27]She is the poorest excuse of a mother I've ever seen.