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[00:00:00]is $450 million a day it's losing as a result of the US blockade and President Trump wants oil and gases to come down ahead of the the summer travel season.

[00:00:11]So the first phase of this deal I think is going to happen at some point. The second phase is going to be the very difficult part resolving the nuclear issue. So on that, in an interview with Russian state, a Russian state news outlet, Ibrahim Azizi, a top Iranian official said just today that Thran quote does not intend to transfer its enriched uranium to a third country, which is really at the core of what is really the key sticking point, right?

[00:00:43]What happens with the uranium? How far apart do you think the Trump administration and Iran have been when it comes to what happens to this nuclear material?

[00:00:55]>> I think they're very far apart, Kate. In part because this is what President Trump seemingly cares most about in his own words, the nuclear dust. And the challenge the the dilemma that President Trump has is that he needs to uh extract very strong concessions from Iran in order to justify this incredibly costly war. He can't afford to get a worse deal than he would have three months ago before the war began. And that is going to be a tall order for the president.

[00:01:28]>> But the setting of expectations we have seen over and over again. And as word of possible agreement emerged yesterday around a memorandum of understanding, I was watching you talk about this and you said very clearly that getting everything hammered out, especially on the this this key issue of what to do about the nuclear program, getting it hammered out in 60 days basically just is not going to happen. Why?

[00:01:55]Well, for context, the Obama nuclear deal was a deal that took around two years to negotiate. So, two months is probably quite ambitious. The other issue, Kate, is that >> um you know, this has been a 47year ideological war between America and Iran, and you have a regime which doesn't really prioritize their country's national interests. So on our end, we're prepared to Iran offer Iran pretty significant sanctions, relief, and economic incentives to conduct itself differently. But it's a regime that doesn't want to conduct itself differently. And it's thinking about its own regime survival, not the well-being of its people. And that its nuclear material is a key part of its of its of its uh survival instincts. On another story, an important story we've been following. US officials now say the US and Iran have reached what they describe as a tentative agreement to reopen the street of Hermuz and to begin talks on the nuclear program in Iran. President Trump is in the situation room right now, we're told to make uh what I'm quoting now, a final determination on the deal. The president also posted that the US naval blockade of Iranian ports will quote now be lifted. What's your response to these latest developments?

[00:03:15]>> Well, again, we've seen misdirection and outright lies from the administration uh for a long time. And this deal that they're saying is not a conclusion of the crisis that Donald Trump plunged us on. It's actually a furthering of the disgrace. Because what Donald Trump is doing right now is trying to claw back and just get back to the point we were before this whole crisis started. But the damage is done. The regime is more extreme, not less. The regime still has their highlyenriched uranium, and he has no plan to get it out. He said that that was going to be part of further discussions. What this is just about is the straight of Hormuz who which was not closed before this all began. And my worry here is that this Iranian regime because of this opening is going to be able to receive billions of dollars in oil money that they're going to use to further their lowcost drones that are still plaguing the area. funding of their proxies uh that are doing terrorist activities throughout the Middle East and endangering Americans and ultimately strengthening them to continue to resist what frankly we should have been continuing to do with the Iran deal that Obama made. So this is a president that this is shameful. He is failing and this is no great deal.

[00:04:24]It's a furtherance of the disaster that he created.

[00:04:27]>> Trump just posted on Truth Social and I just going to read the first two sentences for you and get your reaction.

[00:04:33]Senator, Iran must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. The Hormuse Strait must be immediately open, no tolls for unrestricted shipping traffic in both directions. All water mines, bombs, if any, will be terminated. Uh, and then he goes on to explain some more. If all this happens, will you support this agreement?

[00:04:55]>> Well, remember this is my first point.

[00:04:58]Before he took office, the straight of her was open. There was a deal in place in which they pledged never to have a nuclear weapon. We had insight into their milling, their mining, cameras, and spot inspections to ensure that that commitment they made wasn't there. You had a leader in place that created a fatwa against ever having a nuclear weapon. Well, Donald Trump took all of that and blew it up. And we are now in a situation where he's trying to scramble to get back to where we were before he was president. So again, I don't believe him that there's some kind of great bargain that's going to end this war.

[00:05:34]That's why I'm going to continue to fight in the United States Senate to force these war power resolutions because right now we are still in crisis. We weren't in crisis before he was president, a crisis of his of his creation. And most perhaps painful is that every American is paying the cost for his his his incredible disaster at the pump with higher prices and really with the pain that their families are facing economically.

[00:06:00]All right. Happening now, oil prices falling with hopes of a potential deal between the United States and Iran.

[00:06:07]There is said to be a memorandum of understanding that would include reopening the straight of Hormuz, lifting the blockade on Iranian ports, and setting up a future negotiation on Iran's nuclear material. Now, we are waiting to learn if the president will sign off on it. With us now is really the reporter who broke the word of this memorandum of understanding yesterday uh from Axios, CNN political and global affairs analyst Barack Rav. Barack, it's always great to see you. Why don't you give us the latest news you're hearing about what the president thinks so far of this memorandum of understanding, what the holdup might be, what are the considerations?

[00:06:48]>> So, I think that at least as of yesterday, the president was leaning towards signing off on this uh memorandum of understanding. Um, I think there are two main reasons that President Trump is still waiting. The first reason is that he wants to make sure he wants to see that the Iranians are not backing away from what has been agreed upon because the Iranians through the mediators told the US uh on Wednesday already that they're ready to sign and I think President Trump wants to see that they're not walking back and at least for now there's been no official and uh public uh statement by any Iranian official that walks away from what has been published over the last 24 hours. And I think this is something we haven't seen so far because in previous rounds uh Iranian foreign minister Rakji or his spokesman or other Iranian officials came out publicly, openly and officially and said this is not true. We do not see it this time.

[00:07:49]And I think it's interesting. Another thing that I think President Trump is doing, according to what I hear from US officials, he wants to see how this is playing out in domestic in the domestic political debate in the US. And I think we should look at, for example, uh an the editorial board of the Wall Street Journal published yesterday an oped about the deal that had some criticism, but it was very very mild and I think it says a lot about um where um where the hawks, Iran hawks are at the moment.

[00:08:28]They're not attacking this deal with everything they got. They do criticize parts of it >> because US officials say they have reached a tentative agreement to open the straight of Hormuz and start nuclear talks. The question is whether the president will sign off.

[00:08:43]>> I can't guarantee that we're going to get there, but right now I feel pretty good about it. Hopefully, we'll continue to make progress. The president will be in a position where he can endorse the agreement, but obviously uh that's still TBD. So, we're not there yet, but we're very close.

[00:08:57]So, like you said, TBD, this TBD idea would kickstart a 60-day negotiation period to address Iran's nuclear stockpile. President Trump has said, "Look, he's not going to be rushed even if there are midterms coming up."

[00:09:12]>> He is taking a statesmanlike position that he has a a a core belief and he he believes that the most important thing is for Iran never to have a nuclear weapon. So I I believe uh both things can be true that we can do well in the midterms that we perhaps have the makings of a deal here.

[00:09:37]>> So joining the group chat is Democratic Congressman James Wenshaw from Virginia.

[00:09:42]Thank you so much for being here. Um so I wanted to ask you about what this whole conversation around midterms in Iran because I think the argument is that the Iranians watch American media.

[00:09:53]They know the pressure that is on this president. So, are Democrats going to be campaigning on Iran and the war and these things come midterms?

[00:10:02]>> Well, I I guess it remains to be seen where the situation in Iran will stand in the fall, but we know that gas prices have skyrocketed. Unlikely they're going to decline significantly by the fall and I think that's going to be a significant issue. Ward on whether there is final sign off on some kind of a deal between the United States and Iran. And President Trump is said to be weighing a memorandum of understanding that would include reopening the straight of form moves, lifting the blockade on Iranian ports, and setting up a future negotiation. A future negotiation, it's important to note, on Iran's nuclear material. Now, Secretary of State Marco Rubio is set to meet with Pakistani officials. They've been part of the negotiations. Want to get to CNN's Kevin Liptac at the White House this morning on where things stand. Kevin, what are you hearing?

[00:10:47]Yeah, the two sides do seem to be moving closer here, but I have to say it is very difficult to tell whether this is real or whether this is just another mirage. You know, we've been down this road before where uh it appears as if a deal is in hand only to see it all collapse. Now, the way I understand it is that the Iranians came to the US this week, said they were comfortable uh with the text of the plan. President Trump asked for a few more days to decide whether he was going. The breaking news we're following here in Washington is at the White House. President Trump is meeting in the situation room right now to discuss an agreement with Iran. CNN's Kevin Liptac is live at the White House.

[00:11:28]Kevin, what are you hearing from your sources about what's really happening there? Yeah. And you know, the way we understand this has all unfolded is that Iran came uh back to the US negotiators a little bit earlier this week to say that they were comfortable uh with the text of this agreement. President Trump asked his adviserss for a few more days to make a decision on whether to agree to it. Now he is inside the situation room uh making what he calls a final determination on whether to sign off on this memorandum of understanding. You know, we saw just about an hour ago members of the president's national security team arriving here to the White House, including the Secretary of State, the vice president, uh the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. I think something that the president is going to press them on is what specifically has Iran agreed to as part of this understanding. And in his truth social post, he does tick through a number of the points that he is insisting that Iran give in to his demands on including uh that they say that they never be able to have a nuclear weapon. That of course is sort of the underpinning of these negotiations. He says that the straight of Hormuz must be immediately open uh without any tolls. He also says that the naval blockade that the US has had in place on Iranian ports is now lifted.

[00:12:52]And that is interesting because of course the deal hasn't been signed yet, but the president seems to be suggesting uh that the blockade is over. Now when it comes to the highlyenriched uranium which is one of the most contentious issues in all of these discussions the president is suggesting that it will be uh taken possession of by the United States and destroyed. And that is interesting because our understanding had been that this memorandum of understanding would essentially put off the question of what happens to that uh near bombgrade material for further negotiations. you know, for another round of talks over the next 60 days to try and work out some of these thorny issues of Iran's nuclear program. The president here suggesting that there is in fact a solution at hand, which is that the US would take possession of it.

[00:13:41]We have not heard that from Iran. In fact, we have not heard much from Iran at all when it comes to what exactly is in this final text. And that I think will be a key detail before any of this is finalized. Yeah, one of many key details before any of this is finalized.

[00:13:57]Uh, thank you so much Kevin for that excellent reporting. Um, John King, the whole the I mean maybe they'll pull a rabbit out of a hat, but the notion that Iran is suddenly going to say here the United States take all of our inenriched uranium and we're going to open the straight of Hermoose while we're at it.

[00:14:16]Um, it would be fantastic if all of that happened, but the color me skeptical >> uh for for good reasons. U history and facts, even just the facts during this conflict. Look, we have to pay as close attention to this as we can and trust the great reporting of Kevin and rest of our White House team. But facts are facts. The president said this war would be over a few days. It's not. Uh they say there's a ceasefire right now.

[00:14:40]There's things flying and bombing and blowing up all the time. Uh the timelines the president has laid out in the past have simply not held up. Uh the things he has said about the United States taking or getting the nuclear materials in the past have not held up.

[00:14:52]You're right. We should hope for that day. Uh but uh if you put that social post back up, you don't need to do that.

[00:14:58]Most of what's in it is just not factual. It doesn't match up what happened here. So that's the problem we have here. You have a geopolitical crisis, life and death crisis, deep impact on the global economy, and the words of the president of the United States that simply don't pass the smell test most of the time. Can I just add to the skepticism here? First of all, welcome to negotiating with the Iranians and and yes, President Trump says he wants a few more days. Everyone would like a deal. Yes. But as our global affairs analyst Brett McGherk said last night on CNN, and he has been through this a lot, until there's a deal, there's not a deal. Almost near close doesn't count. And this is simply to negotiate another round of talks.

[00:15:44]>> Yeah. All right, everybody.

[00:15:45]>> Right now, President Trump is meeting with his top adviserss in the White House situation room discussing whether to agree to a new deal with Iran. In a post he just posted on social media, Trump says that Iran, and I'm quoting now, must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. End quote, adding that the straight of Hermuz must be immediately open without restrictions. Joining us now to discuss CNN political and national security analyst David Sanger. He's also a White House and national security correspondent for the New York Times.

[00:16:17]And among all of these things, he's also the author of the book New Cold Wars: China's Rise, Russia's invasion, and America's struggle to defend the West.

[00:16:27]David, thanks so much for joining us.

[00:16:29]So, the president is under increasing pressure right now, not only at home, but abroad, to bring this conflict with Iran to an end. How likely is it that he ends up agreeing to these latest developments?

[00:16:41]>> Well, Wolf, I think he'll probably agree to them. The question is what exactly he is agreeing to because the uh the true social that he issued seem to be a mix of things the Iranians have agreed to long ago, things the president would like them to agree to, and things that we don't believe they've yet agreed to.

[00:17:02]So, let's just break it down. The good news is the one that you um quoted, which is uh that Iran must agree that it's never going to build a nuclear weapon. They've long provided that assurance. It's in the first page of the accord that President Obama signed with the or was never signed but agreed to with Iran in 2015.

[00:17:25]So, uh so good news, that one's out of the way. Um after that, the president discussed opening the straight. Well, he said a month and a half ago that that was the condition for uh the ceasefire and of course we had the ceasefire and there's been no opening of the straight.

[00:17:43]We still don't know whether or not the Iranians agree to do that without tolls which is what the president has uh has indicated. And then the third part is he seems to describe an agreement in which the United States would go in and recover the nearbomb grade nuclear material that's buried at Isvahan. And he says destroy it. Well, it can't be destroyed, but it might be able to be down blended so that it's no no longer an immediate uh threat for a weapon. But we just don't know the Iranians have agreed to that yet. in in that uh uh media post that he uh issued just a few minutes ago, he said Iran's enriched uranium will be, and I'm quoting here now, unearthed by the United States, but a top Iranian official told Russian state media that Iran does not intend to transfer its enriched uranium abroad. Is there anything that would compel the Iranians to negotiate on maybe even relinquish what's remaining of its enriched uranium?

[00:18:44]Well, in the uh Obama era agreement, they did actually ship 97% of all the fuel they had around the country uh to the Russians. So, there's precedent for doing that. But you could read the president's uh statement as saying that once they unear this, assuming they're allowed to go do that, it would be what called down blended, essentially diluted in Iran. And that might be an acceptable solution to the US because it would take away the immediate threat. The other question though, Wolf, is what do they do with the other 10 tons of nuclear material that spread around Iran? Do they get all of that? Do they collect it? Do they down blend it or send it out of the country?

[00:19:28]>> Lots of unanswered questions. David Sanger, as usual, thanks very much for joining us. And to our viewers, thanks very much for joining us. And presumably more questions will be asked of Pam Bondi uh during the course of this interview. On another story, an important story we've been following. US officials now say the US and Iran have reached what they describe as a tentative agreement to reopen the street of Hermuz and to begin talks on the nuclear program in Iran. President Trump is in the situation room right now, we're told, to make uh what I'm quoting now, a final determination on the deal.

[00:20:01]The president also posted that the US naval blockade of Iranian ports will quote now be lifted. What's your response to these latest developments?

[00:20:10]>> Well, again, we've seen misdirection and outright lies from the administration uh for a long time. And this deal that they're saying is not a conclusion of the crisis that Donald Trump plunged us on. It's actually a furthering of the disgrace. Because what Donald Trump is doing right now is trying to claw back and just get back to the point we were before this whole crisis started. But the damage is done. The regime is more extreme, not less. The regime still has their highlyenriched uranium, and he has no plan to get it out. He said that that was going to be part of further discussions. What this is just about is the straight of Hormuz who which was not closed before this all began. And my worry here is that this Iranian regime because of this opening is going to be able to receive billions of dollars in oil money that they're going to use to further their lowcost drones that are still plaguing the area. funding of their proxies uh that are doing terrorist activities throughout the Middle East and endangering Americans and ultimately strengthening them to continue to resist what frankly we should have been continuing to do with the Iran deal that Obama made. So this is a president that this is shameful. He is failing and this is no great deal.

[00:21:19]It's a furtherance of the disaster that he created.

[00:21:22]>> Trump just posted on Truth Social and I just going to read the first two sentences for you and get your reaction.

[00:21:28]Senator, Iran must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. The Hormuz Strait must be immediately open, no tolls for unrestricted shipping traffic in both directions. All water mines, bombs, if any, will be terminated. Uh, and then he goes on to explain some more. If all this happens, will you support this agreement?

[00:21:50]>> Well, remember this is my first point.

[00:21:53]Before he took office, the straight of her was open. There was a deal in place in which they pledged never to have a nuclear weapon. We had insight into their milling, their mining, cameras, and spot inspections to ensure that that commitment they made wasn't there. You had a leader in place that created a fatwa against ever having a nuclear weapon. Well, Donald Trump took all of that and blew it up. And we are now in a situation where he's trying to scramble to get back to where we were before he was president. So again, I don't believe him that there's some kind of great bargain that's going to end this war.

[00:22:29]That's why I'm going to continue to fight in the United States Senate to force these war power resolutions because right now we are still in crisis. We weren't in crisis before he was president. A crisis of his of his creation. And most perhaps painful is that every American is paying the cost for his his his incredible disaster at the pump with higher prices and really with the pain that their families are facing economically.

[00:22:55]>> On another story, an important story we've been following, US officials now say the US and Iran have reached what they describe as a tentative agreement to reopen the street of Hermuz and to begin talks on the nuclear program in Iran. President Trump is in the situation room right now, we're told to make uh what I'm quoting now, a final determination on the deal. The president also posted that the US naval blockade of Iranian ports will quote now be lifted. What's your response to these latest developments?

[00:23:25]>> Well, again, we've seen misdirection and outright lies from the administration uh for a long time. And this deal that they're saying is not a conclusion of the crisis that Donald Trump plunged us on. It's actually a furthering of the disgrace because what Donald Trump is doing right now is trying to claw back and just get back to the point we were before this whole crisis started. But the damage is done. The regime is more extreme, not less. The regime still has their highlyenriched uranium and he has no plan to get it out. He said that that was going to be part of further discussions. What this is just about is the straight of Hormuz who which was not closed before this all began. And my worry here is that this Iranian regime because of this opening is going to be able to receive billions of dollars in oil money that they're going to use to further their lowcost drones that are still plaguing the area, funding of their proxies uh that are doing terrorist activities throughout the Middle East and endangering Americans and ultimately strengthening them to continue to resist what frankly we should have been continuing to do with the Iran deal that Obama made. So this is a president that this is shameful. He is failing and this is no great deal.

[00:24:34]It's a furtherance of the disaster that he created.

[00:24:37]>> Trump just posted on Truth Social and I just going to read the first two sentences for you and get your reaction.

[00:24:43]Senator, Iran must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. The Hormuse Strait must be immediately open.

[00:24:51]No tolls for unrestricted shipping traffic in both directions. all water mines, bombs, if any, will be terminated. Uh, and then he goes on to explain some more. If all this happens, will you support this agreement?

[00:25:05]>> Well, remember this is my first point.

[00:25:08]Before he took office, the straight of hermuz was open. There was a deal in place in which they pledged never to have a nuclear weapon. We had insight into their milling, their mining, cameras, and spot inspections to ensure that that commitment they made wasn't there. You had a leader in place that created a fatwa against ever having a nuclear weapon. Well, Donald Trump took all of that and blew it up and we are now in a situation where he's trying to scramble to get back to where we were before he was president. So again, I don't believe him that there's some kind of great bargain that's going to end this war. That's why I'm going to continue to fight in the United States Senate to force these war power resolutions because right now we are still in crisis. We weren't in crisis before he was president. A crisis of his of his creation. And most perhaps painful is that every American is paying the cost for his his his incredible disaster at the pump with higher prices and really with the pain that their families are facing economically.

[00:26:10]>> All right. happening now. Oil prices falling with hopes of a potential deal between the United States and Iran.

[00:26:17]There is said to be a memorandum of understanding that would include reopening the straight of Hormuz, lifting the blockade on Iranian ports, and setting up a future negotiation on Iran's nuclear material. Now, we are waiting to learn if the president will sign off on it. With us now is really the reporter who broke the word of this memorandum of understanding yesterday uh from Axios, CNN political and global affairs analyst Barack Ravi. Barack, it's always great to see you. Why don't you give us the latest news you're hearing about what the president thinks so far of this memorandum of understanding, what the holdup might be, what are the considerations?

[00:26:58]So I think that at least as of yesterday the president was leaning towards signing off on this uh memorandum of understanding. Um I think there are two main reasons that President Trump is still waiting. The first reason is that he wants to make sure he wants to see that the Iranians are not backing away from what has been agreed upon because the Iranians through the mediators told the US uh on Wednesday already that they're ready to sign and I think President Trump wants to see that they're not uh walking back and at least for now there's been no official and uh public uh statement by any Iranian official that walks away from what has been published over the last 24 hours.

[00:27:45]And I think this is something we haven't seen so far because in previous rounds uh Iranian foreign minister Iraqi or his spokesman or other Iranian officials came out publicly, openly and officially and said this is not true. We do not see it this time. And I think it's interesting. Another thing that I think President Trump is doing, according to what I hear from US officials, he wants to see how this is playing out in domestic in the domestic political debate in the US. And I think we should look at, for example, uh an the editorial board of the Wall Street Journal published yesterday an op-ed about the deal that had some criticism, but it was very very mild and I think it says a lot about um where um where the hawks, Iran hawks are at the moment.

[00:28:38]They're not attacking this deal with everything they got. They do criticize parts of it >> because US officials say they have reached a tentative agreement to open the straight of Hormuz and start nuclear talks. The question is whether the president will sign off.

[00:28:53]>> I can't guarantee that we're going to get there, but right now I feel pretty good about it. Hopefully, we'll continue to make progress. The president will be in a position where he can endorse the agreement, but obviously uh that's still TBD. So, we're not there yet, but we're very close. So, like you said, TBD, this TBD idea would kickstart a 60-day negotiation period to address Iran's nuclear stockpile. President Trump has said, "Look, he's not going to be rushed even if there are midterms coming up."

[00:29:22]>> He is taking a statesmanlike position that he has a a a core belief and he he believes that the most important thing is for Iran never to have a nuclear weapon. So I I believe uh both things can be true that we can do well in the midterms that we perhaps have the makings of a deal here.

[00:29:47]>> So joining the group chat is Democratic Congressman James Wenshaw from Virginia.

[00:29:52]Thank you so much for being here. Um so I wanted to ask you about what this whole conversation around midterms in Iran because I think the argument is that the Iranians watch American media.

[00:30:03]They know the pressure that is on this president. So, are Democrats going to be campaigning on Iran and the war and these things come midterms?

[00:30:11]>> Well, I I guess it remains to be seen where the situation in Iran will stand in the fall, but we know that gas prices have skyrocketed. Unlikely they're going to decline significantly by the fall and I think that's going to be a significant issue. Ward on whether there is final sign off on some kind of a deal between the United States and Iran. President Trump is said to be weighing a memorandum of understanding that would include reopening the straight of form moves, lifting the blockade on Iranian ports, and setting up a future negotiation. A future negotiation, it's important to note, on Iran's nuclear material. Now, Secretary State Marco Rubio is set to meet with Pakistani officials. They've been part of the negotiations. Want to get you CNN's Kevin Lipac at the White House this morning on where things stand. Kevin, what are you hearing?

[00:30:57]Yeah, the two sides do seem to be moving closer here, but I have to say it is very difficult to tell whether this is real or whether this is just another mirage. You know, we've been down this road before where uh it appears as if a deal is in hand only to see it all collapse. Now, the way I understand it is that the Iranians came to the US this week, said they were comfortable uh with the text of the plan. President Trump asked for a few more days to decide whether he was going to sign off. We heard from JD Vance, the vice president who has been leading these negotiations yesterday. He described it as not quite finalized yet. Listen here.

[00:31:37]>> Well, I think it's hard to say exactly when or if the president is going to sign theou. We're going back and forth on a couple of language points. I do think that we've made a lot of progress here. It's very clear that I think uh the Iranians uh they want a deal and they want to open the streets of Hormuz.

[00:31:51]We want them to open the Straits of Hormuz. There are a couple of issues on uh the nuclear uh stuff, the the highlyenriched stockpile and also the question enrichment. So, you know, we're going back and forth with them.

[00:32:05]>> So, the nuclear stuff has been the thorniest part of all of these talks.

[00:32:09]The plan uh would push some of those conversations into a future negotiation.

[00:32:14]In particular, what will become of Iran's stockpile of highlyenriched uranium? Will it be destroyed in Iran?

[00:32:21]Will it be handed over to the US? Will it go to a third country? That will be decided in the future negotiations. Now, according to US official, uh Iran has part of this deal would reopen the straight of Hormuz, no tolls, unrestricted uh to traffic and would remove the mines that it has placed in that waterway over the next 30 days. The US blockade on Iranian ports would be lifted progressively as the US sees progress on that front. And so a lot of moving parts here at this point. Not clear yet that President Trump or the Supreme Leader will sign off.

[00:32:56]>> No, of course we're waiting for that. It was also just interesting to hear the vice president and the language he used in acknowledgement of how much power and control Iran does have over the Straight Hormuz at the moment. Kevin Lipac, great reporting from the White House as always. Kate.

[00:33:08]>> Yeah. Joining us right now is Kareem Sajapore. He's a senior fellow at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Kareem, thank you for getting up this morning for us. you know, as Kevin was kind of uh putting it very well very well and simply which is is this real or is this another mirage? What's the sense you're getting?

[00:33:26]I I think Kate at some point whether it's this week or next week um or or the following week um we will see a phase one deal which is essentially for both parties to end their mutual blockade of the straight of Hormuz because Iran's economy is really suffering perhaps as much as $450 million a day it's losing as a result of the US blockade and President Trump wants oil and gases to come down ahead of the the summer travel season. So the first phase of this deal I think is going to happen at some point. The second phase is going to be the very difficult part resolving the nuclear issue. So on that, in an interview with Russian state, a Russian state news outlet, Ibrahim Azizi, a top Iranian official, said just today that Thran quote does not intend to transfer its enriched uranium to a third country, which is really at the core of what is really the key sticking point, right?

[00:34:28]What happens with the uranium? How far apart do you think the Trump administration and Iran have been when it comes to what happens to this nuclear material?

[00:34:40]>> I think they're very far apart, Kate. In part because this is what President Trump seemingly cares most about in his own words, the nuclear dust. And the challenge the the dilemma that President Trump has is that he needs to uh extract very strong concessions from Iran in order to justify this incredibly costly war. He can't afford to get a worse deal than he would have three months ago before the war began. And that is going to be a tall order for the president.

[00:35:13]>> But the setting of expectations we have seen over and over again. And as word of possible agreement emerged yesterday around a memorandum of understanding, I was watching you talk about this and you said very clearly that getting everything hammered out, especially on the this this key issue of what to do about the nuclear program, getting it hammered out in 60 days basically just is not going to happen. Why?

[00:35:40]Well, for context, the Obama nuclear deal was a deal that took around two years to negotiate. So, two months is probably quite ambitious. The other issue, Kate, is that >> um you know, this has been a 47year ideological war between America and Iran and you have a regime which doesn't really prioritize their country's national interests. So on our end, we're prepared to Iran offer Iran pretty significant sanctions, relief, and economic incentives to conduct itself differently, but it's a regime that doesn't want to conduct itself differently. And it's thinking about its own regime survival, not the well-being of its people. And that its nuclear material is a key part of its of its of its uh survival instincts.

[00:36:30]>> The breaking news we're following here in Washington is at the White House.

[00:36:33]President Trump is meeting in the situation room right now to discuss an agreement with Iran. CNN's Kevin Liptac is live at the White House. Kevin, what are you hearing from your sources about what's really happening there?

[00:36:46]>> Yeah, and you know, the way we understand this has all unfolded is that Iran came uh back to the US negotiators a little bit earlier this week to say that they were comfortable uh with the text of this agreement. President Trump asked his adviserss for a few more days to make a decision on whether to agree to it. Now he is inside the situation room making what he calls a final determination on whether to sign off on this memorandum of understanding. You know, we saw just about an hour ago members of the president's national security team arriving here to the White House, including the Secretary of State, the vice president, uh the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. I think something that the president is going to press them on is what specifically has Iran agreed to as part of this understanding. And in his truth social post, he does tick through a number of the points that he is insisting that Iran give in to his demands on including uh that they say that they never be able to have a nuclear weapon. That of course is sort of the underpinning of these negotiations. He says that the straight of Hormuz must be immediately open without any tolls. He also says that the naval blockade that the US has had in place on Iranian ports is now lifted.

[00:38:06]And that is interesting because of course the deal hasn't been signed yet, but the president seems to be suggesting uh that the blockade is over. Now when it comes to the highlyenriched uranium which is one of the most contentious issues in all of these discussions the president is suggesting that it will be uh taken possession of by the United States and destroyed. And that is interesting because our understanding had been that this memorandum of understanding would essentially put off the question of what happens to that near bombgrade material for further negotiations. You know, for another round of talks over the next 60 days to try and work out some of these thorny issues of Iran's nuclear program. The president here suggesting that there is in fact a solution at hand, which is that the US would take possession of it.

[00:38:55]We have not heard that from Iran. In fact, we have not heard much from Iran at all when it comes to what exactly is in this final text. And that I think will be a key detail before any of this is finalized.

[00:39:07]>> Yeah, one of many key details before any of this is finalized. Uh thank you so much Kevin for that excellent reporting.

[00:39:14]Um, John King, the whole the I mean, maybe they'll pull a rabbit out of a hat, but the notion that Iran is suddenly going to say, "Here, the United States, take all of our enriched uranium, and we're going to open the straight up hermoose while we're at it."

[00:39:30]Um, it would be fantastic if all of that happened, but the color me skeptical.

[00:39:37]>> Uh, for for good reasons, history and facts, even just the facts during this conflict. Look, we have to pay as close attention to this as we can and trust the great reporting of Kevin and rest of our White House team, but facts are facts. The president said this war would be over in a few days. It's not. Uh they say there's a ceasefire right now.

[00:39:54]There's things flying and bombing and blowing up all the time. Uh the timelines the president has laid out in the past have simply not held up. Uh the things he has said about the United States taking or getting the nuclear materials in the past have not held up.

[00:40:07]You're right. We should hope for that day. Uh but uh if you put that true social post back up, you don't need to do that. Most of what's in it is just not factual. It doesn't match up what happened here. So that's the problem we have here. You have a geopolitical crisis, life and death crisis, deep impact on the global economy, and the words of the president of the United States that simply don't pass the smell test most of the time.

[00:40:26]>> Can I just add to the skepticism here?

[00:40:29]First of all, welcome to negotiating with the Iranians. And and yes, President Trump says he wants a few more days. Everyone would like a deal. Yes.

[00:40:40]But as our global affairs analyst Brett McGherk said last night on CNN, and he has been through this a lot, until there's a deal, there's not a deal.

[00:40:52]Almost near close. Doesn't count. And this is simply to negotiate another round of talks.

[00:40:59]>> Yeah. All right, everybody. Right now, President Trump is meeting with his top adviserss in the White House situation room, discussing whether to agree to a new deal with Iran. In a post he just posted on social media, Trump says that Iran, and I'm quoting now, must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb, end quote, adding that the straight of Hermuz must be immediately open without restrictions.

[00:41:23]Joining us now to discuss, CNN political and national security analyst David Sanger. He's also a White House and national security correspondent for the New York Times. And among all of these things, he's also the author of the book New Cold Wars: China's Rise, Russia's invasion, and America's struggle to defend the West. David, thanks so much for joining us. So, the president is under increasing pressure right now, not only at home, but abroad, to bring this conflict with Iran to an end. How likely is it that he ends up agreeing to these latest developments?

[00:41:56]Well, Wolf, I think he'll probably agree to them. The question is what exactly he is agreeing to because the uh the true social that he issued seem to be a mix of things the Iranians have agreed to long ago, things the president would like them to agree to, and things that we don't believe they've yet agreed to.

[00:42:17]So, let's just break it down. The good news is the one that you um quoted, which is uh that Iran must agree that it's never going to build a nuclear weapon. They've long provided that assurance. It's in the first page of the accord that President Obama signed with the or was never signed but agreed to with Iran in 2015.

[00:42:40]So, uh so good news, that one's out of the way. Um after that, the president discussed opening the straight. Well, he said a month and a half ago that that was the condition for uh the ceasefire and of course we had the ceasefire and there's been no opening of the straight.

[00:42:58]We still don't know whether or not the Iranians agree to do that without tolls which is what the president has uh has indicated. And then the third part is he seems to describe an agreement in which the United States would go in and recover the nearbomb grade nuclear material that's buried at Isvahan. And he says destroy it. Well, it can't be destroyed, but it might be able to be down blended so that it's no longer an immediate uh threat for a weapon. But we just don't know the Iranians have agreed to that yet. in in that uh uh media post that he issued just a few minutes ago, he said Iran's enriched uranium will be, and I'm quoting here now, unearthed by the United States, but a top Iranian official told Russian state media that Iran does not intend to transfer its enriched uranium abroad. Is there anything that would compel the Iranians to negotiate on maybe even relinquish what's remaining of its enriched uranium?

[00:43:58]Well, in the uh Obama era agreement, they did actually ship 97% of all the fuel they had around the country uh to the Russians. So, there's precedent for doing that. But you could read the president's uh statement as saying that once they unearth this, assuming they're allowed to go do that, it would be what called down blended, essentially diluted in Iran. And that might be an acceptable solution to the US because it would take away the immediate threat. The other question though, Wolf, is what do they do with the other 10 tons of nuclear material that spread around Iran? Do they get all of that? Do they collect it? Do they down blend it or send it out of the country?

[00:44:43]>> Lots of unanswered questions. David Sanger, as usual, thanks very much for joining us. And to our viewers, thanks very much for joining us. Presumably, more questions will be asked of Pam Bondi uh during the course of this interview. On another story, an important story we've been following. US officials now say the US and Iran have reached what they describe as a tentative agreement to reopen the street of Hermuz and to begin talks on the nuclear program in Iran. President Trump is in the situation room right now, we're told to make uh what I'm quoting now, a final determination on the deal.

[00:45:15]The president also posted that the US naval blockade of Iranian ports will quote now be lifted. What's your response to these latest developments?

[00:45:24]>> Well, again, we've seen misdirection and outright lies from the administration uh for a long time. And this deal that they're saying is not a conclusion of the crisis that Donald Trump plunged us on. It's actually a furthering of the disgrace. Because what Donald Trump is doing right now is trying to claw back and just get back to the point we were before this whole crisis started. But the damage is done. The regime is more extreme, not less. The regime still has their highlyenriched uranium, and he has no plan to get it out. He said that that was going to be part of further discussions. What this is just about is the street of Hormuz who which was not closed before this all began. And my worry here is that this Iranian regime because of this opening is going to be able to receive billions of dollars in oil money that they're going to use to further their lowcost drones that are still plaguing the area. funding of their proxies uh that are doing terrorist activities throughout the Middle East and endangering Americans and should have been continuing to do with the Iran deal that Obama made. So, this is a president that this is shameful. He is failing and this is no great deal. It's a furtherance of the disaster that he created. Trump just posted on Truth Social and I just going to read the first two sentences for you and get your reaction. Senator, Iran must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. The Hormuse Strait must be immediately open. No tolls for unrestricted shipping traffic in both directions. All water mines, bombs, if any, will be terminated. Uh and then he goes on to explain some more. If all this happens, will you support this agreement?

[00:46:59]>> Well, remember this is my first point.

[00:47:02]Before he took office, the straight of her was open. There was a deal in place in which they pledged never to have a nuclear weapon. We had insight into their milling, their mining, cameras, and spot inspections to ensure that that commitment they made wasn't there. You had a leader in place that created a fatwa against ever having a nuclear weapon. Well, Donald Trump took all of that and blew it up and we are now in a situation where he's trying to scramble to get back to where we were before he was president. So again, I don't believe him that there's some kind of great bargain that's going to end this war.

[00:47:38]That's why I'm going to continue to fight in the United States Senate to force these war power resolutions because right now we are still in crisis. We weren't in crisis before he was president. A crisis of his of his creation. And most perhaps painful is that every American is paying the cost for his his his incredible disaster at the pump with higher prices and really with the pain that their families are facing economically.

[00:48:04]>> On another story, an important story we've been following. US officials now say the US and Iran have reached what they describe as a tentative agreement to reopen the street of Hermuz and to begin talks on the nuclear program in Iran. President Trump is in the situation room right now, we're told to make uh what I'm quoting now a final determination on the deal. The president also posted that the US naval blockade of Iranian ports will quote now be lifted. What's your response to these latest developments? Well, again, we've seen misdirection and outright lies from the administration uh for a long time.

[00:48:40]And this deal that they're saying is not a conclusion of the crisis that Donald Trump plunged us on. It's actually a furthering of the disgrace. Because what Donald Trump is doing right now is trying to claw back and just get back to the point we were before this whole crisis started. But the damage is done.

[00:48:55]The regime is more extreme, not less.

[00:48:57]The regime still has their highlyenriched uranium, and he has no plan to get it out. He said that that was going to be part of further discussions. What this is just about is the straight of Hormuz who which was not closed before this all began. And my worry here is that this Iranian regime because of this opening is going to be able to receive billions of dollars in oil money that they're going to use to further their lowcost drones that are still plaguing the area. funding of their proxies uh that are doing terrorist activities throughout the Middle East and endangering Americans and ultimately strengthening them to continue to resist what frankly we should have been continuing to do with the Iran deal that Obama made. So this is a president that this is shameful. He is failing and this is no great deal.

[00:49:44]It's a furtherance of the disaster that he created.

[00:49:47]>> Trump just posted on Truth Social and I just going to read the first two sentences for you and get your reaction.

[00:49:53]Senator, Iran must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb. The Hormuse Strait must be immediately open, no tolls for unrestricted shipping traffic in both directions. All water mines, bombs, if any, will be terminated. Uh, and then he goes, >> "Just a short time ago, President Trump posted on Truth Social that he is quote meeting now in the situation room at the White House to make a final determination on a new Iran peace deal."

[00:50:19]After weeks of negotiations, Trump is weighing a major breakthrough that would extend the current ceasefire and reopen the Strait of Hormuz. The deal would set up a future negotiation on Iran's nuclear material, too. Let's discuss with retired Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton. He is a CNN military analyst.

[00:50:35]Colonel, great to see you as always. So, it appears that at this point we're in a bit of a staredown because the US sources at the White House have indicated that President Trump doesn't intend to sign this until the Ayatollah has signed it. Iranian officials meantime have said that there will be no action until there is a step by the White House. So I wonder what are you watching for to find out when one of those two things happen?

[00:50:58]>> Yeah, I think that's uh that's an excellent question, Boris, because one of the things we have to watch for is what kind of military activity uh the US is going to be conducting. You know, if they're going is there going to be something going on here in the Gulf in the Straight of Hormuz or the Gulf of Oman? Is there something going on in the northern part of the Persian Gulf like right around here at Car Island? You know, those are the kinds of things that could potentially indicate whether or not there's going to be some kind of a signature or whether there's going to be military pressure put on the Iranians because what they have to do is one of the things that the Iranians are going to demand is a cessation of the blockade. And you here you have all the the ports, you have the container terminals on the Iranian coast, you have their sea and river ports. All of these are critical to the Iranian economy. And if the blockade isn't removed, that's going to be a real problem for the Iranians. that may slow down any processes that they have in approving any kind of agreement with the US. I >> I was looking closely at the president's statement and he effectively told the folks that have been stuck in the Persian Gulf for quite a while, all those vessels, that they should get ready to go home, saying that the blockade would now end, but it wasn't clear if he meant that it would end upon the deal being signed or if it was actually that the US was now moving folks out of the way. He also said that the US along with Iran Iran's uh help and this uh observance of the IAEA would remove the enriched uranium that's buried in underground in Iran. If that does come to fruition, what does that look like?

[00:52:28]>> Yeah, that's a really good question, Boris, because uh the area that they're looking at here is really Esvahan. So this uh this area right in here is basically going to be the area where we believe the highlyenriched uranium is is buried. So in this particular case, what they'll have to do is they'll have to if the US is going to remove this, they have to have cooperation from the Iranians. Uh that's uh you know, unless we're going in using military force, which is not the purpose of a ceasefire agreement, obviously, uh we're going to end up in a situation where uh the Iranians are going to have to cooperate.

[00:53:01]There's going to have to be an inspection mechanism. They're going to have to be all kinds of things put together and it requires a lot of detailed work and what we see right now doesn't indicate that that detailed work has happened. I, you know, we could be wrong about that because that might not be public. But what could happen is there'll be a lot of negotiations after even this agreement is signed uh either by the Ayatollah or uh by the president or hopefully by both if if they're going on that along that route.

[00:53:26]>> There's been a disagreement at least publicly. We don't know what's been said privately to this point about whether or not Iran would agree to actually having that material removed from Iranian territory, whether the US would accept that it might go to a third party. Which do you imagine might be the most effective course of action to ensure that whatever Iran decides to do with future nuclear capability is observed closely and that they may not just have access to undo the process of diluting that highlyenriched uranium.

[00:53:56]>> Yeah. So what that points to is exactly what you said in your question. Observe closely. There has to be an inspection mechanism that handles all of these areas. So what you're looking at here, you know, are the sites that you have the research facilities. They're going to be critical. And then of course the enrichment facilities. Both of these elements are incredibly critical to determine whether or not the Iranians are actually moving forward or regressing in their nuclear designs, in their nuclear weapons uh building capacity. So if you're talking about the highlyenriched uranium, one possibility in addition to removing it from Iran itself, either to a third country or to the US, the other thing is to minimize its capacity, its potency in Iran itself and render it basically useless at least temporarily uh in the making of a bomb.

[00:54:42]Uh so that is the kind of thing that uh that would have to happen but again that would would require a major inspection regime and uh that would have to be done usually through the atomic international atomic energy agency or you know some other party that has the capability of really assessing whether or not the nuclear capabilities are there and whether or not they've been removed because uh Iran's a vast country and there's a lot of things that they can do that are not public knowledge.

[00:55:09]>> Yeah. The breaking news we're following here in Washington is at the White House. President Trump is meeting in the situation room right now to discuss an agreement with Iran. CNN's Kevin Liptac is live at the White House. Kevin, what are you hearing from your sources about what's really happening there? Yeah. And you know, the way we understand this has all unfolded is that Iran came uh back to the US negotiators a little bit earlier this week to say that they were comfortable uh with the text of this agreement. President Trump asked his adviserss for a few more days to make a decision on whether to agree to it. Now he is inside the situation room uh making what he calls a final determination on whether to sign off on this memorandum of understanding. You know, we saw just about an hour ago members of the president's national security team arriving here to the White House, including the Secretary of State, the vice president, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. I think something that the president is going to press them on is what specifically has Iran agreed to as part of this understanding.

[00:56:17]And in his truth social post, he does tick through a number of the points that he is insisting that Iran give into his demands on including uh that they say that they never be able to have a nuclear weapon. That of course is sort of the underpinning of these negotiations. He says that the straight of Hormuz must be immediately open uh without any tolls. He also says that the naval blockade that the US has had in place on Iranian ports is now lifted.

[00:56:46]And that is interesting because of course the deal hasn't been signed yet, but the president seems to be suggesting uh that the blockade is over. Now, when it comes to the highlyenriched uranium, which is one of the most contentious issues in all of these discussions, the president is suggesting that it will be uh taken possession of by the United States and destroyed. And that is interesting because our understanding had been that this memorandum of understanding would essentially put off the question of what happens to that uh near bombgrade material for further negotiations, you know, for another round of talks over the next 60 days to try and work out some of these thorny issues of Iran's nuclear program. The president here suggesting that there is in fact a solution at hand, which is that the US would take possession of it.

[00:57:35]We have not heard that from Iran. In fact, we have not heard much from Iran at all when it comes to what exactly is in this final text. And that I think will be a key detail before any of this is finalized.

[00:57:47]>> Yeah, one of many key details before any of this is finalized. Uh thank you so much Kevin for that excellent reporting.

[00:57:54]Um, John King, the whole the I mean, maybe they'll pull a rabbit out of a hat, but the notion that Iran is suddenly going to say, "Here, the United States, take all of our inriched uranium, and we're going to open the straight of Hermoose while we're at it."

[00:58:10]Um, it would be fantastic if all of that happened, but the color me skeptical.

[00:58:17]>> Uh, for for good reasons, history and facts, even just the facts during this conflict. Look, we have to pay as close attention to this as we can and trust the great reporting of Kevin and rest of our White House team, but facts are facts. The president said this war would be over in a few days. It's not. Uh they say there's a ceasefire right now.

[00:58:34]There's things flying and bombing and blowing up all the time. Uh the timelines the president has laid out in the past have simply not held up. Uh the things he has said about the United States taking or getting the nuclear materials in the past have not held up.

[00:58:46]You're right. We should hope for that day. Uh but uh if you put that true social post back up, you don't need to do that. Most of what's in it is just not factual. It doesn't match up what happened here. So that's the problem we have here. You have a geopolitical crisis, life and death crisis, deep impact on the global economy, and the words of the president of the United States that simply don't pass the smell test most of the time.

[00:59:05]>> Can I just add to the skepticism here?

[00:59:09]First of all, welcome to negotiating with the Iranians and and yes, President Trump says he wants a few more days.

[00:59:17]Everyone would like a deal. Yes. But as our global affairs analyst Brett McGherk said last night on CNN, and he has been through this a lot, until there's a deal, there's not a deal. Almost near close. Doesn't count. And this is simply to negotiate another round of talks.

[00:59:38]>> Yeah. All right, everybody. Right now, President Trump is meeting with his top adviserss in the White House situation room, discussing whether to agree to a new deal with Iran. In a post he just posted on social media, Trump says that Iran, and I'm quoting now, must agree that they will never have a nuclear weapon or bomb, end quote, adding that the straight of Hermuz must be immediately open without restrictions.

[01:00:02]Joining us now to discuss, CNN political and national security analyst David Sanger. He's also a White House and national security correspondent for the New York Times. And among all of these things, he's also the author of the book New Cold Wars: China's Rise, Russia's Invasion, and America's Struggle to Defend the West. David, thanks so much for joining us. So, the president is under increasing pressure right now, not only at home, but abroad, to bring this conflict with Iran to an end. How likely is it that he ends up agreeing to these latest developments?

[01:00:35]Well, Wolf, I think he'll probably agree to them. The question is what exactly he is agreeing to because the uh the true social that he issued seem to be a mix of things the Iranians have agreed to long ago, things the president would like them to agree to, and things that we don't believe they've yet agreed to.

[01:00:56]So, let's just break it down. The good news is the one that you um quoted, which is uh that Iran must agree that it's never going to build a nuclear weapon. They've long provided that assurance. It's in the first page of the accord that President Obama signed with the or was never signed but agreed to with Iran in 2015.

[01:01:19]So, uh so good news, that one's out of the way. Um after that, the president discussed opening the straight. Well, he said a month and a half ago that that was the condition for uh the ceasefire and of course we had the ceasefire and there's been no opening of the straight.

[01:01:37]We still don't know whether or not the Iranians agree to do that without tolls which is what the president has uh has indicated. And then the third part is he seems to describe an agreement in which the United States would go in and recover the nearbomb grade nuclear material that's buried at Isfahan. And he says destroy it. Well, it can't be destroyed, but it might be able to be down blended so that it's no no longer an immediate uh threat for a weapon. But we just don't know the Iranians have agreed to that yet. in in that uh uh media post that he uh issued just a few minutes ago, he said Iran's enriched uranium will be, and I'm quoting here now, unearthed by the United States. But a top Iranian official told Russian state media that Iran does not intend to transfer its enriched uranium abroad. Is there