The Insane Probability Math Behind Cosmic Fine-Tuning

[00:00:00]Welcome to ID the future. I'm your host, Andrew McDermott. Hey, every so often on the podcast, we like to rebroadcast conversations from ID scientists and scholars that air on other podcasts and shows. So, we've got a treat for you today. Steven Meyer recently sat down for his second interview on Piers Morgan Uncensored. Now, last time he talked about scientific evidence for the existence of God. On this goound, he explores science, faith, and the very origins of the cosmos with peers. Meer unpacks some of the evidence explored in the new documentary film, The Story of Everything. From the digital code embedded in our DNA to the precise fine-tuning of the laws of the universe, Meer argues that the most common sense explanation for our existence isn't blind, purposeless processes. It's intentional design. So without further ado, here's Dr. Steven Meyer with Piers Morgan.

[00:00:58]>> What are we looking at here? I mean, for those who are not as skilled in this kind of thing as as you are, what are we looking at?

[00:01:04]>> Molecular biologists will kind of [music] start out wax lyrical and describe the interior workings of the cell as something like an automated factory run by digital code in which the code is processed by little nano machines. And it's automated to a degree that it's just it's it's [music] just mind-blowing. The God hypothesis provides, in my view, and that of many scientists and [music] philosophers, the best explanation of the origin of the universe.

[00:01:31]>> It's fair to say that this moment of Russell Brand searching for a Bible verse during my interview with him got a lot of pickup, especially from those who are skeptical about those who purport to believe in God. However, a new movie might counteract such cynicism. The story of everything features some of the world's most eminent science brains who argue that far from being mere cosmic chance, the universe has in fact been designed by an intelligent creator.

[00:01:54]Here's a taster.

[00:01:57]Today I'm going to tell you a story which may seem very strange.

[00:02:05]>> Galileo, Kepler, Newton >> each tried to explain events in the history of the universe. Has the universe always been here >> or is it finite?

[00:02:16]>> Is there something else that would lay these questions to rest?

[00:02:19]>> It reopens that question of ultimate meaning.

[00:02:23]>> How in the world did this start?

[00:02:28]Well, >> it's based on the New York bestselling book Return of the God Hypothesis by Dr. Steven C. Mayor, who I'm very pleased to welcome back to Uncensored. Welcome back to you.

[00:02:38]>> It's great to be back, Pierce. I remember our previous conversation very fondly. It's wonderful to be with you.

[00:02:45]>> Well, over two million people watched our last interview which showed the huge level of interest in what you have to say. Um, and I was delighted that actually, not only is there that little clip of uh of me at the start in that trailer of your movie, but I later make a another appearance with my big argument with Richard Dawkins on Uncensored. Um, where he got extremely triggered by my persistence in trying to explain to him why I believed there was a greater power out there than us. Why do you think this issue of whether there is a god uh winds up some people, some scientists, atheists, whoever they may be to such an extraordinary degree? Why do they care so much?

[00:03:30]>> I think it winds us all up in a way because it has such profound implications. On the one hand, there is a a motivation, a desire to believe in God because it provides the basis of belief in an afterlife and ultimate human meaning. On the other hand, we all have a motivation not to believe in God because I think we'd all prefer not to be morally accountable to a a being uh beyond ourselves. And so we have these conflicting motive motivations in every every person's heart and mind. And uh what we try to do in the film and what my colleagues and I have tried to do in our scientific and philos philosophical work on this topic is extract the motivational questions and look and see what does the evidence actually say?

[00:04:12]What have we discovered about the the the scientific questions that would bear on the question of whether or not God actually exists?

[00:04:22]What's really interesting is that there was a recent Pew Center survey that pulled a random sample of 2533 members of the American Association for the Advancement of Science. And he came up with some pretty remarkable stats.

[00:04:36]33% said they believed in God. 18% believed in a universal spirit or higher power. 41% stated they didn't believe in God or a higher power. Seven didn't know or refused to answer. What What do you make of of those statistics?

[00:04:54]>> Well, I don't think they're all that significant in that they roughly reflect the kind of breakdown in the general public, although I think they have skewed over the last century in a direction that is more agnostic and atheistic than the general public. But the story we're telling in the film is about is the story of many scientists who are reconsidering and even rem reaffirming belief in God. Not in spite of the scientific evidence but because of new scientific discoveries especially about biological and cosmological origins about where the universe came from and where life came from. These are unanswered questions from within a materialistic framework. And this is the way we contrast. This is the kind of the explains the title of the film. We contrast two competing grand narratives, two stories of reality. The one affirms that life and the universe are that the universe is eternal and self-existing and self-organizing and self-creating so that everything both life can be explained as a result of an unguided undirected purposeless process. And the other story is the is the equally ancient story. goes back at least to the ancient Greeks that there is a great mind behind the universe that is responsible for the creation of the universe and for shaping matter and energy to bring into existence all the intricate things that we see around us especially those in the living world so we've got these two competing narratives or essentially worldviews or philosophies and so I think the the uh the stats about the scientists just reflects that reflects the fact that since the 19th century the 19th the materialistic narrative has been dominant But the story of the film is that that's shifting and shifting very rapidly. I think that's actually one of the reasons that you're seeing so many high-profile people in our culture begin to reconsider the God question. It's bubbling up to the surface as your last segment indicated.

[00:06:48]>> Yeah. I mean, it always for me it you know I was raised a Catholic. I remain a Catholic. It I've never had any doubt that there there is a God. Then my my kind of scientific brain if you like is just computing the reality that if we are this tiny pimp prick in the universe and there are gazillions of galaxies and all these things the idea that a we're the only people that exist in the whole thing is preposterous. I think there obviously must be other stuff out there.

[00:07:18]But secondly, no scientist, no atheist, nobody I've ever spoken to, from Richard Dawkins to anybody else to Ricky Jves, to whoever it may be to Professor Steven Hawking, no one can ever explain to me what was there before nothing. And because the human brain cannot answer that question, to me, self-evidently, there must be something more powerful than a human brain, a greater entity than a human brain that could at the very least answer that question or clear up that that quandry because we can't do it. Our brains can't can't answer that question.

[00:07:56]>> Well, it goes back to that very fundamental philosophical question. Why is there something rather than nothing?

[00:08:02]And the the answer that the materialist scientists gave for a very long time was that there has always been something something material something physical.

[00:08:13]And the assumption was that the universe the physical universe was eternal and self-existent and therefore did not need an external creator because it had always been here. Alas, beginning about a century ago with uh discoveries in observational astronomy and then subsequent developments in theoretical physics and then more discoveries in observational astronomy, we've discovered that the universe itself, as best we can tell from these multiple lines of evidence and inquiry definitely had a beginning. And that raises that fundamental causal question all over again because we can no longer say the universe is the eternal self-existent thing in the way that theists have long affirmed that God is the eternal self-existent thing. Instead, the universe had a beginning and therefore requires some sort of external cause or creator. And and I think I I saw your interesting uh uh interview with Richard Dawkins responding to the conversation that you and I had before. And Dawkins said, "Well, because time itself began, we can't really talk about what came before the beginning of the universe."

[00:09:15]>> Well, okay, fair enough, but that doesn't make the causal question go away. What caused the universe to come into existence? What could have caused time itself to come into existence?

[00:09:26]Well, clearly the kind of cause you would need, what would need to be postulated to explain the origin of matter, space, time, and energy is something that is separate from or which transcends matter, space, time, and energy. And as you survey the the the available candidates, it turns out that the God hypothesis provides, in my view, and that of many scientists and philosophers, the best explanation of the origin of the universe. And that's one of the one of the three big discoveries that we look at in the film is the discovery of the beginning of of everything and why that is bringing back consideration of what we call the God hypothesis.

[00:10:06]>> Yeah. Fascinating. Um let's talk about some other aspects to the film. Um it features many prominent scientists from across the major uh disciplines of of uh physics, chemistry, biology. Let's talk about physics first and the uh cosmic fine tuning argument. What is that for the layman?

[00:10:29]>> Yeah, thanks. That's a that's a fascinating uh set of discoveries and a fascinating ongoing discussion. Uh beginning in about the 1950s and60s uh physicists began to discover that the very most fundamental parameters of physics, the strength of gravitational attraction, the strength of electromagnetic attraction and of the other fundamental forces in physics, the masses of the elementary particles, the expansion rate of the universe, and the outward pushing force called the cosmological constant responsible for that. And even and maybe even especially the configuration of the matter and energy, the arrangement of matter and energy at the very beginning of the universe. All these parameters are what physicists will call they call them finely tuned. Meaning they fall within very narrow ranges outside of which there life in the universe and even basic chemistry would be impossible. And the collective probability of getting all those parameters to fall in each of those sweet spots is infantesmly small.

[00:11:35]And consequently, many physicists have come to the conclusion that as f Sir Fred Hy put it, a common sense interpretation of the facts suggests that a super intellect has monkeyed with physics and chemistry to make life possible and that there are no blind forces in nature worth talking about.

[00:11:52]Now, that's an especially telling quotation because Hy was early in his career a rather strident scientific atheist. He even coined the term the big bang to kind of stigmatize the idea that the universe had a beginning. And in the end he ended up coming around to some kind of uh to an affirmation of some kind of intelligent design behind the universe because of this fine-tuning that he and now many other physicists have discovered and ex explicated with with further inquiry.

[00:12:25]On a personal level, what is the kind of unfulfilled Eureka moment for you that you dream about happening in your lifetime?

[00:12:36]a discovery. What is the thing that would be most exciting to you?

[00:12:40]>> Well, I think the thing that that that first gave me a Eureka and which would just absolutely has fascinated me for now nearly 40 years is the discoveries that were being made in molecular biology. uh that started in the 1950s and60s with Watson and Crick elucidating first the structure of the DNA molecule and then Francis Crick five years later realizing that along the spine of the DNA molecule there is a that there there are chemical subunits that are functioning like alphabetic characters in a written text or like digital characters in a section of machine code.

[00:13:18]In fact, one of the great physicists at the time, George Gammo, looked carefully at the the the Watson and Crick model and realized that these these uh so-called bases that contain the information were functioning like like a digital bitstring. And so the information revolution came into biology in the late 1950s and60s. And since then it has absolutely changed our understanding of the of the nature of life and posed a fundamental challenge to the origin of life uh studies as well. In the 19th century around the time of Darwin uh his great bulldog Thomas Henry Huxley said the cell is a simple homogeneous globule of undifferentiated protoplasm. And when scientists thought that the cell was a simple enclosure of Jell-O like that, it was pretty easy to imagine how with one or two simple chemical reactions, that protoplasmic substance that was they thought the essence of life might have come into existence in a completely undirected way. But as we've learned more and more about the interior workings of the cell and there's much more to discover and that would be some of the the Eureka things that I' I'd hope to learn about uh in the future.

[00:14:32]But we've now learned that the cell is not only contains digital information.

[00:14:37]It's that digital information is part of a complex information storage, transmission, and processing system that rivals, in fact, exceeds anything we've developed in our own high-tech digital computing world. A couple years ago, our our our uh uh friend opposite uh professor Dawkins said that he was knocked sideways with wonder at the miniaturized intricacy of the data processing system inside the living cell. Now, that's not the kind of thing that you would expect to arise by undirected chemical processes. And in fact, there is an impass in what's called origin of life research today precisely because no one can explain how you get from chemistry to that kind of intricate code and the whole system for processing it. Now, as far as what I would hope to see in the future, we've now learned that the information in DNA is not in any way the whole story. There must be other information inside living cells and inside the the whole process by which animals are developed. And so I'm very eager to see what we we discover in the future about the higher levels of information. We do know that life represents a hierarchically organized system of information storage and processing, but we don't know where all the necessary information is to for example build an animal form.

[00:15:55]>> Right? So talking of cells, Cambridge University scientists only this week actually released an incredible image uh showing one of the most detailed 3D reconstructions of a human cell ever produced. And people say that this points towards intelligent engineering rather than random chance. Um what are we looking at here? I mean for those who are not as skilled in this kind of thing as as you are, what what are we looking at? Well, it looks like we have a cross-section of the cell and and in that cross-section, we're able to see a dynamic representation of the movements of the various cellular organels. And the organels are structures within the cell. Uh but at an even more at an even more fine grain level, if you go down further and that this looks like a ukareotic cell. So this one would have a nucleus. inside the nucleus would be that DNA uh protein synthesis system whereby the instructions on the DNA would build the molecular uh machines made of proteins and the protein enzymes that are necessary to process the information in DNA but also to catalyze at very rapid rates all the necessary uh reactions that keep cells alive. So you you you now uh molecular biologists will very quickly and cell biologists will kind of start to wax lyrical and describe the interior workings of the cell as something like an automated factory run by digital code in which the code is processed by little nano machines. Uh so it's information information processing miniature machinery and it's automated to a degree that it's just it's it's just mind-blowing. So the idea of the simple homogeneous or homogeneous glo of goo is long long ways back in the rearview mirror. It's a it's a completely new day in biology. And of course when the main evolutionary ideas of Darwin and others were were formulated first formulated in the late 19th century they knew of nothing of this. And so this is especially for the field known as chemical evolution or the theory known as chemical evolutionary theory. The theory that purports to explain how we got from the simple chemicals in a alleged prebiotic environment or soup to the first self-replicating organism. There those theories are at a state of complete imp no evolutionary biologist has a a compelling persuasive or even plausible theory of how you get from chemistry to a full living cell. I know your producers been also seeking an interview with my colleague James Tour who is in the film.

[00:18:43]Uh, Professor Tur has over 850 peer-reviewed publications. He's one of the top organic synthesis experts in the world. also a specialist in nanotechnology and he's been a very outspoken uh critic of of scientists who present to the public the idea that we understand how the living cell came about through undirected chemical processes when in fact no such thing is the case. So uh that that that little snapshot you just showed uh gives just a flavor of the complexity. In the film we go a little a little bit deeper to the nano scale and show the way the information on DNA is being processed.

[00:19:19]We show the machines that are being built. And once you see this, you can't unsee it. You realize u you almost don't need to make an argument for intelligent design because you can see that this is obviously an intricately designed uh system on a miniaturized scale.

[00:19:35]>> I mean the the human body in all its complexity with everything that's involved is unbelievably brilliant and complex and a stunning piece of engineering. never mind anything else. Um can you see a situation where artificial intelligence which is obviously developing at a ferocious rate at the moment where rather like with when they bought out chess computers and they were these gigantic things and a human could beat them and then very quickly I think Gary Kasparov who was a world champion lost to one of them deep blue and then that was it. Now nobody can beat a chess chess computer. Are we going to see a situation do you think in two, three, maybe five years, whatever it may be, where artificial intelligence can solve all the problems about the human body that we are currently incapable of solving, including, for example, cancers, diseases and so on?

[00:20:32]>> Well, it's a fantastic knowledge and I think it obviously uh augments our human intelligence beautifully and we can use it for good or for ill. But there's an interesting problem that's development developed with these large language mo models or the the kind of uh chat GPT style, you know, latest generation AI.

[00:20:52]And I think it's a it's a really interesting tell. It's called a the problem of model collapse. And the idea is that if you feed into the AI system a body of text that's written by conscious intelligent agents and then you quer use the AI system the LLM and the something like chat GPT to query that system ask it a question you'll get an output you'll get a an amazingly coherent answer but if you use the output as data what's called artificial data and then you query that output the next output ends up being quite a bit less coherent. And if you keep doing that over multiple iterations, the whole thing breaks down. You get what's some what there's a parallel problem in origin of life research when people have attempted to simulate the origin of genetic information with various physical processes. There's a problem known as error catastrophe. You have this buildup of incoherence over time.

[00:21:50]And I think that shows that the system as a whole there's there's a fundamental asy symmetry. The system as a whole, the artificial intelligence is fundamentally dependent on the initial input of meaningful or functional information from a conscious intelligence. And that's one of the key principles that allows us to detect design in living systems as well. We see a large amount of functional or what we call specified information in DNA and RNA and other these other large informationbearing macroolelecules in the cell. And we know from our experience that that type of information always arises from a conscious intelligence. In fact, there's a an early pioneer in the application of information science to molecular biology, a man named Henry Quasler who said that the creation of new information is habitually associated with conscious activity. So when we find that kind of information at the foundation of life, something like digital code in a computer program, it is in fact very reasonable to infer that a conscious intelligence was ultimately responsible for that information. In the same way that our AI systems won't work if we don't have that initial input from from conscious agency as well.

[00:23:02]Fascinating. Let's just turn quickly to arguments against God. One is that the universe is so large, 93 billion light years in diameter, and so old, 13.8 billion years, that mere probability dictates that life has to exist somewhere, and we just happen to have won the cosmic lottery. What do you say to that argument?

[00:23:24]>> Well, uh, I'm completely agnostic as to whether life exists elsewhere in the cosmos. We just don't know at this point. What I would say is that u, well, two things. First, if you run the probabilities, it's it's not a slam dunk that life must exist anymore. People used to think that making making calculations on something on the basis of something called the Drake equation and on the basis of the number of G that there are in the un about two trillion. It's an amazingly vast expanse we live in. But the number the the improbability associated with getting all the par the parameters right both at the cosmological level and in the local level of a that are necessary to build a life- friendly solar system are equally daunting in the other direction. So it's not clear but but what we do know for sure is that to build life you don't just need a a friendly planetary system.

[00:24:22]You've got to create something has to create the information necessary to create self-replicating organisms. And in our experience again, information is the product of mind. So my argument would be if life exists elsewhere in the cosmos, odds are it was also it was produced by an intelligent agent as indeed I think the life that we know of must have been based on the features that it possesses that are that are invariably indicators of the activity of a designing mind.

[00:24:52]And what about this bonkers theory, but then it was bound to be bonkers and some of the best theories in the world turn out to be true when they're bonkers?

[00:24:59]What if it's not God, but it's an advanced alien scientist who was designed a simulation that we're all living in and he sort of rather he rather enjoys the suffering.

[00:25:13]The fact of that uh postulation having been uh floated by very prominent scientists uh including no less a personage than the great Francis Crick even our our a friend and colleague Richard Dawkins who's been on your program floated that idea of what's it's called panspermia the idea that life was either designed elsewhere by an intelligent alien or it evolved elsewhere and then was transported here to earth by the intelligent agent. Now, in fairness, I think Professor Dawkins later disclaimed that that speculation that he made in a in a documentary, but uh the fact that that scientists have had to go there shows just how difficult the problem of the origin of life is.

[00:25:55]Um, and notice too that that is actually an intelligent design hypothesis, but the the the designer being postulated is an intelligent alien rather than rather than than something like a transcendent intelligence that we would associate with God. Couple things to say about that. First of all, it doesn't really solve the ultimate problem of the origin of the information necessary to produce life, which is the fundamental uh unsolved problem in origin of life research. Uh it it it merely kicks the problem not down the road, but but boots it out into space. But even more fundamentally, the alien designer hypothesis doesn't account for the origin of the fine-tuning of the laws and constants of physics and initial conditions of the universe that we were talking about. That fine-tuning has been present from the very beginning of the universe. And clearly, no alien being or any other being within the cosmos could explain the origin of the finetuning that would allegedly make its future evolution and origin possible. So there's a huge unsolved problem with the the the uh find with the alien designer hypothesis. Uh and one other and that is that no alien intelligence within the cosmos can explain where the cosmos itself came from. So I've argued in Return of the God hypothesis, my book, which is the basis of the new film, The Story of Everything, that the theistic design hypothesis does the best overall job, the best job of explaining all the evidence we have about both biological origins, but also physical origins, the finetuning, and the origin of the universe itself, the cosmological origins.

[00:27:33]I I asked Neil deGrasse Tyson recently who was the the greatest scientist there's ever been that we know of and he said Isaac Newton who would your candidate be for that title >> it's hard to beat Isaac Newton but uh James Clark Maxwell and Einstein are Newton Clark James Clark Maxwell and Einstein are generally generally regarded as as the three greatest physicists Einstein said he stood on the the the shoulders of Maxwell Newton als also use that same quote to talk about the importance of Galileo and Kepler. So, a lot of great scientific minds. Um, I was very fortunate to get to study at Cambridge University and a lot of those people were there in in the the history of science at Cambridge. I wasn't there with Maxwell. He predated me, but uh he had inscribed on the great Caendish laboratory a psalm uh psalm 111 which says, "Great are the works of the Lord sought out by all who take pleasure therein." I used to gain a lot of uh uh sort of uh confidence in my own developing thought to realize that many of the great scientists from who got science going back to Newton and Bole and and Kepler but right through to Maxwell and beyond were men of deep religious faith and they saw that in they they felt that what they were doing in studying nature was was explicating the work of a great mind that lay behind the the physical universe they studied and that's that's uh in inscribed there for all to see on the on the entrance to the the historic Caendish laboratory there in Cambridge.

[00:29:07]>> Um let's just quickly reference a report on the today's show about the possible discovery of a very famous biblical artifact, Noah's Ark. Let's take a look at this. Imagine these mountains millennia ago, submerged by floods. And in this beautiful biblical landscape named in the Old Testament, the shape of a ship. The book of Genesis says Noah landed here in the mountains of Ararat. So, could this really be Noah's ark?

[00:29:46]>> What do you think of that? Do you think Noah's ark existed and that's some evidence towards it?

[00:29:55]>> I am I am uh again I'll plead agnosticism. I do not know what to think of that particular discovery. I know archaeologists on both sides of that uh debate, but um I would tell you that the gen the trend line in archaeological discovery over the last 100 to 150 years has been to repeatedly confirm the historical reliability of the biblical text, both the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament. Many of the figures that were uh described in the gospels as having been present in the trial of Jesus have been independently attested by archaeological inscriptions uh most prominently Pontius Pilate and and Caiaphas the Jewish high priest. If you go to the British Museum in London, the whole story of the interaction between the Empire, Kingdom of Judah under Sekcharb on the Assyrian side and and uh and Hezek on the on the on the Jewish side is attested in the Assyrian record. So you have this external corroboration of the biblical text. So that's something that fascinates me on an avocational level. don't know about the recent uh discovery that you just highlighted, but I do know that there's an awful lot of archaeological evidence, surprising amount and and that many people just don't know about that has confirmed the historical reliability of of the narratives that we find in those ancient scriptural documents.

[00:31:20]>> Well, that brings me neatly to a conclusion. Poly market, the prediction market says there's over $60 million currently invested in the return of Jesus by 2027. So, a 4% chance that it will happen. Biggest spikes seen since last November and in early February this year. So, a lot of money coming in on Jesus potentially reappearing on this planet. What do you feel about that?

[00:31:48]>> Well, I wonder if if their predictions come true, who will get the payoff?

[00:31:53]But uh [laughter] uh I think I I I think wars and rumors of wars tend to tend to do that to people and get the esqueological intuition focused on the other end of the timetable. Uh where did everything come from? And that's of course what our our film is about. You've been so kind to let us let us share some of that with your audience.

[00:32:19]the um I interviewed Russell Brand uh last week in and several clips went viral including him spending several minutes trying to find a Bible passage from there. Do you think we are in this era slightly prone to a new phenomenon of performative religious conviction where people adopt it late in life as a bit of a PR crutch?

[00:32:44]I I'd like to dodge that question because I never like to speculate about motivations. But what I would say is that we certainly are in the last seven or eight years in a period where first of all I think the new atheism has run its course. I think it overplayed its hand >> and I think there's a renewed interest in the God question and it and it is bubbling up to the top of the the culture in the form of discussions with many surprising people. I think of Ayan Hersy Ali in your country uh Tom Holland uh the great historian uh in our country the social scientists Charles Murray who's re recently written a book called taking religion seriously some of the the leading uh talk uh podcasters are are discussing this I've been on Wikipedia described as a pseudocientist because uh in challenging the strictly materialistic definition of science science by posing the the idea of intelligent design or developing and arguing for the intelligent design. I'm violating a convention that many atheistic scientists believe is normative uh for for scientists to to accept. Uh we're challenging that uh assumption or that normative prescription because we think it prevents scientists from following the evidence wherever it might lead. And it was certainly never a normative prescription in the time of Newton and the great scientists who got science going. Putting all that aside, it's interesting that the founder of Wikipedia has recently announced a Christian conversion experience and he cites our work on intelligent design u the alleged pseudocientific perspective that the the site still stigmatizes as a as a big factor in his in his conversion to Christianity. So um it's at least opening. I think we have a lot of things going on in science, philosophy, and culturally that are opening people's minds to the God question and in a way that even five, six years ago was not was not happening.

[00:34:46]>> Yeah, 100%. I think that's the purest definition of irony you just laid out there. Uh Dr. Steven C. May, great to talk to you again. Uh I could talk to you for hours, but we sadly run out of time. The story of everything, this movie based on your bestselling book, Return of the God Hypothesis. How do people get to see it? I know it's out today, Friday. How do people get to see it?

[00:35:06]>> Yeah, thanks. Thank thanks for asking.

[00:35:08]It's uh people can get tickets in the US. It's out in US theaters right now.

[00:35:14]People in the US can get tickets by going to a site, the storyofthing.

[00:35:21]Filmm for film. The storyof everything.

[00:35:24]And it will be out later in the summer on digital platforms, but I would recommend seeing it on the big screen.

[00:35:30]It's visually stunning. The producers have done a great job. There are 400 visual effects. They take you way out into space to see the galaxies close up and deep into the interior of the cell to see all that digital and nanotechnology we've been talking about.

[00:35:44]So, it is a a visually stunning cinematic experience.

[00:35:49]>> Brilliant. Dr. May, great to see you again. Thank you very much indeed for taking the time for Unsense.

[00:35:55]>> Thank you for having me again. is always always a pleasure.

[00:36:01]>> That was Dr. Steven Meyer discussing the documentary film The Story of Everything on Piers Morgan Uncensored. We're grateful to the producers of Piers Morgan Uncensored for permission to share the conversation on ID the future.

[00:36:15]Now, if this exchange has piqu your curiosity and you want to learn more, well, you can watch the movie. It's actually available now on Amazon Prime, so you can stream it there. And if you want to dive even deeper, it's all based on Dr. Meyer's book, Return of the God Hypothesis. And that book is available anywhere books are sold. So you can find it at your favorite book seller online, offline, or hop on to return of the godhypothesis.com.

[00:36:44]That's return ofthegodhypothesis.com.

[00:36:48]Well, for ID of the future, I'm Andrew McDermad. Thanks for joining us. We'll see you again soon.

[00:36:55]Visit us [music] at idthe future.com and intelligentesign.org.

[00:37:00]This program is copyright discovery institute and recorded by [music] its center for science and culture.