Joe Rogan Is What Plato Warned Us About

Added: 2026-05-25

[00:00:00]Antonio got a president.

[00:00:06]>> Thanks for not lighting this place. We don't want anybody. [screaming] >> Thank you very much.

[00:00:16]>> This is a story about the most powerful voice in modern media. A comedian whose casual endorsement was credited as a factor in electing a president of the United States.

[00:00:30]But to understand how he got there and what he became, we have to go back 2400 years. It is the year 380 BC. A philosopher in Athens sits in a courtyard writing a dialogue that will define Western thought for the next 2400 years. He describes a cave. Inside it, prisoners chain sense birth stare at shadows on a wall and mistake them for reality. One prisoner breaks free. He climbs toward the light. He sees the sun for the first time. He understands truth. And then he goes back to free the others. He had no idea that over 2400 years later, he would describe the career of Joe Rogan with frightening accuracy. of those inside loc.

[00:01:25]>> You ever heard Howard Stern?

[00:01:40]>> We view Joe Rogan as the man who changed conversation. The podcaster who proved that long- form talk could beat cable news. the comedian who gave scientists, fighters, philosophers, [music] and presidents the same chair in the same three hours. And that's true. He did that. I'm not a person that needs to be taken seriously. It's not my job. I'm literally a comedian. Like, you can make fun of me. I'll make fun of me. It's fine. I don't It doesn't My my future doesn't rely on people taking me seriously.

[00:02:14]but through the lens of Plato's allegory of the cave. Joe Rogan isn't just a podcaster. He is the [music] escaped prisoner, the man who broke free from the shadows, claimed to see the light, and proved exactly why Plato's story doesn't end the way you think it does.

[00:02:33]Plato wrote, "How could they [music] see anything but the shadows if they were never allowed to move their heads?"

[00:02:42]This is how the most powerful voice in modern media lived out the exact [music] philosophical warning Plato wrote over two millennia ago. But to understand how Rogan became Plato's nightmare, you first have to understand why millions of people trusted him in the first place.

[00:03:01]And honestly, they had every reason to.

[00:03:11]In book seven of the Republic, Plato describes prisoners chained inside a cave since birth. Behind them, a fire burns. Figures carry objects that cast shadows on the wall. The prisoners watch these shadows their entire lives. They name them. They debate them. They believe the shadows are all that exist.

[00:03:36]Plato wrote, "To them, the truth would be literally nothing but the shadows of the images."

[00:03:43]Now, think about what American media looked like before Joe Rogan. Cable news in threeinut segments, talking heads and split screens, every opinion pre-approved by an editorial board, the shadows on the wall. Joe Rogan was a prisoner in that cave. a Fear Factor host, a sitcom actor on News Radio, a stand-up comedian doing clubs. He wasn't taken seriously. He wasn't supposed to be. And then on Christmas Eve 2009, he sat down in front of a laptop with his friend Brian Redband and started talking.

[00:04:25]Start broadcast and then update the Twitter. update to Twitter.

[00:04:35]>> No sponsors, no editors, no network, just conversations.

[00:04:40]3 hours long. For the first time, someone was talking to experts the way a curious person actually talks. Not in sound bites, but in real time. It felt like the truth. And for millions of people who had been watching Shadows on the wall their entire lives, Joe Rogan felt like the man who had found the exit.

[00:05:03]>> If you trace the first one to Carl Sean back in 1980, >> your I use your segment on wolves on how wolves became dogs. You drink sometimes which are like piss magnets.

[00:05:14]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:05:15]>> They're delicious, but they make you want to pee.

[00:05:18]>> Make you want to beat your wife, too, dude. I've seen a lot of dudes drinking Monster that you know they're going home to punch.

[00:05:24]But day 5,026 in a row, you'd be like, "Oh my god, I can't do this."

[00:05:31]>> Yeah.

[00:05:31]>> And that she's dying.

[00:05:33]>> Plato said the escape prisoner would be blinded at first, that the light would be painful, but slowly his eyes would adjust, and he would see things as they truly are. Rogan didn't just leave the cave. He invited the audience to leave with him. But Plato understood something about escaping the cave that Rogan didn't. The light doesn't just illuminate, it blinds. And a man who has been staring at shadows his entire life can't always tell the difference between the sun and a fire.

[00:06:16]In Plato's allegory, the escape prisoner climbs toward the surface. At first, everything is blinding. And then came the moment that proved the will to conversation could reshape reality.

[00:06:30]>> It's tobacco and marijuana in there.

[00:06:32]That's all it is.

[00:06:36]>> Elon Musk smoking weed on the podcast.

[00:06:39]69 million views on YouTube. Tesla's stock fell 6% the next day and two senior executives resigned the same morning as if the puff had shaken the entire company loose. One conversation on a podcast moved markets and triggered a government investigation by the Secretary of the Air Force. Bernie Sanders discussing Medicare for all.

[00:07:08]Edward Snowden explaining mass surveillance from exile.

[00:07:12]Scientists explaining consciousness, [music] quantum physics, the gut biome.

[00:07:18]Episode after episode, Rogan delivered something cable news never could. Depth.

[00:07:25]>> If you found out something [music] about UFOs, would you let us know?

[00:07:28]>> Well, I'll tell you, my wife would demand that I let you know.

[00:07:31]>> Is your wife a UFO nut?

[00:07:33]>> And the effect was measurable. books mentioned on Rogan's podcast hit the Amazon bestseller list within 24 hours.

[00:07:41]The Carnivore diet saw a 400% spike in Google searches after a single episode.

[00:07:48]This wasn't a podcast anymore. It was an engine. And then Spotify came calling.

[00:07:56]In May 2020, Joe Rogan signed an exclusive licensing deal worth an estimated $200 million.

[00:08:05]The man who started with a laptop and a friend had built the most powerful media platform on earth and then in 2024 he renewed for $250 million $250 million.

[00:08:22]>> Uh out of the New York Times on Joe Rogan his overall contract value might be $200 million. Ify has agreed to a new multi-year deal with Austinbased [music] podcaster Joe Rogan. The contract is worth $250 million.

[00:08:39]>> The most listened to podcast in the world, 11 million listeners per episode, more than two and a half times bigger than the second biggest podcast. An audience that is 78% male and between 18 and 34 years old. the most coveted demographic in media. To put that in perspective, CNN averages under a million viewers in prime time. Fox News about 2.7 million. Rogan gets 11 million from a studio in Austin, Texas. But Plato warned that the ascent is painful.

[00:09:19]The truth is not always what we want it to be. Plato wrote, "And if he is compelled to look straight at the light, will he not have a pain in his eyes which will make him turn away?"

[00:09:31]Plato's escape prisoner eventually sees the sun and he is supposed to return to the cave and free the others. Rogan did go back. He brought his microphone and he offered everyone a seat. The problem was he couldn't tell who was carrying sunlight and who was carrying a torch designed to cast new shadows.

[00:10:01]Plato said the escape prisoner must return to the cave and tell the others what he's seen. But Plato also warned the prisoners won't believe him. They'll mock him. They might even kill him. Joe Rogan returned to the cave, but not as Plato intended. Instead of carrying truth into the darkness, he opened the cave door and let everyone in. Doctors and conspiracy theorists, epidemiologists and antiaxers, astrophysicists and flatearthers and this thing that you keep. But don't No, no. Where did you get this information, Jamie? Where'd you get it?

[00:10:36]>> Where'd I get what >> this information? Where is this coming from?

[00:10:39]>> It's coming off the internet.

[00:10:40]>> Exactly. The American reading some information. I'm reading some information.

[00:10:45]>> You didn't go to the library.

[00:10:46]>> Each one got 3 hours. Each one got the same chair, the same microphone, the same platform.

[00:10:54]>> The source of the original.

[00:10:55]>> What? Just because someone gets in an accident and they're high because Hold on. Stop.

[00:11:00]>> No. No. You interrupted way too much.

[00:11:02]You need to stop.

[00:11:03]>> Bring up a study that we wrote. We wrote about it on our website.

[00:11:05]>> Look, I don't care about your website.

[00:11:06]You since marijuana legalization, highway fatalities in Colorado.

[00:11:12]Hold on a second. Since you call me Hold on a second. Since you called me a puss and you do this with the crazy lady at a comedy club. You think if you scream enough that it makes a point. My point is I don't care that we smoke up. And you just said I was interrupting. You're interrupting screaming.

[00:11:24]>> Yeah. On the MRNA. Yeah. Total of about 15. I think >> in 2015 he removed all of his music from all the streaming services.

[00:11:33]>> Spotify removing more than 100 episodes of the Joe Rogan Experience.

[00:11:38]>> I do not know if they're right. I don't know because I'm not a doctor. I'm not a scientist.

[00:11:42]>> What >> it does?

[00:11:42]>> What comes from the Bible?

[00:11:43]>> Ultimately, our sense of right and wrong comes from the Bible.

[00:11:45]>> Our sense of right and wrong. The only way that a person could have ethics and morals and treat each other well, don't you think that people understand what's good and specific? Listen, if we're going to have a conversation, we can't keep talking over each other like this.

[00:11:57]when someone is trying to make a point about something that's complex like this. If you think that the only way for a person to have ethics or an understanding of each other or compassion for each other is to rely on ancient myths that are easily scientifically disproven. Well, that's what >> the co era cracked the foundation. Dr. Robert Malone, Dr. Peter Mcola, episodes that triggered a global backlash. Neil Young pulling his music from Spotify in protest. Rogan himself pulling over 70 episodes from the platform. 270 scientists, doctors, and medical professionals writing an open letter demanding accountability. And Rogan's response, I'm just a comedian asking questions.

[00:12:41]>> I'm just a person who sits down and talks to people and has conversations with them.

[00:12:45]>> But when the largest audience in podcasting history is listening, a question isn't a question anymore. It's a signal. When a flatearther sits next to an astrophysicist and both get three hours, truth and lies become equal shadows on the wall. And feelings favor the guest who sounds the most confident, not the one who is the most correct.

[00:13:09]Plato wrote, "Opinion is the medium between knowledge and ignorance."

[00:13:16]Rogan isn't afraid of the dark. He's afraid of nothing. And that's the problem. Because a man who filters nothing passes on everything. And when the shadows and the sunlight look the same on the cave wall, the prisoners stay chained, [laughter] even with that extra 2 in.

[00:13:37]But here's the part that Plato found most terrifying. What happens when the escaped prisoner doesn't just bring people to the light? He becomes the light itself. What happens when the largest audience on Earth stops looking at the sun and starts looking at the man who claims to have seen it?

[00:14:06]Plato's deepest warning wasn't about the original cave. It was about the danger of building a new one and calling it freedom. Look at Joe Rogan's audience.

[00:14:16]They don't just listen. They adopt his opinions as identity. Carnivore diet, sauna protocols, elk meat, float tanks, jujitsu, alphabrain. Political skepticism as a personality trait. I'm not left or right as a political position. One that by 2024 looked almost exclusively right.

[00:14:41]>> Supplements on top of this carnivore diet. I get in the sauna immediately after every work. Distract myself [music] cuz I'm floating, you know, and you drift into the wall sometimes.

[00:14:50]>> And uh when you put together Alpha Brain, >> and then came the endorsement that proved the cave was already built.

[00:14:58]November 4th, 2024, [music] the eve of the presidential election. Joe Rogan officially endorsed Donald Trump for president. The man who had spent a decade saying, "I'm not political," had just made the most political statement [music] in modern media history. And millions of young men who trusted him to think independently nodded along.

[00:15:21]Independently, of course.

[00:15:23]>> And it just came over the wires that Joe Rogan just endorsed me. Is that right?

[00:15:29]>> Thank you, Joe.

[00:15:30]>> But the one of the beautiful things about you is that you freeball. Like you get out and you do these huge events and you're just talking and you're making we've we've highlighted you on the show many times where you when you did this Biden impression where he's walking around he doesn't know what he's doing.

[00:15:43]It's funny. It's it's standup. It's funny stuff.

[00:15:45]>> We're doing great. Don't let anybody lie to you.

[00:15:49]>> Plato described the shadows in the cave as projections of objects carried by puppet masters behind the prisoners. The prisoners debate which shadows are the most real and they call this debate knowledge. Rogan's audience debates which guests are the most credible, and they call his debate thinking for themselves. The $250 million deal is the cave. Spotify pays for the shadows.

[00:16:15]Advertisers pay for the attention. The audience provides the chains willingly, enthusiastically, and calling it freedom. Now, if this sounds familiar, it should. We made a video about another man who built a system so perfect that the people inside it believed it was fair. His name was Dana White. And if you haven't seen it, go watch it after this. The machinery is the same. White sells fights. Rogan sells conversations. And in both cases, the audience is the raw material. You see knockouts, you see submissions, you see blood, drama, and glory. And this is where Plato's story ends, but Rogan's doesn't. Because Plato imagined one final figure, a man whose power comes precisely from his refusal to claim it.

[00:17:11]He called this figure the philosopher king.

[00:17:24]In the Republic, Plato described the ideal ruler as the philosopher king, a man who seeks wisdom, not power. One condition, he must know he has power and accept the responsibility that comes with it. [music] Plato wrote, "The heaviest penalty for declining to rule is to be ruled by someone inferior to [music] yourself.

[00:17:49]Joe Rogan is the inverted philosopher king. He has [music] more influence than any single media figure alive.

[00:17:57]>> I just don't think you should be married to your ideas.

[00:18:00]>> And his response to all of this is, I'm just a comedian. Don't listen to me.

[00:18:05]>> I don't know because I'm not a doctor.

[00:18:07]I'm not a scientist.

[00:18:08]>> I don't debate religious people and tell them they're idiots.

[00:18:14]>> CNN is saying I'm taking horse dewormer.

[00:18:16]Yeah. What? So they must know that that's a lie.

[00:18:18]>> There's a lot of people saying.

[00:18:19]>> So if you have conversations publicly, then the the whole world can essentially go, "No, you're wrong." That have had the president on now, they don't do their court gesture. They don't do it.

[00:18:29]They just they suck up to him.

[00:18:31]>> Yeah.

[00:18:31]>> So the comedians >> that have had that are podcast that have had Trump on, that's they're not doing their job. It's tough now because the podcasters have become just ass kissers for the politicians, right? They they don't challenge them. They just like, "Yeah, cool."

[00:18:50]>> That's not the job of a comedian. You are to challenge. You are to make uncomfortable. You're not to sit there and fake laugh.

[00:18:57]>> Y >> that is not the job of the court jester.

[00:19:00]>> Yeah.

[00:19:01]>> Period. So >> there is a difference. People were actually somebody yesterday was talking to me about that about you know political influence through comedy and all that stuff.

[00:19:10]>> But Plato understood something that Rogan doesn't. [music] But Plato understood something that Rogan doesn't.

[00:19:17]Denying your power doesn't make it disappear. It makes it unaccountable.

[00:19:21][music] A king who says I'm not a king still sits on the throne. [music] He just never has to answer for what happens in the kingdom. And here is the final irony. After endorsing Trump, Rogan started criticizing him. The immigration policies, the Epstein files, [music] the very audience he helped mobilize turned on him. The man who said, "Think for yourself," was punished the moment he thought differently.

[00:19:49]>> You saw that thing that I had to do at the White House the other day. I did see it.

[00:19:52]>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. People are pissed.

[00:19:54]Who's pissed?

[00:19:55]>> I don't know. People online.

[00:19:56]>> What? Because I was at the White House.

[00:19:57]>> Yeah. They're like, "Yo, Joe, you can't be at the White House, Joe. You said you wereing politically homeless. I amless.

[00:20:03]He joked about it. He called me a liberal during the whole thing. He's like, "Joe, he's very liberal." Wild time to be alive, kids.

[00:20:10]>> It's wild.

[00:20:10]>> But at least we're going to have drugs soon.

[00:20:12]>> That's pretty nice.

[00:20:13]>> Well, at least all those people that are hooked on pills are going to get off of them. A lot of them are. At least it's going to at least give them something that works.

[00:20:20]>> How come we can't get free healthcare?

[00:20:22]>> Yeah, right.

[00:20:23]>> Why don't we do that?

[00:20:24]>> I'm paying out the >> Why can't we do that? I bet if they took all the money from fraud, it would pay for healthcare 10 times more.

[00:20:30]>> We're in Ukraine or Israel.

[00:20:31]>> Oh, yeah.

[00:20:32]>> Plato predicted this, too. He said that when the escape prisoner returns to the cave [music] and tries to tell the prisoners the truth, they will hate him because truth is threatening to people who have built their entire identity around shadows. Joe Rogan [music] built the biggest conversation in human history. And then he discovered that the conversation had [music] built something bigger than him. An audience that wants to think what he thinks and will punish him the moment he stops. Is Joe Rogan a bad person? That's not the right question. Plato was never interested in whether the prisoner was good or evil.

[00:21:13]He was interested in what happens when a man escapes the cave and then builds a new one with better shadows and calls [music] it freedom. And what happens is this. The largest audience in media history enters the new cave willingly.

[00:21:30]They sit down. They watch the new shadows. They debate which shadows are the most real. And they call this debate thinking for themselves. Is was there any point like you know you ever heard Howard Stern talk about his acid trip >> and you have to wrestle with your identity because >> that's why I need you to move to Austin >> tobacco and marijuana in there >> and ones [music] that I hope people enjoy. So if I pissed you off I'm sorry >> and [snorts] it just came over the wires that Joe Rogan just endorsed me. Is that good? [screaming] [cheering] >> Thank you Joe.

[00:22:06]Over 2400 years ago, a philosopher in Athens wrote about prisoners who mistook shadows for reality. The story ends with a warning. The prisoners might refuse to be freed because the shadows are comfortable, familiar. They feel like choice. Joe Rogan escaped the cave. And then he built the most comfortable, most familiar, most convincing cave. the world has ever seen. He filled it with microphones and guests and [music] three-hour conversations and $250 million worth of shadows. And millions of people walked in, sat down, and called it thinking. Plato warned us. He told us exactly what happens when the escape prisoner mistakes his own fire for the sun. He told us what happens when an audience confuses the freedom to listen with the discipline to think. And he told us what happens when the most powerful voice in the world says, "Don't listen to me." And everyone listens anyway. And here's what none of us want to admit. We didn't just watch it happen. We clicked. We subscribed. We shared. We told our friends. We entered the cave willingly. thing, man.

[00:23:28]Everybody wants to pretend they're [ __ ] smarter than they are. We're all talking monkeys >> and we called it freedom.