This video presents an interfaith debate where a Muslim speaker challenges a Christian supporter's understanding of Jesus's nature and the preservation of biblical scripture. The speaker argues that if Jesus is 'God manifest in the flesh,' he cannot worship God, as worship implies a superior being. The debate explores whether the Bible has been preserved accurately, noting that early Christians wrote gospels like the Gospel of Thomas and Gospel of Mary that are not in the Bible, raising questions about which gospel represents the authentic message. The speaker also discusses Muhammad's prophethood, citing Quranic claims about Satan and archaeological evidence from Mecca to support Islamic theological positions.
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on the cross he died for you. He was sinless.
>> So the father >> what you want. Okay.
>> So the father manifested as a son.
>> God the creator.
>> Mhm.
>> Manifest.
>> Sorry. Sorry.
>> It's okay. It's okay brother. Let's explain. Please. Please explain.
>> Jesus is the son of God.
>> What do you mean by the word son of God?
>> Why are you looking the Bible?
>> Because the moment you say the moment you say someone is a son of God.
>> Yeah. Which is why I believe it. You don't.
>> Do you know what it means to me automatically? It means to me the son can only exist if the father existed. If the father did not exist, the son would not exist. Is that what you believe?
>> God created Jesus, didn't he?
>> Oh, he's a creation of who?
>> Oh, right. Yeah.
>> And so are you.
>> So Jesus is a creation.
>> You said Jesus.
>> He's just trying to catch me out.
>> So Jesus is a creation of God.
>> Jesus is God manifest in the flesh.
That's what he >> So he's not a creation or is he a creation? Jesus is God manifest in the flesh. What does manifest mean?
>> Manifesting means >> something that appears to come from somewhere. Okay. So Jesus is manifested.
He wasn't the son of >> So when he was So when was he manifested?
>> Now he was not the son of a man like you or you. He wasn't a flesh man. He was made from the spirit.
>> He was made.
>> Created made.
>> A woman gave birth. Uh-huh.
>> Don't try to argue over silly little words, okay? Because it doesn't work with me. My faith is so strong. I know the truth. All right.
>> Did Jesus worship God?
>> What? What? Just three questions.
>> Simple question.
>> Let's talk about belief.
>> Yes.
>> Let's talk about >> in your belief. Did Jesus worship God?
>> We're talking about belief now.
>> Of course, he spoke to God, didn't he?
Dear God, this God.
>> So, if anyone does God worship anyone?
>> Ask God. Does God worship or does Jesus worship?
>> God doesn't worship anyone.
>> No. Right. So why are you asking me? If you >> If you say Jesus worship God then he cannot be God.
>> You said did God worship anyone?
>> That's what you asked me.
>> Yes. To understand that you understand.
>> Ask God.
>> Sure.
>> Don't ask me.
>> God doesn't worship anyone.
>> Don't ask me questions that you've already.
>> So now do you do you agree?
>> You have come to argue with me.
>> Reasoning to reason.
>> Reasoning.
>> You don't stop talking.
How about yourself?
>> You're not calm.
>> Do you stop talking?
>> How can I when you're firing snow and fire?
>> We call them firing question.
>> Okay, let me relax.
>> And has a calm face.
>> I'm calm now.
>> So, what do you believe?
>> I believe in one God who is not a mother or a daughter or a sister or a father or a son. He's the one and only absolute self-sufficient being. The necessary being who? God of Abraham, Jacob, David, Solomon, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and all the creations.
>> So, where's Muhammad in the Bible?
Because I genuinely need to know where Muhammad is in the Bible and and the the scriptures that you talk about in the Quran is your no answer.
>> I am I'm trying to answer >> to tell you where it is.
>> Yeah. We need to make sure that what you have today as revealed by God is transmitted accurately and in a preserved way. So you believe the Bible has been preserved.
>> Yeah.
>> I believe what I believe is my own belief.
>> Is it preserved?
>> I don't believe all of these hundreds of translations. I read Greek scripture.
>> You read Greek?
>> Fluent in Greek? Yes.
>> You're fluent in Greek?
>> Yes. Okay.
>> And I've read really ancient stuff. It's really difficult when I've read it. Book of Revelation. So I was saying that is the only book of God that was breathed out by God in Greek.
>> What's the word?
>> What's the name of God in Greek?
>> Theos.
>> Theos. And what's the name God revealed to?
>> Moses the prophet. His personal name.
>> What's your name?
>> The tetetrogrammaton.
>> Sorry.
>> The tetra gmaton.
Y hwh in English.
>> What did he say? What was fulfilled by God?
>> When God says in Hebrew.
>> Yeah.
>> So he says this is his name. What's the name of God in Hebrew translated in Greek?
>> The name of God.
>> Yeah.
>> In Hebrew. I don't read Hebrew.
>> Right. But but God gave a personal name.
>> Say it then. Don't try.
>> Do you know that personal name?
>> I don't know. Oh, that no that name that name is not found in Greek. That's the problem.
>> Oh, there you go then. How?
>> So that's because the Bible doesn't have that name.
>> Book of Revelation here. I said to you book of Revelation is the last book out in Greek spoken out in Greek to in the cave of Revelations, right? In Patmos.
>> What is logos mean to you?
>> Word.
>> Word of her.
Can I finish my saying please?
>> So it was spoken out in Greek and written in Greek. Okay.
>> And what language?
>> Thank you. Greek. Great.
>> That was the last book. Last words of that book say that no man had to take away from this word. It's the final word.
>> Right.
>> So if that's a very that's a very important point.
>> So God >> what you said is very very important.
So, so why were the Christians?
>> No. Answer my question.
>> I am answering.
>> No, you're answering.
>> If you allow me to, if you allow me to >> I'm not going to ask you them.
>> We find the early Christians did not adhere to this warning in book of revelation. They started writing books with their own hands and they attributed these. I'm explaining I I'll give you the the names of the people. They started attributing these writings and they said these are what God has inspired them to write the book called the gospel of the Ebionites, Gospel of Judas, Gospel of St. Thomas, Gospel of Mary, Gospel of Philip.
>> No, it's not. They don't believe in that either in the Bible.
>> That's what I'm saying. So my point so now you realize these writings called gospels of Jesus Christ written in Greek was >> I'm just showing to you these people they call themselves Christians and they the ones who wrote the gospel of St. Thomas, for example, >> no, they didn't call themselves Christians. Christians were first named Christians and the facts they were named.
>> They believed in Christ.
>> They believed in Christ and his message.
>> Call themselves Christians.
>> Fair enough. I stand corrected.
>> I stand corrected. Thank you. So, so, so what I'm saying is these early followers of Christ, >> they followed him, believed in him, and they believed that he had a message, the gospel, and they wrote this gospel. Do you believe in that gospel of Philip?
>> Philippians?
>> Nope. Gospel of Judas.
>> Gospel of Mary.
>> I don't Mary. I don't know.
>> It's not in your Bible.
>> No, because I haven't read it. Should I read my Bible?
>> Yeah. So, now the question is, So this is the precisely my question.
>> People who considered themselves followers of Christ >> believed in him >> and they said they have received his gospel >> which they want to transmit by writing.
>> This is not the book that you believe in. So is the gospel of Christ with you or with them in the gospel of St. Thomas?
If I haven't read something then there's no way I can actually answer.
>> So potentially it could be them and you are reading a false gospel >> potentially. That's that's a hypothetical.
>> No >> because historically look look you can say in my book whatever you want no problem but what I'm saying is when you have a gospel in your Bible and a gospel in their position both of these gospels they are different in various ways.
They both cannot be >> what you believe in because you don't believe in the other one. You didn't even know.
>> I haven't read it. So I can't even converse with you about that.
>> So that means >> it's something I haven't read. I'm not of that.
>> You're talking to me about something that I haven't read.
>> So why is that Gospel of St. Thomas not in your Bible?
>> Until I read it, how can I answer?
>> No. No. Why is it not in your Bible? The Bible is because you did not compile the Bible, did you?
>> Yeah.
>> You didn't. So the people who compiled it, >> you're asking me, you're asking me to answer the question about something.
>> Why didn't they compile it? Why didn't they add in it in the Bible? Why did the church add that?
>> These are notify.
>> No, no, I'm not saying it is. I'm saying that many, many Christians argue that the Bible, but it's not.
>> Okay, let me correct myself. Let me I want to correct what I just said. Holy Spirit.
>> I want to correct what I just said.
>> No, wait a minute. So you don't want me to correct myself when I make a mistake.
>> What I'm saying >> when you finish letting me know so I can correct myself what I said.
>> Can you stop talking and let somebody explain?
>> Go ahead.
>> So the books you're saying about I can't comment on because I haven't read them.
Like the apocrypha that's not in the Bible. There are people who argue that it should be but it's not forgerous.
>> Let me finish this. But it's not inspired by God. It's not it's not inspired by God. They are like which are written by people who are trying to ask me why they're not in the Bible. God knows why they're not in the Bible. God knows. We don't know answers to questions that only God knows. There's questions that you ask you've never answer. Only God knows. Only God knows.
He can't answer you a question on something.
>> Sure. You don't need to answer it. When we see several gospels and only four gospels in a particular compilation called the Bible, I have serious questions about preservation of the gospel because if all this if these gospels supposed to be inspired, I don't see any evidence of gospel of St. Luke for example being inspired. He says like this don't want to say >> no I know what he says. He says for us >> for as many people for us many people have undertaken to write >> it seemed good to me also to write having been there investigating it.
So he's writing for his most excellent theophilus the gospel. So he doesn't say excuse me God inspired me.
>> He doesn't say God inspired me. He says >> the Bible says it.
>> No Luke says the reason he writes is because two things many people are writing >> and it seemed good to good to him also to write no inspiration. The thing is you're questioning that. Well, you believe the Quran from somebody who couldn't even read and write and he was just a heathen man and he was >> because he received it from God without knowing how to read and write.
>> How do you know?
>> I will tell you how we know.
>> How do you know?
>> Excellent question. Trust that.
>> I I will tell you how.
>> But you don't trust something that was >> Now I will answer I will answer this question you asked. Excellent question.
How do we know Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam received revelation from God? Because when he received revelation, his companions at his time when they witnessed revelation coming to him, if he was on a mount like a camel or a horse on the desert sand, they would see the mount the camel's legs, the horse's legs dab inside the sand.
>> Yeah.
>> By the weight of revelation. Please, please, you ask me how we know.
>> This is evidence in front of them.
with Jesus. He did miracles.
>> Please, please, please, please. So, we have so we have we have the miracle that they witness that prophet Maham did and they witnessed this miracle. So, when he recited the Quran, they knew that this was not from anyone or anything other than God. That's why they believed in him because they were witnessing revelation. So when the Quran told them about things that they didn't know, how did the Quran know that information?
To give you an example, right?
>> The Quran says even Satan doesn't have the ability to give the Quran. And and and the Quran says if if you allow me to. The Quran says it's all made up. It's made up. When you recite the Quran, then seek refuge with God from the accursed Satan.
>> God is not my God. I >> I'm finishing my answer to your question.
>> Hurry up.
>> How do we >> Oh, no disrespect, but can you hurry up?
>> Do you want me to say the same thing when you speak? Hurry up. Hurry up.
>> I don't speak much.
>> So, I will I would not say hurry up. I >> about 15 minutes.
So, so when the Quran says when you read the Quran, seek refuge with God from the accursed Satan, >> take Satan as your strongest clear enemy.
And you're saying the book which says when you read my book, curse me. Please think about >> no because of prophets. When you imagine if that book was written by Satan and he's saying when you read my book, curse me every time you read my book and seek refuge with God. So God curses me and I have no power.
>> He's a deceiver. Satan deceives. So do you so so do you do you think Satan would do that and say >> Satan would do anything to get people to >> So how do you know it wasn't Satan who wrote the Bible? Why not absolute?
>> By saying no, God has inspired people to written it >> because it's the truth.
>> I'm saying I'm saying the Quran is the truth. Absolute truth. And you're saying no, Satan authored it.
>> Bible. Why does it say there's going to be a new book that people will know it's the real God and we're going to bring Muhammad to you? Everybody.
>> Do you know why? Do you know why I answered earlier about the gospels? My point was you meaning the Christian community has not preserved the messages of the prophets and messengers because many of these messages are found in the writing elsewhere which is not in the Bible. So to to answer your question where is it in the Bible it's most likely not preserved or or or it's preserved in a very adulterated tempered form.
>> Okay. Let me give you an example.
>> Let me give you an example.
>> When Jesus Christ says to his people, >> I have many things to tell you many things.
>> Yes.
>> But you can't bear them now.
>> Yes.
>> So did he tell them all the things that was necessary to know?
>> Well, at that point >> at any point in his life, >> why did you just say that? He told them, "But when I go, when I go and when I send him, he will guide you unto all the truth."
>> That doesn't mean it's Muhammad.
>> Sorry, sorry, sorry. Remember what you said? How do we know? One second.
>> Did Jesus say everything that there was to say?
>> I believe that again.
>> I don't think No, you don't know.
>> He said that I have many things to tell you. I know one thing. You don't know that as a man. You do not know all of the things that Jesus said or did.
Nobody knows all of the things that Jesus said or did. Nobody. Only God.
Only God.
>> Excuse me. So the important thing that's another question.
>> So the mission of Christ, the mission of Christ that he had many things to tell them which he did not at that moment.
But he didn't tell them >> because because he says when I go >> and if I don't go he will not come.
>> Listen when someone says if I start talking to you about geopolitics or something and you don't understand what I'm talking about I'll say to you you will understand when it happens and you'll go away and five years later you'll say oh my goodness I remember that lady in high she told me that was going to happen. Okay. But at the time you couldn't understand it. It would be way above your >> So who is it going to say according to Jesus >> because he says >> your faith your faith >> the words of Jesus please we need to be very text.
>> No you have taken out of context because Jesus says >> Jesus says >> you don't know what I've said.
>> I'll tell you what the context is. Jesus says >> I have many things really going on and on. I have said >> is it too much to hear about your Bible?
>> No, it's too much. You >> sure? So I will finish with this then. I will finish with this example.
>> You don't have a debate. You just >> I will finish. I will finish with this example. So when Jesus says I have many things to tell you but you're not ready.
You can't bear them. But when I go and I will send him if I don't. So basically you are now acknowledging that Jesus did not complete his mission of saying everything that that was needed for them to know that >> he he said he said >> no you're misdring it. Sorry >> you're interrupting. You're interrupting in my care because you can't continue.
>> How can I How can I make my statement?
>> How can I finish my statement without being interrupted?
>> Because you're twisting it. I'm not trusting it >> because Jesus said when I go I will send him >> and he will tell you, guide you and tell you the truth.
>> Not Jesus.
>> The Holy Spirit.
>> Not Jesus.
>> No. The comforter, he will send you the comfort. So get it right.
>> So So hang on. Hang on.
>> Do you do you accept that?
>> You hang on.
>> Do you accept that?
>> You hang on. He said, "I'm not telling you things now because you won't understand." So has Jesus when he sends a comforter comforter is the Holy Spirit who fills you. It's not Muhammad. He is not Muhammad.
>> So tell me the Holy Spirit what he said.
>> You listen to me now. I am listening.
>> You tell me what the holy spirit say.
>> You tell me sister Muhammad. So great.
No disrespect.
>> Are you shifting?
>> I'm want to talk about I'm not shifting.
>> But what I want to ask you is you won't let anybody else talk.
>> I don't let anyone else talk. You're not letting me speak at all about anything >> at all. At all. How long do you need?
>> Well, if I just start.
>> Just tell me. How long do you need?
>> Do you have Jesus?
>> Do you have >> Tell me when you finish. I'm going to listen to you.
>> I want to talk to you about your God.
>> Go ahead.
>> You're Muhammad, your prophet.
>> Yeah.
>> Not mine. So, >> can you tell me where Muhammad is from?
He was from Arabia, >> born from his mother in this earth in the creation of God.
>> Where was he from? Which place?
>> Mecca. Are you sure about that?
>> Yes.
>> Absolutely. 100%.
>> And how what was Mecca like at the time of Muhammad?
>> Mecca wasn't like in like England now.
Mecca had a small population. People were >> listen.
You asked me a question.
>> You asked me a question. So, please listen to the answer. Thank you. And I No, I will tell you when I'm finished.
>> Hurry up because I'm >> No, I'm not going to hurry up. I'm asking question.
>> I'm not going to hurry up.
>> Right. So, I'll tell you then.
>> No, you asked me a question.
>> No, no, you spoke. I >> I would like you to be civilized.
>> I can't.
>> So, I can answer. You just No. You are rude for not letting me answer the question that you asked. Excuse me. I'm answering this question and you do not rudely interrupt. Thank you. So listen now patiently and attentively >> very patient >> and more patience is required. So the Mecca of course Mecca at that time was not a very >> it wasn't a city like England right it was a city with a local description I just asked you >> I am answering you're interrupting do not interrupt >> do not interrupt when I'm answering >> I studied Islam for >> do not answer and I've I've studied Christianity for more than 30 years >> I don't care I'm trying to tell you >> no I'm saying your knowledge about Islam is only 6 years >> and my knowledge is 30 years so don't bring your experience I'm answering question. So I'm not answering about Mecca.
>> So Mecca, do not interrupt, please.
Right.
>> Is it the mother city?
>> Do not interrupt. I'm answering. I am answering. Why are you so rude?
>> Why are you so rude?
>> Because I want you to answer your question.
>> I am answering and I will only be able to answer if you don't rudely interject.
>> Come on then. But be quick like are you?
>> No, you're not quick. You're never quick.
>> Come on. Come on.
>> You see how cameras recording?
>> Come on. Come on.
>> Watch the clip afterwards.
>> I don't want to watch it. You need to do self-reflection.
>> Just answer. What was Mecca?
>> Right. Relax. Then Mecca was the people around. Majority of them were idol worshippers.
>> No, the ground.
>> I'm not finished.
>> But I want to know how.
>> I am not finished. Do not interrupt so rudely.
>> Right. Mecca.
>> Um, excuse me. Why are you so rude?
>> Why you so rude?
>> This is not civilized behavior. And now >> you expect me to listen to you, but you don't listen to me.
>> There's no archaeological evidence.
>> Why? Why are you so rude?
>> Because I'm trying to tell you that you've been >> I'm trying to answer.
>> There's no >> And you're rudely not listening to my answer.
>> Trying to block me.
>> I'm not blocking you.
>> No archaeological evidence.
>> So you read Dan Gibson's book, right?
>> Whose book did you read?
>> Not Dan Gibson.
>> Whose book did you read?
>> Nobody's book.
>> So how did you know there was no evidence?
>> Research.
>> Okay. Give me your names of >> but not but not >> okay I'm researching too no tell me now >> I've got it at home >> what archeological evidence now I don't want you to email tell me now >> what have what academic reference name me one >> written down it's written down >> you can't remember even one >> but it's written down at home with many many others >> one reference >> well I don't know >> you can't remember one you've done a research and you don't even know one reference >> I read my Bible more than I read those >> so what kind of RESEARCH YOU DOING YOU CAN'T REMEMBER ONE INSTANCE of a reference.
>> There's no archeological.
>> I'm saying what you're saying is nonsense.
>> What you're saying is nonsense.
Substantiate. Substantiate.
>> Answer me.
>> What?
>> Why is there no >> you're making statement which is nonsensical? Ahistorical.
>> Answer it.
>> I've just TOLD YOU SO.
>> THE ARCHAEOLOGICAL evidence of Mecca. If you read Ahmed Jalad's work, Ahmed Jalad looking at physical evidence. Why are they building over such sacred land? Why are they >> Have you been to the museums in Saudi Arabia?
>> Listen to me. They're excavating and they haven't found anything there.
>> Have you visited the museums in Saudi Arabia?
>> Why?
>> I'm answering.
>> No, you're not answering.
>> Are you listening?
>> Where is the >> I am saying the evidence are kept. If you ever dare to visit, if you dare to visit the museums in Saudi Arabia, you will see the archaeological evidence >> of Mecca being archaeological.
>> It's barren. There's no trace of any lush.
>> Where did you get that from? Trees or trees. Where did you get that from?
>> Where did you get that from? The research.
>> Which research?
>> Name me a reference.
>> It was like England.
>> Let me a reference. Let me a reference.
>> You told me.
>> You're just waffling now. You told ME >> YOUR RESEARCH YOUR RESEARCH is like >> he said >> what's up university >> was like England before >> I said it wasn't you weren't listening >> it was >> I said it wasn't >> that's not true you said >> I said Mecca was not that shows you you're not even listening to what I said >> okay you're going to edit that one again >> no it's not even my cameras >> you said Mecca was like England >> you have you
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