Update! Justin Baldoni v. Blake Lively DRAMA With Katie Pope! | Ep 170

Added: 2026-05-30

[00:00:00]Hopefully nobody else gets sued and we can all live peacefully.

[00:00:03]>> That's all. Yeah, it's all we ever want.

[00:00:04]>> That's not gonna happen. All we ever want Los Angeles.

[00:00:06]>> I know. I know. Everybody sues everybody.

[00:00:08]>> Everybody sues everybody.

[00:00:10]>> Nobody knows this, but I got a lawsuit against >> I got one against >> suing everybody.

[00:00:23]>> Welcome to the Brotherly Love podcast, everybody. I don't know if you were preview to that uh really interesting conversation that we were having before we started, but here we are today. And we'd like to welcome back my good friend Katie Pope. EVERYBODY, WE GOT LOTS of questions for you.

[00:00:40]>> I hope I can answer.

[00:00:40]>> There's quite a few legal cases out there right now that are quite troubling.

[00:00:44]>> Matt has several of them used himself.

[00:00:46]He ask >> Matt, this is not We're not talking about your legal cases.

[00:00:49]>> Oh, there is a deposition that I'm going to be calling in for. Matt, what is this talking about? WE'RE TALKING TO TRYING TO get some free legal advice.

[00:00:57]>> I would have expected a phone call.

[00:00:58]>> Jesus, what's it? Okay, >> maybe it's that Travass water should be drinking it. Look at it. It's taking him out.

[00:01:03]>> So, let me start off with >> Pete's not as reliable as we thought, is it, man?

[00:01:07]>> My uh my jury duty. Can I get out of it?

[00:01:11]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:01:12]>> Uh I mean, I guess my my prudent response here would be you should go.

[00:01:19]>> Yes.

[00:01:20]>> Perfect. That's >> I will be going. The lines come up. We go to We go to black and then we come back and you're like you're feel you're totally relaxed.

[00:01:28]>> Well, we figured that out.

[00:01:31]>> What was said? What the hell? I was writing a check.

[00:01:35]>> This will do the trick.

[00:01:38]>> Don't do that.

[00:01:40]>> Oh man.

[00:01:41]>> Sir, are you trying to bribe the state court?

[00:01:44]>> Yeah. Let's >> never going to make your life.

[00:01:50]This thing right here.

[00:01:51]>> 20 bucks.

[00:01:52]>> Yeah.

[00:01:53]>> Yeah. I don't know where that came from.

[00:01:54]What's up, Andy? You have you have questions?

[00:01:56]>> Yeah. What do you have >> papers? Andy's new thing is >> prints out papers.

[00:02:00]>> Should we explain that that that we have our our legal specialist?

[00:02:04]>> Our legal specialist here on the show. She's a legal specialist.

[00:02:09]We really love pod show as as for and for many other shows, but but ours in particular.

[00:02:13]>> She's our podcast lawyer.

[00:02:15]>> Special special place in my heart. This one.

[00:02:17]>> We have a little >> Yes. Katie's now on retainer. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[00:02:20]>> Yeah. For like a dollar.

[00:02:22]>> He's also up on all of the latest, >> you know, legal battle and pop cult pop culture legal battles, right?

[00:02:29]>> Oh, yes. Okay.

[00:02:29]>> I try to be on on most of them.

[00:02:31]>> How do we What's your TikTok? How do people find you on Tik Tok?

[00:02:34]>> Katy Rose Pope.

[00:02:34]>> Okay, there you go. Katie Rose Pope.

[00:02:36]Everybody check it out. Give her a follow. She'll keep you in the loop.

[00:02:39]What are you doing, Matt?

[00:02:40]>> I brought some snacks.

[00:02:42]>> He brought worms.

[00:02:43]>> These are mulberry worms.

[00:02:46]>> Oh my god, bro. from Fram Cams >> from where >> Matt's getting >> Matt's doing company old time Matt is look at these beautiful >> silk worms these are amazing feeders for all your chameleons bearded dragons sometimes even like them but they eat only malberry leaves >> I don't even really know what a malberry leaf is >> oh it's a tree on me uh if it's a tree >> that and they only eat malberry we not have the defecation worms.

[00:03:18]>> Smells like chocolate.

[00:03:20]>> Why don't you try?

[00:03:21]>> Smells like chocolate.

[00:03:21]>> I'm not smelling that smell in that container. Broken.

[00:03:24]>> Okay, I'll smell it.

[00:03:25]>> Smell. Tell me if it smells like chocolate.

[00:03:27]>> Just remember that there there's a lot of poop in there.

[00:03:29]>> Oh, it kind of oddly does. But like in like the worst way. Like if that makes some sense. Cuz I do think I just smelled.

[00:03:37]>> I'm sure. And it's like if you ate chocolate and it directly pooped out kind of a thing.

[00:03:43]>> Yeah.

[00:03:43]>> These guys, they're really soft. You want to feel them?

[00:03:45]>> No, I don't want to feel anything. All I'm telling you is always pimping out the pod.

[00:03:48]>> I actually used to like dig for worms a lot.

[00:03:50]>> How smooth it is.

[00:03:52]>> Oh yeah. Oddly smooth.

[00:03:53]>> And they and they spin silk >> and people use See, look. Look at the silk. He's already spinning it. I don't know if you see this on camera, but they spin silk. And you can use silkworm silk for many different applications.

[00:04:04]>> Joe makes himself a shirt.

[00:04:05]>> Whoa. Look at this ascot. I just made it. But look at this one. This one's more striped like a tiger.

[00:04:11]>> I mean, think about it though, man.

[00:04:12]These poor guys are kept in there.

[00:04:14]>> What do you do with them?

[00:04:15]>> Wait. So, where did you get that?

[00:04:16]>> Joe, it looks like it's on your You're on your lips.

[00:04:19]>> Joe, stick out your tongue.

[00:04:22]>> Wait, stick out his tongue.

[00:04:23]>> Oh, no.

[00:04:24]>> I made you lick a silkworm.

[00:04:25]>> The problem is that they're they're in that box until they get eaten.

[00:04:29]>> No, no, no, no, no. I feed them. I'm going to This is just This what they came in the mail package.

[00:04:33]>> Okay, great. So, you're going to put them in a slightly >> go container that used to have pot stickers.

[00:04:36]>> He's going to put them in a He's going to put them in a a slightly >> These are my animals pot stickers. Yes.

[00:04:41]>> He's going to put them in a slightly >> Check out Fram Scams. Jesus. Mary and John Rams for your paying panther chameleons and all your silver does take over.

[00:04:51]>> Did we not talk over each other? You guys are driving me literally insane.

[00:04:54]>> Is that a store or did you get them online?

[00:04:57]>> So, this is it's it's actually like out of their home. It's just a couple.

[00:05:00]>> It's a in Los Angeles.

[00:05:02]>> No, no, I think they're somewhere on the East Coast. It's a happy couple, but they So, anyway, the guy I think if I'm not mistaken, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think he actually quit his main job because this has become such a good business.

[00:05:13]>> Is it really just only the worms?

[00:05:15]>> No, they sell he breeds panther chameleons like lots.

[00:05:17]>> Okay. And so then he also feeds.

[00:05:20]>> Just to clarify, they're going to be moved to a slightly bigger box and then gut loaded and then fed to something.

[00:05:25]>> Exactly.

[00:05:25]>> So, how did you find this company?

[00:05:27]>> Instagram.

[00:05:28]>> Oh, >> yeah. All the animal, you know, all the animals. Was it a targeted ad or were you just like stumbling?

[00:05:34]>> No, I I I follow so many different >> Got it.

[00:05:37]>> Worm peoples and chameleon people and Gu that it comes across my feed now. So that means it's a targeted ad.

[00:05:44]>> No, no, no. There was no targeted ad algorithm.

[00:05:46]>> No, >> a little bit of both.

[00:05:48]>> No. And you have no idea what >> in your legal opinion. Who's right?

[00:05:52]>> Depends.

[00:05:52]>> Me or Matt?

[00:05:53]>> The >> He probably likes you.

[00:05:55]>> Would you like a sticker?

[00:05:56]>> Well, of course. Matt's playing with worms.

[00:05:58]>> Okay. Who wouldn't like me better in this moment?

[00:06:01]>> Cra >> chameleons.

[00:06:06]They're called Cams.

[00:06:07]>> Is it also?

[00:06:08]>> And his name is >> Yeah, this is this is another my bracelet that he gave.

[00:06:11]>> He has swag.

[00:06:12]>> Yep. I got Fram Cam swag.

[00:06:14]>> Gosh, >> love it.

[00:06:15]>> And this is my unlimited exotic swag for my monitors. I've got a black water monitor, black dragon.

[00:06:22]>> This is my tokens of valor. Redbeard relics. Red beard relics right here.

[00:06:27]No, I just I just You actually care.

[00:06:29]>> I actually care.

[00:06:30]>> Okay, that's good.

[00:06:31]>> I'm going to put Fram's cams on my mic.

[00:06:33]>> That's actually really nice when >> No, I don't I don't know. I don't take money from these people. In fact, I paid for those silkworms. I just uh >> It's not upside down, Matt.

[00:06:42]>> They're not upside down.

[00:06:43]>> That's perfect.

[00:06:43]>> When they're a good company and I like, you know, what they're doing.

[00:06:48]>> Redbeard relics. My buddy Josh is Redard. I got all my tokens. Pirate jewelry.

[00:06:52]>> Oh, okay. Okay. I remember when you were telling us about the pirate. He's a good dude.

[00:06:56]>> Awesome. It's awesome.

[00:06:57]>> Where you could buy the treasure?

[00:06:58]>> Yeah. Yeah. Look at this.

[00:07:00]>> Is that like >> old coins? A vintage old uh uh >> Okay. Do you know >> that's really not what that is at all.

[00:07:08]>> Can you tell me what it is, Andy?

[00:07:09]>> It's a 1700s. Uh I believe it's a Lima.

[00:07:12]>> Yeah.

[00:07:13]>> Maybe it's not a Lima. Could be an escoo.

[00:07:15]>> He gave me this as a gift.

[00:07:17]>> That's a Lima. That's from the I think it's from the >> get tangled. See, this is why I don't wear multiple chains a lot cuz they just get tangled.

[00:07:22]>> It's got like all these chains.

[00:07:24]>> I have a bunch of them as well, but they're getting worked on right now.

[00:07:26]Okay.

[00:07:26]>> These aren't them. My >> official >> I'm getting this is really used.

[00:07:30]>> Yeah. You've seen this ring, right?

[00:07:32]>> Yes.

[00:07:32]>> Yeah. So, that was that's a real Lima.

[00:07:34]Like >> it's a real Lima.

[00:07:39]>> Okay. That was used to pay for something. But what's the back story like?

[00:07:42]>> Well, okay. So, that's from I think it's from the Seville Mint, which was uh destroyed in an earthquake. But back in the day, they >> one piece, a two-piece, a four piece, and an eight piece.

[00:07:50]>> Seville in Spain.

[00:07:51]>> Yes. And so so the pirates would wear their currency cuz they would get taxed at the ports.

[00:07:56]>> Yeah.

[00:07:56]>> You literally take a little piece of this. This is solid silver.

[00:07:59]>> Yeah. It's >> a little piece off and >> pay for like a little tool where they would bang it and >> it wasn't a specific tool any >> We should bring that back.

[00:08:06]>> I would love to. So I have I I So when I hang out with Josh, we barter with with each other in silver and act like pirates. It's really fun.

[00:08:15]>> Especially like Andy's entire life has become Burning Man >> pretty much.

[00:08:18]>> I'll give you this shilling and you give me this. That's really what it is.

[00:08:21]PIRACY.

[00:08:22]>> HONESTLY, THAT KIND OF sounds fun.

[00:08:24]>> Desert like go-kart that he drives around now. And >> build like a fake pirate ship in your backyard or something. There's a house in the valley that has a pirate ship in the yard. This driven by a few times.

[00:08:34]>> Where is this house?

[00:08:36]>> Josh and I are going to >> Woodland Hills area.

[00:08:38]>> Wow. The best part about Josh, he's like 6'5, huge pirate.

[00:08:42]>> He's got this massive beard. That's why it's red beard.

[00:08:45]>> And yeah, it's great. It's really fun when we walk around town together.

[00:08:48]>> It's great. That's where the story was going. This big 65 pirate guy. He's a great guy.

[00:08:53]>> No, he's a great guy. He really is great guy. And your jewelry line is gonna be amazing.

[00:08:57]>> Yeah. Well, there's another guy named Josh. It's kind of jewelry line.

[00:09:00]>> It's a little confusing. So, it's Josh and Josh.

[00:09:02]>> Okay.

[00:09:02]>> There's Josh Scott who's Redbeard and then there's another Josh who is a tokens of valor and he's the guy he's the actual the craftsman behind all these pieces. He makes them all by hand.

[00:09:11]>> Okay.

[00:09:11]>> And uh yeah, it's going to be a skill.

[00:09:13]>> I know. He's really cool.

[00:09:15]>> That is pretty cool. That's something you hear every day. I see I do see this defamation on the top.

[00:09:19]>> Yeah. Yeah. So, we're here today really to follow up. I've been I'm >> enough about this. Katie, >> let's talk about pirate treasure and worms.

[00:09:27]>> Yeah. Welcome, Katie.

[00:09:28]>> Glad we had Katie on. She's so happy she's here.

[00:09:32]>> I actually wouldn't mind talking about worms and pirates.

[00:09:34]>> Yeah. Okay. See, >> what a nice person. A lot nicer than me.

[00:09:39]I'd just get up and leave. I just have some questions here.

[00:09:42]>> Oh, no.

[00:09:43]>> All right, Andy. I just prepared prepared a few little questions. But we can I mean we don't have to stay totally on track.

[00:09:48]>> Yeah. Don't worry. I don't think we're going to read that. Like there's a lot of people don't read anything. That's why you're here.

[00:09:53]>> Why are definitely >> we never read any of our contracts.

[00:09:59]>> Sorry. Go ahead. I keep quiet.

[00:10:00]>> There's some sort of legal bound to get these guys to keep quiet.

[00:10:04]>> No.

[00:10:05]>> See? See?

[00:10:07]>> Why are defamation cases difficult to win? Okay. Yeah, I can answer that.

[00:10:10]>> Okay. Why? Tell us >> what is a defamation case?

[00:10:13]>> Oh my god. We're starting at ground zero.

[00:10:16]>> Well, yeah. I mean, I'm I sort of understand somebody goes out there and publicly says something >> defaming you >> about your character, >> right?

[00:10:24]>> I mean, who hasn't done that? I mean, somebody's done it to me a bunch of times. You do it on the daily.

[00:10:29]>> No, I've never done it. I always just stay very quiet.

[00:10:31]>> You were talking about Joe earlier before you got here.

[00:10:33]>> Well, I've had defaming me my whole life.

[00:10:37]>> I've had some runins as of late.

[00:10:39]>> With some defaming.

[00:10:40]>> Oh, yeah. Matt might actually call for your services. Yeah, it's very true.

[00:10:45]>> Why it would happen?

[00:10:46]>> I had a company trying to defame me as of recent.

[00:10:49]>> Yeah. Because of a accidental posting, not by me, but someone that I'm associated with like >> Katie knows all about it.

[00:10:58]>> Oh, you do? Okay. So, >> I do. Andy was talking about >> doesn't know about it. Okay. So, obviously someone I'm associ with, I will remain named this. I think you all know who. uh accidentally posted something this whole firestorm and uh yeah and then apparently what what the digging found out is that a company don't know who hired them but a company was hired and a lot of money was spent >> and also this is the best I got to say and this person >> I got to say this too it's all false >> it's all false >> they even went as far as they went as far as like posting like look at these these contributions and things that >> that's not actually your last name >> it's not his name >> I didn't make anything >> it's it's the wrong first of all I never get in the middle of politics cuz I'm literally and I've said this many many times. I'm right down in the middle. I don't I don't adhere to any one or the other. I just kind of like >> It's so funny though >> in my own thinker make judgment calls and certain things and it's just my own personal thing, but I don't associate with any >> I think critically about everything.

[00:11:53]Good. I >> I don't associate with any party or I just don't do it personally. It's not for me. I don't blame people for doing it. You can go out there and support whatever you want. That's another thing.

[00:12:02]I'm very like open-minded, compassionate human being. And yeah, they took this all out of from I don't know where. It's not true. And then they went through my followers list. Get it off your chest, man.

[00:12:11]>> Well, yeah. Well, then they went through my followers list and only picked out >> possibly conservative type website, but didn't didn't go with the majority of all the other people I follow, which aren't necessarily conservative, like Obama and all these other people. I follow everybody. I mostly follow animal stuff because I like the conservation.

[00:12:29]Exactly. So, like it's just so funny how people will go and try to defame you these days. Now, is there do I have a case against it?

[00:12:36]>> It depends on what the statements were exactly. You have to look at either the spoken statement or the written statement. And it actually has to be untrue, right? And it can't be an opinion. If something is an opinion, then it's also protected. Got it.

[00:12:49]>> The most challenging part about defamation too, especially for you all, is that you're public figures. So uh the additional thing that has to be proved is actual malice which means that the person had to either >> speak or write the statement with reckless disregard for uh the truth or that they knowingly published it knowing like this was actually inaccurate.

[00:13:10]>> Got it.

[00:13:11]>> Uh and so that's a pretty high hurdle and that's why a lot of defamation cases are pretty difficult. And now the idea of a public figure has really expanded.

[00:13:20]You know, I so many people are on Tik Tok. Like I'm on TikTok and I was a random person, right? Like you're kind of all putting yourself out there and you can be a limited purpose public figure, too. So that actual malice standard is challenging. There's some people that think we should get rid of the actual malice standard. There's some people think the other side of this like we should keep it.

[00:13:39]>> Obviously people have first amendment rights.

[00:13:42]>> So um >> and those need to be protected.

[00:13:44]>> Yeah, of course. So it's hard to find that middle ground, but that is one of the reasons that their defamation cases are so difficult. But we're seeing a lot of them, especially in the public. Um, there's a lot of well-known figures that are being sued for defamation.

[00:13:55]>> Taking case out against these guys.

[00:13:59]>> You're not going to get anywhere with that schmuck.

[00:14:01]>> They keep slandering my name.

[00:14:02]>> You know what's sad?

[00:14:03]>> You did beat. You know what's sad though is that then this is what I found is I think they're doing it because they think that it'll hurt you when and your ability to earn a living and support your family which is really quite vicious >> you know to think to go after somebody knowing >> they had to know it's it's not true. I mean if you just do the research on me you know it's not true. So they act actively went out there and was like, I'm going to try to hurt this person to prevent them from working in an industry that clearly doesn't like that point of view.

[00:14:36]>> I guess >> very interesting.

[00:14:38]>> Well, I don't know who actually published these statements.

[00:14:41]>> It was like US Weekly people.

[00:14:43]>> Wait, really?

[00:14:44]>> But then do you think that there's >> I didn't know that.

[00:14:46]>> I guess to take this slightly towards the Blake Lively camp, >> which I feel like is ultimately where we're headed.

[00:14:52]And you guys would probably know more about this than I, but like the PR side of things, right, in crisis PR and how people plant stories. Oh, yeah. And they kind of push that narrative.

[00:15:01]>> It is very real.

[00:15:02]>> I mean, that's really what we got to see in the Blake Lively case is we got to take a look under the hood and see these text messages and emails between PR teams.

[00:15:11]>> Yes, >> it's one of my questions.

[00:15:13]>> You let her speak cuz honestly, >> that's really true. That's the last 45 seconds has been I think the most intelligent >> 45 seconds >> we've had in three and a half years of doing this bot. I think the way that she just spoke I don't think is we've never had a more intelligent moment ever.

[00:15:28]>> I don't know. You've had some smart.

[00:15:29]>> No, it was calm. It was succinct. It was eloquently stated.

[00:15:34]>> It You used a verbose vocabulary.

[00:15:36]Honestly, >> yeah. Take it away. We're giving our fans finally something worthwhile to tune in for. You give your fans a lot. I And I was watching your uh Project Hail Mary episode last night, >> which I went to go see because of Katie.

[00:15:50]>> Dude, how good is that? Oh my god. I was >> I mean, I read the book and I was obsessed with that and then I pushed >> Yeah. And Britney and I really wanted to see it, but but Katie was the driving force for all of us to go to the movies and we I mean, I loved it so much.

[00:16:02]>> I speaking about getting to to peak under the hood, this experience allowed me to do that because that was exactly what it was. It was it wasn't that it was even a real narrative. It was there was a company literally creating the narrative by putting clips after clip and just flooding the algorithm with enough clips that that other than people that weren't paid, other influencers then picked up on it. Oo, maybe this is I could get in this algorithm to get my own clicks.

[00:16:29]>> I just love grows. It's like a forest fire. And that's how you start it.

[00:16:32]>> But it kind of is. And there's one thing and I'm I don't know this 100% for fact.

[00:16:38]I don't know this is gospel but I've heard that like YouTube for instance the ad buyers will buy based on um keywords or topics right so then say this topic is trending then all of a sudden before you know it the ad dollars are getting pushed towards videos >> so then people are that obviously people want to make money I get it so then they're reposting these things but then before you know it your whole algorithm is things that's being dictated by ad revenue and and what they want advertised, but then that's based off of key words and topics that people want pushed. And so it is this it's hard cuz I do find Tik Tok to be pretty authentic, but then at the same time, >> you kind of have to be weary of some of these things.

[00:17:23]>> Yeah. We're entering we're entering an era where uh internet opinion matters more than court ruling almost.

[00:17:29]>> Oh, I I think so. people used it as a as a de facto jury in this case too because we would see things on the docket and they would get unsealed and you would read messages and then you'd have myself and plenty of others who I've had the pleasure of meeting over the last year and a half that would kind of go wild because you'd read a text message and you'd be like oh my gosh this is insane like who is saying this behind somebody's back or like when Sony is bad mouthing Blake Lively you're like god it's >> wild stuff and you're like I you know you never would have seen this. So, >> I didn't know that you could like I mean, how much do emails and text message actually matter? For a while though, I felt like it they they were admissible, but now it's >> Well, at this point, they are not even necessarily being admitted and obviously it's been dismissed and settled, but um you know, discovery is a broader net than admissible in the courtroom, right?

[00:18:22]So, they were getting there and they that's what they were actually fighting over is what was admissible in the courtroom, but it was still on the docket and most of it was unsealed. So we could go through like myself um and read text messages with Taylor Swift, text messages with PR, >> the back emails with Sony, like what they were really thinking. Oh my gosh, we really need to talk. You're trying to delete dailies. Like what is going on?

[00:18:44]>> I mean, if my text messages with Nave were ever released, my life would be over.

[00:18:48]>> You really have to think about what you put in writing. And the other thing too that I think Blake Lively's side had asked for and what you're scared now. Oh, no. It's just >> his eyes just were like, >> "No, it's just it is just it just it's just a crazy thing." Go ahead.

[00:19:03]>> I think the >> Yeah, he's worried.

[00:19:07]>> Don't worry.

[00:19:08]>> These guys are >> Joe will be calling you after this.

[00:19:13]>> Oh boy.

[00:19:14]>> No, I'm just like >> No, it's it's true. In fact, I heard a quote, "Don't put anything in writing these days that you wouldn't be okay with seeing on the cover of the Washington Post."

[00:19:22]>> No, it's very true. And it's hard cuz people do read things out of context cuz you're you're never going to be able to read a whole person's conversation or be in their shoes. So like everything is to a degree out of context.

[00:19:33]>> Context is a moment in time. You know, it's a weird is a bunch of stuff the factors that come into it. So you cherry pick a statement. You cherry pick a series of statements >> and then it gets blown out of proportion. Yeah. Misinterpreted whatever it is means.

[00:19:43]>> It's this just infatuation with you know the people's lives and behind the scene.

[00:19:48]It's wild stuff. It is really wild. I mean it's always been you know fodder for you know tab tabloids and things but like you said this the social media element to it and just the ex complete 247 explosion of you know privacy is uh you know >> yeah nobody has implosion what >> nobody has any privacy no one it's a figment of everyone's imagination I guess the one thing I was always wondering about was you know Blake had asked I believe when she was subpoenaing documents during discovery she had asked for even like login to somebody's Gmail account.

[00:20:20]>> That's insane.

[00:20:21]>> And and this is why it's because apparently the CIA, which I know, target word, maybe >> we all just bolt >> like CL okay I guess >> just takes over one mic left >> clandestine operations. What they will do is like say you guys are working with each other but you're in different locations. You'll have a common login and so instead of sending the email, they'll have it in drafts. So it's never sent. So there isn't like a finalized record. That's brilliant.

[00:20:50]>> Right. And I was thinking you could probably also do that with like notes app, right? Because you can have shared notes.

[00:20:53]>> That's brilliant.

[00:20:54]>> Yeah. And so I was like sometimes when she would ask for things I'd be like do you ask for these things because you've done them in the past, right? Like you know these tactics.

[00:21:03]>> This is brilliant dude.

[00:21:04]>> Um so >> wow I'm never sending another message again. Just go to the drafts guys.

[00:21:09]>> Well you know you know here's and and here's just to add on top of that.

[00:21:12]Here's also a little interesting fact is that they're now >> uh ending end to end encryption on your Instagram DMs.

[00:21:20]>> Oh, meta.

[00:21:21]>> Yeah, they have everything.

[00:21:23]>> Why would they do that?

[00:21:24]>> Well, because they want everything.

[00:21:26]>> Exactly.

[00:21:26]>> They want all the data.

[00:21:27]>> That information it will be shared now.

[00:21:28]So, forget about like you even have to think about like we're brothers, right?

[00:21:33]>> Sure.

[00:21:34]>> I'll come across something online. No, I'll come across something in on social media that is clearly offensive >> and I'll send it to my brother >> strictly because he's my brother >> and that is something even that now is almost scary and almost off limits now.

[00:21:51]>> Ridiculous.

[00:21:52]>> Yeah. And that's hard too because like you could be sending it and you don't know your opinion of it, right? But people are going to interpret that opinion.

[00:21:59]>> They're going to say you liked it. It's always seemed that if you share something, it's in support of it, which actually most of the time I feel that at least in my case, if I share something with them, it's either I'm I'm I'm blown away or shocked that somebody would do that or it's so offensive that I'm like, "Guys, you got to see this. This is bizarre." Exactly. It's bizarre.

[00:22:19]>> So, but it is funny how not funny, but it is it is it's so inaccurate that the perception is it's always in support of whatever you said.

[00:22:27]>> Yes.

[00:22:28]>> He must love it cuz he sent it. No, I send it cuz I hate it.

[00:22:31]>> You know, yes.

[00:22:33]>> I feel that's more than not the case.

[00:22:35]Usually when people share things, I think it's in shock.

[00:22:38]>> Yeah, of course. Of course. Or like I'll send you guys stuff um with the AI explosion.

[00:22:44]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:22:44]>> Some of these videos that are created, I'm not I don't I'm necessarily I don't adhere to the content of the video. What I adhere to is the amazement of AI >> to recreate >> and what it's done, >> right?

[00:22:55]>> Yeah. Or you can't even tell some of them these days. Like you have to do a double take and then where you're like at Grock, is this real?

[00:23:03]>> I know. I know.

[00:23:04]>> I'm doing that all the time on X cuz it's just so hard to believe sometimes.

[00:23:08]>> It is.

[00:23:09]>> It's such a weird world we live in. So, okay.

[00:23:12]>> Yeah. Back to your list.

[00:23:13]>> Well, I mean, you know, it's a broad broad spectrum.

[00:23:16]>> So, going to the Blake Lobby thing like that case is over, right? It's done.

[00:23:19]>> Pretty much. There's one thing that's outstanding, which is this 47.1 law in California. I think the judge is about >> what what was it? 0.1 million.

[00:23:29]>> Well, I wonder did they ever come to the conclusion if the controversy actually derailed the the production and or the financial gains or I mean >> so I mean >> it's helped to be honest with you.

[00:23:40]>> Yeah. I mean it was I forget what the numbers were on It Ends With Us but I mean it exploded the movie. I think it it financially did very well. And I don't think that there was necessarily an issue on on the uh you know the movie itself making money, but more on Blake Lively claiming that she >> her reputation was harmed from the alleged retaliation.

[00:23:59]>> Um >> whose lawyer sleeping now? His or hers?

[00:24:02]Which one? Which legal team is getting a good night's sleep?

[00:24:06]>> Uh I would think maybe his more than hers cuz she's still in it for this 47.1 which I don't think she's going to get.

[00:24:13]She's asking for attorney's fees plus triple damages plus punitive damages, which would be tens of millions of dollars. It's a new law in California.

[00:24:20]It's supposed to be like a me too law where like if you make a complaint for some form of like harassment, discrimination like she did, >> um that if that person then turns around and sues you for defamation and you prevail, which she technically did because it got dismissed when he sued her for defamation, that then you're the the triple damage, the triple damage is there. That's like the big component to this. It's like >> it's supposed to deter people from, you know, having this counter action >> uh >> of defamation, you know, if you were a true victim, right? Because then, >> but it's hard because >> you counter sue often so that you have skin in the game, right? Um, if I'm being sued and then all of a sudden I'm like, "Oh my gosh, none of these things happened and actually you did XYZ and I was never going to sue you over it, but now that you've sued me for 10 items, like I should throw it back because you have to have a defensive strategy." It's actually one of the things in insurance that bothers me the most and I'm fighting with insurance companies regularly on is that oftentimes counter suits aren't covered, right? But to me, that's part of the defensive strategy, right? Um, how am I supposed to have leverage in a settlement if I have nothing against you, right? Like and and maybe and obviously you would want those claims to be uh you know to have merit to them. I'm not saying frivolous claims by any stretch of the imagination, but so that was kind of part of this is like he had this defensive strategy and they were dismissed because they fell under the litigation privilege andor the fair report privilege and so it had nothing to do with actually like whether or not they were true or false or if she had set them with malice. So, she does have that going. I don't think any of this happened in California. I don't think California law applies. I think this law is unconstitutional because it's over broad and impacts the First Amendment.

[00:26:10]>> And I think that this federal judge in New York is going to feel similarly and he's kind of already indicated that he's pretty annoyed.

[00:26:16]>> Wow.

[00:26:17]>> So, >> interesting.

[00:26:18]>> Um, it's it is a real interesting legal question, though. Uh, so we will see.

[00:26:24]It's also a new lawsuit. It hasn't really been tested.

[00:26:26]>> 47.1.

[00:26:27]>> Yeah.

[00:26:28]>> Yeah. Don't.

[00:26:30]>> I think they're gonna need a 47.2.

[00:26:32]>> Yeah. 47.12 >> the update.

[00:26:36]>> What?

[00:26:37]>> 47.18.

[00:26:38]>> Give me my phone right now. iOS 47.121.

[00:26:42]>> Oh my god.

[00:26:43]>> Oh, we haven't even implemented 47.1.

[00:26:47]>> But the rest of it and also whatever decision comes out, they've given up the ability to appeal it. All sides have said nothing is appealable, which is an interesting thing. And there's no confidentiality agreement in the settlement. No money changed hands.

[00:27:00]>> Wait, what?

[00:27:01]>> Yeah, this is it's actually kind of insane. So, I think he's going to probably I don't know if he'll do a documentary or a tell all or what, but he'll he'll come out with his side of the story is what it sounds like.

[00:27:10]>> After this really gets wrapped up here.

[00:27:12]>> It really just seems like a giant marketing scheme to promote the movie.

[00:27:15]That's really what I thought it was.

[00:27:17]>> I was like, "This is brilliant."

[00:27:18]>> No, this was this was a feud.

[00:27:21]>> This was definitely a feud.

[00:27:23]>> Something happened on it.

[00:27:24]>> Yeah. I mean, >> who knows?

[00:27:27]>> Yeah. Yeah. Something >> something definitely occurred. Whether it was power struggle eos, it's always about egos. Egos got involved and >> you know, it was it was >> Don't tell me that. I just got into a bit of an ego dispute with somebody on the phone the other day.

[00:27:41]>> Did you really?

[00:27:41]>> What do you mean you were there? Both you guys were there.

[00:27:44]>> The problem was he completely misunderstood what I was talking about.

[00:27:48]>> So, the ego came out in the wrong way.

[00:27:51]But >> he did send that horrific post.

[00:27:55]I guess the question though is like when you're on set and you have a director, are you trying to go against them and undermine them? Because that's what it appeared like she was doing.

[00:28:04]>> She always does, but it's true. I'm >> professional. I'm always trying to undermine the people I like.

[00:28:10]>> Matt's the uh >> Matt's the Blake Lively of the family.

[00:28:14]>> Don't you dare live.

[00:28:16]>> Well, you know what? I I think she's kind of unfortunately and correct me if I'm wrong and I don't want to create a narrative here because one of my questions is can Tik Tok creators accidentally create legal exposure when when covering like celebrity drama but um I she kind of has I mean if you look at over the years it might lean to prove she has an issue >> with says it prior to this she literally says >> she literally says I like to go in as the actress but then rug pull >> and become the director. She says it in an interview.

[00:28:48]>> Oh my goodness gracious.

[00:28:50]>> I did see that interview. I was shocked.

[00:28:52]>> She was so lighthearted about it too, Joe. She was like, "Well, the thing is, you know, >> I guess people can get a little upset with me because they hire me as an actor, but secretly >> I will rug pull and become the director."

[00:29:04]>> Yeah. And you're like, "Then I pull the >> and then the camera pans a representative and the rep's like, >> "Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. I know.

[00:29:11]>> Don't say that." Right. Like that. which is I think part of this too is she's played by this kind of traditional PR playbook. Yeah. That maybe you guys are also a little bit more familiar with and we live in this Tik Tok world where even that the movie was from the book and it blew up because of Tik Tok and she needed to kind of lean into these things >> and it seemed like she was really playing by this. Let's just push narratives to People magazine, US Weekly, I don't know, whatever. Like, >> right.

[00:29:37]>> Yeah.

[00:29:38]>> Interesting. It always gets me when I when people underestimate that really the only narrative now in town is social media. There there isn't anything else >> which is scary.

[00:29:49]>> It is scary.

[00:29:50]>> But it's true. You can't deny the fact that you can literally destroy someone or blow up whatever narrative you want.

[00:30:00]>> Yeah. Selective editing and >> by social media alone.

[00:30:02]>> Selective editing and clipping content is dangerous.

[00:30:05]>> Oh my gosh. It's It is dangerous cuz >> it's all about the clipping. Yeah.

[00:30:08]>> Well, the clipping is like the new I saw somebody say it's like the new drop shipping because people >> and I there's a podcast I listen to uh Julian Dory and he lets people clip his podcast and I think they make money off of it which is kind of brilliant because then you like end up getting more exposure from it.

[00:30:23]>> That's exactly what's >> And so like all these random accounts are like clipping the larger podcast >> and I I don't know. I'm like whoa.

[00:30:31]>> Yeah. No, that that is so that's the name of the game because when you >> when you when you see ching jokes objective you just say woo cuz can you say it again? I get paid.

[00:30:41]>> No, like you though. I can't say it like you.

[00:30:43]>> Yeah, you there's a few hats behind him.

[00:30:44]I don't know if you can. And his doll like got >> Yeah, it was subliminal.

[00:30:49]>> I I turn all the guests into my wo machines. He sets that up every before every pod. He comes and puts all those hats up.

[00:30:56]>> Yeah, he dusts them. Although Joe, you're you're slacking. You need a little dusting.

[00:31:00]>> I know. I only come here when absolutely necessary. Trust me.

[00:31:03]>> No, but I you'll you'll see these things now and you'll you'll see these people who are somehow make it into everyone's feed and then you research it and you you find out that like they were a part of four to 30,000 clips this in a month.

[00:31:18]And you're like, "Oh, no wonder why."

[00:31:20]It's literally impossible to compete with somebody who's got 30 different 30,000 different pieces of their content circulating on social media. That's like it's almost mindblowing when you think about it. You're like >> Yeah. Like a brush fire just takes takes takes off.

[00:31:38]>> Yeah, it does.

[00:31:40]>> Yeah. But I guess somehow you get the other people to work for you basically and split it a little bit. So like then it's I I mean it it is >> you put some bait out there, you know, some material and they run with it.

[00:31:51]>> It almost be it almost has become more of a PR battle than a legal battle it seems.

[00:31:55]>> Mhm.

[00:31:56]>> Right.

[00:31:57]>> Very smart, man.

[00:31:58]>> What?

[00:31:59]>> Very very insightful.

[00:32:02]>> The court of public opinion is what they call it.

[00:32:05]>> I mean, it's so funny because you go back to like literally like the Roman times LIKE THE LITTLE THINGS.

[00:32:11]>> I THINK he's guilty.

[00:32:13]It's like it hasn't changed.

[00:32:15]>> You've actually gone full circle back.

[00:32:17]>> Literally just it's just >> I'd like to SEE THOSE TWO FIGHT.

[00:32:20]>> YEAH, EXACTLY.

[00:32:21]>> GRAB THE LION.

[00:32:24]>> FROM A MASTADON in there and that back in the day it'd be Blake and what's his face and we a lion >> in the coliseum. From a legal standpoint, what's the single most damaging allegation in the entire Blake Lively or and Justin Baldon situation?

[00:32:39]>> That's that's challenging. Um, there's a few things I can think of. One, the Vanzan lawsuit. I still like I'm not >> Vanam lawsuit.

[00:32:46]>> Is it?

[00:32:47]>> I'm still not over in there.

[00:32:50]>> Take your fancy clothes and you're still going to know.

[00:32:53]>> Vanzan is a company. It's a It sounds like it's a shell company that was owned by Blake and Ryan.

[00:32:58]>> No, Shell Company.

[00:33:01]>> You say it like that. Those are This are fairly common.

[00:33:04]>> Collecting shells on the beach. What's wrong with that? Uh, so wait, so the Vanzan. Okay. Yeah.

[00:33:08]>> So what is that? It was a shop company that they didn't really do much. They It doesn't look like the company does much, right? Maybe they paid a few employees through it. Uh and >> back prior to the big lawsuit, she Vanzan initiated this smaller lawsuit in September of 2024, late September. And all that the lawsuit did, it just named John Doe's as the defendants. It did not name a defendant. And what that did is it allowed them to get the subpoena power by filing the lawsuit. And then they subpoenaed uh Stephanie Jones for uh her messages cuz Stephanie Jones was uh the PR lady for Belon.

[00:33:53]>> Wow.

[00:33:54]>> But her underling, Jen Ael, was the one that really handled the Belon account.

[00:33:59]And they had had a falling out, uh Stephanie Jones and Jen Ael. And so it appears that Stephanie Jones kind of let Blake's team know that she had some damning messages um about like a smear campaign and so they used this lawsuit to like obtain them. And so to me, like as a lawyer, I couldn't imagine filing that lawsuit to be quite frank with you because the nature of the complaint is around like contractual like a it's a contract dispute and it's like the most boilerplate like we believe so and so breached the contract, but there's no defendant named. How do you try to sue over a breach of contract when you don't know the other party?

[00:34:45]>> Wow.

[00:34:45]>> Like that that screams to me playing a little dirty.

[00:34:50]>> Yeah. Like I don't this is about this is the behind this is the the the deep state kind of stuff >> because presumably Stephanie Jones's contract with Wayfair and Belon had a confidentiality agreement in it that said something like, you know, unless I'm complying with a subpoena, you know, of a court of competent jurisdiction.

[00:35:12]And so she felt like she couldn't turn over those messages until she had a subpoena. So they Yeah, that's what it appears to me. That's my opinion.

[00:35:20]>> So it was it was a it was a way to exchange information with legal protections for the person who was exchanging.

[00:35:25]>> That's what they thought, but it doesn't I there are messages that predate the lawsuit that make it look like they've kind of they had changed hands on or at least she had become known to some of these messages prior which probably already violated the confidentiality provision. So there's like a lot going on. So that was one bad thing. I also thought that um Beldon's lawyer, Brian Freriedman, signed a declaration stating that somebody from the Taylor Swift camp said that ta uh Blake had asked Taylor to delete messages kind of knowing that litigation was pending >> or about to happen which is expoliation.

[00:35:59]Um >> that doesn't work.

[00:36:02]>> Why would she ever do that?

[00:36:03]>> It's like not a good look. And then >> no cuz I mean any literally if they subpoenaed the phone records any they not she can't delete them from the phone servers. Uh yeah. I mean it would show up that like there was a message sent you might not have it. There's normally ways to back it up but yeah.

[00:36:19]>> He's like you you couldn't delete it forever. No you can.

[00:36:22]>> Oh really?

[00:36:24]>> No you can't.

[00:36:25]>> Wait a minute. Starts >> so it just says >> no you can't a message.

[00:36:30]>> You can literally it only with a court order but you can with a court order go into any phone carrier and say these messages were deleted.

[00:36:38]>> Is he completely fabricated? So for instance, signal is much more challenging because it has like the auto delete function.

[00:36:44]>> Signal is different.

[00:36:45]>> But sometimes it can be deleted and then all you would see was that like two messages were sent, but then it would be bad because you told somebody to delete and you knew that you were like either in a lawsuit or about to have a lawsuit, especially as a plaintiff because you're the one bringing it. So that >> uh that burden on you starts sooner than it does on the defendant.

[00:37:03]>> Got it. Wow. Would would this would this van Vanzan discrepancy be considered >> unethical behavior?

[00:37:11]>> I personally think so. That's my opinion of it based off the facts that I have today. Interesting.

[00:37:17]>> I'm willing to see more facts than somebody could tell me otherwise. It's not something I would do.

[00:37:21]>> I hear that Ryan is such is a real charmer, right? Ryan Reynolds.

[00:37:27]>> Uh what? Where you going with this?

[00:37:29]Yeah.

[00:37:31]>> What?

[00:37:32]>> Absolutely. I totally think he's a total charmer. Yeah, >> I've heard that he's not. That's I that was being sarcastic. I mean, I don't know him personally.

[00:37:39]>> Let's not get into the weeds here.

[00:37:41]>> I'm trying to do what everyone else does. Really? Just monopolize on the >> cut and I'm letting people use it.

[00:37:46]>> What? So they can just spread this little fire working for Andy?

[00:37:51]>> Everybody will be my employee by the end of this episode.

[00:37:54]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:37:56]>> You know I don't like this.

[00:37:57]>> I got my releases right here. My attorney has prepared them for me.

[00:38:00]>> What? Yeah. Do you sign?

[00:38:03]>> Don't worry. My my shell company already filed this lawsuit.

[00:38:07]>> Oh my god.

[00:38:09]>> So, we're fine.

[00:38:10]>> Billy Cino Pen Oaks. Um, I've noticed though I'm starting to understand why people say that there is a real psychosis that can develop if you're on social media too much because I really >> because I'm developing >> because because um I uh I've noticed that like you'll start to you'll start to swipe and if you pause on something that's you know uh insightful in a bad way like a fight or something then all of a sudden it's another fight and then the fights get worse and then by the end of it you're like I'M GOING TO FIGHT SOMEBODY. IT'S BAD. It's really I smell tacos.

[00:38:45]>> It's probably the worms, bro. Sure.

[00:38:46]>> Chocolate worms. It's the >> worms. I'm hungry.

[00:38:49]>> Smells like cadaavver in here. I'm starving. We should get lunch after. You guys are >> all this legal tacos got my tummy going.

[00:38:56]All this fighting has made this really hungry.

[00:38:58]>> I know.

[00:38:59]>> All this fighting.

[00:39:00]>> I can't. Not without cooking them. I could get parasites.

[00:39:04]>> So, the the breakdown of just Matt, can you stop? I could I could I could if in a survival situation, what you'd want to do is >> spindle my own blanket on >> take the head.

[00:39:14]>> Yeah.

[00:39:15]>> Crack it.

[00:39:16]>> Pull out the stomach contents with it.

[00:39:18]Then most what's left is just some >> If I didn't have fire, then I could eat it that way without >> Didn't have fire.

[00:39:23]>> Yeah. And then you'd want to just make sure you clean.

[00:39:25]>> He tells me you could probably figure out how to start a fire.

[00:39:28]>> Oh, I I've been practicing with my little stick.

[00:39:32]>> I CAN DO IT. NO, I can do it. I can do I learned it in in when I was in Tanzania.

[00:39:37]They taught me and now I had I brought my stick home with my little rock and flint thing and I can I can made I made fire. I have it on video.

[00:39:42]>> Friction fire >> like when the apocalypse happens. We'll come over here >> and fire. It's super easy.

[00:39:51]>> This one I would highly suggest cuz it's very reliable.

[00:39:55]>> The lighter.

[00:39:56]>> Matt's doing the stick thing and then all of a sudden >> I know you guys are just bizarre.

[00:40:02]>> Leave that there.

[00:40:03]>> Yeah. Okay. Well, uh, Andy, where else do we have to go?

[00:40:06]>> I don't know, man. We're all over the map.

[00:40:07]>> I do I do kind of have a funny story of something that happened to me while making content.

[00:40:11]>> Okay, great. Let's talk about Yeah.

[00:40:13]>> And I'm curious of your opinion on this.

[00:40:15]So, since I'm >> Give our legal advice.

[00:40:17]>> Yes, please. Please. Um, so I was obvious I've obviously stocked this docket like crazy and there's only there's over 1,400 specific entries and within them there's like hundreds of pages on each one. Like so there was one day that there was like a huge docket dump and you know there were probably thousands of pages of stuff and I was clicking through them and I was going through them and I had seen some of the text messages before and I knew that they were like Justin Belon's text messages.

[00:40:42]>> This is like mildly creepy guys and it is >> it's okay.

[00:40:46]>> It is. So then she showed up at Justin Belon's house and was in his kitchen when he got home.

[00:40:51]>> Okay. So >> uhoh. you know, >> uh, I was gonna stop you right there.

[00:40:58]It's okay.

[00:40:58]>> No, no, no. Um, so one day I was going through them and I noticed that, you know, the phone number hadn't been redacted.

[00:41:07]>> Did you call him?

[00:41:09]>> Yes, she actually did.

[00:41:11]>> I did text him.

[00:41:12]>> Did you do star 67 before? So you >> No, no, no, no, no, no. I was like having a total freak out because if you know me, I'm like quite anxious and >> Yeah. Joey, you're like, "Okay, this is mildly creepy, but I >> imagine her fiance." You texted Maldoni.

[00:41:31]>> Yeah. I wanted to just reach out. You texted another guy.

[00:41:35]>> I don't think Nave would care if it's like you go do you like your side project.

[00:41:40]>> That's awesome.

[00:41:41]>> No. So, this is what happened.

[00:41:42]>> Project is Justin Belon.

[00:41:44]>> I mean, okay. This is not what happened.

[00:41:45]>> It's kind of funny cuz Naveiv and Beldon have sim. They kind of look alike actually.

[00:41:48]>> Kind of do.

[00:41:49]>> Oh my god, guys. You're okay. You're >> have really thick beards.

[00:41:53]>> Yeah, I think >> and kind of long the same color. Yeah.

[00:41:56]All right. Go ahead. Okay.

[00:41:57]>> Oh my god.

[00:41:57]>> Wow.

[00:41:58]>> Okay. Anyway, >> you should be Belony for Halloween and you can be Blake. WHAT A GREAT COSTUME.

[00:42:04]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:42:06]>> Better than my George Washington.

[00:42:07]>> No, I mean it was good, too.

[00:42:08]>> The wooden teeth are >> although I do I am going to pitch us to be the mummy.

[00:42:12]>> Okay, >> cuz I think I could be Brennan Frasier and V could be the the guy the other guy from The Mummy.

[00:42:16]>> So, okay. Wait, >> but I did text him, but I I was more like, "Hey, you might want to get this redacted."

[00:42:22]>> And so immediately all of a sudden it was like on the docket. They pulled it and it got redacted. So I just I was like I literally SENT THIS TEXT.

[00:42:31]>> GOSH, >> I literally sent this text and I was like, I'm so sorry. This is very creepy.

[00:42:34]Cuz I was like thinking to myself, maybe this isn't still his number, right? You know, these text me they were it was I did find that up.

[00:42:42]>> So um so I was like I was like maybe not. So then I was like, what should I do? What should I do? And I was like, "Well, I guess if it's still in service, like, let me just text." So, I write this thing that's like, "I'm so sorry.

[00:42:51]Like, this is like totally an invasion of your privacy, but like exhibit whatever dage like your number's here."

[00:42:57]And I send a screenshot.

[00:42:58]>> Oh, by the way, I'm a lawyer. I mean, I I be like, I hire that person.

[00:43:04]>> I know.

[00:43:04]>> The only person who's ever protected me is a stranger I've never met. Did you get a response?

[00:43:08]>> I did get a response, not from the number, but through somebody else. It was like, he got it. That was him, and he's like very thankful. Um, >> oh, >> his lawyers didn't want him reaching out, which made sense because the content creators were part of this, which is part of my trepidation with >> um, having sent it to begin with was like Blake was subpoenaing content creators and I didn't want him to have to take the stand to be like, oh, have you communicated with any others? And he's like, well, this random girl sends me this message like >> you get pulled into Oh my god. So I was like I was like oh you know I but I was I also recognized time was kind of the essence like your numbers on here >> that is so noble. So you reached out to Baldoni and it was his number and somebody from his camp responded and you did it eloquently obviously and did the screenshot of the exhibit.

[00:43:57]>> It felt very creepy. I'm not going to lie to you Joey.

[00:43:59]>> Creepy but creepy but you know but but wow >> right cuz if your number had been >> honestly I would appreciate that right thanks. You just said at the same time.

[00:44:09]>> I said it better, but you know.

[00:44:10]>> So, it got pulled. It's not still up there. Like, nobody can go find it.

[00:44:14]>> I didn't even save the number in my contact.

[00:44:16]>> Did you get flowers? Did he send you any FL? Nothing. This guy's making millions of with this really sexy photo of him.

[00:44:22]All linen.

[00:44:24]>> Baloney. Thank you.

[00:44:25]>> Baloney.

[00:44:27]No.

[00:44:27]>> No. I I honestly because content creators were a part of it. It made sense that like there needed to be like nothing because they Blake had subpoenaed other content creators, >> right?

[00:44:37]>> Because she thought that everyone was like in collusion. And I was just like this number this number can't like stay up on this docket. It needs to be and so you know they motioned the court immediately. It was taken down and then it was refiled with it redacted.

[00:44:51]>> So Katie is quite the researcher. When we go on I know on double dates there's always fascinating conversations. Didn't you figure out like Mr. Moholland, wasn't there a guy name? What's >> I love William Moholland.

[00:45:02]>> We're just going to take Moholland. Tell us the story real quick.

[00:45:04]>> Yeah, tell us real quick.

[00:45:05]>> What the street?

[00:45:06]>> He was responsible for the St. Francis Dam collapse, which was pretty bad. But like they said, >> where's the St. Francis Dam?

[00:45:13]>> Uh somewhere like Santa Claritaish.

[00:45:15]>> Okay. So there was a big dam up there holding some water and you wanted to drive people away.

[00:45:19]>> No. Well, okay. Well, there's more to that story. I mean, like, how long do you have? I love William Maholland. Some people are a little bit skeptical of him bec brought water to LA and LA would not be what it is today and would not have grown the city without >> Does this in incorporate the movie Chinatown?

[00:45:34]>> No.

[00:45:35]>> Um, so Chinatown is loosely based off of a portion of like him, but not really.

[00:45:41]Like the full story of him is really about there's part of it that deals with the Owens River Valley um and bringing water from like the Mammoth area.

[00:45:48]>> Beautiful mind over here.

[00:45:50]>> Thank you. How do you have all these?

[00:45:52]>> I'm I like I must be on some spectrum.

[00:45:55]Like I don't know what spectrum.

[00:45:56]>> You're on the spectrum of another word's called smart, you know.

[00:46:00]>> I mean, that's what I would call it, you know.

[00:46:02]>> Navidid gets quite annoyed when I was >> Oh, yeah. I'm sure I'm I sorry that in your world you have to play it off. I'm on the spectrum. I'm Something's wrong with me. Nope. Something's wrong with us.

[00:46:11]>> We're idiots.

[00:46:12]>> YOU'RE SMART. BACK in the day, people all had your level of intellect. That's when great things were done. Now we came up with Tik Tok, you know. Now we're idiots.

[00:46:19]>> Tik Tok is great. could have learned so much from Tik Tok.

[00:46:21]>> True.

[00:46:22]>> If you're smart, you use it right.

[00:46:23]>> If you're smart, you do. If not, you look at cat videos, you know, and and he's obsessed with >> looking at the worm videos, but he brought water from the Owens River Valley.

[00:46:33]>> Cats with worms.

[00:46:34]>> Stop it.

[00:46:35]>> We're talking about Owens Valley. Let her speak.

[00:46:36]>> Go. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

[00:46:37]>> I'm going to teach you about and there it was all gravity. The aqueduct was fully like using gravity. I don't think it used any actual pumps. He did it under budget and ahead of schedule, which is I mean it was like 200 miles or something like that. I mean that's insane, right?

[00:46:52]>> For our high train that uh >> Yeah. Right. We're still waiting. Um and so that that's how he brought water and that's how we have a lot of the like kind of uh incorporated cities in Los Angeles is they wanted water access. And so that's how they became part of LA was because we now had water from uh this aqueduct that Mahalland built. So that's what he was really known for. But then unfortunately I think he was head of the department of power and water and he did inspect a dam and then later that day it collapsed and it did did kill 500.

[00:47:23]>> Oh god.

[00:47:24]>> Oh. Oh wow.

[00:47:25]>> Okay. I know it's not funny. Terrible.

[00:47:27]>> But but retrospectively >> damn.

[00:47:30]>> People were saying that like at that time period there was no way for him to have known that the ground he built it on uh I forget what was wrong with the ground but that it was not suited for a dam. Um, but like obviously in today's world they would not have built it there because of that. So it was just >> does this have something to do with the salt and sea?

[00:47:51]>> No, Matt, that's the river. That's a other side of town.

[00:47:54]>> That is an interesting one.

[00:47:56]>> It's really interesting, but it's literally like 500 miles away in the other direction.

[00:48:00]>> Do you know about that one too?

[00:48:03]>> I actually know a lot about the salted sea. I wanted to and I'm >> I live there. No, but we've been a few times and because I went there, I really wanted to make a movie about it because I think it would be so brilliant. I'm going to give away the idea right now because who knows if I'll ever make it.

[00:48:14]Make a movie.

[00:48:15]>> No, that was with Val Kilmer. No, that was a different No, the Salt and Sea when I I think it was the Colorado River. Something happened where they diverted water accidentally. They weren't This is a big accident.

[00:48:24]>> Water.

[00:48:24]>> That's what I said. What did I say?

[00:48:25]Water.

[00:48:25]>> Roer.

[00:48:26]>> Roer. They diverted water accidentally.

[00:48:28]>> That's what I said. P of power.

[00:48:30]>> Good. Have to live with >> Yeah.

[00:48:32]>> Yeah. It's awful. So, they diverted water accidentally. It was supposed to go somewhere and it ended up going into a basin in the salt and desert in the sea in the desert and became known as the salt and sea. They they called it they tried to profit off the mistake and call it the Riviera of the of the desert and they like major like take forget Vegas now we have this beautiful ocean.

[00:48:53]So they like a bunch of like huge businesses built hotels and schools and resorts and casinos and you can look at old commercials and like promotional.

[00:49:01]They're like welcome to the salt and sea, the Riviera and the desert and and a lot of people like relocated their businesses there. What they didn't realize is the salt and sea is built over it's a it's a lithium. It's a lithium deposit and and the salt is is so acidic that it kills everything in the water.

[00:49:18]>> It's like Mona Lake, right?

[00:49:19]>> Exactly. So it's it's actually it's horrific. And so within 5 years this this Riviera, everything died. People were getting skin rashes and like >> So can we mine for lithium mine?

[00:49:30]>> Well, we can, but how do we get how do we do it underneath the water? We got to >> drain the water.

[00:49:34]>> Well, they should.

[00:49:35]>> They should because now we just found another lithium mine I think in I want to say Missouri or some M thing with it.

[00:49:42]So we might >> I think I huge lithium deposit. It's like one of the biggest ones.

[00:49:46]>> Did you say lithium?

[00:49:46]>> No, I said lithium.

[00:49:47]>> Oh, >> that's what I said. Anyway, long story short is how great would a show be though about that 5 to 10 years where they think it's going to be the new the French Riviera. Yeah. And they like and everything and then everything backfires and now the Salt and Sea is a pretty seedy place cuz people have gone there to strip all the buildings and stuff for copper because they just fled like people just had to leave all these these resorts.

[00:50:07]>> Where is it located exactly?

[00:50:09]>> At the >> in San like near the Sango desert.

[00:50:13]>> I feel like you could do something really cool with that cuz it's like apocalyptic now.

[00:50:17]>> It is. I feel like some of those are the best books to read, too.

[00:50:21]>> It's really interesting. And if you haven't ever been, it's it's pretty fascinating to go drive through.

[00:50:24]>> Well, we should all go.

[00:50:25]>> We can, but it smells so bad because the ocean cuz they they stocked the water with fish. They thought like this is they had boats. This >> and Yeah, it's worse than that. So, if you go to the chocolate, >> I don't know about that.

[00:50:39]>> If you go to the beaches, uh there's just dead carcasses of all the aquatic life that they tried to stock cuz they wanted to make it a big fishing place.

[00:50:46]And it's a it's the biggest it's the it's I think it's the biggest body of water >> like man-made body of water in >> this side the Mississippi.

[00:50:54]>> I mean sure >> it's not it's not at all.

[00:50:58]>> Wow. It's really brilliant.

[00:50:59]>> Actually is a great idea.

[00:51:00]>> It's so cool. Kind of like that Boardwalk Empire but you make it the Salt and Sea and then you flashed back between what it is now and what it what they thought it was going to be.

[00:51:08]>> That would be amazing.

[00:51:08]>> I know. And then there's one guy supposedly that has lived there the whole time. He's like there was one guy.

[00:51:13]>> That's what your movie should be about.

[00:51:15]He's one guy. Total cook. They call him five armed Willy. Five.

[00:51:19]>> No, but it is it's pretty creepy. When we were there, uh there's all these abandoned houses and stuff and and we stopped on the beach and we were trying to just to soak it in, but it was so the sulfur is so bad cuz and there's so much dead animal decomposition. It's really wild. But in the houses there's like ghost people.

[00:51:37]>> Wait, so do you think people film out there for like apocalyptic type movies?

[00:51:41]>> I don't know if they can. I don't think it's that bad can. I don't think they can. I mean they they would I think you get like headaches really bad.

[00:51:46]>> I don't know why it's like give bringing me back to that movie like Book of Eli.

[00:51:50]It >> it's very much like that >> similar >> if you like again if you drive through town cuz again a lot of great movie >> great movie uh a lot of I don't want to say I mean I'll say it a lot of degenerates have gone out there because >> well I don't want to be I don't know I mean look people go through hardships and stuff but a lot of people and a lot of people have gone out there because they can it's like a it's a a post-apocalyptic town that still has infrastructure so they've taken it over.

[00:52:13]So there's no law. There's no police.

[00:52:15]But you'll have people that have moved into these houses and they're doing drugs. They're stripping it for copper.

[00:52:19]It's really It's pretty wild.

[00:52:21]>> It's a wild place.

[00:52:22]>> Breaking back.

[00:52:23]>> It's very crazy. It's very >> of hell where it sort of is.

[00:52:28]>> Yeah. It's >> it's a wild place to drive through. I mean, it really is like it's it's I'm I'm shocked that they have like honestly the It's such a >> You actually Andy and I have walked right up to the water's edge and it you'll just see dead fish floating. It's terrible.

[00:52:40]>> Yeah. You'll look at houses and you'll see like people like >> skate through the broken windows. It's so scary, dude. It's very scary. But I'm surprised it was it's such a a a disa such a disaster. I can't believe we haven't cleaned it up.

[00:52:51]>> It's crazy.

[00:52:52]>> I mean, it's it's such >> Well, exactly. There you go. But it's such a disaster. You talk about that highspeed rail. It's so funny, you know, that Disney Walt Disney when he created the Montreal technology, he gave it to California.

[00:53:03]>> Yeah. We took it out >> and said, "Put this. This is how you connect the state." And because they were at that time they were driven by the oil companies. They literally also the taxi cab unions and all sorts of stuff.

[00:53:15]>> But they literally destroyed it and didn't want to have anything to do with it.

[00:53:18]>> Yeah. We could have at least had some public transportation. Horrible. I think there was also like um like almost like trolley cars, right? That were >> Yeah. Like San Francisco Los Angeles. All electric trolley.

[00:53:30]>> You been to downtown Los Angeles recently?

[00:53:33]>> Well, don't go.

[00:53:34]>> I know. It's not bad.

[00:53:35]>> It's pretty bad.

[00:53:36]>> I know. I used to have to work down there and I still have co-workers down there and like every day somebody's getting stabbed, drugged.

[00:53:41]>> It is terrible. I don't understand. You have there's there should be one primary goal for any place for people to live and that is safety. It's that's a apolitical that is first. That by the way that exists in not just democracies. We're talking everywhere all over the world.

[00:53:59]>> Safety is >> you got to have safety first. whatever that looks like. Whatever, you know, please >> then you can have you can talk about anything else you want to talk about, but >> no, it's it's very true.

[00:54:10]>> Yeah. I mean, it's just uh >> nobody can create anything without safety.

[00:54:14]>> You're absolutely right. So, just to wrap it up on that one thing. So, so this 471 thing for >> Oh my gosh. Wine. I just love how this this >> I mean just to tie it around. So, like so >> you don't talk about Mr. Mr. Belboa, Mr. Van Eyes, >> Moleholland. No, I'm saying there's other people all named after people.

[00:54:32]This is the crazy thing.

[00:54:33]>> Oh, yeah. There was there was a Oh, like Tarzano came from Tarzan in the book and the author that wrote it like Yeah, the author that wrote it named Tarzanna.

[00:54:42]>> Yeah.

[00:54:42]>> Oh, I got a cool one for you. Author that wrote Tarzan.

[00:54:45]>> Yeah, totally.

[00:54:46]>> Name Tarzan. Hey, it's a great book >> cuz he lived there.

[00:54:48]>> We're going to let you name this little town. So, what? Yeah, you wrote a good book. You can name the town. I don't know exactly the facts, but Cold Water Canyon and Laurel Canyon um Laurel was the name of the king, the chief of the native uh people that used to live here and Cold Water County has a very specific um meaning to that tribe. And that was like the >> Matt, we have a fact checker here.

[00:55:14]>> No, we don't.

[00:55:15]>> We might check that out.

[00:55:16]>> I love this. Check it out.

[00:55:18]>> They only took cold water showers.

[00:55:19]>> No, no, no. We got to name that one.

[00:55:21]Matt, that's >> they they and these were big Laurel and Hardy fans, >> Matt. Those are not facts.

[00:55:28]>> No, it's true. It's true. That is a real fact. I I did I did Laurel was some Native American >> chief. Okay. And Cold Water.

[00:55:37]>> I'm researching it right now.

[00:55:38]>> And then I think it was Moses Sherman for Sherman Oaks, maybe. Mo like he was the property developer and then he uh subdivided it, I believe.

[00:55:47]Um, >> I wanted to name Sherman Oaks Joe Oaks and then just call it Jokes for short.

[00:55:52]>> I think that'd be nice. My town Joe Oaks.

[00:55:55]>> I'm just a >> very funny town. Joe Oaks became >> It's basically just saying yeah because the water was cold there were laurels >> Matt.

[00:56:07]>> Well, Jim has just looked it up and essentially I wasn't far off. It was because Cold Water Canyon had very cold water and they rested on their laurels at the other place, so they named it that.

[00:56:19]>> Well, there are some like natural aquifers in the Santa Monica Mountains, like in the hills. Yeah, >> cuz there's one on the street that Naveid and I live on.

[00:56:26]>> Really?

[00:56:27]>> Yeah. Underneath it. And then I think that there was like a Native American group that lived at the bottom of the hill, too. And I It was probably kind of considered like, you know, a spiritual place.

[00:56:37]>> I was wrong. Yeah, I still I still can't believe Wait, >> somebody fed me. Okay, it is this algorithm.

[00:56:45]>> It is true though that it was Cold Water Springs and the Laurel Tra.

[00:56:48]>> There's also a weird like burial ground by weird rock formation.

[00:56:52]>> I I have some conspiracy theories.

[00:56:54]>> The guy who wrote Tarzan named Tarzanna.

[00:56:56]>> Yeah, >> it's hilarious.

[00:57:00]>> I'm sure the locals were really pleased with that one.

[00:57:02]>> Joe's not happy there's not a Wo Boulevard somewhere.

[00:57:04]>> I know. I have a sign, but I can't get >> I mean, they could still happen.

[00:57:08]>> They do have some keys to some cities around the nation, but >> I mean, >> not this one.

[00:57:12]>> Do you still have those keys?

[00:57:14]>> I think so.

[00:57:14]>> Do they open anything or they just >> No, they don't open anything.

[00:57:17]>> Well, ladies and gentlemen, thank you for listening to THE BROTHERLY LOVE.

[00:57:22]>> WE'RE not ending it there.

[00:57:23]>> End it.

[00:57:24]>> We don't have to end it yet.

[00:57:26]>> No, we have at least at least I I want to spend another hour on this.

[00:57:29]>> Well, we'll have to have Katie back cuz our hour is up >> on the different street names.

[00:57:33]>> Yeah.

[00:57:34]>> Wow.

[00:57:34]>> Yeah. Well, give us >> This has been a fascinating conversation though.

[00:57:37]>> You said you had one on Baloa. No, you don't have one on B.

[00:57:39]>> Uh, no. But then the Griffith Griffith, he did Griffith Park. I think he murdered his wife. I forget the whole story on that >> in the park.

[00:57:46]>> And then like Henry Huntington did the Huntington line.

[00:57:50]>> And then there was something with like Robertson and Culver not liking each other, which is why Robertson Boulevard stops before Culver City.

[00:57:58]>> Oh, >> wow.

[00:57:59]>> Yeah. He Henry Culver wouldn't let Robertson.

[00:58:03]>> They're all developers.

[00:58:05]Stop right here.

[00:58:06]>> I thought Griffith Park was named after the Brussels Griffin, which is a very interesting looking little dog.

[00:58:10]>> The ugliest dog I've ever seen.

[00:58:12]>> Griffith. Griffith. He named it Park and he murdered his wife there.

[00:58:16]>> Oh my god.

[00:58:16]>> I think he murdered the wife. I actually think she might have survived. She shot her in the face or something.

[00:58:21]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:58:22]>> And I want to say it happened in Santa Monica, which is interesting, too, because >> Santa Monica. Of course it happened.

[00:58:26]>> Well, people acted like that was like their beach.

[00:58:27]>> Either there or Venice. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:58:29]>> And it's like, you know, 5 miles, so 10 miles, I guess. But yeah. Wow.

[00:58:34]>> There's an interesting LA.

[00:58:35]>> How do you know all this stuff?

[00:58:37]>> And then there's like a woman that died in a sistern on my street.

[00:58:40]>> And so what I've gone down in a >> sistern like a well, you know, from the aquifer woman died in her sister.

[00:58:49]>> No, it's a well and at midnight during the full moons, you hear me?

[00:58:56]>> No, wait. So there's a woman that died 25, maybe 1923, something like that.

[00:59:01]>> Moing mortal, right? And there's pictures in like the LA public library of it. I like looked at it cuz you can see them online. They the >> Jeez, you looked at the pictures of the dead woman.

[00:59:10]>> Yeah. Yeah. Literally, they were available online. I was just hunting around.

[00:59:13]>> Did you email them too or send him a text? Hey guys, you're not going to want to know. But you can see >> now did was it did they did anybody pay for the crime?

[00:59:20]>> Uh yeah, her husband >> Oh.

[00:59:23]>> murdered her and like put her in the well. Um he wanted her money. Like >> what did she what did he say? She fell in the well. I I forget what the story he said she wasn't feeling well, but that was a clue.

[00:59:34]>> I think he was a dentist and >> he was dropping little hints. Little uh >> I think the the street figured it out cuz THE WATER TASTED WEIRD.

[00:59:47]>> OH, IT'S LIKE THE hotel at the like the whatever the >> that crazy ass hotel started and >> Oh, from the person in the water tower at the top of the hotel. Yeah, I fed water for the hotel and this lady was dead in there. Oh my. She went missing.

[01:00:03]Imagine you're bathing.

[01:00:05]>> I still like I still like Where's Where did your wife go? Well, well, well. I don't uh I don't know.

[01:00:11]>> I haven't seen her. She wasn't feeling well.

[01:00:14]>> They'll never find out.

[01:00:17]>> They will when they taste the water.

[01:00:19]>> Yeah, exactly. God.

[01:00:20]>> Wow. A note to end this.

[01:00:22]>> Okay. So, we have to have you back >> cuz we had like three, four more cases to talk.

[01:00:26]>> You're our resident lawyer. You'll be back many times. Believe me, with these three guys, >> now I might be the historian of Gaddy.

[01:00:32]We could come up with a little song.

[01:00:33]>> Oh, we'll come up with a joke for you.

[01:00:35]>> Yes, we will.

[01:00:35]>> I mean, we should have Nita on, too, so we can tell you how much I like annoy him with these things. True. Well, I mean, we'll get to Oh, he's got to come on.

[01:00:42]>> All he does is save lives. We want the juicy stuff.

[01:00:49]>> Oh, that's amazing. We will have him back. But we'll have you back because you are you will you are now our resident legal >> historian.

[01:00:55]>> Historian gossip. Hopefully nobody else gets sued and we can all live peacefully.

[01:01:00]>> That's all. Yeah, it's all we ever want.

[01:01:01]>> It's not going to happen. All we ever want Los Angeles.

[01:01:03]>> I know. I know. Everybody sues everybody.

[01:01:05]>> Everybody sues everybody.

[01:01:07]>> Nobody knows this, but I got a lawsuit against >> I got one against suing everybody. Uh anyway, >> they even know.

[01:01:14]>> No. Yeah, but they will. What? I am getting served.

[01:01:17]>> It's my shell company.

[01:01:19]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[01:01:20]>> Never what the car. Damn it. Too recognizable.

[01:01:25]kind of dude. You just Anyway. All right. Well, that's it. Andy, take us out now if you'd like.

[01:01:31]>> I'm the iguana don.

[01:01:33]>> The iguana >> as in the >> my god.

[01:01:36]>> The iguana mafia boss.

[01:01:37]>> Oh my god.

[01:01:38]>> The iguana don.

[01:01:39]>> Ladies and gentlemen, if you're still here, thank you for sticking with us. I don't know what to say.

[01:01:44]>> Katie, thank you for coming by this.

[01:01:46]>> Please like and subscribe on YouTube.

[01:01:48]Check out our online merch store. And we will see you all next week.

[01:01:52]Thank you everybody for joining us here on the Brotherly Love Pod. Please like and subscribe on our YouTube and check out our online merch store. You can find the link in our show description. And we will see you next week.