Leaders' Questions LIVE: Paul challenges Martin on Bertie Ahern mass distraction tactics

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[00:00:07][music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] >> Thanks. Can I come over?

[00:01:08]T-Shock, your former leader and T-Shock Bertie Ahern has engaged in disgusting racism in Dublin Central.

[00:01:15]Saying we have, quote, "Too many immigrants." Saying, "The ones I worry about are the Africans. We can't be taking in people from the Congo and all these places." Saying he worries about the next generation of Muslims. Bertie Ahern doing it makes it very blatant what the agenda is. Scapegoat immigrants, divide ordinary people. Why?

[00:01:37]So, nobody blames Bertie Ahern, Fianna Fáil, and the landlords and developers you have allowed to profit from the housing crisis.

[00:01:45]People from the Congo didn't take corrupt payments from developers to blow up the property bubble. They were never found by a tribunal to have been untruthful in explaining how 400,000 euros in today's money passed their bank accounts.

[00:01:59]Muslim children didn't crash the economy causing years of misery and austerity for ordinary people. Unlike Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, they never rolled out the red carpet for developers and vulture funds. They weren't the ones who sowed the seeds of the current housing disaster and they weren't the ones who refused to maintain council flats and then voted to increase council rents.

[00:02:19]All of this is an act of mass destruction. From what? From the horrendous conditions that people in Dublin Central, many of them, are forced to face every day. Right across Dublin City, there are council tenants living in conditions that nobody should be asked to live in. Yesterday in Sheridan Court on Dorset Street, we met a single mother with two children with additional needs. She's 3 months living without usable water because it's scalding hot.

[00:02:46]3 months.

[00:02:47]She has to bring her children to her mother's house to bathe them in Fairview. Her bedroom is severely damp and moldy. This is her bathroom. Look at the mold. Another woman is sleeping in the living room as her bedroom has been rendered uninhabitable due to leakages in the ceilings and in the walls. This is the wall in This is the hole in the wall of her bedroom. There's another resident's ceiling collapsed in places in January. Her flat is not in a livable condition, but she has nowhere else to go. This is her ceiling. The only work done for the people in Sheridan Court has been superficial. But it's not just Sheridan Court, it's right across Dublin City. And then to add insult to injury, Dublin City Council has hiked these people's rents by 30%, an amount that many of them simply cannot afford.

[00:03:33]Counselors from Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, Labour, and the Greens shamefully voted against a budget amendment that would have stopped that rent hike. I have two simple questions for you, Taoiseach. I want answers to them. One, will you commit to the residents of Sheridan Court and other flats around Dublin City that this treatment will not continue, that people in 2026 won't be asked to live like this. And secondly, will you support a reversal of these unfair rent increases in Dublin City and drop your agenda to hike council rents right across the country?

[00:04:08]We have a very clear asylum system in this country, which is fair and robust. And I don't approve of any commentary that would anyway undermine any particular ethnicity or any person with a particular ethnic background. And I've been very clear about that.

[00:04:24]And I my understanding is that Mr. Heron formulates has resigned from those comments and says there's no issue with people who come through our asylum process. But I I want to be very clear from my perspective and the practice perspective that we do not approve of those specific comments. And they were in a conversation which was subsequently published, which was not therefore a distraction process by anybody here cuz no one could anticipate that any commentary of that kind would go would be in in the public domain. But be that as it may, our position is very clear.

[00:05:00]We do have a fair and robust asylum process, which has accelerated a lot.

[00:05:05]And Mr. Callaghan has outlined that in and and then we have a broader migration narrative. People come from Europe, from the after countries and beyond who work in our economy and who work in our health service as well. And we have many of our citizens with different ethnic backgrounds who pay pay a very full and and and meaningful contribution to Irish life. In terms of the broader issue then of terms of housing, this government in particular over the last number of years has substantially step changed the provision of of of social housing. This year up to 9,000 built compared to very low numbers four 4 years and a goal.

[00:05:48]And so there's been a very substantial step change in the provision of public housing itself. And there is also significant funding made available to local authorities and particularly Dublin City Corporation Council in respect of regeneration and in respect of refurbishment and maintenance. Now in the first instance, it's a matter for Dublin City Council to make sure that its housing stock is properly maintained and refurbished.

[00:06:16]And you know, we we established local authorities, we give them powers and we give them remit. Anytime they do anything then the Dáil and the reflex or elements of the Dáil want to come back in and say, well, local authority doesn't have any sort of space or any parameters in which they can develop policies themselves. These are elected representatives of many many parties including your own and they have to organize and run their councils in a sustainable manner. That's a matter for the councils.

[00:06:45]Government doesn't dictate every single item of of of of local authority policy.

[00:06:51]What we have tried to do in the last while is to say to councils they need to zone more land for housing. Don't know whether you agree with that or not, but we believe they do because we need more we need more space for local authority housing, social housing, sorry, affordable housing >> [snorts] >> and affordable rental as well.

[00:07:09]And that is the most fundamental way to meet the housing needs of in Dublin Central and indeed across the country. Yeah, on on Bertie Ahern I'll just say this that what people say when they don't think they're being recorded is actually more valuable than what they say when they do know they're being recorded. And it suggests a dirty game used on doors by Fianna Fáil to divide and rule ordinary people to have them not blaming the people you represent, the developers, the landlords, the people who get rich from the housing crisis. Instead it's better to blame the people from Congo or wherever else. In terms of the council flats and the rents issue, I mean, I don't think you can have it both ways. You're you're the T shock.

[00:07:50]You're you're the leader of a party which has counselors, for example. So, you do have a responsibility and a connection with the votes, for example, to increase council rents. Do you stand over those increases or not? And they're not doing that out of nowhere. That is a national out of nowhere. That's a nationally driven project. You look at your own program for government, increasing council rents. You look at this new program from which hasn't been published yet, which points to massive increases in council rents. You point to look to the plan to merge cost rental and social housing. But, the other thing is the department. The department T shock will now respond, Deputy Murphy.

[00:08:24]Same as everybody else. Your time is up, Deputy. T shock, please. Uh first of all, that was a unacceptable comment you made in terms that is not Finna Fáil approach. That's not Finna Fáil policy.

[00:08:34]And by the way, you're not uh shy yourself in terms of mischaracterizing people, misspinning, uh and deliberately uh exaggerating positions of different politicians on an ongoing basis. You're no angel yourself when it comes to politics. I don't pretend that you are.

[00:08:50]And the other problem is on councils, Deputy. There are I I've been on a city council.

[00:08:54]Uh I I've always divided the council between between those who actually genuinely want to govern or run a city as opposed to those who just oppose everything and never voted for a budget in their life. I don't know, did you ever vote for a budget in your life on a city council? Probably You're probably not. Just answer me.

[00:09:10]Those you represent, you never do.

[00:09:13]You want more and more and more, more services. Services here, services there.

[00:09:17]But, when it comes to the annual budget, you guys never vote for them.

[00:09:21]But, other politicians have to step up with a bit of guts and a bit of courage and vote and make sure a city runs. And that's the difference between your politics and the politics of the majority. Thank you.

[00:09:31]T shock, time is up. Deputy Paul Murphy, please. Time is up, T shock. Deputy