Live Satsang (Q&A) with Swami Tadatmananda (19 July 2026)

[00:00:01]recording.

[00:00:05]Okay.

[00:00:30]Shanty shanty shanty.

[00:00:41]Good. Welcome to all. Welcome also to all of you attending the satsang online.

[00:00:47]We have lots of uh great questions.

[00:00:49]We'll get right into them.

[00:00:52]First question from Melissa who lives in Alaska. Um, I lived with a loved one who becomes negative or angry very fast.

[00:01:03]That's quite un it's unfortunate but quite common. Uh, I find it hard not to get swept up in it. Also very common. I know their reactions come from their own karma and their own patterns, but I still find myself being reactive or emotionally pulled down. How can I remain centered and compassionate in those moments? Well, the good thing is that Melissa realizes that the other person's behavior is inevitable. I mean, some people are wired like that. They have their own karma. They have their own backgrounds and we can't change people according to our desires. They are who they are. So Melissa is really on the right track in recognizing she can't change the other person. She can change herself, which is exactly the right response. But she she notes that she finds herself still being reactive or emotionally pulled down, which until you're enlightened, that's what's going to happen. The long-term solution to this problem is when you become enlightened and you when the person says something hurtful, you won't feel hurt at all. Not a trace of hurt. when the person says or does something hurtful. So the question is that's that's the long-term solution.

[00:02:41]The question is what to do in the short term in the meanwhile until you become enlightened until you discover that whatever the person says doesn't truly affect you your true nature as such and atma pure consciousness in the meanwhile the best thing in my opinion that you can do is meditate meditate more meditate more medit Meditation helps you in so many ways.

[00:03:14]For example, um it's obvious that Melissa has understood a lot. There's a lot of wisdom in her. The problem is is that sometimes our reactions happen so fast. We get caught up in those reactions and the wisdom inside of you gets overridden, is not accessible.

[00:03:37]Wisdom is there but if you're caught up in a emotional reaction that wisdom is not accessible.

[00:03:45]How to make that wisdom more accessible?

[00:03:48]My guru used this expression. I I suppose it's Indian English because I've never heard it in the United States. You say you need some thumb space. I've never heard anyone, in fact, other than my good, I've never heard anyone use that expression. What he meant by thumb space is space in and to use them in a more colloquial way um emotional space, mind space.

[00:04:21]Meditation gives you some space and space in a sense that you don't react so quickly.

[00:04:32]If you are a consistent meditator, the speed of your reactions is slowed down.

[00:04:40]Also, the the the level at which you react is there are two things. One is how quickly you react. Also, we all have a threshold. If the problem is below the threshold, we don't react. When the when right you we all know that when it's above the threshold, then the reaction comes. So meditation helps in both ways.

[00:05:00]Meditation increases the threshold. You become less reactive. But more importantly, meditation slows down the reaction, giving you some time, what my guru called thumb, thumb space. With that little bit of time, you can catch because you have already have the wisdom, you can catch yourself before you get caught up in the emotional reaction. That's the trick. catch the wisdom is there but you have just by the way that space is not long you it's maybe a second or two you have before the emotions kick in so in that second or two you can catch yourself remind yourself that the person who said hurtful things something we all know people who say hurtful things do so because they were hurt right we all know is that wisdom is there but the wisdom is often inaccessible in the moment. So with meditation you have that thumb space a little bit of time you catch yourself before getting caught up in that reaction and then you can handle the situation in a much more graceful manner. So meditate, meditate, meditate.

[00:06:27]Absolutely. All right. Next question from Prashantto who lives in Bangladesh.

[00:06:34]Um, regarding karma yoga, Bhagavad Gita says that to be a karma yogi, we should surrender our work as prayer to God.

[00:06:45]However, as a person with limited devotion or love for God, how would I practice karma yoga consistently through the day? This is a wonderful question.

[00:06:57]Um, it's what what Prashantu says is correct. He studied the Bhagavad Gita well and he understands that karma yoga as taught in the Bhagavad Gita is really a form of bacti. It's based on bacti.

[00:07:12]It's a devotional attitude. Having a devotional attitude with you throughout the day while you're engaged in your various activities. That's karma. It's a simplified way of describing karma yoga.

[00:07:25]But it's it's fundamental.

[00:07:28]A devotional attitude is fundamental to karma yoga as taught in the Bhagavad Gita. Karma yoga is I interesting. I just I remember this this question uh reminded me that many many years ago there was a book written by a western author that taught karma yoga in a secular manner completely secular manner the book was I have to remember it it's it's all I think it's in the maybe in the 1980s this book was published Uh, seven habits of successful people.

[00:08:15]Seven habits of successful people.

[00:08:18]Steven Kovi is the author.

[00:08:22]He taught karma yoga in that book without any Bhagavad Gita. He may have I don't know he may have studied some Bhagavad Gita. I have no idea. But he taught karma yoga in in a very straightforward secular fully secular manner. He said whatever you do something you can choose your actions can you choose the results.

[00:08:53]But generally when we act we act expecting to get the results we want.

[00:09:01]But the world doesn't work that way.

[00:09:05]Having that expectation that I'm definitely going to get what I want, that expectation sets you up for frustration and disappointment when things don't turn out according to your expectations.

[00:09:21]So to act knowing that you can choose your actions but you have no control over the results is exactly how Sri Krishna begins to teach karma yoga in Bhagavad Gita the famous verse chapter 2 verse 47 you have and I'll loosely translate it as choice you have choice aa over your action But never do you have any control over the results.

[00:09:58]So Kovi basically paraphrases Sri Krishna in teaching that in the Bhagavad Gita. So indeed it is possible to practice karma yoga without focusing on the devotional aspects of it but focusing on it from a very pragmatic standpoint.

[00:10:21]Dealing with expectations. Expectations are a huge problem for so many people.

[00:10:27]When your expectations aren't met, you get upset. And just to give a very common common examples, you expect to get a raise at work.

[00:10:39]You get upset, you but I deserve a raise. So do a lot of other people. But things don't happen just because you deserve it. Or of another example, many people are when they're when they're uh grown children take to certain decisions in their lives in terms of who they marry or what their jobs or professions are. Sometimes their choices aren't in alignment with what the parents had in mind. Parents are upset.

[00:11:14]Why? Expectations.

[00:11:19]These expectations cause huge problems and you can imagine having a life where you were free from such expectations.

[00:11:30]You did your best but you gracefully accepted whatever was the outcome.

[00:11:39]That's karma yoga. That's secular karma yoga. So that's nice that Pashanto asked that question.

[00:11:48]Uh Sheila who lives in Bangalore um asks uh what is the purpose of marriage according to scripture and there's actually a very specific reason. Now of course in general the purpose of marriage is it's emo it's an emotionally healthy uh living arrangement. It also helps procreation.

[00:12:13]So our culture lives on but there's a spiritual reason for being married. Um that spiritual reason is found a word that some of you know that in Sanskrit the wife put uh Putney in Sanskrit can is often called sahadmony.

[00:12:36]Sahad dharmony. Dharmony is one who follows dharma.

[00:12:41]Sahad harmony one who accompanies the performance of dharma from a very when I say scriptural point of view I mean in the vadas patney is called sahadarmony and sahadharmony means the wife must be there to assist the husband in following dharma and in the context of the vdas are mostly rituals So in that context he can't perform certain rituals without his wife. He's prohibited from performing those rituals. She must be there. So in a rich in a very narrow ritualistic sense the wife is meant to empower the husband to perform these rituals. Now that's in a very narrow ritualistic sense. In a broader sense, husband and wife become partners on the path of spiritual growth. The path of spiritual growth is a long path and it's pretty difficult and lonely if you're walking that path alone. So almost everyone would naturally choose to have a partner on that lifelong path of spiritual growth. So the purpose of marriage then is to have some good company along the way.

[00:14:13]Okay. Next question from Harsha who lives in London.

[00:14:20]Harsha asks by the way Harsha could be a male or female name both. Right? So so I I won't make any assumption. Um uh Harsha asks uh Harsha long I'll paraphrase. So Harsha had some Harsha practiced meditation earlier in his or her life and uh had some some spiritual progress. But now Harsha says um I I understood from cosmos that I needed to follow the cosmic law of dharma and karma and I got married. Good. We just said that's good.

[00:15:03]Now Harsha says I'm blown away with life forces and I lost my progress.

[00:15:10]I'm not because of getting married. Come on.

[00:15:16]I'm I'm listening to the scriptures but getting more questions. My and this is a and kara says I have a question about questioning.

[00:15:30]So I'm think I'm guessing that Harsha is questioning should I have gotten married or not? I suppose um and Kara asks, "Do I really need to question or should I accept that questioning is the nature of my mind and move on?" Okay.

[00:15:49]Do I really need to first of all, do I really need if if I'm correct in my assumption and I'm not sure if it really is a question, should I have gotten married or not? That need not be questioned for the vast majority of people getting married is the most healthy lifestyle possible. So for most people so that need not be questioned but question about questioning and the questioning nature of the mind. Should I accept it or not? And he says uh should I accept it and move on? Accept it but don't move on.

[00:16:27]And what I mean by that is sometimes acceptance means ignore it.

[00:16:34]We should accept the realities of our lives. We should accept the fact that marriage is complicated.

[00:16:41]Life is complicated. Your mind is complicated. Your spouse's mind is complicated. Life is complicated. That fact should be accepted.

[00:16:52]But accept it and move on suggests that you accept it and just ignore it. No, that's accept the complexity of life and deal with it. That's all. And deal with it in a pragmatic way. And a pragmatic way means not getting overwhelmed by it, not being caught up in this whirlpool of questioning, but deal with it in a healthy pragmatic uh manner.

[00:17:22]Okay, I'll take another question or two here. Then we'll see if there are some local questions. This question from uh Shankr who lives in Hyderabad.

[00:17:31]Um I understand that suffering in life is due to nonrecognition.

[00:17:37]Self nonrecognition self nonrecognition is my guru's term for failure to recognize your true nature as such and it's a very powerful expression.

[00:17:50]Ignorance of the self can only be removed through knowledge.

[00:17:55]Correct. Karma, yoga, devotion, meditation prepare the mind whereas knowledge removes ignorance. Correct.

[00:18:02]You quoted Shankara many times. We've said mokaha moka liberation is due to knowledge alone. All of that is correct.

[00:18:11]But then he points out, shanker points out that it's also said in scriptures and by me that the self is beyond self intellect and conceptual knowledge.

[00:18:23]So you can't realize the self through intellectual understanding and logical conclusions. All of which is correct.

[00:18:32]But can you please reconcile this contradiction? There's no contradiction at all. If we really understand what we mean by selfrecognition when the scripture says or when I say that the self is beyond intellectual knowledge beyond yeah he said beyond speech intellect conceptual knowledge meaning that the self is not something you understand like you understand anything else. You can read history books and understand something about history. You can read psychology books and understand something about how minds work. But but if you read vdanta books and you read vdanta books in exactly the same way as you read the history books and psychology books then you'll read the psych the vdanta books and you'll know what vdanta teaches. You know that vanta teaches that your true nature is such an atma that's conceptual knowledge according to vanta my true self is such anand atma according to me is something very different so there's that gap gap between conceptual knowledge vanta says that my true nature is such Ananda but according to me I am this body mind sense complex constantly subject to suffering there's a gap and that gap comes when we convert vdantic teachings into conceptual knowledge which they are not I've said this many times but it's so fundamental let me say it again it needs to be said. Vantic teachings do not convey knowledge in a way that other books and teachings do. Vantic teachings specifically are intended to direct your own practice of atma vichara. Atma vichara means self inquiry.

[00:20:53]Self inquiry is a process of looking within for the sake of self-recognition.

[00:20:59]Who am I really?

[00:21:02]Who am I really is discovered through the practice of atma vichada? But that practice of atma vichara needs guidance.

[00:21:12]The guidance comes from scripture and teacher.

[00:21:17]Notice that scripture and teacher are not imparting conceptual knowledge.

[00:21:24]Scripture and guru are imp are guiding your practice of atma of vichara. The metaphor I've used many times is like a map. A map has lots of cons lots of information.

[00:21:39]But the purpose of the map is not to convey information. The purpose of the map is to guide your journey. In the same way, there's lots of information in vdanta, but the purpose is not to convey information. Enough said.

[00:21:57]All right. Question from Amit who live who lives nearby in uh in New Jersey here. Um Adwighta clearly teaches separation of body from atma self. I am not the body. But even though I am not the body, is it not atma's responsibility to take care of the body and maintain it?

[00:22:23]Atma needs to take care of the body and maintain it. But then Amid has listened to these teachings and he he understands. But atma is actionless and does nothing.

[00:22:37]Then who exactly takes care of feeding, resting and take keeping this body healthy? The answer of course is not Atma. The answer in this case is Amit.

[00:22:48]Whoever is writing this email, whoever lives in Belmeid, New Jersey, just 10 miles from Arasham, that Amit needs to take care of the body. The ignorant individual person. And how do I care for the body sincerely as my instrument and sad for duties? He says nicely, the body is your instrument for spiritual practice. If you don't take care of your body, how will you do spiritual practice? He says, but how do I do this without falling back into the old habit of taking myself to be the body? The fact that you're writing this email shows that you still think you're the body. The fact, right? An enlightened person no longer says, "I am this body."

[00:23:36]Until you're enlightened, take care of your body. That's it.

[00:23:43]You before enlightenment, you have some identification with the body.

[00:23:50]Take care of it. That's natural, is it not?

[00:23:53]So an unenlightened person will take care of the body because it's natural and it's not contrary to vanta. Oh here's here's a metaphor. This is helpful. Suppose someone argues suppose a were to argue but swami g the body is not me. Why should I take care of it?

[00:24:13]Well first of all he's already said it's a vehic it's a vehicle for sadena. And a nice metaphor is you know you're not your car, right?

[00:24:23]But you take care of it that there's no contradiction here at all. You know you're not your car. You take care of it because it's practical.

[00:24:34]You know you're not your body. You take care of it because it's practical. The enlightened takes care of the body. The enlightened person doesn't take care of the body.

[00:24:48]who takes care of the body ishwara in the form of the body and mind. This is a little subtle but let me share this with you.

[00:25:00]The enlightened person knows I am sat on anandma I'm absolutely in separate from this body. The enlightened person says I have no need to take care of this body.

[00:25:13]Absolutely true.

[00:25:16]On the other hand, in that body is a mind. A mind that experiences hunger and thirst.

[00:25:25]When the mind experiences hunger and f thirst, that body mind gets food and water.

[00:25:36]Why?

[00:25:38]It's natural. Ishwara created this body mind complex in such a way that when it's tired it rests when it's hungry it eats when it's thirsty it drinks by the you get the I don't want to get too far into it it's another big topic anyway without being willful without acting on desires the enlightened person takes care of the body in a very natural way. You could even make the counterargument that if you're not enlightened, you take care of your body less effectively.

[00:26:19]Let me make that point. Do you think an enlightened person is going to reduce their sleep to 4 hours a day so that they can work more hours in the day so that they can climb the corporate ladder more effectively?

[00:26:38]Ah, so being unenlightened can actually interfere with your ability to take care of your your body. Okay, one more question here. Then we'll take your questions. This is from uh Vishuajit who lives in Bangaluru.

[00:27:01]I noticed that when people ask us half of them live in Bangalore, half of them live in Bangaluru.

[00:27:09]Okay.

[00:27:15]Interesting. No one liv No one lives in Bombay anymore. No one.

[00:27:24]Today everyone lives in Mumbai.

[00:27:27]Interesting.

[00:27:30]Okay. Um, Vishvet says, uh, here's the question.

[00:27:37]Based on my poultry knowledge of Hindu scriptures, mostly Vanta related, there doesn't seem to be the concept of free will. And I'm I'm glad that Vishujet acknowledges his lack of knowledge because the scriptures and vanta teach that you do have free will.

[00:27:58]He says uh I have heard certain teachers of vanta mention that free will is a construct of western philosophy and doesn't fit well into vdanta.

[00:28:10]There are plenty of vanta teaches that teach all kinds of things.

[00:28:15]Some of them absolutely teach that there is no such thing as free will.

[00:28:23]They're not following the methodology of edua vanta. They're not they they claim to be teaching adwita vanta they're not teaching ad they're teaching their we say they're teaching their own version of it and I'm not saying it's wrong I'm just saying it's not the tradition it's not adita vanta as taught by the in the tradition of shankara absolutely accepts free will and accepts free will because The entire doctrine of karma hinges on free will.

[00:29:02]If you threw out free will, and by the way, you can definitely argue against free will. There are plenty of compelling arguments against free will.

[00:29:11]And these v these vdanta teachers use those arguments against free will and they argue in a very powerful way against the against free will. The problem with that is not merely that it's not what's conventionally taught, traditionally taught in Adita Vanta, but they simultaneously have to reject the doctrine of karma. The doctrine of karma, as we've discussed here many times, is a very helpful belief system.

[00:29:44]So if you're willing to throw out the baby with the bathwater, go ahead. Throw out free will and throw out uh doctrine of karma. And basically the arguments end up like this. Atma doesn't do anything. Atma has no free will, which is a statement of fact.

[00:30:05]But vanta, as we just said, is not statements of fact. Right? We just got done saying that.

[00:30:13]Vanta guides your process of self inquiry.

[00:30:19]Tell me that process of self inquiry.

[00:30:22]Does it require will do you have to decide to engage in that process of self inquiry?

[00:30:35]You can you can see the problem. This falls into a uh what modern scholars are calling neoadua.

[00:30:45]Not don't mix it up with neo vdanta.

[00:30:47]That's a separate thing. Neoa is a modern mixed up form of adwita vanta that does reject free will. It says you're already enlightened. atma doesn't do anything so go home and it's based on statements of fact found in the teachings of vanta but as I just said vanta is not meant to impart statements of fact vanta is a very rich and powerful methodology that's meant to lead you to discover your true nature that meth methodology absolutely incorporates and accepts free will all the way through until the very last step and the very last step is enlightenment.

[00:31:49]Up and up to that point free will is very meaningful. After enlightenment even the world becomes unreal.

[00:32:03]The world is given pro the by the way if you know anything about adwita v about this neo adita they say the world is not real why even deal with it the way vanta works is it grants the world provisional reality. The world along with the doctrine of karma and free will is given provisional reality until the very last step. And the reason for that is vanta has to ex address us where we are in a state of ignorance.

[00:32:47]If vdanta fails to address your ignorance, it doesn't work.

[00:32:55]So anyway enough said let let's finish Vishujit's question from daily life experience I do understand that as an individual I make choices but given that much of our behavior is driven by goonas vasas and samscatas what does free will really meaning what does free will really mean is it a choice to turn to a a spiritual path is the choice to turn to a spiritual pathic conscious free will decision or is it just a combination of satuguna and ishwara krypa satuguna condition of your mind a purity of mind and ishwara krypa god's grace why do you take to spiritual life is it is it free will or not and the problem here is how we define free will and this is a problem that not just visited has but many people people who deny free will use some modern arguments and even traditional arguments. Modern arguments goes a modern argument against free will goes like this.

[00:34:07]They can science a scientist can stick electrodes in your brain and see brain activity that precedes your awareness of a decision being made.

[00:34:23]the fact of science. They can actually measure a gap of time between something changes in your brain and you're making a decision. So they draw upon science.

[00:34:36]By the way, that that argument has lots of defects in it, not just one or two.

[00:34:42]It's highly flawed because first of all when you make when you report making a decision it takes you a while to figure out that you've made a decision. So there's a problem with the reporting mechanism. There's also a problem in tying your behavior to the brain ignoring the mind entirely.

[00:35:03]Anyway, that I'm just saying that there's a scientific way of refuting free will and it's highly flawed.

[00:35:13]There's also scriptural ways of refuting free will. A scriptural way of refuting free will is to say that seeking enlightenment is God's grace.

[00:35:31]That's actually a flawed reasoning.

[00:35:33]However, so definitely grace comes into the the uh formula. But God's grace in the Hindu tradition is given according to the doctrine of karma which means due to your good deeds you accumulate grace called puna karma and god is the karma paladata ishwara and gives you the results of that. So in order to get ishwara krypa god's grace you need to do good karma. In order to do good karma you need to have free will.

[00:36:16]In the same way he says oh you have purity of mind. How do you get purity of mind?

[00:36:24]A pure mind doesn't come up to use your language accidentally by itself. It takes some discipline. It takes some spiritual practice.

[00:36:35]So the arguments against free will are flawed.

[00:36:45]Enough to said a simple way of putting it is this.

[00:36:52]You can turn the existence of free will into a really complicated philosophical topic.

[00:37:01]A philosophical topic that in my opinion you can argue equally well from either side.

[00:37:10]I think the arguments for free will and against free will are equally strong from a purely philosophical standpoint.

[00:37:23]And it looks to me that this argument will go on. This argument has been going on for a long time and I don't see it ending anytime soon.

[00:37:36]But is Vanta a matter of philosophy? I thought we're trying to solve the problem of suffering.

[00:37:47]We're not seeking philosophical knowledge.

[00:37:51]We're seeking to understand who I am so that I can stop suffering.

[00:38:00]That's a process of self inquiry. Let me change that. Suffering is part of your experience.

[00:38:07]Vanta takes a deliberately experiential standpoint as opposed to a philosophical standpoint. A philosophical standpoint does is does free will really exist or not. A vantic standpoint is whether or not free will exists, you experience yourself as having free will. Correct?

[00:38:35]From the standpoint of your experience, vanta accepts the provisional reality of that experience and deals with it appropriately.

[00:38:49]Okay. Um, do we have some questions here? Anyone has a question? Okay.

[00:38:55]You'll need the microphone.

[00:38:58]Turn microphone on.

[00:39:03]Okay.

[00:39:08]Thank you very much.

[00:39:10]>> Yes, please.

[00:39:11]>> My question goes back to Melissa's original question that you elaborated on.

[00:39:17]>> Yes. Dealing with difficult people.

[00:39:18]>> Um, >> in that kind of a circumstance which many people including, the mic is not have experienced.

[00:39:27]>> Ah, there you go. Just hold it closer please.

[00:39:29]>> Okay. in that kind of a world which I have experienced myself.

[00:39:34]>> Yes.

[00:39:35]>> Is the concept of the so-called teaching moment which is emphasized in many aspects of our life. Is it a waste of time or is it a lost cause?

[00:39:46]>> Okay, that's a good question. So the question if I understand correctly is when somebody is behaving badly you can turn it into a teaching moment and use it to help the person.

[00:40:04]Is that a good approach is your is that is your question and the answer of course is it depends on the person and the situation. Sometimes it's absolutely the right thing to do. Sometimes it's absolutely the wrong thing to do depending on the person you're talking to and depending on the situation. Just to give an obvious example, suppose you're dealing with a a 2-year-old who's acting out.

[00:40:33]You can turn it into a teaching moment.

[00:40:37]You can't reason with with a with a two-year-old. And the problem for others is that it turns out that 22 year olds, 32 year olds, you see where I'm going with this, 42 year olds can sometimes behave like two year olds and you can't reason with them.

[00:41:01]So if that 42y old is behaving like a two-year-old and you try to turn it into a teaching moment, good luck.

[00:41:10]it won't work. So yes, when you can you convert a situation into a teaching moment, but many times especially with people who are plenty of people have real huge issues and no matter how much you care and no matter how no matter how much you understand, you can't simply push your understanding on them. You may understand their problem brilliantly, but you might not be able to fix them because they're not fixable at that moment.

[00:42:03]Maybe in a maybe at a later date but in a present moment that person may not be reachable accessible. Okay. Uh other questions here you'll need the microphone please.

[00:42:21]>> Prance G. This is the first time I'm coming to Ashabodasa.

[00:42:26]>> Thank you. Uh my question is um I'm going through the teachings of yours on the uh the syllabus and I'm trying to understand the basic uh vdantic uh you know uh teachings and all that stuff.

[00:42:40]Theoretically I understand as we all know this is the journey like you know enlightenment and all we understand it might happen this lifetime or couple of lif time after but right now the thing is just we are seekers just going in this journey. Um I do understand that body mind is different and we have one consciousness. So you started explaining with individual consciousness and then actually the truth is it's just one consciousness simultaneously reflecting right. My question is at the end of our life there is no body there's no mind but the karma that gets accumulated it gets transferred but if there is one universal consciousness >> I mean if you can explain me with an example like how where it is attached to like if I if I understand one one consciousness my consciousness got it >> then I can say it gets reflected through that in my next birth it >> but it is universal how do we >> got it >> thank you So who who gets reincarnated?

[00:43:44]Who owns a karma?

[00:43:47]And yeah, and we just discussed how atma doesn't do anything. Consciousness doesn't do anything.

[00:43:57]So therefore, consciousness doesn't own any karma and consciousness doesn't get reborn. As you yourself correctly said, there's one consciousness. That one consciousness doesn't get reborn. Which is why at the very beginning of the Bhagavad Gita in chapter 2, Sri Krishna makes it very clear that what travels is the subtle body, the sukchma shar not atma but the sukma shar. Let me turn that down. Okay, got it.

[00:44:29]Um, atma doesn't travel. Subtle body travels. And this is yeah according to the doctrine of karma which as we said is a very elaborate but helpful belief system. According to the doctrine of karma you the subtle body is that which enliven your physical body. The doer of the actions is associated with the subtle body. The karta, agent of action, a hungara, ego, doer, all associated with the subtle body. The subtle body is said to travel at the time of death. And therefore, it's a subtle body that owns the karma. It's a subtle body that's driven by the force of karma to take another life for the sake of exhausting karmas that that were not exhausted in prior lives. If you say what is the role of atma in all this you know now careful don't say no role you might be tempted to say oh this is adwita vanta atma doesn't have anything to do with this in the absence of atma is there any karma in the absence of atma is there a body mind individual in the absence of atma who's sitting in your chair So atma is present all the way through the story so to speak but not as the agent of action in um there are many metaphors used to describe this in um vidya's famous text panchadashi he gives the example of a chitra chitra is a paint in in this case painting as other meanings as well. Uh in this caseh he gives an example of a painting. So suppose you have a painting of a person uh picking flowers.

[00:46:39]Did you ever think about this? Picking flowers is a little papa because you're killing the flower for your own enjoyment.

[00:46:50]I don't make a big deal of it. But I'm just making a point about the doctrine of karma. Technically plicking picking those flowers is a tiny papa. If you're picking them to offer at an altar, you say, "Isn't that different?" Do you think he do you think Yeshua wants you to pick these defenseless flowers to put them at an altar? If you like to do that and if it's part of your spiritual practices, it don't make a big thing of it.

[00:47:21]But it's a micro papa to to pick flowers if I can use that expression.

[00:47:29]It's a picture about this this girl picking flowers.

[00:47:35]Where does atma fit into the picture like the canvas on which that picture is drawn?

[00:47:48]What is the relationship between the canvas and picking flowers?

[00:47:56]You can't say no relationship because if the canvas weren't there, there'd be no picture of picking flowers.

[00:48:05]On the other hand, if you say, well, how does the canvas participate in the picking of flowers? Not at all. So you can't say atma is not present in the act of a willful in in willful actions. Atma is absolutely present but not as the agent of action.

[00:48:33]The agent of action is you the ignorant individual person.

[00:48:40]that U is associated with the subtle body and it's that subtle body that travels at the time of death. Does that answer your question? Good. Okay, let's take just a couple more questions here then we'll wrap up.

[00:48:55]Next questions come excuse me.

[00:49:01]Question from Amit who who lives in India. Um why do we say aam brahasmi and not atma brahasmi?

[00:49:16]It's talking about aam I and that word I goes back to our topic just now egoankara I I I.

[00:49:29]So why does vanta if at that I the word I seems to indicate ego just like this this finger seems to indicate ego. If I aham a is a Sanskrit pronoun I if a hum points to the ego I'm a pronoun so pronouns point right? If a the pronoun points to the ego then why does scripture say aam braha by the way the verb is actually in the first person. In fact, you could leave the word aam out and you get the same meaning. Brahma means I am Brahman. Aam braha mei means exactly the same. Uh itself has both subject and verb meaning in in it. It's a first person verb. I am. So brahmi or a braha. I am brahman. But doesn't that imply ego?

[00:50:38]Well, no is the obvious answer. But why does it put it in the first person?

[00:50:51]Why are these teachings in the first person at all?

[00:50:56]Why doesn't vanta just say no? No, that's second person. We have to go for first third person.

[00:51:08]The mahavakyas are both in first person, second person and third person grammatically. So we're sorry to turn this into a grammar lesson, but grammar plays a role here. You'll surprisingly grammar plays a big role here. Take a third person mahavakia. Third person remember from your grammar sa class he, she or it. All right. So third person mahavaka braha or better I am atma brahma. This one take that one. I am atma. This self I am atma Brahma is Brahman. I am atma.

[00:51:51]This self is Brahman is a mahavakia in the third person.

[00:51:58]Is that in is that statement meant to impart information?

[00:52:05]Sounds like it.

[00:52:07]But what is the overall intent? That statement sounds like information.

[00:52:13]Absolutely right. But what is the overall purpose of vanta?

[00:52:21]Just like in the map, the map tells you this town is Chicago.

[00:52:29]Not really a town, but anyway, this town is Chicago. But is the purpose of the map to tell you about Chicago or is the purpose of the map is to guide you to Chicago?

[00:52:45]So the map contains information but the purpose is not to convey information.

[00:52:51]The vanta says I think it's munda upanish I am atma brahma. This this self is brahman sounds like information but its ultimate intent is not to convey information but to lead you to a destination. Or how about now a second person mahavaka remember second person you tumi you are you are what t that brahmani second person you can see it it sounds a little less like information sounds a little more like Guru. This comes in chandog where the guru tells his disciple nine times nine times suggesting that it takes a while before you get it. And it also shows the guru's patience and the thickheadedness of the disciple. You got anyway long story there.

[00:54:03]But decidedly it sounds less like information.

[00:54:10]Now go to the first person. So second third third person mahavakia definitely sounds like an philosophical information. Second person mahavakia less like information more like a guru teaching. But a first person mahavakia aam brahma.

[00:54:34]Does that sound like information?

[00:54:40]You get the point that Mahavakia is in the first person because it's meant to address you at the deepest psychological and emotional level.

[00:54:54]So this is why why we have a mahavakia in the first person. Couple more questions.

[00:55:03]is from Ahmed who lives in Vancouver, Canada.

[00:55:11]Ahmed asks, "Can a person be enlightened and not know it?"

[00:55:20]Oh, and and based on based on a metaphor, can a person be enlightened and not know it? It sounds counterintuitive, but Ahmed is basing his uh the statement on something I've taught many times. I said when you get enlightened, there's a process of assimilation that follows enlightenment.

[00:55:45]And that process of assimilation is metaphorically represented by these old Polaroid cameras.

[00:55:54]You take the picture and the picture emerges from the camera white and then over a period of time the picture develops.

[00:56:07]So that metaphor is used to convey a process of assimilation that takes place after enlightenment.

[00:56:17]you get enlightened, then there's a process of of assimilation. Based on that metaphor, Ahmed asked, does it mean then that enlightenment could get enlightened without knowing it? Because when you take the picture, it's pure white at first. And here I want to remind you that metaphors are metaphors.

[00:56:39]Every metaphor is meant to show a particular thing. No metaphor shows the whole thing. If the metaphor were a perfect metaphor, it wouldn't be a metaphor. It would be the actual thing.

[00:56:55]So whenever we have to you whenever we use metaphors, we have to know what is the point made by the metaphor. The point of the Polaroid metaphor is not suppose we say enlightenment is like when you click the Polaroid when you click the camera the picture is completely white in the same way when you get enlightenment you don't know a thing.

[00:57:24]That's not the point of the metaphor.

[00:57:28]The point of the metaphor is to show the gradual development of the of the picture is like the gradual process of of uh of assimilation. Does a person know it when they become enlightened?

[00:57:46]Yes, absolutely. Do you know it when if we define enlightenment as selfrecognition?

[00:57:55]If in ignorance is self nonrecognition.

[00:57:58]So enlightenment must be selfrecognition.

[00:58:02]When you look at yourself in a mirror, do you does does it take what that those pictures took several minutes to develop? Right? So when you look at yourself in the mirror, does it take you several minutes staring at your image in the mirror before you get it? No. Recognition is instantaneous.

[00:58:27]Okay, enough said. We need to use metaphors properly. Last question from Aneli who lives in Bangalore, not Mangaluru.

[00:58:38]Good.

[00:58:42]Um, Anelie asks, um, why don't I feel a desire for enlightenment or self-realization arising from within while my husband seems to seek it.

[00:58:57]Absolutely natural and nothing wrong with it either.

[00:59:02]Some people are the answer is really according to doctrine of karma.

[00:59:11]Some people are born with an inclination to take to spiritual path. An inclination for spiritual growth. We call that a samscara.

[00:59:30]Purvanma samscara. Not karma but samscara. An inclination that you're born with.

[00:59:39]Some people are born with it. Some people are not born with it.

[00:59:44]Normal.

[00:59:46]Now if you say is someone born with the inclination are they better off than somebody who's not born with an inclination. Don't make that assumption.

[00:59:56]We don't know. How about this? Some people are born with an inclination for music.

[01:00:04]and at a young age they play some music and then they drop out and spend the rest of their lives taking drugs.

[01:00:13]Not a very nice example, but it happens, right?

[01:00:19]Somebody might be born without an inclination for music, but then in grade school they're encouraged to take a musical in take up a musical instrument. They start playing violin.

[01:00:34]They love it so much. The more they play it, the more they're attracted and they grow up to be a world famous violin player.

[01:00:43]Both are possible.

[01:00:47]Inclinations that we have from childhood don't determine our destiny.

[01:00:54]Depends on how we act on those inclinations.

[01:00:58]So someone may be born with an inclination for spiritual growth but do they act on that inclination or not?

[01:01:09]So husband might have that inclination.

[01:01:11]Is he acting on that inclination? If he is wonderful if he's not then he's not.

[01:01:18]And Anjelie might not be born with that inclination.

[01:01:26]On the other hand, it might develop later in life. And if it does develop, that's wonderful.

[01:01:34]And if it doesn't develop, that's pretty normal.

[01:01:39]Most people don't develop a strong desire for spiritual growth. That's also normal.

[01:01:48]So, um, if you say, why don't I feel a desire? Why? Means we are all created normal.

[01:01:59]A normal person has a huge range of perspectives of inclinations of disinclininations.

[01:02:10]So if you're born with a with an inclination for spiritual growth, 100% normal, natural. If you're born without an inclination for spiritual growth, 100% normal, natural.

[01:02:26]But whatever direction your life takes doesn't depend on the circumstances of your birth.

[01:02:35]Whether you're b if you're born with a desire, if you're born with an inclination for spiritual growth doesn't guarantee that you'll be enlightened.

[01:02:49]If you're born without a desire, an inclination for spiritual growth doesn't mean that you won't get enlightened in this life. The conditions of your birth are an artifact of the karmas you're born with. And the karmas from your past life do not fully determine the future of this life because of free will. We're back to free will. Yes, we're all born with karma.

[01:03:23]Due to past karmas, you may have a desire for for spiritual growth. You may not have a desire for spiritual growth due to the karmas you're born with.

[01:03:33]Doesn't make any difference at all. You can be born one way or the other, you have free will. And for most people, for the vast majority of people, I can't let let me not make uh let me not overgeneralize.

[01:03:55]Your karma does not determine your future. That's a doctrine of predestination.

[01:04:03]Predestination is soundly dismissed by Hinduism in general and vanta in particular.

[01:04:13]Predestinate predestination is dismissed. Why? You are born with free will. Which means whatever karmic inclinations or disincinations you might be born with your free will is more powerful than that. So that's that's the answer and that's a good place to conclude for today.

[01:04:55]Panasha.

[01:05:14]Om shanty shanty shanty.

[01:05:22]That's it. See you next time.