Preston Davey -Monster Dad's Trial- Thursday 26th May

Añadido: 2026-05-31

[00:00:10]Well, hey, it's me Vicki.

[00:00:20]Good morning, good afternoon, good evening where in this crazy world I'm buffering.

[00:00:29]what I'm going on where I left off earlier uh talking about the Preston Davyy the little baby I think by now we all know about this case you know we've been following this case haven't we and we've been following the trial of this beautiful little baby Let's just dads. Uh, he was being in the process of being adopted by Jamie Barley. This guy, this is the same guy. And his partner John, some ridiculous surname, GF, I'm going to call him, or just John over there in Blackpool. There's Blackpool Tower in the background in Blackpool in the north of England. They're in the process of adopting him and this baby had to be rushed to hospital, but to be honest, I think it was likely from the evidence we've heard.

[00:01:41]He was already deceased and not saved him sadly. So, we're in the trial. Uh I'm going to get on with it. I was follow I did a video this morning following uh so it was a day in the UK so uh the court was not sitting Monday and Tuesday they certainly for Wednesday they had a very long day of evidence and this uh today Thursday uh it hasn't been such a long day but what's happening is Mr. Vley, Jamie Vley has been speaking in his own defense and uh I got to just prepare you. I'm sure you know us certainly if you've seen any of this before very upsetting details for my members. Please get your panoo emojis ready because it's lie after lie after lie from J out in quite a lot of lies and his answer to when he's caught out with anything that he said that later turns out not to be true is oh I don't remember or if he's challenged like he was challenged things that he said were by um uh Preston's foster mom.

[00:03:07]Uh he just says she no, she's not telling the truth. The medical people are not telling the truth. They're not telling the truth of the hospital. Uh the the doctor that dealt with Preston when he had a fractured elbow, he wasn't uh telling the truth. There was a language problem. He blamed it on the language problem. Oh, he's blamed on him for the lies that he fought out in every except for his partner. So, he and his partner. So, they were this, you know, happy little family supposedly. Uh they were in the process, as I say, of adopting uh Preston. They wanted him.

[00:03:48]They wanted a baby. You know, this is and it just wasn't as easy as maybe you thought it was going to be. It put a lot of pressure on their relationship.

[00:03:59]And Jamie Vley, the guy on the left, who's a a teacher, a head at a high school, taking a year um off work, but that doesn't seem a good idea because he was literally left holding the baby and it was too much.

[00:04:21]It wasn't everything. every time John went away with work. John is a sales saleserson um and he works away quite a lot and um Jamie Vley would have a hissy fit meltdown and um you know text him and tell him to get back here now and I'm having to cope with the baby all on my own. And anyway, we heard some of the dramatic drama queen texts uh that he sent to John. And um the question is, isn't it because so after this? So little Preston was in their care for four months during which time he sustained 40 I think it was 41 injuries over 40 anyway, including a fractured arm. His back of his throat was bruised.

[00:05:13]He had injuries on his bottom. Uh and then the police found all these videos and photos that Jamie has tried to explain away, but they are not the normal sort of photo take of a baby, explicit photos of his genitals for some unknown reason. some video of him pooing in the bath and Jamie actually holding his legs up so that he could get a better view of it on the video, sending that to his partner. Um, and it seems like John was at the house when some of this abuse happened. So, you know what's so what happened after Preston very tragically died? Uh, they he says or they say they didn't speak to each other for two weeks. They both went to live with their respective parents.

[00:06:08]Uh but then they got back together and they've been back together ever since.

[00:06:11]So they're still couple. So you know, personally, I think they're both in it together. I think they're as complicit as each other. But it doesn't matter what I think, does it? Because what matters? What are the jury thinking? I wonder. What are the jury thinking? I keep forgetting to put a poll up of what you all think if they're innocent, guilty, etc. I will do will do it uh probably over the weekend because there's still a little way to go with this trial. Um, so yeah, Jamie has been given has been speaking in his defense and he's been cross-examined not only by the prosecution but also by John's defense lawyer who was a they've got different lawyers and you just look at this little baby's innocent face to the slaughter. So services have got some blaming I think because Jamie was you know actually saying that he was struggling um made some strange comments about Preston you know there were so many red flags weren't there that uh everybody this little boy down and hope you know now he's free of abuse in the arms of the angels Um, and you know what? If he wouldn't have died that day, you just think, how long would he have to endure that? He's probably endured four months, he'd already endured it. But if he wouldn't have actually died, how long would it have carried on till he was old enough to fight back, you know, how would he how long would these men have carried on neglecting and abusing this baby, you know? So I think Preston just gave in in the end. He probably just thought, "Oh my god." So you know, his cause of death was obstruction of his airway by a soft object, which just lead you to imagine yourself what that might have been. Uh and um yeah, they wasn't the first time he'd been rushed to hospital. It was the third admission to hospital in in four months and apart from that, 40 injuries.

[00:08:28]But Jamie Vley is insistent that he and John did nothing to hurt Preston. He doesn't know how all these bruises appeared that he had and now the what looked like a bite mark on his bum appeared.

[00:08:42]Nothing to do with him though and nothing to do with John according to him. So what will the jury think? That's the question.

[00:08:52]Okay. So hello you lovely lurkers.

[00:08:54]Listen, thank you so much for caring about Preston. Everybody is watching.

[00:09:00]Hello to replay crew. Uh thank you to everyone for liking, subscribing. Uh people have been interested in this case and that's the whole point of this videos too many times especially little baby like Preston who didn't really you know I don't know what's going you know his biological mom that's all I'm not but who's going to be Preston's voice you know this little baby not only him but other children Um, they can't be their own voice, can they? And and Preston didn't even have, oh, how can a boy? So, these men were they Preston was in their care, you know, they didn't snatch him away or whatever. He was in their care. They had a responsibility to protect him. They're supposed they were supposed to be his dads, but of course, they weren't. Uh, and it gives me the chills everything every time they refer to him as their son or their themselves as his dad or whatever. Weren't his dad and he was son uh because they didn't treat him like that, you know, and they often Jamie will refer to him as little one.

[00:10:20]Oh, you know, I had to put little one down for John as well. a horrible way of referring to him.

[00:10:29]See what little one is doing, you know, instead of using his name. So, his name of course is Preston. Sometimes you'll hear him referred to as Elijah because that was the name that they gave him.

[00:10:40]Uh, but he is gone 13 months old have any life. And this Jamie Vali especially, all he ever talks about is how this has affected his life. you know, uh, how how, you know, how he's feeling sorry for himself. He's a typical narcissist, typical psychopath in my view, because all he cares about is how everything is affecting him. And this is the guy when we watch video of him at the hospital screaming for his mom. He's in his late 30s. He was screaming for his mom.

[00:11:23]And that ally I Beth killed him. I'm going to hell.

[00:11:30]But now he's not saying that. It wasn't him who killed him. Now he's say nothing to do with him. He has no idea why this boy couldn't breathe struggling for breath and they just left him on the bed for over an hour and they took him to the hospital when then he went floppy but actually I think he died basically. And um he Jamie's excuse for how this happened now. It wasn't what he said at the time is that he left him in the bath while he went and had a shower and conditioned his hair.

[00:12:04]And um when Preston was laying face down in the bath and report showed he had no water in his lungs, that's not what he died of. He died of obstruction of the airway. So, it seems like this story about bath time was a total fabrication, but okay. So, I'm going to put um I'll probably put several pictures of Preston up as I go along. Uh I'm going to be Oh, actually, I think I'll share the I'm reading from the Manchester Evening News. So, special thank you to my members. Sorry we're not having a members live tonight. I think we're going to do it tomorrow night instead because they're open court hearing tomorrow.

[00:12:47]uh for this case. So I'm I'm going to save my voice for a meers live tomorrow evening. I know you'll understand because it's an important case. Um let's share the screen and read it. So there's as in the UK that cameras on Are they in the CX thing that's can't access your screen? Why not? Why not? Why can't the browser access my screen? Let's try again.

[00:13:34]Yeah, it can now. Um, so I've forgotten what I was saying now.

[00:13:42]got confused with the fact that the browser it said the browser couldn't Yeah, I forgotten what I was saying. So, there you go. Um, yeah, I'm reading from the Manchester Evening. Ah, that's what I was saying. So, no reporters are allowed in the courtroom, but they're not allowed to record and allowed to report.

[00:14:09]they are allowed then to report on um you know on what happens in the courtroom and I'm reading from the Manchester Evening News version of what happened in the courtroom. So we have to bear in mind as well we're hearing it secondhand. We're not there in the courtroom. We're just reading how the reporter interprets what is said. Um and you know the people that are getting the full story of course are the jurors who are getting all the photos all the videos uh the reporters are can't see those uh things. I don't think most of the jurors and hopefully the jurors will come to the right decision.

[00:14:58]So yeah. Hi lovely lurkers. Hi replay crew. There's a few of you chatting already, so I'm just going to say hello to who's in the chat before I get on with it.

[00:15:10]Hi, Junior. Thank you. Hi, James. Hi, Jacqueline.

[00:15:17]I'm good, thank you.

[00:15:19]Hi, Skills watching from California.

[00:15:22]Wow. Hi Lou Louise. Hi Tracy. Hi Lily.

[00:15:38]Hi Heather Davis. So just said I'm going to do the members live tomorrow night instead.

[00:15:46]uh do the members what happened in the be any the jury on I don't know if the the courtroom is meeting tomorrow but there's no no evidence being given tomorrow so no it's not members live but there's a few few the members here So, it's a bit like members where we uh left off 05. I mean, there's been the last couple of days yesterday and today it's been all about Jamie Vley, isn't it? And what he's got to say um his in his own defense, which basically seems to be like a load of lies, doesn't it? But anyway, so Mr. Wright, who is the prosecutor, asks if Mr. Valley was seeking to misrepresent the position to medical staff about the bruises on June the 30th because they had previously contacted uh safeguarding. So thing is you're also talking about uh a child who had been referred to safeguarding you know because the medical the hospital staff had been suspicious of all the bruises he had. You know Jamie keeps saying he was a clumsy toddler. He wasn't a toddler. He was only 13 uh months old. So, he wasn't walking yet. He was crawling. And I know that uh uh babies do bang their heads and things like that. Of course they do. But you've got to think of the volume of four months in these men's care and over 40 injuries. That's not just a little bump on the head here and there, is it? 41 what that's an average of 10 injuries every month he was in these monsters care. So uh three hospital admissions the final one resulting in death. And the other thing you've got to think of is the nature of the injuries. you know the do all the medical the the forensic pathologists and the doctors who sort of confirmed uh this uh sort of uh decision that um the cause of death was obstruction um they agreed these are not null injuries bruising at the back of the throat couldn't have been from the attempts to res resuscitate him etc. So anyway, Mr. Volley says no, he's not re um misrepresenting, but Mr. Wright refers to medical notes which say bruises to head. Oh, that's right. He said the toy box fell on his head and that the dad has videos of the incident. But Mr. VI says it's incorrect. And Mr. Wright asked if the senior nurse on admission got it wrong.

[00:18:51]And Mr. VI says yes. You know, he's so reminiscent of Erin Patterson in her trial. Everybody else has got it wrong or lying, but I'm I've got it right.

[00:19:05]That's what she said as well. This is what Jamie Val is saying. The medical staff, uh, the social workers, the foster mom, they're all wrong or lying.

[00:19:16]He's telling the truth.

[00:19:20]So, he said, "Oh, so the staff nurse got it wrong." and he said correct because we did not state where the bruises came from.

[00:19:29]And Mr. Wright says you were together, you and John, given an account of the situation that led to his condition and the bruises on his forehead. And Mr. Vley says, "Your summary is wrong." And Mr. Wright says, "At no stage did John say to you privately or publicly, Jamie, you've got this wrong.

[00:19:56]And Mr. Vley says, "I don't know what we've got wrong." Mr. Wright suggests the toy toy box incident happened two weeks earlier. "Is it you were covering up what was really happening to that little boy?" he asks. Mr. Vley says, "You've got it wrong. Very wrong."

[00:20:16]Everybody's wrong except Jamie Barley, aren't they?

[00:20:23]Yeah, even the dog's agreeing.

[00:20:27]>> Yeah. Mr. Vley told officers he had shelled against him.

[00:20:33]Mr. Wright asked if he was not concerned about his son suffering a a second potential collapse. Yeah. Because he said he was having seizures.

[00:20:43]You know, they said he said, "Oh, I thought he was having a seizure." So he just left him on the floor and videoed him. He didn't, you know, try and get any help or anything.

[00:21:04]Thank you all for thanking me. You know, it's got to be talked about. You know, when I first started doing it, I didn't want to do it. I don't like talking about children's cases. I find them very upsetting, as you know. But not only that, YouTube doesn't like it. They don't push the videos out. They, you know, they make it clear that they're not really happy with the content.

[00:21:30]But then in the end, you think, what do you just avoid things because they're unpalatable and then these things don't get attention, do they? You know, some sometimes you can't pretend. You can't sweep things under the carpet and pretend they're not h happening. This happened and Preston existed and he might have had a short life. Mr. Vali told officers he had shown the video to a nurse. He tells the court he was petrified of allegations being made against them.

[00:22:05]Mr. Wright asked if he was not concerned about his son suffering a second potential collapse, but Mr. of all he said they were concerned but at that point they were discussing the allegations.

[00:22:18]So now as these things come out you know it gets clearer and clearer doesn't it of the hospital and they were under the attention that they had been referred for safeguarding issues but he still carried on abusing little Preston he you know is I wonder and I've thought it a lot over the last couple of days home or something because how is he lo if if he knew that they'd already been referred to safeguarding you know that there was already you think he would have stopped abusing Preston then, you know, in at least until things died down. But maybe he was drinking, taking drugs. I don't know. He was off work. He was bored shitless basically. He felt he we know from his messages to John, he felt very strongly that he'd just been left to look after the baby. But do you know what? It was his choice.

[00:23:42]He chose to have a year off work to bring this little I think it you know it just wasn't as easy as he thought it was going to be when John was out to work and maybe he thought John was you know seeing someone else there was a few um messages he'd sent to John you know because where are you you know you got to get back here now and John John probably did everything he could to avoid going home um but maybe John was seeing somebody else you know just don't know do you that I feel like there's a lot more to this. So was how did he keep losing control the way he did? Because listen, everybody loses it sometimes, you know, it's like you can all get angry though you would not hurt person. Uh but you know I remember when my son was little sometimes you know they do I mean I don't mean a baby because obviously couldn't do it but I would just have to put him in his room sometimes because because sometimes uh you do lose it you're a human being but I'm thinking did John lose sorry the because because he wasn't working, was he bored and he was drinking and he was losing control because of that because for even though he knew that the hospital were suspicious of him It's a very big lack of error. What if he know?

[00:25:45]Yeah. Had so many video and photos. Why was he recording been able to get everything back there?

[00:25:55]Because he did a lot on Snapchat and Snap It's hard to get me delete a lot of the the videos that have been presented as evidence against him. They were actually deleted off his phone. So, he did try and cover up as well. Now, why would you try and do that?

[00:26:19]Anyway, uh he tells the court he showed the toy box video as an example. He maintains that Preston had bruises that lasted a long time as he said in his police interview.

[00:26:36]Mr. Wright asks where in the interview does he say he showed the video as an example, but Mr. Vley says he didn't expand on his answers. Then then at 111 the defendant says he can give examples where Preston was injured by things.

[00:26:55]So because when Mr. right asked him how did he get those bruises you were being asked about on June the 30th when he was presented to hospital staff and asked about them and Mr. Well, he said, "I don't know, but I can give examples of when he's been injured by things 2023."

[00:27:25]On July the 4th, Mr. Vley messaged his partner at 8:47 saying, "Cap also shouting, "You can back him up in a minute. don't complain and at 9:43 sent a message saying I can't shower before you get home so hurry so he can't shower but having said that on that fateful day when uh Preston died he got in the shower and let while Preston was left in the bath on his own and he decided to get in the shower and condition his hair he said now he's well but these messages are coming back that sent to John saying, "I can't have a shower until you get home, so hurry."

[00:28:11]You know, he's really irritated with John for some reason, isn't he? There's something going on there in their relationship, isn't there? It's all going wrong. I wonder if there's another man involved or something.

[00:28:25]But he says it was a typo and he meant a bath, not a shower. However, he says he was not getting increasingly frustrated.

[00:28:34]Oh, come on. at his home and relationship situation. And Mr. Wright says, "But on July the 7th, he was back in hospital with an avulsion fracture to his arm." And Mr. Vley agrees he had a fracture to his arm. And Mr. Wright says, "Why are there so many contradictory accounts from you as to how that little boy sustained that injury?" And Mr. Vley says, "There are not."

[00:29:03]Mr. right acid accounts given to the medical staff are incorrect and he says the odd comment yes in respect of Dr. Elbow from the fracture clinic Mr. Wright asked the defendant whether the doctor had misunderstood and Mr. Vley says absolutely yes so he accused Dr. Elbow uh of misunderstanding due so he was xenophobic as well because he accused Dr. Elbow of not understanding because of the language barrier.

[00:29:40]What about friends and colleagues? Asked the KC and Vley says I think they've just come at different points.

[00:29:53]So then Mr. Right. Asks about Amy Shepardson who was Preston's social worker and he refers to the account Mr. Vley gave that they had visited John's parents and were laid back. Preston had been put to bed.

[00:30:14]Sorry.

[00:30:16]Shh. Somebody's whistling their dog outside and she's thinking whistle. Is that Hey.

[00:30:25]So, sorry. I might have to put her in the bathroom if she carries on barking.

[00:30:29]It's the big dog, as you can probably tell by the bark. So, he refers, the prosecution suggests he feels the need to conceal what went on to cause the fracture, but Mr. Vley disagrees.

[00:30:47]Uh, Mr. Wright suggests that both went into Preston's room to settle him. Mr. Vley says they went to see what he was doing because he was making them laugh.

[00:30:58]Mr. Wright says the defendant suggested injury must have happened in that time and that Preston then settled for the night. He asks if he remembers the evidence from Dr. Gford that the boy baby would be inconsolable and unsettled.

[00:31:16]But Mr. Well, they said he wasn't unsettled and he gave him a wink as he lay him down. Who gave him a wink?

[00:31:32]Hi Michelle.

[00:31:38]Hi Sean.

[00:31:42]Yes, Scooby.

[00:31:47]Scooby outside.

[00:31:50]So, who who gave who a wink? I mean, Preston's not going to be winking.

[00:31:58]So, he's M. And why would you wink at a baby?

[00:32:02]It's just rubbish, isn't it? Anyway, so the Casey says, "You've each covered up what happened here, haven't you?" And uh Mr. Vi says no, the only story here is yours, sir. You know, he's so accusatory as well. So, obviously the KC, you know, he he's a prosecution lawyer and it's all his fault that Preston's dead by the sound of it. Or how dare he accuse him?

[00:32:31]Mr. Wright asked if Amy Shepherd misunderstood when she recorded that Mr. Vley said they'd been woken in the night and the defendant says he told her they had got up and that is how that misunderstanding must have happened.

[00:32:46]Another misunder understanding.

[00:32:54]Oh my goodness.

[00:32:58]It's much mis understanding after misunder understanding isn't it with this one.

[00:33:10]Right. Where's my bloody Pinocchio? Put your Pinocchios up in doing that. Uh when the police asked him um I need to put my >> um when the police asked him why you know he said to the police not as obsessed with Preston's genitals as you are. That's what he said to the What a thing to say, you know. Absolututely.

[00:33:58]Right. I'm on the wrong one there. Hang on.

[00:34:03]My Pinocchio emojis.

[00:34:09]I find them.

[00:34:12]Oh god, nothing's working right. Why is that not doing that?

[00:34:27]I'm determined I'm going to find him.

[00:34:30]It's not going to defeat.

[00:34:37]Yeah. Very very cocky and arrogant.

[00:34:42]And he's also he's a liar.

[00:34:55]Says I've got an unstable internet connection.

[00:35:00]I have haven't I haven't got stable internet connection.

[00:35:12]It's fine on my phone.

[00:35:19]Maybe I've got too many windows open.

[00:35:21]That's a possibility.

[00:35:29]Why is my Why is there Still hasn't come up.

[00:36:05]Oh, never mind. I have to give in with that. Oh, yeah. It's come up.

[00:36:10]It's come up finally. Right. Okay. Let's go back to where I was.

[00:36:18]So, the health visitor visited the family as he was unsettled and he squirmed as they put him down. But Mr. Vley says, "No, no, no. The word squirming was never used."

[00:36:34]And a friend said that Mr. Vley said they had gone to see Preston in the night and he was in an odd position.

[00:36:44]I don't know what she's referring to as an odd position, he says.

[00:36:50]and M and Mr. Vi says so she doesn't remember sir he said there was no mention of any banging of the arm or car by his friend so everyone who said so different people had said to the piece that Jamie and John had given different versions, all these different versions of how Preston had fractured his arm. Uh, but Jamie Valley now is saying, "No, I never said any of that."

[00:37:42]Mr. Wright says the defendant has repeatedly given inconsistent said that it was as he was put either putting Preston in the car seat or taking him out. But he's denying that he ever said that. He says others said M of all he said he caught his arm in the [ __ ] bars but the defendant said they were taking his arms off years later.

[00:38:15]It's not that many years later. Three years later in a text message to a friend shortly after the injury occurred Mr. said we it happened in their company you know we can twist anything around this man in another message to a jury is told and we were holding his hands he sort of twizzled and Mr. Wright says is the reality that you both knew full well how this happened and Mr. said, "Your reality is wrong." Mr. Wright suggests the defendant yanked or pulled Preston's arm.

[00:39:10]"He wasn't settled. You were finally had come to the end of your tether," says the Casey.

[00:39:18]"But Mr. says, absolutely not. There were times when it was hard work, but we would absolutely not hurt our little boy. You are absolutely wrong.

[00:39:34]He doesn't say Preston's name very often or Elijah, you know, be it. It's often little one, our little boy, our son.

[00:39:43]It's rare for him to actually use his name, you know. It's rare for him to use his name.

[00:39:53]uh which it to me is telling. I feel he can't use his name because it you know it makes him feel bad. So on July the 12th the jury's told Mr. Vley texted a friend and he said he was not in a good place and he was struggling. So this was the other thing. Uh he told a friend he didn't want to be here anymore. You know he was depressed as well. It's all about him.

[00:40:19]God that poor baby. How was that baby ever put with these two idiots who couldn't look after a goldfish? Never mind a baby.

[00:40:28]Mr. Vley tells the court there were many times he was struggling but not because of parenting. He remembers meeting a friend at a hotel that that day. The jury hears he doesn't recall asking for some of her anti-anxiety medication. So apparently asked his friend for her anti- an Well, she says he did. He doesn't remember that. He'd probably say she's lying. And Mr. Volley says that conversation didn't take place.

[00:40:59]So, she's another liar. According to him, everyone's a liar except for Jamie Barley.

[00:41:07]He agrees that Mr. McGawan for Zachary met them and he gave the baby to him, but he says it was his turn rather than saying he couldn't cope as his friend said.

[00:41:20]Now, so we're talking about a man here who's not working, right? He's not working.

[00:41:28]He's taken a year off to look after a baby that he wanted, you know, that they they applied to adopt a baby. He's got his mom lives up the road. He's got support from her. He's got all these bloody friends, it seems. He's always talking about he went to meet a friend.

[00:41:46]He spoke to a friend, all his friends.

[00:41:48]and he's got a partner and he can't cope.

[00:41:52]Why did he ever get a baby? And then he's saying to Mr. uh to John when John gets home, it's your turn now. I've had him all day. Well, yeah, because John's been at work. You know what I mean? John would probably prefer to spend some time with the baby than uh uh well, you know, depend on what you believe of John. I I'm not 100% certain that John is involved. I think he probably was, but let's give John the benefit of the doubt and presume he wasn't involved. You know, he's out at work all day. He gets in and and then he he walks into this screaming banshee who we've seen exactly how dramatic he is as he was at the hospital.

[00:42:38]This screaming banshee saying to Right, you have him now. It's your turn. you know, it's your turn. You better get home soon because I can't shower otherwise. But then another day he left um left Preston in the bath while he went and had his shower, didn't he? But you know, it's just cohes, isn't it?

[00:42:58]Kahan is Spanish for bollocks. It's just all bollocks. Everything he says.

[00:43:04]Uh he agrees that Mr. the GF met them and he gave the baby to him, but he says it was his turn rather than that he couldn't cope. Now, apparently his friend said he said he couldn't cope, but no, his friend was lying. He It wasn't it was his turn.

[00:43:25]Um, so then at 11:32, the jury was told of noted stresses in the defendant's life. On July the 13th, 2023, the jury is told that Oh, the jury is told that head teacher Rebecca Warhorse, so don't forget Jamie Vley was head of year at a high school. She had a responsible Well, so that's the other thing. He can't cope. He's got no financial worries. You know, it's not financial problems. He's worrying about maybe losing his job, but he hadn't lost it yet. uh paid Mr. VI a visit at home with another staff member and in her record she noted three stresses in Mr. Vley's life and the jury was told that was the birth mother challenging the adoption Mr. a gown for Zachary face imping possible redundancy and a house move. Well, do you know what? Buying a new house, that's a choice. Nobody was making them buy a new house. You know, they chose to buy a new house apparently the morning of the horrible day where Preston died. They met up with their mortgage advisor, left the baby with um Jamie's mom and met up with their mortgage advisor. Well, you know, it is a stress, but well then don't buy a new house. You know, it's not an obligation. They had a house. Why were they buying a new house?

[00:45:04]So this is what so all these stresses in his life apart from the birth mother challenging the adoption they were choices you know he he made choices in his life so yeah it's the thing this with I'd like to find out more officially about the birth mother was she challenging the adoption is it true I think it is true. According to the mainstream media, it is true that uh little Preston's birth mom when she was a teenager, she actually murdered somebody and that's probably why the baby was taken off her. I don't know.

[00:45:48]I'd like to know the full details of that. So, it seems like from what's being said here, she wanted the baby, you know, but she wasn't just being she wasn't allowed to have Preston, you know. It seems like that's what was going on, isn't it?

[00:46:07]Yeah, Sean, it is. It's It is a horrible case. It's a horrible horrible Oh, you know, all children's cases are going to be particularly horrible, aren't they?

[00:46:15]But uh I think this one just cuz he's you know so little and um all those injuries in just four months. It must been constant you know constant abuse to create 10 injuries a month to this boy on average.

[00:46:38]It's a shame his birth mother didn't get him because the thing is she's now in her 30s herself. Um what she did was a terrible thing. Um but you know it was a long time ago and presumably she's a reformed character. I don't know but she did do a terrible thing to an old lady.

[00:47:01]Anyway, we won't go into that here. The jury's told that on July 19th, the videos of Preston spinning in the toy saucer at the park were filmed. So this was the spinning cups. He was Preston was put in them and spun so fast that he went practically unconscious and he was visibly distressed. And this twon videoed it.

[00:47:30]Do you regret what you did to him on that day? Says the KC. And Mr. Vley says, I do regret spinning him that fast.

[00:47:41]Did you regret it while you were doing it? Asked Mr. Wright. And Jamie says, I regretted it after my interviews.

[00:47:53]Yeah, he regretted it after his interviews because he realized it made him look like the [ __ ] he is. He didn't regret it when little Preston was stricken, you know, visibly distressed in the videos. Well, the jury will have seen those videos. I hope this jury makes the right decision in this case.

[00:48:15]Uh, you know, you regretted it after his interviews. What the thing is, if you went a bit too far and you're a bit exuberant, as soon as you saw your little boy was distressed, you go, "Oh, sorry. I shouldn't have done that. You know, you may do it without realizing. Well, I don't think you would, but um at the end of the day, let's get, you know, if you did and you suddenly thought, "Oh, I spun him a bit too fast there." Uh you would go to him and comfort him and take him out as soon as you saw he was distressed. Oh, not this tw. He only regretted it after his interviews.

[00:48:56]He's asked whether at no stage in life did you regret what you did to this little boy on July the 19th. And Mr. Vley says there was no reflecting or understanding. No. Did you regret when you were focusing on his eyes? Because what he did was he put the video up.

[00:49:18]Preston had his eyes closed. He was practically unconscious. And he went up to him and lifted his eyelid up.

[00:49:26]That was on the video. That was on the video. So, the thing is they're taking all these videos and you can't argue with them, can you? You know, they're there. They've videoed.

[00:49:38]So, the Casey says, Oh, he says, "I didn't regret. I just realized I'd spun him too fast," said Mr. Vley. And the Casey says that in one picture, Mr. Vley appears to be focusing on his face and eyes.

[00:49:56]I checked his eyes. Sorry, I have to talk like that. That's how he talks.

[00:50:00]He's so pathetic and uh you know, he's like a he's just a man baby, isn't he? I checked his eyes because I felt they weren't doing what they should have been doing. I realized he had his eyes closed and they were spinning back and forth as they are in the video. So, his eyes were spinning back. Oh my god, he'd spun this baby so fast his eyes were spinning backwards and forwards.

[00:50:28]So the jury will have seen that they this jury have got to find this guy guilty, aren't they? Anyway, he's asked by what he did about it and he says they went home probably went home and SCX abused him then.

[00:50:44]Um Mr. the right says nine seconds later there was another spinning video and he says do you remember the phrase frozen watchfulness he asked this little boy was resigned to his fate and it was obvious on his face and Mr. They said, "No, this little boy, our little boy, had a brilliant life with us." A [ __ ] off.

[00:51:14]Oh my god. Now I'm getting angry. He had a brilliant life with us. He had such a fantastic life with them.

[00:51:25]Four weeks, 40 injuries.

[00:51:29]Wow. Then he was dead. Three hospital admissions. What a fantastic life that boy had according to this twon.

[00:51:39]Oh my god.

[00:51:42]Monster.

[00:51:44]Absolute monster. He had a brilliant life with us.

[00:51:49]Did you regret it when you sent it to your friend or partner? That's the video. And he says, "No, I regretted it when it was pointed out to me." Ah, but do you know what? thought if he didn't laugh, you would cry. He regretted it when he realized how it showed that he'd abused Preston. He regretted it. That's when he regretted it when he got caught out.

[00:52:15]Mr. Vley says, "That is my regret and always will be."

[00:52:22]He's just not for real, is he? This guy, he's asked if he sent the one that showed you opening his eye. No, I sent the one with music. Music?

[00:52:38]I didn't. I just didn't click in that moment that my actions were wrong, says the defendant. For whose benefit did you set it to music? So, he even set it to music.

[00:52:51]this little boy visibly distressed and his eyes rattling around in his head and he said it's music. [ __ ] sake.

[00:53:01]There was no benefit and there wasn't any amusement. He says he was spinning around and it was a song about spinning around.

[00:53:12]He was your play thing and you were serally ab abusing him said Mr. Wright.

[00:53:19]It is true that he was his play thing.

[00:53:21]He was just like a little toy every time he got bored.

[00:53:26]Uh he tortured he tortured him for fun.

[00:53:30]He's a vile man.

[00:53:33]I mean really really just unbelievable what this boy went through this baby.

[00:53:43]And he said no if that was the case there would be thousands of images. Mr. Volley said, "God, yeah, I I think Louise, I agree with both uh well, all of you what you're saying. He's a monster.

[00:54:08]I think it Preston was tortured, Jack, what Jacqueline said. And I agree with Louise. Psychopaths cannot empathize."

[00:54:16]And I'll tell you something, sometimes I I hope you'll understand why I'm saying this. There's times when I think to myself, I wish I was more psychopathic and less empathetic because it's hard being an empath. You just feel weighed down by the world sometimes, you know, even a little thing. I'm trying to think what I saw the other day and I couldn't stop thinking about it. I think it was a hedgehog in the road or something. And uh this hedgehog was just sat in the middle of the bloody road. And anyway, I avoided it, went round it, but I was worrying about it all night if this hedgehog had got to the side of the road or not. And this morning when I was driving up, I'm looking out for it because I'm I this was late last night when I we saw the hedgehog just sitting in the middle of the road. And the thing is, there weren't many cars on the road.

[00:55:09]It's a very windy road. Uh, and I thought some people won't even try and avoid animals on the road. Oh, there was an owl on the road as well. An owl this morning, a little baby owl that look and it was on the other it was in the other lane to the way I was going. And I saw it and I'm thinking, "Oh, what do I do?

[00:55:32]could have beat my horn and met try and make it fly off because there's cars coming the other way and it was a busy time. Anyway, a car coming the other way slowed down luckily and this owl just flew off so that was okay. But yeah, that bloody hedgehog I worried about it all night that you know and I thought it must be quite nice being a psychopath really because you don't have to have all these emotions.

[00:55:58]You don't have to have all this worrying about whether the hedgehog got to the side of the road or not. You know, that's how much something can affect me.

[00:56:06]I mean, honestly, there's sometimes things there was a video once that I saw on X that I'll never ever forget. I don't know how it it got on there. Uh, and it was the most distressing video I've ever seen. That was about the abuse of a child. And I just I just couldn't stop think I haven't still haven't stopped thinking about it. And it was about a year ago. I just just can't get the the images out my head. So, you know, people who can do horrible things like this man has done to Preston, how could he not care that about how Preston was reacting?

[00:56:45]Look, he really is a monster. Iceman.

[00:56:49]An iceman is like cold as ice.

[00:56:56]Anyway, on July the 19th, Mr. Vi messaged his partner to ask why he was in Sulford. Yeah, see this is it. He was in Sulford Keys apparently. So, I think John was having an affair. Personally, I'm thinking it more and more. Or Jamie thought maybe he was having an affair.

[00:57:16]And he tells the court they followed each other on Find My Friends. But he says it was not a control thing. No. No, no, no, no. It was just so that he wouldn't call him when he was driving.

[00:57:29][ __ ] off. He then sent the spinning around video. So, yeah, a lot of these things he's definitely done to um it's almost like a punishment for John, if you like, or a clamor for attention from him a lot that you know, these things were always done when John was out at work.

[00:57:53]and he's looked at him for on find my friends. He's been thinking why is he in Sulford? What's he doing in Sulford?

[00:57:58]He's supposed to be blah blah. He's with someone you know definitely he is a control freak this guy.

[00:58:09]Do you know what this couple they've got to relationship haven't they? And they're still together. Don't forget.

[00:58:18]But their relationship is so toxic and Preston just got caught up in the middle of it all, didn't he?

[00:58:30]You know, he got got caught up in the middle of it all, right? Everyone in Preston's life, well, except for maybe the foster parent. I think with the foster parent, he he did have some love and comfort in the foster family.

[00:58:52]It was a family, wasn't it? So, but really that's the, you know, I don't think any of the social workers were much good really or you know, nobody really picked up on anything that was happening. But they should they should never I don't think this comes back to what we said right at the beginning.

[00:59:14]What are are the the criteria for adopting a baby?

[00:59:21]You know, if somebody wants to adopt a baby, they should have to surrender all their uh you know, let the police look at all or their social works or whatever. Examine their social media, their messages between the the relationship. Is it you don't give a baby to a toxic partnership like this one?

[00:59:42]You know, I'm not against same-sex couples uh adopting babies or children.

[00:59:48]That's to me the these men, they're not horrible because they're gay. They're not horrible because of their sexuality.

[00:59:56]They're just horrible people. You know, there's plenty of um you know, husband and wives uh that abuse their children as well. So, you know, it's I don't think it's that kind of thing. Not in my opinion anyway. It's not about that. But they are horrible people.

[01:00:15]You know what? Not because of their sexuality, but just because they're tw.

[01:00:22]Yeah. The foster parents. Yeah.

[01:00:26]Uh anyway, the jury is told there's a photo of a Preston in a bath on July the 21st. Mr. Vley says it is deeper than his usual one and he didn't always use a bath seat.

[01:00:42]The court is now shown the photos showing Preston over the bars of the cop. Do you remember this photo, these photos?

[01:00:51]Preston's over the side of the bar of the cop with blue lips and is dribbling from his mouth and he's taking a video of him. Mr. Wright suggests the baby was put in that position and abused. And Mr. Vley says that is not correct. and he says we've established he was left there for a long quite a long time which I'm not proud of. So again now that he's been caught out doing it he's not proud of it but he didn't at the time he was just happy to take video of him and pictures of him. What was he going to do with those photos?

[01:01:32]And he says uh it was saliva coming from the baby's mouth.

[01:01:44]Mr. Wright says Preston was struggling to breathe, which he says was apparent from his color and the position of his neck over the bar.

[01:01:54]Now, this is going to make me cry because I can't believe that they could just leave that baby like that, you know, and just take photos and videos like it was funny.

[01:02:05]The defendant says he didn't feel he was in any danger. He agrees. He called Mr. GF to come and look at the position that he'd fallen asleep in. Now, John was there that day.

[01:02:18]He says he laid Preston down when GF came in the room. But Mr. Wright says, "The pair of you sex assaulted that boy, didn't you?" And Mr. Vley says, "No, you're incredibly wrong. very wrong. I don't think he is wrong. I think that's exactly what happened to that baby.

[01:02:39]Where's the Pinocchio?

[01:02:42]Liar.

[01:02:45]Nobody. You know you a baby lying over the, you know, with his head over the C, saliva dripping from his mouth, blue lips, and he's not going to and see, oh, what's the matter? He's taking a video of him and thinking it's funny.

[01:03:04]He's a vile man. You know, whichever way you look at it, whether you think it was an SCEX attack or not, it it wasn't right to just leave him there like that.

[01:03:18]He says on reflection, now that he's thought about it and been caught out, he should have laid him down. He said, "If I felt there was any danger, I would have laid him down.

[01:03:29]He was your play thing, wasn't he? Mr. Wright says. And Mr. Vi says, "No, he was not. He was our beautiful boy that was very much loved."

[01:03:43]There are some things I got wrong, but he was very much loved. And that is something you will never ever be able to take away. So you see, again, he's accusatory to the barristister. It's the barristers's fault. Obviously, all this.

[01:04:01]Well, you know, it's true. Jamie Jamie knows what really happened.

[01:04:07]And uh remember at the hospital he was screaming, "I'm going to hell. I'm going to hell." Well, Jamie, you are going to hell. I think I've got one of the members emojis. Hell.

[01:04:21]Let's have a look.

[01:04:24]Is that the hell one? I hope I'm putting the right one up there. I can't see very well on my phone. Yeah, you are definitely going to hell, Jamie. 100%.

[01:04:35]You're going to hell. I don't know if that is the hell mode. I've put the right one up. I think I have.

[01:04:44]I think so.

[01:04:49]Ah. So, yeah, he's definitely going to hell this this man for what you know. He knows what he did, but we'll see what the jury makes of it.

[01:05:00]And Mr. Wright asks, "What really happened that day when you were at home?" And he says, "No seex allegations as you would say," Mr. Barley replied.

[01:05:20]Mr. right asks about three photos taken on May the 15th which he says show Preston in the cot with his feet over his head.

[01:05:31]Why not move in? Mr. Wright says I don't understand why I would. He was not in any danger. Mr. Vley says, "I'm just thinking it. He's in this cot with his feet over his head."

[01:05:47]Anyway, how yeah it's not a natural position really really that is it for a baby but possibly Mr. Wright suggests that the defendant position the baby like it for his own amusement and Mr. Vley says I don't understand what the amusement would be. Mr. Wright says later that day July the 23rd he discovered GF had gone out. It was a Sunday and they had a routine for a Sunday. The jury's told he was asked about a photo he took of Preston's bottom that day. He says he was alone in the house when he took the photo and that he showed it to Mr. McGowan for Zackly when he got home. And the defendant agrees that GF would use his phone differently to the way he did. And Mr. Wright asks if he uses it to pay for things. One of his phones, Mr. Bley says, however, that he then says he can't say whether he does or not. He says he just assumes he does, but he can't say. And Mr. Wright suggests the photo was a momento.

[01:06:56]The defendant disagrees.

[01:07:01]A photo he took of his bottom. Oh, dearly.

[01:07:06]Mr. Wright then goes back to the police interview where Mr. VI was asked about the spinning playground toy um and the spinning playground toy and shown the video. Mr. Vley says it sometimes take him takes him a while to recognize he's wrong.

[01:07:24]During that interview told officers Preston had some diarrhea on the day he slumped over the [ __ ] bars. Mr. Vley said he noticed a problem with Preston's bottom and he took a picture to show his mom and Mr. GF, but by the time he charged changed him again, it didn't seem a problem. He said he showed the photo to GF when they were in the house, and GF later changed him. And Mr. Wright suggest this was the day that Preston was SCEX abused by both men, but Mr. Vley says no.

[01:08:03]On July 24th, there was a 14minute video of Preston alone in the bath. That was that fancy leave. You wouldn't leave a baby alone in the bath for 14 for 14 seconds, never mind 14 minutes. Mr. Vley said it was to see how he would cope with being alone.

[01:08:22]And Mr. Wright asked if this was a dry run and whether he had dark thoughts about drowning him in the bath. And Mr. Volley says that is not the case. We lost our boy. You forget about that when you put these allegations forward. I could not think straight, he says. It's all the barristers's fault again.

[01:08:48]They lost their boy. Whose fault was it?

[01:08:51]It's your fault. In an interview on September the 14th, Mr. VI was asked about the Snapchat video captured on the day Preston died, which the prosecution says shows him in distress. Mr. Vley didn't recall that video and he told officers he was being asked about things he didn't remember. Did you need time to get your story together? Mr. Wright asked. No, I had just forgotten about that video of him having the seizure on the bed.

[01:09:22]Well, you would forget, wouldn't you?

[01:09:24]Your baby has a seizure on the bed.

[01:09:25]You'd forget all about it. It's nothing.

[01:09:28]Oh, what? Oh, yeah. You had a seizure on the bed. Oh, that's nothing to see here.

[01:09:32]Nothing important that I need to remember. In the interview, Mr. Vley said he took it to ask a friend who knew about epilepsy. He tells the court that is correct. You were just making it up as you went along.

[01:09:47]The Casey suggests he says that friend isn't someone he would always Snapchat with and he would usually WhatsApp.

[01:09:56]I usually would have a conversation on WhatsApp. Yes. The odd occasion, the odd video would be Snapchat. And Mr. Wright asks, "Are you editing your responses?"

[01:10:07]But Mr. Vley said Snapchat would have been the easiest format.

[01:10:13]Mr. VI also asks if he was worried uh about what G Mr. VI asks if he was worried about what GF might be saying in the next interview room when he replied no comment and Mr. VI says there was nothing to shy away from. Casey asked whether in the intervening period prior to his detention on the 11th 12th of June 2025 whether he and GF had been in a relationship and he says yes is it by now June 2025 you'd managed to come up with a joint version of events no John and I it was always very difficult he says he said there were many months where they were unable to speak about the passing of Elijah, also known as Preston.

[01:11:05]Mr. Wright claims they were both abusive to the baby, jointly illreated and neglected him, and on more than one occasion, Mr. Vley restricted his airway.

[01:11:17]And Mr. Vley said, "That boy, our son, has never been SCEX abused."

[01:11:28]Mr. Right. Says, "It was only then that you attempted to explain any of the injuries at postmortem, saying it could be incubation or caused by medical staff. The reality is you killed that boy."

[01:11:44]And he says that our boy was not SCX abused or murdered or hit.

[01:11:50]And that is the end of the crossexamination of for for the prosecution of Jamie. So I don't know if John's going to testify or not. I think that might might be Oh, no. There's still a bit more.

[01:12:10]So, so now this is his own lawyer, Mr. Kennedy Casey, the defense lawyer for Jamie. He's clarifying some answers given relating to his explanation of rubbing Preston's belly like a tube of toothpaste when he took him out of the bath on July the 27th. Mr. Vley said he rubbed Preston's belly and back in the bedroom and bathroom. He said he rubbed the belly quite hard and he hit his back with his bare hands. Mr. Kennedy asks, "Did you ever treat Preston simply as a play thing to be amused?" And he says, "No, we did not. I did not."

[01:12:58]Mr. Kennedy then asks about the suggestion that by July the 11th, sorry, just bought a drink.

[01:13:10]He was increasingly broken down by his circumstances and he had told a friend he had a right meltdown and Mr. Kennedy points to a later message in which he says he had spoken to a social worker and he felt better.

[01:13:29]Mr. Vali confirms that after speaking with the social worker, he felt reassured that what he was feeling was normal. There you go. The social uh social worker missed that red those red flags. Um you know, let me put the red flags up now.

[01:13:49]Um so he had spoken to the social worker and he had told the social worker that he was having he was struggling having problems and blahy blahy blah. Uh but just wasn't picked up on enough was it?

[01:14:07]I suppose I don't know.

[01:14:12]Uh he agrees that the headteer and school staff members were correct when they noted that Mr. Barley appeared in better spirits after their home visit.

[01:14:28]Mr. Uh Kennedy asks if he spun Preston in the saucer toy again after he noticed his eyes were looking unusual and the defendant says he did not. And that concludes Mr. Kennedy's reexamination.

[01:14:51]So they finished very early today because at 12:31 the judge told the jury that as far that's as far as the trial can go today and he said the trial will now adjourn until uh 10:30 a.m. on Monday. So no hearing tomorrow and then on Monday a defense pathologist will give evidence.

[01:15:15]So we've heard from the pathologist Allison Armor. Don't forget Alison Armor.

[01:15:23]She was uh the forensic pathologist also.

[01:15:29]Let's put a picture of her up. She was the forensic pathologist at the Nicola Bully trial. Not trial. Sorry. Should have been a trial. No, never mind. Uh Allison Armor, she was the forensic pathologist in the Nicola bullying quest. Um and she is the one that's testified to Preston's injuries, saying that he had bruising at the back of his throat and this that and the other. And her findings were confirmed by Dr. Gford, another doctor. But it was Alice and Armor that did the physical examination of baby Preston after he died. Uh but Dr. Gford uh confirmed uh Allison Arma's findings.

[01:16:18]But Dr. Gford did not do a physical examination of Preston. Her conclusion was come to by the medical reports and photos and and uh things that she'd been sent. She didn't actually get the chance um to examine Preston whereas Alice and Arma she did examine him. Bless him. very distressing. That must be as I said before too doing an autopsy on a little baby just must be just just can't you know imagine I mean doing an autopsy on anyone is you know it's not I someone has to do it and I'm glad some people do choose that profession because somebody's got to do it but um you know God a baby I mean I just always wonder.

[01:17:15]That's it. I, as I say, being an empath, I couldn't do that job because I just wouldn't be able to go home and forget it because you've got to lead a normal life. You got to go home and have your dinner after you've done that. Just you just wonder how people can do it, don't you? But they do. You know, some people Sorry, Jesus. Uh, some people can compartmentalize like that. say I couldn't I would go home and that'd be I I just won't be able to stop thinking about that baby. I can't stop thinking about him as it is. I haven't seen him in that state, you know, um to see what had happened to him and anyway, but luckily people do do that job because somebody's got to do it. up.

[01:18:04]Uh so yeah, now on so it's saying that on Monday the defense so the the def obviously the defense have probably had their own autopsy done and the defense pathologist is going to speak. I wonder if John's going to speak. So the trial will now adjourn till 10:30 on Monday when a defense pathologist will give evidence and the judge wishes the jury a good weekend and the and reminds them not to conduct any of their own research and that concludes the evidence for today.

[01:18:43]It's funny, isn't it? So they get sent home the jury. They're going to be home now Friday, Saturday, Sunday and they're not supposed to do any, you know, go on Google or or do anything that's, you know, how do you know that they haven't, you know? Yeah, Louise, you couldn't do the job either. No, how how do you know?

[01:19:06]You know, maybe that jury, they'll just go straight over and get on Google. I don't know. But um having said that, they still got to go by the evidence, haven't they? The evidence that's been presented. We've had the prosecution case. Now we're hearing the defense case. And it'll be interesting to see is the defense pathologist then going to come up and say, "Oh no, um there was no bruising to the throat or say that the bruising that was to the throat is caused by something else."

[01:19:46]You know what they going to say it's caused by? So, we've had two medical professionals now that have said that that bruising to Preston's throat could not have been by incubation.

[01:19:58]It must have been while he was still alive because uh you don't bruise apparently after you're deceased, which made me quite uh you know, remember Nicola Bully had quite a lot of bruises on her that were never explained with it. She had quite a few bruises. She had that big L-shaped bruise on her leg. Um, and they they were never explained.

[01:20:26]Those bruises, but they must have been still alive, as Alice Arma says in this case, she's the same forensic pathologist that did Nicola Bully's autopsy.

[01:20:42]um your body does not bruise after the the heart stop beating. So to bruise you have to have blood flowing. And so that's what she said that the bruises on Preston's throat in her opinion had been done just hours prior to him dying but while he was still alive. So, so it' be interesting to see what the defense pathologist comes up with because I think we are all more or less convinced they they're guilty or certainly uh that Jamie is guilty. I know. Um but of course we've got to listen to all the evidence. Well, the jaw we don't make any difference what we think. We're just giving our opinion. That's what we're doing here in the live chat and that. And we have the right to do that.

[01:21:36]We have the right to have our opinions.

[01:21:37]We're not on the jury.

[01:21:40]And if we were on the jury, we will talk about it except between I don't know if the jury are allowed to talk between themselves at break time and things like that. I don't know if they're allowed to even do that or have they got to wait until we actually sent away to come to a verdict. Anyway, but we're not on the jury, so we can talk about we can give our opinions what we think whether you know he just never he never come Jamie never comes over to me as a sincere person who's not lying sadly that's how it comes over to me in the interviews that the police interviews the different things he said the way he was at the hospital where he said I effing killed him I'm going to hell knows he's he is hotel him and I think those videos at the hospital they're the raw videos of before he had a chance to think about anything.

[01:22:43]Um but that's my opinion anyway but we all have an opinion don't we? Okay.

[01:22:51]So, yeah, couldn't do that job, Louise.

[01:22:54]So, there won't be anywhere on this. So, what tomorrow night in the members live, I'm going to do the members live tomorrow night. Uh, if you're not a member, please join and come and join us because, you know, we're going to have a break from true crime completely. We normally in the members lives talk about something a bit lighter, you know, because true crime it is it's you know it's important and you know you're either interested in true crime or you're not and I am for whatever well there's lots of reasons why I am but um I was watching Netflix was it yesterday anyway it spilled today and I watched Nogumentary.

[01:23:47]It's uh in is there four or five episodes? It's about Kylie Manog and her life so far. Of course. Oh god. I was f it was fascinating.

[01:24:00]You know what a woman I mean she really is.

[01:24:04]You know, I'm from the know where I'm from, but I never liked her when I was young. She was too sort of twe for me. Like I was like things more I like new romantics and you know things had more of an edge and of course Kyle was you know shiny pop sort of thing and stop a waterman type thing. Um but very interesting to see how it all developed. Talking about relationship, talking about cancer. Uh you know, she's she's had a very difficult life.

[01:24:43]She had fame and fortune, but it's not all been plain sailing. And you know, money and fame doesn't bring happiness in your love life because she was with a fair well she had a relationship with Michael Hutch from in excess. He later killed himself, didn't he? And anyway, I found a lot of resonance with things that happened in my own life. Anyway, we're going to talk about that in the um members live. I've decided you're a member and uh you you've got Netflix. Try and watch documentary first so you can give opinion on it what you think. It's very interesting. I watched all episodes not back to back. I did have a break overnight and then watch the rest of it earlier on today. But I was fascinated with it. You know, she was very it's very interesting. um a difficult life she's had even but all it's funny isn't it love but you can't find you can't find happiness in love in your private life and there's all those fans out there anything to go out with Kylie Mino she can't find love or she's found it a couple of times and I think it was obvious she's still in love with Michael Hutchkins. That's how it struck me.

[01:26:18]Anyway, that's what we're going to talk about tomorrow. So, if you get a chance and you're a member, uh try and watch Oh gosh. Uh try and watch some of it. I'm going to I'll tell you about it anyway about some of the things we're going to talk about. I can't show it because Netflix won't let you do that, but I'm going to talk about what it was about. Um, I hope you find it interesting. It's a little bit lighter than true crime. Um and if you know why join and come and join us tomorrow night for that live maybe tomorrow depends what might come up case I will be back in I'm I've got to finish off the painting on my roof turn point hope. Press share, press notifications, but most of all, look after.

[01:27:38]I'll see you really soon in the the next video. And until then, may your God go with you.

[01:27:46]and E.