Kier Gaines Talks Therapy, Dr. Cheyenne Bryant, Finding The Right Therapist + More

Added: 2026-05-15

[00:00:00]We're in an era where social media has turned a lot of people into mental health influence >> for sure.

[00:00:05]>> How important is licensing when somebody is giving, you know, relationship or trauma advice to millions of people?

[00:00:12]>> Uh, you know, I personally find it important to be licensed. Um, for myself, it's important because it makes sure that it makes sure that I'm ethically sound. Make sure that people are safe around me. Make sure that I'm continuing all my education credits.

[00:00:25]make sure I'm getting all the training because it's one thing, you know, we got a lot of therapeutic language being slang about people calling you gaslighter and narcissist and we got all the words but people don't really know what happens next in terms of healing.

[00:00:39]>> Healing. Yeah. Nobody talking about problems with no solutions.

[00:00:42]>> No solutions. We just spinning a problem. We talking about it wide but not necessarily deeply. So for me to be licensed, it makes sure that if somebody walks in the room and says, "Hey man, you know, I feel like I'm going to jump off the top of the building tonight.

[00:00:55]What you gonna do next? What's your next move?

[00:00:57]>> What's your next move? A man comes in and says, "Man, I'm feeling like hurting my wife." What you gonna do? What's your next move? All that psycho babble doesn't help when you got to be in a room with somebody and feel your way around that person and have quality training to back that up. So, when we got all the words, but we don't got any wisdom. That's like uh having a map with no way points and no words on it. You you'll know that things are there, but you have no idea where you are, where to go. Do do audiences even understand the difference between a licensed therapist, a life coach, a relationship expert or a motivational speaker anymore? Has social media blurred all of those?

[00:01:32]>> I don't think so. Social media is not a place for dynamic nuance. So, I not only do people not know, I honestly don't think that people care.

[00:01:40]>> And that's one of the things that uh I really hone in on when I talk on my platforms because therapy, being a licensed clinician is a specific thing and it's a specific designation by the state that says that you passed all your exams and you're doing all these things you need to do to make sure that you're upholding all the ethical principles of the craft. And that's that's amazing.

[00:02:02]When people are hurting, sometimes they just want to hear from somebody. But you got to hear from somebody qualified and trained and steeped in the knowledge to know not just what everything is and what sounds good, but what is the best practice to help move you forward in life?

[00:02:16]>> Did you see our interview with Dr. Sha Bryant?

[00:02:18]>> I saw clips.

[00:02:19]>> Okay. So, when we were getting ready for that interview, I called one of my friends. Um, her name is Dr. Shondaanda Reynolds. And she was saying that to me because I was mentioning >> Dr. Shondaanda.

[00:02:27]>> Yes. Come on.

[00:02:29]>> That's my sister. Like, we went to high school together. like all of that. But yeah, she was she helped me prep for that interview because there was so many different things that you have to go through.

[00:02:36]>> It's very nuance.

[00:02:36]>> The conversation we're having with Dr. Shyan Bryant takes away from the conversation we should be having about the real issues that some people have getting licensed. And I know you're licensed as a therapist. So I don't know if you have anything that you've experienced when you were going through your process.

[00:02:48]>> Uh not anything to that extent but lensure is incredibly challenging to get through. I don't think people understand how much schooling, how many how many hours of um practicum and how many hours of internship you have to undergo and then the test itself is difficult and then the licensing board and then you have to sit for a certain number of direct and indirect hours which means a therapist who is more experienced than you sits in with you every week and you talk about your sessions, what went well, what didn't go well. Um, and it it it could be challenging for a number of reasons cuz sometimes you can only, you know, you rise to the level of your help. If you don't have incredible supervision, it's going to dictate how thorough and how effective you are as a therapist in the long run. Yeah.

[00:03:32]>> But, um, even with Dr. Shauna, she's psychologist. Psychologist is different than a licensed therapist. Psychologist is a scientist. Licensed therapist is a practitioner. They're therapists who aren't psychologists, and they're psychologists who aren't therapists.

[00:03:45]It's incredibly nuanced and deep. So yeah, I think this conversation is important that we're having about lensure and making sure that ethical guidelines are held intact, but there are so many other conversations that happen on the inside that the public doesn't even know about >> as far like what >> like how a lot of therapeutic modalities are not really normed on black people.

[00:04:09]>> Talk about that a bit. Dr. Shondaanda talks about that. Talk about it.

[00:04:12]>> Yeah, they're not normed on black people. When a lot of modalities are steeped in psychology and they take a group of people who they study and the people who they studying weren't black, there's this thing in therapy that happens when people don't have cultural competency.

[00:04:26]>> That's right.

[00:04:27]>> And that means like you can come into the room and you can see a black man and then you can see like an uh a South Pacific woman >> and you'll say, "Oh, depression is depression. I'm going to treat these people the same way." You might not honor the fact that where she's from, the hierarchy in the family looks different. So, she may have a different re reverence for her family that might be that might make it harder for her to say, "Nah, Dad. Nah, mom. I'mma do my own thing. I'm going to move in my own direction."

[00:04:53]>> Being culturally competent is treating her knowing, having that in mind, knowing how her culture works and how it affects the way she moves through the world. You may see a black man and think, "Oh, you know, you're in therapy.

[00:05:04]I need you to talk about all your problems." ignoring the fact that that black man has a lived experience where the medical system has not treated his ancestors very well.

[00:05:12]>> He walks in therapy skeptical, rightfully so. So, cultural competency doesn't say, "Oh, man, you got these problems. You need to come into therapy and you need to talk to me because you need to be better." Cultural competency meets him where he is and says, "Ah, I can see why you're skeptical. Let's take the first three sessions and get to know each other a little bit." Matter of fact, I'mma tell you a little bit more about myself. Because what we learned, what black therapists have learned is we get taught when you in a session with somebody, you don't do no self-disclosure.

[00:05:38]>> It's it's not about self-disclosure.

[00:05:40]You're not supposed to talk about yourself, which is right to a degree, but when you in a room with black and brown people, especially black and brown men, you're going to expect him to give all that up and you don't say anything about yourself, >> that's not going to work. The robotic cut off wall of a therapist is a motif that don't work for black men.

[00:05:59]>> Don't work for black people. And if you don't have cultural competency, you would not know that.

[00:06:03]>> You know what's so interesting? The first time I ever started doing therapy, I specifically said I didn't want somebody culturally competent. I wanted somebody that was had no idea about our experiences, what we go through, what I may be going through, cuz I just wanted to tell them what I was dealing with, and I just wanted them to come from like a perspective of >> no bias, >> blank slate.

[00:06:24]>> Just a blank slate. So, it's funny you said uh what you say specific cuz I was looking for an Asian woman >> specifically.

[00:06:30]>> Specifically.

[00:06:30]>> That's very specific. Why Asian woman?

[00:06:32]>> I cuz I just was trying to find like somebody that I felt like didn't know our experience at all. In no way, shape, or form. Didn't find one. Just want you to know that.

[00:06:40]>> So, where'd you end up? Like what type of >> I ended up with a a white woman and I was with her for a couple of years and she was good. But I do feel like what really really got me to that next level was a culturally competent black man.

[00:06:52]>> Yeah. And it depends. A question that floats about a lot is uh do black people need black therapists? And I always say it depends. It's not so much about the lived experience of the therapist. It's about the aptitude of the therapist.

[00:07:05]Number one, how comfortable you are with them.

[00:07:07]>> You know, the most effective therapist I ever had, she was a 65 year old white woman.

[00:07:12]>> We ain't had nothing in common.

[00:07:14]>> Nothing in common. But the way that she moved in that space, it just so happened to bounce with the way that I understand the way that I absorb information, the way that I take instruction. So for me, her her race and her gender wasn't as important >> in order for me to feel comfortable. But that ain't everybody's story. And if you do need somebody that looks like you to be comfortable, then yeah, that's absolutely fine. It's more so the effectiveness of the therapist is going to be contingent probably a little bit more on what you find acceptable to share all your information with where you feel nice and comfy in a session versus some standard rule of law that just applies across the board.

[00:07:55]>> One thing I love that you talk about is something that we don't talk about enough as black men is that father wound, man.

[00:08:00]>> Oh man.

[00:08:01]>> And I saw you uh you you posted a caption with in a video with your daughter and you said, "Becoming the father I deserved. I hear you I hear you speak about that a lot. Can you talk about that father wound that men don't address often?

[00:08:13]>> Yeah, man. You know, I think men are men have this mentality sometimes where we believe that our job is to endure hardships like a good soldier. You white knuckle through life and you don't complain about it. Even when you with the homies, you know, you can talk about your difficulties once or twice, but when you get to when you get to complaining a little bit too much, it's like, "All right, bro. You need to, you know, cry me a river, build a bridge, and get over it." Um, with the father wound is really specific and uh my mentor Jason Wilson talks about this a lot.

[00:08:43]>> Love Jason, >> man. That's my dog. That's my dog. He's he's such an incredible dude, man. Um, I be on the phone with him for two hours at a time just talking life. But we talk about these wounds in parenthood. And with the father wound, it hurts the most because that was supposed to be your model and your road map. And I think we see a father wound as a a man that was completely absent. Like your father wasn't there. Like traditional athlete story. You know what I'm saying? and he went out for milk and he never came back.

[00:09:08]>> But also, there are a lot of men um especially like in in AfroCaribbean households and West African households, and it's not just germaine, the black people. White people go through this all the time where there was a man in the house, but he wasn't really emotionally available. We got all this language now, but it wasn't like this in the 80s or the 90s or the 70s or the 60s or the 50s when both we and our parents were coming up into our maturation. So, it's a longing not only to have the love that you think that you needed, not the love, love that you definitely needed and like that hand overhand guidance and that warmth that you needed from your father cuz warmth is not the opposite of strength.

[00:09:48]>> It's not the opposite of strength. And I think maybe a lot of our fathers maybe have felt that or maybe thought that.

[00:09:53]Um, but not only that, but now it's requisite.

[00:09:57]It's required of you to demonstrate that warmth in a world where that was never associated with masculinity before. So now, not only are you flying the plane while you building the joint, you trying to figure out coordinates to a place you've never been.

[00:10:10]>> Yeah.

[00:10:11]>> And you ain't got no landing gear and they shooting at the plane on social media. They shooting at the plane in public. All of that, man. So, it just it becomes a lot. And I think it's hard to have that conversation in public because of things like patriarchy. And whenever if if you're a man like yeah my father won't you know never I never learn how to be these things. It's like well boohoo you know men have all the power in society. You need to learn how to deal with it. And it's like I feel you but it don't work that way. Nope.

[00:10:40]>> You're still an individual that needs some toutelage that needs some warmth needs some love. But after you turn a certain age as a man like no no nobody holds you anymore. We did an event when I was just talking to a group of men.

[00:10:51]And I said, "When the last time you been held?" Couldn't nobody answer that.

[00:10:55]After you assume a man's body, don't nobody hold you no more.

[00:10:59]Nobody Nobody holds you in their arm and just tells you it's going to be okay. It doesn't work that way. So, >> and that's what you want your you want your woman to be that. You want your wife to be that, but >> Yeah. But it can't be a hyperdependence on her to be that for you. You need to diversify. It's very important for men to do this. And I talk about this in the pod and in my book. You have to diversify where you get your needs met, or else you end up leaning on one person a little bit too hard for everything.

[00:11:24]>> Mhm.

[00:11:25]>> And you burn them out.

[00:11:31]Y'all >> finished or y'all done?