Dr. Berry provides a blunt but necessary reality check by grounding metabolic health in evolutionary biology rather than the modern obsession with exercise. It is a compelling argument that you simply cannot outrun a lifestyle mismatch with your own DNA.
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You Can't Outrun (Or Out-hike) A Bad Diet: Dr. Ken Berry | Off-Trail With DixieAdded:
Good to see you. It's been six years.
Can you believe that?
>> Has it been six years since we saw each other in Texas?
>> It has been six years. Uh Wow. Yeah.
Yeah.
>> I feel like we both look younger, don't you?
>> I I think so. I'm That's what I'm going for. Hashteam live forever. So, >> yes.
>> Uh I I certainly feel better than I did then, for sure. Um, but yeah, so it was uh the TSP event and I I I don't know if it was planned that it would be right before lunch, but I just remember that your presentation was uh so compelling that a lot of people when they went to get their lunch plate were like, I'm good on the bread. Like I I I think they got double the meat and and and let certainly over half of the people declined the bread. And uh I was like, man, I hope they were planning for that because that certainly changed the amount of food that they might have needed. But >> yeah, I didn't plan for that, but you know, Jack Spearco, it's quite possible that he could have planned that.
>> I believe that that there was some mastermind behind that for sure. Um but that that that's so funny. So, uh you're still doing primary care or family physicians seeing >> I'm still a part-time uh family physician. and I still have a few patients I take care of. Uh, increasingly I'm doing other things virtually with people and we have a private community where we help people more small group kind of stuff to help them reverse diabetes and stuff like that. And so still see a few folks in real life uh and but mainly virtual these days.
>> Yeah, I wish I could find a primary care physician. like I'm just about to swap over to another one, but I've even tried a couple functional medicine doctors and I just like I can't get I just can't get a good one. It's it's very difficult. And so I've thought about just going the virtual route and and I mean nowadays um unfortunately I just had a a recent loss with a pregnancy but I I went and ordered my own lab work because even like OBGYNS and and um it's so difficult to find somebody who's willing to be >> um proactive who's who's wanting to do preventative medicine instead of just catching problems on the back end and trying to put a band-aid on it. And so I went through and I'm not affiliated with them at all, but like doctor says.com and ordered my own lab work, you know.
So it's it's really becoming very important to take your own health into your own hands and uh know know the things to advocate for yourself. But you don't even have to go and beg a doctor anymore nowadays. You can find one online that'll just give you the blessing and to do to do whatever blood work you want to because it's almost like it's your blood.
>> Exactly. It's your blood. It's your health information. I'll tell you Dixie medicine modern the practice of modern medicine is a is in currently a state of complete and utter upheaval. Uh I think 2020 broke the system and we're still seeing the ramifications of that now in 2026. I think uh the curtain was pulled away back in 2020. Everybody saw behind the curtain and saw that oh that that arrogant doctor who thought they oh you you don't tell me I tell you. They were revealed to be complete puppets basically. Uh they were they were parrots. They were just paring what they had heard or been told to say. Uh they were pushing things that would make them money that would increase their profit margin. It it turn it was very icky. It was very yucky. It was it was disgusting. And so many people now in 2026 don't even go to the doctor at all.
They do what you do. They go to ownyourlabs.com or uh doctor says and just order their own lab work. If they're feeling bad, more and more people are turning not even to Google anymore. They're turning to, you know, one of the large language models and saying, "Hey, I've got the following symptoms. What is it likely that I have? And should I go see a doctor or is that not necessary?" People are doing that increasingly. I'm not sure what's going to happen long term with health care and primary care and just going to the doctor to sit for a doctor's visit. I predict it's a thing of the past. I think that maybe each, you know, moderatesized town will have one doctor that some people go to see and the rest of everybody else. You'll either see an AI virtual doctor or you'll see a doctor who's licensed in multiple states virtually through Zoom or if you've got a bone sticking out, you'll go to the emergency room. That's that's really your your three choices, I think, coming in the future because nobody wants to go and sit for two hours to listen to an arrogant doctor preach to them about how they need something for their cholesterol and they need the latest flu shot and the latest COVID shot. It's like, dude, I didn't come here for any of that. I came here to ask you a very specific question, but the doctors feel like they have to market to you now. And it's it's very uncomfortable. It's weird. It freaks people out. People don't like it. And people I think people are sick and tired of it.
>> Yeah. Absolutely. I I absolutely OBGYn I was referring to, of course, he didn't call me directly, but somebody in his office when I messaged them and was like, "I'm I'm h I have some concerns. I went and got this lab work done and uh they called me and they said um your doctor would really prefer to manage your labs himself.
They were just very condescending about the fact that I had gone and done this and they're like we we wouldn't have even ordered these labs and I said I know there they said unless there was an issue and I said I know but I'm not trying to wait >> yeah duh >> I'm not trying to wait to have a miscarriage for you to like care about me. So, yeah, it was it was very frustrating. Um, but I I found a doctor another doctor who seems because unfortunately I can't have like AI deliver my baby yet. Um, >> right. Yeah, that's right.
>> So, uh, I'm I I tried to find another doctor, but it's an hour away for a doctor that's even willing to just be a little bit proactive with me and and check my hormones and things like that.
So, >> it's just, like I said, it's very frustrating. But, what what got you I don't know this. I kind of know your health journey, but what got you into the medical field to start with?
>> Like baby Dr. Kenberry before he was a doctor. What What made you think, hey, this is what I want to do?
>> I can remember even when I was six and seven years old, >> watching Trapper John MD and MASH and Quincy, the medical like watching every medical show. There was Marcus Welby.
Maybe maybe I was too young for that.
But I watched every doctor show that I could watch uh from a very young age. It was kind of weird, I think, actually.
But I just always that was that's just what I was going to be. And it at one point I was literally going to be Trapper John MD. I think that's the one who lived in his Winnebago out in the hospital parking lot and just basically worked, you know, 18 hours a day. Went and took a six-hour nap in my Winnebago in the parking lot and then went back to work. Uh there's nothing else. I mean I for a minute I entertain being an astronaut, being a jet pilot, being a professional football player of course, you know, but then when reality set in, I'm like, "Yeah, no, I'm going to medical school." And uh I had a little bit of a a hiccup initially because in when I when I got to be like 13 14 years of age, first of all, I didn't like to study. I had severe ADHD and so I didn't do great in high school. Uh thanks.
Yeah, I think we are kindered spirits in that.
>> Relatable. Relatable.
>> Yeah. And so, thank goodness for uh basketball because I was such a good player that I I got a lot of bees that I didn't deserve. Let's just put it that way. Uh but also, I started having migraines very early in my teenage years. And if I didn't get eight hours of sleep and and eat pretty decent, I would get a migraine at least once a week. And so I'm like, I can't be a doctor and be on call in my Winnebago.
And I'm like, oh, I'm sorry. You'll have to die. I've got a migraine. I can't do that. But when I got to college and, you know, got in my early 20s, the migraines calmed down enough that I'm like, "Okay, I can do this." So, I got back on track and uh initially I went to X-ray tech school, which is a two-year associates degree, just to make sure I could handle the blood and guts and the vomit and, you know, the stuff. and uh did a lot of moonlighting as an X-ray tech even into my first year of medical school until I got busted and told that I'd get kicked out if I was working anymore in medical school. You're not allowed to do that.
Uh but that yeah, it's always been kind of my trajectory with a few little detours, but I got right back on the the doctor path.
>> Yeah. And how much uh studying nutrition did y'all do?
>> That's a trick question, isn't it? So, in at at UT medical school in Memphis, we actually got half a semester, our second year of medical school of nutrition training. Now, 95% of it was okay. Uh Dixie was hiking this trail and she fell down a 250 foot bluff and landed on her face and she's in the intensive care unit. How are we going to feed her? we we're gonna give her an IV.
We're going to feed her, you know, that by a different method than chewing up food because she smooshed her face. And so 99% of it was burn patients, severe trauma. How are you going to calculate the fat, the protein, the amino acids, vitamins, minerals to feed them introvenously? Very, very little of it had anything to do with, okay, you've got a patient in the clinic who has type two diabetes. That was maybe 1% of it.
And whatever that 1% was, it was completely wrong as far as how you actually treat a a human out in the wild with nutrition. It was completely and utterly wrong. Um my our professor was a PhD, not an MD. uh and he had type 1 diabetes and I remember him telling us all the time about how he ate lots of whole wheat pasta to keep his blood sugar uh manageable literally not a joke not kidding that that he said that at least 15 times. So we would have nutrition one hour a week for half a semester or maybe two hours a week and that was it. There was nothing.
Nutrition was not mentioned unless it was somebody in the intensive care unit or the burn unit and we were trying to calculate their their formula that we were going to put in their IV.
>> That's wild. I didn't even consider that side of it. You know, when people are like, "Yeah, we actually did do a little bit of nutrition that it it was probably more that type of thing." Well, I I went to a um rheatologist and >> because I I ended up with a positive ANA tighter. I didn't I don't remember if I knew about this and no, I didn't know about it when I saw you last.
>> Uh but I Yeah, I had like one to 320 is the ratio. So, it's pretty high. And unfortunately, even with some of the things that I've done, which I haven't gone full on, >> I haven't done a super good job. I haven't tried keto. I haven't gone that far. I've done low carb, have not tried keto. Uh, so >> that's a great start.
>> That's probably a great start. That's probably what I should do because I really want I know that that that ANA tighter can be less intense. You know, I know I can and I don't know how you say it like reduce the ratio. Is it really reducing it or >> um anyway, yes, it can be a lower number and uh so that's I I would like to do that. It has stayed the same but has not, you know, gotten better. Um, but I got that um, well, it wasn't a diagnosis. I just I had that I went to a rheatologist. It was actually an allergy doctor that sent me to the rheatologist and I talked to her and said, "Okay, well, this is something that I could probably change with my diet, right?
Avoiding certain things that cause inflammation or and she was like, uh, I mean, I guess you could, but that's like a whole lifestyle change." And I said, "Yeah, I but I'm I'm asking about it. I I I want to know more about that. And and she just really kind of brushed me off and said, "Well, we can give you this hydroxychloroquin and uh it might >> help keep this at bay." And I and I I said, "So, we're not sure that this medication will keep it at bay, >> whatever it is, because they they basically told me I don't have enough symptoms, so I'd have to wait till I got worse and come back." And >> so I said, "Okay, well, I don't want to do that." And so she's like, "Okay, well, how about this medication?" And I said, "Okay, well, we don't know that for sure it'll keep it at bay, but what are the potential side effects?" And she said, "Long-term use could cause vision loss."
>> And I said, "Well, Lord, I don't want that either." And so I I got the prescription and I took it for a couple weeks and I just I said, "No, I I want to do something else." And I have a friend who has Hashimoto's and is a health coach and she really was very knowledgeable on AIP. And so that's what I did. Now, that's not a low carb thing, but it it started me in some kind of direction of learning the process of >> limiting certain things or um eliminating them and then bringing things back in to see if I had any reaction, etc. So, unfortunately, I've gotten very lax. Um, but I I can still even now look at pictures of myself back before I started that and after several months of it and it's a night and day difference in in the puffiness of my face, the way that I feel, >> etc., etc. So, uh, so what about you?
How did you end up really focusing on >> carnivore, keto, low carb, etc.? So I the first few years of my medical practice when I was in my early to mid30s I got really really fat and pre-diabetic and I got up to 297 pounds at my heaviest that I weighed. I was probably heavier than that but I stopped at that point because I didn't never want to see 300 lb which I may have hit.
I don't know. And also my A1C got up to 6.1. So, I was well on my way to becoming an a severely obese di type two diabetic doctor. And uh a lot of people say I have an accent. I don't think so.
But some people say, "Yeah, I can tell you're from the south." And in the south, it's kind of like Texas and and other southern states. Things have to make sense or people will call you out on it, right? 1 plus one equals two, whether it hurts your feelings or not.
And so you can just imagine this fat diabetic doctor coming into your room, Dixie, and saying, "Well, Dixie, you're getting you need to lose a few pounds."
And you're like, "What? Who are you?
What? Who? Shut up." Right? And so I could not be that doctor. I had to fix that. And so I I I since I was pre-diabetic, I started following the American Diabetes Association's PDF handout that I'd given to hundreds of patients. I thought, well, I'll just follow this. I have obviously haven't been. I've been eating junk. So, I'll start eating better in air quotes.
I'll stop eating bacon and stop the saturated fat and I'll start jogging.
And I did that for three months. And guess what happened, Dixie? My diabetes, pre-diabetes didn't get any better. And I gained two or three more pounds.
>> Oh, wow. Even with that added exercise.
>> Exact with jogging two or three days every week. Now, here's the problem that that faced me with. Every doctor secretly thinks that their patients don't do what we tell them to do, right?
We think, "Oh, I told this fat person to lose weight, and I could say fat person because I used to be a fat person, so don't be coming at me. You need to get out and move more and eat less. You need to stop eating junk." And we we suspected, and if they were type two diabetic, I would hand them the ADA handout like I followed, right? And then they would come back in three or six months and their diabetes would be a little worse and they'd gained a little weight. And I would not accuse them of anything because that would be rude. And I'm a southern boy. So I would just assume quietly they didn't do what I said, >> right? Like in your mind, you didn't do it, >> right? They if they had done as I instructed, this wouldn't be happening.
And so I'd raise their medicine a little more, put them on a little more, tell them to do this, that, and the other, check labs. Okay, I'll see you again in 3 to 6 months. That was uniformly what I saw. And that so that's the same exact thing I saw in myself. Right? So now I'm faced with the obvious fact that maybe they had been listening. Maybe they had been doing exactly what I recommended that they do. Maybe what I recommended just did not work.
Maybe I was full of crap. And so I'm like, well, I got to figure I got to figure this out. I got to fix me because I can't be a fat doctor telling people to lose weight for the next 25 years.
So, I dug into the modern nutrition research. That didn't help much. I started digging into all kinds of different genres up to and including archaeology, history, anthropology, and paleo anthropology.
I read a few books. One was The Paleo Diet by Professor Lauren Cordane.
Another was uh the Atkins Diet Revolution by Dr. Robert Atkins. And based on those, I'm like, well, these guys say eat a lot of meat and really kind of cut the carbs, cut out the bread, cut out the the, you know, the starches. And I mean, diabetes is a disease of high blood sugar.
So that sort of makes sense. Let me try that for three months because obviously the American Diabetes Association's thing didn't help me at all. And I don't want to be on a bunch of medicine. No doctor wants to be on medicine. That's kind of inside baseball for you. we we we're terrible patients. So, I'm like, "Yeah, I'm going to try this for three months." And I tried that for three months. And I lost 10 or 15 pounds. And my A1C came down substantially closer to normal just after three months of eating more meat and leinated bread, eliminated most of the just starchy foods, sugar added foods, stopped drinking fruit juices, just very minor changes as far as cutting the carbs, immediate improvement. So, I saw this big signal like, "Hey, this is that wow." So, then I really dug into low carb and paleo and primal and I kept hearing about this keto diet because that was back when that was pretty new and and becoming popular. So, I kept I'm like, "Well, that just all you do from from low carb to keto, you just turn down the carbs more. That's really the only difference. Okay, I can do that.
I'll try that and see what that did."
So, I went 90 days keto. uh probably 50 total grams of carbs a day I would guess looking back completely normalized my blood sugar and my A1C lost another 15 20 pounds. I'm like, "Dang, this I mean, wow." And so my patients who came every three months, I had thousands of patients before the clinic fired. They noticed immediately, doc, just like you said, Dixie, your your face, you're not so puffy, you look healthier, you look younger, look, you look happier. I heard that so many hundreds of times. And you've lost a bunch of weight. What are you doing?
So, I'm like, I don't know. I feel like this is a temporary weight loss hack. I didn't know that much about it back then. It's brand new. Uh, and so I didn't tell everybody, but my my most fattest people with a a body mass index BMI of 35 or higher, so severe obesity, I would tell them you need to try this keto diet or you need to try this beef better, beef, bacon, butter, and eggs diet because, man, it really works. And then also for people who were severely obese and had terrible A1C's and blood sugars.
So people with type 1 and type two diabetes who their A1C was 10 or 11 or 12 because they were already in severe danger right to start with. And so if they could improve that by doing this experimental diet then why yeah of course you should do that at least short term three to six months. So then as I'm doing this, I mean, I'm having to buy new clothes. I'm having to uh buy like shoes that are a little bit smaller. My ring is getting loose on my finger. It's just crazy all the changes that are happening. But I kept also noticing that my shoulder arthritis was better, that my rosacea was better, that my heartburn went completely away. It was 80% better on keto, went away completely on on carnivore, >> stuff like that that has nothing to do with weight loss, right? That has nothing to do with now if it was knee arthritis, sure, maybe you lost weight and your knees not having to carry as much, but thumb arthritis, shoulder arthritis, and and also I kept hearing this message from patients who they'd be like they lost 30 pounds, but they're like, you know, my thumb is so much better now or my carpal tunnel or my acne or my heartburn or my whatever, my dandruff, everything seemingly got better on this diet. And I'm like, at first, all doctors think that patients are full of crap. Like I kind of hinted at earlier. And it's like, yeah, you'll patients will tell doctors anything, especially if they love the doctor. If they like them, they'll be like, "Oh, he saved my life." You know, and so we we're taught to discount that. And so when the first patient said, "Oh god, my heartburn's gone." I thought, "Well, that's just anecdotal. It's just a coincidence." Right.
>> Right. But when the when the 10th patient, the 20th patient, the 30th patient had said, "My heartburn's gone, my skin condition from whether it's psoriasis, eczema, rosacea, acne is better, dandruff, uh toenail fungus is another one. I just kept hearing people say, "Yeah, it's gone. It just went away."
>> That's wild.
>> My jockage went away. I didn't have it other but patients, right? I'm like, >> "Yeah, >> what the hell?" And so that's when I really just dove in head first. It's like this is doing something to people physiologically, biochemically. This is not just a weight loss hack. This is not just a blood sugar hack. This is this is a big deal. And so I that's what that's what brought me to archaeology and anthropology because it occurred to me I wonder if our modern diet is so mismatched with our biology with our DNA that I it's causing a lot of these chronic conditions that we think are just chronic diseases that people have had forever. What if that's not true, right?
What if and what if what if basically our our modern human diet is like feeding a cow meat or feeding a a lion grass? What if it's just the wrong diet for us? And so that's when I do dove into the the the anthropology and archaeology and I found out very quickly that even 500 years ago the the diet we eat today, most people it would be completely unintelligible to the average person 500 years ago. They wouldn't even consider it food. They wouldn't even eat it unless they were starving to death.
They would not touch what we eat today.
They And so they knew back then that you eat as much meat as you can get your hands on. You eat as much fish as you can get your hands on. You eat as many eggs as you can get your hands on. If you're going to eat vegetables, you always cook the vegetables. You don't eat raw vegetables. And you can go back and look at a a a restaurant menu even from the 1910s or 1920s.
There was no raw vegetables on the menu.
And most of the dishes contained either fish or meat or eggs.
>> Even in 1910, 1920, it's just like we just people knew better. You just don't do this. You don't eat raw nuts. You don't eat raw vegetables. Now, ripe fruit is fine. And of course, that's that's meant for mammals to eat it. But they just knew better than that. If you're going to eat a lot of vegetables, you cook that to death. If you're going to eat grains, wheat, rice, oats, and corn, you never eat that raw. You grind it up, you process it, you cook the crap out of it. Because if you eat it raw, it's going to cause inflammation.
They knew this. And so, what are the diseases that we're faced with today?
It's too much sugar, too much starch, too many carbs, leads to obesity, leads to diabetes, leads to fatty liver, and it's chronic inflammatory disease, and perhaps in your case, it's chronic autoimmune conditions.
>> Well, and that's and then the increasing rate of cancer.
That's really the four big things that we have in modern humans that even if you go back in time a hundred years, it was just not there. We had those conditions, but they were very, very rare. They were not common. You didn't have five people at your church with an autoimmune condition or 10 people in your backpacking club that had type two diabetes. That just was unheard of. Does that make sense? And so that's that's when I started talking about maybe there's a proper human diet and what we're eating in modern times ain't it.
>> Absolutely. And I I heard you mention which your YouTube channel is incredible. I side note here, my mom is having some different health issues and she was concerned about some of her kidney function values and this and that. She couldn't get a call back from her doctor. Labs were ordered and then you know she can't like get a follow-up.
So of course she's googling and trying to learn about it herself and freaking herself out. Um, but she is also is having something going on with her heart and and for me too, my biological father passed away of a heart attack at 32. He had arthosclerosis.
>> Atherosclerosis. There we go. Yeah, I'm not the doctor. Um, but anyway, I have read his autopsy report and it's that was actually very interesting. But, uh, yeah, so he had a heart attack at 32. He was playing rugby. Didn't feel good.
Went to lay in his truck. His friends found him laid beside his truck and you know they performed CPR and he died on in the ambulance on the way and so >> Wow. And he was he he played rugby full time.
>> Yes. Was very active. Well well he was an engineer but he played rugby quite frequently with his friends and they were in a recreational club and so he was practicing weekly. I mean very active. Um, so you know that that's something genetic bullets that I consider and and and try to think about in my life choices and uh my mom has several autoimmune things and um but anyway, so dealing with something with her heart so she's like I've got to cut sodium and then I've got to dealing with whatever might be happening with her kidneys and she's like well I don't need to have a lot of protein and so I said you know what mama I'm about to go find I said I bet Dr. Barry has something about this on his channel. You I feel like you've covered >> all of the topics that anybody could want to find out about. So, if you're if you've got a question, go check out his >> YouTube because I went and searched protein kidneys Dr. Barry and up pops a video where you talked about that. And so, um there's just so much contradictory information out there. And I know I think at least that that's a lot of the reason that people are scared to kind of delve off into this thing that seems to some people maybe gimmicky or um it causes some hesitation. So I know that's true of my mom especially when you have multiple things going on.
But it doesn't just have to be type 2 diabetes or insulin resistance. It it autoimmune issues. Um and I guess a lot of it is inflammation is the root.
Is is that right? Or I mean I guess it can be a lot of different things, but >> it's it for the the vast majority of of chronic disease in modern society, it's chronically elevated levels of glucose or sugar, chronically elevated levels of insulin and chronically elevated levels of inappropriate chronic inflammation.
Yes, those are the three big drivers of not only metabolic disease and obesity, but also inflammatory diseases like arthritis and reflux and all that, but then also the autoimmune conditions and also cancer.
All of those things are driven by those three things. And I'm not saying that those three things cause all cases of those things. I'm saying that those three things, if they're elevated, are going to make your cancer worse, make it metastasize quicker. They're going to make you have more severe autoimmune disease and make you have more than one autoimmune disease, which is becoming increasingly common. They're going to make you fatter and they're going to make you metabolically sicker. Yes, absolutely. So, I'm so glad you did that for your mom because here's something that your your people, they need to understand and I think they're predominantly common sense people. So, I think they'll get this and be able to be like, "Oh, got it." Doctors, this is very important. I'm going to tell you a secret about doctors. Doctors are just dudes and chicks just like you. They are human beings.
They are not demigods. They are not omnisient. They are they're in many cases not much smarter than you when it comes to just verifiable IQ and common sense and intelligence. They just went to school for four years and then did a residency from two to seven years that they were they were more indoctrinated than they were actually educated. And I hate to say that because I'm still a board-certified licensed doctor, but it's true. Uh I think in no other field I don't think in engineering because you know in engineering the bridge bridges can't just fall down and buildings can't just fall down. People get fired and lose careers but you know in medicine somebody can have a big fat heart attack at 32 and just die dead as a hammer and it's like oh well there you go. Just luck of the draw. I don't know. I don't know that only only in medicine can you really get away with that kind of crap.
any other career choice, there's going to be hell to pay if something really, really bad. If a plane falls out of the sky, they're going to look at every single engineer that had anything to do with that plane, >> right?
>> Absolutely.
>> But seldom does that happen in medicine.
They're just like, "Ah, luck of the draw. We don't know." And I think increasingly people are not okay with that answer anymore. So doctors are just dudes and chicks. And so they are capable of believing propaganda.
They are capable and willing in many cases to repeat propaganda that they either know is or suspect is But it yet it's the party line that the American Diabetes Association or the American Heart Association, that's their official guidelines.
Therefore, even though the doctor themselves goes, I don't know about that, they still say it. They still repeat it. and and so you're the patient sitting there going, "Well, that's not my experience and I I'm the one living with me." So, but you're the doctor and so it's so confusing for patients that I I think more and more people are just turning turning away from the practice of modern medicine in disgust and they're just trying to figure out the answers for themselves. And I think in many cases, Dixie, that's less dangerous than just blindly believing the doctor that you've been seeing.
>> Yeah, I I agree. I mean, my dad almost died. Well, my stepdad that is my dad, you know, technically he he adopted me when I was seven. He's my dad, but I didn't want to be confusing when I'm like my biological father died of a heart attack, but my dad. But anyway, so my dad um has he's overweight. Um he's got, you know, I I I think genetics actually have worked in his favor so much that he just kind of takes advantage of that. But um he ended up in uh the hospital for a month with COVID because he was obese.
Uh I think he had a lot of the comorbidities. Um but while he was in there, I don't know if it was some of the medications. I don't know if it was what he was eating while he was at the hospital, etc., etc., but uh he they told him he was diabetic. And so since coming home, he's he checked his blood sugar a lot and that kind of seemed to fade out. I I don't really think that he's eating a whole lot better, but anyway, he came home with this pamphlet, you know, the the ADA and this is the guidelines for a meal and I mean, he's eating these veggie straw things and so many of them and and I just I remember looking at that and telling my mom, "Mom, this is garbage. Like, please don't feed him this and think you're doing better. Like I know you think you're doing better than McDonald's, but and maybe so a little bit, but and but it's very difficult to get somebody to believe you who I'm I'm an engineer through school. I'm a backpacker. Uh yes, I care about my health and and I'm relatively healthy, but why do they think I know more than the ADA? Why would I possibly be able to guide him better on this? And that's what's so frustrating is >> trying to get people to believe you that you just because you're not blessed by those gods or whatever that you still might be able to research and learn and and know what you're talking about to some extent. And >> and that's very very common in people over the age of 60. Really, it's much more common for them to just blindly believe their doctor. And also, Dixie, you suffer from powdered butt syndrome when it comes to your mom and your stepdad. They've they've seen you throw up. They've seen you pick your nose.
They've seen you poop your pants. That's powdered butt syndrome. And so, you literally could cure cancer and they'd be like, "Oh, Dixie, honey, that's so sweet. Run along.
>> That's so cute." Yeah, >> that's so cute. I just love you now.
Shut up. Trying to watch TV here. Yeah, that that's very very common. And that's why one of the many reasons I started the YouTube channel and tried to be just so plain spoken and common sense was for so that somebody like you could say, you know, dad, you this is a huge risk factor. You almost died of COVID because you're so overweight. You need to watch Dr. Barry.
And so that that's where I get a a ton of views is just people getting their mom, their dad, their grandparents, their aunts or uncles, that nextdoor neighbor that you really love, like a family member, to say, "Go watch this doctor. He's board certified. He's licensed.
Go listen to him. He's he's he's telling it like it is." And that helps a lot of older folks to go, "Okay, well, he seems like a rational, common sense guy. He doesn't seem crazy." And also, he's not trying to sell a bunch of crap, right?
which is super common right on on the social media. The doctor talks for 10 seconds and then it's five minutes of here buy my crap, buy my supplements, buy my program, whatever. And I try to just minimize that stuff. I I try not to sell anything so that people will go, well, he's not trying to sell me anything and maybe I should listen to him or at least try it. And then the final thing is what I'm recommending to people. It's not some new fad modern weird chemical factory diet. This is literally the oldest diet that human beings have eaten.
>> Right?
>> If you go back in time far enough, Dixie, >> like 12,000, 15,000, 20,000 years ago, human beings did four things reliably.
They breathed air, they drank water, they played in the sun, and they ate meat.
Those four things they did reliably. And so it's kind of like the cow eating grass. If you say, "Well, why is grass good for the cow?" It's because that's what cows have eaten forever. They've gotten used to it. They've adapted to it. Maybe 50 million years ago, grass wasn't that good for cows. I don't know.
But now they've eaten grass for so long, it it would be just stupid for some young vet to come along and say, "Well, actually, the research shows that grass is not good for cows." What farmer would listen to that crap? They'd be like, "Shut up. That's dumb." So, I'm applying that same way of thinking to humans. You can do this with wolves. You can do it with any wild animal. What have they eaten for a long damn time? Therefore, that's the diet that's probably going to give them the best health. And when it comes to human beings, if you go back in time more than 8,000 years, 9,000, 10,000 years, we ate as much meat as we could get our hands on.
>> If we lived near a river or an ocean, we ate as much fish and and sh mllisks and crustations as we could get our hands on. Sure, we ate berries. Sure, we ate vegetables. Sure, we ate honey if we could find it. Sure, we ate grass if we had to. We even ate each other if we were starving to death, right? I mean, Very true.
>> Anything not to starve. And so really what I'm trying to get people to understand is there's two different kinds of diets that we studied in the past.
>> One is an optimization diet. If there's not a famine, if we've got plenty of food options, what did humans eat? Meat and eggs and fish. That was always if and also if you were a wealthier person in the tribe or in the village or in the whatever, you ate all the meat and all the eggs and all the fish. The poor people got the grains.
Now now nowadays they try to uh they try to deify the the the slave diet, the prisoner diet. They're like, "Oh, beans and rice, rice and beans, eat the wheat, eat the, you know, the the grl."
If that was a healthier diet, you don't think that the wealthy people back then would have ate that? Of course they would. Healthy people have wealthy people have always wanted to have good health. And I mean, we see that today.
They're billionaires. They spend $10 million a year trying to optimize their health.
>> Oh yeah. You've watched that guy too then. That Brian Johnson. Is that Yeah.
Isn't that fascinating when he's But he's he's like plant-based, isn't he?
>> He is. And that's because of all the propaganda that's out there.
>> Literally, if you ask experts in in animal science, what should cows eat?
They're like, duh, grass. If you ask them, what should a wolf or a cow eat?
Duh, meat. It's like, duh. Why are you asking a dumb question? It's only when it comes to human beings that we're like, what should humans eat? We're like, ah, plant-based, >> I don't know.
>> Uh, Mediterranean, maybe? I don't know.
Uh, flexitarian, vegetarian, I don't know. Like, think about that for a second.
>> Yeah.
>> What the hell? Where's How's that even possible?
>> Yeah, that's it's a really good point.
Because we've bl we've blended religion, we've blended uh moral and ethical stuff in we blended the profit motive. Very very important because you can make anything out of vegetable seed oil, out of wheat, rice, oats, and corn, and out of some added sugar. You can make anything out of those three ingredients.
From a jelly donut to a pizza crust to a loaf of bread, they're all the same exact thing. And it's shelf stable. You can make it in China. You can ship it over on a cargo ship. It can sit in a warehouse for six months, then sit on the grocery store shelf for three months and still be fresh when you buy it.
>> That's not how real food works.
>> I don't think, you know, I I was born in the 80s, but most of my childhood that I remember was in the 90s, and I don't think I drank water until like the 2000s. I don't I don't think for all of the 90s I drank water. I don't think I remember going days as a teenager and being like did I I don't think I've had a like you know fruit or vegetable or you know there was never any whole foods regardless of what it was. Now of course we had some meat in our hamburger helper or whatever but like I just think back to because I mean the worst thing if somebody eats meats, vegetables and fruits that's still better than McDonald's, right? I mean but >> I just I don't Well, fair enough. But I >> didn't know what to get at McDonald's, right?
>> Well, fair. That's true, too. But, uh, so I just I don't I I don't recall.
>> I I just remember I I had to eat like food dyes and sugar for the most part.
And it's crazy to me what that might have done to me. And maybe that's Hey, that maybe that's why I have that ANA tied or what it is.
>> Um, >> 100%. I'm sure that there's a little bit of a genetic component >> to what you may or may not have because I don't think the jury's in yet. I think you might have an autoimmune condition or you might not >> because you have not really tried a good tight diet for 90 or 180 days and then recheck that tighter. I think you might be blown away if you did that. Uh, I think most of us during the 80s and 90s, we just ate pure junk because that's when television was at its kind of penultimate.
You didn't eat something if it weren't advertised on television. You just wouldn't touch that because that was either it was either gross or it was not cool, right? And so there were there were moms who still cooked liver and stuff like that. But none of the cool kids ever ate that or at least that they did. They didn't admit it at school.
You're like, "No, I I drink Capri Sun and I eat Oreos and I have Froot Loops for breakfast with with, you know, rainbow chocolate milk. I don't use regular milk." Of course not. That's boring.
>> They even colored popcorn, man. They even colored popcorn.
>> 100%. Yeah. And so I think that that's part of the reason that we're seeing this explosion in metabolic and autoimmune and inflammatory disease is because for the last 30 years we've been fed nothing but junk.
>> Yeah.
>> And you brought up Hamburger Helper. Let me let me help people understand. So you understand that there are now experts in nutrition who have PhDs in human nutrition who will try to tell you that it's the helper part of Hamburger Helper. That's the That's the healthy part. That the hamburger is actually the unhealthy part.
>> Wow.
>> Now, think about that for and tuna Helper, same way. It's like, well, tuna, I don't know, maybe full of mercury.
It's actually the the wheat noodles.
That's the healthy part of Hamburger Helper. The reason your mama made Hamburger Helper is because she couldn't afford to just feed the family 100% hamburger. If she could have, she would have. If she could afford to fed him 100% steak, she would have.
Hamburger Helper became popular and now they're literally nutritionists and dietitians who will say, "Oh, the the noodles are the healthiest healthiest part of that. The the hamburger will cause cancer and heart disease and colon cancer." Idiotic. It's crazy. The reason that that back in the the 60s and 70s that you would you would eat a meat a tiny bit of meat and then three vegetables or a bunch of bread is because you couldn't afford to just eat nothing but meat. It was too expensive.
That's why it's not that those other things were healthy, but now they've been healthwashed and greenwashed to the point where people truly believe that the the the thing that your grandmother and mother used to use to cut the cost of your meals is the healthy part of the meal. And it's like, no, that is just not true. Absolutely not true at all.
>> Yeah. So, why are carbs bad or why is less better?
>> So, too many carbs too often are going to cause blood sugar spikes >> regardless of the carb like >> That's right. Slow breaking down carb or what?
>> That's right. So, the more processed and the more simple the carb is, the worse it is, the more unhealthy it is. And so the carbs in broccoli are decidedly less bad than the carbs in a jelly donut.
That's absolutely true. They're released slower. They don't hit your system as fast. And broccoli's on average lower carb than bread or than a jelly donut, right? So yes, of course, the more processed the carbs, the more sugar added, that's terrible. That that's just literally dangerous junk food. But for many people, me being one of them, even if I even if every single carbohydrate I eat is berries and honey and fruit and vegetables, I would be 30 or 40 pounds heavier than I am right now because and I would also be pre-diabetic, even eating those healthy carbs. Okay?
Because I I have to be a carnivore. I've been a carnivore for nine years now. And >> wow, >> eating nothing but beef, butter, bacon, and eggs, plus or minus some fish. That keeps my A1C normal. That keeps my blood sugar normal. That keeps my inflammatory markers normal. And it keeps my waistline pretty close to where I want it to be. Now, there are some people that can live on Doritos and Pepsi Cola and Ding-Dongs and still look very fit and healthy. Well, you know those people. I know those people. I'd like to slap them. But they they they can do that up until a point. But the problem that many people miss that even doctors miss this Dixie is you can be very slender and be very very metabolically unhealthy or very unhealthy from a from an immune system and inflammatory standpoint even though you're quite slim. If you think back, most all of us can think of a smoker that we used to know that was skinny as a rail, right? I mean, they were skinny. They're dead now, but they look very slender and very healthy until they died of some cancer or they died of of weirdly type two diabetes. It's like they were so skinny.
How did they have type two diabetes?
That's weird. Yeah. All those things can happen to thin, apparently healthy looking people, too. It's not just the fat people who die prematurely. And so, yeah, the the quality of the carbohydrate does matter. your genetic your genetics matter a little bit. But for the anybody who fattens quite easily or has trouble losing weight, anybody whose blood sugar goes up very easily, they get pre-diabetes or they have type two diabetes or they have type 1 diabetes. Anybody who has high blood pressure or hypertension, anybody who has fatty liver or metabolic syndrome, those people by definition have chronic carbohydrate overdose. And the way that I can say that so confidently is I have seen thousands upon thousands of those people when you put them on a restricted carbohydrate diet, uh, still they can eat until they're full. They don't have to portion control. they just have to cut the carbs. Those conditions get much much better or go completely away.
Big deal, right? Big deal. So, if type two diabetes, if it'll go completely away, if you eat low carb enough, >> then you can literally say therefore >> type two diabetes is caused by eating too many carbohydrates too consistently for too long. Same for fatty liver, same for metabolic syndrome, same for hypertension, same for so many chronic medical diseases. If you cut the carbs and keep them cut for long enough, consistently enough, that condition either goes completely away, or improves by 90%.
>> Yeah. And I've seen that uh personally, not me, but my stepdaughter. She just turned 13 this year. Uh when I first met her, she was nine. And she when her parents got divorced, it things got really bad as far as her diet. I mean, they kind of always were, you know, if she got picky with foods, it was like, "Oh, let's pick her up some McDonald's on the way." And and you don't I I just remember a time in my life where I thought, "Well, surely if something was bad for you, it wouldn't be allowed to be in food." You know, I just I I really thought that. I was like, "So, I know that's a very common belief. very common like, oh, they wouldn't be allowed to sell it at the supermarket if it was unhealthy.
>> They sell cigarettes, they sell alcohol, there are a lot of things that are bad for you that are allowed to be sold, but you just don't think of it that way because it's like, well, the government protects us, right? And so, so I know that's a whole another thing. But so I I >> know that my husband and her mother didn't mean harm to her, but >> Exactly. when I came into her life, I mean, she she wouldn't really eat much other than chicken fingers and French fries. And so, it was it was a really Yes. And it was a really difficult thing to try to navigate, but um at some point I suggested like, hey, I think maybe we should get some blood work done uh just to check because >> beautiful, >> you know, even though she was eating a little bit a little bit better, it just there there weren't a lot of changes.
And so anyway, I but it's a very delicate thing to navigate and you're somebody new coming into this family unit and but I love her and I care about her. She's she's my child. You know, I didn't have her but she's mine.
>> And so the her pediatrician was even hesitant and a little bit um resistant, if you will, to to even do the blood work. Well, I just don't think it's necessary. She's just a kid. She's just got, you know, whatever. And kind of brushed it off. But my husband was like, "I think you're right." and he he pushed for it and we found out she was pre-diabetic, >> type two pre-diabetic. And so, >> um, we, you know, he said, "Well, we're making some changes and that's it." And so, now she gets out just like us and exercises four days a week in the morning before she goes to school, uh, whether that's lifting weights or doing cardio or whatever. And and we drastically restricted carbs. Now, we still have what we call junk food Friday, and she's allowed to mostly have what she wants on Fridays. uh still within reason, right? Like we're not having a Coke with every meal and this and that, but >> but the difference that it has made for her, I mean, she beat pre-diabetes. She is no longer considered pre-diabetic.
Now, >> could we tighten down more and improve things more? Yes. But, you know, I I we also worry about having her because she was so used to eating all these awful things like having a negative relationship with food. And so, it it's I don't know. kind of walking on eggshells with some of that I feel like but but we've led by example too so it's not like oh well only you can't have this you know we're we're we're all doing it together to be healthier and and you know she was really frustrated about like I feel like this wasn't my fault that I was in this situation and now here I have to deal with this but there are kids at my school who are who are little bitty and they're eating everything they want and it's not a problem. I said it's not a problem right now, but you have to understand that it will still affect them one day in one way or another and theirs may not come in the form of being overweight where you see something's wrong. I said it might be like me where I have some health issues going on that I you won't see from the outside. So just because you're not overweight doesn't mean that you're healthy. So >> absolutely and I've seen that in her.
>> You've done such a great thing for her.
uh when she gets older, I hope that she appreciates that as much as she should.
And for so many people, and I'm I'm sure the >> because trying to navigate that blended family dynamic is it's literally like walking a a tight rope that's on fire sometimes for some people. And so, but literally when when I was a first year medical student, Dixie, there was no such thing as pediatric type two diabetes. And there was no such thing as pediatric fatty liver. It just didn't exist. They didn't even teach us about those things.
>> Yeah.
>> But now in 2026 at the biggest children's hospital in Nashville, Tennessee, they have a clinic dedicated to children with type 2 diabetes.
Children and children with fatty liver.
This was not a thing back in 2000. And now it's so common they have to have a special clinic just for those kids. And obviously everybody knows they've got special clinics for kids with obesity and and are trying to get, you know, get Ozimpic FDA approved for children down to the age of eight.
>> Oh no, that's so sad.
>> Yeah. Yeah. This is something they're actively working on right now and it's so obvious that it's the food that's causing this. But here's why we know that's the problem. There are actually obesity experts out there that'll say, "Well, obesity is genetic, right?" And but that that absolutely cannot be true. I my undergraduate degree is in animal biology. I I took genetics courses. I understand genetics.
That is impossible. If if a doctor says your diabetes is genetic, your uh obesity is genetic. Your blood pressure is genetic. What they're implying is is that the biggest cause of your diabetes is genetic. That's what you hear, right?
Like I c I literally can't do anything about being obese. It's my genes. I can't do anything about being type two diabetic. It's my genetics. That's >> it takes the ownership out.
>> Exactly. Because first of all, that's that's factually incorrect.
Now, let me be be very clear. Yes, genetics probably does play some part, right? maybe one to 1% to 5% because we know that there are people who fatten easier than other people. We know there are people whose blood sugar goes up easier than other people. That's obviously true. But what the doctor's implying is that if the majority cause of your obesity is genetic and that's completely provably false, right? Same for all these other chronic metabolic conditions and the autoimmune condition.
And the next thing they'll be saying is well the reason you've got breast it's well they are saying it oh your breast cancer is genetic you got this special marker when the truth of the matter is is having that special genetic marker made you 1% more likely to develop cancer. It was not the predominant cause of you developing that cancer. But the way the doctors word it what the patient hears is oh this is this is genetic.
There's nothing I can do about this. So, they just keep eating the junk food. And I don't even think they're eating the junk food because they're glutton or sloths or stupid. I think they continue eating the junk food because if you ask them, they would literally say the Dr. Dixie literally said >> by my genetics. I didn't I'm not It's not my It's not my fault.
>> It's my genetics. So, why are you yelling at me for eating the jelly donuts? that's not what caused my diabetes. When the truth of the matter is, it absolutely is the jelly donuts and other things that was leading to your stepdaughter's pre-diabetes, which is basically early type 2 diabetes when she was an early teenager. It was absolutely the food. And do you see that you and your husband have proven that?
>> Yeah.
>> Because you cut the carbs. Now she no longer has pre-diabetes.
>> Yeah. So pre-diabetes and type two diabetes is chronic carbohydrate toxicity. That's what it is.
>> Yeah. And when when you see you have some of these genetic markers, I feel like that should >> fuel you to be more proactive if anything. I've got the colon cancer gene and and so but what the doctor explained to me at the time is yes it doubles your risk but that means you go from like a four or a 2% risk to a 4% risk you know where it's exactly >> but it sounds so scary you know but sure will living a healthier lifestyle help offset some of that increased risk yes of course absolutely so >> yeah so where do people start I mean I know anything can be made into like a a big science and you can go down the rabbit holes of of um the quality of the meats and things like that, but do you think it's more important to start off just >> maybe not focusing so much on that, but but just what you eat? I don't know if that makes sense.
>> Yeah, I know. I know exactly what you're getting at. So, I think it's for somebody who's listening to this who's overweight, obese, pre-diabetic, type two diabetic, fatty liver, hypertension, metabolic syndrome, uh, fat in the middle, just want to build, you know, fatigue, brain fog, any of that stuff, I think it's much easier and it makes much more sense to you to start subtracting things from your diet. And this is how I've been wording it since 2017. Step number one is to remove all added sugar from your diet. All of it. None of it's healthy. None of it's good for you. And most people intuitively understand if I switch from eating Lucky Charms to Special K. That may special K may not be a great choice, but it's less bad than the damn Lucky Charms. Most people get that just intuitively, right? So, cut all of the added sugar. That's number one. That's going to move you further down the road back to good health.
Number two is to get rid of all the grains. Wheat, rice, oats, corn, soybean, amaranth, millet, quinoa. These are not health foods. These are poverty foods. And this is something I learned very clearly that's going to be in the book I'm writing called In Search of a Proper Human Diet. The grains are foods that that we ate to keep from starving.
They are poverty foods. Fallback foods is what the archaeologists and the anthropologists call it. When you can't get the good healthy food, this is what you fall back on, okay? Is wheat, rice, oats, corn, soybean, beans, and rice.
Rice and beans. That's poverty food.
That's not health optimization food.
Even though it's very often painted as a as a health food. Oh, rice and beans, super healthy. No, that's poverty food.
Okay, so cut out the grains. Cut out all the added sugar and cut out all of the vegetable seed oils. Now, the research behind cutting out the seed oils is not as clear as the evidence cutting out the sugar and the starches, but remember the cow analogy. What should cows eat? Grass. What should wolves eat? Meat, right? How? So the reason that those things are healthy foods for them is because they've been eating that for thousands or millions of years. How long have we been eating vegetable seed oils a hundred years or less? Okay, we have not had time to adapt to them. We have our our genetics have not changed between 1850 and 2026. Our we are exactly the same genetically. We were never exposed to the amount of vegetable seed oils that are made in a chemical factory and put in a plastic bottle.
That's not something humans are used to eating. And so those are my three things. Start first by removing stuff.
Stop worrying about how much food you're eating. That is irrelevant. And you if you if you're like, "Wait, he just said I can eat as much food as I want." Yes, that you start just go to my YouTube channel and subscribe and start watching free videos and eventually a week or two from now you'll go, "Oh, I see why now I can eat until I'm full if I'm eating the right foods." Exactly right. Added sugar is never the right food. Grains and beans are never a healthy choice.
They're they just they they make your grocery bill cheaper. Vegetable seed oils are never a healthy choice. Okay.
Then step number four is fill up at least half of your plate with fatty meat or fatty fish or eggs with the yolk. At least half. And then fill the rest of your plate with low carb vegetables, low carb nuts, low carb berries or fruits.
Okay? If you want to fill up the entire plate with fatty red meat and eggs with the yolk and fatty fish, that's okay, too. That's carnivore. That's what that is. But if you fill up half your plate with fatty meat, eggs with the yolk, fish, that's that's fatty. And the rest with vegetables and nuts and seeds and plants, that's low carb. That's what low carb is. Keto is when twothirds of your plate is covered with fatty meat, and then a little bit of low carb vegetables, a few low carb nuts, a few low carb berries. That's keto. Keto is not some weird fat diet. It's literally the diet your great great great great grandmother if you put a plate before her 350 years ago, she'd go, "Yeah, that looks good. I'm going to eat that." She would recognize everything on the plate on a keto plate. Now, keto's become very popular. So, now there's keto bread and keto pancakes and keto syrup and keto cookies. And even Duncan Hines has got keto cake mix. That that stuff is marketing That's not real keto. Real keto is meat and veg.
>> That's it. Okay. Real carnivore is meat and meat. Meat and eggs, meat and fish.
That's real carnivore. These are ancient diets. These are not new diets. And so, if anybody's wanting to start right now, if you're type two diabetic, pre-diabetic, you're like, "Yeah, I've got to fix this." And now I I kind of believe this country boy, I think I think this may be at least in part due to my diet. Cut the all the added sugar.
Cut the grains. Cut the vegetable seed oils and start filling at least half your plate with fatty red meat, eggs with the yolk and fish, and then recheck your A1C in three months. And you're going to go, "Oh, okay. So, pre-diabetes and type two diabetes, they are chronic carbohydrate overdose. That's what they are." Huh. And then you can start watching, you can be watching all my YouTube videos between now and then. And by the time you get that A1C, you will be educated enough on how to feed a human being that you can start to teach your doctor about this and also teach your doctor about which labs actually matter because I wrote this book called Common Sense Labs that you can get on Amazon or any bookstore.
And once you it's very easy to read.
It's written for regular folks. It's not written at a at a MD PhD level.
Once you get the basic concepts in that book, you understand why you need an A1C every three months. You understand I need a fasting insulin. I need these inflammatory markers. These are super important. And also, you'll learn that, oh, if my LDL is high, that's probably not a big deal at all. My total cholesterol is high, that probably is meaningless. Yeah, it's meaningless. But you'll start to understand why those things are important. And I think like we started talking about at the very beginning of this conversation, people are they're they're quickly becoming aware, my doctor is just repeating what they've heard. They haven't thought about this. They haven't studied this.
They're just repeating the mantra that they were instructed to repeat. And if they don't repeat it loud enough and often enough, they'll get kicked out of their little doctor club.
>> Yep.
>> That's what's going on in modern medicine. And it's it's a scandal. It's it's embarrassing as a doctor, but all the patients, all of your viewers, you guys are stuck having to cope with it and having to deal with it and having to figure out a way through this quagmire >> that is modern medicine. And I think that me and others in this low carb, keto, carnivore space, I think we figured out how to do it with food in a way that makes you healthier, that makes you feel better, and makes you look better while still getting to eat until you're comfortably full, not chronically starving yourself to death.
>> Yeah. And I'm, you know, even for myself, I'm not overweight. I'm I'm one of those people up to a certain point. I don't know now if I could just eat whatever I wanted and not have the problem. But for most of my life it was that way. Yep.
>> And I wonder though cuz I don't know that anyone's ever in blood work, standard blood work that I've ever had any of this stuff tested. So, I was going to ask you like what are what are the some of the things that even I should check because just because it's not presenting on the outside doesn't mean that I'm not having some issues with insulin, you know, resistance or or whatever. So, I I'm like I said, I'm about to change primary care physicians.
I've got an appointment in actually I think >> six days from now. Um, so I want to request some of this blood work because I think this doctor will actually be open to me saying, "Hey, I want to check these things >> hopefully. If not, doctor says or whatever other website." But so um, especially markers for inflammation because I think what I'm going to do >> is get this blood work, check it, and then maybe I go to the the most extreme carnivore or even if I can do keto and then check it again. Um because I know I know you've mentioned before that some people can handle low carb. Some people are, you know, really need to push it tighter to keto and some people like yourself really do best with carnivore.
>> So I don't know where I fall in that. I don't I I'm I'm not sure. So I guess the best way to find out is is elimination and then bring things back and continue to get the blood work done. Um, so >> I realiz >> I'll just tell you, uh, Dixie, the the the most important test that the average doctor never checks is a fasting insulin or a serum insulin test. Now, most doctors check your blood sugar, >> but many doctors, if your blood sugar is just a smidge high, they're like, "It's probably fine." Some doctors who are a little bit smarter will check your A1C, which is a three-month average of your blood sugar. And I and indeed I bet in your stepdaughter's case, that's what they used to diagnose her.
>> Yes.
>> As pre-diabetic, her A1C was elevated.
And so now you've got that back down to normal by cutting the carbs. But mo many doctors will check an A1C. And even if it's onetenth of a point high or two10 of a point high, they'll say, "It's a little high. Not that big a deal.
Probably we'll recheck it again in a year."
>> So now you get to keep doing damage to your body for another 12 months. But if you check the fasting insulin and you need to fast for 12 to 14 hours before you get it checked because if it's above 10 even before your blood sugar elevates even before your A1C elevates if your fasting insulin is above 10 you're hyperinsulinemic that means that within the next 10 to 15 years you will develop pre-diabetes and type two diabetes. I think it's the earliest test for type 2 diabetes out there that that you can ask for. But be prepared when you go to your doctor and say, "Will you check my insulin level?"
It's either called a fasting insulin or a serum insulin.
>> Okay?
>> Be prepared for push back. They'll be like, "I never check that. I don't that's not important. You don't need that. Why do you want that?"
>> That's so frustrating. I had to fight tooth and nail to get my I believe it's is LP little a uh is something I wanted checked for myself just because of the heart disease in my family and and that's a marker that I guess is is pretty telling that you may have issues later in life. I I don't know your thoughts on that but anyway just the fact that I asked for that and they acted like they had kind of no idea.
Well, they knew what I was talking about, but it they even ordered the wrong test and I had to go back and fight them to order the right thing. It was so frustrating.
>> It's very common. And >> we need a Kenberry everywhere. We need one in this town.
>> What I call that because everybody knows that their doctor's arrogant. But what you bumped up against was arrogant ignorance.
>> Yes.
>> And that's the most dangerous kind of ignorance is you're arrogantly ignorant.
Like what?
No. You don't even know what you're talking about, doctor. And one of the most powerful things we put in this book, Common Sense Labs, >> is to an explanation paragraph so you can actually explain to your doctor, this is why >> I love the fasting insulin, and it's why you should be checking this lab on all of your patients, doctor. And so, it kind of puts the ball back. And when there's like, I wouldn't even know why that's important. Well, here's why. I'll I'll read it to you. Hold on. I brought my book with me. And then uh we we talked about earlier how so many people are kind of doing it theirel and how do I find a keto doctor? How do I find a carnivore doctor? Let me tell you that the model that Nisha and I, my wife, who's a registered nurse, this is the model we're kind of going to, we've got a a PhD community, which is a subscription model. You can pay by the month or you can pay annually. It's it's less than a c-ay at your doctor's office. and you get to ask me all of your keto questions and all of your carnivore questions and all of your lab questions. Now, I'm not your doctor inside of the PhD community, but you you've probably heard people be like, "I wish I could find a doctor who understands low carb or keto or carnivore, >> right?" Well, now you got one if you're in the PhD community. I'm going to tell you everything you need to know about the diet, about the proper human lifestyle, about what labs to ask your doctor for, so that when you go to see your doctor or just a random doctor if you don't have one, you can say, "Here's the labs I want checked, and here's why I want them."
>> That's so helpful.
>> Uh when they ask you about diet, you can say, "I'm, you know, you don't you can either not say the the K word and the C word, keto and carnivore, because sometimes doctors lose their mind." You can say, "Look, I'm eating a whole food diet that has no added sugar." That's very ancestrally appropriate.
>> That that describes keto and carnivore, right?
>> It does. Yeah.
>> Yeah. And so what doctor if and you can even say if you put a little olive oil on your meat, you can say, "I'm eating a Mediterranean diet that has no added sugar in it." That's keto and carnivore.
>> Well, I wanted to ask you your thoughts on olive oil. I have like fit 11 questions I want to ask you. I know we won't have time for all of them today, but like I've just been >> I've just been so excited to talk to you. But uh yes, olive oil and avocado oil magical there's no magical health benefits whatsoever >> from olive oil or avocado oil or coconut oil. Now, they are much less bad than the vegetable seed oils.
>> Okay.
>> Uh and and I think they're they're probably fine. And if anybody actually likes the taste of olive oil or avocado, they're fine. Coconut oil has lots of healthy saturated fat. They are probably the least bad vegetable oils that you can eat.
>> Okay?
>> But the the fats that you need to be cooking with daily and eating daily are the animal fats. Because for the same reason that cows eat grass and wolves eat meat, human beings, what fats have we been cooking with the longest? What fats have we been eating for the longest period of time? It's beef tallow. It's butter. It's It's egg yolk fat. It's beef tallow. It's bacon grease. These are the things that we've been eating and cooking with >> for the longest period of time.
>> I know that there is a small amount of people who for whatever issue for whatever reason have issues with red meat. Well, for example, the alpha gal folks. Yep.
>> You know that is terrible. So, I I saw a video of yours the other day that was talking about, well, if you're eating chicken, make sure you have the skin on because then you're getting added fat.
Um, for myself, my son had cow's milk protein allergy and so he was affected by dairy through my breast milk. And so, the the gastroenterenterologist told me sometimes because of the proteins, it's it he will heal faster if you also cut red meat and pork from your diet. So I was like on chicken and fish and so I didn't know about that make sure the skin is on at the time but you know I did cook with duck fat and things like that. So so there still are >> some options out there even for those people to to maintain more of a >> absolutely you can do a carnivore diet without ever eating pork or beef. Okay.
You can do a keto diet without ever eating pork or beef. You can actually do a low carb diet that's oo lacto pescatarian where you include some eggs, some cheese, and some uh fish. That's that that can be a proper human diet for many many many people. Some people have to cut the carbs more. Some people don't. But anybody who tells you that, oh, red meat's bad for you, it'll cause cancer or it'll cause heart disease.
They're completely ignorant when it comes to human nutrition, they're they they mean well. They're they think they're helping you, but they're just literally ignorant when it comes to reduh human nutrition. And if anybody tells you that that the yolks of eggs are as bad as smoking a cigarette or any of that kind of foolishness, they Yeah.
There there are studies there there was a Time magazine article that for every egg yolk you eat, that's like smoking two cigarettes.
>> It's like that is ignorant. It is time to get back to the old ways. It's time to get back to the the ancestral diets because back then there was no type 2 diabetes clinic for kids. There was no fatty liver clinic for children back when we were eating lots of meat and some low carb veg. That just it didn't happen. That's the diet that makes us the healthiest. You don't have to be carnivore. Uh but you might need to be carnivore for 90 days. And I talk about that in a lot of my YouTube videos.
>> Yeah. Yeah, I'm excited for this new book you're writing because I know you said the lies my doctor told me at that time you weren't you were just figuring out keto or you were you were just starting it so you weren't y >> quite shouting it from the rooftops yet at that time. So I'm excited for this >> new book. But so in the taking this to traveling like you mentioned um fast food restaurants what you get from McDonald's it's it's better to eat a few hamburger patties than to be like oh well I'm traveling so I guess I just have to get the the whole combo and a Coke too.
>> Correct.
>> Correct.
>> The thing with backpacking though uh y >> that is that is tough.
>> Um I'm not saying it's impossible. I think there have been some people who have at least for backpacking trips. I don't know about these longer through hikes if people >> and I've got some I've got some tips and tricks for your backpackers.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. I'm prepared. I'm prepared. D >> I'm excited. I'm excited. Okay.
>> Okay. All the beef jerky.
>> Okay.
>> All the even marinades and all that.
>> It it Listen, if that's the worst thing, if that's the worst thing you're eating, you're winning. Okay. And so, yeah, preferably get the one that doesn't have any added sugar, but you you know yourself, it's hard to put a lot of sugar on beef jerky.
>> Literally, Slim Gyms at the convenience store is a health food compared to what most people eat. Okay, so any jerky, preferably homemade, any billong, preferably homemade, learn to make pimickin. There's there was there was these very successful people before the Europeans got to America that literally lived on pimin which is animal fat and animal protein and and a few little naturally occurring carbohydrates. They would travel for weeks and eat nothing but pimickin and what they could kill.
Okay? And then I'll give you one keto example that is a product, but I know the guy that makes it and I actually told you about it at TSP six years ago and that's keto bricks. You can each keto brick which is is made by my friend Robert Sykes. He lives in Arkansas.
He makes them himself and each one has a thousand calories that is is almost all protein and fat. And so once you get fat adapted, you do not need the sugar gels.
You don't need the sugar rush, the sugar hit to keep hiking. Once you're keto adapted, you can live on fatty cuts of meat that have been dried.
People have done it for thousands of years. This is not some new thing I'm promoting here. This is literally what people used to when they didn't call it backpacking back then. They called it, "We've got to get the hell out of here and walk a thousand miles to somewhere new. What are we going to take with us?"
They weren't taking big bushels of wheat.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. They were taking meat.
>> Dried meat. Dried me.
>> Okay. So, all that. How do you feel about protein powder?
>> Protein powder. If that's the worst you're doing, you're probably winning.
Uh, but once you once you discover how easy it is to make your own jerky and bill tong and pimickin, you're going to be like, I'm not wasting money on protein powder. There's no point because the protein that your body absorbs and uses the best comes from meat and eggs and fish. There is no protein powder in the world that beats meat, eggs, and fish for being bioavailable and bioabsorbable and bioable.
And that's the there there's a big fat period at the end of that sentence because there's no exception. There is no protein powder that I'm gonna say, "Well, God, in that case, that's that's just as good as meat." That doesn't exist.
>> Makes sense.
>> Okay. Yeah. Good. Good to know. Yeah. I I just there are some days out of convenience that I'm like, "Oh man, I guess I just have I haven't had enough protein today. I haven't eaten enough today or whatever." And so, >> and so on those occasions when you're like out of convenience or I'm stuck in a bind, get the lowest carb option that you can get in that situation. And so, very often when I'm traveling over the road or in an airport, I will go to McDonald's and I will say, I need four quarter pound patties. Sometimes I get the cheese, sometimes I don't. Put some mustard on them, put some pepper on them, some salt on them. Boom. That's it. That that is a perfect human meal.
>> And mustard over ketchup because of the sugar.
>> 100% mustard has no sugar added. Even the the the name brand mustard has no added sugar at all. It's super super low carbohydrate. Whereas the ketchup, especially in fast food restaurants, is just red candy sauce basically.
>> I love that. Um, so there's I don't know if you were the one that I heard about this study from, but I guess it was just on one person, one hiker. Um, but I'm just going to read it. I've got my phone here. But, um, the conclusion basically, but they just looked at somebody who threwhiked the PCT because a lot of people will think, "Oh, well, I'm exercising that much, so it's offsetting my bad diet." I mean, I'm certain I said that in videos while I was through hiking. Yeah. So this says during a 112 day hike along the PCT, extreme daily volumes of physical activity coupled with a poor diet resulted in a reduction in FMD little BA. I have no idea what that is. May maybe you do. An increase in CFPWV and minor unfavorable changes to body composition. Our findings suggest that large volumes of exercise do not compensate for a poor diet and correct or may provide diminishing returns and prove detrimental to physiological function. These findings have implications for others attempting long distance through hikes or similar tests of endurance. Importantly, individuals with poor arterial function or low bone mineral density should take extra precautions when engaging in long-distance hiking in order to maintain proper physiological function.
And so that exactly right that is exactly why our ancestors took jerky and bilong and pimkin with them because that feeds your bones that feeds your muscle so you don't lose muscle. Uh there are so many people who really believe in their heart of hearts including many doctors that you can outrun a bad diet and it is this this is one of many studies that shows very clearly I don't care how much you exercise if you're if you're living on a junk diet your health will suffer. It might be a visible suffering, right, like obesity or your A1C going up. Or it could be an invisible suffering like an autoimmune condition or chronic inflammation in a joint or in your skin or in your gut. Or even your mental health might suffer.
But you cannot outrun a a diet that's too high in carbohydrates, too high in ultrarocessed sugar added carbohydrates.
It is impossible to do.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Well, and I mean there's a reason I think when we get to the end of these long through hikes that we feel like crap.
>> Exactly. Yeah. And I think our ancestors, if you look, they didn't just do these long through hikes for fun and giggles.
>> No.
>> They only did it if it was life or death. And so I I don't I don't think that you're harming yourself by doing an occasional long, you know, 200, 300, 500 mile hike.
But to do that routinely, yeah, that's probably not good for you.
>> Yeah. Yeah. I probably I know like my posture has suffered. A lot of things have suffered from these long-distance hikes. I don't I don't regret doing them, but I wish I had done them >> with longevity in mind. I wish I had thought about those things to kind of offset >> um >> some of the negative sides.
>> And I don't want to I don't want the backpacking community to come for me.
I'm not saying never do a long throughhike. Oh, >> I'm saying I'm saying train for that. Be ready for that. Do it once or twice a year.
>> Yeah, >> but that doesn't need to be a monthly thing. That that's going to cause too much stress on your body.
>> And if you are doing the keto, carnivore, even low carb, adjust to it before you get out there. I've I've seen somebody try to >> get into keto while on the trail, and that was an absolute disaster. So, >> that's not going to work. Yeah. And not just with the backpacking side of things, but so my husband tried keto for about a month and he got so frustrated because he was tracking with one of the little breath breathalyzer doohickeys >> and he was consistently not in ketosis and he would get frustrated. Is that like starting out? Is that something to really track? Is it is it really that important or I mean >> No. No, it's not. If you'd asked me this back in 2018, I'd have been like, "Oh yeah, you've got a blah blah." No, in 2026, tracking your ketones is a waste of time and money. It is irrelevant.
Okay? You're getting all of the health benefits by cutting the carbs. Whether your blood ketones or your breath ketones are are high or medium or low, it's irrelevant. The you're going to get the benefits regardless of that. And so, if you got money to blow, money to burn, sure, track your ketones. But if you're like, "No, money's kind of tied around here." Do not waste money on that. you don't need it.
>> Okay. Okay. That's good to know because he ended up he was like it's just not worth it. I'm, you know, putting all this effort into it, not having things I want to have and then I'm not even in ketosis and I, you know, but >> and he was in ketosis. Uh it's much more complicated than what the number says on the the breathalyzer or the the ketone meter, >> uh once you're also once you're keto adapted, you never have really high ketone numbers again because you're burning them as quickly as you're making them. So really his lack of having high ketones on his breathalyzer was actually a sign that he was getting healthier.
>> Oh man. Yeah. He took about about 30 days and was just like never mind, you know. So okay.
>> So yeah, it's time for you and him to get together and either do 90 days of a meat heavy keto or if you really want to affect that that autoimmune marker, 90 days of beef, butter, bacon, and eggs.
And uh then recheck those markers. Any closing questions, Dixie? That one real good question that I can answer for everybody.
>> Um, actually, I just What do you have coming up that you're looking forward to that you're working on? I know I saw that you have the the ads um that y'all started, which is amazing. So, maybe that would be a really good resource for >> for people because I saw you have like meal plans on there.
>> Yes. And so the American Diabetes Association, the ADA, has given such terrible dietary advice to people with diabetes for so many years. U and then me and other doctors yelling at them on Twitter now ex saying, "What the heck's wrong with you? Why are you recommending added sugar recipes on your website for people with diabetes? That makes their diabetes worse, not better. You're not supposed to be making diabetes worse."
And so they would not answer us. They would not debate. They would not discuss with us. And so we just said,"You know what? They're I don't I think they're so I think they're bought off. I think they're paid for." So we just started the American Diabetes Society. And if you go you just type in American Diabetes Society.org.org.
You can find recipes that if you make them and eat them, it will actually lower your blood sugar. It will lower your A1C. If you have type two diabetes, you can follow the ADS recipes to reverse your type two diabetes because at the ADS, we don't want to be your partner for life. We just want to reverse your type 2 diabetes so you can get on with your life.
>> That's perfect. Well, thank you so much.
I know you're a busy fellow. I really appreciate you coming on and talking to me and uh yeah, this has been really fun and I'm going to do it. I knew when I tal I sat down and talked to you, I was like, "Okay, I'm going to do this thing." So, so >> let's do it.
>> Let's do it.
>> And I want you to I want you to document it because there are a lot of people who follow you who trust you because you don't lie to your followers.
>> And so, I want you to do this and then report the truth. Whether it helped or didn't help, felt better, didn't feel better, be honest about the results.
That's how we all learn together. I'm going to get that blood work ordered hopefully through the doctor in six days and then Yeah. So, you said how many days? 90 days.
>> 90 days. You can do it.
>> I can do it. I'll do it.
>> You can do it.
>> All right. Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. And where can people find most of the most of your content? YouTube.
>> Yep. So, if you have a medical condition that you'd like to hear maybe the common sense truth instead of the mainstream media's slant, just go to YouTube and type in Dr. Barry and then whatever your medical condition is, Dr. Barry diabetes, Dr. Barry eczema, Dr. Barry acne, Dr. Barry depression, and I probably have a video on it. If you need some support, if none of your family members are on board, uh Dixie, please include a link to our our PhD community.
If people need if they want to pay for that extra support, they can. A lot of people don't need that. If you are a pre-diabetic or diabetic right now, go to the American Diabetes Society.org and follow those recipes and those guidelines and it will actually lower your A1C. If you want snarky Dr. Barry, you'll find me on Twitter. If you want loving and helpful Dr. Barry, you'll find me on Facebook or Instagram.
>> Oh, that's wonderful. Thank you so much again.
>> Thank you, Dixie. See you next time.
>> Byebye.
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