Uncapping the Momentum - Jeff Mayhugh

Ajouté : 2026-05-24

[00:00:00][music] Hi everyone, this is John Dailyaly here with another episode of the Reagan Caucus podcast. My regular co-host Thomas D. How is not here today, but don't worry, he will be back next week.

[00:00:19]My guest today is a civic educator and political reform advocate who is trying to strengthen American democracy through better representation. He is the vice president of the No Cap Fund, an organization dedicated to uncapping the House of Representatives. I'm talking about Jeff Mayhew. Jeff, thanks for joining me today on the Reagan Caucus podcast.

[00:00:39]>> Thanks, John. I really appreciate you having me. And and a little bit of news.

[00:00:42]I'm actually now the president. So >> Oh, that's great. Congratulations.

[00:00:46]Congratulations.

[00:00:47]>> Last time I was here, I was vice president. Now I'm president. I'm not sure what the difference is yet, but you know, we'll figure it out.

[00:00:52]>> That's right. Is there is there more of like a hail to the chief sort of vibe now that you're president?

[00:00:57]>> Uh I don't know. I guess you know I more questions directed at me. [laughter] >> Well, I appreciate you correcting me on that. Thank you very much. I was a little out of date. Well, yeah, thanks for coming back on the show. We actually had you on the podcast um last November and you told us about the work of the Noap Fund and uh the group's mission of increasing the number of seats in the House of Representative. Uh since then it it seems that there's been some real momentum both behind the organization and the cause itself. And uh so I should back up a little bit. You and I um we met in person last February at the uh the principles first summit in DC.

[00:01:35]Thomas was there as well. Um and you and the rest of the the No Cap Fund crew were were getting a lot of attention at your table. You guys were next to us and I saw that uh you were bringing people in um including some notable people were pretty notable people were stopping by.

[00:01:48]One of those individuals was uh Chuck Todd, formerly of NBC News. Um he has since been out there on social media advocating uh for uncapping the House. I saw um Eric Ericson, he's a uh a lot of people know him, conservative commentator. He's on board as well. Uh Yaval Levin, um he's out there talking about it. I know he's been on your podcast before. Uh Chris Dyerwalt from NewsNation and the Hill. I saw him advocating for it. And there's also this guy, and you might be able to explain him a little bit better to me, but named Mr. Beat. He's on YouTube. Uh, he's apparently very popular online, probably with people a little bit younger than I am, cuz I I wasn't sure who he was. But, um, Jeff, all this momentum, um, I'm curious, where do you think it has come from? I know I know part of it is clearly from your guys' work at the No Cap Fund. Uh, and, uh, you also think that a lot of people are just kind of looking at all this dysfunction in Congress and they're saying, you know, hey, something's got to change, man. And this actually seems to make sense.

[00:02:47]>> Yeah, I think I mean that's that's probably like the foundation of it is like PE things are broken and people are looking for answers and these are the answers. I mean some some of those people that you mentioned I mean they've been talking about this longer than I've been talking about it. You know Chuck Todd he's done a TED talk on this before. He's talked about it on MSNBC.

[00:03:07]Yvallin has written about it in his books. he's, you know, part of the Academy and Arts and Science, um, you know, group that put together a, you know, a whole academic study about expanding the house. So, you know, the this the idea isn't new, right?

[00:03:22]Obviously, as the fact that it's kind of baked into the constitution with the census and everything like the idea isn't new about representation, about the importance of it. I think what's what's going on right now, I think everything in life is timing, right?

[00:03:35]We've got the 2030 census coming up.

[00:03:37]That's the next opportunity we really have to write a new aortionment act and expand it. What we need to do is we need to repeal the permanent aortionment act of 1929 prior to that. That's what our organization's goal is. That's what we're trying to get out there. We're trying to create electoral success for people who want to do this for legislators. Right. And you mentioned Mr. Beat. Mr. Beat you. Where does this momentum coming from? The momentum is coming from Mr. Beat. Um so he is a former educator now a YouTuber and he joined our board at the beginning of the year. Uh we've collaborated on one video and in that that one video that we collaborated on the No Cap Fund has gained 20 volunteers across 10 states, right? We've been able to just in that one video we've been able to to generate that much momentum. Um and those volunteers and and myself have been working probably for the last three months now and creating an administrative uh structure to help scale the organization. Um the next phase would be more content creation and fundraising cuz you know as one of my favorite people in politics is Mark Hannah and uh not necessarily because of good reasons but favorite people to read about is Mark Hannah and he famously said the most the two most important things in politics are money and I can't remember the second um but the second is people and I that's what that's what my focus has been is is is recruiting people to build this event out. That's what the volunteers are. Once we get the money, the everything else will kind of start to snowball and take take effect.

[00:05:20]Um, you know, people when they first hear it, they're like, "You want more government? I don't quite understand."

[00:05:29]>> Uh, when you explain it to them in, you know, regular terms and you kind of give them the history, they go, "Oh, that kind of makes sense. Yeah, let's do And once you see it, you can't unsee it. And it is that's the it's the most reasonable, rational, structural change that we can make to our government.

[00:05:46]That's the number one thing the volunteers when I interview them, that's what they tell me. The reason that they're willing to dedicate their time is because they believe that this can happen and that will have a positive impact on their lives. And when you get everyday average citizens willing to donate their time to something like that, you know, it's going to be successful.

[00:06:04]>> Let's Yeah, I was actually going to ask you more about this. I'll skip to this part because I do think it's interesting the organizing that's going on, the volunteers. So So the No Cap Fund recently opened a state chapter in Colorado where I live. Um it's it's being led by someone named Brian Freestad. I hope I'm pronouncing his name right, but he's a good guy. I attended the first meeting. Um I unfortunately couldn't attend the second one, which I I do feel bad about.

[00:06:26][laughter] I hope I hope Brian's not mad at me. I don't think he is. But he's a very he's very motivated. He's out there organizing. He's talking to congressional candidates about this issue, which I think is important. I'm curious, Jeff. So, how many chapters are there now that are part of the no cap fund and you know, you you brought up part of the strategy about the repeal efforts, but I mean, part of it also has to be you're you guys are just looking to get a lot of publicity too and get people talking about this perhaps uh get it asked in some some congressional debates, that type of thing. So, yeah, I'm just kind of curious what all is happening right now.

[00:06:58]>> Yeah. First, Brian is just a fantastic volunteer. He's been a tremendous help.

[00:07:01]I really appreciate him coming on board.

[00:07:03]Uh the energy is important, right, to to to get something like this talked about.

[00:07:08]The chapters, I think we have about six of them right now that are kind of like in flux. I mean, we're just getting going. These things are hard to get off the ground. Brian's probably been the most successful out of all of us in getting these uh chapters up and running. And um you know they're designed to engage average people on this topic, the topic of representation, to teach us why it's important or teach people why it's important, but then to also teach them the skills to go talk to their friends and family about it, >> right? Cuz you that's how you really get it spread. Um you know, money can amplify a message, but a message can travel through people as well. And so, you know, if you if you build that foundation from the ground level, whenever you get the funding, then, you know, it's really just gonna spark up top. And look, people at the top are talking too, right? Like you mentioned, Vince S mentioned it on 60s Minutes, Chuck Todd's mentioned it a bunch. You know, people in the media are talking about it, especially with this whole gerrymandering situation going on. And um, you know, I like its timing, it's effort, it it'll come to be at some point. Our goal this year is to get this talked about in the 2026 midterm elections because let's face it, the people running for office right now are going to need to be the people that repeal the Permanent Aortionment Act.

[00:08:24]>> Right. Right. And and one thing I think I I I think is is been very helpful to your cause is and it's it sounds like it's it's it's you know just a nice little add-on, but I think it actually is helpful. You have this the Y435, you have the merchandise. You guys when we met in principles first, you were nice and nice. You guys gave me a t-shirt.

[00:08:43]I've been wearing it around. People have been asking me what does that mean? You know, why 435? We were out my wife and I were out hiking in the uh the desert a [laughter] few weeks ago. Came upon some people who were interested in what that was. Gave us an opportunity to quickly kind of talk about that. So, I think it's pretty I think it's a pretty smart uh uh mechanism.

[00:09:02]>> Yes. And you can go to our website www.nocapfund.org and you can order a Y435 t-shirt. Uh, in fact, if you you know what I'll do right now for your listeners only, for the the first 50 people that go to our website and sign our declaration for representation between now and Monday.

[00:09:21]Okay, that's gives you the whole weekend to get it done. Oh, >> well, I will say [laughter] >> this isn't live. I forgot we're not doing it live.

[00:09:31]>> All right, this will this will go out Monday, I believe. Is it five? May 18th.

[00:09:35]We'll go out. So, uh, maybe a few days past that. I will give your listeners from the day that it airs 24 hours to sign our declaration. The first 50 people that sign our declaration, I'll send you a free t-shirt. How about that?

[00:09:49]And then you can talk about it with your friends and family. So, it's something that you're passionate about. You don't even have to put skin in the game. I just want you talking about it with your friends and family. That is the most important thing because let's face it, my favorite story about this is George Washington. Everybody knows George Washington as the commander of our army.

[00:10:06]The guy that that you know led us to victory and then became president of the first president. He could have been a king but he isn't. He's a president. He walked away from the job. And during the constitutional convention when all the states were debating all these very complex issues, the issue of representation came up and there was a discussion about should we have a one representative for 50,000, one representative for 40,000, one representative for 30,000 and Washington being the statesman that he was as the overseer didn't feel that it was his job to put his finger on the scale during these proceedings except this one very important issue. he decided to stand up and speak in favor of a lower representation ratio, meaning one for 30,000, putting the people and their representatives closer together. He felt that that was the foundation of of self-government. And let's face it, that's what makes America great is self-government is your ability to be part of the process and speak with somebody in the government. And right now, it's just not working.

[00:11:13]>> Yeah. Yeah. So, I was I was surprised.

[00:11:15]Um, there was one and this was just on Twitter, so I I don't know if he's he's talked about this out loud, but u one notable person who surprised me with their criticism of the idea of uncapping the House was uh former Congressman Justin Amash. Uh he tweeted this uh this he said that it would make the House more not less partisan. And then he said individual senators aren't as captured by party leaders precisely because the body is much smaller. the bigger the chamber, the greater the pressure to streamline process, block amendments, and centralize decision-making. Uh, do you think there's anything to that argument, Jeff, or do you think he's off base on this?

[00:11:54]>> I'm I'm a little surprised because Justin seems like a very intelligent person. Um, >> kind of a libertarian as well. Yeah.

[00:12:01]>> And so I think that this is he's he's reacting emotionally from the experience that he's lived in and he's not thinking about this rationally. And I know that that might be a surprise because he is a very rational individual from, you know, I mean, I don't know him, but from looking from the outside in, >> what I would say is is he's got it completely backwards. Actually, Madison wrote in the Federalist Papers that the number must be raised to avoid against the cabal of a few and and as to I can't remember the exact words, as to not divulge into the confusion of the multitude, right? Well, we're way under where we should be. Like we're not even close to where the founders started.

[00:12:40]Like the numbers are just and we haven't advanced for over a hundred years. We're in the cabal of the few. Okay. And you know the the reality is and there's some great work out there. I would recommend Justin. You reach out to me. I'll send you some free books. Lee Drupman wrote a great book called Breaking the Two Party Doom Loop. Okay? And he talks about this issue specifically in the fact that, you know, Justin's talking about it make it more partisan, less partisan. No, that's not actually the case. Okay. The reason is back when the representation ratio was a one for 500,000 or 400,000 back in the 60s and 70s, Drew writes that we actually had a secret four-party coalition because you had liberal Republicans and conservative Democrats and these two groups would swing back and forth between the parties to get actual legislation done. And you gave them space to operate because right now this the candidate needs the party to get into office. And I think Justin should reflect on this and why he's not in office is because he went against the king of his party and now he can't get the support of his party to get back in office and that makes it difficult. Well, if you shrink the district, it's all about your constituents. Okay? It's about access and accountability. No longer does money play the number one role in you getting elected. No longer does the party play the number one role in you getting elected. They will still play a role.

[00:14:02]Let's not get that confused. But they won't be the role that gets played to win you office. It will be the voter and that's frankly the most important thing.

[00:14:12]I >> I think you make a very strong argument.

[00:14:14]So I wanted wanted to twist this up a little bit. So one one topic that's been in the news a lot lately is uh gerrymander jerry gerrymandering. I knew I was going to botch that up. Um and and the reason is because both parties are trying to redraw congressional districts mid decade uh for political gain. Let's be honest about it. Many people certainly, you know, they say they don't like gerrymandering. Um, we had Rory Riley topping on recently to talk about this. She has a book coming up on the issue. But, but there are people on on both sides uh who are trying to sort of rationalize what's happening as a countermeasure, you know, on against the other side and their gerrymandering efforts. Uh people say that, you know, it started with Texas and then but I think Rory who we talked to uh actually kind of points out that it actually started in Ohio a little bit earlier, but it's it's definitely had this cascading effect. Um and it's really kind of a mess, you know, right now uh with all these midterms going on and all this these potential, you know, this this redist redistricting. Jeff, you recently wrote about this topic for the dispatch and how um uncapping the house can play a part in kind of neutralizing it. C can you talk about that a bit?

[00:15:24]>> Yeah. So, I mean, think about it this way. Our founders believed, you know, like we we we freed ourselves from Britain's, you know, thumb because we didn't have representation in parliament. Okay? We were okay with taxes. We just wanted to be able to have a say in those taxes. Okay? Well, think about how large the districts are right now and the way they cut them up in Virginia specifically where you've got like all of this whole area up here in Northern Virginia where all the wealth is now it stretches all the way through here. Okay? So, if you're down here in Elton, you have 0% chance of really getting representation from somebody that's going to win office from Burke.

[00:16:07]Okay? The the income level is disparity.

[00:16:10]And let's say you can't you have to travel three and a half hours to get to your representative to meet with them if they're in their district or you can go straight to Washington because at least you're close enough here as opposed to other states.

[00:16:21]But let's say that your representative doesn't want to listen to you. Now what can you do as a citizen? You can run for office. How are you going to win that district when you come from Elkton? You have 0% chance of winning the district.

[00:16:33]And Madison writes about this in the Federalist Papers as well. He says who are going to be the representatives of uh the United States and he basically lists off all the occupation the merchants the farmers the mechanics the everybody has a chance has a chance an opportunity that's what makes America great is the opportunity for representation and so you know it said when we interviewed him talking about this issue he said when you're drawing lines and I'm paraphrasing when you're drawing lines for purpose of party wins, you've lost the you've lost the basis for representation there.

[00:17:10]You're no longer worried about representing your constituents or um you know fulfilling your responsibilities as a public servant. You're now thinking about yourself only and that's kind of a problem. And frankly, you know, going back to this whole idea about Democrats doing it, they're they're trying to defeat Trump. They think he's an existential threat to our country because he thinks about himself and himself only. And my question to you, whoever is gerrymandering for the Democrats, is aren't you doing the same thing? Because nobody nobody's talked to me about it, right? Like nobody nobody came and asked my opinion about it. They don't ask my neighbors opinions on it.

[00:17:52]They just do it and we're supposed to be okay with it.

[00:17:57]>> Yeah. It's uh it's interesting because that's that's a very good point because this isn't something the people are actually asking about. Um it it really is just a pure political calculation and uh you know it's it's I wish it had this this had never started this new uh this new wave. Um but uh it just seems like it's kind of uh spiraling out of control pretty quickly.

[00:18:20]>> Have you ever watched >> Sorry, can I I got a a little story I wanted to share with you. Have you ever watched the show For All Mankind?

[00:18:27]>> Oh, yeah. I do quite often.

[00:18:30]>> So, it's it's such a fantastic show.

[00:18:32]Okay. I was watching it last night with my wife. I'm in the final season.

[00:18:36]>> And I just want to briefly like for the viewers out there go through like the phase of the show, right? It skips generations. It's the retelling of the moon race where United States actually loses, but then we keep going and we end up to Mars, right? So, like it's the basic um story of life, right? There's a new discovery which creates new opportunity because there's new resources. Okay. Now those new that new opportunity creates immigration. Okay.

[00:19:03]People go there for the new opportunity.

[00:19:07]That's new jobs. Okay. Now once that's built out and it becomes successful, now there's automation.

[00:19:16]There's automation that comes. There's new technologies that are better able to handle those resources. And now all the people that move there, their jobs are lost. And that creates revolution, right? That creates a problem. And on the show, >> spoiler alert, spoiler alert. [laughter] and and on the show and and this is a big spoiler on the show the um the laborers that immigrated to Mars who are helping do the resources they um protest the protest turns violent and they take over the Mars station >> right >> and there's this great scene where the guy he's just emotional and he's angry and he's frustrated and he's taken over the governor and he's got him taped up and the woman goes up to him And he goes, "All right, now what's the plan?"

[00:20:06]And he goes, "We make them stop the im uh the automation." And she goes, "How?"

[00:20:12]And he's like, he's just like, "I don't know what to do." And like I think it I think that that is really like what the MAGA revolution was. It was cuz a revolution is just changing power. Okay?

[00:20:25]And when the people that rile you up and get you to do the really hard thing, you know, in this case a a violent revolution, um, when they don't actually have a plan to see it through, aren't they just as bad as the other people, they they were frustrated. The people got frustrated and got violent because the automation took place behind closed doors. They didn't have a say in what was going on. Okay? They found out through a leaked, you know, uh, media piece and that caused the revolution.

[00:20:59]Now, luckily in the show, cooler heads prevail and they fast forward 6 months and now guess what they're asking for?

[00:21:06]They're asking for representation.

[00:21:08]They're asking for independence, right?

[00:21:10]They realize that look, these things are going to happen. You're not going to be able to stop technology from progressing, but you should have a say in how it's done. It shouldn't be just one person literally in a mansion on a hill, which is what's happening on the show, deciding for everybody else. It's supposed to be a representative system.

[00:21:31]And that's what we have here in America.

[00:21:33]That's that's the story of America. We sent Benjamin Franklin to parliament to try to get some representation for us, and it didn't work. And right now, American citizens are the least represented citizens in modern democracies. Okay. Plain and simple. And that's just a travesty.

[00:21:53]>> Yeah. Yeah. No, it's I don't And you actually kind of filled me in because I'm like a episode behind. So, thanks a lot. Now I don't know. [laughter] >> Now I know what's going to happen to this. But no, I'm just joking. But no, that's that's a really good point. And I, you know, it's it's I I think of that when I watch watch a lot of these shows, but for all mankind, you you really do see glimpses of of different parts of early earlier parts of our of our society and and it plays out in the future. It's it's pretty interesting stuff. But, um, I did want to ask you, so you you've been talking obviously about about this topic for a while and to a lot of people perhaps more and more lately. Um, you know, and helping to build build the momentum that we're currently seeing. Um, do do you have any stories you can tell like just sort of fun stories or maybe some, you know, common questions or concerns or confusion that you hear from people as you're out there talking about this issue?

[00:22:44]>> That's a good question. I have lots of I It's funny is I I take notes when I talk to people about this and I write them down. I write them if you want to follow along, you can go to the uncapped papers on Substack and I write about it every week when we, you know, interesting things that um that people say. So, this one uh from David in um uh Washington, I believe he's married with five kids. So, if you're married with five kids and you've taken the time to volunteer for a political organization, that tells you you are dedicated. I know that from personal experience. We have that in common. He's also got two jobs and he's still decided to sign up and volunteer. And the he said the fact that a state loses representation because it doesn't grow as fast as another, he thinks is a travesty. And I agree as well. Just think about it. Like you lose power in your government because another state grows faster than you. Like why are you losing access and accountability to your government? Again, it's all about self-government. If we're going to be a representative democracy, we've got to have representation. Um I think it's just interesting like the the diversity of people that sign up.

[00:23:56]Um, you know, I tell people all the time, this is a bipartisan issue. It helps every single American citizen, hands down. And whether the people in Washington realize it or not, it helps them. Okay? Because I think that they're good people. Most of them, not all of them, but I think that they're good people trying to do good work. And they can't get it done either. Okay? And this opens and creates opportunity for new people to help. Think about it like a business, right? your customer. You have a hundred million customers and over the next five years you now have 300 million customers.

[00:24:32]Are you going to keep with the same staff? Are you going to hire some more customer service representatives to handle the new customers? You're going to hire more people. And that's what we're sitting at right now. When I go in, I was I was at the Hill last week and I was going to offices and dropping off stuff. And I would talk to the uh the staffers and I was like, "Do you feel like you're overworked? Do you feel like there's too many people to talk to?" And like I never got like a straight answer like, "Yeah, you're right." But I did definitely get that face like, >> "Yeah, >> I kind of hate my job. It's kind [laughter] of sucks. This is really hard. It's my first job out of college and I thought it was going to be way more fun and this is kind of miserable."

[00:25:13]People are angry and I'm just like, "Hey, I have a solution to make your job easy." This is about quality of life for the people who work in Washington. It's about quality of life for everyday Americans because it gives them better access and better accountability to their representative.

[00:25:30]And I I I I'm guessing there's probably some sort of personal satisfaction on your end that when you talk to people about this this issue that you probably I'm guessing I imagine you probably see a light bulb going off in their head.

[00:25:42]Who who people who've never thought about this before, never understood probably didn't even know how many house house seats there are. Didn't understand that it was fixed. All this is is there sort of like an awakening expression that you get a lot when you talk about this.

[00:25:57]>> Yes, absolutely. And like I said, if once you see it, you can't unsee it, you know, like now now they start to look at, >> you know, I think right now and for the last 10 years, we look everything at politics. We look through the lens of Trump. Okay, he is the guy that dominates every conversation. But once you see this, you can't look at it any other way. And that's actually the correct way that citizens should be looking at government. They should look at it through the lens of representation, not at the lens of any one particular person. George Washington led us with that both with his standing up at the convention and walking away as president. He he said it wasn't about me, it's about you. and Donald Trump and the media and anybody that's really stuck on Donald Trump. What they're saying is it's about him. They're giving him the power by talking about him. They could take away his power simply by talking about this. This is what should be talked about every single day. If you love America, you love representative democracy. And you need to understand that Americans like me, middle class, family, we just don't have access and accountability as we should. And this changes the game.

[00:27:09]Well said. Well said. U so just kind of on a side note, um I I wanted to bring this up because I just for some reason I I found it funny. I saw online that you recently spoke at the leadership institute. U Matt Lewis, friend of ours, uh posted a photo of you online from the event and I and the picture cracked me up because it looked like you were on stage giving life advice to a larger like a slideshow photo of your younger self. So [laughter] I have to ask Jeff, is is is that what was happening, Jeff? Were you deliber or I was did I deliberately um interpret that image out of context for my own personal amusement?

[00:27:49]>> You know, I didn't think about it that way, but you're kind of that's kind of what I was doing. Like, so it's a content creator uh class, and I've taken that class a few times over the years.

[00:28:00]um you know to learn about how to write, how to get published, how to get on shows like this so I can talk about this issue >> and um I was there just passing along advice that I had learned in the class.

[00:28:12]Um and that I guess it the advice that I would have given my younger self, right?

[00:28:17]Or I or my younger self got. Um what I found interesting about that is nobody really cared. Nobody cared about my story. Nobody cared that I got published. Nobody cared about any of that. You know what they did care about that care about though?

[00:28:30]>> They cared about Y435. They asked me every single question. I I spoke for like 15 minutes and I took 30 minutes of questions and every single question was about the House.

[00:28:41]>> Dangerous.

[00:28:42]>> Why do we have 435 representatives? What number do you think we should have? How do we make this happen? I've never thought about this. this the the whole class had that light bulb moment and I don't think they'll ever be able to look at the government any other way.

[00:28:58]>> That's interesting. That's interesting.

[00:29:00]Yeah. I'm sorry they weren't interested in your personal stuff, Jeff, but that's [laughter] that's crazy.

[00:29:06]>> That's all right. I might on the video version I might put that photo up there.

[00:29:09]My son's been editing and uh I just for some reason it struck me as funny when I saw it. It just kind of felt like you talking to yourself and saying you're good enough, you're smart enough, and dog on it, people like you. [laughter] >> Oh man, I love that SNL skit. That's a good one.

[00:29:23]>> Excellent. Excellent. Well, this is probably a good place to end things, Jeeoff. I just I I always appreciate talking to you. Uh you're clearly very passionate about this issue and I think it's becoming it's an important issue. I think it's becoming people more people are realizing that it's important and and I'm glad that it's getting momentum.

[00:29:39]Um, I'm wishing you the the best of luck on everything and I want to I want to thank you for coming back on the Reagan Caucus podcast. Um, did you want to let people know just one more time your website or where they can go to sign sign the declaration, find out more about the organization?

[00:29:53]>> Absolutely. So, you can go to our website www.nocapfund.org.

[00:29:59]You can sign our declaration for representation. You can email your representative right from our website. I recommend you do that daily. Staffers tell us that it takes 80 to 100 emails before they'll even respond just showing the problem that we have with representation. You can also sign up to volunteer. Like John mentioned, we've got chapters going up all across the country. We'd love to get you either tuned into one or maybe even starting one of your own. And then you can donate um in order to make something like this.

[00:30:26]A a people movement in order to scale is going to need some money at some point in time. And every little bit helps. So we'd really greatly appreciate it. And remember, for Reagan caucus members who are listening to this, what did I say?

[00:30:37]25 or 50? Let's go with 50. I'll eat the shipping cost myself. First 50 members to go on and sign the declaration of representation after this episode, you get 24 hours to sign it. First 50 members, I will ship you a free Y435 t-shirt.

[00:30:54]>> Excellent. And I can say personally, they are they are nice t-shirts. They they fit correctly. You never know what you're going to get. Sometimes me, I do an XL and sometimes stuff's snug. It's perfect. is perfect. So, uh, yeah, definitely a good shirt. So, um, thanks again, Jeff, and for everybody watching this, I want to thank you all for tuning in. As usual, if you watch today's episode on YouTube, as always, make sure to, uh, like the video and subscribe to our channel. If you're listening to us on Spotify, Apple Podcast, or some other audio platform, please like and subscribe as well. And we will see you next time on the Reagan Caucus podcast.