A brilliant, witty dissection of the stylistic friction between Hong Kong kineticism and American studio pragmatism. It transforms a cult action relic into a fascinating case study of cross-cultural cinematic evolution.
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Hard Target (1993) Commentary with @TheBadMovieBible and Nick HelmAdded:
Hello everyone. It's Oliver Harper here and I'm back with stand-up comedian Nick Helm and Rob Hill, aka The Bad Movie Bible, for another exciting commentary.
And this time it's on the Van Damme classic from 1993, Hard Target. So, Nick, are you looking forward to some Van Dammage? Yeah.
Yeah.
>> Good.
>> [laughter] >> I I bloody love this film. I do. I have I've been really busy, so I haven't been able to rewatch it in advance, right?
But um but I really love this film. I remember in uh 1993 we went on a family holiday to Florida and we went around Universal Studios and they had um it was just before Jurassic Park came out or or maybe it had come out that summer but not in England yet.
And um uh so we didn't see Jurassic Park, but they had all these huge posters all over uh Universal Studios of uh of the poster for Hard Target.
And it was very exciting. And I think it was most people's It was most people's first introduction uh to John Woo.
Um Yes. And and and it's weirdly executive produced by Sam Raimi, isn't it? That's right. We'll go into that uh in the commentary cuz he would then go on to produce Timecop. Yes. Van Damme. Which is weird. Do you know all about the background for that? Well, Timecop, yeah, I know a bit. Well, no, but with Timecop and Sam Raimi and uh Jean-Claude Van Damme. Do you know all that? Are you going to tell us later? Yes, I'll tell you something. Yes.
>> Oh, great. I'm really I'm really excited about that then, yeah, great. Cuz I've always I've always wanted to know, Oliver.
>> [laughter] >> How about you, Rob? Are you excited for some Hard Target?
>> I'm always excited for some Hard Target.
I think you should tell us all about Sam Raimi and so on now though, so you've got nothing to talk about later and we can laugh at you.
>> No, no, no, no, no, no, not doing that.
Not losing precious hours [laughter] in the podcast. Can't have a dead air.
So, folks, if you wish to sync this commentary with your own copy of the film on Blu-ray, then put the timestamp to zero and press play now.
Weirdly, this film has two edits when it came out uh on I believe it's the actually and on home video. So, America, they're usually the ones for keeping things uncut, having loads of violence in where the BBFC are far more restrictive on um certain, you know, things like head butts and all sorts.
But, Hard Target was cut in the USA and then the UK it remained uncut. Um as we see later on in the film where Jean-Claude shoots a guy like 50 times and thinks, "Oh, I might have to kick him as well." And he kicks him in the head and then all I think he repeats that kind of process, so they cut those bits all down. So, they just maybe shoot someone once or kick someone once. So, yeah, that was unfortunate when I grew up watching the VHS tape and then I got some American laser disc and went, "Oh, some of the stuff's been cut out." But, thankfully now, uh as it's been re-released over the years, you can now watch it uncut So, was it was it an 18 in the UK then? Yeah, it was. So, it was an 18 in the UK and but it was R-rated in the States, which is >> Yeah. So, that's why it was cut because that >> That's a lot less restrictive, isn't it, in in real terms than an 18, I think.
But, isn't isn't an 18 kind of like a an R-rating anyway? Or or is it an NC-17? Yeah, pretty much.
Oh, that's a good point. Yeah, they kind of varies. NC-17 is um usually something that's a little bit more just game. It's very difficult to market.
>> Yeah, yeah. Showgirls.
But, also isn't isn't R-rated aren't you allowed in under a certain age if you're accompanied? If it's R-rated, I can't remember. I can't remember now. That's how many kids got to see things like Robocop. They went in with their parents.
>> That's That's why like I think restricted is Yeah, does that mean that you're allowed to go in without your parents? I think if it's R-rated then they try and steer it lower than that so that more people can just go. We're not the ones to be discussing the finer points of American censorship of the MPAA. There isn't a single American among us.
So this sequence here with the guy he's kind of been chased down by Lance Henriksen's guys. He's He's actually the writer of the movie. Oh, right. Chuck Chuck Farrah.
>> Were they angry with him then?
>> [laughter] >> They'd read the script.
Cuz Chuck is ex-Navy SEAL.
He had went to screenwriting. He'd written Darkman.
He wrote this and went on to write Virus which is not particularly good movie.
It's more about the um the special effects and uh the Jamie Lee Curtis. Yeah, she hated that film. One of the worst films I think she's ever been in she proclaimed.
Um Lots of striking physical effects though. Yeah, like you say.
Oh, yeah. Virus is uh it's great to look at but the story's a bit a bit janky.
>> So is that the is that the Sam Raimi connection then that he wrote Darkman and then he did this? Yeah, well yeah for for him and for Chuck the writer and Sam's connection cuz So basically Sam Raimi and his connection to this picture and eventually Timecop. So when Jean-Claude had made Lionheart that was distributed by Universal Pictures. And at the time Sam Raimi got to see that edit because Sam was obviously working with Universal on Darkman.
He was very impressed with Lionheart and saw the potential with with Jean-Claude and wanted to work with him.
Um when was it John Woo was a big success in international market with The Killer and Hard Boiled and uh it was massive in America on VHS cuz everyone was sort of blown away by his style of action. Um it was in it was inevitable that they would want to bring John Woo over to the United States, but Universal were very concerned about his kind of poor English and um his style of action. Uh they probably think it I think there were concerns about the violence.
So, Sam, having obviously showing a keen interest in John Woo, he was enlisted by Universal to sort of essentially help John Woo uh on Hard Target or any project he got involved with.
And and kind of step in to take over. I think that's usually the job, isn't it, of these people? If it all goes pear-shaped, there's someone there to step in and take over. Those opening shots, the the POV shots are kind of very Sam Raimi. And I think you do get a few like set like that like that arrow is kind of like um Army of Darkness kind of stuff. Or the eyeball. It's It's a lot of Sam Raimi's crew are involved, aren't they?
I know it's the same Sam Raimi's go-to editor is the And Sam's brother's in this as well, as he always get gets his glorified cameo.
>> Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Um yeah, I bloody love Sam Raimi.
>> [snorts] >> It's It's just interesting thing seeing him do this. Obviously, we know that Sam wasn't always super keen about horror.
He saw it as a way to sort of a quick way into make money cuz most producers now always do you know, for an indie filmmaker, horror's always going to make money in some in most cases, but uh Cuz they started off making um Three Stooges type shorts, didn't they? And then he kind of transposed all of his comedy stuff into uh Evil Dead, and they were like, "We'll make We'll make the most horrifying horror movie of all time." Evil Dead was literally like a calculated move to to attract attention, make your money back.
>> It's the It was the John Carpenter route, you know, you do like a little indie horror film, and then you can make loads of money off the back of it. And then when it with his blank check he did a crime wave which was a disaster.
>> Yeah.
So when So when they had to do Evil Dead 2, they made it a comedy.
And then it was like the best of both worlds.
I think uh with also with Darkman it shows you his kind of love of comic books and also wanted to make wanted to make The Shadow but couldn't do that so he made his own character with the help of Chuck and then and then it showed you his kind of love for action and also this comes about.
>> So um I mean so uh loads of loads of like things combining uh loads of my favorite things combining to make this film.
Um Yeah. It um >> Shots of New Orleans. I love the music as well. It really captures New Orleans in this.
Also it's worth mentioning that um guy the writer playing that character in the beginning. I forget his name now. Farrow or Chuck Farrow. Chuck Chuck Farrow.
Looks a lot like Kurt Russell in that he's almost made up to look like McCready. Well, that's the thing and of course Kurt Russell was originally sought for the role of Chance Boudreaux or the the role that would become Chance Boudreaux. That's true.
>> What else is this What else is this actress in?
>> Well, this was her first feature film.
>> Yancy Butler. Um she'd I I think she had a Is this before Candy? This isn't before Candyman.
Is she in Candyman? She's not in Oh sorry. No, Kasi Lemmons is in Candyman, isn't she? The black lady she's in um Candyman.
Drop Zone. When was Drop Zone? That was '94.
Was it?
Drop Zone Drop Zone uh Did that come out the same time as Terminal Velocity?
Oh. The childish >> it I think it was, wasn't it? Yeah, it was the Or was it Point Break? It was the same time as >> They looked really like similar.
Terminal Velocity and Drop Zone were kind of like oh yeah. So I recognized her more recently uh in Kick-Ass. And she's she's also in the sequel as well. She plays the sort of the bad guys the uh the the bad guy's mother, right? Oh, right. Okay. Okay. She's also in great movie called Witchblade.
Um which in which she's an NYPD cop and she inherits Joan of Arc's enchanted magic glove and uses it to fight crime.
Oh, is that based on the comic book?
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I used to read Witchblade, yeah. Oh, of course. Um what else is this guy in? Oh, jeez, yeah.
I meant to look him up actually.
It might be I might just be remembering this film as we're watching it going he's actually No, he is he's a he's a bad guy.
>> [laughter] >> Um so it's kind of like a play on the deadliest game, isn't it? Yes.
It's basically there's like loads of different films that kind of like take this thing where it's like rich people hunt down poor people and for sport.
>> Yeah. And it all kind of ties into the sort of the real life crimes of Zodiac, you know. Um it was part of all the the dangerous game, wasn't it? That was these. I'm a big fan of this um this genre the most dangerous game the 30s original one is a a favorite.
>> The black and white yeah, it's great.
It's great.
Um it's quite good that they've kind of like they've set it in New Orleans to like get around his accent.
>> Well, yeah, that was purp- yeah, purposely done yes to do that. But it's great because it's like it's an amazing setting. You don't really get many like films set in New Orleans.
Absolutely. Just those establishing shots of the of the town a minute ago were were brilliant.
>> Yeah, it's like a proper western as well, you know, the close-ups and And he he described himself as a greasy-haired samurai in this Van Damme, which I like. I mean, I love his hair.
What's great about his hair is when he's doing like his his like roundhouse kicks and then his hair is sort of like swings. It's like Yeah, it's like it's like Tom Cruise's hair in Mission Impossible 2. It's like grow it long and then we'll get loads of uh Yeah. And wear And wear a long loose flowing jacket as well, so that you get all that's all that lovely It's funny you mentioned Timothée, cuz it that that's what John Woo used to get a lot of crap for. I remember this back when this came out. People saying it looked like um it looked like a TV advert because of all the slow motion.
>> also his obsession with pigeons, you know, doves as it were.
>> Yeah.
Uh which they appear in this as well.
And also you mentioned like a western because when he you know, the two couple of thugs who tried to steal our money, he obviously pushes them away, but he moves his jacket around like he's you know, he's kind of taking a gun out.
>> Well, yeah. Well, yeah, it cuz he's getting his LEG OUT.
>> [laughter] >> AND IT'S JUST like it's so cool cuz it's like he is he is the weapon, so I mean >> Exactly. He's cocking his leg.
>> [laughter] >> Jean-Claude Van Damme is a weapon. Um Uh yeah, and he's so [ __ ] cool in this. And his like jacket is kind of like one of them duster jackets. It's you know, it's like and you've got like these slotted kind of things in the shop, so it's all kind of like getting all these western feels. Yeah. And the music's great. Who Who does the music in this?
>> Graeme Revell, who did The Crow, uh Street Fighter the Movie, um Who did the Who did the music on Broken Arrow? Was it Ry Cooder? Oh, Broken Arrow. That That might be Hans Zimmer, right? Broken Arrow?
>> Oh, maybe it's Hans Zimmer, but it's Ry Cooder-esque, isn't it? That's what they're sort of aiming for.
I don't remember a score in The Crow. I just remember a really good soundtrack.
>> [laughter] >> Really good like you know, chore uh pop music basically. Loads of Chemical Brothers and It can't rain all the time.
>> [laughter] >> That was beautiful. The Crow is [ __ ] great. Anyway, we're watching Hard Target. We're watching Hard Target.
Oh, we should do The Crow soon. Well, I I cuz I've I've just just rewatched all of Brandon Lee's movies, all of Shannon Lee's movies. It's That would be a good one to do.
That was a kick. When I saw this kick he does, we just uh does like double kick, like kicks one guy, then goes to the next guy, and they slow it down.
>> There he is. So good.
>> [laughter] >> Yeah.
There was a great kick. I watched them Hard Target 2 um in preparation for this, and um Scott Adkins does an amazing slow-mo kick where it's a double kick, two guys coming at them on motorcycles, and he kicks them both in the face at the same time in slow-mo. I didn't even know there was a Hard Target 2. Yes, he used that guy to kick the other guy. Brilliant. [laughter] Amazing.
All right, so you AH, AND IT LOOKS SO PAINFUL. AMAZING.
That actor had to try really hard to make sure his head hit that post.
[laughter] Yeah.
But I do love the kick he does in the minute where he he spins around and kicks the guy in the back of the neck to throw him through the through the window, which is >> He like hooks him around.
>> Yeah. He would which he would do in Street Fighter. He would do the kick >> back the following year. There we go.
So well done.
I like I like the slow motion, but I think this kind of could have worked really well if it was just sort of like sped up, and the slow motion >> speed.
Yeah.
Ah, that's a great >> And when he spins him around, whack. Ah, it's good. Good rhythm on that. That was good really nicely done.
It's just so cool. He's just so cool.
It is literally blending Eastern and Western filmmaking, isn't it?
>> Yeah. Yeah. Because we'd seen slow motion used before in other movies, but John Woo was so good at choosing his moments to do it, especially when you see Andy later on like reload that shotgun, the shell goes flies out of the gun. It's like, "Oh."
That is some good This is This is proper action porn, this film.
Because Yeah, it's the slow motion is kind of aimed at aggrandizing Van Damme, isn't it? It's kind of aimed at mythical mythicizing him, whatever that >> It's mythologizing. Mythologizing him, I suppose, would be the word, yeah.
There's It's just It's not just him fighting, and if anything, his fighting's in normal speed. It's more his like dramatic looks and so on that seem to be slow-mo. Well, it's choreo- It's choreography, isn't it? It's like It's It's presenting It's what It's what John Woo does with guns, you know? It He makes it kind of like balletic.
>> It is, isn't it? It's not just about It's not just about like um blocking a fight. It's kind of like let's let's capture him in all his glory doing that. And let's And let's make the fight look balletic rather than brutal or vicious or effective even. It is the most like watching people dance when doing their martial arts. It It's like every kind of move is a gag, do you know what I mean? So, they've kind of like So, it's like And then this is the one where he hooks the guy around the head and smashes him through a window, and it's kind of It's not just like bam bam bam bam bam. So, the slow motion really does bring that out, but the way she's reacting in the car at that point, you kind of think it should be like chaos, do you know what I mean? Like everything's going to [ __ ] and she's like she can't keep up with it. But when it's in slow motion, it's kind of like the pacing is a bit kind of all right.
You get a sense uh that the town is like is just being destroyed by Lance Henriksen and his and his guys. Like There There seems to be not many people around, and any people you see are kind of homeless or, you know, just a minimal amount of background people. So, and then even here at the police station, it just seems like everyone's got a day off or something, and she's only one working.
What There isn't there Aren't they on strike or something? There isn't there a strike? But there is still like a sense that that there's something's Something's not right about the town.
No, something is really wrong with that off that death. I'm just so paranoid about that candle in that death drawer.
She that candle is still just sitting there alight. This town's got enough problems without her burning it down. It would have burned the oxygen, surely. It would have It would have snuffed out by now, surely. The top of the desk must be boiling by now.
Uh well, you know what they say, if if you're thinking about the candle in the desk, then you're not really enjoying the film.
And you then you're waiting for this scene to end.
Yeah, it does it does slow down every time he's not on screen, isn't it? So, when John Woo had had come over, he was given like Okay, choice of scripts. What What would you like to do? And um and he goes like eventually settles on Hard Target. And when it came to making the film, there was like I think there's kind of like quotes from people that Van Damme's ego at this point was pretty swollen. You know, he was you know, he was uh Because at this point, you know, he did he just done Universal Soldier, which was a a massive film. Probably his most successful film pop uh box office-wise.
It was it was fairly massive. Like, do you think he always had to cuz cuz it wasn't that long after he got fired off Predator, right? Oh, Predator was '86.
You know, Yeah, this is a This was he was at his absolute peak here, I think, wasn't he? This is maximum Van Damme like status. Had Double Impact come out by now?
Yeah. Right. Okay.
So, you would have had um it's kind of like Death Warrant, Double Impact, Nowhere to Run, uh Universal Soldier.
Maybe no you know, maybe Nowhere to Run was after Universal Soldier.
Nowhere to Run was after after this, wasn't it? It's kind of See, there's certain sort of release dates and things like that, but I think this year '90 It's a '93 kind of movie.
I think Nowhere to Run was was after this because it was him like doing a more family-friendly one.
Potentially. I Because then he'd do Yeah, '94 would be Timecop then Street Fighter.
I always remember cuz Kieran Culkin is in Nowhere to Run.
Yeah, Nowhere to Run was just before this.
Oh, was it?
Yeah, it went it went Double Impact, Universal Soldier, Nowhere to Run, Hard Target, Timecop, Street Fighter.
It was Jean-Claude Van Damme promoted Nowhere to Run on The Big Breakfast.
>> Oh, did he? And and they and they said, "Oh, you're working with Kieran Culkin."
He's uh uh and he goes, "Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, he's Macaulay Culkin's older brother."
And they were like, "Older? I think he's younger." And he goes, "Nah, he's older." And they couldn't they couldn't correct him.
>> [laughter] >> And they were scared they're going to get their heads kicked in, but uh Um in terms of John Woo, I think for me it's Broken Arrow, Hard Target, and his American stuff. Broken Arrow, Hard Target, Face/Off, Mission: Impossible 2, Wind Talkers.
What about Paycheck?
Paycheck, [ __ ] Hmm.
>> [laughter] >> Did Paycheck bounce for you?
Paycheck was that's like an ironic title as well, isn't it? It's like everyone turned up for the paycheck. But isn't that a remake of I think it is a remake of something. He's going to be he's been attached to so many films that he's he he was attached to He-Man, attached to a Turtles film. He's he's like What was the other director who'd who'd done um Oh god, what was it?
Noah.
Is it Noah? That Noah film with Russell Crowe. Russell Crowe.
The Darren Darren Aronofsky. Yeah, he's been attached to tons loads of projects that never get off the ground, you know.
Yeah, but all of his [ __ ] things sound insane. Like, "Oh, I'll do Batman, but he's a mechanic." And and he's like >> [laughter] >> Don't do Batman then, do something enjoyable.
>> [laughter] >> Why can't any of them just do Batman right once? Do you know what I mean?
>> [laughter] >> Uh Mask of the Phantasm. I think you'll find Adam West's version is definitive, Nick. I I don't have a problem. I think there's room for all Batmans. I just want to see You You know, they get the costume right with [ __ ] Batman versus Superman, but the film is dreadful. And then, you know, they get the casting right, but you know, it's You know, Batman Returns.
>> Bruce Wayne, but not a good Batman, you know what I mean? It's always >> Yeah.
>> [snorts] >> Um It's cinematography, isn't it?
>> that reveal. Is it Russell Carpenter doing the photography, isn't it? Yeah, so you had the sort of the sort of slow-mo reveal of Van Damme.
And cuz he Van Damme would come back to come back to that hairstyle, wouldn't he, for those um Coors Light adverts, wouldn't he?
Yeah.
>> Oh, yes. Yes. They were the best adverts they'd done.
>> [laughter] >> Have you ever seen JCVD?
>> Oh, yeah. Love that film. Absolutely love it.
>> It's so good. It's like Die Hard in a post office. It's like it's it's amazing. Yeah, Rob, why wasn't that on your video? I didn't think about it like that. Yeah.
>> Oh, no. That opening That opening sequence, which is like a one-er, when um yeah, and uh and then the bit when he does the monologue to the camera, and he's like He's an He's an incredible actor when he's speaking in Flemish. And then, you know, he struggles.
What's the What What What's the story about the lump on his head?
I never knew Yes, I never I was puzzled by that. I think it must be like a thing, right? Um Yeah, I don't know I I have looked it up before, and the story wasn't memorable enough to remember it.
So, [laughter] yeah, just a birth thing.
Or like he punched it. Is there something about his character in this that I can't remember now? Is there like Do we know anything about his background? Do we know anything about why he's Isn't he Vietnam vet? He has military training. Um Um, he has obviously, you know, he's just been basically kind of bumming around, really, and getting odd jobs.
>> he's he's essentially homeless.
>> Yeah.
>> And is essentially try Yeah, he's turning up at the docks trying to get on the daily billet or whatever it was called. So, he's like he's absolute rock bottom kind of but it's like I feel like there should be some explanation for that. He should have suffered some terrible His family's been killed in a car crash or something like that. So, for him to to explain why someone of his obvious skills and abilities is at the bottom of the No, cuz you don't have that You don't have that with the Clint Eastwood in the Dollars Trilogy, do you? He just turns up into town and he does his stuff and then he leaves. He's like a mystery.
Yeah, but there's no um there's no there's no explanation required for that, either. We know that he's a bounty hunter. He's just He's a really skilled bounty hunter. That's a common situation. Like there's I feel like there's some something should explain why he's at the very bottom of society when he's obviously an intelligent, skilled Well, he had it His character had assaulted someone on a on the last kind of ship out, you know, for work. So, he was you know, he had to reapply.
That part explains it, yeah. Pissed off the union.
But you But But But if you're looking for that in this film, it's not that kind of film.
>> [laughter] >> It's like It's about It's about looking cool and kicking. Do you know what I mean?
>> Exactly. It That is what it's about. It's just interesting that they haven't even bothered with the slightest bit of kind of character develop No, development, but character background, I suppose.
>> But everyone's Everyone's got the brief.
Do you know what I mean? And John Woo is like, you know, it's like a paper-thin kind of film in a way, but it's like John Woo makes it look incredible, and then they've got Lance Henriksen in it, and he's amazing He's like one of the best I [ __ ] love Lance Henriksen.
>> Yeah, he's great. He In fact, he was um that cuz this is There were two cuts of this one even before all the MPAA cuts that were required. Yeah. Van Damme re-edited it himself.
But but that that aside, John Woo's cut apparently focused a lot more on Lance Henriksen's character and gave him a lot of character development. And I just wondered whether all whether when when all that was cut whether some of the some of Van Damme's character development went with it.
Well, there's one bit of trivia that says that Van Damme had done his own cut. Because Van Damme was or by this point famous he was quite skilled at doing his own cuts to actually and have found had success with Bloodsport and Cyborg re-cutting stuff.
Well, he edited them. Well, he would basically improve the fight scenes, right?
Right.
So, in the case of Hard Target, um one sort of piece of trivia said he went in and used more close-ups of him because he'd said people are going paying money to see him on the big screen, not Lance Henriksen.
>> Yeah. Hence why he he cut down more of Lance. But, I don't know if that cut that Jean-Claude had done was just a result of this cut. I think this is just a what John Woo wanted which would please the MPAA.
I I I dug into this actually and it's the MPAA cuts are entirely separate.
There were like you say like 20. They went back and forth like seven or eight times.
>> Cuz they're always the same, aren't they? Cuz they say this needs to be cut, but they won't explain why.
>> so so all those cuts went, but that that aside, there were two fundamentally different approaches to the movie. One was um John Woo's was to focus more on um Lance Henriksen's character and and his relationship with Arnold Vosloo. He apparently loved those two. Well, as everyone did. The studio did as well.
Well, and Sam Raimi cuz Arnold Vosloo took on the mantle of Darkman, didn't he? For the for the sequels.
>> Yeah.
But yeah, so so Van Damme recut it, took out all the Lance Henriksen stuff, put in more close-ups of him. And that does tie in with what people were was about the actual shoot as well, how Van Damme Van Damme insisted on having a camera dedicated in every shot just focused on his muscles.
And he did demanded that happen. John Woo went along with it, but didn't use any of the footage, apparently.
>> The muscle cam.
>> [laughter] >> But he's he's taking his moment, isn't he? He's like he's not building his career at this point. He's like cementing it. He's like, you know.
>> And he's right. People pay to see him, not Lance Henriksen. It's a it's a but it's a vanity cut. It's like Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves with Alan Rickman. And Kevin Costner made them get rid of loads of Alan Rickman stuff from Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves. But then when you actually see the stuff that they've cut, the Sheriff of Nottingham comes across much, much more evil and it kind of takes a lot of the fun out. Mhm. Was that an extended cut? Yeah, he cut a man's tongue out and and then there's quite a really big scene where all the Celts come and and he's kind of And there's an extra bit with his kind of what his witch-like mother.
>> Yeah, like it's his mom and it it's so it explains too much. And I think actually with Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves, he's in it just the right amount and he still steals the show, you know. Mhm. Yeah, he does. But I like Kevin Costner in that film as well, you know. I've I've no problem with him.
He's got the emotional edge to it. We should do Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves.
Definitely.
I love that film. But yeah, it's kind of like what you would do in these days, isn't it? You'd you'd have like your action star and they've kind of like minimized his dialogue to a point where he's kind of like um you know, he's not carrying all the scenes, you know. But um I think Van Damme, doesn't he? He knows his limits at this point what he can do. And I think the amount of dialogue he is given, he does it really well. And I think he's um It's the it's the man with no name thing. It's like give Clint minimum dialogue and then it's all about like seeing what's going on through his eyes, you know.
Mhm. This bit here, the karate chop to the stomach. Ah.
Um Arnold Vosloo is great.
Randall Randall Randall went >> And it's because of this that he got the gig in The Mummy. Apparently, this Mummy's from the same producers.
The Mummy was like what a 4 years later, I think, production wise, wasn't it?
>> Yeah, but that he he'd made a really good impression, apparently, on everyone on set apart from Van Damme, obviously.
Vosloo, and so that that they want to say they they immediately said, "Right, well, we've been waiting to give this guy a really good big breakout villain performance cuz he's great."
>> Yeah. It's a Universal production as well, isn't it? Yeah. Did you hear what Have you heard the story about what Van Damme said to him when they first met?
No. Apparently, they didn't meet until they till they were shooting on on set, and Van Damme had his first scene with him, and afterwards came up to him and said, "Where are you from?" And Vosloo said I said, "Africa." And he said Apparently, Van Damme just said to him, "You're never going to make it in Hollywood. You should go back to South Africa." And walked away. The first words he ever said to him. Oh my god.
And apparently, stuff like that is one of the reasons everyone was so impressed with Vosloo cuz he he just swallowed it all. He He didn't bite at any point.
Yeah, that's good.
I think Lance Henriksen is uh is most terrifying in this movie.
>> Oh, he's a great bad guy. He's a cuz you fall in love with him in Aliens, you know?
And uh and he's and you really miss him in Alien 3, and it's kind of he's such a great character, and then to like twist him into this absolute bastard, it's like it's it's fantastic. He's so good in it. But, it's but what Yeah, that's kind of what I was saying where you have like you have your action star, and then you have like your flamboyant Yeah, your scene-chewing bad guy. your character actor that does it.
And uh and it's kind of like a good balance in these films. Yeah, it's it's the Die Hard formula, isn't it? It's Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And um like later on in this film is one of my all-time favorite shots in any film, which I which I will I'll point out later.
>> [laughter] >> But um but it's incredible.
He's the um the villain in Hard Target 2 is really good as well and he's clearly based his performance. It's a guy called Robert Knepper who looks a lot like Lance Henriksen.
And he clearly based his performance on him, plays exactly the same kind of character in exactly the same kind of way. And it was originally meant to be his brother apparently, the Die Hard 3 style.
But for whatever reason the studio didn't want to have too greater connection to the first film and kind of made a reboot. Right.
>> But he uses the same gun though, he uses exactly that that same single shot. It's weird when they do that, isn't It's like an elephant gun, like pistol.
>> Yeah, weirdly I fired one. It's one of the few proper guns I've ever fired. The shop in Florida that I went to on holiday to shoot some guns. They were like well we we you can you can choose a you can choose a a regular 9 mil a a a submachine gun of some sort and an oddity and that was the oddity I chose cuz it was the biggest.
Did it have a lot of ridiculous kickback? Yeah, the guy said he said it's called a nose breaker because people come in there knowing what they're obviously I don't know what I'm doing but people go in there knowing what they're doing and don't listen to the warnings and shoot it and the recoil breaks their nose.
Ooh.
>> [laughter] >> Um like I really love Lance Henriksen, right? Um but I haven't seen loads of films with him in, right? Um so I've seen this and I've seen Aliens and I watched the Millennium series that they did, the spin-off from the X-Files. And obviously he's in Aliens versus Predator. Um but um what >> Omen 2? Do you remember the Omen 2?
>> Is he in the Omen 2? Oh, and he's he's in >> Oh yeah, I'd forgotten that already.
He's in the first Terminator film. What What other What other And he was going to be the Terminator, wasn't he? That was the original plan.
>> Yeah. They had um they did like they've done like a bust of of Lance Henriksen as the Terminator with half of his face off. Yes, he did.
There was a James Cameron drawing, isn't it?
And they they've made like a like an I don't know if it was AI or if it was an actual bust, but but he looks really cool as the Terminator and you think you know, that wouldn't have been a bad that wouldn't have been a bad substitute.
You've seen the you've seen the Ray Liotta film No Escape?
Yeah, is he the bad guy in that? No, he's not a bad guy. No, he's just one of the basically the the prisoners. He's like the head of the prisoners on the That's like that's like Fortress, isn't it? That's like the Christopher Lambert film, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, which is also a fun film. I don't think I've seen No Escape. I've seen Fortress.
I'm just looking at his he's in a bunch of things I'd forgotten about. He's in Scream 3. Oh dudes, come on guys, we've forgot one film we've not mentioned, NEAR DARK. OH, [screaming] NEAR DARK. WELL, NO, he's more of a bastard in that, isn't he? Or Stone Cold.
Stone Cold, man.
He's he's the bad guy. He's the he's the the king of the bikers in Stone Cold.
He's awesome.
>> What's Stone Cold? Oh, you are you serious, Nick? You would [ __ ] love Stone Cold. You've not seen Bad Boys 2?
>> [laughter] >> It's a it's a nine early 90s action movie starring Brian Bosworth in and it's an action movie in all the best ways. Right.
He's yeah, he's like a he's like a crazed Hells Angel gang leader trying to take over the country, basically.
Is there is there any other really big ones that you recommend?
Stone Cold, Near Dark. The Quick and the Dead he's in, isn't he?
>> Oh, yeah, HE'S BRILLIANT IN THE QUICK and the Dead as well. It's what a what an amazing character in Quick and the Dead.
>> Another Sam Raimi production.
>> yeah.
AVP, obviously. And then yeah, Dead Man, which is a movie I haven't seen in years, but I'd love to watch that again. The Johnny Depp Jim Jarmusch I think it's Jim Jarmusch movie.
>> yeah. It's weird though, isn't it? Cuz when you're young, you kind of think, oh, Lance Henriksen is one of the biggest stars on the planet. He's in every film I watch. And then it's like When he whacks him on the knee with that baseball bat, you feel that.
>> Oh, you know it's going to hurt, don't you?
Good sound effects in this.
I tell you, I wish that they brought over some some of the stunt guys from Hong Kong to work with just to get a bit more energy into these fights. Just for a bit more Hong Kong in in the fight scenes would be good.
Well, Chow Yun-fat wasn't really that interested in Hong Kong like you know, martial arts. He's all about the the gun.
Yeah, well, he did a lot of martial arts movies earlier in his career. But yeah, by this point he he he he he like yeah, he he didn't yeah, he'd lost interest by this point. Didn't want to be that guy.
Me and me and Harry Hill and Hugh Davies we're in a little cinema club and we went to see Hard Boiled at the BFI recently.
Oh, did you? And they didn't know what it was.
>> [laughter] >> And at the end of the day >> and Harry Hill didn't know what Hard Boiled was? No, I said do you want to see Hard Boiled cuz it's at the BFI and they were like, yeah, sure. And they came along and we watched it and they were like very loud, wasn't it, Nick?
>> [laughter] >> But like >> Classic dad moment that is. But Chow Yun-fat is so cool in that movie and and and there is a lot of like obviously there's a lot of action, but I think that when he's got this big budget it's so much slicker and you know, his Hollywood movies compared to his Hong Kong movies are kind of I love I I mean I really love A Better Tomorrow.
You guys are more of The Killer's or like the Hard Boiled? Um Is it The Killer? I love The Killer. Yeah, I I kind of see that that trilogy those those three films I kind of see as an unofficial trilogy in my mind.
>> Which three films?
Um Hard Boiled, Better Tomorrow and The Killer because I saw them all kind of at the same age all like quite close together. And they've always been the odd older John Woo movie I've seen has always seemed a bit different somehow.
Oh, the one I didn't mean Better Tomorrow cuz they made loads of sequels to that as well, didn't they? I meant Bullet to the Head. Yes. Yes.
>> Or bullet bullet in the head. Yeah.
That's That's incredible.
I think was was it I believe it was Hard Boiled that sort of got the most attention, right?
>> so, yeah.
>> internationally? Yeah.
>> That was a huge huge deal on video when I was a kid. Go Is it the hospital they burst in?
Camera just follows them through all this with the baby. Yeah, all this carnage. I mean, it's it's incredible.
>> Yeah, it's No, it's amazing. It's amazing, but it's I mean, there it's so loud, you know? There is so much It's like non-stop shooting for like the second half of the film, and it's kind of like, yeah, right. I was looking over it and going, are they enjoying this?
>> [laughter] >> But I yeah.
But like I think like Hard Hard Hard Boiled was like his breakout film, you know? That was like the one that went international that got In the West, yeah. Yeah. But but they were all big films.
I never quite clicked with his American ones, to be honest. I really liked Face/Off back in the day, but I can't say I've gone back to them much. I liked I liked Face/Off in the day.
I thought I used to think Broken Arrow was the best film ever made. And I do and I do sort of prefer it to Face/Off.
Face Off is a bit too self-important and bloated, isn't it? And Broken Arrow is more of a I'd have to watch them again.
I I just can't remember it in enough detail. Broken Arrow written by Graham Yost, who also wrote Speed.
Yeah.
The bus that couldn't slow down. I you [ __ ] loved Broken Arrow.
But with John Woo's other movies, he wouldn't wouldn't be working with an action star. He would be working with Christian Slater. Carey Elwes, John Travolta twice. Yeah. Yeah.
So, that's why I kind of gravitate towards more of Hard Target because the lead Yeah. can do the action. Yeah, I would now. I'd I'd it was funnily like 10 years ago this wouldn't have been in my top three John Woo American movies, but it it now it's easily my favorite after rewatching it last year first time in ages. Yeah. No, I I've I've always loved this. It's my favorite Van Damme film.
Oh, wow. Oh, nice. That's it's a very strong contender.
>> I think it plays into all of his strengths and it hides a lot of his weaknesses. Like God, [ __ ] hell, the dialogue scenes in Street Fighter are unbearable, you Man, if you like this, you should check out this one movie Bloodsport. It's really good.
>> [laughter] >> I've tried with Bloodsport.
You mean you tried? I've tried.
[laughter] I'd never get far through a Jean-Claude Van Damme film.
Um Rob, you were saying earlier about like sort of the character development of Chance Van Damme's character Chance. Um because I think the the minimal sort of backstory helps play into him being the prime candidate to take part in Lance Henriksen's kind of gang.
>> That's Yeah, yeah, good point. Yeah.
Because he again, another guy who doesn't have much of a background. There isn't much about him.
Um Yeah, that is a good hand wave that's that is a that's an excellent hand wave.
He's the ultimate prize for them.
Um cuz they keep hiring basically guys who are like again, this wealthy um works in the market surgeon, I think maybe. Uh he just just wants to shoot someone and he [ __ ] it up.
Um But yeah, yeah, it's a good point that the anonymity side of it is a big part of the of the plot really cuz that's why they find it so hard to find what's happened to her father because he was just an anonymous homeless man.
You had expertise though. Yeah, exactly.
So So yeah, so in this movie they're seeking people who know what they're doing but but won't be missed, which makes a lot of sense. But then in the sequel they they take Scott Adkins who's like a one of the world's most successful MMA fighters.
>> [laughter] >> Without any explanation they take exactly the opposite route just cuz it's convenient. All right. I'll just point out there, sorry. I I I thought the guy they'd hired was a surgeon, but it's the guy opposite him who's the surgeon who's basically hiding information that, you know, when they go to report on these deaths, they don't find out they've actually been killed by whatever, right?
So but they kind of look alike. It's like maybe like 10 years apart in age.
It's kind of strange. It's a bit kind of Epsteinesque, right? Where he's providing a service for billionaires.
>> [laughter] >> It's like Shooting Stars.
Running joke in Shooting Stars where Vic starts massaging one of the female contestants from behind and then his hands are quietly replaced by the hands of a homeless crazy man and then he just walks right in front of them.
>> [gasps] >> For years I tried to find behind the scenes material on this movie.
Um the way I you could get it was on the Killer Criterion Collection on laser disc with some sort of behind the scenes material because it was John Woo's kind of first American movie, but I was like then thankfully thanks to YouTube there's been a little bit more information put out there like with behind the scenes interviews. Uh But there is if you go on YouTube you can watch the sort of VHS work print.
Yeah.
>> little chunks of it. You got the time code at the bottom. We're seeing some some scenes that are just played out longer like with the bike chase and and you I think you actually go to um uh Van Damme's kind of house like Chance's house when uh Nancy Butler is there as well. So, there's little bits of kind of dropped like character development. Um but I I don't think I think some of these clips I don't think they showed the full kind of like um violence that they kind of trimmed because John Woo submitted it I don't know how many times the MPAA but he made like 20 edits or something like that.
To get where he wanted it to be. Who's this guy?
Yeah, I was >> the guy who's was working for Lance Henriksen. He's basically covering up the guy.
>> He's in stuff, isn't he?
He Well, weirdly cuz I'm covering the Punisher the Thomas Jane movie as a retrospective.
>> Oh, wow. Yeah, right. He's in that briefly near the I think it's the same actor. Cuz they shot it in Florida.
>> Oh, no. I'm thinking of Punisher I'm thinking of War Zone the um Our War Zone, yeah.
>> a bit like He looks a bit like the Irish guy in that.
But he would be way too old by that point. No.
This bit with this guy here.
>> This bit with Is this the bit with the door? Yes, it is.
>> It's like I mean that [ __ ] Ah, man.
That's like >> But when he puts the gun up to the >> Yeah. That's like the shower scene in Psycho, right? Or or going in the going in the sea after Jaws. It's like not going to [ __ ] go on one of them uh peep hole door spy glass things.
>> This guy looks just like Robert De Niro when he's made to look old in Casino.
>> Yeah.
No, Casino is older. Is it I can't I'm thinking Casino but it might be Goodfellas.
>> With his massive glasses on at the end.
It's so funny.
Is that Is that Casino? I thought it was Goodfellas.
Uh maybe it is.
>> It's Goodfellas. It's Goodfellas.
You see him old in Goodfellas as well.
>> Yeah, when he's leaning out the door and he's telling her to walk further down there.
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, well, he's well, he's he's he's aged up in both movies. Put it that way.
But this is Marco St. John. He was in Yeah, he's more well known in The Punisher, Friday 13th The New Beginning.
Yeah, Friday 13th New Beginning is the I think it's the fifth one, isn't it?
He's the sheriff.
This Ah, man.
Oh, it's good. Horrible, horrible.
Um, have you done the Friday the 13th, Oliver?
Not a fan of them. I think they're [ __ ] >> Oh, really? Oh, my favorite >> They're fun. They're fun to watch, but I mean, I I went through all of them during COVID. I was like, I don't know what the fuss is all about.
>> Oh, really?
>> [laughter] >> I Cuz they all got butchered by the MPAA. So, all the good stuff's cut out.
>> Oh, the seventh one is shredded, but um but I I really like them. I think six is The sixth has got like the Alice Cooper theme tune. Yeah, is it five, six, and seven kind of kind of ones I thought were okay. Number eight in New York is I thought was Yeah, it wasn't very good. One of my favorites. Jason Takes Manhattan. Um I kind of like the remake Michael Bay did that combined essentially like three of them into one movie.
>> Yeah, I like I like I like all of them.
Uh, but everyone's favorite is four, but my favorite is six cuz it's got Alice Cooper and they do that James Bond bit at the beginning and it's all a bit Yeah. It's a bit tongue-in-cheek and it's like such a fun film. And they've got all the kids in the camp there.
Anyway, Lance Henriksen.
Lance Henriksen and Arnold Vosloo are really good double act, aren't they?
They are. They really are. Yeah. That's what made You can see why went that way.
I think the balance is fine as well. I mean, you don't want it to be about Lance Henriksen. It shouldn't be the Lance Henriksen film. It should be about Jean-Claude Van Damme. But I noticed >> on on Letterboxd, Arnold Vosloo is credited above Lance Henriksen. Uh that's normally that follow like he's not in in the movie is he credited above Lance Henriksen that'd be weird. But is it kind of like sometimes they get it back maybe it's like an >> Yeah, yeah. Normally on a movie like this it's pretty accurate but yeah, yeah it does happen.
>> with with Arnold Vosloo and Lance Henriksen.
Uh maybe.
>> [laughter] >> What's the IMDb doing? Yeah, the IMDb has him above has uh Henriksen first above Vosloo. Yeah, cuz yeah Vosloo wasn't an established actor at this point.
>> it's got Chuck Zito credited fourth above Vosloo as well. So maybe we shouldn't pay much attention to what websites put on them.
He's very persuasive, isn't he Lance in his sort of you know giving him this money belt.
And if you've got nothing you've got nothing to lose. So And he gives him he sort of tells him hard truths, doesn't he? You know, about the situation this guy is in but you know, being homeless and not treated with much respect for he's done in the past by serving his country. Maybe they should have called the film Hard Truths.
It's it's so unfair though. He's completely outnumbered, you know. Well, yeah he's immediately absolutely [ __ ] Yeah, yeah.
>> [laughter] >> I could probably I could probably get away with this, couldn't I? And then oh no, I'm [ __ ] >> like hide just find somewhere to hide for ages, you know.
Look at the gun he's got as well. It's like it's like the bloody gun in RoboCop, you know, the state of the art bang bang, you know.
Yeah, give him a chance to run away first, Jesus.
>> This is enough.
Not fair on We got a code in New Orleans.
You give the homeless people a 10-second start.
>> [laughter] >> This is um there's a lot of energy to this scene. It's all come from Henriksen, isn't it?
Henriksen's incredible. Yeah. But like this guy is incredible as well, you know.
>> He's got He's He is really good actually, this guy. Was it Willie C.
Carpenter, isn't it? This is This is like um you know, this is like a sequence that kind of like really shows you the stakes of the film. We've met him, we like him, he's friends with Van Damme, and then and then Van Damme's not in it for like 5 minutes while they do this bit and uh and it's kind of like oh right, you don't normally get that in a lot of films, do you? Where it's an adjacent kind of you know, scene.
I can't think where I know him from, this guy.
Willie C. Carpenter. He's in Double Trouble with the uh with those enormous bodybuilder twins. He's in Men in Black.
What, the Barbarians? Yeah, the Barbarian not not the not that actual movie, but yeah, the Barbarian brothers.
Were they in uh Natural Born Killers?
The Barbarian brothers? Yeah. I don't think so, were they?
>> They I In the script, there's a there's they're in the they're in the script. I think he wrote he wrote them in the script. And they're not in the movie. I think one of them they got like uh their legs chainsawed off or something like that.
>> [laughter] >> And they were like, "Mickey Mallory did it."
I love that bit when he shoots the statue. He's just like hiding behind it.
So then the guy who's they've hired to shoot the guy is like doesn't have the balls to kill him now, you know, cuz he's wounded.
And uh Well, the reality has kicked in.
The reality of what it's about It's like Morgan Freeman and Unforgiven.
A moment ago he had to be held back from taking an advantage of shooting him early. They probably should have left Oh, but maybe he was just trying to get it out of the way.
But then it's a waste of your own money though, isn't it? You've paid a huge sum to kill someone. This one I shoot him straight away and go, "Oh, okay, I'm done now." You know.
Nice.
>> [laughter] >> Aw.
Take cover. Take cover. Come on, you don't have military training. It's But it's also elements of Running Man in this as well, isn't it? Mhm.
Yeah, Sven Ole Thorsen for one.
He pops up in this somewhere, doesn't he?
That gun is for so cool he's got, but it's such a faff because you've got like you've only got one bullet.
>> [laughter] >> Constantly reloading. He's got to have that bullet belt, doesn't he? He has.
It's quite cool.
Makes a load of money in the end.
>> He's got one bullet that he's thrown in a graveyard with his fingerprints all over it.
Yeah.
But New Orleans is corrupt. Who is going to care about one bullet?
>> [snorts] >> Oh, people.
Oh, the music here is brilliant as well.
Bit of sad jazz.
God, I still miss sax I still miss saxophone in in in our music today. They don't tend to use it anymore.
The sequel is set in like the jungles of Southeast Asia, which is a much easier to believe environment, to be honest.
Really? I think I think this is I love it being set in New Orleans, but it it does make it hard it does make it more of a like a That's Ted Raimi.
Does make it kind of a give it a bit of a fantasy edge.
>> Going to change, man. He's [laughter] like >> [gasps] >> I I don't It's interesting with this sort of freeze frames. Yeah.
Why are they putting silencers on? It feels like it's a glitch, but um Don't they ping some of the uh the just innocent bystanders walking past?
Why Why are these people just wandering about in front of an army of armed men pointing guns at them? It's the busiest it's been as well, right? It's been a deserted empty town and now all of a sudden everyone's [ __ ] going shopping.
>> [laughter] >> It's It's There is almost like an air of magical realism about it.
Yeah, it's fantastical, but that's um it's a bit like Desperado when they set it in Mexico, cuz it's like no one knows what Mexico is like.
It could be like this. And it's exactly that, isn't it? It's kind of like they want a Western town, but like in the modern day, so it's kind of we'll go to New Orleans.
Well, that was a kind of everyone's obsession, wasn't it? Because they everyone said that the >> Western had died out, but it hadn't really, because those sort of tropes on those Western films were just kind of woven into other action films, you know what I mean? And the settings >> they were cop cop movies. Westerns Westerns were very close to actual, you know, the Wild West days when they were being made in the '30s, '40s, and '50s.
And then cops took cops took over.
I think space took over in a lot in a lot of ways as well. I think space The advent of the space age just made the the old West a lot less glamorous and exciting and aspirational for kids and young people and so on. But like Lethal Weapon and Die Hard, they're kind of like they're like modern Westerns, aren't they? But they're but they're cop but they're cop movies. Yeah. Yeah, space yeah, they're all the same archetypes anyway.
There was a odd editorial choices in this where, you know, John Woo has clearly shot stuff in high frame rate slow motion.
And then they just sort of artificially slow down weird sections where they're just putting the body in the ambulance.
Well, when it's jerky.
It's all jerky.
>> I hate it when they do that.
I hate it. It never works. You never guess what, John? We haven't got enough slow-mo.
>> [laughter] >> Damn.
Was Lou kind of hiding? He's going to get him. This is I love this moment here. He's really great, this guy.
Yeah.
Of course, that's his car.
Leaving without saying goodbye.
>> [laughter] >> He's kind of like an M. Emmet Walsh kind of guy, isn't he? He is, isn't he? Yeah, and he's a sleazy, low-rent M. Emmet Walsh.
>> [snorts] [laughter] >> He's called Van Cleef. Yeah, apparently it is a reference to Lee Van Cleef. It's Of course it is. It's a It's a cowboy film, isn't it?
>> [laughter] >> Ah, that's awesome. Ooh.
>> [laughter] >> He's [ __ ] hell. That made a mess.
[ __ ] hell.
>> [laughter] >> Like, what an evil [ __ ] >> [snorts] >> Ooh.
Um That's got that bears a passing resemblance to that famous um is it an automobile in Sam Raimi's movies? Oh, yeah.
>> doesn't it?
>> Oh, is it though?
>> I don't think it I don't think it's the same one.
>> I don't think it is, no, but it it it's close enough to make me wonder if it's a reference. I probably not a reference.
It's under some tarpaulin in The Quick and the Dead.
Yes, yeah. Yeah, he has to put it in every movie.
It's one of the first cars I bought in Grand Theft Auto when I start playing that. Oh, really?
>> [laughter] >> Rob's 6-month love affair with GTA. No, it was it wasn't a love affair. It was a >> [laughter] >> It was a fling.
>> [snorts] >> It was a violent relationship that should never have been.
>> [laughter] >> It made like Rob the most unproductive he's ever been.
>> [laughter] >> It didn't it wasn't that bad for productivity actually cuz I I had watch movies while whilst playing and it's but it's yeah, it's just not it's just a distraction from getting [ __ ] done still. Yeah, big time sponge, you know.
What do we think of Yancy Butler in this? I think she's very good. I think she's uh she does the she does the emotional stuff very well.
She does do the emotional stuff, there's no two ways about that. She does No, she's convincing.
You know, when she finds out her father's died. I think she's great and she's got amazing eyes.
I wouldn't mind her dialing it back a bit.
Mhm.
What, dialing her eyes back? Yeah.
>> [laughter] >> It's It's It's maybe a It's maybe a kind of Hong Kong hangover where everything's hyper emotional. Yeah, exactly. It's the director is telling her to do it at the end of the day. It's a joint thing.
Oh, I love this kick coming up. Right to the face.
And there's every single bone in his foot shattered. Yeah. In that moment.
>> [laughter] >> He should have timed it where he kicked the guy in the neck or something, you know, as he lifted his head up and got him.
Oh, well. Oh, look at those 90 squibs squib marks.
This is an interesting bit there like with Van Damme's performance. He just goes She's like, "We've got to save her."
Something goes, "She's dead."
You know, in a very cold manner, you know.
Yeah, but No, that's not cold.
And And And the point is that they're going to die.
You know?
You got to move, you know.
Yeah. Oh, it's a wonderful stunt double stuff coming up here with Van Damme.
Guy with a Just a ginormous wig on.
I mean, that is my breaking point with Face/Off when you can see two completely different guys on a speedboat at the end.
>> [laughter] >> It's just like, "Did they swap faces as well? Did they?"
It's like watching the Garth Marenghi's Darkplace where they They They double him for running. I keep thinking of that at the moment cuz of all the slow-mo as well.
>> [laughter] >> This is all the Fatal Deviations. So, you haven't seen Fatal Deviation, have you, Ollie? I don't think. I have seen >> Yeah, you have seen it.
This is what was This is what inspired that, isn't it?
And it's got And it's See, they're very near to the box factory from The Simpsons cuz there's a lot of boxes around here. As I go flying into them.
Uh did you do Broken Arrow for your for your Die Hard thing, Rob?
I didn't, no. No.
>> Cuz that's that's another one, isn't it?
Yeah. Yeah, there I mean, there's a lot that are close to cuz Die Hard is so much more influential than people realize, I think. But there's there are there are so many that are exactly that plot that you can kind of keep quite strict with it. And remind me, you did definitely do Anna Nicole's skyscraper, right?
>> Oh, I certainly did.
>> [laughter] >> This is Coming up now is one of my favorite bits is when he um he gets tries was to you know, he drives towards them and he gets knocked off the bike and then he has to run and then it speed ramps him running as it all explodes. It's like so good. Cuz it goes slow but then it goes to normal frame rate and you see how quick he's running as the bullets miss him.
It's like ultimate shot.
>> This is identical to Fatal Deviation.
He drops her off first, does a skid to turn the bike around, then rides back to then stands up on the Do you knock him off a Do you knock him off like a BMX bike or something?
>> [laughter] >> This is This is where it got I'm watching this thing with my dad. He's like, "This is stupid now at this point." He was like He was gone. He was like, "No."
>> [laughter] >> Took him out the movie, you know.
>> [laughter] >> That time does this little little roll.
Such a good stunt, though. Yeah, it is a good stunt, yeah.
It's the explosive bullets he's firing.
>> [laughter] >> Whoop.
Yeah.
Oh, that is good, isn't it?
Here we go. Got the Van Damme run.
Oh, look at that hair.
>> [laughter] >> Look at that explosion.
We've got to show off the hair. We've got to show off the hair.
>> [laughter] [laughter] >> What just happened?
What was in that barrel?
This one of those plastic things they put down, right? Yeah, I mean it should be full of water if it's a functional Lance Henriksen looked a little bit like um James Woods in The Specialist there.
Yeah.
Like they occupy kind of like the same space.
They do, don't they? I've never thought about that before.
Have you done The Specialist?
No, I've not done that. No. I didn't think it was very good film, but >> Oh, I [ __ ] loved everything every single >> It was Was it regarded as a bit of bit of a trashy movie when it came out?
>> Oh, it is. It is trash.
>> It was still on.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's got like [ __ ] saxophone music going all the way through it, and it's all sleazy, and it's great, though. Every Stallone movie in the '90s was fantastic.
>> Yeah, I'm a big fan of Assassins as well, or Assassins. Assassins, yeah.
>> That's completely forgotten about now.
Yeah, yeah. The Wachowskis, they um they didn't like what Richard Donner did with that movie. I think they they claimed he butchered the script.
>> Did they write it? Yeah, one of their early sort of scripts they'd done. Yeah.
Um well, also >> at the same time as Bound, or was it before? But I can't remember if it was after I think I think it was after. Uh it was after Desperado and then and then Antonio Banderas is doing this big kind of American action movie and uh Yeah.
And I a lot of my love for Desperado went over to Assassins, but now when I watch Assassins it's kind of it's not as good.
Yeah, I'm I'm in exactly the same boat.
I love Desperado so much and I love Stallone so much that I convinced myself Assassins was a masterpiece. I thought it was great. I thought it was great and and you kind of like I didn't really honestly know who was going to win by the end of it and then of course it's Stallone, but um But and the same with Broken Arrow it was kind of like they're not going to kill John Travolta though, are they?
He you know, he he he he nearly gets away with it, right? But uh >> [laughter] >> But I was naive and young.
Can you guys see Arnold's close friend there?
Sven.
Yeah, Sven. Oh, really? He's one of the um he's one of the guys that pops up in all these films, isn't he? Oh, yeah, course. He's the one that pops up in more rats, doesn't he? He's your connection back to Running Man, too.
Yeah, right.
And actually, isn't he in that What's that um Night um Yeah, but he's in um he's in a few Albert Pyun movies as well. I wonder if he's in Knights with um Lance Henriksen.
Maybe they're friends.
>> Oh.
I know he's in um uh Nemesis.
Nemesis.
Yes, he is in Nemesis, yeah. He's uncredited, though.
He's in Cyborg 2: Electric Boogaloo.
He's a doormat.
>> [snorts] >> He always plays security guards, isn't he? [laughter] Just hired as muscle. Just stand there and look big. You know, is he in Quick and the Dead? Got to score some steroids.
He says and he says one line, I think in Running Man.
Yeah.
>> [laughter] >> She is so pretty, isn't she? Yeah, you don't see that often.
To be fair, they're very they're both very attractive.
But there's not a lot of chemistry, right? No. No, not really.
I love this bit. It's so funny, isn't it?
What he just gives the steak a punch, you know?
>> [laughter] >> Gives it a slap.
>> [laughter] [snorts] [laughter] >> We've got Wilford Brimley coming up soon. Absolutely.
>> Oh, yeah.
Yeah, yeah. We all know people always like to point out how old he was when he was in Cocoon. He was younger than Tom Cruise in Mission Impossible 5 or something.
That beat us.
I I did watch Cocoon actually a few I think around Christmas time. I I I hadn't seen it for years and it was a very it's still a very good film.
>> That would take me back to childhood probably more than any other movie.
Yeah. Number 2 is supposed to be quite bad, Cocoon 2 >> that one as well.
That was always on ITV. Cocoon, one of the all-time great Steve Guttenberg movies.
>> [laughter] >> Uh Cocoon's a little bit like Batteries Not Included, isn't it? It's kind of like the um Mhm.
It's got yeah, a bit more mainstream in my mind. Yeah. Who did Batteries Not Included?
The director God, it might been um Oh, what was his name? Was he one of the sort of Was it It wasn't George Lucas.
his He He was part of some I want to say it was like Joe Dante's friend or something or part of Roger Corman's crew.
>> Matthew Robbins who done I believe was it Dragonslayer, I think.
>> It's very um Yeah, he did He did Dragonslayer, yeah, and then um It's very ambling, isn't it?
Oh, he did Legend of Billie Jean.
Oh, right. Hm.
He did good stuff. Yeah, all right. He's great in this, isn't he? Wilford Brimley.
>> [laughter] >> I think he's playing a moonshiner. Yeah.
Could be wrong.
And he has the accent, doesn't he? Cuz uh Is he Van Damme's uncle or dad or what is he?
I think it's it's uh I'm sure it's his uncle, I think. I don't think it's his father, right?
No, that would be a bit too much, right?
Oh, I don't know. He's just Ooh.
He's his uncle, yeah. He's great, isn't he? Cuz he cuz it's kind of like uh you need someone to sort of like some new energy in in the film at this point.
But also, you know, you also Chance needs like needs some support at this point cuz he's now he doesn't he's he's unarmed.
There's always some There's always this scene in in a people on the run movie when they Yeah, they Yeah, it's some Yeah, some some old friend or an uncle or someone who lives in the middle of nowhere or whatever.
They always get some like old cat Like John Cleese does it in one movie I saw a while ago. What the [ __ ] It's the It's like the bit in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles when they all go to the farm. Yeah. You have like a You have like a a quiet moment, you know, just before the third act kicks in. And you know >> Cooper right? You know he's going to die. That's why they've introduced him.
They've got They've got a really likable, friendly, yeah, likable, friendly character actually to come in and basically sacrifice himself for the for the final. He doesn't die, though. Does he not? Does he not? Does he not? He gets sad, but he's he's like hit flask was in near his chest.
>> ride in on a horse at the end or something?
Yeah, you you do see him sort of try to cause a distraction, you know, as he blows up his property.
He's like, "Get the [ __ ] down." Because he cuz cuz uh Vosloo can hear the dynamite sort of the spark about to go off.
It's a wicked explosion.
I love this film.
>> [laughter] >> Finally, finally out of all the films we've done, we found one I liked.
[laughter] >> [laughter] >> You like Die Hard 3, right? I do actually. I love Die Hard 3, yeah.
>> [laughter] >> It's all blocked out from Under Siege 2.
Um, yeah.
Go on, go on, Rob.
>> [laughter] >> Is Wilford Brimley reminding you of like an off-duty Santa Claus? Pretty much.
>> [laughter] >> Could have been a good Santa, couldn't he?
He would have been great.
He he cuts his beard short and lets it grow back.
Arnold's Christmas movie is coming out uh in December.
Cuz he shot it last year with him as Father Christmas. And I was like, "Oh, when's that coming?" Oh, yeah, oh, year away. Arnold Schwarzenegger as Father Christmas? Yep. Um I think it's Amazon or I can't remember, maybe Netflix, I don't know. He's He's not had a great track record with Christmas movies, has he?
>> [laughter] >> Him and snow don't go well.
He watched Jingle All the Way for Christmas and then he watched End of Days for New Year and he [ __ ] up both.
>> [laughter] >> Apparently, this was all meant to be a like a boat chase. You must know about this Ollie. This is something Well, it would have been it would have been harking back to Invasion USA, wouldn't it? Yeah.
But I know for whatever reason Van Damme was was adamant that it all had to be horseback.
Down on the bayou. I guess it's like we you know, he wants to make a cowboy film, doesn't he? So it's it's like we got to have horses. Yeah, with once you contextualize it that way it makes a lot of sense.
Statham's got a cigar in his mouth cuz he's a bad guy. Yeah, yeah.
>> [laughter] >> And when as soon as he kicked that door and started firing he was blinking like a [ __ ] >> [laughter] >> I mean they've made an attempt to kind of like do a Robocop where all the bad guys have their own little thing.
But I saw someone saying the other day there are only two actors who never blink when shooting guns on screen.
Can't be Roger Moore. No, no. One of them was Um The ultimate flincher. Uh Yul Brynner in Westworld.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's true. Right, yeah. I can't remember for the freaking life of me what the other one was. But it's someone more recent.
>> but it's it's T-1000.
What about Patrick? Yeah, that's a good point. I don't think they mentioned him.
They hadn't done their research properly, would it?
>> [laughter] >> Who does Ollie? Who does?
The bane of Rob's life, top 10 lists where they just pinch another top 10 list from someone else.
>> [laughter] >> Westworld is one of my favorite films.
Yeah, abso- I love that movie.
I love the concept of it, but it does have an somewhat of an irritating film score cuz I watched it recently, the 4K one by Arrow. I was like, "Oh, yeah, it's a bit bit grating."
Nah. I think it's a perfect film. The TV I think I think the TV series is is incredible.
>> Oh, no. The TV series can [ __ ] right off. The uh the >> [laughter] >> the I I I put I picked Futureworld over the Westworld TV series. I would I'd I'd pick the original Westworld TV series from the late '70s, early '80s. Did you know about I've got I've got I've got that on DVD. I've got that on DVD, yeah. I love >> That's loads better than the new one.
Oh, you guys are lunatics. What are you talking about?
I think the bait and switch in Westworld is incredible where it's like a silly comedy and then it turns into like, "Oh, no, it's all kind of going off the chain." This is [ __ ] There he is with the bigger He gets an explosion. He gets a slow-motion explosion as well.
>> [laughter] >> That's what we're here for. Wilford Brimley flies it off.
Doing [snorts] a Wolverine.
>> [laughter] >> I've got that jacket that Lance Henriksen's wearing. That's quite handy.
I imagine cos players him then.
>> [laughter] >> Apparently, Keanu Reeves doesn't blink in John Wick when shooting guns.
He just have a just He just have a lot of training, didn't he, before the lines, so But they can CGI that now. Like uh >> [laughter] >> I think they do comp in a lot of the the gun flashes. Like um like Blade Trinity when they uh have where he starts his eyes open at the end.
>> [snorts] >> Oh, cuz he refused to open them.
>> to have his eyes open.
>> [laughter] >> I didn't know that.
Oh, that is the laziest form of acting.
That's wonderful. But he hated it so much, didn't he? And >> Yeah, cuz he spent most of his time in his um in his what was it? Just not coming out and just smoking trailer just smoking loads of weed. Uh and writing post-it notes. Uh assigned Blade.
>> [laughter] >> Which is what kind of like uh made uh Ryan Reynolds um kind of be more prominent in that film.
They must have shot this in the winter, maybe coming to autumn.
>> Yeah, it looks cold. Winter, sorry.
Yeah, it looks very cold in there.
>> And orange. Yeah.
Yeah, when all all the trees are dead.
All the trees are dead. It looks like um looks like fall.
And by must have been Yeah, if they shot in the summer, it would have been brutal. It well, they would have they would have shot in the summer and then it would have like gone over to like New Orleans. No, no, I know when they shot actually. It was August.
>> November. August? It's not August. Look at those trees.
>> They started shooting in August and they shot for two months, so. Well, this must be like this must be October then. Yeah, but there's no leaves, so it looks more like it might be November. I don't want to quibble with you guys, but uh if you know leaves the way I know leaves.
>> If they if they shot if they started mid-August and it was a 70-odd day shoot, then that that would run them into November.
Is this a Is could be near the end of production then.
>> It looks like it's kind of chronological.
>> have been like what you were saying, Rob, with the idea of it being a a boat chase and then ah.
They might well be using the same location that originally planned for the boat chase. I think it's better with with horse. Definitely better with a horse.
Because you do something you don't see.
You don't see like a guy on a horse getting chased by a helicopter. You know what I mean? It's often often a guy in a vehicle or a guy on a boat, you know, so.
And he's you know, John Woo Mind you, John Woo does a lot of boat stuff, doesn't he?
Awesome.
Oh, that damn stunt double does actually look like James Bennett, foul deviation himself.
>> [laughter] >> Now we're going to get the return of the the doves soon. I never noticed that.
One of the guys jumping down off the the arm thing of the helicopter goes falling ass over tit as soon as he lands on the ground. Oh, amazing.
>> [laughter] [gasps] >> So, this was just meant to be like an abandoned warehouse, and then they had all these uh Mardi Gras floats, and they were like, "Well, let's use use these."
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And again, it's if if this this was like Robocop. Yeah.
>> With the sort of taking place in there.
>> Yeah.
They were the doves. Industrial area, you know. Oh, there could be doves hidden in here as well, pigeons as I believe they were in this cuz there were no doves native to They don't have quite the same kind of meaning, do they, though, pigeons?
Flying rats.
>> [laughter] >> Just poop everywhere.
>> [laughter] >> Who's got Who's got the biggest gun?
>> got a [laughter] cigar.
It's so big. It's like a massive turd, you know? It'd take ages to sort of puff your way through that.
You've got such a way with words, Oliver.
>> [laughter] [laughter and gasps] >> I love this bit here when he kicks the barrel and then shoots it, and this ginormous like explosion happens. Like it's like a flamethrower. They've like blasted it through the uh the glass.
That's um bullet in the head a bullet in the head reference, isn't it? Or callback.
>> What with the with the bird [ __ ] or the The the the No, the burning back the flaming barrel, I think.
>> [laughter] >> They are. Love it.
>> [laughter] >> It's over the top this. This blew my mind when I was like what was it 12 years old seeing this god.
Thought it was the coolest film ever.
That guy was still on that bike I just realized.
Was he? Yeah, there's like a dummy tied to it after it landed. He's still in he's still in the seated position on the bike. He got welded onto the bike immediately.
>> [laughter] >> Yeah. That is a man committed to just staying on his bike.
Stop with this juddery frame rate.
I think it may have been kind of like a studio thing where they were like he's doing too much snow mo and then they'd have done it.
Do you know what I mean? Because he's using it a lot less as the film goes on.
Well, it's not his final cut is it? It's not like he didn't have final cut and the version released was apparently the the Van Damme version. So, I guess they could have done anything they want really.
Do you you pretty confident this is the Van Damme cut?
>> Well, I I couldn't work it out and I I did as from the only [clears throat] research I've done that pointed to an answer did point to it being the Van Damme one.
Right.
Okay.
I mean cuz cuz we're in the time now with so many like bootleg labels kind of re-releasing movies. I'm not surprised no one's actually wanted to try and do that.
>> Yeah, well John Woo's [clears throat] really up for it apparently. He's said I noticed he said in a couple of interviews he'd love to see it re-released. And it must be the Van Damme one because when you read about it it it talks in the past tense and it says things like the original film had a lot more character development for Arnold Vosloo or whatever. So, Mhm. Oh, here's all the Mardi Gras stuff here. And what what what is John Woo's like current output like?
Is he doing much? That's a good question. I've no idea.
>> He had He had gone back to make stuff in Hong Kong, right? Yeah, he did like a really huge like historic epic, didn't he? Red Cliff. Yeah.
>> That was that John Woo? Yeah, two movies he did.
Um and then the Rain Rain of Assassins.
Yeah, that's it back in Hong Kong or China, I suppose it would be. Crossing part one and two.
Um Manhunt. Yeah, Silent Night, um which is actually uh American made film.
With Joel Kinnaman. And The Killer, which is also um a Peacock original. So, I think that's a kind of a like an animated thing?
No, it's not an animated thing. What are we talking about? He did a remake >> It's a It's a It's a It's a remake. It's a remake of The Killer. He did a remake of To Catch a Thief, didn't he? That was a TV movie.
The Cary Grant movie. Mhm.
>> [clears throat] >> Really?
So, his last his last big US movie really at sort of was Paycheck. That sort of kind of scuppered his career.
What year was that? 2001?
Three.
2003.
>> Yeah, yeah. Cuz he had that and Mission Impossible 2 back to back or something, didn't he? Cuz Mission Impossible 2 was seen as at the time was seen as a disaster. Well, when was Windtalkers then?
Uh that was uh 2002. That was in between MI2 and uh Paycheck. And that's Christian Slater and This is my favorite scene.
This is my favorite shot.
Coming up.
I love um I love this stuff of him getting his jacket off. That's crazy, isn't it? Really is. This here with Lance and he's on fire. Yeah.
>> Yeah, yeah.
>> And you kind of like go and the Look, and you kind of like go That's You kind of like go, "Why is the Why is this shot Why is this shot so cool?" And then you go, "It's your One of your lead actors and you've set him on fire with his face, you know, they haven't used a stunt guy. Yeah.
I think I recall reading that he he didn't expect the fire to get that >> The Yeah.
>> It licks all up his neck and everything.
It's It's like, "Fucking hell, he really did it."
Cuz they've covered him in that gel to stop him from >> But that's the I think that's the safety measure rather than part of the plan.
What I read, and you never know if it's true, is that his like his his cuff was meant to catch fire and then he does the the dramatic removal of the jacket. But yeah, the whole [ __ ] thing went up, which no one was expecting. But then they always tell those stories even when it's true even when it's But he doesn't break character, do you know what I mean? And he is just he's just an actor and he's he's on fire.
It's [ __ ] nuts. You You wouldn't You wouldn't do that.
He's got He's got the gun upside down.
This is a bit they cut it down quite heavily in the US cut, so but now it's like how it's supposed to be. So many bullets.
And then finish him off with a kick as well. Here we go. Icing on the cake.
Swack.
Finally got that cigar out of his mouth.
And he did the Van Damme helicopter kick as well. Yes.
>> Amazing.
>> Come on.
>> Amazing.
And the other guy comes along and he's like, "Give it a rest, pal." It's just our shooting the guy with like another whole clip. He just He's like He's like a like a somebody's not played a first-person shooter and just waste all their ammo straight away.
>> [laughter] >> I love how Hafþór Júlíus Björnsson hitting the ground then scared a dozen or so pigeons.
Cuz so far they've been quite cool about this massive gunfight happening right by them. That hasn't scared them at all.
And this guy's just popping up like a video game like at least the enforcers or something, you know.
Oh, this is great, this bit. Fires the arrow. I'm going to hide.
Straight through.
Ah.
Lovely jobly.
Badass.
What What if the guy sees her? He goes, "You [ __ ] bitch."
>> [laughter] >> He turns shoots him in the groin, doesn't she?
>> [laughter] >> These are the worst henchmen in the world. I know. It's It's like Under Siege 2 where everyone's too old to be a henchman.
>> [laughter] >> But every Every time one of them runs out of ammunition, he looks at his gun confused.
Like that's not meant to happen.
But But you know, like in the script it's like, "Oh, we we It ends in this warehouse." And then they've got all these Mardi Gras things. It's just like, "Well, that's just free money." Do you know what I mean? You just stick that on the screen. And it's like all of a sudden you've got a really interesting finale. Oh, is that how it So that they literally like went to shoot here and then found all this stuff in it? I think it was something like that. Or they Or they found them all and then they just dressed it with them. But it was kind of like they They haven't made these things. They're like Mardi Gras floats.
They are They're shooting the rodeo as the saying goes. Oh, here we go. Two guns.
Let's waste this ammo. Here we go.
John Woo. Kick him out of the way. Next guy.
>> [laughter] >> Why don't you kick him in the face?
Who's this guy with the sunglasses that's being shot?
I've never He's He's It looks somewhat familiar. I think he's He's played another, you know, I I keep thinking how a bunch of these henchmen, they're normally the kind of people you recognize, but I don't recognize any of them really.
>> Oh, I think I might I know what I recognize him I know what I recognize him from.
Hard Target.
>> [laughter] >> There's moments coming up, you know, when he is up against Vosloo and then they do the backs against the wall and they split down the middle so you got Van Damme on the left and Vosloo on the right and and it's like that was again used in Face/Off.
I'm not sure if it's used in Broken Arrow, but I think that's also stemmed from >> Tango & Cash.
>> He's a >> [laughter] >> Vosloo like a must have been half older than Killers, right?
His job with the classic John Woo traits, you know. But I think it was at the time, you know, it's because not many people had seen these kind of things he'd already done in his Hong Kong movies. They all seemed to kind of fresh to American audiences. So, oh my god. Well, it's totally fresh. It's, you know, they didn't make they don't make action films or they didn't make action films like this at that point. Mhm.
Yeah.
Like John Woo in the '90s was like a huge revelation, you know. Yeah. He completely like you know, he's completely different from a Tony Scott or a Mike Michael Bay. This is like from Face/Off, right? When they >> Yeah, I've never even thought about it before, but this is like in Tango & Cash they have exactly this scene and they're blatantly copying it from John Woo. I've never really thought about that.
The the cuz this is a really common scene, isn't it? The two the the two antagonists and the protagonist and they they talk to each other. That's the key.
That's the John Woo thing, isn't it?
They have like a They have a bit of banter.
>> While they're reloading. Yeah, it did there's a quiet moment while they banter and reload and then and then this.
He [laughter] shoots the guy back throws a grenade. It's great.
They must have a scene like that in Assassins as well.
Yeah, I bet there is.
This is brilliant cuz he got massive explosions. Van Damme jumps out the window, slides under the table, and then just bam bam bam bam bam shoots Vosloo from underneath.
So well executed.
>> [laughter] >> So excessive is Oh, it's great.
There's a door just there.
>> [laughter] >> Now he's got to jump through it. Oh.
>> [laughter] >> Oh, dear. No wonder the MPAA were like, "Oh my god."
>> [laughter] >> I'd love to have been in that first MPAA screening.
But you you see they can get it's so over the top and ridiculous.
It you you couldn't see it as excessive violence. You just see it as some sort of like I don't know. Some sort of parody of it.
>> It's the Robocop thing, isn't it? It's like >> It is, yeah. It's >> start cutting it out, it gets more violent.
Yep. Yep. Spot on. There's also the type of um gunshot and gunfire we're getting, and it is like it's that Paul Verhoeven style. The muzzle flash is huge, the noise is scary, the damage is serious.
It's like There's There's different ways to do a gunfight on there, and this is brutal.
I might imagine seeing this in theaters like DTS surround sound. It would have blown your mind.
I want to ask I say I don't think I've ever seen this the Prince Charles kind of show it.
Maybe they have, I don't know.
But it would be pretty sweet to see it projected.
Oh.
I was outside the Prince Charles the other the other day, and there's a still got that massive poster of Tommy Wiseau above it. It's It's really cool, man.
There's nice They've got some deal though that they they they can only play it there. Yeah. Yeah. That no no one else in London is allowed to screen The Room because he's got an exclusive deal with I interviewed Tommy Wiseau once.
Did you? He's He's interesting, isn't he?
>> [ __ ] awful.
>> [laughter] >> Was that for your radio show?
>> Yeah, it was a low point.
>> [laughter] >> I used to be better than when Van Damme got to flex his muscles as he took his shirt off.
Is there anything in this room that isn't explosive? Everything that gets hit with a shotgun explodes. This is action movie, mate. Everything explodes.
>> [laughter] >> Even clouds.
You've got all these barrels that are like just launching up in the air.
And all the papier-mache's been soaked in gasoline, I think.
Just wasting ammo there. Paper really does explode.
>> [laughter] >> Does when Jean-Claude Van Damme shoots it, anyway.
This is a bit weird when they keep fading in between Yeah, this This caused a lot of confusion as well cuz apparently there were a lot of dissolves in the original cut and because that's the way that they did it in Hong Kong and still do in a lot of ways. But they But American audiences apparently were confused because they It's associated in the West with going into a flashback.
So, apparently this scene here baffled everyone in particular cuz it looks and it is a bit odd. It is quite confusing.
It's supposed to create um you know, sort of make you disoriented.
>> a It's a woozy. It's meant to be a woozy. But But it doesn't really need to be in slow motion cuz you know Mhm. This bit here.
Flips through the flames.
I then Lance Henriksen just goes flying back now. Love it. Look at that.
>> [laughter] >> That was great.
I think this this film is definitely Van Damme is most coolest I think on screen, you know. I've I've been sleeping on this movie to be honest most of my adult life. I didn't I didn't remember it being especially good and then I re-watched it last year and did like it a lot more but it really does stand out, doesn't it?
That's great.
It's great but like Lance Henriksen, you know, you don't really get a lot of really super great villains actors, you know. Mm. Who's in um Who's in Sudden Death?
Oh, it's Powers Boothe. Oh, Powers Boothe, yeah, yeah, he's dead good.
Yeah. It's either It's either Powers Boothe or Stacy Keach, isn't it? It's um Uh but yeah, he's he's good but he's kind of like he's not Lance Henriksen, you know what I mean?
More of a string puller.
I don't know cuz he's cuz he plays a cop. He's kind of he's sort of become corrupted. So, he's he's not just like Lance is is just pure evil, I think.
But Lance's face is just incredible, right? And Powers Boothe is kind of like, yeah, cool.
Well, I think Powers Boothe in in Sudden Impact is is kind of playing it straight as well whereas Lance Henriksen's definitely got his tongue in his cheek.
Yeah.
Powers Boothe in U Turn, you know, he's um quite a nasty character, isn't he? So.
Well, I I love him I love him from Deadwood cuz he's in Deadwood which is the the only modern TV show I really love and he's absolutely awesome in that. I like Powers Boothe. He's great.
But But But Lance Henriksen is is chewing the scenery without winking at the audience.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
So, he's playing it straight, but it's huge. Yeah, he's he's playing it over Yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe that's the wrong take. He's He's playing it over the top He's rather than tongue-in-cheek.
And he's got a really sort of deep kind of like powerful voice as well, you know.
So, that's all that smoking Marlboros probably over the years given that sort of Yeah. Gravelly voice. He's got an amazing voice.
As soon as he As soon Yeah, here we go.
>> [snorts] [laughter] >> I love it.
Go on, Van Damme looks just like Party Boy from Jackass then.
>> [laughter] >> Party Boy's great.
Oh, he picks that blood out. That is great.
>> [snorts] >> Gah.
Give him something else to jump over.
Yes.
>> [laughter] >> All of his circus skills are coming to light.
Good kick to the face. Oh.
Oh, that sound Is Are they the That's not the Indiana Jones sound effect, is it? Or the punch.
>> Yeah, it it sounds like that. One of those really deep >> [laughter] >> I don't know who I don't know who did the sound design on this. I don't think it Certainly not Ben Burtt.
I'd love it if he has a flashback to a moment he's not seen.
>> [laughter] >> You know, he was Wilford Brimley gets stabbed. He was Ah.
Grenade in the trousers in a minute.
>> [laughter] >> It's another great slow mo.
The clip off the grenade.
It's over.
>> [laughter] >> This annoys me.
What? The grenade in the trousers? When he Whoop. Just take it out of YOUR TROUSERS. THROW IT. THROW IT.
>> [laughter] >> He like Why are you doing that? Why are you doing that? Throw the [ __ ] thing, you stupid [ __ ] Pardon me.
That's a good whoops.
>> [laughter] >> It's a bit like James Woods' death in specialist, right?
Yeah. Oh, yeah. What did he give it a whoops as well?
>> Doesn't he get like a grenade down the trousers or something? It's really similar, isn't it? Yeah. I can't remember now. His one is great cuz he's like a pinball machine. Like he He lands on a bit and then he gets blown over here and it's [ __ ] Yeah.
>> [laughter] >> Oh, poor old Wilford Brimley. Look at him.
It's weird seeing him without his glasses.
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
>> [laughter] >> Oh, all of this is like kind of constipated singing at the end. Born on the bayou. It's Creedence, man. It's Creedence Clearwater Revival. Love Creedence. [laughter] A great song to [ __ ] And of course, Creedence finishes off Die Hard 4 as well, doesn't it? With Fortunate Son.
It does. Yeah. That's Yeah, good point.
>> That's cuz cuz they cuz that's John McClane's favorite band, isn't it?
Credence.
And Justin Long has never heard of him.
I don't even know what is that in Die Hard 4? Yeah, they're in the car and he goes, "What sort of music do you like?"
He goes, "Credence." Or something like that. And then at the end they play Fortunate Son. Ah, nice. It's the best bit of the film, to be fair. The closing [laughter] credits cuz you're like, "Oh, wow, that was great, right?"
>> [snorts] [laughter] >> Oh, yeah. I I enjoyed that. I don't Like I said, it's never really been on my radar this movie, but it it's like the last two times I've watched it, it's leaped up in my estimation.
Yeah, it's one of them films that I always want to rewatch and then I just never get round to it. And but I love it. I Yeah.
I think I I think I I prefer it to Face/Off and I probably prefer it to Broken Arrow now.
>> Oh, so is it now the top >> much better than Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think it's much >> The top of the John Woo American movies.
I haven't seen Broken Arrow in a while, but but I think you're right. Like having having Van Damme actually, you know, being able to do all of those own stunts and stuff or most of his own fighting.
Cuz Van Damme ain't going to do like a a flip in the air.
>> [laughter] >> Yeah, I it still holds up, man. Also the first American studio film major American studio film directed by an Asian.
Which is >> Yeah, yeah.
worth mentioning and kind of crazy when you think about it.
>> Kind of bonkers, yeah. It's bonkers.
That's like American studio picture rather than independent. It's slightly different. But but yeah, but then also Asians were treated really badly and you know, like if you even look at Tango & Cash, I mean, the amount of racism in that is just is like is horrific, really. But um Uh yeah, and you know, kind of like um there was still like communist, you know, communism and America and it was it was all about they then sort of like broken down the like Hong Kong films were becoming popular in like the early '90s in in in America. And I think they're always more palatable than Chinese films as well.
Hong Kong Hong Kong films have have always had a like a an international objective up to a point. And now the Chinese film industry seems to work slightly Yeah, I don't know. I don't know, but there were a few there were a few notable examples immediately after us cuz it's only a couple of years later that Ang Lee made Sense and Sensibility.
And Wayne Wang made Joy Luck Club.
So it's kind of like once the once the door was opened, plenty of people came through it. Well, there was action and then there was then there was arthouse stuff. Yeah.
And so Ang Ang Lee kind of went the arthouse route. Well, the reason they got him to do Sense and Sensibility was because they wanted they wanted kind of like you know, um like that perspective. Yeah, and sensibility, yeah.
But like a foreign sensibility to kind of like make sense of Jane Austen. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Make it accessible to people who aren't British as well. But there's there is cuz I've [clears throat] done I've done working on this Bruceploitation project at the moment.
I've done a lot of research on this subject.
And there's really strangely or I'm really surprisingly, there was a like there were actual there were female Asian women filmmakers in Hollywood in the like the 1920s going back that far making Chinese language independent films, but not in the mainstream. But I was really surprised to learn that there was Yeah, a whole community of people making movies. There would there would have been the immigrants that were brought over to do the the rail the rail lines.
Yeah. The high target again as I've mentioned I think in other commentaries is like it's a high concept idea. And the '90s was great for that high-concept stuff and taking, you know, directors from other countries and get them over to work over here to bring something new and fresh.
Seemed to be the way to go and uh It's one of them tropes, isn't it? Like Die Hard. It's kind of like, hey, it's it's people being hunted. Yeah, yeah.
And and it was popular around this time as well, wasn't it? Cuz Surviving the Game was around the same time. I remember loving that. And it's only a couple of years after Deadly Prey, remember? Deadly Prey was around this point.
>> Royale? Battle Royale was 2000s.
Um there's Judgment Night as well, right?
Yeah. Yeah, of course, yeah. And um and and [ __ ] uh Trespass. Yeah. Yeah.
>> We should do Trespass. We should do Trespass.
What a film.
>> think I've I don't think I've seen that.
Ice T, Ice Cube, Bill Paxton, William Sadler.
Both the Bills, both the Ices.
Well, everyone, that's the end of the commentary. Hope you enjoyed it. Me and the boys will be back soon with another podcast in the coming weeks.
Take care and goodbye for now. Bye. Adios.
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