Owen Jones Pushes Gaza Blood Libel

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-18

[00:00:00]Hey guys, welcome back to another Jewish Crash Out. I'm Jack the Jew, and on this one, we're going to be looking at a debate that happened between um Owen Jones, who we've seen before, and somebody else named Natasha Hdorf um who is the legal director of UK Lawyers for Israel. Um I don't know if any of you guys have seen her. If you guys haven't, look her up on YouTube. She's really good at what she does.

[00:00:29]Um, and yeah, so let's get started with uh the interview. Oh, and if you guys like this kind of content of reacting, of watching these kinds of this kind of stuff and not crashing out by yourself and crashing out with other people. So, you know, for me, I you guys are really helping me out. So, I'm not just banging my head against the wall, but if you guys want to watch more of this kind of stuff, please like and subscribe and comment. It really helps the channel grow and for you guys to watch more of this. So, and then make sure to hit that bell so that you guys also get um anyways let's keep let's continue and uh watch this.

[00:01:07]>> Well, with the appalling rise in anti-semitic violent incidents that we are seeing which is clearly >> one thing before they before we start they're they're basically talking about it was after the stabbing um that happened in London I think a week ago or so. Um, and they're discussing whether or not should the UK ban uh pro Palestine marches because a lot of them have been using from the river to the sea which is you want to erase Israel from the face of the earth and also Kaibar Kyra al Yehood which is a old timey Muslim chant that uh that is basically we're going to kill the Jews.

[00:01:49]So, um, yeah. So, there's it's been very anti-Semitic and it's threatened a lot of Jewish communities and they've actually, even if they were peaceful at certain points, are very disrespectful and will march in front of synagogues or in inappropriate times like after the uh other stabbing or other Yeah. other stabbing in uh in Manchester in on Yumkipur where people actually died. So, um, so that's the question in the UK and we're going to watch them discuss it.

[00:02:23]Owen Jones and Natasha House Dorf and, uh, let's watch.

[00:02:27]>> On the rise in the UK, 2025, the most dangerous year for British Jews in terms of anti-semitic attacks on record. There is more and more focus once again, not least because the prime minister has brought it into play and the leader of the opposition, Kami Beno, on the role of marches uh, for Gaza. Some people call have called them hate marches uh with regards to what is said on them.

[00:02:49]There is the allegation we heard it from Heidi Alexander this morning the transport secretary that they have a radicalizing effect uh in against Jewish people. This is of course something much contested not least by some Jews themselves who are on the marches. Let's get a conversation about this going with Natasha House, barristister at six pump court chambers, legal legal director at UK lawyers for Israel charitable trust.

[00:03:09]I know in Jones you'll know of course Godardian columnist who himself has attended some of the marches. Thanks so much for joining us both this morning.

[00:03:15]Natasha, can I just start with you? Um what do you say to the argument that although of course some appalling things are said on these marches and it is not uncommon to hear appalling things said on marches, >> I also don't think it's just not the language. It's also that they have certain marches in certain times in certain places to antagonize Jews and also that Jews when they're walking through these areas don't feel safe. And you know, we we've already seen there's been footage of UK police telling uh UK Jews to put away your Yamaka, put away your Meended because it's too uh antagonizing to the protesters. So again, your their own rights are being um squashed. So >> it would be an infringement on our rights to protest too grave to prohibit.

[00:04:09]>> But what what about the Jewish rights?

[00:04:10]That's the other.

[00:04:13]>> Well, I disagree. And of course, at the center of this is a balancing act, but it's one that uh has been pretty controversial since these marches, and I would call them hate marches for reasons I'd be happy to explain, um since they began over two and a half years ago. I remember actually being in a panel uh with Lord Ken McDonald and Sir Jon uh for excuse me Jonathan Hall KC uh the independent review of uh counterterror legislation already in November 2023 if you can cast your mind back to that time. Uh and the general consensus I have to say on the panel is that the police weren't doing enough. Um I certainly have not accepted throughout this period that there were simply insufficient powers. I know we've heard um from um uh police commissioners uh all over the country complaining that they need to be given more powers by legislation in parliament. But the fact of the matter is we saw a complete change uh at least to an extent in the way that these uh marches were being policed with respect to this incitement and these vile calls for genocide against Jews after the horrendous attack on Yum Kipur on Manchester Jews which was of course swiftly followed by the tragic incident um another mass attack mass killing of Jews at Bondai Beach. So the change in the police's approach uh wasn't prompted by >> and still the next day they had protests anti-Israel marches you know throughout the UK >> a change in legislation but a change in attitude and I think your previous caller Jod put it exceptionally in explaining what these phrases mean something that has been evident to anyone with a familiarity of the Middle East but of course also to the British Jewish community from the very beginning and unfortunately the level of ignorance we have seen in combating these calls for genocide for the attacking Jews and of course for um globalizing the inifard which it's important to note we also saw on the 77 bombings that globalization of the inifard doesn't of course just include Jews it includes ordinary British citizens as well and it's high time we take the proper measures the home office the police uh and also members of the public in calling this appalling rhetoric out >> I understand that >> here here Sashan, before I go to I just want to push on one thing, but if if there can be no doubt that there are some things that are said on these marches um that will be appalling and I'm sure the police ought to deal with them. But if you are a person who feels passionately does not agree with the idea, >> but the police don't deal with them.

[00:06:39]That's the issue.

[00:06:40]>> Genocide against Jews does not agree with the idea of violence against Jews.

[00:06:44]Indeed, you stand per fiercely against that sort of appalling racism. But you still want to register your profound abhorance with what the Israeli government is doing in Lebanon and Gaza.

[00:06:56]If these marches are are banned, >> well, what are we doing? Defending ourselves. Yeah.

[00:07:00]>> How are they to do so?

[00:07:02]>> I think this is perhaps the most critical aspect of our conversation, the most important part of this discussion, which is what the driver of this wave of anti-semitism that we have seen is. And the critical driver that is not being discussed, Lewis, is the false information being spread regarding Israel. And this is something the government um does have powers to do something about. Of course, in a democratic society, people are free to express their views. Um even if I might consider them to be abhorrent, but there are things the government can do with respect to uh ministers spreading false information about Israel, which are undoubtedly driving many uh well-meaning people to attend these marches. Um, >> but could it be that things the Israeli government itself are doing are driving people to attend these marches?

[00:07:47]>> The use of the term genocide over and over again is a blood liel against Israel to incite people to march against them because would if there was if you knew there was a genocide, wouldn't you march against it? But there is no genocide. That's why it's a blood liel against it's the oldest trick in the book of anti-semites. Well, there I would actually push back and challenge very strongly because what I continuously hear on these marches and in the media, the allegations that are supposedly underpinning this action have no basis in reality. They are, if you will, the modern version of the blood liel. Now, you may say to me, well, there are lots of well-meaning people who believe them. I'm sure in the Middle Ages there were many well-meaning people who'd been deceived, who believed that Jews targeted children to use their blood for religious ritual. Uh, that was not the case then. It is not the case.

[00:08:35]Now the fact of the matter is if we draw a parallel perhaps this may assist um Lewis the the Allied forces of course in the Second World War killed millions of Germans. Um nobody called that a genocide. Nobody called brave RAF pilots conducting bombing raids baby killers.

[00:08:53]And yet we have these tropes and these blood liables being circulated with a complete refusal to acknowledge and in many circumstances I'm sorry to say broadcast the reality which is and I I say this as someone who's been on the ground >> on the LBC the the channel that this interview is this debate is going on.

[00:09:13]They have multiple times talked about or had people on and not pushed back on when they say that it's a genocide happening in Gaza >> in Gaza witnessing the measures that the IDF takes along with me members of uh six NATO armed forces very senior generals colonels majors among them I've got to bring her in and I should say actually in a second >> yeah she she's t she's making too much sense we got to cut her off >> well well there were people who criticized British government action in the second world war and in terms of being so extreme particularly the attacking who who there were people what 5% of UK public was against bombing raids in Nuremberg and and uh and Berlin >> civilians and so on but let's not get distracted by that Owen um Jones from the Guardian um the you know what the accusation is here it is that these are hate marches and you've heard what Natasha has to say what is your response >> the world's being turned on its head these are the opposite of hate marches peace marches marches opposed to Israel's genocide against the Palestinian people. It's >> and there it is. And then he uses the word like it means nothing.

[00:10:18]>> The expression of opposition to Gaza being wiped from the face of the earth, over 100,000 people being killed according to multiple academic uh studies. Uh you know, let's she says Jenna. I mean, just be clear. Natasha is making it clear that her view is scrutiny and opposition to Israel's crimes is anti-semitism. And she >> No, that's not what she's saying. the use of genoc genocide that word and I've also used the word there's a holocaust in Gaza where they always use like to use the terms that we used in in our trauma in Europe uh the actual holocaust um as against us so that that's what we're against. There is no ethnic cleansing, there is no gore crime, there is no starvation, there's none of this and still they use the terms >> as herself said. I've read her article on the spectator that accusations of genocide are plut liel. Omar bov is an Israeli academic. He's the dean's professor of holocaust and genocide.

[00:11:17]>> And there's just as many experts that go against him and disagree with him.

[00:11:21]>> But he's at Brown University. He says, "I have been teaching classes on genocide for a quarter of a century. I can recognize one when I see one. Amos Goldberg, professor of Holocaust history at the department of Jewish history and contemporary jury at a Hebrew University, Jerusalem. I can go on.

[00:11:34]There's a whole list, but I should say of Israeli specialists who dedicate their lives to uh scrutinizing uh and researching genocide. Thousands of Jewish people attend these protests.

[00:11:44]They hold placards asserting their Jewish identities. They wear their keeper.

[00:11:48]>> Yeah. Because they believe that being solidarity with Palestinians and everybody else will keep them safe and it won't.

[00:11:55]>> They wear orthodox Jewish clothing. that includes >> that's nura Carta who are actually that are against the state of Israel existing in the first place >> survivors like the 88-year-old Steven Kaposh I interviewed Rabbi Hershel Gluck last week who received an OBE for his work on intercommunal relations he's the >> I could name just I'm not going to but I could name just as many experts and rabbis and everybody else that disagree and say that there is no genocide and once again if object Objectively, you look at the numbers, it doesn't make any sense. And it's not a genocide.

[00:12:32]>> Yeah. The Shamrin, which protect Jewish civilian um communities in northeast uh London. He said to me that so many Jews attend these protests that he thinks is a higher proportion of any minority, any community in this country, including Muslims. Jewish people are the co-organizers of the protests. It includes the national secretary of the Palestine Solidarity. Again, that doesn't mean that that's true, that some guy said that >> campaign, every single protest has Jewish speakers. But what is very clear here is >> again, that doesn't mean that it's not hateful against Israel.

[00:13:05]>> Natasha believes that any scrutiny, any opposition to Israel's crimes is unacceptable, is essentially an attack on Jewish people, and she wants to shut that opposition down. Um, and and I'm afraid to say that's not going to happen as long as is as as long as the Israeli state exterminates Palestinians, commits >> the exterminate. Wow.

[00:13:29]>> War crimes, cooks children alive in their tents.

[00:13:33]>> Cooks children alive in their tents.

[00:13:35]Wow.

[00:13:36]>> But then missiles starves people. We are going to keep on marching. And it is turning the world on its head to say that opposing murdering people, that opposing killing Palestinians is hatred and extremism. But that's not what's happening. There's context to what is going on that you guys are not talking about or don't even want to reference because then it obviously puts your point of view and narrative in the negative.

[00:14:02]>> And if we're going to talk about just finally what's inflammatory, you can support openly Israel.

[00:14:09]>> Literally what you just said was inflammatory.

[00:14:11]>> Wiping Gaza from the face of the earth.

[00:14:13]And we're having no debate.

[00:14:15]>> No one said that. that's not an Israeli policy.

[00:14:18]>> How that's extreme uh or dangerous.

[00:14:21]>> And also if if there are ministers that have said that in the Israeli government, it doesn't matter. Again, look at the actions of the IDF on the ground. They are not perpetrating a genocide >> or hateful. But if you march opposing civilians being murdered alongside your Jewish fellow citizens, that makes you a hateful, dangerous extremist. The world's turned on its head and people >> again. No one ever said that.

[00:14:48]>> Don't buy it.

[00:14:49]>> Natasha, uh, you've heard the charge there, which is that you are simply trying to shut down scrutiny of Israel and what it's done in Gaza and is doing in Gaza. What is your response?

[00:15:00]>> Well, he's certainly not familiar with my work and my commentary on this and certainly perhaps as unfamiliar with the facts and the reality on the ground.

[00:15:07]what we've heard in these series of projections um and uh ill-informed ones as the rhetoric of a Hamas uh propaganda machine. This is an internationally prescribed terrorist organization that is putting out fake numbers, fake casualty statistics in uh seeking to capture the minds of unsuspecting people like Owen Jones and plainly they've been extremely successful. But it doesn't take away from the reality and these uh genocide so-called genocide scholars that have been quoted. It's a shame that many of them or in fact all of them that were listed don't seem to appear prepared to debate these issues um in public. It is public discourse. It is opportunities like this. Well, certainly not with me and colleagues who have put out contaminations.

[00:15:51]Well, I'd be happy to go up against any of them. But I look, in fact, I was faded faded down. So, let me continue. Um what we have heard is that manifestation of the blood liel 100,000 killed by whom? We've heard this consistent um attempt to blame Israel for all of these ills when in fact the reality of the situation is that it is Hamas and those other internationally prescribed terrorist organizations.

[00:16:19]Let's not forget the IRGC uh is now being supported on the streets of London in similar hate marches. It is these organizations that these misguided individuals are marching to protect and defend who are responsible for the humanitarian crisis for the killing that Owen and others so pretend to lament.

[00:16:37]And it's the pretense here that is most damaging. That is what is having this mis uh information uh spreading uh effect. Um if we are to engage with the reality of starvation was just thrown out. We have put out report after report assessing the levels of aid that were facilitated in the Gaza Strip and proving each and every one of these tropes wrong.

[00:17:02]>> Natasha, let's Owen respond to what you've said.

[00:17:04]>> Okay. Okay. I mean, look, you made a completely outrageous claim that I'm part of the Hamas.

[00:17:09]>> I I just I just Yes, you are.

[00:17:11]>> Absolutely. You are a Hamas propaganda machine and I just wanted to show recently the Gaza people, the people of Gaza did a marathon. So I just want to show you like as they say that there's genocide and famine. I I've never seen after uh the Holocaust a you know even during the Holocaust this would have to happen because they say currently there's a genocide in Gaza. So I've never seen this in World War II and they're they're running and they look all quite healthy and there a lot of them and they're running. I'm not going to play any because it might be copyrighted but I just want to they make a good point.

[00:17:58]This is the fastest recovery from genocide and famine in history. And also, I wanted to point out a lot of Egyptian flags, which is what Gaza is. It's a part of Egypt. There's a there's a Egyptian flag and they're on their bikes. He looks like he's healthy.

[00:18:17]Everybody looks fine to me. So then then I also have already taken a little break. I want to show this is the number of incidents according to the youth.

[00:18:27]this organization in the UK number of incidents of anti-semitism this is what it used to be before 2023 October 7th and you why all of a sudden the Jews are massacred and you get an increase of anti-semitism to this day I still don't understand but you can see it's not gone down it's gone down but not anything and it's actually slightly increased on October 2025 not a surprise Um, and yeah, so we're we're this is the the and you can also what I want to point out is all these protests, this is when they're happening. So I wonder these hate marches if there if there's a correlation between this increase of anti-semitism and the marches.

[00:19:18]>> No basis or evidence for that. And if we're going to say that anyone who says that huge numbers of people have been murdered, exterminated, killed, whatever you want to say, by the Israeli state, the economist, the economist backed Israel's assault on Gaza. They did their own detailed estimate of the number of people killed in Gaza. And their upper limit, and these are out of date, this was last a year ago now, was 110,000 people. If we are to believe my esteemed guest the >> even 110,000 which we have to imagine let's say 40% of that is kamas let's say even 50%.

[00:19:55]40 whatever it's still out of two million people that's still not a holocaust or a genocide words mean something. Economist magazine is now part of the Hamas propaganda machine as regards the well do you know what >> they the economist use statistical modeling not confirmed body counts and it and it did not conclude genocide I'm guessing in the economist in this thing so yeah and even pro Israel publications estimate over 100,000 everybody says probably it's over 100,000 but still 50% of that or 40% of that, let's say 40 to 50,000 kamas people and their family members, which I'm sorry if you're a family member and you're next to them.

[00:20:43]You're the terrorist. You're putting them at risk and yeah, then you get targeted. And so again, no Holocaust.

[00:20:51]>> I multip you objected. You objected to me uh interrupting you. All I would say is Natasha, please go ahead. carry on arguing that the likes of the economists are part of the Hamas propaganda machine because all you are doing is discrediting your argument. And I would just add by the way you said you mentioned for example about these academics like Omar Bto the dean professor of Holocaust and genocide studies at one of the most prestigious universities on the face of the earth.

[00:21:22]He >> I don't know if Brown University is that anymore but >> dedicates his life every single day of his life studying genocide. He is one of the most pre >> and an expert can be wrong and still there's many experts that disagree with him.

[00:21:37]>> Eminent scholars of the Holocaust. He knows this subject in a way you a spokesperson for a pro-Israel lobbying organization does not. And I'm afraid to say you can say by the way >> it's not a lobbying organization.

[00:21:51]They're UK lawyers defending Israel. So >> you can you can say by the way I disagree with him. I don't think they're right. But you are going to have to stretch everyone's credul to say that Israeli scholars of genocide who dedicate their lives to studying genocide are talking total errant nonsense. You must have to >> Yep.

[00:22:11]>> to accept that there must be some legitimacy in that argument. The truth >> No, I don't. I they experts can be wrong. Look at co >> is Natasha Israel has committed a live stream genocide. It has butchered vast numbers of people in front of the whole world and that's why >> and half of them and the a lot of them were Hamas 40 to 50%.

[00:22:34]>> In America for example twothirds of Jewish Americans think Israel's committed war crimes. 40% >> again I don't care they can be wrong.

[00:22:42]>> Think it's committed genocide. Half of all Jewish Americans under 35 believe it's committed genocide. You >> and Jewish Americans just voted for Mamani in New York. So they're not the same as Jews in Israel.

[00:22:54]>> Have to then say they're part of the Hamas propaganda. Natash, let me just some of those Jewish voices for peace.

[00:23:01]Yes, they are doing uh Hamas propaganda.

[00:23:04]>> Nash, let me just put that to I mean it is true. I mean the the the polling that Owen Jones has quoted there, we see that. Are you is it is it your contention that you know vasues of the western population they are all too victims of the Hamas propaganda machine?

[00:23:19]>> Yes, they have been manipulated into believing something that's not true as in there's a genocide in Gaza.

[00:23:25]>> Well, I don't know how reflective these polls are of the reality and I think there are multiple reasons we need to treat them um with uh care. But yes, this is center the central of the point that I am making which is that this propaganda from internationally prescribed terrorist organizations that you know Owen Jones has given another glorious rendition of of rabbiting off uh is what has been adopted by a great deal of the mainstream media not to speak of course of the social media accounts that are spreading uh these harmful tropes and untruths about the only Jewish state. The reality is and there is information out there which I have published um including with uh colleagues at UK lawyers for Israel and many others who are engaged in this subject that prove all of this wrong.

[00:24:07]The problem with proving a negative of course is that those that are putting out these falsehoods can't be bothered to engage with it. And it is the oldest trick in the book to say look at this Jew who is criticizing Israel when those criticisms >> true that being anti what the Israeli government is doing is not the same as anti-semitism. Well, this is the >> what what is Israel doing? Can we be be more specific?

[00:24:29]>> This is the critical distinction. Um, I have not heard these individuals raising aspects of Israeli government policy that they disagree with. I have heard them uh putting out falsehoods and saying that is the reason that they object to Israel. That is when anti- uh Zionism and anti-semitism are ultimately the same thing. It is the modern acceptable form. But it's it's not criticism of Israel to say that you object to things that the Israeli government has done when it hasn't done them. I I I think what we all need to be doing right now is demarcating Jewish people and the actions of the Israeli state. That is what anti-semites want us to do. They want us to conflate Israel's crimes with the Jewish people. And it's also what people lobbying and supporting the state of Israel want us to do. Now, as regards, by the way, the figures, the Lancet, the most prestigious medical journal on the face of the earth, they estimated that by January 2025, well over a year ago, 83,000 people had been killed. They said that was a very conservative estimate and that obviously excludes all the deaths in the year and and nearly a half since we can listen to the figures of UK.

[00:25:32]>> Okay, I knew he was going to bring up the Lancet and I want to point this out.

[00:25:35]This is from Wikipedia which isn't pro-Israel um is very open to everybody and everybody writes whatever they they think. But even here, this is after the Lancet report said they're they had three to five 15 times higher and they had a a number back in July 2024. They said 186,000 Gazins probably died, which would have been 10 10% of the population at that point, which we haven't even gotten there yet. And then as a result, three days after the publication of the letter, the Martin McKe posted on Twitter, it must have been an author or something that the letter has been greatly misqued and misinterpreted and clarified that 186,000 figure was purely illustrative. They just wanted to imaginate imaginate. They wanted to imagine uh uh hate against Jews.

[00:26:33]So that that's that's what he's quoting >> lawyers for Israel or we can listen to Israeli genocide scholars and then preeminent uh medical journal on earth and we can say well actually we have a >> again the Lancet said that that didn't happen and with experts there's other experts that disagree that there's a genocide. Anyone with a brain and eyes know that it didn't there's no >> democratic right in this country which our ancestors fought for great cost.

[00:26:57]>> Oh very briefly we should be fair enough to protest Palestinians.

[00:27:01]>> Sure. Is it not fair enough to say that one of the things that we are often told especially by the left is that with regards to racism perception matters. It is to some extent in the eye of the beholder how people feel and you cannot deny that at least elements of these marches are making many of our fellow citizens British Jews feeling extremely uncomfortable indeed scared. I I think it's this mainly the increase in anti-semitism and also this little 2021 mark is is what happened in in the last Gaza war and then 2014 was the war before that and you can see like they got excited after October 7th and the anti-semitism came out >> briefly could you answer that point >> there's no doubt at all that there's massive fear at the moment amongst Jewish people not least because of the rise in violent attacks. What I would say is I would hope they would listen to Jewish protesters who join these protests, who help organize these protests, who speak at every single protest, >> who scream globalize the inifat. Yeah.

[00:28:03]>> They stand in the best tradition of Jewish people who have always been over represented in struggles for liberation.

[00:28:10]>> They they represent the tradition of capos during World War II and the Nazis >> and for equality, which has often driven anti-semitism, I would say. So all I would say is please speak to Jewish protesters. Speak to the likes of Namod who organized Jewish people in this country to oppose uh Israel's genocide.

[00:28:27]>> Don't listen to him >> and and listen to Israeli scholars of genocide as well.

[00:28:32]>> Natasha Hoff there barrist at six pump.

[00:28:34]>> I agree. Listen to the ones that say that there is no genocide. So that was the debate there. Um again too short. I think they must have should have had it a little bit longer but again you get the point. Um, I just wanted to Ryan McBTH put out a nice little thing about our uh, professors young who talks about the Sha Shabotian Sabotian uh, I don't know the Shopites Frankus Jews and all these conspiracies of cabals and yada yada yada. So he has a whole thing about how professors Yeah.

[00:29:11]is actually probably a actual Communist Party plant.

[00:29:16]>> People keep writing me about this Professor Xiang guy. Let me tell you something. Number one, he is not a professor. The guy teaches at a middle school. Number two, he doesn't even have an advanced degree. He has a degree in freaking English. I have more degrees in subjects that are actually hard.

[00:29:34]>> Number three, he is a plant for the Chinese Communist Party. It is illegal to access YouTube in China. Yet somehow this guy has a YouTube account. How do you think that happens? It happens because he is put up to this by the Chinese government. And now this guy is on diary of his CEO. You need to write this company and tell them that they just got played by a Chinese scop.

[00:29:58]People keep writing me.

[00:30:00]>> So there you go. So there's that guy.

[00:30:02]And let's let's drop in on another uh debunking and crash in on another debunking of uh another anti-Israel influencer, Assan who we'll have to cover at some point in the future. Um but this is from unpacking Israeli history and um I thought they did a good job here. So let's question on that.

[00:30:24]>> But it was just ethnic cleansing from the start.

[00:30:26]>> That's Hassan on pod from the start.

[00:30:29]>> But it was just ethnic cleansing from the start. That's Hassan on Pod Save America giving his take on Israel's early history. And then he brings in Albert Einstein.

[00:30:37]>> And my assessment on Zionism as an ideology is not that different from Albert Einstein's cuz when he saw Dear Yasin and the violence that the early Zionist brigades were engaging in before the IDF existed, before Israel existed, he wrote about what Zionism was turning into. And he warned that what he was seeing was ex >> I I just want to point out what what Assan is doing here is using certain facts in history. there are certain like kernels of facts and blowing it into a you know different proportion or lying about it or mischaracterizing what the actual what the actual person or invent or the lancet for instance with Owen Jones what it was actually trying to say and they mis you know mischaracterize it and basically lie >> exactly what the Nazis were doing and he said if we do not have a commitment to bationalism if we do not have a commitment to the people that are already living there. The atrocities that I'm seeing that is going to turn into exactly what the Nazis have done.

[00:31:39]And he was right. On the surface, this sounds authoritative, right? Einstein, a person who embodied intellect and conscience in a single human being. And is saying, I basically agree with Einstein on this. Let's start with what gets partially right. Einstein did have real reservations about aspects of Zion's politics. He was deeply troubled by right-wing Zionist movements, especially the Urgul. He had serious problems with manaken and Einstein before Israel was established had advocated >> and that's the kernel of truth >> for a bational solution a single shared state for Jews and Arabs so per isn't inventing Einstein out of whole plot but what he leaves out is the full story in 1921 Einstein traveled to America with him whitesman the head of the world Zionist organization on a fundraising tour he raised money for the Hebrew university across the United States in 1923 Einstein visited mandatory Palestine and delivered ed one of the inaugural lectures at Hebrew University in Jerusalem. He spoke a bit clumsily and heavily German accented Hebrew. He wrote afterwards that his heart was quote warmed by the dream and idea of a Jewish state. In 1947, just a year before Israel was founded, he wrote to Indian Prime Minister Javar Halalu trying to persuade him to support the Zionist movement. This is what he wrote.

[00:32:54]Long before the emergency of Hitler, I made the cause of Zionis a mine because through it I saw a means of correcting a flagrant wrong. Long before Hitler let that sink in. In 1951, he hosted David Benorian, Israel's founding prime minister, at his home in Princeton. And in 1952, when Whitesman died, Benorian offered Einstein the presidency of Israel. Einstein declined not because of any political reasons but because in his own words he quote lacked both the natural aptitude and the experience to deal properly with people and to exercise official functions which is a polite way of saying I could explain the cosmos but I do not want to chair the meeting. He also said explicitly that he was quote deeply moved by the offer from our state of Israel our state of Israel.

[00:33:38]And one final striking detail. At the time of his death in April of 1955, Einstein was preparing to deliver a speech marking the 7th anniversary of Israel's founding. He died before he could give it. His final draft contained these words. International policies of the Middle East should be dominated by efforts to secure peace for Israel and its neighbors. He died preparing to celebrate Israel. That is the full picture. His position, as positions often do, updated when reality changed.

[00:34:05]Do you want to get the full story?

[00:34:07]>> So, that was pretty good with uh I don't know who's this who's this guy is. I don't know. So, but unpacking Israeli history is always a good I watch it and I recommend watching it. You're going to like it. Um and also if you want to if you like this kind of content, like and subscribe and comment even if you disagree. I always try to reply. Um, and thank you guys for crashing in and on that and crashing out on that uh debate with Owen Jones and Natasha.

[00:34:36]And uh yeah, so I'll see you guys in the next one. And make sure again to subscribe and like and comment. It really helps the channel. And I'll see you guys in the next one. Bye.