The Search for Heather Teague: DNA Breaks and a Witness Revisited

Added: 2026-05-12

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[00:04:53]>> So, welcome back. And we are back with Miss Sarah Teague. And the reason why we're back is a lot of you have seen our post.

[00:05:03]We got some DNA results in or lack of DNA results if you will.

[00:05:10]And Sarah, if you want to, we'll just go ahead and give that update on what was sent off, why it was sent off.

[00:05:18]>> Okay.

[00:05:19]>> Just kind of start there and we can and we'll go from there.

[00:05:23]>> Okay. After 27 years, the Kentucky State Police sent Heather's bathing suit bottoms and her towel to the DNA International Lab in Florida.

[00:05:33]So, correspondence between uh the lieutenant prior um he let me know that at 9 months the lab had requested more funding. At 11 months, however, the FBI stepped in and told the Kentucky State Police to remove those items from Florida. their testing could ruin the evidence.

[00:05:56]Okay. So, Rezy Dum, the special prosecutor, called to let me know that on February the 17th of last year, 2025, she had taken those items and sent them to Bodie, which is a private lab in Virginia. So, the deals and our family, you know, kept calling. I I would call weekly uh the BOD lab to find out if there you know was any updates. I actually had have the lady uh the lab text personal email so I would you know message her. Um, so I was told by the Bod Lab that we would have to get a court order to get any results, which led me to believe that there, you know, could be results because she, you know, let me know that we had to get a court order that may be just standard. I don't know. So, I contacted my attorney and and told her, "Well, in the meantime, my friend John, he decides he's just for the heck of it going to file an open record to see what they would give him on on open record to Frankfurt." And here he gets the DNA results from the Florida lab and the Bod lab at the time.

[00:07:13]>> The results from the Florida lab, when were they or when the when was that testing done? Oh, it started December the 5th, 2022. After 27 years, they were sent to the body to the Florida lab.

[00:07:26]>> So, do we know for a fact that the bathing suit bottoms they found was Heathers, >> Rick, that is a very good question. I have been asking for those bathing suit bottoms. See, when uh it was Henderson Police Department that called us August the 26th of 95 in the late afternoon to ask us on three different calls if we knew where Heather was. Well, on the third call, they let us know that Heather had left her car abandoned on Newberg Beach. Well, we had never heard of Newberg Beach. So, we took off there and as we were going, we actually passed a state trooper. Well, by the time we got there, you know, Henderson Police Department wasn't even in the picture, and it was Kentucky State Police. And David Osbbor took Heather's bathing suit top out of a Manila envelope, and you know, it was wet and I smelled it and held it. It smelled like suntan.

[00:08:24]But I never got that I never got her bathing suit top back with her other uh items of clothing, of course. Um, her wallet, her social security card was never found at all. So, the bathing suit bottoms years ago, I was shown a picture because I asked Lieutenant Osborne, you know, I wanted to physically see them, but all they showed me was a picture and they were f they were spread out, so I didn't get to see the outer even what color, you know, they were. And he told me then that they had been tested for semen and and there was none. That that's the only test that had been done.

[00:09:06]>> They just tested for semen only. They didn't do touch DNA or or any other test on it.

[00:09:12]>> Well, I'm talking in in 95, you know, that was that was that was a test that had been done. So when when I got the results, it shows plainly and and and I want I want everybody to know that I let Mrs. Dum and the Kentucky State Police know that my friend John had gotten the results through an open record and I wanted them to explain it to me. I I sent both of them messages saying, "Could you please explain, you know, this to me?" Because this is what um the findings show that I'm that that I can tell is that there were skin cells found at the Florida lab on the exterior waistband of Heather's bathing suit bottles. They were preserved and stored. However, they were not sent to the Bodie Lab. The only the only thing that the Bodie Lab requested or that somebody requested the Bodie lab to do was sample on the crotch. So now we put all this together that at 11 months the FBI stepped in. The FBI stepped in after those skin cells were found. So our questions now is whose skin cells were found that they weren't compared to Marty?

[00:10:35]>> Yes.

[00:10:36]>> So So my question is actually a couple questions. The skin cell evidence, why did they not test it? And what other evidence do they still have that hasn't been tested for DNA? you know, from 1995 to 2026, there has been huge uh advancements in in testing DNA.

[00:11:00]So, I understand it takes money from from the claims that I've heard it for watching, you know, these true documentary series, not these falsified shows or whatever. But just knowing that, you know, it you've got to pay the people to do this, this, and this, and you know, maybe is there not enough funding to test all this evidence? Why would they not test the skin cells?

[00:11:30]against >> all the suspects.

[00:11:33]>> Yeah. The thing is at nine months now testing had already started from December the 5th, 2022 is when they got them. I don't know, you know, which day they started the testing, but 9 months of testing had already been done and the lab had requested more funding, but the FBI steps in at 11 months and that goes right along with the time frame that these skin cells were found. Now this this report was dated January of you know this year. So while the news has been calling the state police and while you know Kesha deal has been calling they were told that there were no results. So now here we get the report back unexpectedly which I always give God the credit and they've had them back since January.

[00:12:23]So, they didn't contact you in any way saying that the results were back.

[00:12:30]>> John submitted a foyer and that's how he got them.

[00:12:35]>> An open record. Yeah, >> an open Yeah, >> record.

[00:12:39]>> Yeah, I think a foyer applies to the to the FBI and we may should have filed one of those, but I've got one pending for over a year. I haven't received any reply. Yeah. I see the Bodie lab told us and my attorney was already working on uh getting a court order when my friend John filed an open record and a total stranger to the deal family.

[00:13:01]>> When When did the bathing suit bottom sit get sent to get tested?

[00:13:07]>> December the 5th of 2022. That's when they were sent sitting down there.

[00:13:12]They exumed Marty Deal, but didn't they just send something else to get tested somewhere? DNA testing?

[00:13:22]>> The red carpet? The >> I I don't know. I I felt like earlier this year or maybe even last year, they had sent something else, something new.

[00:13:32]Or maybe I'm just kind of >> Well, I I think what you're thinking about is on February the 17th of 2025 after Heather's bathing suit bottoms have been at the Florida lab since December the 5th of 2022.

[00:13:45]That's when uh Ramsay Dum stepped in and she called me and said, "I've taken the Heather's bathing suit bottoms in her towel and they are now being sent to the Bod lab in Virginia. It's a private lab." And of course, you know, I'm sure that costs money, too. But, you know, for us to be told we're going to have to file a court order, you know, to get them and then my friend John files it in 4 days. He gets the total report.

[00:14:16]>> So, why did they exume Marty Deal?

[00:14:20]>> That's a very good question. Uh Kesha was told, Kesha and Joshua, Marty's son and uh wife were told that it was for DNA >> or >> that they had lost they had lost his DNA. I guess when you know when you >> So they needed more DNA to compare to whatever.

[00:14:42]>> Yeah. I mean, common sense is going to tell you if Heather was raped >> in the wooded area, she didn't put those bathing suit bottoms back on. Now, this is another this is another alarming thing is I had to file open records to get I to get pictures of the crime scene. I have pictures of inside of the deal trailer. I have pictures of one picture shows Heather's bathing suit bottoms in a clump of like just greenery. They're they're laying there.

[00:15:12]I can't really tell. They're they're red, you know, the they red plaid. There was never any flowers on them that Tim Wthall said. Um, and then in this other picture, Rick, they're just laying in the sand all wadded up and they appeared to be tied with something. So, they're not in a baggie. And we know from Lieutenant Osbborne and Tim Wthal. Tim took a boat across the river. He met L, well, he calls him Dave. Um, they found Heather's bathing suit bottoms. and it was three weeks.

[00:15:47]>> So during let's go let's get into this.

[00:15:51]Let's get into the that second interview with with the only witness in 2004, November of 2004. He's describing watching the state trooper directing the state trooper over the mound. The state trooper comes back and waves his arms like he had found something.

[00:16:12]What did he find? Did he find the bathing suit bottoms then or why did he why did he wave his arms and say that he's got something or what?

[00:16:24]>> There's a lot of that that that's a of another question that's not been answered. And what people need to know is that for 20 years, the picture that this Tim Wthall, the only eyewitness, had told our family, was how he and his wife were eating lunch and she actually saw a man standing near a tree. So she called him in. Now the time varies, 12, 12:30, you know, usually his story is like noon or 12:30. and he look starts looking through his telescope and he sees a man creeping down slowly to where Heather lay and that he's whispering something to her. Uh something shiny he described which insinuated a gun and then as he's as this man is talking to Heather, he's wrapping her hair around his wrist and he jerks her up. Now when when she's lifted up, her bathing suit top fell and she grabbed her towel which was >> f because in that interview he says that he can see that her bathing suit top is not tied right initially and it's been a little while since I listened to the 911 call that he made. Did he say anything about the four-wheelers running back and forth in that 911 call?

[00:17:44]cuz I don't remember I don't want to say he didn't but I don't remember if he did >> but in the second interview nine years later >> what what and people forget I understand that cuz I can I can barely remember yesterday but he now he's talking about a group of guys on four-wheelers that he remembers that but he didn't say that in the beginning because I felt like maybe and this is just my own opinion those group of four-wheelers could have tied into, you know, they could have been very well involved, right? So, wouldn't that be something you would want to tell during a 911 call, hey, there was a group of guys on four-wheelers and then all of a sudden they disappeared and then this happened. Well, what you got to remember is what he told us for 20 years is not what's on the the call.

[00:18:34]See, that that alleged 911 call, which there was never a 911 call, but that's what it's labeled. that was hidden and kept from us for 20 years. So after 20 years, his story had always been that u there was there was a four-wheeler that had wrecked, one four-wheeler that had wrecked near Heather and that when she was lifted up, her bathing suit top fell and she held on to the towel to cover herself and her hair was wrapped so tightly around his wrist that she couldn't scream and her little feet were dangling from the sand. That was what we had. That was the story we had heard for 20 years. So when Sergeant Pagan played the call that he had found while he was looking for the call with the wig and mosquito netting which >> Okay. So let me stop you there with the the mosquito netting in the wig. Even in his 200 uh four interview, he doesn't mention anything about a mosquito wig or or any a a wig or anything like that.

[00:19:40]all the differences in that interview and in the call in in the story he told us and then even in the call that we heard after 20 years. It It's nothing.

[00:19:51]Now, he says in this 2004 interview that the man jumped on top of her, held her down. He jerked a towel away from her and threw it on the chair and the towel was found in the woods. So, how on earth can Detective Rasco sit there and interview this man and know the story that he told us was not the same, you know. Well, of course, in 2004, we had not I had not heard the, you know, the 911 call at all, but Tim Rasco knew the story that they knew.

[00:20:26]>> So, you didn't even hear that 911 call until when?

[00:20:30]>> 20 years later.

[00:20:32]20 years later. And I didn't I didn't know it.

[00:20:36]>> Huh?

[00:20:37]>> Had you requested to hear it?

[00:20:38]>> No. What happened? We went to court um in 2017 to let the judge know that we had heard a call in two we were played a call in 2008 um that would had the wig and mosquito netting. And there were four officers who heard that call also. And I had I had been filing open records, Rick, since 1996.

[00:21:01]Uh it's a Terry Edwards handwritten. And I've got I've got them all here asking about telling my concerns about Marty's appearance and wanting to hear the call that you know that this man was the last person to see Heather. I wanted to hear that call. So I kept filing open records and in 2007 we went to court. This was 12 years after begging filing open records trying to get that call. uh the state police pulled us over and said, "Would you settle for the time and location of the call?" Well, at that point, 12 years, we were desperate for anything. So, they gave us 115 to Indiana State Police, not even to call to state police.

[00:21:43]>> Okay. So, let let's let me let me kind of figure this out here. And I'm not 100% sure where if I was to call Indiana State Police at the time of Tim's location, would it go to like an hour ahead? Right. Because once you reach a certain point there in Indiana, the time changes. So could that 115 time be, you know, the time change time?

[00:22:12]>> That was the time he called. No, I I think uh Newberg, Indiana and and and the Kentucky side are on the same time, aren't they?

[00:22:20]>> Right.

[00:22:21]>> I'm talking about the the Indiana call.

[00:22:24]>> Well, this is is what in was in the August 30th issue of the Gleaner. It says the witness claims he called 911, but there's no record of any such call.

[00:22:35]So, had he called 911, it would have taken him to War County Sheriff's Department. And if you notice in that >> that's written what you just read or what you just said is that >> that's a newspaper article >> claims >> that he made a call but there's no record. So the news is reporting that >> he claims he made the call but there's no record of it.

[00:23:00]>> Right. That came out four days later.

[00:23:03]>> Did the news do I guess research to try to get a hold of that call?

[00:23:07]>> No. I I can't even um I It says that Sheriff Bruce Harg Grove uh who was the sheriff at War County at the time, he he's the one that gave this statement.

[00:23:18]You know, the witness claims he calls 911, but there's no record. I don't know. I never could. Uh of course, it took me years and years before I figured out that this man wasn't telling the truth. You know, um you know, he claimed the back of Marty's head was blown away and there wasn't an exit wound and other other things. So that's why I started, you know, recording our conversations.

[00:23:40]So I don't know where that information came from except uh Sheriff Harrove made it plain that had he called 911, that's where the call would have gone.

[00:23:53]Okay. So, let's move into the I want to kind of talk about that 911 call that he makes to Kentucky State Police and then you know his initial interview with KSP, not the 911 call that he made. Now, what what I did get out of it of the 2004 interview was that he Tim says he's aggravated because he feels like the dispatcher is just kind of tossing him around and asking him all these questions, right? Um being being a first responder and and being around this stuff it it's my problem where I'm having trouble is why does he wait so long, right? He thinks it's a it's a boyfriend or they're playing a joke on her or you know to to an extent I can see that.

[00:24:56]Right? But after the fact, he's on top of her. When when he sees the gun or an item that he thinks is a weapon, that's when he should have called in my opinion. Right. That's where I'd been like, "Okay, this doesn't seem right.

[00:25:09]I'm going to call."

[00:25:13]When does he actually get interviewed for the first time? Not the 911 call that he placed at KSP, but when is his first initial interview with KSP? Were you able to open that inter or hear anything on that interview?

[00:25:30]>> Okay. Right. And then that's what he talks about is he takes the boat across in the, you know, the river to the beach.

[00:25:37]>> And so he's interviewed on the beach right there, not back in office to where they can take detailed notes.

[00:25:44]>> And you can barely hear this interview.

[00:25:47]It's uh >> Oh, it is recorded.

[00:25:49]>> It It's just labeled 826.95. I I sent that to you. I didn't know if you could open it or not. You can barely hear it.

[00:25:55]>> I don't know if I seen it because I would have opened it, >> right?

[00:25:58]>> He he says uh on on the beach I I they claim it's on the beach and he's talking to a female and he's saying the man had a big old beer belly. He was over 200 lb, uh bushy hair and a beard. And that that's about all you can can make out.

[00:26:17]But when I read that 2004 interview, you know, he there's nothing in that interview that is on the call that that they kept from us for 20 years either.

[00:26:30]The man, of course, he told us for 20 years, you know, the man crept down slowly. And when I heard the when Sergeant Pagum played that call for us, I had to stop him because nothing I was hearing after we had waited 20 years to hear this call. He he says in the call the man charges down, jerks her up, yanks her up by the back of the hair of the head and there's something silvery insinuating a gun and then she >> and then in 2004 he says the guy takes like 10 minutes >> sticks it in her face. Yeah. He sticks the gun in her face. The man jumps on top of her to hold her down. She lifts her head. I mean the whole interview is just absolutely it's nothing like what we were told for 20 years or what's see I mean it's not only just not what we were told for 20 years it's not what's on the call we waited 20 years to hear and nothing is like that on the call they created see the call that was created in 2007 you know is with a female and he's saying just just calmly you know uh the man who took Heather was either had dark bushy hair and a beard or he wore a wig and a mosquito netting. And in this 2004 interview, he goes into such detail of a story that's it can't be true. You know, the man didn't sit on top of her and hold her down. Her towel was found in the woods. So, how can a how can a trained KSP officer hear this man talk about this with me calling and filing open records trying to find out what really happened that day and this KSP knew that everything this man was saying was just a story. I mean, it appears like he's allowed to participate in the manipulation of the sketch on day four.

[00:28:29]You know, as soon as he says he saw a man with dark bushy hair and a beard within the first hour, 24 to 48 hours, they should have done a sketch and they didn't. And as everybody knows, Marty De was in no way fit that description.

[00:28:47]>> Okay, let's talk about that description real quick. Let's talk about Marty De um being bald.

[00:28:53]>> What evidence do you have that confirms Marty De was bald?

[00:29:01]>> I have presented three jail records. I have a letter from his mama dated on his last birthday, August the 21st or 22nd.

[00:29:10]I always get that mixed up of 95.

[00:29:12]Anyway, 4 days before Heather was was abducted that she he was walking in her backyard. He had just gotten out of jail and he was totally bald. I have a picture of him bald. Dated July the 15th of 95 at 122. But his mother says he is so bald she didn't even recognize him as he was coming up her backyard.

[00:29:36]>> Okay, so let's do this.

[00:29:39]Four days until Heather's abduction.

[00:29:44]Marty's family, mom, whoever says he's bald.

[00:29:48]How long until Marty ends his life is that period from uh he he was killed. I I like to say, you know, his life was ended because the evidence that I have, you know, with the two shots heard and arguing and yelling, that was uh from August the 26th to September the 2nd.

[00:30:15]So, a week.

[00:30:16]>> Same year.

[00:30:17]>> Oh, just a matter of days. A matter of days.

[00:30:23]this.

[00:30:25]All right, let's let's break this down because they they they deem Marty the suspect.

[00:30:34]Witness describes long bushy hair, beard, blah blah blah. Marty commits suicide or as you assume or you the evidence that you say you have his life has ended one way or the other, >> right?

[00:30:49]How come?

[00:30:51]What does the medical record say? Is there any details of how Marty looked?

[00:30:55]How come that the state troopers didn't say, "Wait a minute, Marty doesn't have any hair."

[00:31:01]Right.

[00:31:03]Is there anything saying what Marty looked like at that time?

[00:31:07]>> Yes. Had they had they pulled up his They used his 94 driver's license. I mean, that's when he Well, that the sketch is identical, you know. I mean, it's obvious. What I'm saying is 4 days leading up to Heather's abduction, Marty is bald. There's witnesses there. You know, there's evidence he's bald. Literally a week, your hair is not going to grow bushy and you're not going to have a bushy beard in in a couple weeks time.

[00:31:34]>> That's why they added the mosquito netting in 2007. The realtore call was taken out of evidence the same year that we went to court in 2007. It was taken out of evidence and taken to Doug Crowe.

[00:31:48]Now, I didn't know all this until I got the Kentucky State Police's files, and it shows plainly that on August the 17th of 2007, the the the realtore call that Wthal made was taken to Doug Crowe, who is a creative specialist in Frankfurt. He kept that realtore until September the 24th of '07, and they played it for us August the 27th of '08.

[00:32:14]So, after I get the state police's files, um, well, it was July the 29th of 2023 that I opened this mislabeled file and found and heard Bill Pulp telling Kentucky State Police that Marty's bald.

[00:32:31]I mean, he told them on day four before Marty ended up dead. Marty is bald.

[00:32:39]Marty has kept his hair short. And I've got the transcription. I've got the the interview, everything transcribed, and it's plain as day. They knew on day four. That's what when I heard that call, that interview with Bill Pope, telling them what I had literally fought for 28 years, filing open records, presenting jail records, five or six statements from family and friends that Marty was in no way fit that description. the jail records, the picture when he just got out of jail. So when I heard Bill Pope telling them on day four, and I never heard, it's not in their files. Did they mention Heather's name? There was a hostage negotiator there. The search and rescue team was there. They're listed.

[00:33:28]There's at least eight officers who heard the yelling, the arguing, and the two shots. But if they were interviewed after to to to state who was yelling, who was arguing, was Heather's name mentioned, those pages are missing. Do you think?

[00:33:48]>> So why why haven't those people that heard this came forward and said, "Hey, that's not what happened or this is not what I heard or this is where where are those witnesses?" Well, when you've got Kentucky state policeman conducted interviews, when the the only eyewitness tells a fabricated totally different story, and then when you've got a mother fighting and fighting and standing up to the state police saying, "Marty's bald.

[00:34:17]Marty's Marty didn't do this beginning the week after his death." That's why that's one of the reasons I can claim this is one of the largest political coverups in the tri-state history. They knew on day four.

[00:34:33]I see. We could have and we should have had our Heather back on day four because all evidence now leads to that Mike Shelton was driving the Bronco and Mike Shelton went to a lady's home the next morning driving a red Chevet which I mean the sketch another sketch was done from the red chevet Heather being held by her hair by a man too big for the car. So, you've got all these people that know what happened that day, but just like Tracy Deal, she's lived in fear this whole time because she told, you know, state police that Marty, well, we don't know that she told that Marty was bald. I am actually trying to find that that record right now, but Detective Babs interviewed her and ironically that little file's missing, too.

[00:35:30]So, what we know right now is Marty Deal, if he was involved at all, which I believe he was. I believe when Mike Shelton picked him up at 3:00 in the afternoon and Mike Shelton's story was that Heather was accidentally run over. I think Marty helped Mike after.

[00:35:53]And bless his heart, he he sat there in that trailer with them turning the lights off and on, calling, doing everything they could to agitate him when when his attorney was telling them Marty's bald. Marty has kept his hair short since his arrest for marijuana.

[00:36:12]And Bill Poke says, "Let me go in. Wait till daylight and let me go in and the first thing I will do is ask Marty about the victim."

[00:36:22]So, if these officers heard Heather's name being mentioned, uh, Marty Deal knew that his brother-in-law was blaming him for the entire day. He knew the Kentucky State Police and Tim Mo had drawn his sketch, his face from a 94 driver's license. So, here you got Bill Poke telling the police, you know, Mart Marty didn't fit that description. You think it changed their strategy? No. for them to surround him and agitate him to the point that well you you've got the file. It says a shot was heard then yelling and then a few minutes later another shot was heard and then Ernie Green came out or his dad came out and said that Marty's dead.

[00:37:11]>> Right. And then the ballistics of the bullet doesn't match the weapon.

[00:37:17]>> No, you you've got one spent shell casing. So, did Ernie Green walk out with the gun that that uh shot Marty?

[00:37:24]Because a.22 revolver, I'm told, doesn't eject the shell casing, and that was the gun that was that on in the KSP pictures of the residents of the deal house. The gun is laying on the uh bathroom vanity and Marty was shot at an angle. I've got the autopsy report and you were asking about that. It says I mean his hair was like a quarter quarter inch little little I mean it's plainly they knew on day four Rick they knew on day four and I didn't find out for 28 years that they knew on day four that everything I had been telling them and bringing them I mean it takes a lot of time to get statements from you know a jailer from a a butician from Marty's uh actually it was Tracy Tracy and her sister went to see Marty in jail in July. And the the sister gave a statement how shocked they were when they went to see Marty and all of his long, beautiful hair and beard was gone.

[00:38:26]All these years while I would stand in front of them with that laminated sketch and the jail records, they would laugh at me, shame me, and deny everything.

[00:38:36]Well, they've still not admitted it.

[00:38:38]Now, this is what Kesha deal has been told to on two different occasions, and she's willing to give you a statement.

[00:38:45]John Webb, she's willing to to give, you know, to put it out there.

[00:38:51]Detective Lashley or Sergeant Lashley with KSP told her on Monday and Tuesday of of this past week, Marty's DNA is nowhere to be found on Heather's bathing suit bottoms. But of course, they're going to say he still remains a suspect. And that's fine because had they questioned him on day four, we wouldn't be here right now. We would know exactly what happened to Heather.

[00:39:18]And I don't understand.

[00:39:20]>> There's been some movement in this case over the last week or two, right? Some things we could talk about, some things we're not going to talk about. But let's bring up what we can talk about for, you know, you mentioned that anytime you try to reach out, you're being referred.

[00:39:42]Can we talk about that?

[00:39:44]>> Yes. Yes, I I we can. Um, of course, for Lieutenant Aaron Prior was appointed my only point of contact at post 16 in 2022.

[00:39:56]I have never heard his voice.

[00:39:59]I call I leave messages and I get I get nothing. But this is what has happened.

[00:40:06]The news has even been calling to get a statement from Corey King who is the public relations uh officer and they've been telling them that there are no, you know, we're waiting on results. And then of course when the DNA report came out and and the first thing I did of course was let Kesha and Joshua know. I didn't want to put anything out there until I let them know. And then I absolutely called Kentucky State Police and Ramsay Dum and I said, "Would y'all please take a minute and explain this to me because this is what has been explained to me."

[00:40:46]You know, and I'm saying, why would you not?

[00:40:50]Whose skin cells are on the exterior waistband of Heather's bathing suit bottoms? They're preserved. Why weren't they sent to Bod?

[00:40:58]>> Do they still have those skin cells?

[00:41:00]>> Yes.

[00:41:01]>> Well, I'm hoping that they, according to the report, they do.

[00:41:08]>> And I may have overlooked this, but has Heather's Heather's case hasn't been closed.

[00:41:12]>> No. Oh, they they never have closed it.

[00:41:15]No. Okay. I didn't know because I know sometimes they'll in order to do certain things they'll close out the case or whatever but this one has not been closed.

[00:41:24]>> No. Now >> they think more you know their suspect was Marty Deal. Uh >> they know better >> that that they know they knew on day four he wasn't bald. And ironically, the same year that this 2004 interview was done, Rick, that's the same year that Tim Wthall went to Ohio and picked Chris Belo from a photographic lineup not once but three different times. They covered his face. What I'm told is the detective in Ohio, Scott Thomas from Madonna, Ohio, where Chris Belo was the suspect in five other uh missing women who all have the green eyes and long hair. And as you can see on the sketch, you need me to show that laminated poster again?

[00:42:13]>> You want to? Yeah.

[00:42:15]>> Um the body of Chris Bo is identical to the composite sketch. And common sense is going to tell you Tim Wthos saw the body and Chris Bo had the long hair that could have been swirling just like he described. But see, there was no suspect until the Bronco was filmed. There would not Marty Deal would have never been a suspect had KSP and Tim Walth not seen the >> So while you get that there's there's something else that kind of struck me in his 2004 interview or is the fact that you know there's a call out there or an interview out there that states a mosquito netting in a wig. But if that was the case, I'm a hunter. All hunters know once you put a mesh mosquito net, turkey net, face net, face mask on, you're not going to be able to tell jawbone lines, how the nose, you >> But he gave a very, very detailed, >> in my opinion, and I'm not an expert, and this is all just me kind of just theorying things out there. Um, how did he give such a good description of somebody in a mosquito netting?

[00:43:32]>> See, that's when my daughter Holly literally laughed out loud when they played that call in 2008.

[00:43:40]We got We had already I mean, I hadn't gotten the statements from people, but I had already found the jail records. I had already, you know, brought evidence to state police beginning the week after his death that I was being told he was bald. My daughter Holly literally laughed out loud and that's when that fell apart because now that call along with the recording of the meeting is gone because that was our question.

[00:44:06]>> You don't have the recording of the mosquito netting call.

[00:44:09]>> Oh no, it disappeared. It disappeared.

[00:44:12]But the thing is upon open record, many open records, the attorney general finally came back and said we do not have a copy of it. which means they don't deny it exists. And the sad thing is is the state police Cody Weber stood up in front of Judge Shepard in 2017 denying it ever existed.

[00:44:37]But he resigned two years later from KSP. And I don't think he had any idea what they were telling him to do that day because that is exactly right. How could you give distinct facial features?

[00:44:52]Of course, by that time, we had already put together at 18 months that Marty Deal's 94 driver's license had been used to create the the sketch, you know, but even even in the 2004 interview, he says, "Uh, oh, Clay does a good job." He said, "Now, I did have to tell him to narrow the chin down a little bit >> because his face was too rounded or something." And and I wish I would have thought because I have three different types of mosquito nettings that I could have put on and you know and and again we got to remember that Tim's not in front of him. Tim is across the river.

[00:45:29]Now don't get me wrong, I've had a couple of telescopes that's pretty powerful >> and you can see some really like one of my favorite things to do is to look at the craters on the moon and you know that's way farther than what the witness was to where Heather was. So it is possible to get that clear because he starts looking through binoculars and then moves to the telescope, right? And then he even mentions that his wife even picked up the looked through the binoculars or the telescope at one point and was like whatever that's weird.

[00:45:57]>> But I can't get past the more I thought about this, I can't get past the description that he gave. If this guy was wearing a mosquito net on his face, the details would not have been >> No, >> in my opinion, and I'm not an expert and I can't sit here and and but just being a hunter and being around people that hunt and seeing other people and myself in those, you can't tell if the guy's got a sharp jawbone or, you know, >> nothing else matches Marty Deal. Marty was 5'10". He was 180 lb. Well, let's see. I don't know. Can you >> Yeah, just kind of hold it up a little closer.

[00:46:44]>> Okay. See, this is this is the sketch of the man. You see the body, the beer belly.

[00:46:51]>> There's no tattoos on that one, is there?

[00:46:53]>> No. But the thing is, and and I remember we talked about this last time. This is the way Marty De looked on July the 15th. Can you see that real clearly?

[00:47:03]>> Yeah.

[00:47:04]uh at 1:22 p.m. This was the day he was released from Webster County Jail. And >> so, how did his hair get to look like that?

[00:47:14]>> Oh, it didn't. See, but but look at Chris Bo now. Chris Belo did not get these tattoos. Look at the body. The body's identical to Chris Bo. And Tim Wthal picked him out of a lineup three times in 2004. And see, Chris Boowo's hair is pulled back in a ponytail. Now, had he had his hair down, his hair would have been swirling. And that's all that Tim Mo could have seen was was the body.

[00:47:41]And it is ident to Chris Belo. It's not Marty Deal in any way. And just just to know that they knew on day four and they put our family through this having to I just don't understand why in 2005 when the FBI came in to tell us to get an attorney to sue the Kentucky State Police Post 16 because the evidence they had taken from the Bronco was found 10 years later still not having been sent off. I don't understand why they didn't just stop it.

[00:48:13]I don't I don't know why they have continued to to let this to let us find out more and more and more that that nothing they've told us is true.

[00:48:24]>> I I know some police officers, some detectives, and they pride themselves in solving cold cases. Yes, >> they're very good officers that they work really hard and and they want to solve these cold cases because it gives not only the family a sense of closure.

[00:48:43]It's kind of it's a sense of oh >> honor.

[00:48:48]>> Yeah. That you know it's been going So you would think that after 30 years new officers come in you know is there new officers appointed to this uh case.

[00:48:59]Okay. So, we're going to come in and we're going to work and we're going to try to get this case solved. Uh, you know, it's almost are they being kind of restricted on what they can do. I don't I don't know. This is just pure speculation or is it just because everything that we talk about, everything that I have seen is actual documents, information that you have sent to me that you have received from KSP, from lawyers, from and I can't even imagine what your your file source looks like. Um, >> well, nothing nothing that I present is not without proof. I I don't make speculations. That's why when I got the DNA report, I wanted to contact Kesha Dale, of course, and Joshua first. But I wanted to I did reach out to to all the, you know, I said, "This is what I'm going to put out there." So, I I mean, I've got emails, and I think I've sent them to you. I said, "So, this is what I can conclude. Am I right? Marty Deal's DNA is not on Heather's bathing suit bottoms." So, let let me ask you this and and I'm not trying to defend Tim Wthaw because I don't you know only only thing I can go on is what the information that you have that you've given me. In his 2004 interview he states I made a pact with my wife and my kids or my family >> after only one year I will give them one year.

[00:50:25]H how does he get to choose if this is an ongoing investigation and I don't know the answer to this? I'm honestly trying to figure this out. I guess if he's a witness, he's given his statement. I'm done. I'm not doing anymore. And I guess that's his right.

[00:50:45]But you would think and I reached out I said I I reached out to him on on Facebook with no no response him or his wife.

[00:50:55]>> Um because I want I want to I want an interview with him. I want to talk to him. I'm not I don't want to accuse him of anything because >> I would I would love to talk to him again >> just to sit down and just have a conversation and say let's talk about what happened that day.

[00:51:13]and he'll probably tell me to go, you know, get lost, whatever. And and that's fine. That's his right. But I feel like I would want to help solve this if if I was that involved, the only witness I would want to continue. I mean, he took a boat across the river. He was there the night Marty uh ended his life or his life was ended, however that happened.

[00:51:42]an ordinary citizen would not >> I have a friend who's I have several friends who are police officers. I asked one the other day. Would a witness come to that situation talking about the night at Marty's home at the at the trailer? He was like absolutely why why would he? He's already said okay this is this this is and this his statements has been given. Why would he be allow He's like he wouldn't be allowed on the property unless he was like member of some search. I don't even know why search and rescue would have been there to be honest with you. Maybe rescue uh ambulance standing by, but other than that, I don't understand. You know, there there's and I know you have way more questions than I do. You've been doing this for 30 years, and I can't even imagine that. And I know people are probably like, "Dang, every time they interview, it's always the same stuff." But people don't understand that over the last few weeks there's been some things that's kind of trickling that the the you know that you you got a scale and that scale is starting to tip just a little bit you know and it's starting to go the other way and as bad as I would you know would say okay Sarah just let let everybody know we we can't do that right um things are happening things are moving and I believe soon. I think we're going to get more people that >> know information that's going to come forward. Um, a lot of the players of that incident of Heather's disappearance, you know, some of several of them have passed on. you know, um I I know people are are threatened or feel feel scared of law enforcement at times and they can be pretty, you know, kind >> That's what I've tried to let let Tracy Tracy know is that um I know she's lived in fear for 30 years, but if she would just let our family know what she saw in that Bronco that or the truck, she didn't say Bronco, what she saw in the truck that was such a mess. All she could do was scream. When I know that, you know, screams were reported to the Kentucky State Police at 8:00. I know the names of the neighbors who I talked to the neighbors, Joyce Trainer and Clarence Crowley. They told me they heard the screams and reported them. If Tracy would just tell us that, I would know if Heather was hurt, just something. And then you got Green, the uncle. He was in the trailer. Now, um, according to Kesha deal, uh, Sergeant Lashley, Detective Lashley told her that they have questioned Ernie Green. And I have asked, uh, a preacher man right there in the area if he would go talk to Ernie Green and these other people that have been named recently.

[00:54:38]Um, that has pretty much confirmed that Mike Shelton Mike Shelton did this and Heather, we may have a location for Heather's remains that did this coming week. I I can say that. That doesn't have anything to do with the other thing we can't talk about.

[00:54:58]>> Right.

[00:55:01]I I just it's it's just really and I I don't know your interactions that you've had with Corey King. Uh but I've I've kind of dealt with him in the past and he's always been really really good about, you know, getting the information, giving the information of what he >> always he always makes a statement to the news. He he's in my opinion and in every time that I've dealt with him, u he's always been like a super standup guy and he's done even back in when I was in the the coal mines, he would come and do some of our uh retraining that we would have to do every year and and his his part was always really fun because he had the cool stories and the cool pictures and the videos. Um, do you think there may be a reason why he's not maybe and I'm trying I'm trying to kind of just ride that line of maybe there's something going on.

[00:55:58]>> Absolutely. Well, >> he wants to say they want to say, but they can't yet. Well, it looks like he could say that, you know, in instead from what I'm being told by Celeste with the news and the and the other news reporters with 25 44 all of them. I called them the other day. They are being referred now to Frankfurt to Sher Baird who is the Kentucky State Police's public relations like Corey Kenya's at post 16. Then Sherry Baird is in Frankfurt. So, they're being referred to her. Now, John Webb said that.

[00:56:35]>> So, why are they being referred to her?

[00:56:37]Now, >> I was told by the news reporters that not only for the DNA results, but for just for Heather's case in general, they are now being referred to Frankfurt.

[00:56:51]>> Okay. So, you think maybe it's being looked at more at a higher state level?

[00:56:57]>> Oh, they're they're trying to do damage control. They have got positive proof that not only Marty Deal did not match that description, they can't deny any of that. They knew on day four Marty was bald and not not the one who did this.

[00:57:11]They can't deny the two shots that were heard and there's only one shell casing.

[00:57:16]They cannot deny this any longer. So they're in Frank they're they're trying to do damage control. They're there's no need. It's not going to work anymore.

[00:57:27]Everything they've done has backfired.

[00:57:29]And I've tried to tell them, I just want you to learn the power of God's word.

[00:57:34]Matthew 10:26 has been written on thousands of lavender ribbons for 30 years, 8 months, and I think 8 days today. And there is power and stated on God's word because the things that I have found, you know, I told you on July the 27th at noon, God gave me in 2023 those words plain as day, an undeniable truth is coming. They can no longer deny and they will have no choice but to tell our family. Two days later, that's when God showed me that mislabeled file with Bill Poke telling them that Marty didn't match. And you you can you cannot even imagine all of the years that just flashed through my mind of me me holding this sketch and presenting jail records and them looking at me and saying, "Oh, it looks like looks like he's got a tree growing out of his head or he's got his hair pulled back in a ponytail." And the jail records, uh, one captain said, "Oh, and and the jail records are capital B A L D." And he says, "That's but that I'm sure they meant brown."

[00:58:45]>> What What do What do you say to people that say, "Oh, maybe he didn't. Maybe he did have the hair, but he shaved it a couple of days afterwards."

[00:58:55]You have the proof. You have the evidence.

[00:59:00]And the Department of Criminal Investigation has all this. That's where the undeniable truths are right now.

[00:59:08]They can no longer deny. And now we're at the place to where and and and I've told you this before and I've told them this. Ramsey Dum, all the officers. And I hope and pray that these new officers, I hope and pray there's no way they can deny the evidence if they're any cops at all that they they can't continue this.

[00:59:28]They can't continue taking up for the previous officers. And I know that's hard. That's hard. But they knew on day four and we could have and should have had our Heather back. And that just >> So 30 30 years later, >> 30 years later, what are you looking for now? What what if I could what what is it that without being harsh or whatever, what is it that Sarah Teague wants out of all of this?

[01:00:01]>> Oh, I just want my Heather back. I just want her back. And I have begged them year after year. You know, they took me to court for harassment at 8 months for writing to Tracy, just begging her, just just tell me who was screaming, you know. And then 20 years later, I have to find out through a friend of Tracy's after 20 years of a picture in that empty lounge chair and Heather's still screaming at 8:00 that night.

[01:00:32]20 years later, I found out that those screams were Tracy's. And just to think back at eight months when they they came to I mean they let me know in the courtroom that day Rick that they were about to testify against me. I became their enemy as soon as I went in there just just like with Tim Wthal. He was there every time I showed up at post 16.

[01:00:56]I mean he was right there and I thought he was just my hero. And then little by little, you know, he started saying things like he went to the morg and and I've got this recorded. He says that son of a was laying on the a slab on the morg. He said gray brain matter was everywhere and uh the back of his head was blown away. Oh my goodness. And I even said on the call when he told me this. I said, "How horrible that you had to see that." And then I called the morg and talked to a lady named Betty and she said, "Um, all I'm gonna tell you is that didn't happen. Uh, by the time he got to the morg, he was already cleaned up and I met Marty's mother on year four." She and I met at the park and she said, she said, "Nothing in this report is right." She said Marty was bald. She said Marty didn't yell out, "I'm not going to do 20 to life." Of course, that's another part of the story that I have positive proof, but and I didn't want to get the autopsy report. I mean, I I could have gotten it before year 8, but I met her on year four, and if it'd been my child, I wouldn't want anybody else to, you know, so I I I asked her, "Was it okay to file an open record to get that?" And and I did. And they all knew on day four, Rick, that Marty wasn't the man who did this. and Sergeant Whitaker KSP stood at the cemetery August the 25th, 2025 the day before Heather's 30-year anniversary and told Kesha and Jenna Pike that Marty has always been their only suspect. Sarah Tig is crazy. And you want to come to Post 16?

[01:02:40]I'll just show you the whole entire case file. And here I've had to file open records just to locate Heather's bathing suit bottoms.

[01:02:48]>> Who who told Kesha and Jenna that?

[01:02:52]>> Sergeant Whitaker. The one who was at the cemetery. The one that I have recorded. Uh the last recording I had of him before he he was before Lieutenant Prior replaced him. We're talking about Marty's hair and the DNA. I was like, "Well, the DNA, you know, won't be Marty Deals. There's no way." Well, how do you know that? And uh and then he says uh well we we talked to somebody uh a week before this happened and Marty one of Marty's co-workers is what he says on the recording and he had the long hair then. And they all knew on day four. I mean it's just like it's a game to them.

[01:03:30]Just like this 2004 interview.

[01:03:34]How can Detective Rasco sit there and let him go on and on? Of course, that they never thought that I would They never thought I would hear that that recording. I mean, they never thought that I would hear that. Well, it was the recording. I had it transcribed. They never thought I would find that. They never thought that that the 911 call would ever be found. And had Sergeant Pagan not been looking for the call with the wig and mosquito netting. And you know, he was immediately taken off Heather's case. He was demoted for doing the right thing.

[01:04:12]He was literally taken off Heather's case. He called me and said, "They've taken me off Heather's case." And his his he was searching for the wig and mosquito. didn't call because he knew that, you know, I was so concerned that how on earth could, like you said, how on earth could this man give distinct facial features through a mosquito net?

[01:04:34]>> Right. So, we we've got we've got the 911 call on the day.

[01:04:40]You have the interview on the beach.

[01:04:44]Now, we have the 2004 interview in KSP uh at their station, their office at Post 16 or where wherever it was.

[01:04:54]Somewhere in there, that's three different recordings. Somewhere in there, they have all three of those.

[01:05:02]Somewhere in there is a recording or a phone call or an interview or something about a mosquito net and a wig that nobody can find.

[01:05:11]>> That's the call they created. I've got their KSP41 that proves I mean God just when I tell you >> KSP41 what is that? ASP41 is a list of their evidence and it it shows plainly that you know like I said on August the 17th of 2007 the real see the realtore real call that Tim Mo did make to KSP was kept in David Osburn's locked desk from August the 26th of 95 till November the 28th of 95. So for 3 months and 2 days this real to real that Tim Mothal had made was kept in an a locked desk.

[01:05:52]Then in 2007 it was taken out of evidence to a creative specialist in Frankfurt and Tim Wthal makes this call with a female and the the call to you know the 911 call was with a male and everything the way he describes the way Heather was taken is nothing like what he had told us for 20 years and it's absolutely nothing like what he described in the 2004 interview. So, let me ask you this.

[01:06:23]>> I don't know what happened to Heather. H >> H how did you get a hold of Okay, obviously the the 911 call was on the internet already. How did you get a hold of the other two audios, the interview and then the uh beach interview >> from KSP files? There I have I have it listed in batches. There's like uh page one through 196 and then 197 through whatever and then there's a separate uh for audio. And so when you pull up these audios, there's there's all of these interviews. And of course, you know, the the 82695 that that was labeled correctly. It was, you know, the interview on the beach where he describes the man with big old a big old beer belly and um lots of hair. Um, and then of course the 2004 interview, uh, it was there labeled as Tim W, let's see, Timoth, no, it said 16951327, which is Heather's case file. Um, Tim Wthal and opened it up. Oh, November the 16th. November the 16th of 95. That's the date. Open it up and there it is.

[01:07:38]you know, and and of course I had it transcribed years ago. I mean, years ago, but I I had totally forgotten about the discrepancies in that 2004 interview until, see, I've got like three people going through these that had been helping me going through these files.

[01:07:55]And when I tell you, Rick, that God revealed that, I mean, for for me to have seen that there's six different labels for that call that they kept from us for 20 years. And then it it's in military time. So, John Lorden, he's another podcaster. He uh did Brain Scratch. Um anyway, I I sent that to him and I was like, "What what is this?" You know, I know the call lasted like 8 minutes, but what what is this? You know, we were given 115 to Indiana State Police. And the first thing that Tim Wos says in this call they kept from us for 20 years was, "I just called Indiana State Police." Well, the call starts at 108 and they gave us 1:15 when the call actually ends. And of course, you know, in in that call for me for us to hear him say, "I've been waiting 25 minutes for her to come back." And did you catch in the 2004 interview where he mentions 26 minutes like it took 26 minutes from Did you catch that?

[01:09:04]>> Yeah. So I think it was like there was like several he gave a few different times like 20 25 and then but he refers to you know hey it's been nine years and and I and I can't fault him on that part right some of the stuff like I said I can't remember stuff from yesterday but there are things that are just out wide open that doesn't even match up to the original 911 call >> oh can you imagine I mean I knew from the from the call that we heard you after 20 years that the man that that that the story that he had told how he came down, he either charged or he crept down slowly. You know, for 20 years, we were told he crept down slowly and then the real call that he made, it says he charged down, but in this 2004 interview, I mean, it's almost comical to the point that, you know, the man didn't jump on top of her and hold her down. And and I I tried to I went over this last night and and I and I prayed before I w I listened to it again. Uh the one thing that I think he's telling the truth because he did mention this in the in the uh other interview is that Heather like for like 15 to 20 seconds is what he told. It's 25 to 30 in this one. But he actually says they conversed that she did not struggle. She didn't try to get away. And that to me, I' I've always felt that there's no way in the world Heather would not have thought. Now, of course, Tim says, you know, her hair was wrapped around so tightly she couldn't even scream. And um but I think she knew I I think whoever came down to get her, she knew him because for her not to kick and fight and she took Taekwond do, you know, I mean, and that one sentence in here, he says they conversed for 25 to 30 seconds and and then of course in the other call, he says that um he's just been waiting for her to come back for 25 minutes. 25 minutes.

[01:11:16]Yeah. So, what Let me let me ask you this.

[01:11:21]And again, I'm not defending anybody.

[01:11:22]I'm just trying to like just really just like I'm a big conspiracy theorist. Like I believe in Bigfoot. So, I mean, you know, we're there. So, what happens at the end of the day if Tim Wall's telling the whole truth?

[01:11:42]>> Which one?

[01:11:44]Whi- which is the truth.

[01:11:46]>> I mean, you got I guess you have a point, but I'm just you know, you know what I mean? What happens if I I don't know. I don't know. Like >> which which story can we believe?

[01:11:57]>> Um I like to think that the one he they kept from us for 20 years is is because that was 2KSP.

[01:12:05]But you know, when you listen to that call, there's an interruption. They're playing music. Um, >> and and and I get to where, you know, in 2004 interview he talks about like they were just like just throwing him around and in that call there's music and there's it's just kind of very unprofessional if you will and KSP like those dispatchers now they're they're on their game now right back then I don't know I >> well the difference is you know the >> e either the the dispatcher was a male or it was a female. It was a it was a male in the call that was kept from us for 20 years. Now, the female in the call they created with the wig and mosquito netting. U we've talked about this before, but ENH or Elizabeth Nicole Hinsley's who was the FBI lady who came in over the 2002 uh incident where Glenn Wildy, her former boss, had contacted state police that Heather Social was being used in Newport, Kentucky. He specifically asked the KSP to go check with neighbors.

[01:13:14]Remember that? And that's the same time Holly got that call.

[01:13:17]>> Yeah.

[01:13:17]>> So, I mean, either But either way, Marty Dale didn't was not the man that Tim Mo described. In no way did he match that description.

[01:13:27]>> And there was no DNA that has been tested >> matched Marty Deal.

[01:13:33]>> But there are still DNA samples that can be tested against all these other people including Marty Deal's DNA that hasn't >> Why wasn't it sent to Bodie? If if they had they this is this is my concern, Rick. The FBI stepped in 11 months into testing after those skin cells were found. So whose DNA did they find that they don't want us to know? I guarantee you it's and and this would not even be anything that they should hide is that okay the eyewitness and and Dave, you know, that's that's what Timoth called Dave the first week. So, to me, that insinuates a relationship for him to call him Dave, but that that's just a little Columbbo moment. Um, why wouldn't they just say, you know, I mean, I've got the pictures that prove they Heather's bathing suit bottoms were just wadded up, tied with something.

[01:14:31]>> And in some of the pictures I've seen, they didn't have any gloves on.

[01:14:35]>> So, obviously skin transfer, you know, them picking them up off the beach. It's going to happen, right?

[01:14:41]>> Well, Nobody knows that, >> right? So why >> why was the towel on the chase lounge?

[01:14:50]>> It wasn't >> at one time and then in the woods. So So there's there's still a lot of questions. Um >> the thing is had he had he jerked that towel away from her and threw it on the chair, there would definitely be touch DNA on that on that towel.

[01:15:06]>> But that that's not the truth at all because the towel was found in the woods, >> right? So, so they could have tested, I mean, they could have swabbed the DNA on the chair. They could have, you know, the towel, the bathing suit bottoms, the bathing suit top. Uh, I don't know, Rick. We we don't really know what happened that day because I mean for the Henderson Police Department to have not known Tim Wthal's story by late afternoon and that being the very place that the FBI claims is Heather's last known whereabouts. How would they know? And I don't know who that I don't know who saw Heather on the boat ramp that would have made that report. Th those are new questions that I'm trying to find out. But at 3:00 p.m. August the 26, 1995 for the FBI to already know that this was drugreated.

[01:16:00]That is there's a lot of information in in that one file and and that is one of five files that after I had to declare Heather legally deceased to get the FBI files and that's what the FBI came in 2005 to do. They wanted me to get an attorney to sue the state police. And then then this is what they said.

[01:16:22]Heather's case will be a landmark case.

[01:16:24]She said he we were told there would be two lawsuits. The first lawsuit would be the Commonwealth of Kentucky versus KSP post 16. And then I would follow up with Sarah Teague versus KSP. as it looks now. The Department of Crim Investigation has enough evidence right now by Tim Wthal and that female creating a call to further implicate Marty Deal adding the wig and mosquito netting that is it's gone. That's tampering with evidence and you don't tamper with evidence unless you're trying to obstruct justice. You don't mislay.

[01:17:04]>> Let me get Let me get it clear. Is there any proof that call still exists? Like there's any transcripts or is there any >> the 2008 call we heard?

[01:17:14]>> The one with the mosquito netting or whatever. Is there any kind of evidence that can >> there's there's four officers. One of them's Captain Ricky Allen is no longer alive. Uh Sergeant Jason Kirk, Mark Carter, and Pat Isel. They're all alive.

[01:17:29]And I have asked them I've asked Mr. McKe the prosecuting attorney to bring them in for questioning because they heard there were four officers who heard that call along with me and Chip. So that is seven people that heard the wig and mosquito netting call. Well, we were supposed to been legally we were supposed to been given a copy. As soon as they played that call for us, it became a public record. We were supposed to have gotten a call gotten a copy. We did not. So upon open record, open record, open record, finally the attorney general said, Stephanie Dawson with the attorney general's office said, "We do not have a copy of it." So they don't deny exist, but the Kentucky State Police stood in front of Judge Shepard in 2017 saying there was only one call.

[01:18:23]So the fight continues. And what we know now is Tim Wthaw has has told so many stories that we don't know what happened that day. I call it the hot blurry Saturday because it was I think there was a drug bust supposed to gone down. I think Tim Wthal is a federally protected agent and he lost Heather. Otherwise, why would he say he's been waiting 25 minutes? He wasn't concerned, you know, that she had been dragged into the woods by her hair because he didn't call 911 and he's just waiting 25 minutes for her to come back in one call. And of course, in this one, you know, the man jumps on top of her, holds her down, jerks her. I I just don't understand how these officers can conduct interviews and not hold him accountable. It's as if nothing that happened to Heather matters to anybody at Post 16. And I and I send the new detectives, Josh, Turner, uh, Lashley. I send them all this and I and I tell them, I'm just praying for y'all. I know this is going to be hard to stand up against one of your own to stand up against 30 years of, you know, you got positive proof Marty De wasn't the man, you know, and where did the other bullet where did the other shot go? And God forbid Marty Deal was yelling out, "I want to speak to my attorney." And here Bill Poke was telling them, "Marty's bald. He doesn't fit that. Not only is he not bald, not only is he just bald, but he's shorter. He's lighter. I mean, he he didn't fit the description in any way.

[01:20:07]And they still made sure that he did not come out of that trailer alive.

[01:20:14]So, our your next move, I guess. What What are we We're going to wait. You know, we got some things or it seems like there's some things kind of bubbling around, working up. Um, like I said, you know, it feels like the table's turning a little bit. There's there's some >> feels like there's a little action, whatever that is. Um, what I would like to do is I know Marty De's son Josh and and his wife Kesha.

[01:20:48]Uh, I don't know if they would be willing to join you and and us on on a and maybe even John one one time get all of us on here and just kind of because I'd like to hear their thoughts, you know, because I know it's been hard on you for 30 years, but I can't imagine and I don't know how old Josh was when this happened.

[01:21:13]>> He was the same age as my son. He was 11 or 12. So, I mean, he has memories of all this going on, right? Well, >> there's an interview with with Josh with Detective Athetherton, and I I I can't even listen to it. Josh is crying and um >> Do you have that interview?

[01:21:29]>> I do. I do. I opened it the other day and and once again, I just couldn't get through it because >> Yeah.

[01:21:35]>> Um, you know, to hear that little fella crying and Athetherton, you know, keeping on and on. Well, what about this and what about that? And, right. So, I asked Kesha, you know, I said, "Kesha, I've got this. I don't know that I can figure out how to send it to you, but she didn't want to she didn't want to hear it, >> you know, I don't." But, you know, in the KSP files, Josh says that he and his dad had fed the goats and that uh you know, he looked outside and uh the grass was tall and Tracy had said she was aggravated with him because she wanted the grass cut. And so at 1:00, you know, Don Parker had told me that Marty didn't do this. You know, Marty was behind my pawn shop working on a lawnmower at 1:00, so there's no way Marty did this, you know, and and of course I told the police.

[01:22:21]>> So there's a witness putting him somewhere else.

[01:22:24]>> Yes. He wasn't even on the beach.

[01:22:28]>> Okay.

[01:22:29]I I would I would like to try to get John Webb uh and maybe Kesha and and Josh just to kind of get I want to get their story too because especially Josh and Josh's story if he wants to and if not that's okay too because 30 years he's been living this too. He's been living under the shadow. He sits in school and has been that's Marty De's son and he killed Heather Tig. That's what that little fella has been through.

[01:23:01]And in 2008 when Penny Bell brought her blood hells in and I I I've told this story before but but I I just love that little guy. You know, Mark Carter uh Josh came out of the trailer and I was across the road and I yelled at Josh and and uh Carter said uh he don't want to talk to you. Leave him alone. Well, here came Joshua. Josh met me at the end of his driveway and I had that sketch. I had this poster and I took it to him. Of course, Carter followed us over there and I said, "Josh," I said, "The state police framed your daddy." He said, "I know." I said, "This is a picture of of your daddy's last driver's license and this is the sketch." He was framed. He said, "I know." You know, so he and I connected that day. But can you even I mean people that hear that the deals and I and our family are connected, they just cannot even believe it.

[01:24:00]>> When I when I first heard it, I was like, she's been doing this for 30 years and and this is the relationship that I mean, that's that's a strong family in my opinion to to be able to deal and open deal. They know I'm the I'm the only one that's been trying to to let people know that I mean Tracy um I'm the only one that's been bringing in jail records and and getting statements from family and friends and proving that Marty was was bald and this is what we're waiting on since since KSP Lashley told Kesha two days in a row that Marty De's DNA is not on there. Don't you know that if Marty Deal's DNA had been anywhere? Oh my goodness.

[01:24:46]>> It would have been everywhere.

[01:24:47]>> Shouted it to the heavens. They would have had a big press conference. But now since they know it's not it hurts my feelings that they had the results back for 3 months and didn't even bother to even tell the news that that the results were back. Had I had that open record not been filed, we would still be going through the motions of getting a court order. See, that's how God works, Rick.

[01:25:14]because of that scripture verse.

[01:25:17]It's powerful. I mean, I I I wish I knew this 30 years ago, but I know it now without that.

[01:25:25]>> We we'll go ahead and kind of start wrapping this up. But, uh, you know, like I said, maybe we have an update in the next week, next couple weeks, but we won't do another one until we have some new information. No, you know, whatever that whatever that looks like. Um, you know, we >> Well, the harsh reality, Rick, is even uh 44,4 25 they won't even put out there. They won't even put it out there, you know?

[01:25:54]They Well, one reporter says it's hearsay. And so that they're not going to put it out there that >> what's what's hearsay >> that for for Lashley to have told Kesha that there was no DNA results. So, so and you know, and I said, "Well, call Kesha. Kesha will tell you." And I think they're waiting on the police to come out and say, and and this is what I told Ramsey Dum and the police. Why can't you just say Marty De's DNA was not on Heather's bathing suit bottoms, but he still remains a suspect? Because I mean, they've not told the truth yet. Marty Deal in no way matched the sketch or what he wouldn't have been a suspect had the Bronco not been filmed. So, right now there's a lot of hearts and souls that are struggling with how to proceed.

[01:26:42]I know this is going to be one of the hardest things that Ramsay Dum has ever done. She's young and I told her that first conversation she and I had, what you're about to learn in this search for Heather is going to break your heart and what you're going to find out, what's happened in this investigation is going to shatter your faith in law enforcement. And I know that's what's happened. This is not easy for the the form for the new officers. This is not easy for them to realize why have they done this? Why couldn't it have been stopped? Why did Marty have to die? You know, that there's so many questions that are above us right now because, you know, somebody was taken to the federal grand jury September the 20th and September the 27th of 95.

[01:27:34]There's, you know, for the FBI to come in the way they did, for the FBI to step in 11 months into testing, Rick, the FBI just doesn't step in for no reason at all. And now to know that skin cells were found, they know who t who touched Heather's bathing suit bottoms.

[01:27:57]And it's forgivable if Tim Wthall did touch him, you know? I mean, granted, he should have wore gloves. Granted, Osborne should have had enough sense to wear gloves uh when they were making >> Huh.

[01:28:09]>> A witness should never touch evidence anyway. But hey, >> right. I know, but but still, >> I'm just out here.

[01:28:16]>> Oh, the witness shouldn't have been allowed to have created a call and be at the trailer. And and the thing the thing that makes me know he was there in plain sight is that Susan Dwit, KSP, who is named in the search warrant, she was there. She told me in 2003 that Tim Martha was there. And I told you I tracked her down to her home and she said, "I didn't tell you that." So the next day I tracked her down to the Commonwealth of Attorney's office in Davis County where she worked and she immediately she she denied that she and I had talked the night before and she just hung up on him. So in other words, she told me that Tim Moth was there, but she denied it later. So, there's a lot everything that we know now. And like I said, I don't put anything out there that I don't have proof of.

[01:29:10]We can officially claim Marty De's DNA was not on Heather's bathing suit bottoms. And this is one of the largest political coverups in the tri-state history. And what's been done with these officers, it's going to take a lot of bravery. It's going to take their hearts changing for these new officers.

[01:29:31]I I don't know. All I know is right now it's in Frankfurt and they're trying to do damage control. And we're at the place now to where they will have no choice but to tell our family because God gave me those words. And I I I know he's faithful and I know whatever happened that day, what we were told has happened that day is not what happened at all.

[01:29:55]Well, there you have it. We uh covered a lot with a lot of good updates, new information. The DNA has came back.

[01:30:04]Marty Dill's not on it. We don't know who's on it, who is on the bathing suit bottoms. Why wasn't the skin cells tested? Why wasn't the towel tested? Why wasn't the chase lounge brought in for evidence? Because there's going to be transfer DNA on there. 1995 to 2026 DNA has the testing capabilities is just phenomenal now. So they're they're you know they exumed Marty Deal to get more DNA. Um hopefully that's not all that's going on behind the scenes. You know there's a lot of stuff that we probably don't know. Um but >> they didn't even take in the red chevet.

[01:30:45]I located the red chevet on Sheriff Bobby Stoneberger's property where I had already told was told that it would no longer run because it had sand in the motor and the person who it belonged to was Heather's boyfriend at the time's best friend. I located that car and it was demolitioned off year years later cuz I didn't have $40 to buy it. Um but um they didn't even bring it in. They did not even bring the red chevet in.

[01:31:17]And one day I went into post 16 and uh it was early on. Uh I had a I had brought a picture of the red chevet to them, a polar little polaroid picture.

[01:31:27]And when I went in, David Osborne left for some reason. I don't know if Timoth was there that day or not. One day when I came in to post before I met him, uh I w I was going in the front door and I saw this big tall man and he kind of ducked. Well, years later when I met him, I was like that was Tim Wthal, you know, he was he was there, you know. Of course, every time I had a lead or something, he would be right there. So, I thought he was just my my hero, you know.

[01:31:55]>> Love speak that man. Uh, a lot of questions to ask, a lot of information still out there that's not been given.

[01:32:03]>> Well, God's not done revealing. I I can tell you that right now. God is not done. God is not done. When Allison Goodman had that word from God in 2003, she came to me. And of course, that's the same year that Heather's social was being used, she said, "God told me this.

[01:32:20]When this is all said and done, it will be a wonder to all mankind. And people will be saying that mother, that mother, you stand and declare, to God be the glory." And even though that's been 23 years later, it's all in God's perfect timing. He is wrapping this up where there will be no doubt that it was God who did this because you know I let Ramsey Delaman State Police know that when God gave me those words and how he showed me that mislabeled file and I mean God's got a big old day set aside and it's it's coming.

[01:32:57]>> Well, there it is folks. We are going to wrap it up now. Sarah, thank you so much for taking the time out. I know we've been trying to get back together on this and uh >> well, you know how that is. God's perfect timing. I >> happens when it's supposed to.

[01:33:12]>> Absolutely.

[01:33:12]>> And thank you for being patient, you know.

[01:33:14]>> I thank you for your bravery.

[01:33:16]>> Well, just telling your story, just getting your story out there.

[01:33:19]>> Oh my goodness. That 2000 Oh me.

[01:33:25]>> I'm going to need you to send me that other one on the beach because >> Okay.

[01:33:29]>> I know I have it. I know you sent it to me, but yeah, I have I got to clean my emails up. I got so much crap in there that >> Well, this was hard. You know, it's um >> even when you turn it up, you can barely hear it.

[01:33:41]>> Yeah, I've got I've got an idea on what I'm going to do with that. So, >> I'd like to hear that. Um so, again, thank you so much for taking the time out this evening. Um, we we'll uh definitely stay in touch and you know anytime you you need anything you you know where I'm at, you know how to get a hold of me.

[01:34:01]>> So, thanks for watching.

[01:34:03]>> Yeah, absolutely. Uh, thanks for watching Front Porch America. Until next time, y'all. Be good to each other.

[01:34:09]>> Thank you, Rick.

[01:34:10]>> You're welcome.

[01:34:18]>> Say what you want to say. Be real. Be kind. Free speech. Make this a better day. You got a voice, a story to be heard.

[01:34:32]Share it all.

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