The Rural Healthcare Transformation Program (RHDP) is a federal initiative providing $10 billion annually to states for rural healthcare improvement, with Massachusetts receiving $162 million through a competitive RFP process. The program requires innovative, sustainable healthcare programs that cannot involve building new facilities but must demonstrate measurable outcomes and Key Performance Indicators. Successful implementation requires forming collaborative networks among multiple towns, establishing community health workers to collect social determinants of health data, and partnering with academic medical centers like UMass Medical School's Digital Hub. The program emphasizes transforming healthcare delivery through mobile diagnostic services, telehealth monitoring, and rapid response teams rather than traditional facility-based care.
07/21/2026 Hardwick, MA. Board of Health Meeting
Added:You might be online.
>> Item on the agenda is the review approval of the June 23rd uh 26 meeting minutes to accept as second.
>> All right. Any discussion on the minutes?
>> Hearing no discussion. Uh all in favor?
I >> I those minutes are approved.
Next on the agenda, we have a review of the financial reports. Does anyone have any questions or comments on the financial reports?
Starting a fresh uh >> Yeah.
Okay. Just forformational purposes.
>> Actually, Dr. Well, if you see that, let's receive that. invoice that came in today. It's important to $200.
>> Okay.
>> Recycle your pen.
>> I can't.
It's okay.
whenever it's juicy.
>> Uh okay.
>> So our account balances are basically back to budget year.
>> Yeah.
There's a listing of the expenditures the previous fiscal year.
There are any questions on that? We will move on.
Any questions?
>> No.
Uh, moving on to item three, presentation on the rural healthcare initiative. I will yield the floor.
Miss Corsick, Dr. Halen, floor is yours.
>> Hi. Well, we it's been a while since we have chatted. Um obviously it was our board that was the first board to take on the rural health transformation program. Um, >> our board being >> the hardwood started hard started.
>> We started this.
>> Oh, the board hardwood board of health.
I >> guess health, right?
>> So, I'll give you a couple of documents here to look at and the reason I didn't hand it to you ahead of time is because then you would be shocked because you'd see that the heart of Florida Health is the leader of this and it's been a while and I think October. Yeah, that's great.
>> Um, so for new members of the board, are you familiar with the rural health transformation program at all? Okay, so I'll give that to you in a snapshot. Um, last the big beautiful bill, love it or hate it, um, there was a 50 billion with a B provision uh, earmarked specifically for rural health. Um the rules around this were $10 billion per year divided among the 50 states based you you the states got the amount based on their RFP and how they responded to that RFP.
Probably a little political action in there too since Massachusetts was lower on >> 48 >> 48 um and they give away that what they're doing as a grant is 5 years it's 10 billion per year. However, you are not guaranteed another grant the second year, third year, fourth year. You have to show outcomes. You have to show that you're using it, that you have good programs in place, and that you follow the rules of the rural health transformation. The rules are this. It has to be innovative. It has to apply to rural health. You can't build new buildings. This isn't about doing Mary Lane. This is about trying to figure out how to do things like rapid response units, how to do um uh diagnostic labs, uh labs in mobile vehicles, how to leverage your libraries and your senior centers as places where the seniors can go get their annual physicals, various things, the various types of programs.
So that's what they're looking for.
They're looking to transform and remake the way healthcare is delivered in rural communities.
the at the end of this if you have worked your programs and you've developed them the right way you should have put the KPI the key performance indicators and your analytics and your measurements in place to make these programs billable you want them to last it shouldn't be about a grant program like we get a grant program for get it one year two years and then it goes away this is the whole goal is to put programs in place that will remain forever billable will that happen.
I don't know if we put 10 programs in and eight survive, I think that's pretty much a success, right? So, we know it won't be 100%. Um, because there are some really innovative programs, >> some interesting ideas, >> right? So, um, but what this package has right in front of you and what I'm ready to give you and what we're be talking about a little bit today is, um, some of the programs, how we got in front of UMass, why we do UMass. Um, as you know, the Mary Lane thing was going on, a lot of infighting over there.
We were getting nowhere. And by the way, I did reach out to Bay State ahead of time to see if they do programs in um, in exchange for the money that they took from the trust. We were actually working down that pathway before the RHDP got announced in which case at that point I'm like well we're in Worcester County and we could probably do a lot more. So I did a ring out to Dr. um uh to do to Eric Dixon who's the CEO over there and um to Dr. Eric Halbert who runs he's added quality head of analytics head of informatics um and they met with us right away and said sure um we sent them over kind of programs and we're like shovel ready we'll work with you and they said yes and we ran over there and um we started talking and then started building the program back from there at this point in time what we've done is met with all the boards of health of the nine towns or 10 towns yes that our in our group um and the way that the group was um decided which towns um was really not rocket science on this. This is this is a it was more like a dart. Um this is the map. This comes from you'll notice that as from the you when Massachusetts entered their big RFP to get their money they basically this way. What they did is determined which these dark blues are what's called R2. That's like really really rural like we have nothing. And the tan the uh light blue ones those are rural one which means they have >> something >> something. Yeah, maybe they have a doctor or a pharmacy um but nothing else. And all the white is not eligible.
Okay. So the white are not eligible towns. So you see there's a lot of white. Okay. Where the dark blue hard blue we're dark blue. We are R2. We are we are R2. Yes. Um and there's some stats in here that you can look at that show why we're R2. It's poverty, age, a lot of other things. Okay. Um so what we did then is okay, we decided to put a stake in the ground say we're going to do this and uh we met with board of health and we thought well this would be a great idea and then we started meeting with the towns around us. Um we kept getting yeses that they'd work with us and here's the rules. If let's say that there's nine programs UMass wants to launch with and they've got to start with two this year or whatever it is.
Everybody starts with the same two.
We're not running in different directions. We don't have different agendas. We're all running the same program in all the towns because UMass has something called a digital hub. They just launched it um January 2025. It's a gigantic facility. Neil and I have toured it. It's fantastic. They do hospital at home. That's where they run all their PH uh their um paramedics out of their mobile labs. All that is coming out of >> ICU monitoring all kinds of stuff there.
It's really quite a facility.
>> It is. It's very >> actually it's a big building. It's it's right in square, >> right? It's not on the UMass campus, right? It's >> downtown right across from library.
>> Really?
>> What's it called?
>> The digital hub.
>> Yeah. If you Google it, you'll find digital hub and you'll see them with their scissors and everything >> videos and stuff. It's actually quite impressive.
>> It is impressive. So with that, knowing they had that, that also made them an ideal partner because they had just basically started programs there. Well, kind of test them out, testing them out in Worester. And when rural health came along, that gave them the funds to actually expand it and to do those things. And we were the perfect test because we had already brought together our towns and we brought together how we could work with the towns and um kind of a roadmap form and our shovel ready programs, right? So which of course are kind of silly shovel ready you guys can share, right?
So um you you are actually on the very front page because um well There is a Hardwick Health Visits Committee. We we just threw a name in there called Provin Health Rural Health Collaborative.
It's not real. Um it's just a name that it's a working name with UMass. Um as you can see the group there, the Hardwick Health Committee at the time um was I'm sitting on the chair of that.
There's Neil, there's John Mott, Romano, Leland. Do you notice that those are the advisory board?
>> Right. Right. And not to >> Right. Exactly. Right. So, this was we can adjust anything we want. I will tell you, UMass had to change out half their team already because Massachusetts has taken so long to get through this process. We're almost last, by the way, >> in doing out the money and getting the programs out. I cannot believe how slow this state is. Don't even get me started on that. Um, >> but it just passed like a year ago, >> but it has to Well, Judy's going to get to the fact that the money needs to be spent by September.
Right. It has to be doled out. So this 162 million that Massachusetts was given.
>> These are now all these people are going to come in and say this is, you know, we want this piece of it. It's taken Massachusetts so long to figure this out. They're going to get a deluge of all these things and they got to figure out within the next month >> which programs are going to get funded.
>> Would like to be first in line.
>> Huh.
>> We'd like to be first.
>> Yeah. Well, >> yeah. UMass would love to be >> Yeah. And you know, we've already talked to um the legislature and the senator.
We have we've gone every pathway, trust me, to to really boost uh UMass and you even heard about it. So that's pretty good. But I mean, I didn't even go to you directly and we you know, people figured it out. We have the community.
>> Yeah, we had the committee. Um so the this is why it's a challenge and the money was available on one one to be doled out one one this year. It has taken UMass this long just to get their committees together and their whatevers together to um you know all these people like UMass Bay State uh I don't know behavioral health network all these folks even tiny towns are all sitting there waiting saying when is this going to open so we can tell you what we're going to do with this money and what we need for this money. Well, okay. Let's say you get this happens. It's supposed to, by the way, he she texted me. Um, it's it's next week. Um, that they get to submit. So, I just got that email.
The um so the name of the game is even if they go through this process and it takes them 3 to four weeks, which by the way, Neil is on the state committee so he gets to see all the junk um come through, they've got to determine who does it. And remember, there's another grant that is due for January. That grant has to be turned in by October 31st.
So, we don't even have enough time to barely put a program in, get data in, anything. Meanwhile, you have states like Michigan that have had their program since February. Um, you know, they're all going to submit the statement and go, "Well, we need 300 billion this year because look all we've done." And we're going to go, "Oh, gez, we haven't even started." So, this is going to be interesting to see how this is handled for year two of the grant.
So, yeah, it's challenging and we have had our programs ready to go. I mean, we have books of this stuff. We we're ready down to the software we need, everything. Um, and it's just been very aggravating. So, hopefully next in the next month, um, we'll know exactly how much UMass got. Um, UMass is focused on us that we were the first ones to go to them. So, they're very um they really loved us. Um we are they only have one other project they're working on and putting this bid in for and it's in kind of north central uh Worester County. Um and it's a fire department thingy. It's very different than what we're doing.
It's a triage. It's something we'll utilize even later. It's a program we'll pick up later. Um but for this round, we are their primary focus. So, this 30 million that they're putting in for um is designated for this program for these towns. Um again, how did we pick the towns? We just reached out. We have actually had others reach out to us. We didn't reach out to Warren. They reached out to us. We let them in.
>> Lelo, I mean, um uh Rutland reached out.
Holden reached out. Too big.
>> They're 10,000 20,000 people. Two big round one, right?
>> So, >> we have 30,000 now.
>> Yeah. Okam the Brookfields. Uh where Okam the Brookfields Barry us >> Okam >> Okam trade.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> And Peter >> Peter Ham reached out to us.
>> So um really in a in a catch area that you look at that has no healthcare. We have one one public health. We have Barry Healthc Care Center. Uh we have no primary, no pediatrics, no OB. We have one pharmacy at the at the Hannerfords and we have minimal ambulance coverage uh for all of those towns. So really truly the definition of our two.
>> Um and in that we have three major private schools, >> right?
>> Um >> Stson, Eagle Hill, and Valley, >> right? And and then you know all of what we need. So um we really tried to come up with things to serve areas. Some we felt that that what we need to do is we need to understand our area and then you'll we once we understand what our needs are try to come up with a couple things that were easy to get going fast.
Um things that we would love to do like having a mental health crisis line are not happening in the first year. Matter of fact, UMass's mental behavioral health group um just folded. Yeah.
>> Um it was a outside firm that folded. So yeah. So they're going to be seeking another >> because that was one of our we really wanted to have that as a pillar and they kind of turned green when we mentioned that. Um >> but um things and I don't know if I'm jumping the gun, things like remote telemed monitoring of high-risisk patients. um having uh bringing um clinics on wheels to the towns on a rotating b uh basis so that people can have routine physicals, can have targeted examinations for our diabetics, our lung disease people or all kinds of other people. Um bringing diagnostics to the town, so having a van come around and do blood draws, do ultrasounds. A big need in this area is OB ultrasound.
women in high-risisk women in terminal pregnancy uh women are having to drive 45 minutes to get ultrasounds or to see get lab work done drug every week. Uh so bring diagnostics to the towns, bring imaging to the towns and then moving on towards drugs. So pharmacy trying to leverage a 340B program out of uh which is a a discount pharmacy program which the government is trying to dial back now but um trying to bring uh pharmacy in and not just mailing people their drugs under when people get discharged from the hospital finding out who actually is getting their drugs who can afford their drugs who can't afford their drugs.
>> Yeah. who's taking the correct drugs.
Um, having PE nurses available on the phone to follow up with people, having nurses that are available to check in with high-risk people to avoid the 911.
We would love to cut down on the 911 calls for people that don't need immediate transport. So, one of our goals, not in the first year, but is to create a rapid response like paramedic team, triage team that could come out and handle falls, shortness of breath, you know, busyness, stuff like that.
>> Yeah. Stuff that doesn't require transport, freeing up the minimal ambulance uh facilities that we have for these 10 towns concept.
>> Yeah. We figured out I called the flag squad, but yeah. Um um we figured out that every transport costs us 2 hours at a minimum with an ambulance availability. Uh and I can tell you when we had that person pass out at the Ghostwalk last fall, it took 15 minutes for a police car to get there and it took another 10 minutes for an ambulance to get there. So just a minimal thing like that if we could have some fast response services. So, these are some of the programs we're talking about and and Judy can talk about the infrastructure, the computer uh system that we're hoping to put in place to understand our communities and get people enrolled so we know who they are so we can respond to them, >> right? Um the other two overlay things that are involved in every program is uh transportation and uh internet >> both paid for.
>> Correct. Like Starlink for those that >> don't have IP.
>> So we really don't have to cut up the tower, guys. Anyway, >> I got one. I saved mine.
>> Oh, you saved yours. All right.
>> Have one.
>> He's the chairman.
>> All right. So, this is a little confusing for those that are not in healthcare, but those that are in healthcare. So, I'm going to try to um bring this down just a little bit. Um so, I'm going to get up so these guys can see it, too. So, it's a it's a circle. All right. So, these you're missing our 10th town, but these are the 10 towns. This center circle is the digital hub. So, this is these are all the clinical programs. We as a town won't be running the clinical programs.
It'll all be run by UMass. Okay? They'll be that they're on Epic system. It's their doctors, it's their nurses, it's their paramedics, it's their laboratory vehicles, whatever it may be.
Okay? So, they are that center circle.
So, this actually represents a little bit of data and what the services are.
And these individual towns will then have a community health worker. that community health worker. Each one of these towns, um they're all about the same size town at this point. So about 3,000 patients to this one community health worker. You go, "Wow, what is this person supposed to be doing?" Not what you think they're going to be doing. Um in the very beginning um we are hoping as if this goes through and we afraid it does um we are going to be putting in a centralized system that allows our community health workers through various means to collect um social determinants of health and activities of daily living for the people in their communities. The reason for that is if you understand a lot about the people, you understand which programs best work for them. So you can make sure that these folks have access to those programs. So it makes it very easy for then Ubass to be able to reach out and say, "Hey, we have this program.
Is there anyone in the community that was most likely to want this?" It also allows those folks to get all the communications of things that are going on and um eventually that community health worker when we're done collecting this and having the centralized database will then be able to kind of convert to an actual community health worker and do other type things. But in the beginning it's getting to know the communities. We know nothing about our neighbors. We know nothing guys. Um so it's this is the only way that we really can get a grasp on what the folks needs are. Do you know do they live alone? Do they have transportation? Do they have a dog?
Do they have a cat? I mean, because if somebody goes into the hospital, you want to have something triggered that says you got a pet at home that has to be taken care of. There's different types of things you can do with these types of systems. And that's that's what we're going to do. You have to have a consent just like everything in healthcare. So nothing is, you know, taken from various things. It is consent driven that they want to be part of the program. They want to be involved in it.
Um and again it's not no health related directly type stuff. That clinical stuff all remains at UMass. Okay. Do do any questions on that because it was a little complicated. Um but it's a lot easier than it sounds. Um we actually have the specs. We know exactly how to do this. We've done this a few times in our in our life. It's really important to uh get the what social determinants of health or do you have food? Do you have money? You know those kind of like the soft things in life. They're really important to make sure that you can get your medications, you can do whatever um transportation, those kind of things.
Super important um to really understand how to best take care of folks.
>> How does a health agent find these, you know, find these folks?
>> Very good question. How all right. So, part of the funding through this is doing all types of campaigns all the way from town town halls all the way to outreaches and all types of social media. Um, and we're also working with different agencies and CRMPC over there knows that that healthy aging the aging the veterans and actually they're going to help us find more of those types of groups because they often are working with the same individuals so we can then socialize and get folks on board. It's so important to have that community health worker in the town their own not one like in le you know Leester or whatever because you got to trust your town. You got to trust your your help.
Um and and there is an um Neil is working with the boards of health. Each board of health is supposed to designate a person on their board of health to be on the board of health committee for this um and get really up to speed on on health things. If they don't have a person that's a health person on their board of health, they can designate somebody else like an advisory board member, a doctor in the community if they feel more comfortable. There was one board of health I went to that had not one single person on there that had ever ever touched healthcare in their entire life. Right? So, you really do need that um to come together and you know it's a very exciting time. It's a lot of money to invest and I'm glad we're first. Um the the way the systems are built and the way that um a digital hub is built, the way these programs are built, they can easily migrate now to the next towns around us. very very quickly. The hospitals that are involved in the UMass program is not just UMass, it's Harington. Um they are actually doing a sh handshake deal with Haywood Haywood. Um and um they are going to be expanding the hours >> the hours in the personnel at the Berry Health Center. They even whispered um on the last meeting that they're even looking to put in an urgent care there.
So, a real one, >> not a fake one, not smoking marijuana, real one. Um, and with the schools, they've actually come back with plans on how these high-risisk kids that are on a lot of meds, 95% of Eagle Hill is on some form of medication, whether it's for ADHD, at all, um, dermatology, or asthma, allergy type stuff. And that's true of Valley View. Haven't really gotten into Stson yet on what their makeup is. very specialized populations in these in these private schools. So, do you have any questions about Kai how this is? We're waiting for UMass. All of our stuff is in. We've written our programs. Um, we are just sitting there waiting. I >> mean, our hope is that we can get enough funding in the first year to start to get the first this information gathering infrastructure in place and start to put something on the ground, >> right? um this year that we can measure >> um which will allow us to go back and say, "Hey, look, we're trustworthy. Um we said we could do this. We did it. Now we'd like some more money to we have all these ideas, all these things we'd love to do. Um trust us with another round and more money."
>> So, when does a community health agent actually get hired or is that money?
>> Yeah, as soon as that grant goes through, um we'll be searching for that.
And when I talked to the board of health members, um I don't know if you did this, but when we talk with the group again, this will be mentioned again. If there's someone in the community you already know would be a good candidate, have them. It's a paid It's a paid role, >> right? It's a paid It's a job.
>> It's not paid. There is no out of pocket to the town on any of this.
>> Yeah, that's key.
>> Except maybe a little electricity if you're holding the library open later or the senior center open later for physicals or whatever, but there is no out of pocket to the towns on this.
and the ambulance services are >> ambulance services are are interested. Um we in the first round we're not doing these mobile squads because that'll that's a bigger lift. When we get to that point there's going to have to be some massaging and integrating. Um they do make money from these nuisance calls >> wonder do they feel threatened at all?
>> Right. So, so we will we've I mean I've talked with them and what we basically said was we're going to work we're not >> cutting you guys off. We're going to work with you and if you want to be part of this funded, you know, rapid response team. We'll be happy to work with you guys, too.
>> But what we don't want to do, we're trying not to detract from the availability of real ambulances. We want to we want to be additive here. We don't want to be subtractive.
>> Right. So um yeah so I mean >> and if you look at the number of calls that the volunteer fire companies are being called out for medical calls >> you know we're very sensitive fact these people have jobs >> you know and and it cost the town also when we call them out >> and the police too.
>> Oh yeah. Oh they they would be very happy >> to not be responding to these calls. So what would be the qualifications of a community health agent? Is it is it somebody in the medical profession?
>> They actually don't have to do not have to be. Um they could be social work, right? Because again it's in the beginning this is all about social determinance of health and >> now when it gets to that next level that they want to put a paramedic they're they want to dot paramedics around.
Those are all all >> health workers.
systematic.
>> They want to strategically place paramedics. Correct.
>> It's a nice model.
>> It I mean it you know what they would like to see obviously money but um you know for them d-stressing their emergency rooms.
>> They're number 11 in the country by the way, >> right? take take primary care and pediatrics out of the emergency room >> and put it back into the community where it belongs >> with support and you know just even things like having having a triage line you know and working with uh regional dispatch on triage and dispatching the appropriate level of care you know right now we have a sledgehammer that's all we have >> and just like the other towns >> right when I say us it's just >> it's we're Now a big yes, >> right? So I mean we have >> we don't have the ability to to to be subtle. You know there's only one answer to everything, >> right?
>> Well impress you were able to break through the UMass system.
>> They they are so eager to break this.
>> They have a team of about 15 and then there's us.
>> Right. Right. But so and and understand that this is good for them.
>> I mean it's a business model in the end.
This is good for them because this is their catchment area and and >> they want to own central mass. There's no secret about that.
>> So if we if we get all these people signed up with into the UMass system and we're not saying you transfer any care you have anywhere else >> to UMass. But if UMass knows who you are, >> okay, when you hit the system and say there is an ambulance call, they know who you are already. Okay. You're or you call the hotline and they say, "You don't need to call 911. You don't need an ambulance, but you really should come in and be seen."
>> Yeah.
>> And that person in the middle at the digital hub then turns around and messages the ED and says, you know, there's a 14-year-old coming in with a whatever.
>> Yeah.
>> It streamlines everything and it helps them understand and anticipate and work together. So, they're very happy.
>> Wow. And they're they're very much everybody said, "Well, they have the digital hub, you know, where's the human touch?" They're very much a feet on feet on the ground. And they realize they're short on PCPs. Everybody's short on PCPs. So, they're going to do a blended program which basically says if you need to come in, your PCP is going to see you, but there's also going to be um tele >> calls and and checkup calls and various other things. Um so very much a blended model to get to see remember >> um this money was designated for innovation. So this isn't like you could just repeat the same old thing and get paid for it. Only 15% of the funding could go go toward um um paying for doctors etc. So you still are paying doctors to do the services under the normal model but this is additive because you're doing things a special way >> right and if we can have you know if they can understand if we have people who have COPD who have a remote spyometer of glucometers and blood pressure and and so now we have we know who we have and maybe you prevent visits or you you know you know how your diabetics are doing or all those people are doing.
>> Makes perfect sense. Yeah.
>> Um I mean just a simple thing like we said to them, you've got Barry Health Center there. You're paying for the heat and the lights and the air conditioning.
>> What our community would love is if you had 2 hours every evening and you rotated pediatrics and OB through there so that working people could bring their kids in or they could get their OB care there in the evenings or on a Saturday and they were like that's a brilliant idea over that.
>> So I mean just simple things like that.
>> Right.
So, that's what we've been doing.
>> Wow. I'm impressed.
>> Yeah.
>> I'm impressed that the other towns have been so receptive. I can't wait to work with them.
>> Um, it's been a long haul. This has taken, like I said, way behind other states. Um, but I think, well, our program is one of the better ones because I actually do talk to the other states, so I know what they're doing. Um I think we're >> I don't understand we're way behind if it's only been it's less than you know >> so all the the other states have been submitting for their grants but our I was talking to a Rand analyst >> already been in the works though.
>> No but I say I was talking to a Rand analyst this this weekend who was saying to me we haven't seen a single thing come from Massachusetts. What are you doing? We're running these grants for all these other >> all these other states.
>> Right. Right. Yeah.
>> So they UMass has someone on the council.
>> They have one of their people on the council >> and I'm on the council.
>> Is that a DPH failing or >> Yeah. Okay.
>> Erase that from the table.
>> It's >> Yeah, it is what it is. It is what it is over here. But we're ready to rolling.
Um, so it it was a lot of a hurry up and you know, we got all the other towns involved and talking to him, etc. Because we thought Massachusetts would be more um progressive because we are, you know, so we thought this thing would be rolling and here we are. We're like, uh, hang in there, guys. Hang in there, guys. It's really going to happen. Well, I just did get word on an email actually was from Stephanie and she said the inklings are she's hearing that that next week. So that they will be opening the door for bit for the RFP. So >> good.
>> Um >> Okay. So what's next? What's the schedule timeline here going forward?
>> What are you looking for from us?
>> Just telling you what's going on.
>> Just telling you what's going until there's money, >> right? So as soon as uh UMass puts their stuff in, obviously they're going to go high and they're going to get two for 2/3 whatever it is. So, they're going to determine then what programs are in, what programs are out. Um, and it's not a matter of we're going to draw a town.
It's going to be do we do three programs or two programs, >> whatever, right?
>> Um, the the the cluster we've done is pretty set. Um, but, you know, you called me today, which was a really good conversation because there's other towns in the Wester County that want to do these same things. And um I can tell you that UMass is absolutely open cuz I talked to her today to working with the smaller towns because Harrington's a part of this and um you know can do a program this year.
So >> I was going to ask if um you've done a lot of work to get the communities on board letters of support I imagine to go for it. Now is the time to draft those but >> I'm sure they'll be asking for that.
>> Okay.
>> Yeah. And we also have the letters from um uh from Bertham um Peter Durant um gang.
>> All right. Good work.
>> Strong.
>> Excellent.
>> Strong work. Really >> any question? Can I ask >> everybody?
>> Any questions?
>> How are you? Good to see you.
>> You did a great job. Thank you.
>> Thanks. I'll be in contact with the other whatever we can do for you.
>> No, no, I'll be you'll be you'll be getting emails.
>> Soon as we get everything together, we'll start to meet once we get all a lot of work.
Great job.
>> Thank you.
>> But this is the appropriate way.
And you know we might I might as well answer the elephant in the room that's going to get asked and can wear where people from wear absolutely you can use you mass nothing stops you from using UMass. So if they want you know those type of programs or something they're not going to have the centralized you know community health worker you can certainly use UMass you know they'll can leverage certain programs. So, >> um they're just not going to go into Bay State territory. That's all that they have been talking behind the scenes with Bay State cuz Bay State entered a lot of stuff um more around buildings versus programs. So, um UMass has basically said, "Listen, this is kind of how you have to do it." So, they have been there is an olive branch kind of going out there.
>> A little bit of uh council offered.
>> Exactly.
>> And we're trying to not be competitive, >> right? We don't have we just happen to have two health systems and we have then the way this program is set up is very county driven and as it is our cluster actually is a cluster and a half because >> one of the clusters that Massachusetts determined was a group the quaog group is half Worester County and half Bay state >> and so you have UMass Bay state right down the center so that cluster wasn't even practical so they're going to have to recite It's always been that way, right? Wing was was was UMass and >> Mary Lane was Bay State >> once Bate acquired >> Wing Mary Lane >> then, you know, >> they they serve the whole, you know, the whole county. It's a county line.
>> It's a county line. It makes it cleaner and, you know, they can kind of have their own ground. But again, we're not going to ask anybody to give up their base doctor.
>> We are absolutely not. We are going to ask people to >> get in our database. That's all we want to know. And if if you need care and you want to go to Bay State, you go to Bay State. We're not we're not directing.
There's no directing of care. We're just >> absolutely not.
>> We're just trying to make sure we know things.
>> Yeah. and the UMass, you know, school university up there, they're there, the nurses in the nursing school are actually supporting the Bay State program that they're putting out there.
So, >> yeah, there's a whole lot of lot of cooperation in the schools.
>> Mhm.
>> Us is the medical school that supports Bay >> for all their programs. They switched um over to >> us.
Basically was tough. So, >> so great.
So if you need anything else, you know where it went.
>> Thank you.
>> Ethan, you good?
>> Okay. She's not going to give you any more paperwork.
>> No, I'm not.
>> You're safe.
>> I actually did a set for you, so you didn't have to print them all out.
>> Our heads are still above the wall, but we're not counting the paperwork yet.
>> It's a lot. I know, but >> thank you very much. Thank you.
Appreciate >> it. We have a lot of people helping us out there. So, >> you got to love the UMass team.
>> Great.
>> Come out and say hi.
>> Wasn't always that way.
>> Oh, well, it is it is now they're >> they're looking for things to do with their building.
>> All right. Thank you very much.
>> I absolutely will. Yes. You're you're all welcome to endure the rest of the board of health meeting if you want.
>> I'll take the free pass. Thank you.
>> Okay.
meeting. So >> I need the other things we have.
>> You're looking here for the >> um we have a vote of support because you created us.
>> Yeah, we are. We are your you leashed unleashed us on the world.
>> Yes, I'm remembering we >> but you're you're an advisory committee has the board voted >> condition but we're more than >> Have you guys voted to accept and vote support for the work they've done so far? And is it almost time for that?
>> It's fine.
what we can >> go letters too, right?
>> So, yeah, make a motion to >> vote to support the efforts thus far.
>> Thank you.
>> Um and um and look forward to further reports and updates, but I think it's rather impressive.
What we're going to do is establish a um a website that's only a little internal website to keep doing updates so all the boards of health can stay up to date so we don't have to like keep pushing paper all over the place.
>> Um that's going to be the fastest way to get the updates and keep everybody >> Yeah.
>> Okay. I second that motion.
>> Any further discussion? No.
>> All right. All in favor? Hi.
>> Hi.
>> Hi.
>> Yeah, >> you're very good.
>> All right, moving on. Green burial regulation.
>> Yes, I did review. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. And um did everybody receive the regulation?
>> Yes.
>> I have a copy of it. I hope.
>> So, green.
green burials and home burials are allowed uh in the state of Massachusetts.
And um so the board had asked that we investigate adopting a set of regulations um which would outline a process to permit home burials and green burials.
Uh, green burials can be a home burial, but not all home burials are green burials.
Uh, what I what I did with this draft is I more or less uh modeled regulation regulations based on the state guidance uh for green barriers and home burials um and flipped them into a a simple regulation.
um that the board could consider. This is just a draft. Um I wasn't I didn't expect that we necessarily have a vote at this stage. Um but I did do my best to put them in final draft form.
>> Yeah. Um you've got your uh your nine sections um uh one one through three establishing your authority to enact regulations, the purpose for those regulations, and an effective date. That that's a blank spot right there. Um section four, your definitions. Section five, your general provisions, which is really the meat of the uh regulation.
You have section 5 uh.1 through 5.6 which essentially um establishes the procedure um for getting the approval and then of course um uh 7 and 9 um your your ability to seek variances or appeal decisions made by the board. So, um I would recommend uh scheduling a a public hearing on the regulations uh for public input um and then following such a hearing um and and contingent upon feedback from the community um subsequently post uh a date and time to adopt the regulations >> similar to previous regulations. Yeah.
>> Right.
Okay, Dr. Alen, >> I have a question. So, um there are a lot under 55 um of measurements and um regulatory bodies with responsibility.
Um whose onus uh is it? So, so is it the homeowner's onus to bring in someone to do the surveying, clear it through the different committees, determine the flood plane, all that stuff, or is that going to get stuck on? All right. Um, >> no, it would be the homeowner's job to prove it out.
>> So, okay, cuz there's a whole lot of whole lot of measuring got to go on there, right?
>> And then, you know, because you're involving >> it's recording, record, >> right? But then but wetlands involvement here. There's a whole lot of stuff here.
There's about 8 square ft in hardware that's going to be elig eligible for this. So, okay. Yeah. So, that's the the homeowner >> needs to come to you guys or whomever with the documents that certify each one of these little >> My assumption the way it would work is the the uh homeowner or predecess.
present them with the process and let them know that this is what they need to accumulate in order for it to happen.
>> Right. Cuz this could be quite costly.
>> Yes.
>> Seductive >> coming from my other committee I'm on.
This stuff could be very costly.
>> That that is acknowledged.
>> Okay. Yeah. Cuz I see there's septic rules here. There's there's >> Yeah. Well, well, water tables and all kinds of have to do a per test.
Certainly they could cut back the board.
I mean these are just >> I'm not asking to do it. I'm just wondering. So the point is it's going to be the homeowners of their job to come to you with a docu set of documents which basically they're going to certify >> that they have a suitable location.
>> Yeah.
>> Right. And I think too that this this is something that folks that are looking to establish um space on their on their lots for home burials. This is something they're going to want to do well ahead of time of people deceasing. This is not a process to approve >> grandma died last week.
This is going to take a whole bunch of time.
>> The locations >> surveyors and those holes dug in ground and >> Yes.
>> Right. All kinds of junk.
>> Okay. Matt, a question I had uh you know looking of course at the the fees section um realistically given the what uh Neil was saying about the costs involved.
>> Um what would you guess is the workload for the board and board personnel, all the health agents and all that? you know, we want we need to have an idea of that before we >> It seems like you would model it based on your your fee schedule for other similar items um in a plan review uh type type fee. I mean, I did I didn't put the fee in the rag because right >> then every time you updated the rag, you anytime you want to update the fee, you'd have to update the rag itself, >> right?
>> So, I left it loose. But I think that, >> you know, we could look at other towns It's also for burial. So I don't know, >> you know, if you want to be sensitive to that, I I you know, >> right, >> how much do you really want to charge, >> right, >> for this?
>> Especially, you know, as I said, given that >> it's a costly process to get there.
>> It is a costly process for the homeowner. So, >> right, but on the other hand, you want to >> we want to be involved. We want to be involved.
>> We want to be involved and we want to be sure the town's expenses. like a septic like a septic inspection.
>> I think it's going to be rare though. I don't >> Oh, I agree. Absolutely.
>> I don't think it's going to be common >> that people are applying for these, >> right? Absolutely. So, >> but since we actually have a citizen who's requested it, >> you do.
>> Are they here tonight?
>> They are not. They canceled at the last minute. Okay.
>> They were going to be here.
>> Um, did we get a letter?
>> It's in your packet. Oh wow. Oh, there it is.
The the letter from the individual.
I am unable to attend tonight's meeting.
Thank you for the invitation. It is important to discuss the various aspects. Oh, this is about cooling centers. So, never mind. It has nothing to do with me.
>> All right. Uh that will defer because uh okay. So, uh, he would have been here, but, uh, he's not here. And, uh, >> do so. We have to make a motion to >> He does regularly ask. I would say, uh, we have a motion to schedule a public hearing, >> right, for Okay. Um, motion to schedule public hearing regarding green barrels sometime soon.
>> Do we have our next meeting?
Not for August 15th.
We'll specify it as the uh next the August regular August meeting.
>> Okay. Uh what is when is that scheduled?
>> We don't have it yet.
>> We August isn't scheduled at all. Okay.
>> Cuz then yeah, we have some scheduling issues.
>> We have some scheduling issues.
>> Uh >> August and September.
>> Okay.
I'll move that we schedule a public hearing for this uh regulation and the next regularly scheduled public health meeting >> September 3rd.
That's what I have.
>> Yeah, I thought we had one in the schedule. Thursday, September 3rd.
>> September 3rd.
>> Well, I have I mean we can change it too. That's what I have.
>> August, >> whatever. Yeah, the problem with August was >> at least two of the board members are >> gone from much of ours.
>> Yes.
>> Yeah. I have third.
>> Yep. You want to have the put in uh we want to set a uh time for public >> I would say uh 15 minutes.
So we'll make it for 6:15 September 3rd and we'll be public here.
Second.
>> Second. Sorry.
>> Yes. All in favor?
>> I All right.
>> Thank you.
6:15 hearing.
All right.
The uh item five on the agenda was uh going to be a discussion on the the heat incident and cooling center uh controversy that we had uh over the 4th of July weekend. Um, I had a uh meeting with the town administrator today and uh conversation with the police chief and we decided it was more appropriate since we were missing so many of the uh bodies that we needed to have the discussion that we are going to have that discussion after the uh next uh department head meeting at the end of the month July 30th.
So we will send out uh reminder coming to people um police chief, fire chief, uh certainly I think I'll remember and the town administrator.
>> What was the the incident? Um the incident was well we had that really excessive heat uh unhealthy heat and um there was the feeling about town that we needed to be able to provide some sort of uh refuge for uh homebounds and seniors in distress and so forth. And um the plan was that people who needed to be rescued from that were to contact the police department, not through 911, but through the regular dispatch. And uh the police would find a way to move them somewhere >> uh where they could be cooled. Um and there was a specific discussion about bringing them to the police station including the Brain Tree Town Hall where they have air conditioning.
>> Yeah.
>> Um this got mutated online into a cooling center which triggers all sorts of uh uh C incident stuff which involves having staffing on hand to run the cooling center etc etc. The search director was caught off guard and got kind of irrated.
>> Mhm.
>> We want to make sure that >> Who's the search director?
>> Eric.
>> Eric. Eric.
>> Yes.
>> There's Yeah. Yeah. And there's issues with the search team anyway. As in >> Gotcha.
>> They don't have much of a search team right now.
>> Have fallen off yesterday. So, uh, we can't really trigger an incident in a cooling center that requires staffing if we don't really have the structures in place to do it. So, this is about addressing that situation.
>> It isn't actually a very big room. So, we wouldn't have had many people in >> Well, there's alternatives and we have had an arrangement, for example, with Eagle Hill.
>> Okay. I'm just saying that at the police the room they were going to use at the police department. Well, they would have used town offices or they wouldn't be in the police, >> but they would have to staff it.
>> It would take it would take a uh It's good thing Kevin's not here cuz then he'd launch into a discussion about his facility. So, >> so M the Mart issue though, >> um the reason I had Mart involved in that is uh Sharon knows all of these people. She knows where the vulnerability her input is.
>> Gotcha. Okay.
>> I may add, these are the people that are going to be in our data.
>> Correct. Exactly.
>> We're going to know about all of these people and have contact information and all that stuff.
>> Yeah. Um so uh you know we don't want to be releasing uh public promises of refuge where there wasn't really refuge and available. It was a uh >> and then it got out >> a collection of errors >> and then it got out on the email boards and it was kind of was the snowball down the hill.
>> Yes, I see. Yes.
>> It's July. We do not want snowballs.
>> No. Yes.
>> The other problem was that the senior center was closed.
>> Yes. Where people would normally have gone.
>> Normally, people would have gone to the senior center, but it was July 4th weekend.
>> Right.
>> Right. Right.
>> Right. And that would be the case here.
We had air conditioners here.
>> Going forward looking at Yeah. The town hall is actually also another location.
This room is right now. Um, let me turn off the air.
>> And the and >> um the what I think people are angling for is at least at the start to say if this is a daytime occurrence, you're struggling.
There are a number of facilities that have normal open hours that you can retreat to. doesn't suddenly encumber the town for uh staffing that they don't have to try and man a center >> but I understand somebody went to the ER and was treated for >> I had heard that I don't have any details on it >> but the wing >> yeah anyway we we we want you to we we want to have a better approach Okay. Uh, >> any other questions? Discussions.
>> Did you Did the board receive any requests for a cooling center?
>> No, not specific.
>> There was inquiries afterwards about >> right. I've aren't going to do something. I've been in other towns where um we have I've seen cooling centers propped up by finding a volunteer or somebody to open the doors essentially to a room with air conditioners and nobody shows up, >> right?
>> And so I you see I've seen it you see it play out heavily on Facebook.
The town the town should have a cooling center. you see that being said online and then when you open the cooling center >> no one show >> there's nobody that actually >> demands that's for my aunt Gertie I didn't want >> and that so that's I mean I'm not saying that is how it would necessarily play out in Hardwick but >> yeah and >> and I think >> I'm certainly cognizant of that >> I think I think it's the popup situation because say you popped open town hall for a day if you had staff to do it how are you supposed to communicate that efficiently to everybody that there is a cooling center, >> right?
>> Um, and it's a it's a challenge.
>> Yep.
>> Uh, Sharon is an an infallible resource, I suppose. I mean, I don't know that she knows all 3,000 people in town, but >> you know, enough. I saw >> so that uh you know she knows >> she has a lot of interactions with the most susceptible people and that's why >> uh you know getting that somewhat directed through her would be useful and she also has to keep that information confidential under HIPPA.
>> So in a way she has to be the conduit.
Maybe she'll be a good community health agent.
>> Yeah, >> that's You guys should keep her in mind when we get there.
>> Yeah.
>> All right.
>> And if I can plug our thing, I mean, if these people are in the system, we will have the ability to message out to them, >> right, >> for health related things because we can pay to put highspeed internet in the house.
>> Hey Joe, are you doing okay with >> you doing okay? Yeah, you're doing all right.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Uh health agent reports. We have multiple health agents on here. So, Richard, you came the long way.
>> Yes.
>> No, Matt came a long way, too.
>> But, uh >> thank you.
>> You got put on the agenda first.
>> Yeah. Wonderful. Um >> and uh afterwards before you leave, I just want to >> Yeah. Have a discussion.
>> Um so, I'll start off with the uh the food inspections.
>> Okay. Um, so we've been doing the food inspections in town. Um, on our tracker, I think we have a few left, about four of them, um, that are overdue, uh, for the routine inspections, but those are all lower risk establishments, food pantries, that sort of thing. Um, and what we've been finding when I go in is that there are some there are some violations. There are some gaps um, that have kind of gone unressed for a while.
And and namely that's like stuff like hand sinks, hand washing sinks, um service sinks, so mop sinks, stuff that's not easy to fix on the spot.
>> Yeah. Stuff like Michelle was uh ran into last year.
>> Yes. Yeah. Um and so what we're doing really is providing the education. Uh hey, this is why it's needed. Um these are the steps we can take to get there.
Cuz really the name of the game is compliance, right?
>> Um so that is a repeated pattern I've seen in town but all across the other municipalities as well. Um, so it's really just about working with the owners and and just finding a way to to get them up to speed. Um, similarly with uh the housing inspections as well, we received a number of housing complaints and complaints in general. Um, nuisances and such. There are some instances in the housing um where you know that there are some rental properties in in rough shape. Um, nothing that's you know condemnable uh during the warmer weather during the the colder season. then I have some concerns. Um but again, it's going in and providing that education to both um the occupants and to the owners of the properties um and working with them to to try and get them back into compliance um take care of those issues.
So, a big thing with the housing that we've been seeing um we got screens uh during the bug season, stagnant water, a lot of overgrowth. um and those things, you know, for the most part, they have the 30 days to take care of that and, you know, so I coordinate with them to to work that stuff out. Some of the bigger issues, though, um that I've been seeing are heavy content cases. Um a lot of vulnerable populations, particularly the elderly. Um and it is really compiling, you know, that egress is blocked. Um sanitation is an issue in some cases and as you were saying, access to healthcare. Um and and that's vulnerable populations on both sides. So I mean I've I've had >> age. Um so like young mothers for example, expectant mothers that to your point have to they're driving 45 50 minutes to an appointment and you know I only know that cuz I'm scheduling the appointments with them.
>> Um and so you know that in conjunction with you know there being mold in the dwelling unit, there being stagnant water and all of these things that kind of compile into you know potentially hazardous situation. So, um it's just about going in, meeting with the people, establishing that rapport, and then working towards a solution.
>> Right.
>> So, these are these are uh buildings that have occupants.
>> Yes.
>> They're not abandoned properties or >> uh No, for the No, I have not any vacant properties. I will get there though.
>> Okay. Okay. Go ahead. Yeah.
>> Uh for the most part, any of the inspections that I've done has they've been occupied. Um there was one very strange instance, a very old house that they were on their way out when I came to do the inspection, but uh that that house was a separate issue that that was very 1704 I think is when the house was deed. So I mean it has a cess pool.
There was no septic system. So I see it's a very old house but um >> that's your in sex pool.
>> Yes, >> they do still exist.
>> Yeah, it's a very very old house. It was it was a beautiful house, but yeah, very old. A lot of uh a lot of maintenance issues, but it just fallen into disrepair. Um, as far as the vacant houses, that is one point that I want to bring up. Um, >> I don't know if you've heard of the receiverhip program through the office.
>> Um, yeah, I was going to say we've I've had some success, some tentative success. Nothing is obviously the court system is a very long process. Um but with some vacant houses in some of the other municipalities um even if you know whether the owner is deceased and there's no next of kin um or if the house has fallen into disarray and it is you know it's causing a nuisance or is disturbing the neighbors. So we can we go in with the AGO's office we conduct um you know a site visit for my purposes. I need a warrant to go on the property or into the property. Um but they can do things a little bit differently. So >> my understanding is that um because of the uh legal costs uh the uh town administration has wanted us to sort of stay back from that just because >> yeah it is it >> can't afford it >> right? Uh I'm not sure.
>> You think we encounter those costs with the receiverhip program also or?
>> Yeah, the the municipality does get a kickback uh not a kickback but you know can make money off of it in terms of you know if there be leans on for taxes or anything like that on the property. Um to be honest with you, I haven't really done a lot of looking around for the vacant houses in in town.
>> Um I've passed by some that I would assume are are vacant and or condemnable. Yes. So, so I think there there's two individuals here who would like to maybe have a have a comment about that about because they're impacted by an abandoned property that >> Okay.
>> Can we talk about the whole thing right now?
>> Uh yeah, absolutely.
>> All right.
>> My name is Alan Jubert. This is Susan.
>> Susan Messier >> Nessier and she owns Susan headquarters >> down like right in the center of town and her businesses. And we're here to further a complaint that she's had since 2020. Oh, okay.
>> All right. And during that time, the occupants of that house, you know, would deposit motor vehicles, junk. They damaged her her property. And at that time, um, I had I was still in the state police and I went down to her sister because, uh, local police wouldn't help her out. We had vehicles towed. um she had spent a lot of money securing the property and during that time Tex Ceria was on the board of health >> right >> I don't know if most people here remember him so text and you spoke of receiverhip so I have in my hand a order from central housing court wester session of receiverhip and it says town of hardwick by and through its board of health plaintiff and then the defendants David Craneier and Aser Craneer.
So that property which is 18 to 20 Church Street is in receiverhip and there's five pages here that dictates what that receiver should have done. The only thing that was ever done was a blue tarp was put on the roof which you could buy at, you know, Harbor Freight and in about two months it was in pieces in her yard.
>> Interesting.
>> When you say the receiver, who who's that? Is that That's the question. We We'd like to find out. You mean the owner of the property appointed >> or appointed a receiver and of which she's never spoken to. We don't know who it is. And the town of Hardwick has been kicking this can for six years. And so I got some like paperwork here. So at the time I talked to text, there was a lean on that property for $2,479.
Then a couple years later, Counter Harvest printed in the paper that that property owed $9,575.
That was May 12th of 2022. So, here we are in 2026. It's probably owed well over 15,000, right?
>> And on April 13th, 2026, in the minutes of the hardwood board of selection, they went into executive session to speak about this property and other properties. Of course, we don't know what they said because it's executive session. So, we're here today for the board of health since they're part of this receiverhip to do some work in fixing this problem. And whether it's using the people that you have in town, you know, the building inspector, the fire department, you know, I understand the whole legal question, but that's not our problem. You know, we're taxpayers.
She's a business owner. There's not many business owners in this town left. And a lot of people in this room use her, including myself, right? And she maintains a nice piece of property there. Now, that derelch property and the one next to it are fire hazards >> and occupied.
They're marked abandoned.
>> Not the one, but is what is it?
Sullivan.
>> I'm a little head. I'm a little >> And she's here to say she has seen with her own eyes rats. Right. And if that's not a border health issue, I don't know what is.
>> Yeah. All the paper make the cop.
>> So >> I had a similar situation in next to my rental property and I went to see the town. They like, well, what do you want us to do about it? I'm like, I'll handle it from here. Right. And eventually that whole property was cleaned up because this is a huge liability issue for somebody. And but the town of Hardick based on what we're seeing here in this meeting, you are aware of it. You are aware of it in 2020 and allowed it to continue to 2026.
Why do we know is has the is the owner like >> the owner is from Minnesota, >> right? But are they avail?
>> She met him once.
>> Right. Right. So the day that the U top was being put on the roof, it was subzero >> and I see this truck pull up a white van with the ladders stacked to the ceiling.
>> Not really.
>> Okay.
>> And I went out and I said, "What are you doing?" Cuz I was working. It was a Friday. And he said, "I'm putting a top on the roof." Which I wanted because I have shingles that are hitting my building and I'm the one that has to clean them up. And I'm going to tell you exactly what I do. Anything that comes from that building goes in the broken cellar holes because it's not mine and I'm not paying to get rid of it. Right.
>> Secondly, I said, "What are you doing?"
This lady shows up. She says, "The owner is going to be here." She shows up. I said, "I want to talk to her." She came in and she says to me, "This is not what we bought for $5,000."
>> I said, "Where are you from?" She says, "Minnesota." I said, "You bought this?"
Yes. I said, "On site, you bought this for $5,000?" Yes. I didn't see Exactly.
They She This is what she thought she bought. I said, "What did you think you bought for $5,000?"
>> The man put the top on the roof. Okay.
Then that was winter snow. What do you think happens when there's this much snow on the roof and the sun hits it?
Now mind you, I'm my building is closer than that wall to here. The snow is falling off, sliding to the point where it was smashing the side of my building to if you were sitting there, you hit the roof because you I didn't know what happened the first the first time it happened. Then I kind of knew my building is getting wrecked and no one seems to Dr. Romano, I took you for a nice walk one day. Your eyeballs were as big as saucers. You were shocked to see I've been complaining um with um Kenan Young. He told me, "Put put yellow tape up. Do this, do that, do this, do that."
I've tried to do it all. Allan's been my best friend forever. He says, "Let's work together on this." You know what it is? M. And now we have rats, raccoons. I mean I listen when I see a squatter living in there I will not be at work on the two nights that I work I'll be scared to death and I'm waiting to see someone move in wrongly.
>> Have you seen anybody going in and out?
>> No I No, I haven't. But I'm just saying because they do >> awful. But to be honest with you, these buildings are actually the buildings some of the buildings I was talking about when I was just talking to you guys. So it's good.
>> I had been over there for a different and >> you're reinventing the wheel. It's already happened >> apparently. We want to move forward. So yeah.
>> Yeah. Yeah. So, that would be I I'm more than happy to reach out to the AGO's office and find out what's going on. Um, and if it's stagnated and there's nothing going on, then I'm happy to restart that process. Um, as well as looking into whether or not the buildings have been condemned um or placarded for not being >> has a blackard fire department blackard not entering it.
>> Okay. You know, but >> taken down what is the process?
>> Town has to pay.
>> Town has to pay for it.
>> Town has to pay for >> We went through this last year >> because the town has to pay for it. If you if you assume it, it's yours and you have to pay for it.
>> You know, it's like the uh building church street.
>> I brought a contractor in.
>> It's like the holding ground.
>> The ground demolition contract.
>> I brought him in said, "I don't own this property, but I would like you to give me an estimate of what's going to cost to tear this building down." And my ultimate plan and I was working with Keenan Young and Tex and we did have someone who was interested in the property was to try to convince the town to give them the property at a very low price with the with the understanding the building gets torn down. The other thing I was on the sewer committee at the time is this had like I believe two.edus. It was a two apartment place. So they continue to acrue edus that when they're unpaid they're put on the property tax. That's how we collect sewer fees that are unpaid. And so that's how this number just goes up and up.
>> So she's right in in 2017 if you go back in the records you will find out that that property was bought for $5,800. Is this person around? I mean have you ever >> I know but have you ever tried to find them? I've never Well, >> they aren't going to >> If I was on the police department, the first thing I would do is take out a criminal complaint against them for creating a public nuisance.
>> Well, that's what I was going to There are, you know, I'm more than happy to come out and and take a look. I haven't seen it yet. Um, with my >> Do it a date. I'll meet you there.
>> I'll meet you there, too.
>> Can we Can we set up a time and >> Yeah, tomorrow.
>> Like, tomorrow's not a good day.
>> I really can't come out, though, in the in the near future.
>> You can come out and visit with her for sure. Um, yeah, tomorrow or we can >> do I'm I'm actually both from 8 to 5, but I mean I can talk to you while I'm working. I just >> Yeah, there's no worries at all. Yeah, I'll go. I'll take some pictures. I can take a look at everything. Um, like I said, I'll give you my contact information.
>> Um, and yeah, I'm looking into that. I mean, like I said, that was those were the buildings I was I was thinking of.
So, that's great.
>> Can you agree that 6 years?
>> I had no idea what was going on for so long. It's unreasonable.
>> Yeah, I would. Yeah, I agree. So, let's try and move forward with it. And and the other thing um too is if we placard it unfit for human habitation, that would give a little bit more power to the municipality when dealing with people um moving in illegally because it's deemed not fit for human habitation.
>> So, there's 40 chickens living in the downstairs apartment when they when they got kicked out.
>> Chickens.
>> There's 40 chickens in the downstairs apartment.
>> Yes.
>> Did they give you an estimate what the cost was for >> 29,000? 29,000 to take it down. tear it down to the ground, fill the cell the hole with gravel and put up a fence around it. But that was a few years ago.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> So probably in this day and age add another tent to that, right?
>> You may have to make a pitch to, you know, the town, you know, somehow that would be really, you know, that's a challenge as you know, but that's what we'd have to do is try to get the town to allocate money.
>> Does the building have any value?
>> None.
This is what the receivers can receive some value to somebody.
>> And if they can't make something off of it, they're not interested. You know, if you're looking at 30,000 50,000 into tearing a building down to get an empty lot, you're probably not going to get a lot of people lining up.
>> Well, the issue the issue too though is, you know, if somebody they supposed to go through a vetting process, the receiver, to, you know, make sure that they are a a good candidate for the receiverhip. But to your point, if they got into the project and realized that it was way more than they thought, you know, that they offer more than they could chew, then probably wouldn't abandon it. You know, >> they do they just walk away. The receivers like 30 days if you quit.
>> So the receivers walk away and you know, >> nobody owns the property now. Well, I mean, it says uh this David and Ozra, >> they're the receivers.
>> I mean, you can Google the name and find his I'll have to look into it.
>> Yeah. In Minnesota, >> and like for me, it's if we had problems with people out of state, we call out the local police department. Go knock on their door. You know, you hear this all the time. They won't respond to any mail or letters.
>> All right. There's ways you get around that, you know. Well, and that is something else that the, you know, the house necessarily doesn't have to be um unowned. You know, it could just be a vacant property that's dilapitated. And if an owner is in another state, part of the receiverhip program is to still track that owner down. Um, and you know, kind of uh try to get them to do something. Um, you know, I won't go into the legal nitty-gritty cuz I don't know to be honest, but um I think their original idea was to buy this property, fix it up a little bit, flip it, >> make some money, and leave, right?
>> But we're stuck with it. She's stuck with it.
>> The town, the village, >> you know, the town is stuck with it.
We're all stuck with it.
>> Yeah, we all are stuck with it.
>> And there's other properties, too, that, you know, fall into the same category.
So, it would be nice to >> Yeah, we could bunch them together and address them all together.
>> It's been going on for so long.
>> I think we could get together a little group of people that figure out a way to do things and >> that's it.
>> I mean, it's a town bike conundrum. I mean, not to diminish what you're going through. So, >> we've got >> Can you take it village by village? you know, could could it be like a a Gilbertville and we want to you know, you know, >> you know, the the problem always comes back around to the funding to do what's definitive.
>> So, there's a political there's it's a political fight as well. I mean, we have to make the case to the town and make the town meeting and the select board, >> right?
>> And I think if Susan was younger, you know, 20 years ago, and she was in business and wanted to use it as a parking lot, she would have looked at it as an investment property. She would read it across the street.
>> Same thing, right? I mean, he's looking at retirement. He's not looking at buy a piece of property and turn it into a parking lot.
>> And so, but town of Hardick doesn't have money, but other people do, you know?
And I think if the town of Hardwick was able to advertise that that building and that vacant lot and like we have conversations all the time and say, "If I wanted to start a business in town, where would I do it?
Name a building. Name a place for rent in the town of Arman. Name a piece of property that I can buy and build a building.
>> There is none.
>> Right.
>> Okay. So, how should we >> We're going to let Richard follow up.
>> Yeah, I I'm more than happy to follow up on that. From the sounds of it, um it fizzled out. Great. Um that was long before my time. Um I'm from Worcester.
>> That's an easy ride.
you go right over here into the courthouse and knock on the door, right?
Um, so the success we've had with the AGO's office though has been very recent. We had that with them a few months ago. They came out um and conducted some inspections.
>> Um, but that, you know, the court process does take some time.
>> I've been very lucky with criminal complaints. All right. In my course of my career and you know, a lot of times you charge somebody criminally and all of a sudden their license is suspended and the way that they're doing business no longer happen.
>> A magic trick, huh?
>> It's a magic trick.
Maybe we can work together somehow.
>> Police department, you know, creating a public nuisance is a statute in Massachusetts. That's exactly what that is.
>> That's a powerful one. Yeah. So, I'll go out some pictures and and start a new.
>> Can you report back to us?
>> Okay. Great.
>> And we know that we have limited water resources on that block from >> You'll stop in tomorrow.
>> Yeah. I I I'll reach out.
>> Thank you very much for your time.
>> Make photo.
>> You want photo copies of that? Want to take photo copies or you happy just seeing them?
>> I haven't just seen them for now.
>> You're good. Okay, you're good. Keep at us.
>> Yeah. Thank you very much.
Next time I'm going to show you.
>> Okay.
Yeah. And then we'll do the final meeting.
Thank you.
>> Excuse me.
>> That's fine.
>> Yep.
>> Thanks.
>> All right.
>> Might need that.
>> Thanks out there.
>> Richard, you got anything else before we turn over to Matt?
>> Um, no. I one one thing really quick.
the uhratom or credatom as it's called.
Are you guys familiar with uh this?
Okay. Um I I should have looked it up before I came. I don't know if there's any local regulations or bylaws that you guys have already. Um it's kind of an emerging issue. Um we're not >> in a nutshell, but is it the gas station crack?
>> Yeah, it's a synthetic synthetic or naturally occurring. But >> yeah, there was a thing on John Oliver.
>> Oh, last week.
It's not it's not classified, so it's not regulated.
>> Right. Exactly. And and my concern just being in some of these places that are selling it. Um >> it's just that because it's unregulated, there might not be any ill will or malice, but it's still, you know, vulnerable populations, especially kids, uh are going to be attracted to the packaging. And um so just to bring that to your attention, it's something to sort of consider. Uh there are municipalities in Massachusetts that have already put a ban on it um just because, you know, it does function similarly to an opiate and it can stop the breathing. It can be very it can be very dangerous. Can cause psychosis.
>> Um >> maybe we should act pretty quickly in this.
>> I I don't think it's necessarily a uh imminent threat, but it is certainly blooming. It's I imagine that it will be an issue. Our populations here in Gildedville and Wheel and you know in in club area would be >> selling like the same people we have trouble with with the uh tobacco >> and that's actually part of the reason I'm kind of making uh bringing it up now is because you know I've been um eyeing the tobacco. I haven't done any inspections yet but just kind of looking >> we have the mha is doing >> Yeah. Right. Right. And so I've I've heard about those too. Um but when you you go in doing the routine inspection, you see the cratom you see and it is a concern. I think the next >> that's Michelle and I had the discussion about >> you know you guys going in the education aspect before the hammer comes.
>> Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Exactly.
>> Is there existing um rags that we can model on?
>> Uh I would have to look into that. I know there are other municipalities that have implemented them. Um like LOL for example. I know Lola's has got a credom bylaw, you know, banning it for sale.
So, I can take a look at that and, you know, forward it or or be in contact more about that. I just wanted to bring it up. Um >> Okay. Yeah, we're open to >> I think that the town's taken a pretty active stance on controlling substances, >> right?
>> Uh I think you had a lot of public support for that uh when you implemented Yeah.
>> nicotine-free generation.
>> Yeah. So >> it certainly seems it certainly seems to a reasonable extension.
>> What are we a healthare desert? Is that what we're kind of >> how else are you going to protect uh folks?
>> What about is orange doing anything?
>> No. Honestly, this >> I this is the thing I learned today. So thank you. Um it's not on my radar yet.
>> Yeah. Okay.
>> But um certainly uh it's always an evolving situation.
>> Yeah. So I, you know, if LOL did it.
>> Yeah.
>> Um, have we gotten any push back, >> you know, case law? Yeah, probably not.
So, >> yeah, it's pretty new.
>> Yeah, I think typically um if the board can surmise that there's even a 1% chance of a detrimental health effect, then um the board of health regulations will uh survive the court test um and judge will will side with the board of health for enacting you know quote unquote reasonable health regulations.
So even though it is nuance and even though you might not have any case law cuz if if I'm a producer of a product and a board of health enacts a health regulation, I'm going to sue that town, right, to be able to make sales.
>> Yeah. And there are complications.
>> I'm sorry.
>> No. Yeah.
>> Well, the complication being that it can be used um to help people with substance use uh similarly to methadone or suboxone. So it could be used for a benefit in its natural form. The concern more is the synthetic stuff. The concentration I think the number I heard was that it's it's 100 times more potent than morphine in some instances. So it's just incredibly powerful.
>> It is reversed with nine.
>> It can. Yes, it can also >> it's reverse with nine.
>> Not as efficiently, but it can. So there's pending legislation. Senate 1558 proposing a complete statewide ban and house 5127 proposing to keep it uh legal but allowing local uh restrictions >> from >> Massachusetts.
So, uh, currently banned in Boston, Bourne, Drakit, Chumsford, Foxboro, Hanover, Kingston, L Marorrow, Marshfield, Northampton, uh, Rockland, and Weouth. It's pretty good.
>> So, I think you're in good company enacting uh, a regulation.
>> Yeah. And you can get aware to get >> our regulation and, you know, something we can look at.
>> And do you have do you have any that you know of? Uh, no, not off hand, but you know, like I said, we can look into it.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Okay. Thank you for bringing that up.
>> That was great. Can you reach out to public health? Okay.
>> Yeah.
>> Ask them. Would >> like to health trainer get into contact with him. He he was the one that gave the presentation um a few months back, but Okay.
>> Yeah. I can't think.
>> That would be great if he could send that to us at, you know, health.gov.
Okay. Awesome.
Okay, >> that's from Northampton. It's online.
>> Oh, that's a regulation.
>> Regulation.
>> Cool.
>> Pirate.
>> Just look it up.
>> Yeah. Which is >> where this unregulated novel intoxicating products.
That's pretty broad.
>> Yeah.
>> I mean, this stuff, this is one specific thing.
Is that how you say it?
>> Oh, there somewhere. Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Oh, right here.
>> You just go down.
>> Yeah. Just download >> there.
>> No intoxicating product.
>> I open that up. That's just >> Well, but it specifically does mention >> kids used to go to store and get vanilla extract cuz it has a little alcohol in it. I mean, that sort of thing. You know, kids don't kids are very creative.
>> The the attorney general's program for receiverhip does not have a cost to the town.
>> Okay. the attorney. If you can get the attorney general to file and pursue um against the property owner, they will bear the cost of filing in court and go into court. Okay? That's only if you can get the AG to actually take on the project. Um many towns have been successful with this. The other option is if the AG does not have the capacity to take on properties, the town can petition the court themselves through their own labor count uh from their own town council to push uh houses through receiverhip. Um I've been involved in both. Um, Hardwick doesn't have a lot of money. So, if uh Richard, you you were able to get to take on some houses, then that's great for the town.
>> Um, the process of appointing a receiver is the real challenge right now. There's no receivers.
>> Right. Right.
>> Okay. That's that's the whole >> Well, we got solicited by one, but you know, the question is >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Alan Hope emails everybody.
>> Yeah, there you go. My concern is >> we could talk to Alan Hope. I mean, I don't I haven't worked with him personally, but he's Have you seen that?
>> Yeah.
>> Um I my only thing for you folks this month is I did reach out to the health and uh home and health and home alert network.
Uh the Han >> the Han.
>> Yes. And I did get in touch with somebody at DPH who can essentially uh activate everybody on the board.
>> I think we I I get Han.
>> Do you get Han?
>> Yeah.
>> Okay. So, if you >> if you two want to get on the Han, um I just need the email address and the phone number that you want tied to your account. Um and >> yeah, you get you'll get alert text and all that activate. How often do you get text?
>> Daily.
>> Pretty much. Yeah.
>> Yeah. So, if you if you want to get on >> three times a day when the uh World Cup was going >> really >> the World Cup, it was like all the time.
>> What was the >> um they're just letting you know public health throughout the state knowing what the status is with the World Cup and you know, it's >> Yeah, they they were activating um they were activating their >> statewide system. Yeah. Yeah. Alert from >> Is this through GPH? Is this a GP? Yeah.
Okay. I do get that actually.
>> You do get those?
>> Yeah. Okay.
>> From my work. Yeah. From what I Yeah.
So, >> you should be getting them every day.
>> Yeah. I don't get them every day. I mean, you know, >> give them a new email.
>> So, whatever your email and phone number is, you know, if you >> How about you screen them? Let me know.
Let me know if there's anything I should know about, Lisa.
Okay, >> I have enough to >> Yes.
>> Anything else, Matt? No.
>> All right. Uh, administrative clerk's report. C.
>> Can I just ask Matt one quick question?
>> Sure. If a property if if a septic system if if a home if there's a cash transaction from one owner to another do you get notified of of um septic uh issues >> no so if there's a if there's a cash transaction >> or hereditary >> so if there's a hereditary transaction it may not we talking title five inspection >> yeah title >> so if you read title five it does describe certain exemptions from the title five uh inspection and um a direct familial transfer is typically exempt >> which is how familial >> which is how you have sessal >> not the familial thing but but just cash transactions if someone buys a house for cash >> a cash transaction these can slip through the cracks and the reason they can slip through the cracks is because the mortgage companies typically require the title 5 to be done in order to execute the underwriting for the mortgage. Um so in a cash transaction unless the board became aware that the cash transaction occurred, >> right?
>> Um the flag for requiring the title 5 report not might not be triggered. Yep.
>> Now, if it became known to the board of health that there was a cash transaction that did occur and they didn't otherwise meet an exemption under uh the CMR, then the board could then subsequently order uh unfortunately the new owner um of their responsibilities to conduct five inspection.
>> Yeah. Um, and I do know, um, I've talked to other boards about this, and you know, in some some cases, I guess when they have free time in their hands, they've checked the sales logs, um, just to see if any houses in town flipped and then followed up and had like the inside track with local realtors to to to find out. And then of course, >> but with an local realtor, you know, bank could bite you in the ass if you >> I mean, probably not. It's probably a very high percentage of transactions have some type of a bank involved.
>> Right. Right. Right. Right.
>> Right.
>> But yeah, >> no. Specifically asked about the cash transactions, >> but assess pool can pass 805.
>> Mhm.
>> So you can't just fail at assess pool.
You have to have some type of failure criteria.
Um, so theoretically if it's on a low water table area and it's functioning then accessible can't survive a title 5 inspection.
It's possible.
>> Yeah.
>> But 5 years later probably won't, >> right?
>> No. No. Yeah. Somebody was asking about specifically cash transactions whether we are notified for title 5 inspections.
>> Red flag, brick.
That's Alan who asked me that anyway. Okay.
>> Okay. Um, good evening everyone. I only have a few administrative updates. Uh, we've had a new business inquiry. We received a call from a prospective new business owner. His name is Mark. I cannot pronounce his last name. I'm sorry. He's considering opening an ice cream shop. So, I sent him a copy of our food establishment plan review uh application and we're looking forward to hearing from him. His ice cream >> soft serve >> soft serve. I don't know.
>> We have to ask that question. That's an important question. Yes.
>> So, he has the application. So, he'll find out all the information he needs from that.
>> So, hope to hear back from him. Um food permit applications. We've had a few quite a few over the last three weeks of six uh including from the whistle stop. We're expect it's expected to be open in August.
Um anyway, I think many people in town will be happy to see it back.
>> Yes.
>> Yes.
Um, also during the week, our animal control officer Tina, she reached out to ask if the town or the board of health could assist in acquiring dog kennels or crates for temporary housing of lost or stray dogs because during the 4th July holiday, she cared for several runaway dogs in her home and she needs a safe way to keep them separated. and she's looking into options that could help in future situations and what >> can >> I mean SEAP would provide you that but they require it only used in an emergency situation other than that that's something we would have to do >> uh I think I told you through STM and all that >> I would bet that in Now, there's lots of people with kennels they don't want anymore. Um, and maybe not board, but some public person could just post on the uh either on the um town common or the Facebook group.
People could donate and leave cages wherever.
Um this is I mean I know we've gotten rid of a number of them that way just saying hi we've got this size cage who wants it and people come out of the room. So there might be people with spare cages. I don't know if you want to >> do you think is looking to is she looking for a place to store the dogs you know have them or she will >> I think she wants to probably online to contain them.
>> Yeah.
>> That was the impression.
>> I think so.
>> That was it again.
>> That was the impression. that what that >> that she wanted a containment apparatus on her property.
>> Gotcha. Okay.
>> So, she's now looking for a place property that >> Dr. Ma, how what is our acco program? Do we have an animal control officer program?
>> We have an animal control officer. Uh, it's an independent position under the town budget. I've >> Okay.
>> Never dealt with like a phone department. Who's the animal inspector?
>> The animal inspector is >> okay.
>> And it's like court appointment.
>> Yes.
>> Uh we've approved it though.
>> We did. There's a bylaw that you have or no sorry there's a statute local option acceptance town meeting vote can uh change the nominating authority from a select board to the board of health if accepted a town meeting >> I think it actually might be >> it's under she's recommended >> correct no well no the under the statute the board of selectment unless um the statutes accepted the board of health nominates needs an animal inspector um annually to >> recommend to the yamar. So and then the yar does a point. So the really the question is who nominates select board of the board health which is a kind of a point. So >> us >> so it is us. So, um, >> I've had a tough I petitioned DPH a few years ago when they were pushing PH and I said we have a really tough time with animal welfare and animal health and it's a significantly underfunded uh issue in this towns. Um, I had my animal inspector in my hometown. I did that job for 3 years. I had hundred animal inspections and I think I got a $600 statement came out to like a dollar an hour or less and it was like basically volunteerism and I know that in many of these towns they can't find people to take on the animal inspector job >> because it's too much work.
>> Um but DPH was not willing to essentially >> shocking >> spend the grant the ample grant money they had on this issue. Um I think as far as the board of health >> picking and choosing their battles >> and the board of health buying kennels, you know, it's not >> well that would be the the board of health would not be >> Yeah. I don't think it's that's >> the town the town. Um but I like Neil's idea of somebody reach out and >> especially with the context of what it's for. I think that would be successful.
>> Yeah.
>> But nothing, >> right? But in the meantime, what if she finds a runaway dog and has it for a week? Can't keep it crated. So, I'm thinking it's what she means by a kennel.
>> Yeah.
>> So, at least has a run.
>> Is there a shelter?
>> She said that. I think she said when the police department was here, they used to take the dogs here, but now we don't have a police department. So, um >> they used to take the dogs in the basement.
>> Really?
>> Really?
overnight.
>> I don't know.
>> No, no. When the police department >> when the police department's over.
>> Yeah. Animal control typically falls under the police department.
>> Yeah.
>> Um and so >> yeah, cuz they call her when they find >> an animal control officer is typically a police officer essentially working in animal control. So it is scope of the need to deal with it. Um but you folks don't have the facilities >> right?
Talk to your friends in where?
>> Maybe they can.
>> Friends and I mean the police police department where?
>> Yeah, we got friends over there.
>> West Brookfield. Tommy Glorski used to he was an animal control officer in rare and I think he kept he had a row of kennels up by his house.
>> He still does. I think they're loaded with every bit of hoarding material that can be ordered.
Oh dear.
>> I don't drive by there as much as I used to.
>> Would she need a kennel license if she had it at our house?
>> Probably.
>> Yeah.
>> Maybe there's issues with the neighbors.
>> Yeah. Right. Yeah.
>> Tommy's advantage was there was really no one around him.
>> Nah. Yep.
Okay. Anything else?
>> Um, well, the complaints were handled by uh by Rich and then the only other thing I had is the um the FEP emergency. What was this? The uh region developed the crisis and emergency sir uh toolkit which uh you went to that last meeting, >> right? And I have to send you the toolkit.
>> So, we have that available. That's what we saw here.
>> Okay.
And then um LHC >> went to the July 5th meeting.
>> Uh is that the one I was I said >> was that you?
>> No, I didn't go.
>> Oh, that you know what? They didn't have one in July.
>> Oh, >> you're just messing with me, you know.
If I guess >> right. So the last thing was LRPHC the discussion on the expiration of the current grant fund grant funding and future plans maintaining regional public health services.
>> This would be the question I had for you but we can have that discussion afterwards about >> sure >> what's happening.
>> Yeah. since our budget meeting. We don't have to have that in this setting.
Um, >> so that's all I have.
>> Okay.
>> Can FEP be used for cooling centers? I mean, is that within following the cur?
>> What do you mean by >> Well, I mean somehow like funding >> air conditioners.
>> Yeah.
>> Protect your life.
>> Did Lester vote a budget? must go to the budget.
>> Okay.
There was a lot of discomfort.
Um yeah, I my issue is that let's stand at the end of the husatonic tunnel and watch the bright light getting closer and closer and closer.
And that would be the Lester advisory board.
not we had no quorums for about five months, you know, where you're supposed to make a decision and we got to do something about the project and the funding and >> you know, Rich, I was there at every meeting. I showed up.
>> Um, and you'd be there, we can't take a testimony before. It was maddening. And now we get to the end of the fiscal year and >> oh no >> the options were not good.
>> Did they up the assessment for the towns? I'm guessing no.
>> Okay.
>> Nope.
>> Yeah.
>> Lost the COVID funding which was funding a couple of positions.
>> Yes. It was cut down.
>> Had to make cuts.
>> My nurse was able to get into the Blue Cross Blue Shield grant.
Um, so I was able to like supplement hers, but she's down to halftime deal otherwise.
>> And so, well, you know, this is the thing with the with the, you know, safe and the whole uh PhD thing is >> you want all of this stuff done.
>> It's not true.
>> Yeah. Anyway, >> are you Grant or are you >> Grant Phm PH?
>> She survived, I assume.
>> Yeah. My uh Jason O'Brien, health inspector under the ground, worked for me. He just took the regular job in Irving cuz he he's like, you know, I don't love working here for you guys, but this is a permanent opportunity.
I'm like Jason listening man like >> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Do what you got to do.
>> We We've been lucky to have you right now. Please take that job.
>> Well, Michelle was like, >> "Yeah, >> I just felt terrible because >> the people she worked with every day.
She might save everybody."
>> They had to let people go that always thinks.
>> Okay. So, if she was going to fall on the sword, you can't do that. There are jobs out there. So, >> yeah, but you know the problem is >> it's June 30th of the fiscal year.
You're going to tell them now.
>> That is the problem.
>> Duh.
>> Yeah. If they had ironed this out in April, then they would had a couple months.
>> Correct. It's a job.
>> That was just inexcusable to me.
Anyway, um, okay. Uh, old business. You're all set, right, Patricia?
>> I'm all set.
>> Uh, old business status updates, ongoing projects. I just put a note in there.
Uh, lower road landfill. I met with Mark Popp and the you were asking about the contractor. Atlas is the contractor.
>> Um, went through where all the well locations are. So, we did the testing >> and the PAS.
>> Yes, the PAS had all of it. Um, reports will take about six weeks and hopefully get to DEP and uh they will less in the end.
>> Yeah.
>> Okay.
>> So, I think we'll be okay there. Yes, sir.
>> If it comes back negative, >> do you ever get to stop testing that site? You know, Neil, I asked that question >> because I have an interest as a another thing I'm involved with.
>> So, on the board, as as you know, there are hundreds or perhaps thousands of landfills like this.
>> Yes. Across the country.
>> Um, and you're only in trouble if someone finds out about it.
>> And there is a story which I can tell you afterwards because it's just long and torturous about how this was discovered and what happened. Uh, but the question I asked Mark the other day was exactly that. He said, "This landfill's been closed for 40 years. It was like people threw their old china and shoes in here.
>> It's never really tested anything. It's an online landfill." Um, >> how long do we play this game?
>> It's like, well, can we appeal to D and say, >> "You're killing us. you know, this little town has to spend $20,000 a year >> testing $26,000 a year testing this stupid landfill.
>> Uh, and the answer is I have never seen DP walk away from them.
>> Oh, this is a word.
>> So, the likelihood is you can ask, but the answer will be not.
So >> which >> which leads in the meantime we have an unregulated dump just happening in Gilbert.
>> Yes.
>> Which continues to expand and >> Oh 49.
>> Yeah.
>> Church >> and high road.
>> Yeah.
>> Um >> well this is the thing about you know poor Susan. I mean like >> this is tough as well.
>> I tried to get into >> about the the guy doing waste of his waste disposal company.
>> He's just dumping in the backyard >> who was bringing stuff into his backyard and setting down on fire at night.
>> No.
>> Wow.
>> That's not still ongoing.
>> No.
>> Oh my god.
>> Fire department.
>> No, I got the fire.
>> I went there with the uh the fire chief.
No, if you go up high road, the amount of paper waste that is piled in a mountain up there. He's there.
>> I don't think I might not have gone up far enough.
>> I went up I could see I could see the cars and there were like the scrap metals.
>> Oh, no, no, there's a mountain of paper waste there. I think he was taking recycling and just dumping it in a mountain business.
>> He runs a waste hauling business.
>> Feedel, huh?
>> Fred feed.
>> Yeah. Is he licensed?
>> Yeah. I know the the story that I got was a little bit different as to the background on it, but >> Oh, I see the truck move in and out of there and piles come and go.
>> Yeah. I mean, I noticed I was driving by there today. I saw that a few of the dumpsters have been moved out of >> Freddy is of the mind come and get me, >> right? Well, that's the that's the issue. Just God knows what's behind his house.
>> Correct.
>> And God knows what's up on the hill behind the chain. And when it rains, the water runs down the road from up on High Street down.
>> I've seen I've seen behind the primary house. I've not been able to see that secondary house.
>> Just go up just go up High Street to where the chain is across the driveway and go, "Oh, look at that."
>> Yeah, I see. I don't think >> Does he have a permit though? The trash haul.
>> He has a he has a DBA doing business, >> but no, he does not have a trash haul that town. That's actually something that I've seen across.
>> Yeah. that this whole area is people um creating these LLC's or creating these businesses and it's solid waste removal, junk removal. You know, they show up to somebody's house and sometimes it's not even in the municipality. They're like going to Worcester or something like that.
>> Yeah.
>> Taking stuff and then Yeah. disposing of it improperly, whether it's burning or throwing it in the woods. Um >> Okay.
>> And especially if the person is doing it on private property, it does get a little dicey as far as, you know, ordering them to correct it and so on and so forth.
>> Well, he was an easy mark. The burner was an easy.
>> Yeah. Right. Right. How did you guys find it?
>> Well, this is a column of fire.
>> Yeah, but this is just, you know, >> this is >> God knows what's behind his house.
>> He doesn't care if he has a permit.
>> No. Oh, I know.
>> So, >> he's getting pretty old. He's going to die soon.
>> I had like a pile of cows. A farmer lit on fire off her, too.
>> Oh my god.
>> That was crazy.
>> What?
>> A pile of what? cows.
>> Dead cow.
>> Dead cow. Oh, dead cow. Okay.
>> My backside. My backside neighbor. He just used to push them into the creek.
>> Upream from our house. But >> we we called the state fire marshal.
Like we >> That was a smoke.
>> Well, that's what it was. You're going to like order complaints and you know, you could see the smoke and >> smell. Weird.
So D wouldn't get involved in this. D wouldn't get involved in this kind of situation.
>> D might get involved. Yeah. Depending on the situation, >> right?
>> It's possible. Much of it's local violations, but there are state agencies that may get involved.
>> Um >> do they need to be notified?
>> Yeah. I mean, if he's collecting, say they're collecting house household hazardous waste as a commercial entity and say they start accumulating quantities
Related Videos
Campagne CA$$$H Pourquoi revendiquer un meilleur financement? (version nov.2022)
trpocb
153 views•2022-11-03
Modern Privilege and Perspective
Samvoyage1
858 views•2026-04-16
Davos 2019 - Global Economy in Transition
wef
19K views•2019-02-09
The Vertical Long-Run Aggregate Supply (LRAS) Curve
educo-mr
908 views•2025-12-10
Stimulus Loans and Shadow Banking: The Growth of Chinese Financial Markets and the US Experience
BFIVideos
3K views•2019-05-23
Institute Insights: The Implications of Interest Rate Addiction
UNCKenanInstitute
100 views•2019-09-25
The Grouse Shooting Problem
tgsoutdoors
73K views•2019-09-08
Cost to raise child from birth to 18 has risen 36% since 2023
kgun9
198 views•2025-05-14
Trending
Playstation NO DISC/NO BUY Fight Is Over...
DavidJaffeGames
4K views•2026-07-23
Steam and Xbox Just Dropped The Hammer On PlayStation
OhNoItsAlexx
9K views•2026-07-23
Americans Confused in Australia for 17 Minutes Straight
IWrocker
17K views•2026-07-23
LIVE NOW! Cellular Structure and Functions | Complete Cell Biology Lecture | Anatomy & Physiology
MukhtarAliyu-t7m
387 views•2026-07-23