New Budget Alert | FBR Revenue Target Failure | Breaking Views | Sanaullah Khan | Mehtab Haider

Ajouté : 2026-05-25

[00:00:11][MUSIC] In the program, they call you a flatterer.

[00:00:19]I am Asadullah Khan. The budget is about to come and people are worried. People are worried about what will be in this budget. They appear to be victims of fear. That is, we have generally seen this before, although the situation has been similarly disturbing for the last few years.

[00:00:34]But there used to be a time when people had some expectations from the budget as to where they would get relief. Where will you get some benefit in salary?

[00:00:41]How much increment is coming?

[00:00:44]Now people are facing the problem of where taxes are being levied. Where is the burden going to increase more? The power sector is in bad shape. The power sector is burdened with debt. The petroleum [nasal sound] levy target is going to be revised again, i.e. increased.

[00:00:58]Earlier we had set a target of ₹1468 billion and this time the target is going to be ₹1727 billion.

[00:01:06]Now similarly, foreign tourism has reduced significantly in the last year.

[00:01:10][nasal sound] There are reports of new taxes being imposed.

[00:01:15]So where is there hope for improvement? The government feels that it has achieved something in remittances. The government feels that it has achieved something in IT exports. But on the other hand, our foreign debts are also increasing.

[00:01:26]All our etiquettes related to Gujarat, industry and services could not be fulfilled. We still got comparatively better services. So what should be the expectations from this budget? And what difficulties should we be prepared to face? We will talk about this in today's program.

[00:01:43]Dr. Farrukh Salim Sahib is present with me. He is a Musharrazakar. Thank you very much Doctor Sahib.

[00:01:46]Mehtab Haider Sahib is joining us.

[00:01:48]You are also a senior Safi. Myre is Mushiyat. Thank you very much. Mehtab Haider Sahib is Sanau Khan Sahib Senior Safi. He is in the studio with us.

[00:01:55]Thank you very much Sana sir. They say flattery.

[00:01:56]Doctor Farrukh Salim Sahab, there was a saying that camel oh camel, which of yours is straight. So now if we take up any sector in the budget and look at it, we feel that the government is facing problems everywhere. Ah especially if let me get started.

[00:02:14]Ah, this is our power sector because our population also depends on it.

[00:02:19]Our industry also depends on this. The debt of the power sector is troubling and stands at ₹200 billion. Although we brought it down a bit by taking a loan of Rs 1200 billion last year.

[00:02:28]But then it has increased and the debt that has to be levied for the loan of Rs 1200 billion is already present in itself.

[00:02:35]So how will the government deal with the power sector this year?

[00:02:40]See, the real matter is that there is one Vifaki government and four provincial governments. All the problems are with the corrupt government.

[00:02:50]Those who rule the provinces, they neither move their hands nor their feet, they have to get two thousand billion, four thousand billion from the Vifaki government.

[00:03:00]So the problem is only with the Vifaki government.

[00:03:03]Not of the provincial governments.

[00:03:05]Well, you see in the Vifaki government, the Treasury Minister will stand on the floor of the National Assembly and we have been seeing this, at least I have been seeing this for the last 16 years and I said 16 years because the 18th amendment was passed in 2010, and after that, in all the budgets that have come, the Treasury Minister stands. This time they will tell us that the income of a loyal government should be Rs 16000 billion.

[00:03:32]After about a minute, we will be told that out of that 16000 billion, 8000 billion will be distributed among the states and the remaining 8000 billion will be frozen for the payment of this interest.

[00:03:44]Now, keep some hope that if we have any hope from the corrupt government which earns 16000 and after two expenditures, neither a penny nor a penny is left in its pocket, then it is the mistake of those who have that hope. There is no fault of the government in that.

[00:04:04]We are right. As Doctor Sahib said, the provincial governments are not facing any problems.

[00:04:10]But Sana Khan Sahab, we are seeing that the condition of IMF is that additional revenue generation of Rs 860 billion is being imposed on the government.

[00:04:19]Now for that, there is talk of generating half the amount from the states, that 430 states should generate and only 430 should generate from Vifak and Vifak is imposing new taxes worth Rs 215 billion. So can the states be bound by the conditions of IMF? Will you generate this increase of Rs 430 billion?

[00:04:35]No, I don't think so. But there is a condition in it that the states will have to do the physical pack.

[00:04:42]If you look at the report of the Executive Board of India, it is written in it that the four states and the Federal Government had already signed that fiscal pact with the IMF. You will have to sign again.

[00:04:53]So the states will have to do it. It is not such an issue for us states. If Punjab is a state of 12 crore people, then earning additional tax of ₹400 billion there is not a big deal.

[00:05:03]But the problem is not this, what our brother has said is absolutely correct that whatever is left with you, the Federal Government has a complete head. That is interest payment.

[00:05:14]So what else do you have to do?

[00:05:16]And the rest you did by taking loans and Pakistan is a country which charges tax for consumption.

[00:05:22]You also have to meet your expenses in that.

[00:05:25]You also have to take a loan to repay the loan.

[00:05:28]So we are stuck in this circle and for the next one year, because it is a complete IMF program, you cannot get out of that program either.

[00:05:35]You have to do what the IMF says. So I do not see any relief in this budget, rather the pressure will increase.

[00:05:45]PDL will increase, energy prices will increase because the pattern of your energy consumption is changing.

[00:05:54]People cannot afford expensive electricity. We cannot afford expensive gas and already in the last four years electricity has become costlier by more than 100% and gas has become costlier by 1300% and fixed charges are being paid, so there will be further increase in that because you have electricity but there are no buyers and you have to make capacity payment, so for that capacity payment you will have to put more burden on the public and that is the IMF report and if you give relief to the industry, if you bring any special package for it, then you will have to bear its burden and that too cross subsidy. He has said that.

[00:06:30]He has given that commitment in writing.

[00:06:32]Now, in that 131 page report of IMF, it is clearly written that IMF has given a commitment to end the cross subsidy on gas.

[00:06:43]That pass will be around Rs 142 billion. I have also told you that no subsidy will be given on electricity now.

[00:06:49]That has to be passed on. So in the coming years, you and its multiple impact will come to you.

[00:06:56]When you yourself are saying about inflation that there will be 84% inflation next year, it means that inflation will be double digit next year.

[00:07:03]Double digit means that your below the poverty line people, which is currently 45%, will go down further.

[00:07:10]Unemployment will increase further because your economy is based on domestic consumption.

[00:07:17]Export is not yours. Absolutely.

[00:07:19]When the paying capacity of people decreases, your domestic economy will also be affected. Now fuzz a man buys one suit a month.

[00:07:30]Now he has to buy it after six months. Have to buy it after a year.

[00:07:32]If he eats meat once a month, he will eat it after 6 months. If he consumes 2 kg milk daily then it will come down to 1 kg and 1/2 kg. And because of this, your domestic consumption is getting affected. The domestic economy is being affected. Growth itself is saying that there will be 3.2% GDP growth, so with 3.2% you cannot progress, neither can you eliminate unemployment, nor can you provide employment to people, nor can you eliminate poverty.

[00:08:00]Absolutely correct. This is the problem.

[00:08:02]Mehtab sir, you also keep a close eye on the power sector. We heard recently that the Gardishi loans have reduced.

[00:08:09]Yes, loans have been taken. The debts have been repaid. But then the debts started increasing and we are almost at the same place. What happened and then we saw that the current Energy Minister has also received a medal under his policies. So do you think the power sector has been taken out of the Borons or put on the path to being taken out?

[00:08:28]Yes Bismillah Rahma Rahim. Thank you very much for having me. See, basically the power sector has multiple problems. The biggest problem I see is that in the next few years, there will be people connected to the national grids in Pakistan. I see that if there is no immediate reduction in tariffs in the power sector, I see people queuing up for disconnection.

[00:08:58]What is the reason for that? The second reason is that on one hand this government is deregulating solarisation and along with deregulating, but if you see the speed at which solar is expanding, approximately seven to eight thousand megawatts, then there is net metering.

[00:09:17]Apart from that, there are over 14 to 15,000 hybrid systems and 22 to 24,000 MW of solar panels have been imported into the country.

[00:09:28]Now, on one hand, capacity repayment is a huge burden for the government.

[00:09:35]Now tell me that those who had made those capacity repayment contracts, they did it in dollars, especially those which were done with Chinese IBPs, they are in dollars and at least if the capacity repayment is around 2 trillion, then out of that 1000 billion is of Chinese IBPs. So the problems of this power sector seem to be increasing further.

[00:10:01]And the solution is that we should reduce the losses in the power sector instead of increasing them. Now let me tell you one more thing. Yes, the government has already written in writing that from January 2027, the subsidy that people used to get for up to 200 units is going to end and it will be shifted to the list of beneficiaries of BISP.

[00:10:29]So this will be a very big critical decision and its multiple repercussions will be there.

[00:10:35]But basically, what you were talking about the budget earlier, if you allow me a minute, then I would like to comment on that, that you should see that the states have more money. But you tell me whether any of the four states has given Provincial Finance Commission so that they can complete all the tiers of government up to the district and local governments, rather in that they say that there is criticism on us, then there will be criticism, we are absolutely right, absolutely right, but in the power sector that you were talking about, recently we also heard a statement from the Energy Minister, Dr. Farakh Sahib, in which he said that we are going to make electricity cheaper and so cheap that you will produce electricity during the day, store it and use it at night. That is, from his words it seemed that he was talking about encouraging solarization. But a few days ago, the policy regarding net meeting and net billing that came regarding solar seemed as if they were disregarding it.

[00:11:37]So what exactly is the policy regarding solar and how are they going to make it cheaper or how can you interpret this and understand what they are saying?

[00:11:46]Look, there are 193 owners who are members of the United Nations and 192 of them are encouraging every kind of move towards solar. Yes, there is a country which is breaking the spirit.

[00:12:00]Now either it is the wrong policy of the 192 people or some policy of the country Pakistan is going wrong. Mehtab sahab has said it absolutely right that if you look at six projects, out of which three are coal projects and three are LAG projects, approximately 60 to 70% of the capacity payment is going to Sahwal or Qasim or Hako.

[00:12:26]Or the LAG plant, the Bhaki plant, the Balokai plant, the Half Shah Bahadur plant, so this is the issue of CIPK, on ​​the other hand, the matter of theft, the two big DisCos, in which Peshawar Electric is one, shows theft of about 40-45%, the second one is Sakr Electric, the basic question that comes to my mind is why does the government do business of electricity, the job of our government is to rule.

[00:12:58]Leave this to the private sector.

[00:13:00]Selling electricity, buying electricity. First the government buys all the electricity generated in the entire country.

[00:13:06]Then it uses the electricity it has purchased.

[00:13:08]And in this buying and selling, it incurs an annual loss of about Rs 800 billion. And then you are saying that the debt reaches up to two to three thousand billion.

[00:13:19]What is the government's interest in the power sector? He should rule.

[00:13:24]Why does she buy and sell electricity? Yes, it is absolutely correct. Doctor sir, I would like to know one more thing from you.

[00:13:28]Then I take this discussion forward. This year, especially in the last three to two months, we heard a lot about this petroleum levy because people were very affected by it after the start of the war, after 28th February and we saw that when the prices in the international market increased, people were very hurt by the petrol that was mixed with it. Now, we have not only fulfilled the target of Rs 1468 billion but are also going to collect Rs 150 billion more than that.

[00:13:53]Now that this financial year is complete, we will probably be able to collect Rs 1607 billion, which is estimated.

[00:14:01]You might have tweeted about the target we have set for 11 months.

[00:14:03]If I am not wrong, we achieved 11 months in 10 months.

[00:14:07]Well, now Sir, the next target in this is going to be 1727 billion, that is, ₹60 billion more. So this means that even if petrol becomes cheaper in the international market, it will not be cheaper in Pakistan.

[00:14:19]Look, the price has increased in the global markets. China also buys from the same global market from where Pakistan buys. India also goes to the same global market. Bangladesh also goes to the same global market.

[00:14:30]See, this is the internal policy of the government that when the price falls in the international market, then on whom should the burden of it be put.

[00:14:38]Now think that the difference in the price of petrol in India before and after the war is ₹. India has increased it by three percent.

[00:14:49]Now, the increase that has happened in Pakistan just a few days ago is 155 per liter. There is an increase of 11% within China. There is an increase of about 615s within Pakistan. There is an increase of 16% in Bangladesh. So these decisive personalities and decisive institutions of Pakistan will have to think that our neighboring countries also buy oil from the same place from where we buy it. So what do they do?

[00:15:22]What magic wand do they have that they do not put all the burden on the public? What happens here is that when the price increases in the international market, 100 percent of the burden of the international market is put on the Pakistani citizens.

[00:15:35]And on this pretext the government thinks that petroleum levy should also be increased. Let's fill our treasury a little. The only excuse I think is that there is a need to think about what such a policy is in India?

[00:15:48]What is there in Bangladesh? What is there in China?

[00:15:51]What the government does there is that it does not put the burden of the Aami Mandi on the common people.

[00:15:57]We are right. Absolutely fine. In this, Sana Sahab, what is your opinion on how much this burden is going to increase? Now we had to collect 1468 rupees, we have collected a little more and now we are increasing it further. So petrol will remain expensive next year. Look, first of all it is important to talk about what we just discussed. It is unfortunate and I consider it inhuman that you have turned a crisis into a war-like situation, an opportunity, and started making money from it.

[00:16:28]In this situation, people provide relief to their people and look at the oppression.

[00:16:34]How many people do you think travel by plane in this country? 5%, 10%.

[00:16:38]You must know many people, thousands of people who have never set foot on a plane. Yes, they have been given a concession of ₹11. We are just on the orders of one party. My friend, this is such a cruel rule. The kingdom is like a mother to us; for them, all communities are equal. You are not running a company; you are running the country; you are running it like a company.

[00:17:00]A man is telling you, to whom you have sold PIA, I am incurring losses on this oil, on this jet fuel, on JP One. You reduced the prices by ₹11.

[00:17:09]You reduced the prices for the public by ₹5. This is inhuman.

[00:17:12]This is absolutely intolerable.

[00:17:16]And you will have to sit down and explain this. Why are you blaming IMF, IMF does not talk to you here and they will do it next year also because the things that are visible, the signals that are visible, the things that are visible, it is clearly happening that they have turned every crisis into an opportunity, Magrama Sahib, I asked a government official about them, in fact, he often says this and other people also said, they said that when people do not pay taxes, then we do not pay taxes, you tell me which Pakistani does not pay taxes and on what thing does he not pay taxes. Let me give you an example. I have been reading that French revolution of France for the last few days.

[00:17:53]Why did the French Revolution take place? Today, 250 years ago, they understood this 250 years ago. The king of that time, who is called Loi Shaje 14, was building a palace equal to Islamabad, which is still standing today and a series on it is also running on Netflix. At that time, the situation was the same that his servants used to enter the houses and shops, just like people enter the shops in Sarafa Bazaar market, and we used to take away whatever goods were there from people's pockets and their houses, saying that this is tax, so your situation has become like this.

[00:18:28]So you will have to avoid it and tell people while sitting. You keep hiding.

[00:18:33]You don't face anyone these days.

[00:18:36]You yourself are the anchor. You tell me how many ministers come and sit with you and answer your questions.

[00:18:41]This is what happens in democracy, you have to answer. So I don't see any relief anywhere and the way they put everything on the IMF. The IMF does n't stop you from doing anything else that you are living this kind of luxurious life. You are making big tours despite your superiority.

[00:19:01]I mean, who will answer this?

[00:19:03]But we are buying another ship in it. This is Petroleum Development Levy. We made it a tax.

[00:19:09]Please read the press list of ECC today.

[00:19:11]₹16 crore has been released today for the fast track collection of Wazir Azam office.

[00:19:15]You tell me what answer will you give to people? At a time when people do not have two meals a day. You are taking ₹16 crore in the name of maintenance and repair.

[00:19:25]For the PM's office where no meetings are held. The Prime Minister does not sit at all.

[00:19:30]After 2022, ever since the bugging report came out, the Prime Minister does not sit in the office. Sit in the house. Let us see their vehicles.

[00:19:39]What is the biggest issue facing this country right now? Yes.

[00:19:42]Both my friends will tell you this. Baila Saheb, it is a matter of payment. We don't have dollars.

[00:19:47]This is absolutely necessary for us. This is our situation and we need a dollar.

[00:19:52]We should ban these. Then you import food worth $16 to $18 billion. Do you know to whom you give this money? You give it to the farmers of America, Ukraine, Indonesia, Malaysia, Sri Lanka.

[00:20:04]You are not willing to give one to your farmer.

[00:20:06]You give them loan at 18% interest.

[00:20:09]If we import pulses from our country, it means we have to save dollars. Give one billion dollars to your farmer. You will save $16 billion. You are ready to give 18 billion to the farmer outside. You are also ordering cooking oil from him. You are ordering. I am ordering it. I am ordering tea leaves.

[00:20:25]However, there are many areas here where tea is grown.

[00:20:27]Sir, can you guess what the issue is in your country? Your country does not have oil and gas reserves.

[00:20:33]What is the reason for that? Why can't you take it out?

[00:20:36]Someone should do this random program. There are many G Security also which you need to see. Your 202% is your domestic production, it is not from India or any other country. They import 100%.

[00:20:51]Despite that, the way you have stated the oil price, you have increased it by only ₹ in India after 28th February.

[00:20:59]You increased it by 61%. But the answer to this is that Mehtab Haider Sahab, when we ask that India did not increase the prices of petrol, then they say that since it is a very big economy and it is not even in the IMF program, hence they can fund it, they can bear the burden of prices on themselves, we cannot bear it, this is the thinking of the people in power that brother we do not have the cushion, India has it, they have given it, their economy is big, it is an economy of 700 billion dollars, so one is this answer and secondly they were talking about austerity, despite Sanallah Sahab having such a big economy, despite having a reserve of 700 billion dollars, he does not use important vehicles and none of our ministers comes below this. So what will you say on this?

[00:21:40]See, if you analyse the statements of Takbani Sahab in Pakistan, I think he has said something very starting type. He said that during the last four years, revenue worth Rs 50 trillion was collected in Pakistan.

[00:22:00]During four to five that were accumulated over the last 50 years. You should see that under the IMF program, you have collected Rs 50 trillion in tax and non-tax revenue from the people of Pakistan.

[00:22:18]Basically you see that the tax rates have been increased drastically. Yes.

[00:22:24]You Petroleum Levy I am first of all surprised at this Parliament. You may remember that there used to be a limit on petroleum levy.

[00:22:35]Yes, you had 50, first it was ₹1, then ₹25 and ₹, yes, now guess it is unlimited.

[00:22:47]He has given permission that there is no need to come to us. You keep moving forward in your own way.

[00:22:54]Yes, increase the price of petroleum levy as much as you want. The government has started using it as a tax tool.

[00:23:03]You can imagine what it would be like if instead there was 18% GST on it. Yes.

[00:23:09]So one problem was that out of all that money, 60% would go to the states and the rest would remain with you. You say that you are sending a lot of money to the states under NFC.

[00:23:25]I agree with this. But on the other hand, you have also done some such things due to which you are deviating from the spirit of NFC. That at least through this and secondly by using many other tools, you can see the surplus in the states.

[00:23:49]See, within nine months a surplus of Rs 1.6 trillion has been generated. So ₹700 billion is made from here alone. So basically these are the things that people in Pakistan are seeing.

[00:24:01]And in a way, he gave the example of jet fuel, I think there is no better example than that.

[00:24:06]It is capture and in that elite capture, there is no ration.

[00:24:14]You have to increase the burden on the poor and marginalized sections of the society through indirect taxes and non-tax revenue and give all kinds of concessions to the elite people.

[00:24:28]Due to this, poverty is also increasing in this country.

[00:24:32]Gender and inequality are also increasing.

[00:24:35]Because the one who has money is making more money and the one who is poor has no one to care about him.

[00:24:41]Hmm, that's absolutely right. I take a short break in the program. There was also talk of balance of payments. We do n't have dollars. Now one way to deal with the dollar is to expose it. The second way is that we also get foreign direct investment. Another way is to increase our remittances. Now, regarding remittances, the government is confident that we have achieved our targets.

[00:25:02]But as far as our balance of payments is concerned, our current loss is $32 billion. Why has this happened?

[00:25:08]Why could we not meet our export targets? And foreign capitalism is at its lowest level in history.

[00:25:14]In this, only $317 million has been invested this year.

[00:25:19]Why? I will put a question before the doctor.

[00:25:21]Come back after a short break.

[00:25:28][MUSIC] Cheers to you again after the break.

[00:25:35]Doctor Farooq Saleem Sahib, this is our balance of payment problem. We have set a target of $328 billion for our exports. In our first 10 months, we have received $25 billion or $25.8 billion. The shortfall is 5.25%. Our import target was $62-65.2 billion.

[00:25:55]In our 10 months, the data shows that it has reached $57.2 billion.

[00:25:59]Our current deficit is $32 billion. There is an increase of 7%. 7% increase in imports from our target. How can we solve this issue?

[00:26:11]Yes, it is a very good question. Now see, our main burden, to which you are pointing in the other direction, is oil import, gas import, coal import for which we need dollars and this energy import reaches around 25, 26, 27 billion dollars. In this regard, very serious work is being done.

[00:26:35]I'm surprised it's not covered much in the media.

[00:26:39]See, the last big dam we built was Tarbela Dam in 1976.

[00:26:46]So 50 years have passed. Believe me, at this time SV Speak has three big dams on which work is going on simultaneously at this time.

[00:26:59]Work is in progress on a Dasu. It is repair.

[00:27:04]Language and along with that Moman, now this capacity is approximately 9600 MW. Just think that the capacity bill that we had created in 78 years, these three dums have now started doubling it. The construction work on these is currently ongoing. At this time, the direction of the Sindh River has been changed at two places.

[00:27:29]One is at the place of Daau and the other is at the place of Dayamat Bhasha and then that temple is being built over the Swa River.

[00:27:40]Doctor Sahib, may Allah make sure that they start contributing to our electricity as soon as possible, but what will happen to our issues with IPPs that were till 1945?

[00:27:50]You have to make the capacity payments. ₹3400 billion has been given earlier.

[00:27:55]Look, we are importing gas or coal or oil from which we are getting our power, after the construction of these three dams, in the summer months from at least April to September, there will be an additional power of about 8700 MW, which you can understand as free water from the Himalayas, neither will we have to spend any dollar on it nor will we have to spend any money on it, on top of this you can think that the cost of operation may be a little higher. So this work is ongoing.

[00:28:27]If you look at these areas from satellite.

[00:28:30]You can actually see concrete being laid.

[00:28:33]You see the steel fall.

[00:28:36]You see tunnels. And the ground reality is that the direction of the river has actually been changed. So here, about 25-30% of the construction work has been completed.

[00:28:49]Now, for how long can we sustain the financial pipeline?

[00:28:55]This is a big question.

[00:28:56]Yes, it is absolutely correct. And the second thing I told Mr. Sanala was that our total investment from foreign investors for one year has remained at $317 million.

[00:29:06]If you do plus and minus FDI and portfolio investment, what is this? How have we become the lowest in capitalism?

[00:29:14]Asad Bhai, the question is where does the capitalism happen? There are four to five factors where investment takes place. We have political stability, yes justice system, security, we have foreign tax system, I remember four things, protection of money, yes sir, and safety of the investment, you tell me four-five things, is there justice in this country, can the courts give justice if any investor has any issue, tell me is there political stability in this country, is there security in this country. Is the taxation system in this country unfair?

[00:29:57]You know, many investors have expressed their concern that they are not being allowed to take out their profits.

[00:30:03]Letters have also been written to the government in this.

[00:30:06]So you tell me, in this situation, these four factors matter a lot in all the countries of the world where investment takes place.

[00:30:13]We do not have all these four things here. What has happened to your judicial system after the 26th and 27th amendments?

[00:30:22]The way judges are appointed. You tell me which investor will be confident. Do investors take decisions after looking at all these things, where have we said, they do n't come to the conclusion that profit, then energy prices, cost of business is the highest in the world, then tell me how will investors come there, then this is what will happen, whatever little investment is coming, you know, it is G to G, there is no private investment, you go and request your friend Mulik that brother, let's set up a refinery here, let's make some investment here, let's come to SEEPCO, and absolutely Mehtab was right, in 2015-16, we have set up six power plants of LNG and coal, today this devastation that this community is facing today on the price of electricity, and I always demand that a commission should be formed on that and it should be decided, who were these people who made these agreements for payment in dollars and capacity payment, it is a very interesting thing, Mehtab must remember that in those days there was a sectoral power.

[00:31:31]If we remember Mehtab's name, we will tell you. At that time, they objected to both of our elders from the Sharif family and we told them that brother, we will get trapped in the capacity trap.

[00:31:45]We were transferred to that guy with in 48 hours.

[00:31:50]Okay, yes sir.

[00:31:52]He had refused. He was an amazing Secretary Power at that time. Is this about the early 90s or Bhaiya Sir, I am telling you about 2015-16, yes, I am talking about that time and this is on record that call him some day, I will remember his name, if Mehtab remembers his name or if Doctor Sahib remembers his name, what was his name, Mehtab of Se Power, we are laughing, sir, yes, Yunus Dhaga Sahib, okay, Yunus Dhaga Sahib refused that brother, we will get trapped in this trap and today we have fallen in that trap that you are going over capacity and we also objected to the capacity payment.

[00:32:27]He also objected to these agreements.

[00:32:29]And later he had to leave the Civil Service early.

[00:32:33]Hmm, then what are you talking about? So make a commission on this. Let us see who sent this community into this freedom?

[00:32:40]And tell the community. You cannot punish me.

[00:32:42]So at least tell the community.

[00:32:44]Who will make the commission? Will the government form a commission against itself? Who will make up the commission?

[00:32:48]Call international experts. We are local people, here you will find all the people of the court.

[00:32:56]What did the courtiers have to say? He has to give a clean chit. I have to say wow wow. I do n't want to say wow, wow. Those who have destroyed this community should come forward and a commission should be formed.

[00:33:07]Otherwise this will continue. Yes, we are right Mehtab saheb, now these are very serious issues and indeed, many people say that the power sector and Pakistan 's economy cannot go together and at this time no one seems to have any formula to fix the power sector and those who made promises of capacity payments knowingly that it is causing loss to Pakistan, if their argument is that at that time Pakistan was stuck in load shedding, then see, Pakistan had to be brought out of load shedding somehow, it was brought out and the country was brought out of this darkness. This is their argument. Anyhow, now sir please tell me if you want to add something to it then please do so. But my second question is that the government feels that it has achieved great success in some sectors. For example, they have achieved their targets in remittances and they have achieved their targets in IT exports.

[00:33:58]He achieved the target of $3.8 million in 10 months.

[00:34:00]So tell me, do you see the success of the government here?

[00:34:06]Look, the current account surplus has turned into a deficit of about $328 million and a deficit is expected in the next two months as well because the oil prices and RLAG prices are rising.

[00:34:24]Look, basically one thing I want to tell you is an interesting thing.

[00:34:29]Yes, this is the perception in front of everyone and the reality is that the investment has not come into this country.

[00:34:40]But if we look at the back end of the growth numbers that have come out now, there are some interesting things which I would like to highlight, and that is very interesting, it is telling that private investment in Pakistan has increased by almost 110% in the last two years, now the ground reality is completely different from that. The government data on private investment and especially in the construction sector shows that in the year 24, 25, 26, there has been an increase of about 60% and in the year 24, 25, 26, there has been an increase of 55% in the previous year, so there is an increase of about 105, 110%.

[00:35:34]This is the government's figure. Now tell me, are you seeing this much private sector investment on the ground?

[00:35:43]I can't see it. Now this is the data which is cooked up to show their numbers and absolutely everyone believes in FDI and now you will see that when the Economic Survey comes, it will show the lowest foreign direct investment of the unprecedented level, which is the lowest in the history of Pakistan and in that too there is a decline of about 50% as compared to last year.

[00:36:11]So when investment is not coming, it means that some things are not happening the way they should be. One thing that the government wants to do in this budget is to reduce the informal sector and increase the formal sector and investment, it should do some kindness in terms of tax and reduce the tax rates.

[00:36:40]Otherwise, if you impose more taxes like this and increase the cost of doing business, then it seems that the share of the informal sector will increase further, which is not a good sign for this country in any way.

[00:36:56]Right sir, I am taking a short break.

[00:37:00]Thank you very much Dr. Furakh Saleem Sahib. Mehtab Haider Sahib and Sanallah Khan Sahib are present with us.

[00:37:03]Moving on to the last part of the program. And Pakistan's debt is a big problem and as was being discussed earlier, loans are taken to repay the debts.

[00:37:12]Loans are also taken to pay interest on loans.

[00:37:14]And in the last 4 years, there has been a significant increase in debt.

[00:37:19]And in the last one year also we have taken loans worth Rs 7533 billion. So we are burdened with debts.

[00:37:26]And then now, two years ago, we had decided to launch a flight in the name of Pakistan for the next five years. If we look at it after 2 years, it seems that these achievements may not be achieved in the next 3 years.

[00:37:37]So does Udaan Pakistan's Adaf need to be revised? Let's take a short break and come back and talk about this.

[00:37:43]Stay with us.

[00:37:55]Cheers to you again after the break.

[00:37:56]Ikram Hoti Sahib has joined me.

[00:37:58]You are a senior correspondent for 92 News.

[00:38:00]Covers the economy.

[00:38:02]Thank you very much Ikram Moti Sahib. Sir, first of all I want to put a question before you regarding loans.

[00:38:09]Pakistan is stuck in the quagmire of debt. Ah, if you look at the figures of March 2026, there is a debt of 97, that is, ah, 97,307 billion. In March 2025, the debt was Rs 89,744 billion. That means it has increased by Rs 7,533 billion in one year. And our foreign debt has reached 137 billion.

[00:38:30]And this year too, the situation is that we will have to take loans to repay our loans and also to pay interest on the loans. How will we get out of this? Do you think the government has any plan for this in the upcoming budget? Yes of course.

[00:38:41]Actually, the thing is that in every country of the world, there are four problems at the time of budget and if even one of them gets resolved, then they keep trying to resolve the other issues also. The biggest issue in Pakistan is that our rupee is depreciating against the dollar because we are reducing exports and foreign exchange is not coming. Secondly, the war that has taken place has created a situation of emergency.

[00:39:09]How to get out of this? Is that war completely over yet or not? What are you stuck in? Yes.

[00:39:13]Thirdly, the market should not expand because there should have been less tax on investment.

[00:39:25]They have not reduced the tax but have been increasing it. Hence, investment has also been hit. So this means that along with inflation there will be unemployment also.

[00:39:35]Now the fourth thing is that according to the huge expenditure you have incurred, have you not seen whether the tax and non-tax revenue will be able to meet it.

[00:39:46]So the gap between them came down to 25 to 30%.

[00:39:49]Now in this situation, making the budget will definitely be an action. There will be an action of a political economy. But what is said is that inflation should reduce, salaries should increase, inflation should reduce, more dollars should come, one should be able to repay the loans. This work is a bit difficult.

[00:40:09]Yes, yes, that is absolutely correct. Now on this one, I salute you sir, please give me your opinion.

[00:40:15]Secondly, I was asking questions regarding Udaan Pakistan. We had decided some boundaries two years ago.

[00:40:20][nasal sound] In that we had said that we will take the GDP to 6%.

[00:40:23]Exports will take their peak to $60 billion.

[00:40:25]IT exports have to be taken to $10 billion. Employment has to pay $ lakhs of salaries. The fee income, which is currently around 1800, is to be taken to $245 billion. The Shara of Gurbat has to be brought to 12s.

[00:40:36]Which is currently 44.7% according to the World Bank report. Do you think we will achieve respect in the remaining three years of Udaan Pakistan?

[00:40:46]No, in my opinion this is optimistic, these things are very difficult, the way our situation is and it is linked to all the international situations, it is linked to the situation of our political, it is linked to the situation of our economy and the government says that the poverty rate is 29%, 29% is also in the African countries, a country like Pakistan where there is so much good land, so much human resources, it is very difficult. I think one or two things may be possible in this.

[00:41:19]She is from IT.

[00:41:21]We have a lot of work going on in IT. And IT does not just include IT, it also includes digital.

[00:41:26]Lots of things and you see that too.

[00:41:28]We also see. Our young elder is working on this. There is no encouragement for them. There is no guidance.

[00:41:34]No, even on that we keep hearing that there is talk of imposing tax on it. There is talk of imposing tax on Urs also.

[00:41:39]No, look at that, there should be tax on income.

[00:41:42]And there should be equal tax. There should be tax on agricultural income also. It is 24% of our GDP. On top of that, these politicians do not want there to be any tax there and the landlords do not want there to be any tax there. If there is a tax on it, then many sectors may go down.

[00:41:58]Despite the agreement with the IMF, the state is still not able to implement the commitment in the manner it has been made. As for the rest of the things, I don't think that you can increase your exports within this energy cost, the taxation that our brother has mentioned, which is currently so heavy. It is difficult. You don't have an export surplus.

[00:42:22]Rather your industry is closing down because of this energy cost and taxation.

[00:42:28]Mostly our export industry has closed down.

[00:42:32]Rather your exports are decreasing.

[00:42:34]Why are remittances increasing? The reason for this is that problems have increased in Pakistan.

[00:42:40]Those who have gone abroad and are still going abroad, they send money to support their families. Used to sell it earlier also. And if I tell you, if this is not our overseas segment, Pakistan can default at any time.

[00:42:54]Even at this time, you know that Saudi Arabia has deposited 8 billion dollars in Pakistan's reserves.

[00:43:02]China has deposited four or five billion dollars.

[00:43:04]So if you take that out, then the debt that we have to pay in one month and one year is approximately $5 billion. If there were no rollovers, it would be even more than this, sir. I think Mehtab must remember the figure, it is 18 to 20 billion dollars every year, yes, it gets rolled over, then we request, no, you have to pay, it does not get rolled over and this is international debt, domestic debt, this is a big problem for you, you take a loan of 2025 billion on a daily basis for your expenses, on a daily basis, I am telling you that your problem is not on our revenue site, which is exactly what Saqib Sherani sahab told that the tax we have recovered in four years, has not happened in the last 47 years. The problem is our expenditure. We do not need more than four ministries in the budget after the 18th Amendment on Expenditure.

[00:44:03]Here, each ministry has four heads. The ones we don't need. There is a loyal minister, a leader, an advisor and along with that a recommendatory SA PM is also posted everywhere.

[00:44:14]Now you see their expenditure. Then look at your protocols. Then look at your visits.

[00:44:20]Then you should look at your vehicles, then you should look at the imported goods and ships, then you will have to make cuts here and give a message to the people that we too are not ready to make sacrifices with you. The problem is that our leadership is not ready to sacrifice that thing. I definitely say that I do n't take salary.

[00:44:42]Who comes into politics to get that salary, brother?

[00:44:43]We are so stupid, it would be better if you take the salary.

[00:44:47]You better take it. May Allah take it.

[00:44:49]Absolutely correct. In this, Mehtab Sahab, our agriculture target which we had fixed last year was 4.5% and we are able to achieve only 2.89%.

[00:45:00]Our industry was 4.3% and we are achieving 3.5% services, we have almost achieved it. So we are standing on this Jarat Half. The industry also could not achieve the target.

[00:45:11]How will this growth come? And how can this talk of exports increase? If your power sector is not supporting you then how can you increase exports?

[00:45:22]Look, one basic thing is that I believe that IT exports are a potential area for Pakistan and there is a need to pay attention to it. But one thing is that there is a need to discuss to what extent our universities are producing quality graduates.

[00:45:42]So 50 graduates come out. And the people in the market say that Rs 4000 to Rs 5000 is according to their requirements. The rest is not like that.

[00:45:54]So I think this is a potential area which needs attention. There is definitely a need to pay attention to agriculture. The thing about agriculture is that if you invest and improve the technology, its productivity can increase rapidly. And you were absolutely right in saying that we are importing agricultural commodities worth 10 to 14 billion dollars every year, that is 10 billion dollars per annum.

[00:46:22]So this is not a good thing at all for an agricultural country.

[00:46:27]And I think this can be given attention.

[00:46:31]Ikram Modi Sahib, I wanted to put one more question before you and that is another very important issue and that too regarding FBR revenue.

[00:46:37]We initially set a target of Rs 14.13 trillion for tax collection.

[00:46:40]Then revised it. It came down to 13.9.

[00:46:42]That too, whatever we have done till now in the last 10 months is again a shortfall.

[00:46:48]We are hearing an estimate of 600 684 billion. So now that this financial year is complete, this shortfall might have increased further.

[00:46:57]Now next year we are going to set a target of probably Rs 15.2 trillion. How will this be possible?

[00:47:04]Look, as far as revenue is concerned, it is different from the rest of the political economy. There are two things in revenue that don't happen elsewhere. One thing is that the public has to pay the tax and they have to calculate whether this tax is correct or not. Second, you have to see its rate.

[00:47:24]The collection and the rate are both not according to the requirements of Pakistan. And it is also not because the tax is heavy, so recommendations and bribes are used to get it reduced. When this corruption gets too much control in the tax collection system, then what it means is that you will not get even the due tax and apart from that, you will not get the increase in tax at all. So this series has stuck to FDR like a bug.

[00:48:04]All the officers of FDR cannot be restricted to collect the entire tax and not give any exemption to anyone in the matter of tax.

[00:48:13]If the discount isn't given, do n't discount it. And the second thing is that you should not ask for allowance from whatever you collect. If this system is in place then it can be fixed.

[00:48:23]And the most difficult task in our taxation is this. On the other hand, if there is no taxation then your budget will not be made. Whatever assumptions you have about the Iraat, you have them with your eyes closed. Do n't you see that our tax revenue and non-tax revenue will become so huge? So that through it you can do progressive work, repay the loans to the banks and apart from that you can also maintain such a big bureaucracy.

[00:48:48]So all this is going against each other. This total game is going wrong.

[00:48:54]Ok. Thank you very much Ikram Sahib, thank you very much. Thank you very much Aslah Khan sir.

[00:48:57]Mehtab Haider Sahab, thank you very much for participating in the program. Please allow me.

[00:49:01]Allah Hafiz.

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