🔴 LIVE: Rick Chow murder trial

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[00:00:05]I saw the the son I saw both of them chased him and then when I drove down there I can't at this point because I had to turn my vehicle around.

[00:00:25]>> So I had to look left to make sure there was no car coming. So then I drove down there and when I stopped and asked if they needed help, was everything okay?

[00:00:36]The son uh they was distance apart from Cyrus. Cyrus in the middle of them and Mr. Child was in in front of Cyrus.

[00:00:46]Cyrus was already laying on the ground and the father was near the position where his head was at.

[00:00:53]>> Okay. So, so let me ask this just to make sure I'm getting this chronologically correct.

[00:01:00]>> Before you drove down there, you saw them run in front of your car.

[00:01:03]>> Yes.

[00:01:03]>> All right. And you saw him fall a couple times.

[00:01:06]>> Yes.

[00:01:06]>> All right. And then as he fell, you saw him when he fell the final time. Can you tell us where they were positioned?

[00:01:13]>> I could not tell you.

[00:01:15]>> Can you tell us what you what if anything you saw um Mr. child, excuse me, the defendant in this case doing or his son doing when he fell the final time.

[00:01:25]>> The final time when I saw they he was already moving towards the the front of Cyrus.

[00:01:31]>> Okay.

[00:01:33]>> And the sun was behind Cyrus, but a little ways off from where Cyrus was at. It's like the sun ran up near the curb and stopped. It's like he didn't move no further.

[00:01:49]And you saw Cyrus fall a final time?

[00:01:52]>> I did.

[00:01:53]>> Uh, was he ever um pointing towards them or doing anything towards them that you could see?

[00:01:58]>> No, that I could see. No.

[00:01:59]>> And did you ever see anything in his hand?

[00:02:01]>> I did not.

[00:02:13]So, when you actually went down to uh the scene, you said you drove down there. Did you at some point engage um or have a convers What is it? Let me change this around a little bit. What is it that you saw when you finally got down to the scene? You said that you saw Cyrus on the ground. Tell me what was going on.

[00:02:31]>> I when I got down there, u Mr. child was down on his knees. Cyrus was on his back and Mr. Child has his hand out and I asked, "Where the blood come from?

[00:02:50]Are you bleeding? Are you hurt?"

[00:02:53]I said, "Who's hurt?" And he said, "Him."

[00:02:57]So I looked at Cyrus and I said, "Where? Where?"

[00:03:03]Because I didn't see no blood in. And so by then there was another female and Mr. Child. They rode him over and they raised his shirt up and I saw the hole in the back and then he rolled him back over and I clear then he had leaves in his mouth and I cleared the the way cuz he had started um make it gurgling. So I thought he was trying to breathe. So I was trying to clear them. so he can breathe.

[00:03:38]And I told him to uh the female and to do because I didn't know how to do C.

[00:03:45]So I told him to do C CPR because he's trying to breathe and I told him do CPR.

[00:03:54]So the young lady started doing chest compression and Mr. child was getting CPR, mouth tomtomouth, and I just told him to keep keep on keep on.

[00:04:08]>> And you tried to do what you could to to help with the situation after Cyrus had been shot.

[00:04:13]>> Yes.

[00:04:15]>> Do you know who shot?

[00:04:18]>> Cyrus? I don't know who shot, but I know when I went down there, when I turned my car around, went down there and stopped, Mr. Child was in a a shooting sting upright with his legs and he had his arms like this >> like Can you Can you stand and demonstrate to the jury what you mean by shooting stance and hold for a minute?

[00:04:42]Let me move this.

[00:04:46]>> May she come down again, y? Yes, sir.

[00:04:51]>> When I when I drove down there and stopped, the scene was over here and I rolled down my window and he was in a stance like this.

[00:05:05]>> And what did you do when you saw Mr. Chow in a stance like that? The defendant Mr. Chow in a stance like that?

[00:05:10]>> I asked him, "Was everything okay?" And he said, "No, call 911." And is that what you did?

[00:05:18]>> Yes. I had my family in the car, so I needed to get them out of danger and drove them up to the the next uh apartment lot and then I ran back down.

[00:05:27]And as I was going up though, I was calling 911, but I was so nervous cuz I needed to get back down there, help him.

[00:05:35]And I told I just gave the phone to my daughter cuz I couldn't I I couldn't get the information out.

[00:05:59]court.

[00:06:00]>> Yes.

[00:06:49]So, I'm going to show you what's been marked. Slide 20 states exhibit number four. You should take a look at that, please.

[00:06:59]>> 21. I'm sorry. Start 21.

[00:07:28]So I just we loop back a little bit just to to go back to the beginning of this.

[00:07:33]Um what is it that you saw there? You talked about shoot came off.

[00:07:38]>> Okay. And that's what you saw.

[00:07:39]>> I saw him run. He on a red >> bright red. Could you see >> so I could I was able to see him, but I saw a shoe that's white and it just flew off and she was running.

[00:07:50]>> Could you see his face?

[00:07:52]>> I saw his face.

[00:07:53]>> Tell me what you saw.

[00:07:59]>> He just He just looked frightened and scared.

[00:08:04]>> He looked um like he needed help.

[00:08:10]And how is it that you could say he looked frightened and scared? How do you say that?

[00:08:13]>> The way his eyes was just just like like a young child just in trouble and just needed help. He just he just he just looked scared. It just in his eyes.

[00:08:29]>> And is that what compelled you to do a little bit more?

[00:08:33]>> Yes.

[00:08:34]>> Why is that? because um it was like one of my grandkids, one of my kids, you know, just looked scared and uh I just had to help. I just couldn't I could not not do nothing. I could not do nothing.

[00:08:49]I could not My daughter wanted me to.

[00:08:52]I could not The best thing I could do was just get my family out the way.

[00:08:57]And I didn't mind if I got hurt, but I needed my family out the way. And I I had to go down there and help them. And that's what you did.

[00:09:05]>> And that's what I did.

[00:09:07]>> And later you had an opportunity to speak to law enforcement about what you did.

[00:09:11]>> Yes.

[00:09:11]>> You did that.

[00:09:13]>> And uh and let's just be clear, um you're not any relation to anybody in this case, correct?

[00:09:18]>> No.

[00:09:19]>> You were with your family.

[00:09:20]>> Yes.

[00:09:21]>> And you watched all of these things unfold.

[00:09:23]>> Yes.

[00:09:28]>> For indulgence.

[00:09:43]And so just to be clear, as you, your daughter, and grandkids were in that parking lot, you watched Cyrus run by.

[00:09:51]What if anything was in his hands?

[00:09:54]>> I saw his backpack on his back, but I didn't see anything in his hand.

[00:09:57]>> And as he ran down spring tree, what was in his hands? I didn't see anything in his hands.

[00:10:02]>> And as he fell multiple times, what was in his hands?

[00:10:06]>> I didn't see anything in his hand.

[00:10:08]>> And from your vantage point, you feel certain you would have seen if something was in his hands?

[00:10:12]>> Yes.

[00:10:13]>> Thank you.

[00:11:54]Good afternoon.

[00:11:56]>> Good afternoon.

[00:11:59]>> Know this was a startling event, but I need to ask you some questions.

[00:12:04]>> Yes, sir.

[00:12:06]Now, you um you testified that you were with your daughter. You went to this store to purchase something, a drink or something. Is that right?

[00:12:17]>> We was going there to purchase that, but we never made it inside. And we've seen a video of your your automobile BMW SUV I think you said turn off of a park lane onto Spring Tree and then you say you immediately pulled into the parking lot of the station.

[00:12:37]>> Yes.

[00:12:39]And maybe when we get this going technology in a moment, let me get this figured out. Um, I'll ask you some questions about this, but now your SUV, you were riding with uh where was your daughter?

[00:13:15]And your daughter's name is Kennedy.

[00:13:16]>> Kennedy.

[00:13:17]>> All right. And how old is she?

[00:13:20]>> 30. She's old. She's 30.

[00:13:23]>> Don't say that's old. She's She's not a baby.

[00:13:27]>> She's uh She's a young lady, but she was seated in the passenger seat of your automobile. Is that right?

[00:13:34]>> No. Kennedy was behind me. My granddaughter was on the passenger side.

[00:13:38]>> All right. So, which side of the automobile she sit?

[00:13:41]>> She's directly behind me.

[00:13:44]>> And are your the windows in your vehicle are intended?

[00:13:48]>> Yes, they are.

[00:13:50]>> And so, um, let me ask you to step down again. Let me get this for you.

[00:14:04]And our solister has hidden the pointer.

[00:14:06]>> Oops.

[00:14:09]>> So, as you did before, would you uh reach up there and show the where um where your vehicle was?

[00:14:20]>> Yes. I pulled off spring tree on here.

[00:14:24]>> Okay. So, up beyond that bush perhaps.

[00:14:27]>> Yeah. Right there.

[00:14:28]>> All right. And so your view would have been down the road and and so as you testified, you watched through your window. Windows were rolled up in your vehicle, I think.

[00:14:41]>> Yes. They're legally lieutenant, though.

[00:14:42]They're not.

[00:14:43]>> Okay. And and uh the three people you saw run past you. Would you kind of give the jury an indication with the with your pointer there where they ran by you, >> past you?

[00:14:59]Well, I was pulling off Cyrus that was just uh stepping off the step and he started running. So, Savage were here and the other two gentlemen was just past my vehicle here.

[00:15:12]>> Okay.

[00:15:13]>> The shoe flew flew off. The lady came and picked it up.

[00:15:16]>> All right.

[00:15:17]>> I saw them go down cuz I had backed up >> and and and let me ask you to stop you there. You saw the shoe come off somewhere around that red car >> or >> I I don't I don't I don't recall. I don't recall.

[00:15:30]>> Do you recall?

[00:15:31]>> I recall the shoes flying off. I saw the lady come and pick it up.

[00:15:35]>> All right. But that was sometime later that she came and picked it up or >> Yes, she was. They had already they was already off. Yeah.

[00:15:43]>> All right. And did you see uh the gentleman you're calling Cyrus, did you see him throw two cell phones away?

[00:15:52]No, >> didn't see that.

[00:15:54]>> You see him throw anything else away?

[00:15:56]>> No, I did not. I didn't see anything in his hand.

[00:15:59]>> Okay. Now, um if you'll point up on that, you might have to take a step up to get there.

[00:16:06]>> Okay.

[00:16:07]>> Points about where you believe that uh Mr. Belton, that's the person we saw on Cyrus, where where his uh injury would have been. Where where was it? when you saw him being shot >> ran across the street. This is the port that um somewhere uh somewhere here I came and then he went down and then he went down.

[00:16:51]So your recollection is that it wasn't all the way there. It was much closer.

[00:16:57]>> I cannot um >> and I understand.

[00:17:01]>> Yes.

[00:17:02]>> All right.

[00:17:02]>> He ran across the street.

[00:17:04]>> All right. If you'll have a seat, ma'am.

[00:17:05]>> Yes.

[00:17:14]Are you aware that the sheriff's department indicated that the distance from the store to where uh Mr. Pelton tripped and fell was 130 yards? Were you aware of that?

[00:17:27]>> No, but when I was down there, uh when I looked back up at the store, I myself saw like the tip of the store. I couldn't see the whole store itself. So the distance I don't know, but I know when I looked up there at the store myself.

[00:17:44]Um I just saw like the tip of the the store. So it was kind of I couldn't see.

[00:17:50]You could see the lot and the store. You couldn't like see.

[00:17:53]>> But your view from through your rolled up window was 130 yards.

[00:17:59]>> I don't know the distance. I'm not you know.

[00:18:03]>> But let's go back to when the three individuals ran past you. You you didn't know who these people were. You did not know what was happening.

[00:18:11]>> No.

[00:18:12]>> Uh you uh told the jury you didn't see anything in uh the first person's hands. The person we know to be you were calling Cyrus.

[00:18:24]>> No, I didn't see anything in his hands.

[00:18:25]>> Saw nothing in his hands. Didn't see him throw anything away. You just saw him step out of a shoot. I saw him running and he when his um guess leg went back, his shoe flew off.

[00:18:40]So I didn't see him throw anything. I didn't see a cell phone.

[00:18:44]>> And was he carrying the backpack or did he have it looped in his arms in a backpack traditional position?

[00:18:53]>> I don't think I can't recall it looped in his arm. I didn't see that money like that. I thought it was on his back and I was sure because I >> You certainly didn't know that he had a 9 mm pistol.

[00:19:05]>> No, I hidden in his clothing.

[00:19:06]>> I did not.

[00:19:07]>> In the front of his You remember what he was wearing?

[00:19:10]>> Yes. It was a bright red um sweatshirt.

[00:19:13]He had on some darker jeans and some white tennis shoes was white and sweatshirts.

[00:19:22]>> You remember that it had a big pocket on the front? I came to call see a pocket >> now the second and the third people who were pursuing him or following him um the second the first let me let's not confuse you or the juror the first person you were calling s >> yes >> the second person do you now understand what his name was >> uh the uh son Yes.

[00:19:54]>> Okay.

[00:19:55]>> That second person you saw, >> I saw I guess Andy and Mr. Chow.

[00:20:00]>> All right.

[00:20:01]>> Well, you saw Andy uh running after Syrus.

[00:20:07]>> Both of them. Yeah.

[00:20:08]>> And And Andy had nothing in his hands.

[00:20:12]>> I can't recall what they had in their hand.

[00:20:14]>> So, you didn't notice whether he had anything?

[00:20:15]>> I didn't notice if he had anything in hand either.

[00:20:18]>> And and the third person was the father, Mr. Chow. gentleman seated over here.

[00:20:25]>> Yes.

[00:20:26]>> You recognize him today?

[00:20:29]>> Yes.

[00:20:29]>> All right.

[00:20:31]>> He also didn't have anything in his hands, did he?

[00:20:33]>> I didn't see anything in his hand.

[00:20:35]>> All right. And he was following his son.

[00:20:38]He was behind his son, wasn't it? As the videos have indicated.

[00:20:42]>> Yes. It seemed like Well, in my view, just seemed like they was running. So whether side by side or behind you testify you finish apologize for interrupting.

[00:20:56]>> Do you remember what you were saying when I interrupted you?

[00:21:00]>> You repeat the question and I can answer again.

[00:21:02]>> Well, you saw I think I asked you saw nothing in Mr. Chow's hands.

[00:21:06]>> That's correct. I didn't see anything in his hand.

[00:21:08]>> And he was following his son. He was behind his son as and I said before you answer as indicated on videos they could be.

[00:21:21]>> Yes.

[00:21:22]>> What I saw I just saw them running. I can't I don't know who was in front behind. I don't know. They was together running. That's what I saw.

[00:21:32]And so then you saw the three of them proceed down the street 130 yards or whatever the distance was.

[00:21:44]>> And you say that >> then you saw the person you're calling Cyrus fall.

[00:21:51]>> He tripped over the curb.

[00:21:53]>> Okay.

[00:21:54]>> All right.

[00:21:54]>> And went down and proceeded to get back up. And then he went down. He didn't get all the way up.

[00:22:02]>> And you weren't able at that distance to see what he tripped on, were you?

[00:22:05]>> The he tripped over the curb. I saw that.

[00:22:07]>> And And when he began to get up, were you able at 130 yards to see that he had a gun in his hand?

[00:22:14]>> No.

[00:22:15]>> You couldn't see whether he had anything in his hand or not?

[00:22:17]>> No.

[00:22:21]the um do you remember that?

[00:22:30]You remember seeing Andy Chow >> when this young man fell? Do you remember seeing him backing up into the middle of the street?

[00:22:39]>> No. When I saw him, he was just standing still. I didn't see him back up >> in the middle of the street.

[00:22:44]>> He was just standing still near the curb.

[00:22:46]>> Okay.

[00:22:51]And you had no idea at that point that Cyrus had a 9 mm pistol >> in his hand.

[00:23:08]When you saw him fall, you saw everyone stop. All three of them stopped.

[00:23:14]>> I was saw him. I don't know what they was doing. And I saw my eyes was focused on him because of the red sweatshirt.

[00:23:22]Uh I can't if they I can't recall if they was backing up what, but I saw him trip over the curb, get back up, and then trip again >> and he went down. And that's when I went down.

[00:23:34]>> When he fell, neither of the childs jumped on him, >> did they?

[00:23:42]>> I didn't see it. I didn't see them jump on him. No.

[00:23:44]>> Okay. They didn't touch him.

[00:23:46]They didn't jump on him.

[00:23:48]>> They didn't attack him. In other words, >> there was a time period where I had turned my vehicle around and I had to look left to make sure no car was coming. So, whatever happened in that short period of time for me to look left and turn it back and go. I don't know what happened.

[00:24:03]>> Well, that's not the time period I'm asking you about. I'm asking you about what you've testified about that when you saw him fall, neither of the childs jumped on that young man when he fell.

[00:24:15]No, I didn't see him jumping on him. No.

[00:24:17]>> And the second time he you say he tripped or fell, you don't know whether maybe that's when he was shot. You don't know.

[00:24:25]>> I don't know.

[00:24:27]>> In fact, you never heard a gunshot, did you?

[00:24:29]>> I did not.

[00:24:31]>> U and and when he fell the second time or went down the second time, you did not see either child advance on him, attack him, did you? I did not.

[00:24:59]>> Now, the solicister asked you about speaking to the sheriff's department.

[00:25:04]You went to the Rome County Sheriff's Department at their request.

[00:25:07]>> Yes.

[00:25:08]>> And gave an interview.

[00:25:09]>> Yes.

[00:25:10]>> Um, in that interview, You mentioned and it is correct that you and your daughter participated in a 911 call.

[00:25:22]>> Yes.

[00:25:23]>> The 911 call was made after the second time Syrus fell down.

[00:25:31]>> Yes.

[00:25:33]And in that uh sheriff's firm interview, you indicated as you said today, you were right there.

[00:25:45]Let's see.

[00:25:47]You were right there in that spot.

[00:25:48]Though you in the 911 call, you were not able to exactly explain where you were.

[00:25:55]You knew you at the intersection of the corner of this gas station.

[00:26:00]I could not because I was just so frantic at that moment. I could not recall the street I was on and I was nervous. And um I handed the phone to my daughter to finish the conversation with me.

[00:26:14]>> And and so you never saw a gun in anybody's hands?

[00:26:17]>> No.

[00:26:19]And when you you mentioned you turned your car around, you drove down and and you drove past where well you stopped where this where the young man was and Mr. Chow and his son.

[00:26:34]>> Yes.

[00:26:35]>> Uh and you rolled the window down, I think you said.

[00:26:38]>> Yes.

[00:26:39]>> And Mr. Chow, this gentleman, the first thing he said to you was, "Call 911. After I asked him was everything okay, he said no. Call 911.

[00:26:55]>> And uh again, you didn't know there was a gunshot.

[00:27:01]>> No.

[00:27:03]>> You uh you and your daughter went up to what? One of the parking lots, turned in and pulled over and parked.

[00:27:12]>> Yes.

[00:27:12]>> And you walked back down.

[00:27:14]>> I ran down.

[00:27:15]>> Ran down. And your daughter as well?

[00:27:18]>> My daughter after me. Yes.

[00:27:19]>> Okay. And when you got down there, you saw Mr. Chow, this gentleman. Mr. Chow, you saw him uh giving this young man.

[00:27:31]You saw him down on his knees giving this young man mouthto mouth.

[00:27:35]>> No, sir. Well, don't you recall uh telling the uh sheriff's deputy uh when you were interviewed on let's see 7 July 25th roughly a month after this that you watched Rick doing mouth to mouth and saw the brown stuff came out and then you watched him try to do mouth to mouth again.

[00:27:59]>> No sir, when I went down there he was on his knee.

[00:28:03]>> Mr. Chow.

[00:28:04]>> Mr. The child was on his knee. By then the another young lady came down and she was on my left hand side. She went down on her knee. I asked him about the blood on his hand because someone was injured.

[00:28:18]I need to know who was injured. I asked him was he okay? Are you hurt? Who's hurt? And he said him. I looked over at Cyrus down at Cyrus. I didn't see no blood nowhere. So I'm trying to figure out where this blood come from. who's hurt. And that's when they both rolled him over. I saw the hole in his back and just a little blood around it. They rolled him back over. I got the leaves out of his mouth and I told him they need to do because I cannot do CPR. I asked them to do it. The young lady started doing the chest compression. He started doing mouth to mouth.

[00:28:56]>> Okay. So, he he Mr. child did indeed uh give life attempted lifesaving measures including mouthtomouth resuscitation right there on his knees in front of you trying to save this young boy's life >> even to the extent >> yes >> even to the extent of that young man aspirating or vomiting Mr. child cleared his mouth and then proceeded to go back to the >> testimony but I'm aspirating and vomiting from >> sorry >> I don't believe the testimony is in the record >> the commentary >> I'll not and and you yourself did not do you know how to give mouth to mouth >> I did not And I that bothers me today that I could not help him. And the only thing I could do was just clear his ground with the leaves. And I couldn't do anything else but to stay there with him because he didn't have nobody there with him.

[00:30:12]>> But Mr. child did apparently give mouth-to-mouth resuscitative efforts to save his life right there in front.

[00:30:33]>> That's all we have. Thank you.

[00:30:34]>> Hang on.

[00:30:42]You need a moment.

[00:30:48]>> I'm sorry. We got to rehash this, but I So, Mr. McCulla just mentioned that this um the defendant, Mr. Chow, was giving life.

[00:31:03]He was trying to save this young man's life is what he said, right? And that's after he shot it in the back, right?

[00:31:11]>> Well, not I object to that because this is direct redirect. She's already said she didn't see a gun. Didn't see a shot by uh go ahead and ask a question and see where >> Okay. So, Mr. Mr. McCulla asked her, he said, "You um you went through this along with Lydney about what happened right here and said that the defendant, Mr. Chow, Rick Chow, was giving him mouth to mouth trying to save this child's life."

[00:31:49]And that was >> Yes.

[00:31:50]>> Yes. I'm sorry.

[00:31:53]>> And that was after Rick Child had shot him in the back.

[00:31:57]>> Yes.

[00:31:58]And who did you see standing in a shooting position out of anybody of the three people who were who ran in front of your car?

[00:32:05]>> I saw Mr. Child.

[00:32:06]>> The defendant reach out.

[00:32:09]>> Yes, sir.

[00:32:10]>> The man sitting right there?

[00:32:11]>> Yes, sir.

[00:32:12]>> All right. So, you said that you clearly saw Cyrus didn't have anything in his hands, right?

[00:32:21]>> I did not see anything in his hand.

[00:32:22]>> You did? You never saw him pointing turning towards them?

[00:32:25]>> I did not. He was running the entire time.

[00:32:28]>> Yes, sir.

[00:32:29]>> And when he ran by you, he looked scared.

[00:32:32]>> He did.

[00:32:33]>> And who was running behind him?

[00:32:38]>> Mr. Child. Suddenly.

[00:32:41]>> And did you ever see Cyrus turn around and confront them?

[00:32:47]>> No.

[00:32:50]>> Kept running away from them.

[00:32:52]>> Yes.

[00:32:52]>> And they continued pursuing him the entire time.

[00:32:55]>> Yes. Now, also in questioning, um, Mr. McCulla said you didn't see a gun cuz he had it hidden in the front pocket.

[00:33:03]>> I didn't see no gun.

[00:33:05]>> Okay.

[00:33:07]>> Was that because it was hidden in the front pocket?

[00:33:11]>> I didn't see no gun.

[00:33:12]>> Okay.

[00:33:20]And have you seen somebody shot, killed, or dying in front of you like that before?

[00:33:27]>> No.

[00:33:27]>> And you were a little bit frantic is the word you used?

[00:33:31]>> Yes.

[00:33:31]>> A little bit upset.

[00:33:33]>> Yes.

[00:33:33]>> Did you do the best that you could to tell the police what you saw?

[00:33:36]>> I did.

[00:33:36]>> And at the end of the day, you didn't see a gun in Syrus's hands.

[00:33:41]>> Would that be a yes or no, ma'am?

[00:33:43]>> I didn't see a gun.

[00:33:44]>> Okay. Did not see a gun. I did not see a gun.

[00:33:50]>> Nope. Thank you.

[00:33:55]>> Thank you, Mr. >> I do.

[00:34:36]All right, ladies and gentlemen, we're going to take a short break. Um, I know you all had a break when we discussing the matter. Well, none of us have had one yet. So, we're going to take our afternoon break for, let's just say, 10 minutes. We'll be back out. Um, about 44 24.

[00:35:25]Yeah.

[00:35:33]Hallelujah.

[00:39:11]Were you hear?

[00:39:30]>> No, I didn't.

[00:39:37]Does it work?

[00:44:28]Is the witness that were awkward?

[00:44:55]microphone.

[00:45:09]Test it.

[00:45:10]>> But if they stop like you hear that >> I mean I hear That's what I do when I >> you knew that.

[00:46:06]>> That's It's like J is present. Y >> thank you Mr. All right, please. State calls Kennedy Carson.

[00:48:25]from your right hand to >> do you swear or just give this case the truth to hold it and then truth to help you die.

[00:48:36]>> Yes. Thank you.

[00:48:38]State your for the record. Please spell your first name.

[00:48:47]First name Kennedy K I N.

[00:49:03]>> So, um, again, your name is Kennedy Carson, >> correct?

[00:49:06]>> And so, just to kind of, um, move a little bit. Well, I'll give you a couple court kind of procedural pieces. Then we'll I'll try to speed the process along a little bit. Um, so you got a court reporter sitting next to you. So, I just need you to speak loudly enough.

[00:49:19]And if you would, uh, I know it's normal to nod your head or say mhm or mm, but if you'll say yes or no, just so that uh, we can take it down properly and that everybody on the jury can understand what you're saying.

[00:49:29]>> Sure.

[00:49:29]>> Okay. All right. So, um, um, your mother is Lorie Carson. Is that correct?

[00:49:34]>> Yes.

[00:49:35]>> All right. And you're the you're three siblings.

[00:49:38]>> I have three siblings. I'm >> okay. Where where are you in the in the fold?

[00:49:42]>> I'm her first born.

[00:49:43]>> All right. So the more bossy room.

[00:49:46]>> Yes.

[00:49:47]>> All right. Did you grow up around here?

[00:49:49]>> Yes, I did.

[00:49:50]>> What high school?

[00:49:51]>> Spring Valley.

[00:49:52]>> All right. So you grew up on the north side northeast side?

[00:49:54]>> Yes, sir.

[00:49:55]>> Are you slightly familiar with the northeast side of Columbia?

[00:49:58]>> Very familiar.

[00:49:59]>> All right. Um are you any relation to anybody in this case?

[00:50:03]>> No. And in fact, you're under subpoena to be here today.

[00:50:06]>> Yes. All right.

[00:50:07]>> Were you a witness to some matters that took place back in uh May of 2023?

[00:50:12]>> Yes.

[00:50:13]>> All right. In May of 2023, um were you working?

[00:50:16]>> Yes.

[00:50:17]>> What were you doing at that point?

[00:50:19]>> May of 2023, I was working for TD Bank.

[00:50:22]Still am lockbox services.

[00:50:26]>> Okay. And your experiences at TD Bank, you uh just talk about some of the roles you've had here before. I've been a seller, a teller, excuse me, um customer service representative, IT specialist.

[00:50:38]Now I'm a lockbox processor.

[00:50:40]>> So you've been there for quite some time.

[00:50:42]>> Yes.

[00:50:42]>> And and you you've dealt with the public. You've dealt with multiple roles at TD Bank.

[00:50:46]>> Yes.

[00:50:46]>> All right. Now, back in 2023, May of 2023, wherever you live, >> Greenbryer Apartments.

[00:50:53]>> All right.

[00:50:55]And is that in Columbia area, Christian County?

[00:50:59]>> Yes, it is. Can you give give us a little bit better vantage point of where that is in Columbia?

[00:51:03]>> Um off of the Springtree Road, Park Lane Park Lane Spring Tree, I believe.

[00:51:11]>> Okay. I'm going to show you what's already been marked. Stage 15.

[00:51:18]Okay. Going to hand that over to you.

[00:51:21]Take a look at that if you would for a moment and see if you can familiarize yourself with that photograph.

[00:51:29]Are you familiar with that?

[00:51:30]>> Yes.

[00:51:30]>> Tell me what that looks to be.

[00:51:32]>> Um, this looks like Spring Tree Road and the beginning of the photo is Park Lane.

[00:51:40]>> And is that the vicinity that you lived?

[00:51:42]>> Yes.

[00:51:43]>> All right. Can we publish that on the screen, please?

[00:52:05]There we go.

[00:52:07]>> All right. So, you said um and if I could have the witness step down briefly on >> Yes.

[00:52:16]>> coming down, please.

[00:52:18]>> So, come on down here if you would. If you look up tile, I'm going to give you this corner. tell us about what we're talking if you can walk me through as I ask you a couple of these questions.

[00:52:28]>> Okay.

[00:52:28]>> All right. So, you see it show us Spring Tree Road if you can from here.

[00:52:33]>> This one here.

[00:52:35]>> Okay. That's Spring Tree.

[00:52:37]>> And there's been uh the one that runs perpendicular directly in front of that is what?

[00:52:42]>> This is >> All right. And you were living about where back in 2023 is back that way.

[00:52:52]>> Okay. So, at the I'll say at the top of the screen is the Green Bry Brier apartment complex.

[00:52:58]>> Yes.

[00:52:58]>> And that's where you were living back in 2023.

[00:53:01]>> Yes.

[00:53:01]>> All right. You could have a seat, please.

[00:53:11]It's like an amusement.

[00:53:15]>> So, if we concentrate specifically on May 28, 2023, can you give the jury an idea of what you were doing that day?

[00:53:22]>> Um, we had just came back from seeing the Little Mermaid.

[00:53:28]>> So, tell me who he is.

[00:53:29]>> My mother, my daughter, and my niece.

[00:53:32]>> Okay. So, you're going to see the Little Mermaid? Yes.

[00:53:34]>> And tell us what was happening at that point.

[00:53:40]far as when we were coming back home.

[00:53:43]>> Yes. When you were coming, what were your plans for the evening after seeing little?

[00:53:46]>> Okay. My mom was dropping me off, but I didn't have anything to drink at the house. So, we was going to stop by the corner store right there, that shell station to grab something to drink.

[00:53:56]>> Okay. Now, you said the corner store, excuse me, the shell station. Again, I'm showing council states 28 and I'm sorry, states 18 and 16, which are already in evidence.

[00:54:09]>> Yeah.

[00:54:10]>> Okay. So, you talked about a corner store.

[00:54:14]Let me show you stage 16 and 18 and tell me if you're familiar with those.

[00:54:19]>> Yes.

[00:54:20]>> All right. And tell me what you're seeing in those photos. Um, >> and you can actually look it up screen.

[00:54:26]They may be up in a moment now.

[00:54:37]This is the Shell gas station.

[00:54:39]>> Okay.

[00:54:40]>> And so that first May I have? Okay. Big man. So that first um video that we showed was an aerial view, meaning kind of a bird's eye view of it. This is closer in. This is the Shell station that you were uh going to that particular day that states uh 16.

[00:54:58]>> Yes. All right. And uh did you go to that shell station often?

[00:55:02]>> Yes. All >> right. Now about how many times that you could uh just kind of count in your head roughly how many times you've been inside that shell station?

[00:55:10]>> I can't count on my hands. It's been too many. Um I've lived in that area for over 3 years. So that was the gas station I frequent.

[00:55:20]>> Okay.

[00:55:20]>> So >> And so having been in there before, you'd um kind of had a chance to walk and look around the store. Is that fair?

[00:55:28]>> Yes.

[00:55:29]>> All right. And uh was there anything about the decorations in that store or the pictures in that store that would bring your attention to things?

[00:55:35]>> Um what's alarming is when you walk in the store, you see all the photos on the the wall.

[00:55:41]>> Okay. So, let me show you what's been marked number 52.

[00:55:50]Take a look at this and tell me if you recognize that if you're familiar with that view.

[00:55:55]>> Yes.

[00:55:56]Tell me what you're seeing generally.

[00:56:00]>> The clerk stand and the photos.

[00:56:02]>> Okay. And you see several photos, correct?

[00:56:04]>> Yes.

[00:56:04]>> All right. May I have that back? And the stage 52 that is up on that board, the photos that you're talking about above the clerk's head. Is that a fair and accurate representation of what you would see on a daily basis or however often you shopped in that convenience store?

[00:56:17]>> Yes.

[00:56:18]>> Right. Did you have a chance to have conversations with the clerks and people who were in that store?

[00:56:24]>> Yes. Yes.

[00:56:24]>> Do you see any of them sitting in the courtroom today?

[00:56:28]>> Yes.

[00:56:29]>> Uh, who do you see sitting in the courtroom, if you know a name?

[00:56:32]>> Uh, Mr. Child.

[00:56:34]>> And where is he seated?

[00:56:35]>> He's seated over there.

[00:56:38]>> And again, reflect that. Um, the defense, excuse me, the witness is pointing out Mr. Child.

[00:56:43]>> Yes. Okay. The defendant in this case.

[00:56:46]>> All right. So, if we focus on the 28th, um, you were heading home that evening is what you said. Uh, what kind of vehicle were you guys riding in? Um BMW X5.

[00:56:56]>> Okay. BMW X5.

[00:56:57]>> Yes.

[00:56:58]>> And that was your mom's car?

[00:56:59]>> Yes, it was.

[00:57:00]>> And you said your daughter was in the car. You were in the car?

[00:57:02]>> Yes.

[00:57:03]>> Where was everybody positioned inside of that car?

[00:57:06]>> My mother was driving. My niece was in the passenger seat up front. Me and my daughter were in the back seat.

[00:57:14]>> Okay. and you were uh so again you said you're in the back seat and I'd like to uh and what if anything um occurred as you were coming home and turning on the spring tree to go to that store.

[00:57:27]>> We pulled into the gas station as we were pulling in um Cyrus was running out and behind Cyrus was his son and Mr. Chow.

[00:57:40]>> Okay. So I'd like to show uh slide number 20 of states exhibit number four.

[00:57:56]So tell us if you recognize a vehicle that you would have been traveling in on May 28th, 2023.

[00:58:02]>> I'm just passing right there.

[00:58:05]>> Okay. And when you say right there, um, do you need to step down or can can I is that the one that's, uh, there's a >> I can describe it. There's a red sign in front of the car and then we are right behind that red sign there.

[00:58:20]>> Okay.

[00:58:23]And so as you pulled into that G, did you take a ride into the gas station?

[00:58:27]>> Yes.

[00:58:27]>> All right. And what did you observe when you took a ride into the gas station?

[00:58:31]>> Cyrus was running out. Um, his shoe had fell off. And um he was holding his pants up with one hand and pumping his arms with the other.

[00:58:41]>> All right. And when you said he was running out, you said there were people behind him. Do you recognize in this courtroom anybody who was behind him?

[00:58:49]>> Yes.

[00:58:49]>> Uh tell us who you recognized.

[00:58:51]>> Mr. Chow.

[00:58:52]>> All right. The defendant, Mr. Child.

[00:58:54]Rich.

[00:58:56]>> All right. Now, I'd like to um see this and tell us what was Cyrus uh what was his demeanor as he was running away.

[00:59:06]>> His eyes were big. I mean, he was running pretty fast.

[00:59:12]>> Okay. Was it a casual stroll like you walking through the park?

[00:59:16]>> No.

[00:59:18]describe or show the jury if you could with your hands what you were observing as the as Cyrus came out of that store.

[00:59:31]>> Cyrus was holding his pants up like this, pumping his arms like this.

[00:59:37]>> Okay.

[00:59:38]>> You said you saw a shoe.

[00:59:40]>> Yes.

[00:59:40]>> Tell me what you Tell me about that.

[00:59:42]Explain that a little bit more. before he hit Springtree Road, his shoe had fell off.

[00:59:50]I'd >> like to show um slide 21 of state exhibit number four.

[01:00:20]So based on uh slide 21106, exhibit number four, did you see a shoe?

[01:00:26]>> Yes.

[01:00:26]>> Okay. And is that a fair and accurate representation of what you viewed as you and your family were in that um car pulling into the gas station?

[01:00:34]>> Yes. Um, can you describe about although it doesn't seem to be in the video, uh, where you all would have been positioned where your car would have been so you could see those things. Goodness, this car is kind of in the way, but um, we were at the corner at the end of this parking lot area.

[01:00:59]That makes sense.

[01:01:03]And what was Rick Chow doing at that point?

[01:01:07]The defendant Rick Chow >> was running behind his son.

[01:01:11]>> And the son meaning Andy Chow.

[01:01:13]>> Yes.

[01:01:15]>> Can we show states um slide 27? I apologize. State executive number four.

[01:01:37]>> Can you describe? Well, first of all, does that vehicle look familiar to you?

[01:01:41]>> Yes.

[01:01:42]>> Whose vehicle is that?

[01:01:43]>> That's my mother's.

[01:01:44]>> All right. And you are inside of that vehicle?

[01:01:46]>> Yes, I am.

[01:01:47]>> Tell us what you saw. Um, so Cyrus was running out. His shoe came off. He was pumping his arms and holding his pants with the other arm. He crossed the street and he tripped over the curb.

[01:02:00]At that time, he got back up.

[01:02:04]Um, I see Mr. Child step out. He had his arms up and then we see Cyrus fall again to the ground. He kind of like crawled basically um to the place where he passed.

[01:02:25]>> I'm going to go back through that with you slowly. I want to show you something real quick before we go to this next portion. I'm going to show you uh states that take a look at that if you will, please.

[01:02:46]Does that look familiar to you?

[01:02:48]>> Yes.

[01:02:48]>> Uh, tell me what it looks to be a still shot of.

[01:02:51]>> It looks to see um there's a still shot of Andy in front of his father and me and my family in the car and um Andy and his father are running.

[01:03:04]>> Is it fair to say it's a still shot of the video we just watched?

[01:03:06]>> Yes.

[01:03:07]>> All right. I'd like to interstate 72 in the evidence.

[01:03:10]>> Objection. No objection. All right. Be State 72 without objection.

[01:03:14]>> May we close that, please? Yes, sir.

[01:03:20]>> All right.

[01:03:22]So, is Andy and Rick are running after Cyrus? You said you saw the shoe come off.

[01:03:30]>> Yes.

[01:03:30]>> You said that you saw a little bit further down the road Cyrus trip or fall multiple times.

[01:03:37]>> Yes.

[01:03:37]>> Okay. Now, let's talk a little bit more.

[01:03:39]You said that you saw um him standing.

[01:03:43]Go back through that. I don't I do not want to put words in your mouth.

[01:03:46]>> Um, sure. Um, so we pull in. Um, we stop right where you see us. Um, they run across. Um, Cyrus trips over the curb.

[01:03:57]Um, he gets back up.

[01:04:01]You see Mr. child go and step out, put his arms up and Cyrus trips again and kind of gets back up, but he's like a crawl to where he passed away.

[01:04:14]>> What if anything did you see in Cyrus Carmarmac's hands when he ran past you?

[01:04:21]>> Nothing. So, when he was in the parking lot, well, running out the parking lot, he had his like bag right here. When he tripped the first time, he didn't have his book bag anymore. Um, when he was in the parking lot running, he was pumping his arms. It was visible and he was running.

[01:04:40]>> And from your vantage point, could you see if there was anything in his hands?

[01:04:44]>> There wasn't anything in his hands.

[01:04:46]>> I'm going to show you what's been states exhibit number 20.

[01:04:57]Can I hand that to you?

[01:04:58]>> Yes, sir.

[01:05:00]>> Does that Venice point look familiar to you?

[01:05:03]>> Yes.

[01:05:06]>> Is that where you observed um all of the goings on on Springtree Road? Yes.

[01:05:12]>> On May 28th, 2023?

[01:05:14]>> Yes.

[01:05:14]>> Is that where you just testified you saw Rick uh Child, the defendant in this case, and the son Andy, chasing after Cyrus?

[01:05:22]>> Yes.

[01:05:22]>> Is that where you saw that shoe fly off?

[01:05:25]>> Yes. Is that where you saw him Cyrus fall in the backpack fell?

[01:05:30]>> Yes.

[01:05:30]>> Is that where you saw after he tripped him meaning Cyrus tripped over that curve Rick do some kind of motion with his hands?

[01:05:37]>> Yes.

[01:05:40]Come on.

[01:05:42]>> What did you see him do with his hands at that point in time?

[01:05:49]>> Okay. So after Cyrus tripped, he had his hands like this, you know.

[01:05:56]Um, if I can move this down.

[01:06:03]>> Can the witness down there?

[01:06:08]Come on down, please.

[01:06:14]Thank you. All right. Please continue.

[01:06:18]Okay. Um, if the jury is my vantage point this way.

[01:06:24]>> Okay.

[01:06:26]And excuse me. So, um, defendant child's right here. So, where was Cyrus positioned?

[01:06:35]>> Cyrus was in front of him.

[01:06:37]>> Okay.

[01:06:37]>> Will it turn? We're all facing the same way.

[01:06:40]>> You turn turn me in the direction of of where Cyrus would have been facing.

[01:06:47]Okay.

[01:06:48]>> Yeah. Maybe a little lower cuz he had tripped and he was coming back up.

[01:06:52]>> Yeah.

[01:06:53]>> More like that.

[01:06:54]>> Yes, sir.

[01:06:55]>> Or you still >> You can lead with words and you can lead with actions. And I objected either way.

[01:07:02]>> Your honest lower and I got lower.

[01:07:06]>> So if I'm getting lower more like this or more like this?

[01:07:10]>> More like that.

[01:07:11]>> All right. And so as And is that when you tell us what you saw when you saw him lower in the position that I was just in?

[01:07:20]>> He tripped and he's coming back up.

[01:07:22]>> Right. So I'm positioning myself again somewhere in here.

[01:07:26]>> Yes. He was on his way back up. Mr. Chow was already like this.

[01:07:31]>> Did you see Cyrus Carmarmac turn around at any point?

[01:07:37]>> No.

[01:07:37]>> Did you see him point anything at Rick Chow or Andy Chow at any point? No.

[01:07:44]>> Did you hear anything?

[01:07:48]>> There's a lot going on. My mom was in the car and >> you my mom was in the car a little hysterical.

[01:07:59]Um she was she said, "Is that a gunshot?"

[01:08:04]And I didn't really want to be involved with this. And I I was like, "No, that wasn't that wasn't a shot. That wasn't a shot. We had the windows rolled up and so it was muffled.

[01:08:16]>> Okay. Yeah.

[01:08:17]>> But even with the windows being rolled up and it being muffled, did that interrupt what you saw with your eyes?

[01:08:22]>> No.

[01:08:23]>> From the vantage point that you saw it, >> no.

[01:08:29]Now Your mother eventually, excuse me, drove down to the incident location.

[01:08:45]>> Yes.

[01:08:46]>> All right. And uh and came back. Did there was there a conversation of some sort that took place between she and anybody?

[01:08:53]>> Yes. Um >> while you guys were still in the car?

[01:08:56]>> Yes.

[01:08:56]>> Okay. Who did she speak with?

[01:08:58]>> Mr. Child.

[01:08:59]>> All right. And did she come back to the scene for a brief moment?

[01:09:03]>> Yeah. Um she circled around. Um, so after the incident took place, she drove down some and she asked Mr. Child, "Did anybody need help? Is anybody hurt?"

[01:09:15]>> So, don't tell me what he said, but after that conversation, the driving took place.

[01:09:20]>> Yes. And she turned back around.

[01:09:22]We turned around and parked.

[01:09:24]>> May I show states? I'm sorry. Slide number 30 of um defense zip number four.

[01:09:45]What do you see there?

[01:09:46]>> That's my mom whipping the car around.

[01:09:51]>> Who do you see walking past that car?

[01:09:54]>> I guess that's Miss Child. I don't really I'm not too familiar with her.

[01:09:57]>> Okay. All right.

[01:10:01]And is that the point you went back down to the scene?

[01:10:04]>> Yes.

[01:10:04]>> All right. And what happened when you went back down to the scene? I think you said uh the words came out. Did you say you parked?

[01:10:11]>> Yes, we parked.

[01:10:12]>> Okay. All right. And after you parked, um what happened? Let's talk generally about what happened. Now, be careful.

[01:10:18]Don't tell me what other people said, but just tell me what you did.

[01:10:22]>> We parked. Uh my mom hopped out. I hopped out the car.

[01:10:26]>> Mhm.

[01:10:26]>> And we went down to the scene.

[01:10:28]>> Okay. Uh, what did you observe with your eyes?

[01:10:32]>> Uh, Mr. Child was sitting over um Cyrus.

[01:10:40]>> Yeah, he wasn't doing anything. He was just sitting there.

[01:10:45]And did you interact with uh what what was the scene like? Were people What was the scene like when you were out there? Um, my mom made it down there before me and when I was walking down there was another young lady. We kind of just walked down at the same time.

[01:11:03]>> Okay. What was Cyrus doing?

[01:11:05]>> Cyrus was laying there.

[01:11:08]>> What was uh defendant Rick Child doing?

[01:11:11]>> He was just sitting there just looking at him.

[01:11:15]>> What if anything was the son doing? Andy Child, >> he was standing off. He didn't move after the incident happened. He was still >> Did you observe anything around the scene?

[01:11:27]>> Um there was um a gun by a tree over there. Uh Cyrus didn't have his book bag and um it was Mr. Child and Cyrus over there.

[01:11:42]>> Yeah.

[01:11:44]>> And do you know who that gun belonged to?

[01:11:47]>> No.

[01:11:49]Did you see a gun in uh in in Cyrus's hand at any point in time?

[01:11:53]>> No.

[01:12:04]>> Dolphins.

[01:12:05]>> Yes, sir.

[01:12:23]Now, couple more questions.

[01:12:29]Could you tell any type of um just the sizes of the people who were involved in this entire incident that we're talking about?

[01:12:38]>> Sure.

[01:12:38]>> Okay. Tell us what you could observe.

[01:12:40]Um, Andy is much taller than his father.

[01:12:44]Um, Cyrus is much shorter than Andy.

[01:12:49]>> I don't.

[01:12:52]>> Yeah.

[01:12:52]>> Now, you you've um, and I don't want to make this personal, so I'll try to ask this as gingerly as I can. Um, how old Cyrus look?

[01:13:02]>> I thought Cyrus was like 16.

[01:13:04]>> Mhm.

[01:13:06]>> Yeah, that was I thought he was 16.

[01:13:08]>> He looked like a grown man. No, you look like a child.

[01:13:20]>> Thank you.

[01:13:34]We have slide 27.

[01:13:39]one up.

[01:13:43]>> It's a still child.

[01:14:18]No, it's not.

[01:14:26]Let me show you what's the state put up as 72.

[01:14:51]>> So that's your automobile that you were in. Yes.

[01:14:57]>> And where were you in that?

[01:14:59]>> I'm in the back seat. Um, it would be uh the passenger side.

[01:15:04]>> Passenger side.

[01:15:05]>> Yes.

[01:15:06]>> So, that would be to the left side.

[01:15:12]>> Well, the right side is the passenger side.

[01:15:15]>> Okay. So, all right. So, are you on the left side?

[01:15:19]>> I'm on the I'm in the back seat on the right side.

[01:15:22]>> Okay. and and this photograph states exhibit 72. That pretty much the way the thing looked that evening.

[01:15:35]>> Yes.

[01:15:36]>> And it was that dark. It was 8:00 at night.

[01:15:40]>> It was bright outside.

[01:15:41]>> Bright outside.

[01:15:43]Okay.

[01:15:45]And um you know the distance.

[01:15:51]Well, your automobile stopped um in the parking lot. Yes.

[01:15:58]>> Yes. Well, right turning into the entrance.

[01:16:01]>> Okay. There was a bush there on the side and you pulled up to that bush.

[01:16:04]>> Yes.

[01:16:05]>> And you saw these three people run past.

[01:16:07]>> Yes.

[01:16:09]>> And nobody had a gun.

[01:16:11]>> No.

[01:16:12]>> You heard no yelling, >> no cursing?

[01:16:16]>> No.

[01:16:17]>> You just saw three people run past?

[01:16:19]>> Yes. Now, you said that you saw the first person who you described as called Cyrus. You you described that he was appeared to be pulling up his pants.

[01:16:31]>> Holding his pants.

[01:16:33]>> Could he have been holding a pistol in his waistband?

[01:16:36]>> No.

[01:16:37]>> How do you know?

[01:16:38]>> You seen the pants in his hand?

[01:16:40]>> I see. Well, didn't he have a long hoodie on? Red hoodie.

[01:16:43]>> He had a hoodie on. He's still holding your pants. You can still see him holding his pants.

[01:16:48]Did you know he had a pistol?

[01:16:50]>> No.

[01:16:52]>> You didn't know anybody else had a pistol?

[01:16:54]>> No.

[01:16:56]>> And the um windows in your vehicle were rolled up.

[01:17:02]>> I'm sorry.

[01:17:02]>> The windows in the vehicle that you were in were rolled up.

[01:17:06]>> Yes, they were.

[01:17:09]>> And the uh you saw his the you saw Cyrus's shoe come off?

[01:17:15]>> Yes.

[01:17:16]Did you see him throw things left and right as he ran across the parking lot?

[01:17:21]>> No.

[01:17:22]>> Didn't see him throw cell phones?

[01:17:23]>> No. Did >> you see him throw the backpack down the road?

[01:17:27]>> He didn't throw the backpack. He tripped and fell. When he got back up, the backpack wasn't on him anymore.

[01:17:33]>> Had it been on his shoulders?

[01:17:34]>> It was on the shoulder.

[01:17:36]>> Okay.

[01:17:37]And um now the distance from where your vehicle was and your vehicle would stayed in the same stationary position, same spot until after he fell down. Is that correct?

[01:17:55]>> Yes.

[01:17:56]>> And fell down and didn't get up.

[01:17:57]>> Correct.

[01:17:59]>> And and would it surprise you to know that that's 130 yards?

[01:18:04]>> Okay. Well, I mean, you wouldn't quarrel with that number, would you?

[01:18:08]>> I wouldn't know the distance if I seen it.

[01:18:12]>> Okay.

[01:18:13]>> So, it's longer than a football field.

[01:18:15]So, if you're standing at one end of a football field, it's even further than that.

[01:18:19]>> I can see down a football field.

[01:18:22]>> Okay. And and but as you described and exhibited here, these people that were 130 yards away, Mr. Chow had his back to you.

[01:18:35]as did uh you couldn't see Mr. Belton.

[01:18:40]You couldn't see what he had in his hands, could you?

[01:18:43]>> I seen what Cyrus had in his hands when he ran across, >> right? Anything in his hands? That's not my question.

[01:18:49]>> When he got back up from tripping, his hands were he was he was like crawling when he crawled. So, his hands were on the ground.

[01:18:56]>> All right. But when he started to get up and and you said I think in your uh you and your mother made a 911 call, didn't you?

[01:19:07]>> Yes.

[01:19:09]>> You remember telling the dispatcher he might have got shot? I'm not sure.

[01:19:13]>> Yeah, it was a lot going on. I was processing my emotions.

[01:19:16]>> You remember telling the dispatcher uh that you believed he might have stolen something.

[01:19:22]>> That's what was being said.

[01:19:25]Uh, you told the dispatcher I don't know who shot him.

[01:19:28]>> I did say I don't know who shot him.

[01:19:31]>> You uh so you also testify a few moments ago that let's see that you saw him trip multiple times.

[01:19:51]>> Correct. He tripped twice >> and crawled to where he passed.

[01:19:56]>> Correct.

[01:19:58]>> You You did not include that detail in your 911 call.

[01:20:02]>> I didn't.

[01:20:04]>> Do you remember talking to officers uh officer uh Carter, I believe, or deputy? I believe it's uh English or Carter. Do you remember speaking to officers at the scene?

[01:20:24]>> Yes.

[01:20:25]>> You didn't include that detail. You never told either one of them that you saw this gun that you saw him shot and crawled to where he died. You didn't include that in your explanation to them of what you've just seen. And this was something that was moments before.

[01:20:44]>> Yes, I did.

[01:20:45]>> Well, you want to You think you did? I know I didn't.

[01:20:50]>> Well, I'll be happy for you to find it in this transcript, but if you think you did, you think you did?

[01:20:58]>> I think I did. Yeah, I >> I know I did.

[01:21:01]>> When you went to the sheriff's department on July the 25th, 2023.

[01:21:06]>> Mhm.

[01:21:08]>> Did you tell that detail to that investigator as well?

[01:21:12]>> I was asked um far as vantage point. I wasn't asked what happened. In fact, nobody asked you any questions about what happened.

[01:21:19]>> No, they wanted to know vantage point of where I was. And >> they wanted you to draw a diagram, didn't they?

[01:21:25]>> Go ahead. Sorry.

[01:21:28]>> You better finish.

[01:21:31]>> They ask you to draw a diagram.

[01:21:33]>> Yes.

[01:21:34]>> Did they question you about anything about what you saw?

[01:21:39]>> No.

[01:21:40]>> Did they question you about how far away you were? They asked where I was and to draw the vantage point of what I seen.

[01:21:47]>> Okay.

[01:21:49]>> And you didn't volunteer anything like you've testified to today?

[01:21:53]>> No.

[01:22:33]So before I sit down, let me get one more Clarification here.

[01:22:42]When you saw these three people run past your vehicle, did you know that the third person in line, the person following the tall younger man was Mr. Child?

[01:22:58]>> Yes.

[01:22:59]>> You knew him to be the store owner?

[01:23:01]>> Yes.

[01:23:03]But in the 911 call, you recall saying I don't know who shot him.

[01:23:09]>> I Yes, I said that. I was pro. I didn't want to be involved. When my mom stopped the vehicle, I told her to keep going because I did not want to be involved.

[01:23:20]My mom called 911 and she handed me the phone.

[01:23:23]>> Okay.

[01:23:23]>> And my mom is being hysterical in the back and I know I have to be calm and process what I see. I did not want to be involved. That's the reason why I said I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

[01:23:36]Because I didn't want to be involved.

[01:23:38]>> But in the 911 call and on the scene, you didn't tell the police that you saw Mr. Chow shoot anybody.

[01:23:44]>> I didn't want to be involved. I was made to be involved.

[01:23:55]>> Thank you.

[01:23:56]>> Anything?

[01:23:58]Yes, sir.

[01:24:00]Now, there's a set of questions about the statement that you gave gave. Isn't it true that you gave a statement to the police, a written statement on the 28th?

[01:24:09]>> Yes.

[01:24:09]>> Of um May 2023?

[01:24:13]>> Yes. They called me back. I went home and they called me back to make the statement.

[01:25:09]That's like this mark for ID purposes only.

[01:25:32]Hello.

[01:25:52]14. Make sure we get it right.

[01:26:01]>> 82 >> 82 82 Thank you.

[01:26:15]Now, you asked a series of questions.

[01:26:17]I'm going to show you states exhibit 82 for ID purposes only. Um, let me take a look at that and tell us if you recognize that it You recognize that document?

[01:27:05]>> Yes.

[01:27:05]>> Whose handwriting is that? this handwriting. I believe was the officer that I was speaking with, but that's my signature at the bottom.

[01:27:12]>> That's your signature at the bottom.

[01:27:14]>> So, this is uh what you told the officer what the officer wrote down in your signature.

[01:27:19]>> Yes.

[01:27:19]>> And in this statement, it says and it says uh you're making this statement freely, free and free. I can't read today. I make this statement of my own free will and accord without reward or intimidation. All of the above is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Do you see that written on that document?

[01:27:37]>> Yes.

[01:27:38]>> Okay. So then on 2123 um military time, so if I do my math, I can't do math. 9:23.

[01:27:49]>> Yes.

[01:27:49]>> On 52823, you gave a statement to them.

[01:27:52]>> Yes.

[01:27:53]>> All right. And the question, did you see a kid with a kid with a gun? Answer, no.

[01:27:56]When he was running, he was holding his pants up. Is that what that say is?

[01:28:00]>> Is that what that says?

[01:28:01]>> Yes.

[01:28:02]>> Okay. Did you see any weapons on the ground? The answer is yes. The gun by the tree. Did you see how the gun got there? Answer is no. Do you remember saying those things?

[01:28:10]>> Yes.

[01:28:11]>> Um, did you hear the owner say anything about the kid? Answer, you say no. Did you hear anyone say anything about being shot? Answer is no. Do you remember saying those things?

[01:28:21]>> Yes.

[01:28:21]>> And do you remember in this here saying that you heard a pop?

[01:28:25]>> Yes.

[01:28:25]>> You saw the kid fall down?

[01:28:27]>> Yes.

[01:28:28]>> Uh, you called 911?

[01:28:30]>> Yes. Yes.

[01:28:31]>> You parked the car and you walked and the owner was shaking him trying to wake him up.

[01:28:35]>> Yes.

[01:28:35]>> You remember saying that?

[01:28:36]>> Yes.

[01:28:37]>> You said that you saw people run out of the store.

[01:28:39]>> Yes.

[01:28:39]>> The kid, the store owner.

[01:28:41]>> Yes.

[01:28:41]>> The owner and his wife.

[01:28:42]>> His wife came after Mr. Child.

[01:28:45]>> And that you followed on Spring Tree and the son and the corner and the son and the owner had the kid boxed in.

[01:28:51]>> Yes.

[01:28:52]>> The kid fell down and they were in arms reach of him and that's when I heard the pop.

[01:28:57]>> You said that?

[01:28:57]>> Yes, I did. And you said that on May 28th, 2023. Correct?

[01:29:02]>> Yes.

[01:29:02]>> At 9:23 in the evening, correct?

[01:29:05]>> Yes.

[01:29:06]>> And that was about an hour and some change after this incident took place.

[01:29:11]Right.

[01:29:12]>> Yes.

[01:29:12]>> All right. I'd like to show slide 21, please, of states exhibit number four.

[01:29:21]And while we're doing that, there's this question about 130 yards. Uh, did you measure?

[01:29:26]>> I didn't measure. Uh, do you know if the 130 yards is from the front door of the store or from the tip of the property when it goes off of their property onto the public road with Spring Tree?

[01:29:36]>> I don't know where they were, >> but did you have a clear vantage point?

[01:29:39]>> I seen it all.

[01:29:42]>> All right. So, will you play that, please?

[01:29:46]Yeah.

[01:30:03]>> Glint my way glass is hard to see. Is it light or dark outside?

[01:30:07]>> It's light.

[01:30:09]And that's a fair accurate representation of what the weather conditions were like at 8:02 or so on May 28th, 2023.

[01:30:18]>> Yes.

[01:30:18]>> Was not dark.

[01:30:19]>> It was not dark. It was dark at 9:22.

[01:30:25]>> Now, you said in your direct you saw child pointing at Cyrus.

[01:30:31]>> Yes.

[01:30:32]>> Cyrus was on on his knees on I mean, excuse me, getting up on the ground.

[01:30:36]>> Yes. And not too long after that, you realize that he'd been shot.

[01:30:40]>> Yes.

[01:30:41]>> And he passed away out there.

[01:30:43]>> Yes, he did.

[01:30:51]>> Do you know who shot?

[01:30:53]>> Mr. Child shot him.

[01:30:58]>> Thank you, honor.

[01:31:02]So, I notice in this statement that you gave You say, "I pulled into the store with my mom and I saw four people run out of the store."

[01:31:16]>> Four people.

[01:31:20]>> The kid, the son of the store owner, the owner, and his wife.

[01:31:25]>> Yes. She picks the shoe up.

[01:31:28]>> But you say here that you saw four people run out of the store.

[01:31:32]>> Yeah. So Cyrus then his son and Mr. Child and few seconds after that >> okay >> was his wife.

[01:31:41]>> You don't you didn't say that. You didn't know that these videos existed when you gave this statement.

[01:31:46]>> Yes, I did. This camera is all around that story.

[01:31:48]>> I'm sorry.

[01:31:49]>> This camera is all around that story.

[01:31:51]>> Oh, so you knew that there was going to be a video that would accurately reflect what really happened, not what you want.

[01:31:56]>> I didn't know this was going to take place at all. Okay.

[01:32:00]And and then you uh you say in the statement, the kid fell down and they were all in arms reach of him and and I that's when I heard a pop, right?

[01:32:12]>> Yes.

[01:32:13]>> You didn't say that you saw the pop.

[01:32:16]>> I can't you see a pop.

[01:32:17]>> Well, you didn't say you saw a gun. You said the boy got up and tried to run and he fell back down.

[01:32:26]You never said you saw Mr. child shoot this young man. You never said you could see the young boy's hands and that he didn't have a gun because you couldn't see him.

[01:32:39]>> That wasn't asked at that time. You see the question on that document. It wasn't asked.

[01:32:45]>> Well, but you were there to make sure that you tell the story.

[01:32:48]>> I was answering the questions I was asked.

[01:32:51]>> I see. Well, nobody was in a hurry to finish, were they?

[01:32:56]>> It was a lot going on. I was in a hurry to leave because I didn't want to be involved. My daughter was there. My niece was there. My mom was hysterical.

[01:33:04]It was a lot going on.

[01:33:06]>> And and there's nothing in here about uh this young man crawling to die.

[01:33:13]>> I stated that he got back up when he he passed away after this the second time he fell. That's when he crawled over to his passing point. Well, ma'am, what you said is if you need the statement, I can provide it to you here.

[01:33:29]>> You want to read along with me?

[01:33:30]>> I don't. If >> you don't >> I don't.

[01:33:33]>> Well, I want to make sure that this is a fair opportunity to uh give up midway on that first page under a colon, a sentence that begins with owner.

[01:33:52]You say in in the next sentence, the kid fell down and they were all in arms reach of him. And that's when I heard the pop. The boy got back up and tried to run and he fell back down.

[01:34:05]>> Yes.

[01:34:07]>> No crawling.

[01:34:09]>> He tried to run.

[01:34:10]>> No, Mr. Chow. Sh.

[01:34:12]>> He fell back down. I wasn't asked that.

[01:34:16]>> Okay.

[01:34:18]>> They asked me what I seen. And um on the second page you were asked you say you saw a gun by the tree.

[01:34:30]>> Yes.

[01:34:31]>> And and the tree you're referring to would have been within a couple of feet or a foot of where this young man died.

[01:34:40]>> It wasn't a foot. Um it was closer to the road, but that's where the gun was found. Right.

[01:34:45]>> And you were asked, did you see how the gun got there? And your answer was >> no.

[01:34:49]>> No.

[01:34:53]Thank you.

[01:34:55]All right. All done.

[01:34:59]>> Yes, sir.

[01:35:01]>> All right, Miss Carter, you can step down. Thanks for being here.

[01:35:05]Sorry about that.

[01:35:06]>> Thank you.

[01:35:17]>> All right. Um but then we're going to recess for the day. Uh we'll get started again tomorrow hopefully at 9:30. Um again don't discuss the case with anyone. Don't do any research on your own or anything of that nature. And we'll see you back here tomorrow morning. Ready to go. Have a good evening.

[01:35:54]Just bring Nothing at this time. Anything?

[01:36:25]>> Nothing.

[01:36:27]>> All right. See y'all more ready to go.