Fran Frazier: “Eve Was Whole, All By Herself!”

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-19

[00:00:01]We are [music] 95% right the majority of the time.

[00:00:05]>> [laughter] >> I can't I we can't help it.

[00:00:08]>> If I hadn't reached out, I would have been suffering alone.

[00:00:12]That's it. Not with the companion of women who could care for me. This was to be a day [music] of prayer for all women who have a relationship with God.

[00:00:24]Period.

[00:00:25]Period. Welcome. Welcome to Platforms where we have authentic stories and experiences of immigrants from all over the world, from the US, in the diaspora.

[00:00:38]It's all about global conversations about belonging, about identity, and what this means to us in our lived experiences.

[00:00:47]Today, we have a fabulous guest with us, and it's my pleasure to welcome Fran Frazier, advocate for women, for girls, a community builder and leader. It is so exciting to have you. Welcome to Platforms. Thank you, Rosera. I'm just excited to be here. I know. Welcome.

[00:01:09]Welcome. I mean, if you're talking about getting one of the people that can tell us about Columbus, about Ohio, about our lives as women, it would be you.

[00:01:19]You think so, huh? I think I believe so, and I think most of the audience would agree with me once they've heard >> Okay.

[00:01:27]>> lots from you. So, welcome. Welcome again.

[00:01:29]>> Thank you very much.

[00:01:30]>> to have you. We're going to start off talking about one of the main things you've done in the community, which you are the founder of Black Girls Rising. Uh-huh.

[00:01:43]Tell us about Black Girls Rising, please.

[00:01:45]>> Black Girls Rising. Well, maybe about 15 years ago, um I had been doing way before then, though. I've been doing a lot of work on relational aggression in girls. Just wondering why why are girls fighting all the time? What what are they angry about? What's making them sad?

[00:02:08]And uh so I started doing a lot of work in school systems around the country.

[00:02:12]Just trying to figure that out.

[00:02:15]Talking with girls, coming up with programs.

[00:02:19]And I got a call from the State Department of Mental Health.

[00:02:24]And they said, "We've got some extra money left. It's not a lot. It's never a lot."

[00:02:31]And uh we wondered if you might be interested in looking at mental health in the black community.

[00:02:38]And uh truthfully I wasn't that interested.

[00:02:42]But what I said was I really would prefer to look at black girls.

[00:02:50]And they were like, "Well, you know, you can't just look at black girls. You got to look at other girls, too." And And I was like, "Well, you know, then maybe you have to find somebody else."

[00:02:59]Oh, wow.

[00:03:01]Cuz that's where my heart is. That's where my interest is. Cuz I need to know what's going on with our girls.

[00:03:09]>> Yes.

[00:03:10]You know, what where what is their emotional health like? What is their mental health like?

[00:03:16]So they said, "Well, okay, Fran. We'll we'll do it."

[00:03:22]And what they did is um and and truthfully it was Dr. Leslie Brower who said, "All right, we're going to do this."

[00:03:35]It's never been done before, but we're going to do it.

[00:03:38]And so she literally had the department give me their research department to help me with this.

[00:03:48]Took us 3 years to figure out exactly what I wanted to look at.

[00:03:56]And they decided what cities they wanted to look at. So, we looked at three metro cities and one small city that had a large black population.

[00:04:07]So, Columbus, Dayton, Akron, and then Lima.

[00:04:13]Because of the work I had already done in the state, I knew women in all those cities.

[00:04:20]So, I literally called them up and I said, "Look, I'm doing this research and I don't want to go through schools.

[00:04:26]I don't want schools telling me that I can't do black girls.

[00:04:31]I need for you to help me out. So, all of these sister networks in all these cities, uh we got 101 girls in Columbus, 126 in Yeah, 126 in uh Akron, um 115, I think, in Dayton, and I think a little over 75 in Lima.

[00:04:57]So, we ended up with about 411 girls.

[00:05:01]Did the survey Actually, our survey had about 500 items on it. So, I wanted to know everything.

[00:05:09]I wanted to know if you ache, are you sleepy, who's your people, do you drink, when do you have your period? I wanted to know Yes, everything. I wanted to know what their lived experiences was like. And before then, um I did focus groups in each of those cities.

[00:05:27]Yes.

[00:05:28]Did focus groups first.

[00:05:29]Just to get a sense of what the issues were.

[00:05:33]And um then we did an analysis of all of that. We had a >> [clears throat] >> big sharing.

[00:05:41]And then Sharleta Travares, do you know Sharleta?

[00:05:46]Special sister.

[00:05:48]Um said >> me, "All right, so what are we doing in Columbus?" Okay. I was like, "Mhm, I don't know."

[00:05:56]She got a group of women together and we started figuring out what to do, how to educate the community about black girls.

[00:06:05]How to talk to our girls.

[00:06:08]>> Mhm.

[00:06:09]And the study was called Rise, Sister, Rise. Rise, Sister, Rise. So for a long time, that's what we called ourselves, Rise, Sister, Rise. And then I think that's how most people know us.

[00:06:18]>> Yes. And then we decided to become a 501c3 nonprofit organization so that we could sustain the work. Mhm.

[00:06:29]>> [clears throat] >> And then we found out that somebody else had a book called Rise, Sister, Rise.

[00:06:36]Interesting. Mhm. Mhm.

[00:06:38]And she had bought the rights to Rise, Sister, Rise in the United States, Canada, UK. Got you.

[00:06:46]>> like, "What are we going to call ourselves now?" Right? [laughter] Right, we had to come up with another name. And um our chair at that time, uh Sister Abby, said, "Why don't we call ourselves Black Girl Rising?"

[00:07:05]So that's what we became.

[00:07:05]>> That's how it became.

[00:07:07]And we have been hopefully doing our best to get our girls rising over the past 15 years.

[00:07:18]>> 15 years and >> 15 still ongoing.

[00:07:21]>> And still ongoing today.

[00:07:24]I know we could We will talk some more about it.

[00:07:27]When you started this project, the the the research itself >> Yes. because we'll come back to Black Girl Rising. The research itself made its way to the Library of Congress. I know you wouldn't share it if I >> [laughter] >> KNEW.

[00:07:43]YES. YES. YES. It's um it's been in many places.

[00:07:49]>> Wow. We we're we're pleased with what we've done.

[00:07:53]Uh we feel like we have the largest body of research on black girls that we know about.

[00:08:01]Mhm.

[00:08:01]Um and so we're we're And that was like our girls have said, "Okay, you have to do some more research cuz things have changed, sister friend."

[00:08:13]So, we are planning uh next year to do a second study. Amen.

[00:08:20]Yes.

[00:08:21]>> It's necessary.

[00:08:22]>> It's necessary. But I will tell you that um Priscilla Tyson, former um state >> congressman. No. No, I'm sorry, congresswoman. Former councilwoman for Columbus >> Mhm. um created the commission on black girls.

[00:08:40]>> Yes.

[00:08:40]And uh asked me if I would be co-chair, which is a wonderful thing.

[00:08:45]>> Yes. And you did. And we did. And um we looked at over surveyed over 400 girls in this city and created um a wonderful set of recommendations that now the city department of neighborhoods um in fact, Nicole Harper is the director of the commission here.

[00:09:12]>> Right. Um who has put together an advisory group of incredible people.

[00:09:19]>> Yes. Many of whom were commissioners on the commission.

[00:09:23]>> Mhm.

[00:09:24]Um who are now working with um many organizations to um keep that work going. Yes.

[00:09:33]I I know there was a another group of angels rising that you also started. Oh. Explain that one. The angel in you. Uh the angel in you. The angel in you.

[00:09:46]>> That was a long time ago. Where are you getting all of this?

[00:09:49]>> I just poked around and >> [laughter] >> found stuff. Yeah, you did. Um a friend of mine uh was doing a lot of work in school systems around the country.

[00:10:02]>> Mhm.

[00:10:03]And said "Schools are asking me for girl stuff and all I got is boys."

[00:10:09]And so I said, "Okay, I'll come up with something." And I told you I'd gone to Norfolk State. You know I have to make that plug. Yes, please. And um Dr. Ruth Winstead Diggs uh said that any good teacher needs to know how to write her own curriculum. There you go.

[00:10:26]So um I created a curriculum specifically for middle school girls.

[00:10:32]But it was designed to teach girls how to trust their intuition. Mhm.

[00:10:39]Good one. As a way of good decision-making. Mhm.

[00:10:43]So I would go into a class, right? And uh cuz I'm trying to figure out how do you explain an angel inside.

[00:10:52]>> Inside.

[00:10:52]>> Right?

[00:10:53]So I'm Catholic. Mhm. When I was in first grade we were told that we had guardian angels.

[00:11:03]That's true. Remember? Remember?

[00:11:06]>> Yes. Yes. And so guardian angel was to guide, protect, and lead.

[00:11:12]And steer you right from wrong. Mhm.

[00:11:17]So I took that same idea and thought about a girl's intuition, a woman's intuition.

[00:11:28]Mhm. So I asked the girls, I said, "How many of you Mhm. have ever been attracted to a really cute guy >> Mhm.

[00:11:37]>> [laughter] >> that you knew was not good for you?"

[00:11:40]>> Oh.

[00:11:41]And so, you know, all the hands and eventually they would go up, right?

[00:11:44][laughter] And and I said, "Where in your body did you know that?"

[00:11:49]Interesting.

[00:11:49]>> Not in your head.

[00:11:50]>> No. Where in your body?

[00:11:54]Did that knowledge go Yes, and they'll be like, "Oh, my god."

[00:11:58]Yes.

[00:11:59]>> So, Oh. And so, from there we I talked about how to trust that because well, I don't want to get into um a whole thing, but you know, um women around the world are not treated well.

[00:12:18]Around the world.

[00:12:19]>> Girls around the world are not treated well.

[00:12:24]So, I believe that God gave us something special.

[00:12:30]Hm.

[00:12:31]That does not go away.

[00:12:34]And it is this gift that helps protect us.

[00:12:41]It is a gift that helps us to know should I do this, should I not do this?

[00:12:48]Is this right for me, is it not right for me?

[00:12:51]Hm.

[00:12:53]And it's our intuition.

[00:12:55]>> Intuition.

[00:12:56]And it usually gets full-blown right after we start our menses.

[00:13:03]>> Mhm.

[00:13:04]Because our body is opening up.

[00:13:07]>> I know some people would love this.

[00:13:09][laughter] Oh. So, you know, and I so I ask girls, I said, "If you're going home from school one day, um something if you're paying attention to yourself, if you're paying attention to your body, something will tell you, 'Up, don't go that way, go this way.'"

[00:13:26]>> Go another way. That is the angel in you.

[00:13:31]So, we So, I gave girls this curriculum.

[00:13:35]They have a whole pledge, things that they say.

[00:13:40]And what we found out is that girls were turning the radio off and studying.

[00:13:47]>> So, their grades started going up. Oh.

[00:13:50]Um we taught them how to be still inside.

[00:13:57]So, that meant that their anxiety went down.

[00:14:02]>> Mhm. So, in one school fights went down almost by 70%.

[00:14:08]That's amazing. Just teaching girls how to trust That they trust.

[00:14:15]>> you.

[00:14:15]That you've got everything you need already in you.

[00:14:21]So, there's no need to be jealous.

[00:14:24]There's no need to be um intimidated.

[00:14:30]No, because everything that's good and holy about you is already there.

[00:14:35]>> So, I would tell them when when when God made the universe, and I've said this to women. Mhm. When God made the universe, he made every star to shine in its own light. Yes. You So, you don't see stars trying to outshine another star.

[00:14:50]>> No need to. You don't see a star trying to overshadow another star.

[00:14:55]You see a star doing its best to shine with it has.

[00:15:00]And that's all we're being asked.

[00:15:02]Wow.

[00:15:04]So, that's Truthfully, that's the essence of my my work with >> I started with the girls, but you know I'm going to come back to the women and [snorts] how I MET YOU 25 YEARS AGO. WE'RE GOING TO come to that because this is so fascinating.

[00:15:21]You've already said just now that safety or lack thereof for women, young girls all over the world.

[00:15:30]>> All over the world.

[00:15:32]All over the world.

[00:15:34]>> experience.

[00:15:35]>> Absolutely. That we need so much more of now, right?

[00:15:38]>> Absolutely. Yes, yes, yes. 1985, Gwen and I, Gwen Gardner and I >> Gwen and I went to the end of the decade world conference for women sponsored by the United Nations.

[00:15:52]>> Okay.

[00:15:52]>> It was in Nairobi, Kenya. Hm.

[00:15:55]Women were from everywhere. I'm telling you everywhere.

[00:16:01]White women, African women, Polynesian women. I mean, women from everywhere. But the first 3 days, Rosaria, all women talked about was our stuff.

[00:16:14]Hm. Right? We all have periods. We all have babies. We all have menopause.

[00:16:20]We've all got crazy men, you know? We've all been treated like third-class citizens.

[00:16:29]After that, we were there for Well, actually, we we were there for like 22 days. Oh, that's a But but the conference was about 2 weeks. Okay.

[00:16:39]When I left there, one of the things that like I don't know. I [clears throat] think I woke up Hm. in in a way that I've not gone to sleep yet. And that's It was just amazing to me.

[00:16:57]No matter who you were or where you were from, if you were a woman, all of our experiences are shared experiences.

[00:17:05]>> Shared.

[00:17:06]How was it? So, I kept asking myself, "So, what happened? Did men just go to a conference and didn't tell anybody and decided how they were going to treat women and then went back home.

[00:17:17]Wow. Because no matter where a woman is They're going through. They're going through what I went through.

[00:17:25]She's going through what another sister went through.

[00:17:29]And because of that, in this country, we don't have time to figure out how to separate ourselves.

[00:17:37]Talk to me. We don't have time for that.

[00:17:41]>> [snorts] >> You were going through I became a widow at 26 and a half, 27. Yeah.

[00:17:53]And for a minute you think nobody has gone through anything like this.

[00:17:59]But then you find out that there are sisters all over the place who have gone through. And if I didn't if I hadn't reached out I would have been suffering alone.

[00:18:10]That's it. Not with the companion of women who could care for me. That's it.

[00:18:16]So our work, this work is really about how do we get rid of those divisions?

[00:18:22]How do we get rid of those lines that are getting in the way?

[00:18:25]>> Mhm. Mhm. So there there used to be this woman who said to me one day, this is terrible, but said to me [laughter] one day, "You [snorts] know, I am just so jealous of you. I'm jealous of how you look, your eyes, your lashes."

[00:18:44]And I was like, "Look, if that is what's been in the way of you treating me better, I am taking you to the women's bathroom right now and I'm going to show you this Maybelline mascara >> [laughter] >> that I bought for $6.99.

[00:19:03]I'mma show you exactly what you need to do."

[00:19:07]There is so much work for us to do as women, we don't have time.

[00:19:15]I need to figure out if you were so beautiful, what are you doing? That's it. I learn. Tell me what you doing.

[00:19:24]If you look happy all the time and I can't figure that out, I need to know what's making you happy. Yeah.

[00:19:33]Yeah.

[00:19:34]I need to find my own holiness.

[00:19:40]Mhm.

[00:19:41]But if you can help me get there, I need to be open to that. And receive it.

[00:19:46]>> Don't have time to be jealous.

[00:19:49]Don't have time to be wondering why you got what you got.

[00:19:53]I need to be finding the recipe so I can get my own.

[00:19:58]You know, this is the wisdom of Fran Frazier.

[00:20:05]>> [laughter] >> I know you say, "I don't know why."

[00:20:07]>> yeah, yeah. Don't call me Fran with. Yeah, don't call me Fran with. Your record with, but we could sit and listen to such wisdom. We need so much more of that now. As we talk about girls and, you know, safety of girls, it's almost like you have to start all those classes. I mean, we're in the middle of a global scandal Uh >> Yes, yes, yes, yes.

[00:20:30]I didn't think we'd talk about it, but if you have anything to say about that, how could a global scandal of that proportion of abuse of girls happen?

[00:20:40]You know, it's been a global scandal Mhm.

[00:20:48]since women have been here. Yes.

[00:20:53]I We were property before. We were We We were always owned by somebody.

[00:20:58]>> Mhm.

[00:21:00]Always owned by somebody.

[00:21:03]And I kept thinking, what is it that we have that that must be so powerful >> Mhm.

[00:21:16]that somebody wants to subjugate it all the time?

[00:21:21]What is it?

[00:21:24]And I heard Susan Smith. I don't know whether you know Reverend Susan Smith.

[00:21:30]>> I heard her I heard her say one day, "Just remember that one is a whole number."

[00:21:38]And I was like, "One is a whole number." So, then all right. So, if you believe in the Garden of Eden story >> Mhm.

[00:21:51]when Eve was formed, Eve was whole all by herself.

[00:21:58]Mhm. All by herself. Okay.

[00:22:02]Nothing was missing from Eve.

[00:22:05]Mhm.

[00:22:06]Eve had her own holiness. Mhm.

[00:22:10]Eve had her intuition Yes.

[00:22:12]>> which was her God spirit speaking to her Mhm. all the time. She was connected to the divine.

[00:22:20]Mhm.

[00:22:23]Powerful.

[00:22:25]And primarily the role of Eve is and was inspiration. Mhm. Our job is to inspire.

[00:22:36]Hello.

[00:22:38]And when you inspire, you have power.

[00:22:43]And when you have power, you can change things.

[00:22:50]And our voice is power.

[00:22:54]And what do they say about us, particularly black women? What do they say? We got too much mouth cuz we got too much to say.

[00:23:01]But we are >> the angry black woman. I mean, right.

[00:23:05]>> goes the whole gamut. We are >> [clears throat] >> We are 95% right the majority of the time.

[00:23:11]>> [laughter] >> I There I can't I We can't help it.

[00:23:16]I don't know if we'll have time to explore That was too much, wasn't it?

[00:23:20]>> the ratio aspects of what you're just talking about. Women generally, we have shared experience.

[00:23:28]>> Yes.

[00:23:29]>> But, I think there's also something about the black woman. Mhm.

[00:23:33]Well, we got That's another show right there, right?

[00:23:36]That's another program. But, let me say this.

[00:23:40]I met you Yes.

[00:23:43]>> through a program you started almost 30 years ago.

[00:23:48]>> Oh my gosh.

[00:23:49]>> date ourselves, right?

[00:23:52]And to reconnect with you now to me is very divine.

[00:23:55]>> Mhm. I told you that you also run the women's prayer Oh, yes. Yes. Yes.

[00:24:01]>> that's been in place for 30 years.

[00:24:02]>> Yes. Yes.

[00:24:03]>> know which one you want to talk about first. Maybe we'll come back to the women's prayer.

[00:24:07]>> Let's talk about you.

[00:24:08]>> Me, meeting you in in Gwen Gardner's house.

[00:24:11]>> Oh my goodness.

[00:24:13]>> [laughter] >> Gwen brought all the uh mothers of the community, right?

[00:24:18]>> Yes.

[00:24:19]All the All the sisters All the wise women.

[00:24:22]>> Yes.

[00:24:23]In 1979 I started a Well, I was inspired There you go.

[00:24:34]>> to bring together women. Okay.

[00:24:38]And so, uh what I said was I don't think I want to do that cuz, you know, I Wom- Women be looking at everything.

[00:24:49]They're looking at whether you got a run in your stocking, what kind of shoes you got on.

[00:24:55]Do you have a bra on today? You know, just I know. I was like, "Mm, can't do it.

[00:25:01]Can't do it. You have to get somebody else. I'll do something, but I'm not doing that."

[00:25:06]And um and then I found out that you can't say no when you're called. Hm. Well, you can say it. But But eventually you're going to have to do it.

[00:25:17]And um so I prayed for women to come in my way.

[00:25:26]>> Yes.

[00:25:27]Who could help me. Yes.

[00:25:29]>> So I I ended up with women I didn't even know, I'd never met before.

[00:25:32]>> At all.

[00:25:33]But I kept running into the same women all the time.

[00:25:36]>> Yes.

[00:25:37]So seven women, including Gwen, Yes.

[00:25:40]went with me on a retreat to help me figure out what was the calling.

[00:25:48]>> And um and then we went from like seven women to 250. Wow.

[00:25:54]And um then we got a a good number of women.

[00:26:00]And the whole idea, it was called A Quality of Sharing.

[00:26:04]>> Mm.

[00:26:05]And the whole idea was can women get rid of the inner garbage >> Mm. that gets in the way >> Mhm. of me being able to care for you?

[00:26:19]Mhm. Because when the women of a community are healthy, Yes. Like me.

[00:26:26]everybody is healthy.

[00:26:29]The men are healthy.

[00:26:31]The children are healthy.

[00:26:33]Community is healthy.

[00:26:35]But when we are not healthy, Everything else falls apart. everything else falls apart.

[00:26:41]I mean, that's a concept I run into in my research, Africana feminism.

[00:26:46]>> Yes. Which is slightly different from just feminism. Yes. it's about exactly what you said.

[00:26:53]>> Mhm. That they are concerned about the well-being of everybody, not just the female women's rights.

[00:27:00]>> No.

[00:27:00]But to that story of how I met you. So, here I am, new in Columbus.

[00:27:05]You met my husband first.

[00:27:07]>> Yes, yes. And I think he would say at that point, "Here's my wife. She doesn't know anybody."

[00:27:12]>> exactly that.

[00:27:13]>> SAID WHAT HE TOLD YOU.

[00:27:15]>> [laughter] >> HE DID. HE DID. HE SAID HE SAID, "GET MY WIFE. MAKE HER GO TO THOSE THINGS."

[00:27:21]AND SO, but I I really do want to say thank you.

[00:27:25]I want to say thank you in the public to you because as a young girl, young woman, young mother, I don't even think we had had the first child at this point.

[00:27:36]>> Not yet.

[00:27:37]>> But I remember coming to those meetings and sitting at the feet of who I considered the elders in the community, the matriarchs, the mothers, and got fed.

[00:27:49]Honestly, to this day I know it gave me a sense of belonging as an immigrant.

[00:27:56]Yes. New young girl who came from Africa, from Nigeria.

[00:28:00]And sitting with these African-American women, it's it's never stopped making me feel fully welcomed.

[00:28:08]>> Mhm.

[00:28:09]As a black woman in America. So, thank you.

[00:28:14]Thank you. Okay. [laughter] And then we lost touch for years. I mean, we lost touch.

[00:28:19]>> I can't We interviewed Gwen at one point. And then we lost touch and then reconnected at the last women's prayer meeting.

[00:28:27]>> Women's Day of Prayer, yeah, yeah. So, what got you started on that?

[00:28:31]I um One thing I know I am um is obedient >> Mhm. to the spirit in me. Mhm.

[00:28:40]Mhm.

[00:28:41]And um I had um I had a really good friend who passed. Her name was Charlene Morgan.

[00:28:50]Charlene was um a fearless fearless woman.

[00:28:57]She was president of the Columbus School Board. She was active. She came from a a family of women who did whatever needed to be done. Yes.

[00:29:11]So, one day we're talking and at that point in Columbus too many young teenage girls were getting pregnant. Hm.

[00:29:22]And I was talking with Charlene. We were talking and like, "What can we do?

[00:29:29]They've got services. They've got programs."

[00:29:32]>> Mhm.

[00:29:33]Mhm.

[00:29:33]>> what's missing?

[00:29:34]>> Mhm. So, Charlene said, "We We got to pray."

[00:29:38]Hm.

[00:29:40]So, I was like, "Hm.

[00:29:42]Okay." Hm.

[00:29:43]At the same time, I was walking with um Dr. Linda James Myers. We walked every morning for a millennium of years.

[00:29:53]And so, I said, "Linda, um I think we're going to do this Women's Day of Prayer." Hm. And so, she said "We should all wear white." Wow. And I was like, "Oh my god.

[00:30:06]That would be a beautiful thing."

[00:30:07]>> Mhm.

[00:30:10]So, we had the first Women's Day of Prayer in Franklin Park.

[00:30:15]The first one? Was that?

[00:30:18]>> Like, literally in the park. When it was just the park.

[00:30:22]>> just the park. With no shelter. With just in the park praying.

[00:30:27]And it was We probably had like 20 women.

[00:30:31]And it started raining.

[00:30:36]And Pastor Leon Troy of Second Baptist Church came to see cuz he knew about it. Mhm.

[00:30:45]Came to see how we were doing. Just going to come by.

[00:30:49]In 40 minutes, we were in a shelter. He called city hall. We were in a shelter.

[00:30:56]We had a room.

[00:30:57]He Took care of you.

[00:31:00]He hooked us up.

[00:31:02]And so we had that day of prayer. It was beautiful. We feel like we closed down a couple of drug places with our prayers.

[00:31:09]>> Amen. Um but then we didn't do it anymore. Oh.

[00:31:14]And um I had been taking myself to the mountains. I think I told you this.

[00:31:22]Um every year for at least 7 to 9 days.

[00:31:25]Just to be by myself to as my friend Rosetta would say, "Look over my hand." Mhm.

[00:31:32]And uh look over my soul. Mhm.

[00:31:36]And I was told or I'm I need to do that day of prayer again. Oh, you heard.

[00:31:44]I was like, "Okay. Okay."

[00:31:47]So I invited all the big-time women I knew.

[00:31:53]>> At that point. And asked them if they would help me. Mhm.

[00:31:58]So Catholic women wanted incense.

[00:32:02]The Pentecostal women didn't want graven images.

[00:32:06]The You know what I mean?

[00:32:07]>> Talk about diversity, right?

[00:32:09]>> gosh.

[00:32:11]And uh So it the and I also invited the women from the Nation of Islam.

[00:32:19]Because this was not to be a Christian event.

[00:32:24]event.

[00:32:25]>> Right.

[00:32:26]This was to be a day of prayer for all women That's what I'm talking. who have a relationship with God. Period.

[00:32:36]Period.

[00:32:37]And so some of the women were like can't do it then.

[00:32:42]Sorry.

[00:32:44]And I said well you know I'm I'm sorry too. Right.

[00:32:48]I'm just doing what I'm supposed to be doing.

[00:32:52]So um over the past 30 years there has been a diversity of religions and a diversity of Christianity and and the sharing of those rituals.

[00:33:12]It has been an incredible thing.

[00:33:17]To see hundreds of women in white praying all day.

[00:33:25]All day. So we're talking 8:30 in the morning until 6:00 at night.

[00:33:33]Now we we do have a continental breakfast. We didn't have that before.

[00:33:38]But the elder sisters were coming early.

[00:33:42]And my concern was they can't wait till lunch time.

[00:33:47]So we have to give them something to start off. Yeah to start the day off.

[00:33:52]So we have a continental breakfast. We have a lunch. Everything is free.

[00:33:59]And and women have been incredibly generous.

[00:34:06]So we are able to pay for everything.

[00:34:11]The conservatory Rosemarie Cain was on the board of the conservatory when we started.

[00:34:21]And back then it was probably what?

[00:34:28]$800 to for a whole day right?

[00:34:31]>> [clears throat] >> Which was like a thousand trillion dollars.

[00:34:35]And they she had them to cut it in half.

[00:34:39]>> Oh.

[00:34:40]It has been price has been cut in half every year for 30 years.

[00:34:46]>> years.

[00:34:47]So, that same room that room that we're in now we're in the barn now.

[00:34:51]>> Yes. It is incredibly expensive.

[00:34:54]But not for us.

[00:34:56]>> God makes a way.

[00:34:57]>> [laughter] >> And it has been and you prayed and preached and they have talked about you.

[00:35:04]Oh.

[00:35:06]Incredible, Rosie.

[00:35:07]>> I know it's I know it's divine.

[00:35:08]>> No, you.

[00:35:11]It's divine. Beautiful. It's divine.

[00:35:13]>> Beautiful. Cuz that was my first I know, right?

[00:35:16]>> with our faith. Yes.

[00:35:17]>> Right, but you're you're coming back.

[00:35:19]She's coming back. She's coming back.

[00:35:20][laughter] Um Thank you. Thank you for having me.

[00:35:25]>> But that day and truthfully after 30 years I was like, okay.

[00:35:33]Is it over yet or not? Cuz I'm like, help.

[00:35:41]But now younger women have said to me, Again. We we want to be a part of this, Sister Fran.

[00:35:48]Yes. So, um so now we're getting younger women >> Yes. who you know, like we we believe we want to be a part of this.

[00:35:58]>> Yes.

[00:35:59]And I it it's a beautiful thing.

[00:36:02]>> Yes. And to think why not even now when we need so much more building of our diversities as people are trying to tell >> That's true. this mental you know, the the the fact of diversity.

[00:36:20]And I always say this, God himself is diverse. Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

[00:36:24]So, why shouldn't we? Why it's just in that beauty of coming together. That last one was beautiful cuz it was very multi-generational and diverse.

[00:36:33]>> Exactly. And diverse. That's exactly right.

[00:36:36]>> you, Fran, bring to this community. Now, I know you didn't you weren't born in Columbus, Ohio. Mhm. So, let's make sure we get that point in.

[00:36:46]What brought you to Columbus?

[00:36:48]Um >> And where from? Yeah, for real.

[00:36:50]>> As you build. I um well, I'm from Philadelphia.

[00:36:54]>> Okay.

[00:36:55]Born and raised. Yes. Um I have that East Coast flavor still. I try [laughter] hard not to let it go.

[00:37:03]Um but I graduated undergrad at Norfolk State. Okay. And I got a master doctoral fellowship to Ohio State.

[00:37:12]>> Mhm.

[00:37:13]And so, that's how I got here. I didn't know anything. I didn't even know Columbus, Ohio existed.

[00:37:18]>> [laughter] >> I love it.

[00:37:19]>> And uh and I actually I told my mother, I said, "I'm not going. I don't know nobody there. I got no friends." Yeah, who was these people?

[00:37:27]And she said, "Oh, you going."

[00:37:29]You you definitely going, so so I went.

[00:37:33]And uh I got my master's in a year.

[00:37:36]Mhm. Yeah, [clears throat] I was ready to leave.

[00:37:39]And um I end up staying.

[00:37:43]And I told you part of it was I lived in inner-city Philadelphia [laughter] where you had to like walk 5 miles to get to a park.

[00:37:53]>> Uh-huh.

[00:37:55]And when I got to Columbus, there were trees everywhere. There were lawns everywhere.

[00:38:01]It was amazing.

[00:38:03]It was clean. It was beautiful.

[00:38:06]And so I end up staying.

[00:38:11]And I end up wanting to make this my home. Yes. [clears throat] And the thing I love about Columbus even now, but really loved back then, there was enough space that you could create what you wanted.

[00:38:33]You could create your own space. You could dream your own dreams.

[00:38:40]And make them happen. Yes.

[00:38:44]And that's what I loved. When you are in a really crowded city, you don't have much personal space.

[00:38:52]So, you're constantly always aware of your surroundings. Always aware of what's happening. Always looking over your shoulder.

[00:39:05]Because you don't have enough personal space.

[00:39:10]This personal space in Columbus.

[00:39:14]And if you use that space, then you get to do what you want to do.

[00:39:21]And you're saying this to all of us as women, young girls, immigrants, you know, you can build. That's something about this city. Yes. That's welcoming and I mean, we've had guests that said the same thing. Now, with your experience in the schools, I know we're running out of time.

[00:39:42]Your degree in education, your service with women, with young girls. Tell us a little bit about the work you did inside Columbus City Schools and other schools around. What are some things you'd like us to hear? Or what is not understood? I know there are several questions there, but Okay, so >> it. Yeah.

[00:40:01]So, that that's a whole other program, too.

[00:40:05]I think what's really important Our girls need to know that we see them.

[00:40:14]That they are not an afterthought.

[00:40:16]Correct. That when we see them, we're not we're not always looking at what they have not done. Mhm.

[00:40:27]Uh how they should short, you know, like fix that top, you know, pull that skirt down.

[00:40:35]Sometimes before you can change your girl, you have to love her just the way she is.

[00:40:41]>> Thank you.

[00:40:44]And then in loving, you are teaching.

[00:40:50]Not giving a ton of advice. Mhm.

[00:40:54]Not telling your story before she asked to hear it.

[00:41:01]But listening.

[00:41:04]Letting her talk.

[00:41:07]Facilitating.

[00:41:10]But not teaching in such a way that you never get to know what she thinks.

[00:41:21]That's beautiful.

[00:41:23]That's beautiful. I know some of that work as the first set of Somalis came into Yes.

[00:41:31]>> Columbus.

[00:41:32]Tell us a little bit about some of the work you did [laughter] there.

[00:41:35]Cuz I think that gets to this heart of listening to people, knowing who they are, identity. I think yes.

[00:41:42]>> from there. So, please.

[00:41:43]>> Yes. Well, Um there there was some tension between black girls and Somali girls.

[00:41:52]>> Mhm.

[00:41:53]And um the superintendent at the time um invited me to one of the high schools and said, um "Do something."

[00:42:03]>> Do something. Yeah, do something.

[00:42:05]>> and >> Right, right. They were fighting. They were treating each other terrible.

[00:42:10]And um and truthfully, one of the things that I did was just got two groups of girls together.

[00:42:22]And I want you to share your story.

[00:42:25]>> There you go. And I want All I want you to do is listen. Mhm.

[00:42:29]Don't ask any questions.

[00:42:31]>> Mhm.

[00:42:32]I want you to share your story.

[00:42:35]And you listen. Mhm.

[00:42:39]And then, we can begin to see what we can do together. Yes. But, until I hear your story, I I can't make an opinion.

[00:42:50]That's what I'm saying.

[00:42:51]>> your story. Yes. I need to know your story first.

[00:42:55]>> Thank you.

[00:42:57]And I need to listen. Yes.

[00:42:59]And I need to listen without figuring out what I'm going to say next.

[00:43:06]I just need to hear you.

[00:43:09]And truthfully, that's exactly what Black Girl Rising is all about.

[00:43:15]So, sometimes we have women who want to come and volunteer with us.

[00:43:21]And I always say, you know, we're a little bit different.

[00:43:25]>> [laughter] >> Um, we don't give advice.

[00:43:27]>> Yes.

[00:43:29]If they don't ask us our stories, they may not even know.

[00:43:33]Um, but we do listen. Th- This last story you've told, I remember you even talking about when the Somalis told their stories Uh.

[00:43:44]in their hijab and everything.

[00:43:46]>> Yes. Some of them, they were even born in Kenya, for instance.

[00:43:49]>> Exactly. Exactly.

[00:43:51]>> until you sit and talk with people, you really don't know. And that's almost a lost art in our lived experience today.

[00:43:59]>> We need so much more of that. And as you already have seen, you have to come back. If you can believe it, we've literally run out of time.

[00:44:08]>> Oh my goodness.

[00:44:09]>> And we didn't even get into some other things with your work, but um your your journey your giftings, your ability to hear and obey the spirit like you said in building not just yourself but other people, that's a gift we will always treasure in you.

[00:44:29]Um thank you for being who you are.

[00:44:32]>> You're going to make me cry.

[00:44:33]>> and all you've touched in Columbus, your name I know you want to be humble and all that and I did say that where you used to write your name only with small letter S.

[00:44:43]>> That's right. That's exactly right.

[00:44:44]>> Just to show your humility but thank you. Thank you for what you've done in this community and will keep doing cuz you you're not retiring like I told you.

[00:44:52]>> [laughter] >> So we will have you back here, please.

[00:44:54]>> But Rosemary, can I just say um thank you.

[00:44:59]>> [snorts] >> But thank you for what you do. Thank you for your book, My Darling Jesus, that I am reading.

[00:45:07]Thank you for your work in the church.

[00:45:12]Thank you for the gift that you are.

[00:45:17]Cuz you really are a gift.

[00:45:20]You are a gift to me.

[00:45:22]You're a gift to this community.

[00:45:25]So I don't want that to go unsaid. Wow.

[00:45:31]If you say so, friend, who am I to >> [laughter] >> Thank you. Thank you, my mentor, my friend, my angel, a lot of things. Thank you. We will have you back definitely.

[00:45:41]>> That'll be great.

[00:45:42]>> Thank you.

[00:45:43]So again, as you can see, time's up. It gets to go real quickly. Thank you for joining us on this episode of Platforms.

[00:45:54]As you can tell, there are people that need to hear this story. So I do I've been told to say this to encourage you to please like, subscribe, click notifications, and share with somebody, with your community, who needs to hear somebody like [music] Frank.

[00:46:14]Again, thank you for listening in. Until next time, goodbye.

[00:46:22]>> [music]