Laura provides a necessary reality check on the "cosmopolitan ego," urging TCKs to trade their sense of cultural superiority for genuine empathy. It is a grounded reflection on how true global fluency requires the humility to listen rather than just the privilege to move.
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Being A Third Culture Kid Is Not As Simple As It Seems - Cinta LauraAdded:
a byproduct of my upbringing, that being having to juggle school and my professional life, >> um has led me now in my adulthood to believe that being productive means to give yourself no space to rest, no room to rest. I'm working on that right now.
One of my 2026 resolution is to understand that, >> right? Just like I got to sleep, guys.
Right. Ver What is up Indonesia?
Uh, I'm trying my best. That was the worst.
>> I did not expect it.
>> It's okay. It's okay. But I like it.
>> SORRY, REEBUS. I TRIED TO MAKE MY GERMAN intro and I failed. Why did I do a German intro? Because you have a very special half German guest, right? I'm >> Yeah, you're right. Like, oh my gosh, don't let my accent fool you. I am not half American.
>> There you go. Please welcome to the podcast to the What is up?
>> So before we started, I insisted on starting the podcast cuz I have a question for Andovi that may be very dad jokey, but I'm wondering your place is called Mad for Coffee. Who are you mad at?
>> Actually, I'm Listen, I did not come up with a name.
>> So it was my partner that you saw before. Refle >> I I'm just the investor to be honest. So I did. So nothing I did.
>> But did you when you >> I thought it's because OH, SORRY. SORRY.
>> YOU FIRST. YOU FIRST.
>> I was just like But when you seen the name, do you agree with the name?
>> Uh, yeah.
>> Cuz it's like mad for coffee.
>> I thought it was inspired by your voice because you have such conviction and like you have this raspy coarse voice.
So it's like mad for coffee.
>> No, it was just my my partner said it. I was like, "Okay, I like the name."
>> No, actually Andui is always mad. Yeah.
I'm always mad.
>> He's always angry.
>> I'm mad at the public, but I'm never mad privately. Does that make sense? Oh, >> yeah.
>> I'm never mad. Like, >> are you sure you're not mad at me? NO.
>> YOU STILL HAVEN'T Cuz you still haven't invited me to a basketball game.
>> Oh. Uh, w Okay. Okay. Wow. A lot of >> All right, LET'S START THE PODCAST, GUYS.
>> REUS. Quick break from the wonderful Tintala. We're going to talk to you about our episode sponsor, Tap Tap Send.
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And so, this episode sponsor can probably solve that issue. Yeah. Now, TapTaps send is a authorized and regulated payment system and an app that is currently available in the UK, EU, US, UAE, Australia, and Canada. So, you can download it if you're in those countries send money to Asia, Indonesia, and Africa. Now, it has a zero transfer fee, a competitive exchange rate, and 90% of the transfer done within 5 minutes.
>> Yeah. So fun fact and like I actually asked my friend who are in the US to use tap taps to send money to me >> to see how like the experience goes and it actually went through like really seamlessly.
>> And how much did he send you? Nothing.
>> So uh if you're a first-time user and if you're a weeboo or what is that Indonesia watcher there's a code just for you. Okay. Use code tap Indonesia.
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>> Yeah. Yeah. That you you can use that for to grab a decent meal here in Indonesia or anything. So do use that if you have a need to like send money back home.
>> And we abroad if you want to send money to help us. What is up Indonesia? Here's the link. No, I'm just kidding. So, use tap tap send.
>> Yeah. Thank you. Hope this helps. Let's go back to our podcast.
>> Is there something going on?
>> No, cuz I promised her I would invite her to a basketball game. I I I never >> Wow.
>> Cuz I I don't know. I I I haven't played basketball in a long time. Like like it was like two weeks ago.
>> Okay.
>> So, you should like invite her now.
>> And the invite was 2 years and 8 months ago. 2 years and 8 months. I'm very specific. You know, Andobi is like terrible at replying.
>> I'm very bad with >> a lot of people came up to me and they're like, "Hey, Abby, can you like ask Andobi if he's mad at me? Like maybe he cuz he never replied to my text." And I was like, "I'm pretty sure Andovi is not mad at you. He just sucks at like remembering and replying.
>> I'm very unger like that."
>> So, the reason why I I'm speaking about this German thing, one one of the things that maybe people don't know, maybe people in the industry know, but maybe people don't know in general.
>> Yeah.
In an in a country where everyone's late, in an industry where everybody's late, China is never late. That's crazy, guys. I don't think you guys people think so what? No, no, no, no. I I don't I don't I have friends who go late by shooting for 3 hours.
I have people who are late for hours.
>> Yeah. Yeah, that's true.
>> And China is like notoriously known like if you shoot with her, don't come late.
>> So, is that is that the German side of you? Is it your upbringing? Is it just you in general? Like >> I think it's all of the above. I was definitely raised by a father who has always been very strict throughout my life and he to this day lives in that manner. Uh I can tell you exactly what he's doing right now because he does the same thing every day within the same hour. So like his life is very regimented and I guess you know given the fact that I'm raised by a man like him, it's caused me to be that way. But of course now that I'm older in an industry where most people are not punctual, I've learned to adjust.
Although it still does frustrate me, but I think the biggest reason as to why I'm always on time is because I really respect other people's time, >> right?
>> So, I would expect such respect towards my time as well. Of course, you know, I'm not saying that those who have been late before upon meeting me don't care about me or disrespect me. They perhaps they're just raised that way, but I think >> uh I wouldn't want to do to others what I don't want others to do to me. So, I'm that's why I'm always on time. And also I like to schedule my day. I like my day to be product. I like my days to be productive. So you know I know exactly what I'm doing after this podcast. I know exactly what I'm doing after that.
And like everything has just been scheduled in a way so that I can cater to not only what I need to do professionally but also what other people demand of me.
>> Yeah. Yeah. And I think you know Tinda is very time oriented right? Whereas the majority of Indonesian I feel like are very going with go with the flow. they don't necessarily have like all right I'm going to do this this hour and I'm going to do this and then this and then this and then this. Um can I say though um I acknowledge that I still have so much room for growth. There are a lot of things uh that I still need to learn and improve upon. But I think the reason why I've been able to survive in this industry for the last 19 years that's crazy >> is because of my work ethic. People know that when they hire me or correspond with me they know what they get. They know they can rely on me. So I think that's what's allowed me to survive this long in the industry. But with that being said, I do acknowledge that my way isn't always the right way and that came obviously with maturity. So at this age, I truly believe that you know sometimes people are tardy. It can be justified and like I am trying to loosen up because like who wants to who wants to work with someone who's highrung you know that's stressful for the other party too. So, I am self-aware and realize that I just sometimes need to take a deep breath and understand that not everybody sees the world or moves through the world the way I do. And that's fine because as I said, I'm not always right. Perhaps most of the time I may even be wrong. I don't know. So, I'm just trying my best to do what works for me. But when other people are involved, I try to be mindful of the way they are.
>> Right. And one of the things that I really like you saying is that your work ethic, it's I mean, we're the I'm assuming we're the same generation.
>> We're same age. We're same age. Yeah.
>> Yeah, you're right. But like like Chinta has been in this game since like you're right 19 years like like right. So I I like >> and people and not only to be in this game but to be still be sustainable and popping in this game is a two different things.
>> People can people can be in this game and not be popping. Does that make does that make sense?
>> AM I POPPING?
>> YEAH. YEAH. RIGHT.
>> YEAH. You're one of like Indonesia's household name I would say. And I remember watch the first time I watched you was when I was in I think middle school. I was middle school.
>> It was in um Cinderella.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> Yeah. I forgot what year that was, but it was >> 2007.
>> 2007. 19 years ago.
>> So that was like when you were just starting then that was my first gig ever.
>> Right. So but then people will contribute that to many things but you said work ethic and I think that's what people don't understand. people think it's just I mean of course luck goes into any career but though your work ethic has been your driving force right >> I think so I genuinely think so because look I'm very as I said I would like to believe that I'm self-aware I know that I'm not the best actress the best singer the best at anything but what I do know is that I'm very consistent and when someone gives me a challenge I'm going to do my best to go in above and beyond >> and uh I think that's how I've >> uh allowed for I guess high quality output in the things I do especially in recent years not so much so when I was younger because obviously when I was a teenager or pre-teen I had no control over my career but I think people have seen a substantial change in the last six years since I've returned to Indonesia from the US and that's because now that I'm an adult I have authority over what I do and so I'm very careful with how I how I conduct things what projects I choose and you know the real me is finally surfacing >> right right >> and I think I think this is why I wanted to invite Tinta to our PODCAST RIGHT >> MISSED YOU >> because we wanted to catch Yeah, but also I feel like you represent a lot of our viewers, meaning that you navigate between more than one culture, just one culture. Like you you grew up uh your your father is German, right? And so you have this Indonesian culture, but also German culture. And then you lived in the US also for a couple of years. You went to study abroad as well. And then you have a career here in Indonesia. So it takes a certain level of culture, cultural fluency I would say in switching and acknowledging that okay my way is not always correct. There are other ways that people conduct their lives. And I feel like a lot of our viewers who maybe spend a couple of times studying abroad and then coming back they're like they're experiencing a lot of culture shock or even reverse culture shock meaning like why are things like this? You know it should be like this. But it takes a certain level of maturity like you said to finally acknowledge like you know, it's it's not wrong, it's just different at at times.
So, can you tell us a little bit more about that?
>> So, I I would say my upbringing is quite similar to Andovies in that I lived in many different countries. My dad worked in the hotel industry. So, most people who work in hospitality usually move every 2 to three years to different countries. So, I've experienced living in Singapore, Malaysia, the Middle East, Germany, Indonesia, and then finally the US for college. Uh but I guess uh the commonality between those countries is that I had always attended an international school except when I was in Germany. In Germany I was at a local school. That's how I picked up German and I'm and now still able to speak the language. Uh but >> I always attended international schools and they tended to be Americanbased, >> hence the accent.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. But um you're right. Growing up in different countries really gave me um the ability to adapt in different situations and different cultures gave me the ability to appreciate differences in thinking and navigating life. Uh and if anything up until I was I guess maybe 19 20 I thought it was normal to be amongst people uh of different nationalities. You know for me being in in a homogeneous environment was something very bizarre and peculiar to me that wasn't normal >> in my reality >> because of how you grew up right >> because of how I grew up. So when I started my career at the age of 12, it was the first time I had been introduced to a very homogeneous environment. Cuz when you're on set, you know, you have people >> of maybe they might be from different cities or islands in Indonesia, but they're Indonesian essentially, you know, going to either a private or a public school >> um uh with a coming from a culture very different to what I'm used to, even though I'm half Indonesian. M um and so when I moved to the US actually at the age of 17, I did not feel a culture shock at all. I felt like university was an extension of high school, especially given the fact that the American system allows for four years of studies.
>> Yep. for undergrad, but I did it in three cuz I wanted cuz I'm German and I was organized and I was able to manage my schedule so that I uh allowed myself that extra one-year buffer to just graduate early and move to LA.
>> Right. Right.
>> So, I finished in three years at 20 I was done with my bachelors. Um but yeah, what I experienced was the reverse culture shock which is what you're talking about when I came back in 2019.
It was the first time that I'd ever lived in Indonesia as an adult.
>> I see.
>> Right. Cuz before that, I had only lived in Indonesia from the age of 11 to 17.
And I was in a an intern in in an international school bubble. Even though at work, I was >> amongst locals. That become I was only at work after school until before bedtime.
>> The rest of the day or during my leisure time, I'd be with friends from school.
>> Right. But you still have that exposure though that I feel like a lot of international kids who grew up in the international bubble here in Indonesia doesn't have right with your work in the cenetron industry back then right so in the movie industry look it's hard for me to remember what I was like exactly at the age of 12 to n to 17 but if I could look back I think I was a very very awkward teenager which is why a lot of things I did were misinterpreted by society I didn't really know how to behave accordingly And so I set clear boundaries between who I am at work and who I am outside of work and I never really did anything within the industry or people in the industry uh outside of working hours ghto. So I was still very much blind.
You know what's funny is my Indonesian didn't even become fluent until I moved back in 2019. I became fluent between 2019 to 2021 when I pushed myself to have my own podcast at the time called Bicharainta. And it was because of my strong desire to be able to talk about uh heavy issues or social issues in a way that could be understood by everyone. I didn't want to marginalize anyone. And there I pushed myself to learn Indonesian using Google Translate.
>> I see.
>> So I picked up I pic up picked up my vocabulary from Google Translate by writing English questions and turning them into Indonesian. And then I started seeing patterns of Indonesian syntax and grammar. And now fast forward now almost seven years later since I've moved back.
I would say my Indonesian is very fluent.
>> Oh yeah. I I think so. It's >> thanks to Google Translate >> because back then there's no AI yet, right?
>> No, no, no. So Google transl AI, you know, AI makes a lot of mistakes. A true AI Indonesian is very strange.
>> You know, I wouldn't know because I almost never use AI in Indonesian.
Actually, >> I would know. But no, AI in Indonesian strange unless you train your AI to see it like you. Let me uh to answer your question in a nutshell.
>> Um I used to be one of those third culture kids who believed, hey, I studied abroad. I'm exposed to different cultures. I know better. There are international there are third culture kids like that that feel like, hey, because I've had all this experience abroad, let me take this valuable experience and implement it to the country in which I'm from.
But after working so closely now as an adult with people from different different parts of Indonesia, different socioeconomic backgrounds, I realized that we don't know better.
We might have the knowledge that can be valuable and maybe implemented to you know different causes and problems in this country but we don't know better because at the end of the day if you want people to not only hear you but listen to what you have to say you can't you can't um threaten their current beliefs cuz when you are perceived as a threat >> then people will be averse to what you have to say. Can you can you talk more about that? Like can you give an example for example?
>> Uh okay cuz that's very interesting I think.
>> Let me give you an example. Okay as we know uh many Indonesians are religious >> right?
>> Okay >> for people like us perhaps uh you know some of us believe though religion can teach a lot of good things. Sometimes you have to separate religion from science from the way you live your life from politics and so on and so forth.
Right? Like that's probably the uh the common thought process amongst us. But let's say you're talking to someone who is raised in a small town who all they know is religious teachings. You can't say, "Oh, the way you think is wrong."
>> Cuz if you say the way you think is wrong, they'll be like, >> "Excuse me, how dare you? You don't know anything. You just don't like uh my belief system or you just don't like where I'm from. Who are you to say that what I know and what I believe in is wrong?
>> Right?
>> So from that realization and that understanding, I'm like, you know what?
>> As cheesy as this sounds, everything needs to be treated from a place of love, a place of compassion, and a place of empathy. When you're able to really get into the minds of these people and realize what they value, then you'll learn how to communicate certain uh ways of thinking certain values that you want them to understand in a way that they can understand without threatening their belief system or the way they live their lives. and or this is where uh a lot of third culture kids >> um not crumble so to speak, but this is what they lack.
>> They lack the understanding that communication is so important. The way you communicate, it doesn't mean you have to change the way you think. You can continue to believe that A is correct, B is wrong. But if you want people to listen to you, you need to understand how they were raised, the way they view the world, and how to not preach so to speak, but teach what you want them to learn and understand in a way that doesn't threaten them.
>> Do you do you feel the same way Andy like with your experience? Do you experience this this similar character arc? I would say with China.
>> Yeah. when when when I went back from uh India to to UEI, I felt very if I felt that people had to understand my way of of of living like even socially like when I went back from from from India, I went to an international school as well.
When I met girls, I I I hugged I hugged girls, right? Okay.
>> And I remember people were like, "What is this guy doing in like >> and that was my >> cuz you were like just hugging >> and I was cuz in my international school you were like, "Hey, what's up?" And you know, >> yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's platonic, >> right? It's platonic. But funnily enough, that became one of my most popping YouTube videos back in the day because I talked about modus. So, >> but but again, I I completely understand what what China means is like, >> you know, do we have the knowledge? Yes.
>> But who are we to like No, you're right.
You're wrong. I'm right that so I I completely I I completely get what she's what she's talking about.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Me, too. like I also went to a university abroad and I was also in the international school bubble growing up, right? And for a long time I also felt a bit misunderstood and I feel like I have all this knowledge and I feel like this can be very useful but you're right it's always the communication part that making people understand part because what's important is contextualizing what we know into the current culture that we're trying to help. Right. You know, obviously coming from a western education background, we're taught to just speak our minds.
We're taught to just say say things as they are >> as it is. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's but that's not how it works here. Then you might come across as arrogant. You might come across culture here.
No, but you can't just I remember Tinda when I was in when I was in OUI, I remember I I raised my hand up after the class is over and everyone just looked at me >> cuz they're like why does this dude want to stay longer?
>> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
>> And in in western classes, it's complete opposite.
>> I was >> It's a See, she always >> I was that annoying girl in class. I would always raise my hands cuz I I you know, I I wanted to contribute and I also wanted the teacher to notice me.
>> I don't care what y'all think.
>> No, but you're you're Yeah.
>> Yeah. And a lot of us we think that oh if I know something is wrong I need to say it as it is because you know truth being truthful is important and sometimes we value directness but that is not always viewed the same way here and some it cause like a lot of miscommunication as well.
>> Yeah. And that miscommunication is so dangerous cuz especially in my industry the gossip culture is very strong. I've exper not in all industries a bit.
>> No, but in this industry who >> maybe maybe >> but I've experienced crazy things in my industry where for speaking up >> uh that story had been has had been twisted in the past to something super insane. Like let me give you an example.
I'm I'm very vocal now. I'm still vocal now, but now at least I know how to communicate it. But 5 years ago, 6 years ago, I wasn't at this point yet. And so, you know, when things would rub me the wrong way, let's say during production, I would immediately go up to whoever is responsible, whoever this the PIC is, and say, "Hey, look, like, uh, I'm sorry, but this is unacceptable. It makes me uncomfortable because blah, blah, blah." And I'd, you know, create a very strong argument. I'm not just like saying, "No, no, no." Like, I'm giving I'm giving very solid reasons as to why I'm upset.
>> Has been saying that.
And then uh fast forward a few months or a few years later, this person is now my best friend, but she's a director. And she's like, "Chin, can I ask you something?" And I'm like, "Uh, okay, sure. What? Uh, is it true that once you were so upset on set that you kicked the trash bin?"
>> And I was I was like, "Huh?
Yeah. Someone said that you got so upset that you kicked the trash bin really hard and walked off set." And I was like, "Whoa." Oh, like if if someone if someone has told you that I've lost my temper, perhaps. Yes. But kicking the trash can in front of everyone and storming out, that does not sound like me whatsoever. And she's like, "Oh, yeah. Yeah, I thought so. Like you, now that I know you, there's no way you uh could have done that, but you know, there are rumors out there saying that's that's what you have done you had done in the past.
>> See that? See how crazy people's words are here? Like your >> assertive nature and your bravery to speak up can lead people to really create twisted lies.
>> Wow.
>> I mean like accusing you I mean accusing her on like literally kicking a trash man. That's like a blatant lie. That's not even like a misunderstanding.
>> You know you a lot of people believe it.
>> Or maybe the guy or girl who accused you they didn't know it was a scene like and action AND THEN LIKE HUH? OH MY GOD. THINKING THAT IT'S A SCENE. IT'S a scene.
That's crazy. And and and it is a privilege for men when they speak out, it's like, oh, whatever. With with women when you guys speak out, it's like, oh, you're being too assertive.
So, so there's that difference as well, right?
>> So, yeah. Like, like, damn, I'm so sorry to hear that. And >> it's fine.
>> And it hurts because your friends believed you. You >> a director who's now my friend.
>> Okay, got it. And she's like, yeah, yeah. Yeah, she I she was uh she was unsure, but then she asked me, which I'm really grateful for, and I told her the truth.
>> But you know what I'm saying is uh you're Yeah, people people can just people can just create twisted lies because you're too forthcoming, so to speak.
>> So I I have this question maybe like for Tinta and for Andovi. I'm very curious.
So we talked about how different culture creates different values and sometimes it's not wrong, it's just different, right? But at the same time, sometimes it is wrong objectively. So how do you how do you navigate or differentiate between like for example you encounter a difference in culture or a conflict and to a certain extent you understand that this this this is actually a difference in communication style. It's not really wrong objectively but this part is actually wrong. I think for me objectively speaking you know we're all born and raised with a certain set of principles that of course can evolve over time but when I witness something in a different culture or in my own culture that I believe is unacceptable it usually stems from uh something that goes against human rights >> or uh social rights. So like once it >> crosses over into that space then like I don't care where you're from. I don't I don't care how you communicate things.
If it reaches that level of disrespect then I'm going to fight you >> till the end.
>> You're right. No. For me it's the same in China. Same as Shinta but like specifically with pajabat.
>> I grew up eight years in Scandinavia where pajabat stands in line.
>> Yeah.
>> Mhm. And >> they don't get privileged. I don't get zero privilege. When I see people, unless you're the president or the vice president, >> no matter how much I dislike the vice president, >> see, even when I when people know I dislike him, >> I still believe they have a certain privilege cuz they're the vice president and the president.
>> But outside of that, my god, it boggles my mind that they get special treatment.
>> Now, some people might argue like that is a difference in culture, right?
>> No, they're public servants. Servants.
>> Public servant. servant.
>> You know why I agree with uh Andovvi and it's not a difference in culture? Think about it this way. With the types of salaries and perks are government officials are receiving or anybody in the corporate world uh is is what they're receiving justified? One, do they realize with the amount of money they're getting how many people in underprivileged communities they can help? Three, do they understand and realize what problems we have in our country and what that money can do to mitigate those problems?
So uh what they're doing just equates to greed and I think greed is also wrong and I think greed is a universal issue regardless of language, culture, religion.
>> Yeah. So I think that goes to like the value of being responsible for what you have given right because I think that that in itself is also not like a given like people some people don't have that sense of like okay I am given this authority and this privileges I need to do something about it I have this responsibility you know that conscientiousness so I recently read a book by Dr. Um Tony Fernando, it's called Life Hacks from the Buddha.
>> Okay.
>> And something that really resonated within that book was when he wrote, "You cannot truly practice compassion until you comprehend suffering."
>> Okay. And I think the reason why a lot of people in power >> cannot practice compassion or do not even have compassion is because they don't know what true suffering is. And I'm not saying all of us here should suddenly go outside and like torture ourselves. You know, understanding suffering doesn't mean that you have to do something crazy in your own life to comprehend it. If you simply like touch grass, look around you, see the disparity between the rich and the poor, that alone can already give you an idea as to what kind of suffering and torment exists in the world. Or like in my case, not to toot my own horn, but something, you know, people might be watching this and saying, Chentalor, what do you know?
You grew up privileged. I acknowledge that I grew up very comfortable, but um, you know, I I do a lot of social work outside of Jakarta. I go to very marginalized, isolated areas, whether that's in Papua or Maluku or Enete, you know, I've seen true poverty and like that's really opened my eyes to what a blessing, you know, my life is because the, you know, the kind of the kind of misfortune people experience every day, it's unfathomable unfathomable fathomable.
for many.
>> Yeah.
>> And like and including a lot of third culture kids who all they do is get to enjoy the perks of life. Going to a very nice school, going to a nice mall, going abroad on holidays. Like I definitely urge everyone to touch grass and you know see what's truly out there because the way we live every single person in this room is not representative of what Yabra and Asian experiences.
>> Yeah. Yeah. No, I like that. I like that you said touch grass cuz the weeboo communities the weeboos >> one of the things like touch grass right remember at the at the demonstrations we were like >> yo >> yo weeboos touch grass cuz we were like telling them >> to >> to you know to actually know what's happening but what is up Indonesia has for me has done an amazing job >> in actually trying to make these third culture kids and these internationally raised Indonesians to actually quote unquote touch grass.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> But no I I I have a very weird question.
Very weird question. Do you think the internationally raised Indonesians or international kids now >> in this era >> are different than our era?
>> Yes.
>> Oh, this is an interesting topic. Okay, let's talk about this.
>> There's a context why why I'm saying it.
I feel that maybe because back when I when I was in high school, it was just Facebook, right? It was right. Maybe social media played played the game a little bit differently. Twitter or did you >> Twitter? But but >> it was so different.
>> But I felt I I don't know. There's this hinge that I feel like this international kids now >> they're just different. I'm not saying it's bad or good. I just feel like they're not the same as our generation.
>> Like how how differently just one example. One example.
>> Okay. Okay. This is this might be sound very weird. And we boos don't judge me, okay? Cuz I'm judging you.
I feel because the internet culture is now so homogeneous, >> it's so a teenager in America >> can learn something. The teenagers in in Indonesia, right? Cuz you consume the same content, different so and so, whatever. Mhm.
>> But I feel like internationally raised Indonesians in our generation, not all, but some, they do tend to touch grass more >> because the content we consume also was localized.
>> Oh, >> cuz when I grew up, I I couldn't consume all the HBO stuff because it was not HBO, but you get what I mean, all the international stuff because physically it it wasn't in Indonesia. But now with the internet, it's it's been so broadened where like I don't know what's happening in Asia because I watch the Daily Show every day, which is not which is not wrong.
>> Do you get it? Like >> Yeah.
>> I I don't know. I feel like >> um >> What do you think? Or am I just >> No, no, no. I'm I'm trying to phrase it the right way. Um, so I think the third culture kids nowadays, and I can only speak for those in Indonesia especially, right? Um, >> if especially if you're 100% Indonesian by blood.
>> Yeah.
>> You shouldn't be that oblivious to what's happening in your country and to what your culture is about.
>> I'm sorry to say that. And people right now might be watching this and saying, "But Chintza, when you started your career, your Indonesian was awful."
Yeah, sure. I I agree. But I only moved to Indonesia at the age of 11. So up until the age of 11, I wasn't using Indonesian on a daily basis whatsoever.
>> Right.
>> Um, sure I had the same problems as them from the age of 11 to 17, but then when I returned in 2019, I tried my best. And like, you know, I could say, "But I'm only half Indonesian." But I don't let that be an excuse because it is my responsibility as someone who has Indonesian blood to be able to speak the language even though it may not be fluent at least to be able to speak it on a conversational level and >> understand to a certain level why Indonesians conduct their lives the way they do without judgment nowadays whether you're mixed whether you're fully Indonesian they're like I don't know I only watch Tik Tok or I read the news from CNN or BBC. It's like there is a sense of elitism whereby they look down upon their own people.
>> Right. Right.
>> And I think that's unacceptable. And they try to solve all these world problems but from a very western lens which doesn't work because again we're culturally different. There might be some things that we learn abroad that can be utilized here but you know cultural awareness is important to bring about real change.
>> Right. Right. And don't get me wrong, a lot of international racing nations now are culturally aware, but I'm just saying in in general, I I I feel like the swift shift because of the media that they consume, >> right? Like like even when when when I lived in like when I lived in Denmark, the internet wasn't like like now, right? Cuz because of the age, not because of Denmark, the internet cuz the internet age. So like if I wanted to watch Indonesian stuff, I had to really go for it. I had to really look for it.
>> But can I say it's not just media though. It's also the parents fault.
>> OH WOW. HOT TAKE ALERT. I love this.
Okay. What do you mean? Please tell me.
>> Because what I've witnessed, you know, I've dealt with some very young Why I say very young Gen Z's is because you know the oldest Gen Z is now 29.
>> Oh yeah.
>> When I when I talk about >> Do you feel old though?
>> Damn. Yeah.
>> No, we're millennials. I think we're okay.
for millennials. I truly believe that cuz anyway, that's for another time.
>> Uh I believe it's the parents' fault and I feel bad because it's not because the parents are evil or ignorant, but uh their parents grew up in an environment where they were taught that anything western is better than anything that comes that stems from our own country.
And therefore as a kid when they raise raise their child they're more proud when their children can speak English and can adapt in foreign countries because that's a sign of success.
You know it has gone too far because once they hit um the age of 13 or 14 then it's harder to mold them. They're already their own person with their own authority to see the world the way they see fit.
>> Right. Right. Right.
>> That's that is interesting. I think for Andovi's question I think um two things that would differentiate like the previous international kids generation than now for me. The first one I think absolutely about awareness I think back then they're more disconnected and I think they're actually more disconnected. Oh, interesting.
>> Because I think >> Okay.
>> Okay. Just just an example, right? I think a couple of days ago, I was just talking to uh in one of like an international school, high school here in Indonesia >> and I asked them about like political issues here in the country and about like 50% of them and they're like great 10, 11, 12.
>> Okay. About 15, no 50% of them are aware.
>> Okay. That's a that's a great number. I mean compared to back when I was in high school in nobody knows nobody because >> talking about political issues social political issue is not a thing in social media back then.
>> You're right. You're right. I'm sorry.
Yeah, that's another Yeah, you're right.
>> But because now it's very much saturated with different types of content like it's very hard like Tinta said for you to not be aware. I'm biased because of my dad, but like >> I'm biased because of my I'm biased because of my mom. Cuz >> because you guys came from like a very Maybe your parents are politically aware, right?
>> If my mom I wouldn't be like this if my mom and dad wasn't like this. So you you're right. It's a >> parents. So my my parents were were not very politically aware.
>> So I was I was completely oblivious. And I know back in high school none of my friends were talking about politics at all. None of them are aware. Nobody even know who the vice president was. You have like MU that bad.
>> Didn't you have MU like model of the of the United Nations?
>> I didn't go. Okay.
>> I did. I was nervous.
>> Did you guys >> I did m >> I didn't but like we would have to watch our MU team debate >> and so >> you know.
>> Yeah. But I mean we were aware of global issues. Yes. But like Indonesian ones.
No.
>> Right. Right. I get I get what you mean.
I get what you mean. Yeah. Yes. Yes.
Yes.
>> So that's the first. The second part I feel like it's optimism and hope. Like back then and I mean this is like young kids in general. I think >> back then there's so much more hope about the future compared to now.
>> Absolutely.
>> Now if you ask like a younger person about like the future, you know, back then back then the type of movies that we produce about the future is always about like flying cars, cool technology, you know, like >> Terminator is about the end of the world, >> right? We have that. But but I feel like that's like the minority. That's why it popped off so much.
>> Okay. Back then >> I watch I remember there was meet the Robinson from Disney.
>> Legend I love zombie movies when he killed his dog. Oh my god, that's so sad. Okay, >> it's true. And then uh Tomorrowland.
>> Okay. No, no, no. I I get I get >> like a more positive happy golucky childhood.
>> Okay, let's think. Let's think. Kill.
Kill.
No, but I do I do get >> like but now when now when everyone >> now it's hard now all the kids are like what what should we do? I don't know will Trump open the straight of Hormoose like everything is like when is this World War II going to happen? Like everyone is also >> pros and cons here. On one hand I really think Gen Z's and I guess alphas cuz some Gen alphas are pre-teens now for >> what? Wait, how sorry. How old is the oldest alpha?
>> Uh 2012 for 14 this year.
>> Wow, >> that's true. Yeah, 13 live. We want to say 2013 is when it starts, but um >> uh I really thank them for their courage to speak up. I think they're one of the most vocal generations, >> right?
>> You know, um >> but on one hand, action speaks louder than words. And I think it's important not to just speak up, but actually do something about it. And I think that's why a lot of people have this negative idea or negative they perceive Gen Z's and Gen alphas negatively because they're like, "Oh, complain." Like all you do is complain. All you all you do is like talk about your um your discomforts.
>> Uh oh, you're mentally unstable or like not as strong. This these aren't my opinions. Alert alert. These aren't my opinions. These are just what what's being thrown out there. Um, but yeah, I think we need to balance that and I think that's what that's kind of what's lacking in today's generation.
They're really good at talking, but like let's translate all those ideas and point of views into action.
>> Right. Right. Right.
>> So that about action. This is actually very interesting. Everywhere I go when I speak to like you know the the young people and things like it they always ask that right people always say you know don't just complain actually do something but what can we actually do with our limited capacity right >> can you can you give an example in what department cuz like are you talking about politically socially what are you talking >> I feel like they would ask about like anything in general environmental issues social issues political issues anything >> this is just one way to look at it cuz there are so many ways to go about this And this is just one solution of many.
But when I do my seminars at various universities, what I always say is start small and find your community. Let's say what you uh care about is uh the environment.
>> This may sound very mundane, but find a community, find an institution where you can volunteer on a weekly, bi-weekly, monthly basis to let's say plant mangrove trees or plog, you know, uh grab trash on the side of the streets.
Um, sure, these might this might sound very minute and perhaps not have extremely effective long-term outcomes, but you're doing something.
>> Yeah.
>> Um, or in my case, I don't know if you guys know this, but >> there's a really spa special place in my heart for East Indonesia, especially Papua. Like, they're just some of the best people in the world, and I think Papua is the most beautiful place in this country, >> right? Um, and you know, my focus tends to be on education and children, right?
So, like I go out of my way to go there at least once a year. And you know, in the last couple of months, I've been working really hard with my team and finding ways on how we can like contribute long term. It's really hard to build schools in certain areas in Papua because a lot of the land belong to indigenous tribes. So, in terms of paperwork, it's really hard. So, now, you know, we I'm trying to navigate around that and see what else I can do.
And for now, like my goal is to, you know, >> do something as simple as um bring a water sanitation system and like put it in a village cuz that's something super small but long term, you know, and not that costly. So start small. Like people always think, oh, to contribute, I need to help hundreds of thousands of people, millions of people, but it really isn't like that, you know.
Every >> every every re revolution starts from a small group of people who do something consistently. And even though you feel like you're not contributing now, I really feel like you will see it eventually, though that may may take time. So believe in the process, >> right? No, this is a personal question.
How do you balance all that?
>> How?
>> Yeah. Cuz I mean, how do you balance all that like with your entertainment career, your your business career, this like >> how I mean, I know you have your very German schedule and and timing. I mean, I know that, but like >> like like how >> I'm not saying this is right.
>> Yeah. It's definitely not healthy, but uh a byproduct of my upbringing, that being having to juggle school and my professional life, >> um has led me now in my adulthood to believe that being productive means to give yourself no space to rest, no room to rest.
>> I'm working on that right now. One of my 2026 resolution is to understand that, >> right? Just like I got to sleep, guys.
Right.
>> No. Uh but um this might sound super basic to some people, but I have a rule that I need to have one day off a week.
>> I love that.
>> I love that.
>> I need to have one day off a week.
>> I'm looking at my manager. One one day off.
>> If you if you saw my schedule back in 2022, 2023, 24, especially 2022, there was a time where I had literally zero days off. This isn't hyperbole. zero days off for 3 months from July 17th to October 22nd. I still remember those dates because it was such an insane time in my life.
>> What were you doing then?
>> I felt on top of the world, but I was going insane. I was turning into a robot and I didn't know who I was anymore. I didn't have a personality. I didn't have a social circle. Like, but work was awesome.
And um I have this unhealthy obsession um in viewing success as productivity and I don't which is why I read a book called Life Hacks from the Buddha by Dr. or Tony Fernando because like the this is my way of like you know centering myself and realizing that what is life if at the end of the day when you come to the end of your life and reflect upon everything you've done >> you can't even say what brought you joy and I don't think it work it's work that brings you joy it's connection >> it's the memories you create it's your family your dearest friends and that's something I'm working on right now So, how do I manage all that? Uh, I just do I wake up, work, work work, sleep, wake up, work, sleep.
>> I used to I I I lived a robot life from 2021 to 2025.
>> And And that's not counting all your fitness stuff cuz you're still very very fit and like healthy. Like you you juggle that in, right? All your workouts.
>> Yeah. Uh there was a time in 2024 and 2023 2024 where I kind of like let that go. But muscle memory I mean if you if you if you've been >> doing sports >> Yeah. Yeah.
>> since a young age cuz I've been like active since I was 5 years old.
>> You're not going to lose it overnight.
>> But that's you know the advantage I have because I've always lived a very active life. You know I was I was on the varsity team.
>> Right.
>> I worked out a lot after I graduated high school. So, like stopping for two years didn't do too much to me.
>> Wow.
>> But now I have to get back into it because I stopped for two years. I have a patella injury.
>> A patella injury is when your knees kind of shifted because your inner thigh muscle and IT band isn't strong enough to hold your knee together. And that's a byproduct of not doing strength training. So now I'm back into strength training cuz I realized that strength training is so important to prevent injury cuz I wasn't even doing anything.
And I suddenly had a patella problem cuz my body was like, "Hey girl, work out.
You need muscle strength.
That's great.
>> Abigail's like, "H >> great." No, I I actually I'm very curious because you you said you were like always work work and then you're very very ambitious, I would say, and motivated. So, >> and you do a bunch of stuff like Andovi said, right? You're a public figure. You have your entertainment industry and then you're also an entrepreneur, social entrepreneur.
>> What is it that you're chasing after in life that makes you that motivated?
Um, if this question were to be given to me in my teens, I would say, which is sad by the way, but it was also a byproduct of me being bullied. From the age of 11 to 20, 12 to 21, I would say what I was chasing was uh validation to prove to people that I wasn't just some mixed race kid who got lucky in the industry. And so that's why, you know, I worked very hard academically. I worked very hard professionally. And there was like a lot of rage and um disappointment in my heart. But then from the age of let's say post college 20 to my mid20s that was like my healing process when I started to realize that all the anger that had been pent up in inside was not serving me and preventing me from actually thinking clearly and being the creative person that I could be. And so when I returned to Indonesia, uh that's when I realized that being myself, not being a not being scared to speak up, not being scared to be uh to be vocal on issues that I care about was actually a plus point and also really appreciated by people. And so I think I found my true purpose in life uh during the pandemic when I when I finally came to terms with my past >> and also realized that um with the privilege that I had been born with, I need to ensure that I can alleviate the suffering of others. And so with everything I do, whether it's my businesses, whether it's my career, whether it's, you know, fun things I do like podcasts, >> um my motivation is always to help people shift the way they think and feel about themselves as well as how they view the world. I can only provide people information through my platforms, but it's up to them what they want to make of it. So my sincere hope is honestly just to help young Indonesians think more critically, creatively and hopefully become great problem solvers to equip them in competing and also thriving domestically and internationally.
>> Okay. Kinda, I assume and my assumption it might be completely wrong >> that you have been asked multiple times to be in the government.
>> Yeah. in which party inus I mean I I'm assuming >> yeah so >> last year when I >> came back to Indo >> so I'm not I'm not going to ask the question like are you going to do no no no I'm I'm going to ask like >> cuz you know people change who who knows what happens 5 years from now but like >> if you do get an opportunity to work in the government if for if for one one reason or another you want to >> where >> no Is it is it executive?
If you want to. I'm not saying she does.
I'm not saying she does, but I'm saying if she wants to.
>> If I'm being honest, I know you say if I want to, but if we're talking about with the current conditions right now, absolutely not. I've seen great people being torn apart, >> right?
>> Um, >> so I think I could do much more for the people of this country through what I'm doing now as opposed to being part of the government. But in the future, if I suddenly change my mind, because never say never, >> right?
>> Um, I get people in the comment sections telling me that I should be in the Ministry of Education or Ministry of Women Empowerment and uh, Child Protection.
>> Okay, >> that's what I see people request of me and I it makes sense. It is very quote unquote on brand and sincerely something that I care about.
>> Right. Right. Right. But I'm also a very strategic person in that I want to ensure that when I am a part of something uh I actually do my part to help move things forward. So in the future if I if I end up being interested in um joining politics, I'd have to see what this country needs >> because um sure I think there are certain ministries that would require certain expertise, >> right? But for ministries that don't require you to be like a doctor or a lawyer or any of those things, uh I'd have to see because as long as my uh as as long as I'm able to think clearly and really diagnose the problem and find a reasonable solution, then I wouldn't mind which ministry I'm a part of as long as my contributions will clearly bring about the change that is needed. M >> do you look up to anyone specifically cuz we always talk the negative about this country. There's a lot of negatives about this country, especially of our government, but is there any >> thing that you look up to? Anyone in particular? Like for example, for example, I'm I'm going to go first. Like I've always looked up to Pahawk, >> right? Right. Right. Is there anyone that you look up to like this person is amazing?
>> Doesn't have to be political. Doesn't have to be political. It can be It can be anyone in Indonesia in particular.
Like like >> you're putting me on the spot. That person definitely exists, but right now I'm blanking out.
>> It's okay. It's okay. It's okay. Um, >> because I'm always curious what people who have quote unquote achieved things in life who they look up to, >> you know, you know.
>> Okay. Can I can I tell you who I like internationally and then some of the people I like domestically uh according to like their traits?
>> Uh, internationally I've always looked up to Margaret Thatcher. She's known as the Iron Lady and for someone in that time period, she wasn't afraid to go against the norm and speak her truth.
And so I really value that. People always say I'm kind of kass. So that's why I like women who are also seen as very tough.
>> Um, Angelina Jolie because other than the fact that she's extremely beautiful, I really admire the fact that she has a flourishing career but also a huge heart. You know, she has been with the United Nations for a very long time.
>> So I really admire that about her. Um, and Oprah Winfrey at the peak of her career because you saw how much influence she had as a woman, not only as a woman, as a black woman. And I think uh that's so inspiring.
>> In Indonesia, I think there are a lot of fantastic uh women. Someone who may not get enough credit but is amazing is Dr. Suryani, Professor Suryani. is someone who helps people around Indonesia but particularly Bali with their mental health because something that's lacking in our society is a lot of underprivileged communities don't know how to deal with people with mental disorders so they end up chaining them it's called in Indonesian it's called >> they end up chaining them to a tree in a cage and that's not how you should treat those with mental disorders right so she comes and helps treats them not just with medication but also with the social support they need. And I think that's so noble of her.
>> There's something to be said about Ibusi. Yeah. I think her character is just pretty badass.
>> Oh my god. I said the same. I was like, she's badass. That's the first word that comes to mind.
>> Yeah. Like, you know, I've been to her house in um >> Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
>> And she she has like this I don't give an F vibe, you know? like, "Yeah, I'm going to roll up to the beach, >> surf a little bit, go home, tend to my plants." Like, she's so cool. And her voice, man, I It's raspy, but it's like, "Yeah, I'm here. I'm the boss."
>> Okay. Okay. Interesting. Interesting.
>> I think Yeah.
>> Shout out Dr. Sriani and and and Musi, right?
>> Yeah. So, >> we should have them on the pot.
>> We should do having on the pot. I'll be I'll That's I love that. contrary to what most people in this country uh like. I like women. I like tough women who give people a piece of their mind.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> Um you know, I think and there's nothing wrong. It's just a preference. I I see in this country women who tend to be uh looked up looked up to, they tend to be more princess-like, and there's nothing wrong with that. They like they like soft strength, which is fine. you know, intelligent women who are also beautiful but, you know, more elegant and poised.
>> Right. Right. Right. Right.
>> Which is fine. Again, that's a preference. But for me, I'm always about the women who aren't scared to stand out and like >> be the center of attention.
>> Nice.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. I think we want to go into like the questions. have been very very interesting and I feel like some of the questions relate to what we we've been okay >> okay so maybe and you choose four >> okay I I'll choose I'll choose uh this one okay yeah this is interesting that is clearly not being late clearly she will ever.
>> True.
>> Yeah.
>> Even when I try to be late, I'm on time.
>> Yeah. It's crazy. It's crazy.
>> Yeah.
>> I remember out of topic. I remember we I was at a shoot like a year or two years ago with you and I knew I was late with Daniel, right? So, I called immediately.
Dude, I'm going to be late. I'm so sorry.
>> Wait, who's like, whose event is this?
>> I think it's Daniel's podcast. So, you were more scared of Kinta than Daniel?
>> I was like, guys, please I'm going to be late. Okay. I'm so sorry. Okay. Okay.
I'm so sorry.
>> Did you call Daniel, too?
>> I forgot. I told her I was going to be late.
>> It would be so funny if you did call Daniel and then you were just like, "I'm so sorry."
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> Uh Yeah. Yeah. I remember that.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> And I was like cuz it was late at night, right?
>> It was It was sudden. It was a sudden podcast.
>> Did you judge Andovi by He's good vibes.
>> Oh, thank you. Thank you.
>> Okay. So, to answer this question, uh should I answer it in English or in Indonesia?
>> Up to you. Up to you.
>> I don't know. How do you guys usually do this question? English. Okay. Um, okay.
Throughout my life, I've always been under the impression that when I give someone constructive feedback, even when it hurts, it's okay as long as it's founded upon uh >> objectivity, >> you know, like for example, let's say let's say you're my staff >> and like I'm unhappy with what you did.
It's okay for me to be like, "Hey, Andovi, like this is the mistake you made." It's not okay because blah blah blah blah in the future could you please blah blah blah blah. That makes sense, right? Like I'm being professional.
>> But something that I learned here which I'm starting to understand now because I'm trying to practice more kindness and compassion thanks to the Buddha.
>> Um is when you give people criticism, you have to be really gentle. If you again using the same example, I'd be like, "Hey Andovi, I'd like to talk to you about something." And then start with something positive like you know you've been doing really great in this department. I really appreciate it but look what happened yesterday is is not okay because blah blah blah and it could affect my company or like my image because so the reasoning is still there but it's a lot gentler.
>> Right. Right. Right. Right. You know, I don't know what it is about our culture that makes people less recept receptive when you're hard on them.
>> But, um, it's okay because at the end of the day, there's also no point in being mean, you know, even though we see it as just being professional or being tough, tough love. I'm learning more and more.
There's nothing wrong with communicating things with kindness. And if they still don't get it, then yoda, just asa OR SOMETHING.
BUT AT least I've done my part in trying to communicate uh my thoughts in the best way possible. So that's something that I've learned. It's still really hard cuz sometimes when I'm so pissed I'm like I just want to punch this person.
>> But then I'm like you know if this person resigns tomorrow then uh you know this could result in something much worse. So let me just breathe.
>> Yeah. It's uncomfortable now, but it'll be better for the future. And it'll prevent that person as well from twisting the truth and creating another lie. Like, I don't know, Chinta punched a mirror in front of >> Nice.
>> Okay, next question.
>> Next question. Okay.
>> Um, let's Oh, let's do this. This one's interesting. No.
>> Okay. Angova. Hi, Tinta. I'm curious. Is there a book you've been rereading or carrying around recently? If so, which book is that? And what keeps drawing you back? And also, what's your favorite book of all time?
>> Wow, she's putting you on the spot.
Angia Noa, you're putting China on the spot here. Favorite book of all time.
And what book are you rereading? I mean, the the the Buddha book.
>> Yeah. Life hacks from the Buddha by Tony Fernando. Dr. Tony Fernando. He's a psychiatrist that looks at it from a scientific perspective. That's why it makes sense to me because if it's too like woo woo, I'm also gonna be like, >> "Okay."
Um, >> something that I'm reading right now is How to Talk to Strangers by Malcolm Gladwell.
>> I've heard about that.
>> I know it's a classic, but it's >> mindblowing. I feel like we need another podcast just to talk about that book.
>> Have you read it?
>> Malcolm Gladwell is a G.
>> He's a G. The G is for Gladwell. That's He's so He's so good. And I love his hair. Out of topic, but I love his hair.
>> But yeah, I agree. We would need another hour because I'm learning so much from that book. It's a 377 page book if I'm not mistaken. I'm on page 280, so I'm almost done. I could probably be done by tomorrow.
>> Um, >> but it really makes you question the justice system.
>> It makes you question um intelligence institutions.
It makes you question human beings as a whole because um again I can't get into it because it'll take too long but as human beings we tend to default to the truth and there's nothing wrong with that. When we meet people we don't immediately assume that they're lying because in defaulting to truth we allow for ease of communication. We allow for society to run better. We allow for friendships or relationships to be made.
But then this becomes very dangerous when we talk about let's say victims of sexual abuse. U people who are who are who are indicted or people who are said to be guilty for a certain crime. You know again I can't get into it but it's so interesting. It will change the way you see the world. So we'll read that.
But I think my favorite book of all time >> that's a very difficult question.
>> That is a very difficult question. I can say my favorite author of all time.
>> Oh, I got >> uh Daniel Steele. Daniel Steele is an awardw winning author. She writes uh fiction >> novels. Okay.
>> Okay.
>> And I can read her book in like two days and finish it. Her novels because they're for me I think it's it's it's not chick fleeky. I would say it's chick novel >> uh a lot. adultery, the apartment, uh, uh, there she has she has many books that I've read, but basically, you know, she she uses very simple characters and describes or tells a story of very like average dayto-day activities that these characters undertake. But no matter what phase in your in your life you you're in, whether you're a teenager, a young adult, or like a senior citizen, you can just relate to her characters and learn something from them. You know, you you start to value the simplicity of life and the importance of relationships. And I don't know, there's just a lot of wisdom to her books in my opinion. So, if you want to read something fiction, read Daniel Steel.
>> That's so interesting. You know, like a lot of people have I think there's a lot of people who have like this perception that reading fiction is somewhat less than than non-fiction.
>> No, that's not true. Yeah. Yeah.
>> I disagree. That's not me. I disagree with you, but there's an air to it that sometimes people gravitate towards. So, it's really cool to hear that your favorite author is actually a fiction.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. I don't I I definitely don't see it that way. So, I'm proud to say I'm a fiction reader.
>> Me, too. I love fiction.
>> Yeah.
>> And too, right?
>> I love it. Especially the Twilight series. No, I'm not kidding. I I used to love those. I'm not kidding. But we talked about Never mind. Okay, let's go.
>> One more thing. If you want a piece, if you want a piece of mind, read a book by Haymonsim. It's called When Things Don't Go Your Way. When things don't go your way.
>> I love that book. I think in the anxious uh society we live in now nowadays, especially with the youth experiencing a lot of like mental health issues, this book is something that some this book is very it's is a very good read.
>> No, I I echo that. I actually read it.
It's so good.
>> It's really good. It's really good.
>> And if you guys are lazy to read, I talked about it in a podcast, but I don't know if I can promote it here with our friend Kanye.
>> No problem with it. Wait, what?
>> Yeah. Yeah. So I did podcast with Tanya and Ferwi I think a year and a half ago.
Yeah. And I talked about this book. No, we should go to we should record also in Malaka.
>> Malaka books >> to talk about just books >> and talk about Daniel Steel cuz you're going to talk about you're going to talk about >> No, last time Andovi was in Malaka books. We talked about Twilight for like a 40 minutes.
>> Team Jacob.
>> Me too.
>> I ran into Twilight. Yeah.
>> Thank you. Thank you. DON'T JUDGE IT.
>> YEAH, I'M TEAM JACOB for sure. Again, I'm also more into badass men. And I don't really like green boys.
>> Jacob, I mean, it it helps that he has very chiseled abs. Okay, let's not talk ABOUT JACOB'S ABS.
>> PYRO INSPO.
>> YEAH, there you go.
>> So funny. Oh my god. I want this. I want this. This is This is really good. Okay.
Masu.
>> Okay.
>> What breaks your heart the most about Indonesia and what gives you the most hope?
What breaks what breaks my heart the most about this country is we often preach the values of gang royong or working together or being there for one another but in truth is we witness a huge amount of greed in this country proven through the trillions of rupia that has been corrupted by different parties when I say parties I don't mean like political party yeah like different individuals or groups I'm saying it.
>> In fact, just saying it. I'm saying it.
>> Um, and they're just desensitized to the poverty around them. It's mindblowing to me. And I don't want to repeat the same story that I talked about like a couple of days ago on a different platform. But let me just say, there are people in this country that don't even have access to clean water, don't have the privilege to turn the tap and wash their hands or wash their faces or shower or, you know, use clean water to cook. A lot of the people in our country in certain areas for example Papua you know >> are already so grateful and happy when they can eat burnt sago which tastes like powder but for them it's like I can eat today and this burnt sago is delicious because it's all I can eat and I'm starving but I'm happy and you know props to them because you know they show us that living simplistically and being being grateful for what you have allows you to be happy. You don't need much to be happy.
>> And yet here we are. Indonesia has one of the highest rates of food waste.
>> And yet millions of people in our country are hungry, >> right?
>> Like how can you just be oblivious to this? You know, >> if we could only disperse all this wealth >> in in the right direction, >> I feel like we can see tremendous change in our country. And so what breaks my heart the most in is that we claim to be people of faith. We claim to be caring of one another. We claim to be compassionate. But the truth is >> ego, greed, and sin is everywhere, >> right?
>> Yeah.
>> And what gives you the most hope?
>> Yeah. What gives me the most hope?
>> Gibbran.
>> Wow.
>> Gives me the most hope in this country.
I think Indones clip that >> please >> please >> clip at ease.
>> What gives me most hope is that I truly believe that Indonesians are innately very kind >> and loving people innately.
>> Innately yeah >> and how how again how do I know this?
When I go to underprivileged communities that haven't really been touched by modernization, you see how they truly have open arms to those who visit them, how hospitable they are, how they're full of smiles and excitement.
>> Yeah. Yeah.
>> People only become bitter once they realize they've been exploited.
>> Bars, dude, THAT WAS A BAR. I'VE NEVER HEARD THAT people only become bitter once they realize they've been exploited.
>> Mhm.
>> Holy [ __ ] >> I I do have a question.
>> I want to steal that and say, >> but it is it is interesting though like what you mentioned about like what uh breaks your heart the most and what gives you most hope are both about Indonesians. But it seems to be like a two sides of Indonesian. On one hand, you say that Indonesian we have a lot of greed that causes a lot of like inequality and things that you mentioned. But at the same time it is also the compassion and the kindness of the people. Do you think that the former is just a problem of a small groups of elites that are like that or is it is there like a cultural because >> you know what I mean right? I mean those elites come from the people also.
Unfortunately, I think uh they're becoming more prevalent and it's becoming embedded in the culture because >> take uh the most populated parts of Java for example or the most developed >> they have the some of the most unkind and greedy people in the country.
Whereas if you go sometimes to the poorest areas, >> they're actually the kindest and the most giving and the most humble. So I think that's why people like us, people like the wee boos watching, people with the awareness that we have, this is where we have to flip the switch, so to speak, and uh not trying to self-promote, but I just wanted to give a concrete example. I have a I have a foundation, Chintala foundation, but one of our pillars is called act of love because we believe that everything we do needs to be rooted in love. And as cheesy as that sounds, why why why we're becoming such an unhappy society is because we're constantly trying to trigger hate between people. Hate because we have different faiths. Hate because we have different races. Hate because of all the differences that exist. So, we need to combat this with love. And like, how do you teach love?
can't necessarily teach love, but you can take action in a way that makes people feel like they're heard, that makes people feel like they're taken care of, and that makes people feel like, you know, there is hope for their future to change or get better.
>> I'm going to use that line, by the way, that people have become bitter once they I've never cuz I've never heard of that.
>> Do you agree with that?
>> I've completely >> You become bitter once you realize >> that you've been exploited >> and that's through everything. Not that's that's also in love. Mhm.
>> Cuz once you're in love, >> you become toxic once you've been >> mistreated.
>> That feels a bit personal.
>> No, no, I'm just kidding. Okay.
>> Okay. I think the last question, you can read it.
>> Okay. Got it. For underscore, it's a long underscore.
>> Deandra, yes.
>> You often speak about education and empowering young Indonesians. What's one mindset mindset shift you think our generation needs to truly compete globally? We got to compete with the Chinese cuz I went to China recently. Oh my god.
>> We are 20 20,000 years 50 years like like >> but our food's way better. I'm just >> I'm glad you brought up the China example because I was going to almost go with a different answer. Um I think because of what I witness when I am in these >> isolated regions. I was about to say I want the mindset shift that needs to take place is for Indonesians as a whole, not just young Indonesians to realize that they um they have the right to be where they are. They have the right to be in a certain room. They shouldn't see themselves as less than or the Indonesian word for it is >> mind. M >> you know I think uh mind or the feeling the feeling of being less than is very prevalent in our society and that's what prevents us from taking risks and growing in the direction that uh we can grow into but uh because you also mentioned that China example my second answer would also be discipline you know >> discipline is so important to not always spoon feed or baby people into uh uh into sorry not not always spooning spoon feeding or babying people to prevent them from feeling discomfort because the only way you can grow is through discomfort. M >> uh simple example simple example have you noticed okay maybe we can also look at it from a positive way like oh like women are treated in a more gentle way but sometimes let's talk about a basketball >> and a lot of men sometimes when they pass a ball to me they're like >> cuz um I see >> cuz they're scared u the woman will get injured but it's also because maybe in school women tend to not be pushed as much during physical education. Makes sense. It's not because they're like, "Oh, you're weak." But like they're just very careful because you know, Carlo, if someone falls, they're like, "Oh."
Whereas for me, this is the other side of the extreme, okay? I was on the varsity track team in high school and I ran 100 m, 200 m, 4x 100, and high jump.
>> I had a really, really, really bad shin splint to the point where when I was doing my 200 meter race, I tripped during the run, but I didn't come in last. I still came in third.
Even though I was injured my but the point of the story is from what I've witnessed in Indonesia in that case they might be like oh don't force it it's okay you're injured just sit down if you're in pain it's okay cry if my coach saw me cry he would be like what is wrong with you stand back up keep going even when I had to walk with crutches during the awarding ceremony he's like >> leave your crutch behind make sure you're wearing shoes on both feet >> and go up on stage and act like everything's okay.
>> Again, that's the extreme point, but my point is I I have been disciplined to not acknowledge pain and to keep pushing even when things are really uncomfortable. And again, that's why I'm here today. Despite everything I've experienced in life, despite, you know, all the setbacks, all the negativity that I've experienced, why am I still here today? Because at a young age, I had been taught to always continue to persevere and move forward regardless of how much pain I'm in physically, emotionally or mentally.
>> It reminds me of the quote that says like people become what is expected of them.
>> Oh yeah, I remember >> that. You know sometimes when people uh nobody has any expectation towards them, they just become you know nothing.
>> They become mediocre and they settle for that. But once like somebody is expecting greatness from them, sometimes people become what is expected of them.
That totally reminds me of that.
>> This is the first time I'm doing it on camera. I used to play basketball as well. I was on the varsity team, but I've yet to be invited by >> all this BASKETBALL TALK. NO, I HAVE TO WORRY SHE talks about basketball. It gives me it becomes worse, right? Your what you did.
>> So I think it was 10th grade. I was getting the rebound and I jammed my finger. This is permanent.
>> Oh, so even uh not double jointed. This is from the ball.
>> I remember my mom saying, "Chinta, please don't play basketball anymore.
You're going to look ugly." Like, you know, during photo shoots, your finger is going to look horrendous and disgusting.
>> It's okay. Mama mama Indonesia.
Uh but I kept playing. I'm like, you know what? I don't care if this gets worse cuz there is a chance that this this could get worse. If it keeps getting jammed, it's only going to get worse. But I just kept playing even though it was painful at times because I'm like, "No, I'm good at basketball. I enjoy the game. I feel good when I'm with my team and practicing playing against other teams, so I'm going to keep going." I didn't let the pain I didn't let other people's perception, right, >> affect my desire to continue pursuing the sport that I loved and still love, >> right?
Cliff, next double screen pickup game.
Okay, later if he doesn't invite you, we're going to clip this and >> we got you on tape.
>> Okay. Anyway, so before before we leave, >> yeah, >> does not know this.
>> Okay.
>> I've prepared a mini game show for you.
>> Oh, okay. All right. The game show is called Get >> Germany or Indonesia.
>> So, I'm going to give you two choices cuz because you're a mixer half. I'll give you two choices. Random things. You just choose which one.
>> Okay.
>> Right.
>> Oh, it So, if I were to um create an example like food for example, >> that was my first one. That was my first one. I'm giving you a layup. Okay. So, the first one, >> German food or Indonesian food?
>> Indonesian food.
>> That was a layup. That was a layup. That was >> That was an easy one. That was easy.
Easy. All right.
>> German weather or Indonesian weather?
>> Oh, Indonesian weather. Of course.
>> See, I'm giving I'm giving you See, Indonesia. Yeah. Yeah.
>> Now, it's going to get a bit tougher.
>> Okay.
>> Okay. Okay. If you only had to choose one >> Mhm.
>> Okay.
German punctuality.
>> Mhm. or Indonesian sopans. Wow. Ah, >> it's tough because you can be punctual and an [ __ ] right? Exactly.
>> German punctuality or Indonesian.
>> It's okay. Be honest. It's fine.
>> Yeah. I mean, in in my personal life, of course, it'd be soan, but like in my professional life, German punctuality.
So, you need to choose punctuality. If everybody was punctual, I'd be so happy.
>> Ding ding ding ding ding ding.
>> Okay.
>> Now, I only prepared three.
Only three.
>> NO. NO. I GOT MORE. IT'S IN MY BRAIN.
IT'S IN my brain. Okay. Are you ready?
Okay. I'm going to I'm going to give one for Germany. Okay.
>> German technology or Indonesian technology?
>> Of course. German technology. That's not fair.
>> Okay. Now, I'm going to give you >> although things are getting worse in Germany.
>> Oh, wow.
>> Indonesia is not the only country with problems.
>> Okay. This one might be tricky >> cuz I'm speaking in general.
>> Okay.
>> German politics or Indonesian politics?
>> Yeah. I'm talking in I'm not in general I'm not talking about a specific leader in 1945. I'm not talking about I'm talking a in general German politics or in general encompasses that guy though.
>> Oh yeah.
>> No in real in the last 40 years.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 40 years. 40 years.
I'm not going to go all the way.
>> That's true.
>> That's okay.
>> Germany is going through a tough time right now as well. You know think people are very unhappy. A lot of Germans want to move out of the country like we are not in a good place.
>> But if we're talking about I guess corruption and also where budgets are being allocated although Germany also has a problem with it at least for now it's Germany is still better.
>> Okay. Now this is a what if.
>> Mhm.
>> If Indonesia is in the Football World Cup. If if we all know Germans have won four times.
>> Yeah. You already had to choose one for Germany to win THE WORLD CUP. WHO WILL YOU SUPPORT? OH, this is going to be clipped so hard by all the football fans.
>> Germany win the World Cup or Indonesia win the World Cup?
>> Indonesia because Germany already won four times.
>> She knows THAT'S THE THAT'S THE SAME ANSWER CUZ YOU KNOW, but you would totally go for Germany this World Cup, right? Every World Cup.
>> Germany hasn't been good in the last 13 years.
>> Yeah. Yeah. So, cuz if if Indonesia I I always ask this people who are mixed All of them say the same thing. Of course, Indonesia because we they do want to see if Indonesia makes it to the World Cup.
>> Yeah. Yeah. So, so, so that's it. Do you have any more Germany or Indonesia?
>> No.
>> No. That's my That was an impromptu game show that I just >> There was actually a question on your list that I liked.
>> Oh, which one? Oh, no. It's okay. Which one?
>> No, on this list.
>> Oh, I'm going to ask uh both of you.
>> Okay. Okay. Okay.
>> What language do you guys dream in?
>> Oh.
>> Oh, that's English.
>> Okay.
>> I'm I'm sorry. Mix mix. Sometimes it depends on what type of dream for me.
Usually like if it's like an angry dream that I'm just like being pissed off and >> it's in English.
>> Okay.
>> But if it's if it's like a chill dream where I'm just like >> randomly riding a horse in the middle, >> it's sometimes in Indonesian. I don't know. But mostly in English though.
>> I will answer that question shortly. But there's a reason why I really liked this question on the list. Um, do you guys feel like your English has gotten better over time? Has it remained uh consistent or has it deteriorated >> since returning from your respective countries abroad?
>> Well, that's hard.
>> I think it's gone worse for me.
>> It's gotten worse for me.
>> Yeah. Okay.
>> Gone worse for me.
>> So, I'm I'm I'm I'm glad that I'm not alone because my mother tongue, so to speak, is English, right? I'm proficient in the English language and I would I do believe that I'm a native speaker, >> but ever since returning to Indonesia in 2019 and now speaking Indonesian so often cuz now I don't have that international school bubble anymore, I feel like it has deteriorated and I'm scared for myself. And this is why I'm starting to read profusely again because for me it makes absolutely no sense that there are times where I go blank. I mean, I it happened during this podcast, too, where I just can't find the word because I'm so used to mixing the two languages.
>> And so, uh, you know, it it makes me wonder, can it also happen to native speakers? Cuz for you guys, I'm guessing you guys kind of like spoken an Asian and English >> uh equally at home growing up, whereas for me, it was English at school and then eventually also English at home.
>> Yeah. Um because I have another friend who's actually fully Indonesian was but was born and raised in America, came to Indonesia for the first time and finally started living here uh starting from the age of 27. So he had he was a fully grown adult when he moved to Indonesia.
>> But because he was surrounded by these entertainment people over time I noticed that he started speaking >> actually somehow sing English. I don't know why speaking English. Okay. And I and you know at the time I didn't have a social filter yet. I had just come back from uh the US so I was still quite >> blatant about my opinions. And I I said dude your English sucks.
>> I'm like are you are you are you making this up or >> one I'm very >> I'm like are you are you make are you making this up or are you do you actually speak like this? He's like what do you mean like my English has gotten worse? I'm like, dude, yeah. So, I'm scared I'm going to get to that point.
>> And so, um, I'm glad I'm doing this podcast, but at the same time, >> uh, I don't know what how how do you guys feel since returning to Indonesia?
Do you think your English has deteriorated for me, I feel like it has just because I'm mixing the language so much and like a lot of the things that I want to accomplish in this country requires me to speak Indonesian because remember, communication is key.
>> You're right. M >> you know you know you got me thinking actually but when I swear >> I go Indonesian >> my default swearing mode bad words is Indonesian not even English >> really >> yeah my when I when I think of that's my first my first >> right do you guys swear in I go I go Indonesian but that's my first default swearing >> I don't think she swears she's such a ninja >> oh no do you swear in English first or Indonesian first >> no again it depends right sometimes you swear in a joking sense sometimes you swear like when you're angry. I feel like I'm I always default into English when I'm angry.
>> Uh I I I I'm angry in English, but I swear in Indonesia. That's funny.
>> But you know, sometimes swearing like casually like that that goes in Indonesia.
>> I definitely swear in English. But today before you came into the room, I told Abigail that her next book should be called Miking.
And I said that is a terrible business.
>> One of the best ideas I've ever jing everyone's gonna be like.
>> I'll ask Kanye and see what she thinks.
She'll be like, "Are you sure that comes from China?"
>> And we're not using the A. Just N J I N G.
>> So it's softer. I feel like it's Chinese.
>> Somehow even worse.
>> Okay. Thank you, Ginta. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. See you.
>> There you go. trees.
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