"Can Christianity Ever Really Be Good For Women?"- Convo With Pastor | Jimmy Snow + Promise Backlund

本站添加: 2026-05-05

[00:00:00]All right, I promise this call is clearly for you. Jay in Texas. Jay in Texas. I'm not quite sure what perspective you're trying to call in on, but pronouns he him. I need you to take off speaker, whatever's causing that fe audio feedback. Uh, are you actually calling in on as on the side of Christians and on the side of MAGA or are you just trying to make like a broader meta point about it all?

[00:00:24]>> Hi, Provin. Yeah, Jimmy, thanks for taking the time to for me to be here.

[00:00:29]Um, well, I'm definitely not on the side of MAGA. Um, it's, uh, not good for anybody, not just women. Um, I'm in the process, I think, more of more deconstruction.

[00:00:46]And, uh, I I did take it off of speaker, but I think there's something wrong with my phone that I can not hear as loudly when I'm not on speaker. Um, but uh, >> can you hear loudly enough?

[00:01:00]>> Yeah, I don't know what it is. Maybe it's my ear. No, I don't know. Yeah, it seems to be louder that I can hear y'all better when it's on speaker than when I have it up to my ear. I have it actually to my ear. You sound a little a little far away, but I can still hear.

[00:01:16]It's >> fine. Fine. We're We're going to >> continue like that. I guess >> we're going to uh we're just going to blast right on past it. J. So Jay, you're calling in. You're not on the side of MAGA, but your position is that if Christianity is good for women, then so is MAGA.

[00:01:35]>> Uh h that's no, I don't I well I think I've had doubts from watching some of your uh videos on the line and everything about Christianity. starting to have doubts about, you know, how the Christian God has been presented to me and stuff, but I think there's some aspects, of course, if we share >> JJ J, let's I I'm trying to I'm trying to make this like move flow a little easier and faster. So, I'm going to hand you to promise now and simply since you called in and told that to the screener, you said Christianity has some good aspects. You seem to be replying specifically to the the prompt of today.

[00:02:15]The question for you, Jay, is what Christian aspects, qualities, characteristics are specifically good for women? And now I give you the promise as you answer that.

[00:02:30]>> Okay.

[00:02:31]Specifically good for women. Um well I I I think that whenever they speak I guess about how the husband should treat the woman um and uh also you know some women accept that or are happy with that. So that's why whenever the call screener asked me, I also mentioned it was probably perspective um in some sense. But I have >> Yeah, I >> I'm a little con I'm wondering are you calling in because you have a firm position on something or are you you don't you don't seem very convinced yourself because this is the kind of show where we like somebody calls in with an opposing perspective and we kind of casually debate it. But to me I feel like you're not calling for that reason.

[00:03:22]Am I wrong?

[00:03:26]Um, you're not completely wrong. I'm still in the phases of trying to I guess in construct or find, you know, of things that have been presented and I've found the negativities in in the Bible.

[00:03:41]So, but yeah, >> Thomas, he did say >> he said that Christianity teaches men to be good to their wives. Do you believe that's true?

[00:03:51]>> No, not at all. I I I would ask where in the Bible you think it says to be good to your wives.

[00:04:00]>> Uh um I guess the thing that comes to mind is that same passage that a lot of people bring up about uh it tells them how to you know to love your wife as yourself or something like that and respect her. But I also know that one thing I don't agree with and I can see the negativity is when it tells the wives to be submissive to the husband.

[00:04:20]that doesn't always work and that's not always correct.

[00:04:25]So, >> right. Yeah. No, I I I would say the Bible is not clear at all on its position for how women should be treated. And when it is clear, it's in a very awful way. It's usually requiring them to be stoned to death, even though they're the ones that were assaulted. Um or, you know, like you pointed out, to be submitted to their husband no matter what. In fact, it even says even if they're uh I can't remember the exact wording, but what's implied is it doesn't matter if you don't like how you're being treated, your duty is to your husband. And I was married um when I was a Christian to a Christian man.

[00:05:02]>> Yeah.

[00:05:02]>> And we had a >> Yes, I >> an attempted Christian relationship and it was really really awful and toxic and abusive. So, you know, I can't agree with that at all.

[00:05:15]>> Right.

[00:05:17]Yeah. No, I understand. Yeah, I I have seen some videos where you mentioned that.

[00:05:21]>> Uh and >> yeah, the Bible was used to defend me like that's what made me keep staying in something that was really toxic. Um is because I had basically been well I had been indoctrinated into believing that a toxic relationship is what I'm supposed to be in. Um, not just because of, you know, how you're taught to submit to your husband, but because evangelical Christianity spends a lot of time teaching women that they should view God like their husband as well. And that's already a really toxic situation there. Um, so anything that you could possibly say, well, that's kind of good about the Bible, there's something more awful right behind it. And we can find positive, helpful, good things outside of the Bible um without all of the trash. Like there's incredible books out there on healthy marriages and relationships and how to treat your partner um without also some verses talking about how they should be stoned to death. You know, >> I I feel like too it's a little bit worth adding, Jay, if you're going one of the good things is about husbands and wives.

[00:06:32]Do you know how the Bible models getting a wife in the first place? Like mostly, and this is ignoring the rape wives, right? Because there's literally verses in the Bible where you can get a wife if you have enough money and you just initiate it by raping the woman you want. You rape her if she doesn't if she's not already promised to somebody else. You pay your dad, she's your wife.

[00:06:53]Ignoring that.

[00:06:54]>> Yeah. What are most marriages in in the Bible?

[00:07:04]>> You know, I think I'm not quite sure understanding the question or how to answer that. Really?

[00:07:10]>> Would you say most marriages were consensual or non-consensual marriages where the actual woman >> was is the person we're talking about whether she wanted to marry a person or not?

[00:07:24]Uh okay. Uh from my lack of full knowledge and short memory, I think that it seems to be more nonconsentual because it's usually arranged marriages.

[00:07:35]Right.

[00:07:36]>> Right. It literally mar biblical marriage is a property transfer >> and it treats women that way the entire time. A woman is the property of their father and at some point the father either can approve maybe even with her input but also has the power to veto if it's with her input. If she says she likes a guy and wants to marry him and he says no, she doesn't get to override that. So she he can approve or disapprove but in most cases just straight up arrange just straight up arrange marriages. she will decide or not she he her father will decide who he's going to marry her off to. It was literally a transfer of property and that's how women were viewed and and once you did transfer that's why there was a dowy in some cases once you did transfer you were now the possession of the man. So, if you're going to talk about the positivities of how men treat their wives, I don't think you even have to go further than how the man got the wife in the first [ __ ] place, >> right? Wow. You know, that's good. Why, you know, we should have conversations like this and talk to people like you with that info because looking at it like that, it makes more clear. And yeah um in that sense no I don't think that would be beneficial or positive you know without having that consent uh that the woman has that the guy has all the power I I guess maybe my thought was that if it works in that marriage and the woman is submissive like some Christian wives now you know swear or they they accepted it or or they they're happy either way that it's going with them going to church and submissive to their husbands, it works at that point, then to them it was beneficial. Um, >> but do you think women should >> should women have the right to choose if they're quote submitting or not?

[00:09:39]>> Actually, I think yes, that at the end of Yeah, definitely. Because >> once they're choosing, then it's not actually submission anymore. it's just them agreeing um on something and choosing it. So if they're if it's something they're actually choosing and they have um they're consenting to enthusiastically and they're really for it, then there's no need for submission because they're already in alignment with it. Like my husband and I agree on almost everything and a lot of things I'm happy to be like your call and then he's same for me.

[00:10:14]He's like whatever you say. That's not us submitting to each other. That's we are agreeing. We don't have to submit to each other because we want each other to have personal autonomy. So that's like this argument of of submission. Well, if women are liking it, but that's not in in that type of relationship that that type of submission that they're talking about this biblical submission. It is giving up the right to consent to personal autonomy. They're saying I'm giving this up. I don't think that that's moral.

[00:10:47]Well, yeah. I think that I seem to agree with you on that. You know, I I definitely whenever I was married, I did what I could to try to uh give my wife probably more power than she probably wanted. She was also a little bit of Christian. We weren't too too much into it. Uh I don't know if that's one reason why it didn't work out because she probably I I don't know. She probably was another mindset that you need to be that leader. I was really passive with almost everything because I didn't want to cause issues.

[00:11:20]But that's beside the point. I'm not going to go into my personal life. But yeah, I think you know we had two daughters and yeah, I definitely they should have a choice and the way it was in the Bible in the past or even with Christianity in the New Testament, I'm not sure. Uh yeah, submissions like that without uh permission or without wanting to then it's not that that's not beneficial. No, >> can I ask um it says here you're agnostic.

[00:11:51]What's keeping you from calling yourself an atheist? Do you believe that a god exists?

[00:11:58]>> Um well, I I think I'm still in the middle, still having that, you I I did used to believe that quite a bit until I found out about that my religion wasn't the only religion out there and then I heard about agnosticism that they're kind of saying there might be a god or there is a higher being but they don't know exactly which one and it sounds to me a little closer to atheism. So little by little I'm still in that process of figuring out and trying to feel comfortable with seeing if if I can say atheist or not. I'm still >> I get it. It took me a little bit.

[00:12:35]>> Yeah. Yeah. Something holding that. I don't know. It's just been for so long so common that that you know to change and you understand it. I'm sure others have discont.

[00:12:50]>> No, you're good. You're good. It's It's awkward calling in on these things for the first time. Um, what would you say is the number one thing kind of if there is something like kind of keeping you connected to religion or belief in some sort >> in some sort of way? Sorry, I'm so tired.

[00:13:10]>> Yeah. Um, wow.

[00:13:14]I think that sometimes it it it seems difficult to accept to understand of how you know since I don't know too much about evolution that's probably one of the issues um is that how sophisticated we are you know and that if then if things are made there's got to be a maker but then that also comes to well if there's got to be a maker there's got to be a maker for the maker >> wait but Jay J, you just you just kind of gave away the thing without even understanding evolution. You said if things are made, what makes you think humans are made?

[00:13:53]>> Um, >> they're made by their parents in a way, but they're clearly not assembled with intention. In fact, one of the things people don't like as much about giving birth is you kind of don't know what you're going to get. You don't even know if if the pregnancy is going to take, let alone what genetic changes might be there, what what challenges your per your child might face because you can't be intentional.

[00:14:15]>> Uh it's it's a so what makes you think when we see the process that has a level of you call it randomness to it?

[00:14:24]>> Yeah.

[00:14:24]>> What makes what makes you look at that and go humans are made?

[00:14:30]>> Good point. Uh very good point. Um, I guess I can't really have a a good answer for that cuz, you know, looking at it like that, yeah, I don't except for whatever I've been used to. And then we have to prove that God is real, right? Or that he has a choice or whatever. So, yeah. No, I don't know.

[00:14:50]Like I said, I don't know too much about how biology and the processes works to be able to say, "Oh, no, we're not made by something or we are." It's just habit I suppose at this point that kind of comes out.

[00:15:03]>> It's part of it. You just don't know how to answer those things. Even though you don't necessarily believe what you used to, but you don't know how to answer where you're at now. You just know that it's not the other stuff.

[00:15:19]Like, is it a confidence issue or is it a >> you legitimately are still a little bit convinced?

[00:15:27]Hm. I Wow. Very very interesting. I I think perhaps it has to do with both because also don't want to, you know, get uh say something that I'm not qualified to say and say something that's not right and then get snowed here by Jay. No, >> that's >> Well, that's where I was at not not that long ago. I mean, it took like me listening to Matt yell about like if you don't if you don't believe in a god, you're an atheist. And I was like, [ __ ] I really am an atheist, aren't I? Um, but also reading a bunch. Like, I had to go >> fill in the gaps of the things I didn't know that obviously much smarter people than me did have answers for. There's a lot we don't know, but there's also a lot that we know. And I was indoctrinated. I was homeschooled using a Christian curriculum. I did not understand the basics of pretty much anything. So, I would just encourage you to go read a lot more or if you do better with watching videos. I know Erica and Forest have incredible videos on specifically debunking creationism and all of that and talking about evolution. So, I don't know. I think I think it's great that you're thinking about all of this and that you're willing to question this and that you're wanting to have conversation and I think you should keep it up and go start with the things where you're like, "Oh man, if somebody asked me that like I don't have an answer for that." And then go see what kind of answers you can find.

[00:16:49]Yeah. Well, yeah, that that's true.

[00:16:52]That's kind of where, yeah, I'm trying to go through and sometimes it's not comfortable, but you know, it doesn't have to be comfortable, I guess. Uh, and uh, yeah, I do remember hearing some of Matt's opinions on that, too, and ideas.

[00:17:07]But yeah, that's that's true that we're uncomfortable with not knowing, with accepting that to say I don't know because we want to have the answer, right? We want to sound important.

[00:17:17]Yeah, for sure. And and religion offers us this lie that we know everything suddenly. It gives us this certainty or a sensation of certainty anyways when we don't actually have certainty about those things. It's just stories that we've made up um that don't line up with reality. So, they're not even helpful at all other than giving us that comforting feeling. Well, I know I know that I'm going somewhere when I die or I know where we all came from or I know my purpose in life. So, it's kind of like being a teenager all over again and having to start from scratch. But, um, but again, >> magas keep rage quitting when as soon as they hit the screener.

[00:17:56]>> Yeah. Why won't they even call in?

[00:17:58]Sorry, Jay.

[00:17:59]>> Maybe maybe what's your name has become too offensive a question. Like, no, just put me right on air. I don't know. I don't know what's going on. They're having a time over there.

[00:18:08]>> MAGA Christians, there's a little bit of time left, but not a lot. There's like 25 minutes left. Phone number's right up there. 3365432101.

[00:18:15]If you think that MAGA or Christianity is better for women than the alternatives, you should call in.

[00:18:21]>> Yeah, I guess not. It's not better. Um or Mexicans always get across and Trump is an idiot.

[00:18:32]He's a dumb stupid moronic idiot.

[00:18:36]>> That's true.

[00:18:36]>> Goodness gracious.

[00:18:38]>> All right. Well, thank you, Jay.

[00:18:39]>> Yeah. Wow. Hey, thanks a lot, guys.

[00:18:41]Really appreciate it. Very, very helpful. Very knowledgeable. Thank you.

[00:18:45]>> Yep.

[00:18:46]>> Of course.

[00:18:47]>> Bye, Jay.