Ep. 1437 - AMoL Ch. 34: Drifting

Added: 2026-06-03

[00:00:00]This is The Wheel Weeaves, a Wheel of Time podcast with no spoilers.

[00:00:05]Hey everyone, I'm your host Danny and I'm the first-time reader going through this series chapter by chapter. As always, there's no spoilers past the chapter we're covering and that means it's totally safe for firsttime readers.

[00:00:15]I'm joined by my co-host Brett who's a longtime fan and he's guiding me on this journey. We'd like to thank and acknowledge our executive producers, Brandy [music] Ner Kirkwood, Giannis, Shawn Magcguire, LightBinded Pool, Big C, Davis Ferrer, Greenman, Bennett Williamson, Hannah Green, Nuralia, Helena Jacobson, Matthew Mendoza, Sims, Cindy, Manin, Andrew Scar, Pony, Mr. Bod's Body, David, and Honey Bunches of Jason. And before we get into things today, we have some people to thank and acknowledge for renewing their annual pledge at patreon.com/thewheelweavesodcast for a whole another year. So, thank you so much for your ongoing and continued support to Rory Wheart, Lisa Lennox, Sandeep, Sari, and Death's Little Helper. Again, thank you so so so much. We really truly appreciate it. In this episode, we are talking about chapter 34 of A Memory of Light.

[00:01:11]>> Yeah. Chapter 34 is drifting.

[00:01:14]>> Uhhuh.

[00:01:15]>> Yeah. We get a lot of perspectives in this one.

[00:01:17]>> Yeah. Flip-flopping all around.

[00:01:19]>> Yeah. And I don't know how you feel about this, but like it doesn't I don't know if it feels as good as the other chapters that we've come off of. Like things aren't going super great for everybody. It >> Yeah. Yep.

[00:01:31]>> Yeah. So, think about that. Think about >> true statement. You're right about that.

[00:01:36]>> Okay.

[00:01:37]>> And I have some thoughts, obviously.

[00:01:40][laughter] >> Okay. We should hope.

[00:01:42]>> Mhm.

[00:01:43]>> All right. So, I'm going to jump into the fun fact here because we get something that we've heard before, but I did a little bit of digging into the roots of the word. So, >> which word?

[00:01:54]>> Adversary. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So, Rand is facing off against the dark one. Like, it seems for real for real. Like, >> metaphorically speaking.

[00:02:03]>> Metaphysically speaking. Whoa. Okay.

[00:02:05]>> Like in the, you know, >> metaphysical world.

[00:02:08]>> Sure. Yeah. A lot of it we just going to go with it. But we've heard the dark one call Rand adversary before.

[00:02:16]>> Ooh. Isn't that just like someone you're against?

[00:02:19]>> Yeah. But there's also a lot of biblical connotations to the word adversary. So I'm going to go over a couple things here. So the whole creator versus the dark one thing, the light versus the shadow, good versus evil, and Ran versus Shyan, right? for Satan. A lot of biblical stuff going on there. But the word itself also is seen in the Bible.

[00:02:40]So in the Bible, an adversary is an opponent or an enemy. It can be someone or something that stands in the way of God's will. And it can have both human and spiritual meaning. But ultimately in the Old Testament, adversary translates most frequently from the Hebrew word meaning Satan. So in scripture, Satan is like the adversary. Okay.

[00:03:04]>> And then in the New Testament, the most prominent use of the term adversary is to describe the devil. And then you also have Jesus describing the spiritual adversary as the father of lies whose goal is to divide and destroy. So obviously a lot of similarities.

[00:03:18]>> Okay. But in this case, the dark one, >> the dark one is calling Rand the devil. Exactly. Is calling Rand the adversary. So it's a nice little flip-flop.

[00:03:29]>> Is it nice? Is that nice?

[00:03:30]>> I mean, I think it's pretty It's pretty [laughter] cool. It's the wheel of time and Robert Jordan was a genius.

[00:03:36]>> Yeah. A lot of really well I mean it's like the last battle. Tarman Giden which is Armageddon. We have Shyan which is Satan calling Rand adversary. Like that's that's pretty cool.

[00:03:46]>> Okay.

[00:03:47]>> Yeah. So here we go. We jump right into the conflict between the two of them.

[00:03:52]>> Right. And it made me go, >> "Oh, right."

[00:03:55]>> Cuz like so much is happening. Every time >> we have a chapter and then we jump perspectives. I immediately forget what was just happening >> and I'm [clears throat] now focused on what is happening with this person or this character. Yeah.

[00:04:09]>> And so we jump back in with Rand and I was like, "Oh, right. Swallowed by darkness."

[00:04:14]>> Yeah. Touch the dark stuff. And don't touch the swookie. And then he touched it. Shoot. Who could have seen that coming?

[00:04:21]>> Right.

[00:04:22]>> Morraine probably because she's seen >> and she was like, "Don't touch it." But he had to touch it. That's >> And Morraine has seen a lot of things.

[00:04:30]>> That's true. and a lot of different versions of the future. So, >> well, she's also seen a lot of versions of like spooky darkness that you probably shouldn't touch.

[00:04:38]>> Yeah. But maybe she knows that if she doesn't tell Rand, "Don't touch it, then he won't."

[00:04:45]>> Yeah.

[00:04:46]>> You know, one of those reverse psychology wants him to touch it. So, yeah. She knows the outcome.

[00:04:52]>> Right. Right.

[00:04:53]>> Perhaps >> he's the he does the opposite. He's one of those guys >> obviously. Yeah. Like what he does to Elaine. Yeah.

[00:05:00]>> When he's like, "Uh, you know, you really shouldn't come here."

[00:05:03]>> Yeah.

[00:05:03]>> And then she's like, "Well, of course I'm coming."

[00:05:05]>> Yeah.

[00:05:06]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:05:07]>> Uh, now we skip the chapter symbol.

[00:05:09]>> Oh, yeah. Yep.

[00:05:10]>> Moon and Stars.

[00:05:11]>> Yeah.

[00:05:12]>> For Lanir ditching Paris.

[00:05:14]>> We really got to talk about that.

[00:05:16]>> We'll talk about it when we get there.

[00:05:17]>> I'm confused.

[00:05:18]>> Well, I mean, it's Lanir. [laughter] Like, you know, >> I Yeah, I just >> She's been hurt by a man before and she's not going to be hurt again. We're jumping ahead. It's not even the Landfare one. Talk about rampers perspective.

[00:05:29]>> Oh man. Okay.

[00:05:30]>> So, he's in the spooky darkness.

[00:05:32]>> Well, the place that is not.

[00:05:34]>> Yep.

[00:05:34]>> Yeah.

[00:05:34]>> That's what I just said.

[00:05:35]>> Yeah.

[00:05:36]>> So, it's outside of time and reality and the pattern itself. And he can like see the pattern.

[00:05:43]>> Yeah. Yeah. So, this is where it's like we're going to get, >> you know what I'm picturing?

[00:05:46]>> What?

[00:05:46]>> Dumbo.

[00:05:47]>> Like the trippy like the acid >> trippy Dumbo scene. Yeah. that's like folds in on itself and then there's like neon >> the nightmare part of the kids movie.

[00:05:58]>> That's the one >> when you're like the original.

[00:06:00]>> Yes.

[00:06:00]>> Yeah. Animated terrifying.

[00:06:03]>> Yeah.

[00:06:03]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:06:04]>> That one >> that seems spookier >> than this >> honestly. Yeah.

[00:06:09]>> Oh, >> like if I had the >> I picture this is pretty spooky.

[00:06:12]>> Well, no, but he can see like the thousands and thousands of twisting ribbons of light that are people and he can see like the past, present, future.

[00:06:17]He can see all realities. You can see every possible outcome of everything.

[00:06:21]>> How about this mirror room at Touch the Universe.

[00:06:25]>> Yeah. Cool little reference there >> with the like >> No one's going to get that >> lasers in the mirror room.

[00:06:32]>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like Okay. Like kids museum where they have like the cool sign stuff you can interact with because nobody else knows what touch the universe is.

[00:06:38]>> Except that we've already talked about it on this podcast before [laughter] >> specifically. Okay. Okay. So, I want to talk about this though because yes, we get super metaphysical or whatever you want to call it. And even Rand is like, "This isn't the pattern that I'm seeing.

[00:06:53]It's just like what my brain can interpret as or is interpreting as the pattern." Like, it's pretty cool.

[00:06:59]>> Rand is so philosophical.

[00:07:00]>> He's super philosophical. But here's the thing that I want to talk about that's philosophical. So, for a long time, we've heard the dark one as being outside the pattern. And then we've also even the fact that the pattern is described as the pattern with the weaving of the threads of of lives. But Ran thinking that his mind is interpreting it like that. My question is like is this like a chicken and egg situation even though we know they came first? That's not the point. But it's like which came first. Did we describe the dark one as outside the pattern and the pattern as the pattern because someone got the experience of this and then was able to tell other people about it? You know what I mean? Well, like which which came first >> in this scenario? Or is it like because Rand's heard these things before, his mind is therefore putting it into a context that he understands because this is what he can connect it to?

[00:07:53]>> Mhm.

[00:07:54]>> Yeah. Right. Okay.

[00:07:56]>> Uh-huh. Super cool.

[00:07:59]>> Yes. [laughter] >> It wasn't a yes or no question, but that's okay.

[00:08:03]>> You said, "Is this rand?"

[00:08:06]>> Yeah. "Is it this or is it that?" And you said, "Yes."

[00:08:09]>> Yeah. It's not a yes or no question.

[00:08:11]>> A bunch of that.

[00:08:12]>> Yeah.

[00:08:13]>> And I didn't think as hard about it as >> That's true.

[00:08:17]>> You did.

[00:08:18]>> Give it time. Give it time. Let it Let it soak. Let it digest for a little while. I think what I'm going to do after we have our chat, before I read the next chapter, I'm going to reread this chapter after like this conversation cuz I think that'll help me kind of cuz I really it went over my head. Sure.

[00:08:36]>> I'm not going to lie.

[00:08:37]>> Yeah.

[00:08:37]>> Okay.

[00:08:38]>> Well, and under and through because like he he is looking at the pattern, but it's like that's not the pattern. That's just like his mind's interpretation of the pattern of what he can put into the context for this battle versus the dark one.

[00:08:49]>> I heard you say that >> the dark one is outside the pattern.

[00:08:51]Yeah, you saw that already.

[00:08:52]>> But it's like why? I got to keep saying it. You got to say it again and again until you get it.

[00:08:56]>> You just got to repeat yourself over and over again.

[00:08:58]>> That's the everyone knows in the wheel of time.

[00:09:00]>> And maybe one day I'll understand how fairies work.

[00:09:05][laughter] >> You know what? No, probably not.

[00:09:08]>> Same with this. Okay, so now Rand is going to have a nice conversation.

[00:09:13]>> Yeah.

[00:09:14]>> With the dark one.

[00:09:14]>> Well, he's like, "Hey, >> let's chat, bro."

[00:09:16]>> Morid Moridan said that this was just a sword fight and it's not. I think this isn't just a sword fight. I think that that was stupid.

[00:09:24]>> Yeah. Well, >> and Dark One's like, "Yeah, Mortyn's stupid, >> but he got you here, so that's good."

[00:09:30]But what I was going to say is I want to see a version of it where it is Rand versus Mortyn. I don't know if this is just because we just like recently watched Troy with the whole like Achilles opening scene with Brad Pitt where he kills that dude at the beginning.

[00:09:43]>> Yeah.

[00:09:43]>> And it's like, oh, you know, one v one, Mortyn versus Ren. Whoever wins takes it all, right? We should have one of those, too.

[00:09:50]>> But what if Ron doesn't win?

[00:09:52]>> Well, he has to. That's the point. Oh, I see. That's the point of that fight.

[00:09:56]>> Mhm.

[00:09:56]>> Anyway, so yeah, wasn't a sword fight.

[00:09:58]That was just a delay tactic. And then Dark One's like, "Yeah, let's do this battle thing here."

[00:10:03]>> Okay, so this is for real Z's because that tool is a tool.

[00:10:09]>> Was a tool and now you're here. So here's the thing, too.

[00:10:12]>> A tool is a tool.

[00:10:15]Rand also thinks in this moment none of this had happened last time when he was LTT. So in his previous encounter with >> So he's like hm this must be good or terrible.

[00:10:25]>> Yeah. Yeah. Well >> I mean it's different.

[00:10:27]>> It's different. It's not what happened last time. And we don't want a repeat of what happened last time. So it's probably >> also hasn't happened in any of those portal stone flicker flickers things you saw.

[00:10:39]>> Yeah. That that we know of. Yeah.

[00:10:41]Exactly. So, and we can't I can't 100% speak to that because we don't know all the iterations of what he saw, >> but >> probably >> safe to say what is happening now >> is new >> is new and what should be happening hopefully.

[00:10:53]>> Okay.

[00:10:54]>> Yeah.

[00:10:55]>> Well, I guess we'll read and find out.

[00:10:57]>> Yeah.

[00:10:58]>> Because this whole thing >> Dark One throws all of his force against Rand and then it's like boom. Okay.

[00:11:03]Scene end.

[00:11:04]>> Okay.

[00:11:05]>> Yeah.

[00:11:06]>> And moving on.

[00:11:06]>> Yeah. Well, we have to.

[00:11:08]>> And then when we come back to this, I'll be like, "Oh, right. Well, keep in mind keep in mind that with the time dilation here, like a little bit of time for Rand is a long time for everybody else. So, we need a lot more of everybody else for the itty bitty teeny bit of Rand that we get.

[00:11:21]>> Okay.

[00:11:22]>> Right.

[00:11:23]>> Especially right now for Rand because I don't know if time actually >> he's outside the pattern sort of >> moves at all.

[00:11:29]>> Yeah. Well, he has that whole thing where it's like, oh, time doesn't mean anything. Oh, no. But I focused in and I attached myself to the pattern. I wonder if there was ever like a talent of sorts for like seeing the outside of the pattern.

[00:11:42]>> Maybe >> like this almost feels dreamworldy.

[00:11:46]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:11:47]>> It feels almost like the pin pricks of lights where you can see everyone's dreams. Yeah.

[00:11:52]>> But then it also is a variation of what Min does. Yeah. And what Min sees.

[00:11:58]>> For sure. Yeah. And so >> where she can like read the pattern and see what's going to happen, >> right? And she just gets these little viewings. Yeah. But in the past past past >> Mhm.

[00:12:07]>> potentially we had people who had the ability to like see the threads in this >> the threads are fake. Yeah, for sure.

[00:12:14]That's cool. I like that.

[00:12:16]>> Okay.

[00:12:16]>> I mean, we got >> because you're like if somebody saw this before and then was able to pass this down, >> but it's like why why do we say the dark one is outside the pattern and that the pattern is the pattern? It's like well because maybe we saw it as such and are describing it or is it like that's what we describe it as so that's how you see it. Which comes first? I don't know.

[00:12:34]>> But because of the whole time is a wheel thing, didn't this already happen before?

[00:12:38]>> Exactly. [laughter] >> Great.

[00:12:42]>> Now you get it. Now you're getting it.

[00:12:44]>> Good.

[00:12:44]>> Right. Okay. [laughter] >> Well, that's the end of this perspective.

[00:12:48]>> Yeah, that is. Now we got to get on to the next one, which is also really good because I have a lot of things to say about Lanfir here. We got to talk about her and Pin. Pin and Lanfir. What's going on? Okay, go.

[00:12:59]>> Okay, perspective change to Parin. He's having a real bad time.

[00:13:03]>> Yeah.

[00:13:04]>> We are still in the dream world.

[00:13:07]>> We just had a fight with Slayer.

[00:13:09]>> Yes. Yep.

[00:13:10]>> And we got an arrow in the shoulder because he messed up first.

[00:13:14]>> Yes. He didn't pay attention properly.

[00:13:16]The water freaked him out or whatever.

[00:13:18]>> Bunch of stuff. And he's like exhausted cuz it's probably been like weeks or something and he hasn't slept.

[00:13:24]>> Exactly. Yeah. So bad shape because he got the arrow through the shoulder. He's like actively bleeding out >> and his brain isn't functioning well enough to like imagine that he's not bleeding out >> and he's doing the thing that almost like Tam did with the whole fever dream where he's like thinking about stuff from the past because he's like oh something something about Two Rivers and Fil just got to get there and it's like that's not today man not even close.

[00:13:45][laughter] >> So like this is bad because he he's not in a good enough position mentally to will himself to be better and it's just going to deteriorate here. Like this is really this is really bad.

[00:13:57]>> Okay.

[00:13:57]>> So he shifts himself away really far.

[00:13:59]>> Like really far.

[00:14:01]>> I was going to ask you >> like out of this plane.

[00:14:04]>> Out of this plane of like existence.

[00:14:07]>> Like >> he got on a spaceship and went to where the O' Gear are from.

[00:14:10]>> Well, [laughter] no. I mean because we also saw some like snake like people and we were thinking worlds were crossing over, >> right? And so like a portal stone world because here he reaches out to the wolves and the wolves are like what the [ __ ] >> What are like they never even heard of a wolf brother.

[00:14:29]>> Never heard of a wolf brother. So this is not a regular this is not the place.

[00:14:34]>> Well and they're crazy trees.

[00:14:35]>> This is not the same place.

[00:14:36]>> Okay. Yeah. I was going to ask too because it's like it seems like it might just be I don't know like palm trees is it's on a beach somewhere cuz I think it's described as the trees are odd shaped on the top and too leafy and I just imagine palm trees.

[00:14:48]>> Oh they're palm trees. So it's like are you just on a beach somewhere or something?

[00:14:51]>> Oh, is it like Shanchchan land?

[00:14:53]>> But no, but like I'm pretty sure that wolves would be able to wolf each other out across Shan Land and Rand. It's not that far.

[00:15:00]>> Kind of like Grom world.

[00:15:01]>> Yeah. Like is this some sort of alternate total? Like where the hell did Pin go?

[00:15:05]>> He Yeah, he flipped out.

[00:15:07]>> He He's gone. He's gone because then Lanir comes in cuz after the whole wolf thing, he's like where I need help and they're like what the hell are you? Then Landfir shows up and she's like, "Oh, so that's where you went. Here you are."

[00:15:20]>> Yeah.

[00:15:20]>> Yeah. So like, "Where are you, man? Not here today." I don't know. It's crazy.

[00:15:25]>> Yeah. She's super disappointed. She's like, "I can't believe you let that guy be >> I'm not even mad. I'm disappointed."

[00:15:31]>> And you know what's not hot?

[00:15:33]>> Be losing to Slayer.

[00:15:35]>> Yeah.

[00:15:36]>> Not hot.

[00:15:36]>> Just this guy who's like the most competent killer in the universe and you lost to him.

[00:15:41]>> What is Why, Lanir? Okay.

[00:15:43]>> And you know what? I really thought maybe there could be a future here, but turns out you're not my perfect match.

[00:15:48]>> I've been hurt before and I'm not going to be hurt again. Okay, but we got a couple things to talk about this. So, she pops in. Pin is like delirious from blood loss >> and also not sleeping and not sleeping.

[00:15:59]Yeah. And and and and >> yeah, so a lot of things are going wrong with >> being here in the flesh like I bet there's a lot that's happening.

[00:16:05]>> A few things. Yeah. And he doesn't even know like in his because this is parents perspective. He's concerned about what Lanir thinks with the disappointment, but he's like, "When did that happen?

[00:16:16]>> Why do I care?

[00:16:17]>> Why do I care about that?" But it's also like, "Well, maybe because she's the only person who can possibly save you right now. Maybe because you are injured and almost >> cuz I was like, "Oh, good. At least she's here. She'll help him." And then she just [ __ ] doesn't.

[00:16:29]>> Nah. [laughter] Yeah. So, cuz he almost pleads with her like, "Help me, please, cuz I'm dying." And >> And she's like, "Yuck."

[00:16:37]>> Yeah.

[00:16:38]>> Yeah. No.

[00:16:40]You are >> now a couple things that she says is disappointing. I didn't want to have to choose that one. I find you much more appealing, Wolf.

[00:16:52]>> No, like that. But that's the question.

[00:16:54]It's like, I didn't want to have to choose that one. I find you much more appealing, Wolf. Is she talking about having to choose Slayer because like was it a Slayer versus >> parent or is it like a I have to go after Matt or like what is the what's the context here? What does Lanfair want?

[00:17:11]>> I don't know. I think maybe >> Okay, >> this is a test for Pin to see if he can actually get himself out of this somehow.

[00:17:21]>> Okay.

[00:17:21]>> And she's going to like wait around.

[00:17:23]>> Yeah.

[00:17:23]>> Or maybe she's going to go after Matt.

[00:17:26]>> Like she's just like watching from around the corner to see if he actually kicked himself in the butt to save himself or >> Well, I'm questioning my own thoughts now.

[00:17:33]>> Okay.

[00:17:33]>> About this whole being in another world.

[00:17:36]Just the wolf thing was weird. The wolf thing is for sure weird and >> and then Lanir being like here you are.

[00:17:42]>> Yeah, >> it seems like >> or is there like another continent we don't even know of that there are wolves but like >> potentially >> potentially why not?

[00:17:51]>> It makes more it makes more sense that everything's kind of overlapping right now, right?

[00:17:56]>> And he's just flustered and tired and dying and just thought away and he did but like no idea where.

[00:18:04]>> Yeah. like different parallel universe because kind of for sure like that makes sense too.

[00:18:09]>> So anyway, I guess we'll see what Lanir is gonna be up to. But now that Lanir's gone, Pin's like, "Ah, no. I need to reach Fil." [laughter] >> Yeah. Where is she again?

[00:18:19]>> Where is she again? Oh, at the field of Maril. Good. That's where I left her.

[00:18:25]And that's where she'll be.

[00:18:26]>> Uhoh.

[00:18:27]>> And then somehow he gets enough strength to shift there.

[00:18:31]>> Yeah. which kind of seems like it could be a landfare test because now that she's abandoned him in quotes, right, he has to actually do something to save himself. So then he musters up the strength to shift himself there. Like I can see that as a landfare test.

[00:18:44]>> Yeah. Also, the portal that Rand was supposed to be sending.

[00:18:49]>> Yeah.

[00:18:49]>> Is But everything is so messed up now.

[00:18:52]>> Yeah.

[00:18:53]>> We don't even know what time it is or what day it is >> anywhere.

[00:18:57]>> Yep. Yeah. There's a lot of problems like he is losing blood and his brain doesn't work very well.

[00:19:02]>> But this is the last how I feel that this whole parin passing out thing and fading into darkness and it I think that it's a fake out and I'm supposed to think that parin has died.

[00:19:15]>> Oh, okay.

[00:19:16]>> And I don't think so.

[00:19:18]>> You don't think he's dead? Okay. Yeah.

[00:19:20]>> I mean, even the way he leaves it. Okay.

[00:19:22]So, let's talk about this. So, he does manage to shift himself. He thinks files here, but she he's not going to be in the wolf dream. So, like, yeah, that is a thing, man. And also, she's not here today. And the portal is not going to open up probably because the timing is not going to make sense. Now, he collapses. And as he's passing out, he thinks, "At least I was there for Rand."

[00:19:40]And the wolves will have to keep Rand safe now.

[00:19:43]>> Yeah. So, >> and then he like fades into blackness.

[00:19:46]And I for sure thought, >> Yeah.

[00:19:48]>> My first thought was like, "Oh [ __ ] is he dead?" And then I was like, "Ah, this feels like I should think he's dead."

[00:19:57]And it feels like a fake out.

[00:19:58]>> So, how are we getting out of this?

[00:20:00]Like, what are your thoughts on this?

[00:20:01]>> Oh, I think well, getting out of it, >> what are the options?

[00:20:04]>> If he's not dead, >> if he's not dead, then he's in at the field of Maril unconscious, almost dead and dying actively, >> right?

[00:20:13]>> In the wolf dream where no one knows where he is or can find him except for probably Lanir. Like Lanfeir >> maybe Gaul could.

[00:20:20]>> Okay. Okay. Like find him and then >> or Elias. Elias also could.

[00:20:24]>> And then what? Elias has already showed up and kind of saved him once. Is that going to happen again? Maybe.

[00:20:29]>> And then like but like getting to Parin.

[00:20:31]Yeah.

[00:20:31]>> To do what to save him at this point.

[00:20:34]Like we are pretty far down the how do we save paran ladder of like things to do like healing capital H I said I like power healing. Yeah. Is it is the best option? But >> and >> if it ain't Lfere who is it?

[00:20:49]>> Yep.

[00:20:49]>> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah.

[00:20:51]>> Right now >> Yeah. I'm thinking the gateway will open.

[00:20:55]>> That would be convenient.

[00:20:56]>> And then they're like, "Oh my god, parents there.

[00:20:58]>> What are you doing there?"

[00:20:58]>> But then it's like, "Where's Gaul?"

[00:21:00]>> Right.

[00:21:00]>> But then can G back here by himself somehow? He's like sort of been able to >> Yeah. Go can like shift around, but like at the exact moment when the portal is going to be here.

[00:21:08]>> No, but he might get there.

[00:21:10]>> Yeah. Well, all Pin really needs is like some little bit of healing and some food and then he'll probably be good.

[00:21:14]>> Unless he's dead.

[00:21:15]>> Unless he's dead. But >> cuz honestly, if it is dead, this is like a pretty good death.

[00:21:20]>> Really?

[00:21:20]>> Yeah. losing to Slayer like that and then Land of Fear ditching here [laughter] >> kind of.

[00:21:26]>> It's true.

[00:21:27]>> At least I was there for Rand. He was >> He was He did do that.

[00:21:30]>> He did his job.

[00:21:31]>> Yeah.

[00:21:32]>> Cuz the whole thing since like I don't know book freaking three.

[00:21:36]>> Yeah.

[00:21:37]>> Parents been like Rand needs me.

[00:21:39]>> He does go to Rand.

[00:21:41]>> Yeah.

[00:21:41]>> And here he was like I need to go to Rand. I need to go to Rand.

[00:21:44]>> Did it.

[00:21:45]>> He did it. He went to Rand and he saved him.

[00:21:47]>> Yeah. I get that. You've just been waiting for parent to die though.

[00:21:50]though. Your opinion's tainted.

[00:21:52]>> Is it >> a little bit?

[00:21:53]>> I don't actually want him to be dead here. I don't want anyone to die. I like our characters.

[00:21:58]>> You can't even say that with a straight face. [laughter] >> Okay.

[00:22:04]>> Biggest smile on your face. I want everyone to live. [laughter] >> Oh man. Okay.

[00:22:11]>> Obviously, it's better if he doesn't die, but I'm just getting a little concerned. [laughter] No, my concern here is we're in the last battle.

[00:22:20]>> Yeah.

[00:22:21]>> And in terms of people we've lost, like we're more than halfway through this book. I thought there would be more shocking ends.

[00:22:29]>> Okay. You want them to die at the beginning of the last battle when we're not even >> Well, no. Some like some people >> Yeah.

[00:22:35]>> You know, >> right?

[00:22:36]>> Um >> so when you >> I was just >> So two minutes ago when you're like I don't want anybody to die. That was a lie.

[00:22:42]>> No, it's not that [laughter] I don't Okay. I don't want anyone to die.

[00:22:45]>> Yeah. I was expecting people to die and be mad about it.

[00:22:49]>> Right. Okay. Okay.

[00:22:51]>> So, it seems weird to me that we're already at this point in this book and we have so many of our main characters, almost all of them.

[00:23:00]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:23:01]>> Who are still here and alive.

[00:23:03]>> Give it time.

[00:23:04]>> Honestly. Yeah. I just feel like other series have wrecked me, traumatized me.

[00:23:12]Yeah.

[00:23:13]>> into thinking that just like all my favorite characters are all about to die.

[00:23:16]>> Yeah. Yep. That's fair.

[00:23:18]>> Because other authors seem to really like killing off our favorite characters.

[00:23:24]>> I mean, yeah, sometimes some shows, but also a lot of shows don't. A lot of shows keep your main characters around.

[00:23:29]Yeah.

[00:23:29]>> Not just shows.

[00:23:30]>> Yeah. Yeah. It's all the same thing. All it's all the same. main character is a main character because you're gonna follow them and their story.

[00:23:36]>> But it's possible I'm just traumatized.

[00:23:38]>> Yeah.

[00:23:39]>> And I'm just expecting I'm like when >> Okay.

[00:23:41]>> It's not interesting unless someone's dying.

[00:23:43]>> You're the worst. Okay, let's continue.

[00:23:45]We got two more perspectives still. And Parn is out.

[00:23:49]>> I really thought he was dead. [laughter] And the way you're reacting makes me think that he's like definitely not dead.

[00:23:55]>> Well, your whole thing is literally like it has to be like a visible on-screen death. Like it was it was a fade to black.

[00:24:02]>> This is the same death as like a Pedron Nile perspective. Yes, >> because that was explicit like as he dies he thinks this >> sort of but he was like basically were in his perspective and it fa and he like fades to black.

[00:24:16]>> But like the la with Pedra Nile too that was more like a and the last thing he thought was >> No, it's from his brain.

[00:24:24]>> I don't know. I just didn't feel as >> No, it was his perspective.

[00:24:27]>> Doesn't feel as severe.

[00:24:28]>> I don't know why you're throwing me off.

[00:24:29]So, it's like weird.

[00:24:30]>> Yeah. Well, you're going to be real annoyed when he just never shows back up again in this. It's like parents gone, man.

[00:24:36]>> I was going to say, >> and then it won't be like a proper goodbye right now. So, that's going to be even worse.

[00:24:40]>> That actually tracks. It fits.

[00:24:42]>> Uh-huh. Yep. It does.

[00:24:44]>> I'm fine with that. [laughter] >> I don't know what you want.

[00:24:47]>> I just don't know if I just don't know if I should be like upset and mourning and being like, "Oh, no."

[00:24:52]>> If Pin actually dies here, I still don't believe if it was like explicit like arrow through the eyeball and he's dead.

[00:24:58]I don't think that you would be sad at all. Like you wouldn't actually mourn the death of parent.

[00:25:04]>> I think that there are very few I would actually that I'm gonna mourn the death.

[00:25:08]>> That's what I mean. Like I don't think it actually matters >> because did you know they're not real?

[00:25:12]>> Uh it's not true.

[00:25:13]>> Okay. [laughter] >> Not true.

[00:25:15]>> I mean like there's upsetting.

[00:25:17]>> Sure. Sure.

[00:25:18]>> Because you want a story to go a certain way. But I think I can >> Can you though? I don't think so.

[00:25:25]>> Decipher between reality and >> I don't know. You just talked about how you're traumatized from other series and like how they ended. It's ruined you.

[00:25:33]>> What are you saying? Like I don't [laughter] know. Are we saying the same?

[00:25:35]>> No, it means no. I'm traumatized in the fact that I'm like, okay, this isn't exciting or interesting. Unless people are unexpectedly dying all over the place, >> right? Yeah. I don't know, man.

[00:25:45]>> Like Red Wedding scene. So, >> yeah. I don't know. Nope.

[00:25:48]>> I don't know what to tell you.

[00:25:49]>> Interesting. Wolves were present at both. Okay. Red Wedding.

[00:25:53]>> Oh, >> right. Whole wolf thing.

[00:25:55]>> Yeah. Well, that's George Martin. Yeah.

[00:25:57]Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

[00:25:59]>> Just take a break. You're annoying me.

[00:26:00]>> Yeah. I [laughter] don't know what you want from me.

[00:26:04]>> Okay. So, we are back.

[00:26:06]>> Mhm.

[00:26:06]>> And we are perspective changing as per Yuge now.

[00:26:11]>> Yeah. Back on track.

[00:26:12]>> Fil after Pin.

[00:26:13]>> There we go. Twice and twice in a row.

[00:26:15]>> So, if we thought Pin wasn't having a good time.

[00:26:19]>> Oh, yeah. Fel's having a bad time, too.

[00:26:21]>> Also, Fil's having a bad time.

[00:26:23]>> Who is having a worse time? I think Pin because he's like actively dying probably if not dead according to Right.

[00:26:30]>> Yeah.

[00:26:30]>> He chose this mission like for himself a little bit.

[00:26:33]>> Did he though?

[00:26:34]>> He actively went on this mission.

[00:26:36]>> Did he though? Yeah.

[00:26:37]>> Or was it the pattern?

[00:26:38]>> Fil finds herself in the blight.

[00:26:41][laughter] >> Yeah.

[00:26:43]>> Absolutely. In no way, shape, or form did she ever want to be there.

[00:26:47]>> Not true. Not true. Not true.

[00:26:50]>> Why? She is literally a hunter for the horn who set out from home to find the horn of Valier. And here she is at the last battle with the horn of Valier.

[00:26:58]>> Yeah, that's >> that is literally what she set out to do.

[00:27:00]>> Yeah, Alanis Morset would call that ironic.

[00:27:03]>> Yeah. No, that's not ironic.

[00:27:05]>> It's irony.

[00:27:06]>> I don't think so. I think this is what she set out to do.

[00:27:08]>> No, it's irony.

[00:27:09]>> This is like fulfilling the mission, the quest.

[00:27:12]>> Sort of.

[00:27:13]>> Yeah, >> it's a little coincidental but believable. [laughter] Yeah, I was going to say it'd be ironic if like she set out from home because she never wanted anything to do with the hunt for the horn or something and then ended up being married to parin and have to deliver the horn. Like this is this is what every hunter of the horn >> gave up on that cuz the whole hunter of the horn thing was like a stupid ruse cuz she's like I don't know what else to do with my life and I don't like where I am right now.

[00:27:39]>> She never thought she was actually ever going to find the horn.

[00:27:41]>> Every hunter for the horn thinks they're going to find the horn. No, I don't think that Fil was ever a real hunter for the horn.

[00:27:46]>> Oh, boo. She's the only adventure. She's the only real hunter for the horn. She hunted and found the horn. Sort of. Uh, I'm going to regret saying that.

[00:27:56][laughter] Yeah. But anyways, it's fine. She's here. She wants >> Okay, maybe it's not irony, [laughter] but it's definitely something.

[00:28:05]>> It's something.

[00:28:05]>> It is for sure something >> and it's a bad time. Okay. So, we have her, the caravan crew, >> a bunch of them.

[00:28:13]>> There's So, so there's eight wagons that are functional and about a hundred people because we got some of the band guards, which was like 50 or something two.

[00:28:22]>> Yeah. Chao wagon drivers, workers, and then minus two, one person died from like a twig or a stick or something like that. And then another person got some mud on them and the mud dissolved their leg and then also their face. So they have to gag that person so that they didn't attract more attention and the spooky stuff in the blight. So half a day down, two dead. It's not going well.

[00:28:44]>> Okay. So we need a plan to survive.

[00:28:46]>> Yes.

[00:28:46]>> Because this is bad.

[00:28:48]>> Yeah.

[00:28:49]>> And I'd like to remind the audience that last time we were here, I specifically said she should just go find Avianda at Backendar.

[00:29:00]>> Yeah.

[00:29:00]>> So >> yeah, that's true. You did. Okay.

[00:29:02]>> I said let's go. You did say that.

[00:29:04]>> Let's just go find them.

[00:29:05]>> Yeah, but that was also with your knowledge of the blight being like, "Oh, yeah, Sha Ghoul is probably right over there." It turns out >> it is.

[00:29:11]>> It is. [laughter] >> I was very fortunate. You were right.

[00:29:16]>> I was right.

[00:29:16]>> You were sad.

[00:29:17]>> Yeah, you were right. Okay, I can give you that.

[00:29:19]>> That one. I mean, I thought we'd like land like right there. Like it thought it would be like faster, >> like closer, but it's like it's in the distance. It's like over there.

[00:29:26]>> I was like, "Just go there. There.

[00:29:27]That's where they are."

[00:29:28]>> Here's the thing. Anybody who lives near mountains though, if you're like, "Oh, that mountain in the distance, that [laughter] mountain is so that far away." Like, that mountain is so far away from you.

[00:29:37]>> But it's the only mountain. This isn't like a mountain range.

[00:29:41]>> Doesn't matter if there's only one mountain and you can see it in the distance.

[00:29:44]>> Oh, no. It's the mountains of Oh, no.

[00:29:45]Cuz they're on the other side of the mountains of doom, right?

[00:29:48]>> Yeah. So, it's it's not exactly clear, but like you'd have to probably cross mountains to get south and that's what they talk about. So, like there's mountain ranges and >> Yeah. So, that's worse. That's also the thing about mountain ranges is you can cross through the mountains. Like it's possible. It's just it's dangerous because of all the other spooky stuff in the blight. But that's the thing like sha ghoul. Sure. Yes. It's right over there. However, we got to do some stuff before we talk about that.

[00:30:11]>> Yeah. Let's have a chat about shady eyes doing shady things.

[00:30:15]>> Okay.

[00:30:16]>> We're confused and we all need to talk about it. And I'm actually relatively impressed.

[00:30:21]>> Yeah. I want to see the characters that are here together >> who figure stuff out sort of >> who talk to each other.

[00:30:26]>> Yeah, that's true. That's true.

[00:30:27]>> And actually say things out loud that they're thinking.

[00:30:30]>> Yeah.

[00:30:30]>> To help everyone.

[00:30:31]>> Yeah. To like help the group. So we got a wagon circle. We got the eight wagons in a circle. Bunch of people are trying to sleep. But we've got the core group here. We've got Mandin. We've got Hin from the band. We've got Aravine.

[00:30:43]Remember her? And then Satal and Anela from Chafay. So, we got a couple people in this like core group who are trying to figure out game plan because the first couple hours have gone poorly.

[00:30:55]Yeah.

[00:30:56]>> They have they've gone a short distance to this campsite. They have not gone very far.

[00:31:00]>> No. Cuz they've already lost two people and they're like, "Uh, this is a problem."

[00:31:04]>> Yes. Yeah. [snorts] >> Now, before when we were in Tarvalen and you're like, "And Satell and Anan is here for some reason."

[00:31:12]>> Turns out there's a reason she's here with this group. It's because of all her knowledge and it helps us further the plot. [laughter] >> Yeah. I thought you were gonna say because like she's a dark friend.

[00:31:22]>> No, >> she's a sleeper cell. No.

[00:31:24]>> Well, that's what Fyel thinks about different things like that.

[00:31:26]>> Yep.

[00:31:27]>> In this she's very suspicious of everybody. So, everyone gets everyone gets put on the suspicion list as we go through this chapter. So, she's talking about Berisha's death. So, the Isedai because during the bubble of evil, we pointed it out.

[00:31:40]>> Suspicious death >> got speared through the foot. But none of the people here know enough about gateways to know if that like lapse of concentration from getting speared through the foot would cause Barisha to make a gateway accidentally >> to somewhere else. Yeah.

[00:31:57]>> And Satel goes no >> here to explain to us probably not.

[00:32:02]Probably not. But also maybe like just because you did a training I don't know years a hundred years ago >> and like gateways weren't even reinvented yet when Satalan was >> I'm like yeah you have to do a bunch of crap under like scary pressure.

[00:32:16]>> Yeah. None of the pressure of the eyesight training prepares people for bubbles of evil. No, that was not in the training. I have to say now >> it's like kind of kind of that training that hundred weaves they have to do.

[00:32:27]>> Okay. Yeah. A little bit.

[00:32:29]>> Kind of each one of those scenarios is its own bubble of evil. Okay. You know what? That's a That's fair. That's fair.

[00:32:34]So, >> cuz they're weird.

[00:32:36]>> Yeah. So, now we've got a couple alternatives for Okay. So, if it wasn't, then what does that mean? So, what are the implications here? Was the bubble of evil the thing that corrupt like corrupted the gateway? Did the bubble of evil literally do this? Or was Bisha a dark friend who >> more likely?

[00:32:53]>> But that's the interesting thing that Satella Nan talks about. It's like the bubble of evil and bubbles of evil in general seem to be random. So they point out that if Berisha was a dark friend and intentionally made this gateway to the blight, if there was >> one person would have walked through and been like, "We're at the wrong place."

[00:33:11]>> Wouldn't have even went through because you look through and you're like, "That's not the field of Mealore." So was like, was the bubble of evil necessary for Berisha being a dark friend to open up a gateway to the wrong place? So they all rush through? Like there's a lot of things that have to fall in line there.

[00:33:26]>> Okay, here's my thinking. Okay.

[00:33:29]>> Master plan.

[00:33:30]>> Okay.

[00:33:31]>> Forsaken are doing things.

[00:33:32]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:33:33]>> All kinds of things. And they were told to wrap up their own [ __ ] because they got to get on board with the plan that's happening. And it's all a plan that's happening. Now we have Grandall who's messing with all of the great captains.

[00:33:44]>> Mhm.

[00:33:44]>> Very intentionally. And knows exactly what's going on.

[00:33:48]>> Yeah.

[00:33:48]>> In every camp.

[00:33:50]>> Mhm.

[00:33:50]>> At every turn.

[00:33:51]>> Mhm.

[00:33:52]>> So [clears throat] knowing that Bay is here to deliver the horn of Valier.

[00:33:56]>> Yeah. Let's fake a bubble of evil.

[00:33:59]>> Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[00:34:00]>> And then a forsaken just opens a gateway.

[00:34:02]>> Yeah. Or even if Bersa is a dark friend, it's like, "Hey, we're gonna cause chaos at the exact moment. You open up the gateway." Yeah. Because >> that makes so much more sense than anything else I've even thought of.

[00:34:14]>> Well, it's like literally literally anything we don't understand is labeled as a bubble of evil.

[00:34:19]>> Right.

[00:34:20]>> But that doesn't make it. So, we've actually seen very specifically >> like this wasn't bugs, people turning into like bugs or exploding into bugs or like we've seen >> melting into lava and stuff. Yeah.

[00:34:31]>> But we have seen Forsaken faking bubbles of evil sort of.

[00:34:36]>> Yeah.

[00:34:36]>> In the past.

[00:34:37]>> Yeah, we've seen some crazy stuff.

[00:34:39]>> So, yeah, that actually makes the most sense now that this is actually a forsaken thing.

[00:34:45]>> Yeah.

[00:34:45]>> To disrupt >> Yeah.

[00:34:48]>> the Horn of >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's funny, too, because Aravine's like, "Okay, so was this a trap?" Because if Bisha was a dark friend, like the shadow has to have something better to do than interrupt some random like nothing caravan.

[00:35:02]>> See, I thought that when they were having this get together chat, Vil was actually going to tell them tell them like, "Oh, >> I was actually on board with that though."

[00:35:10]>> Yeah. Like tell everyone so then everyone knows. And but the problem with that is if we have dark friends here, but >> but I feel like if if there's if if everyone knows, then the dark friends have to trick everyone.

[00:35:22]>> Yeah.

[00:35:23]>> Into making me get the the versus just defeating Fil.

[00:35:26]>> Cuz I thought Fil was going to be like, "Okay, well here's the deal."

[00:35:30]>> Yeah.

[00:35:30]>> I think this was dark friend interruption for >> one of you is a dark friend and I have the horn of Valier. Yes. So we have to protect it and then everyone's on guard waiting for someone else to blow the horn of other than Matt >> because now we've been diverted away from Matt with the horn of Valier and we're like moments like we're like in the last battle. We're like this is what's happening >> and in the blight and possibly heading to Shale Ghoul >> which is exactly what's going on now.

[00:35:56]And so all of this is lining up real nice for my own predictions to come true.

[00:36:02]>> Okay. So therefore, [laughter] >> I must, you know, it's kind of scary for them right now, but I'm okay with it.

[00:36:09]>> Yeah. I'm okay with some of you.

[00:36:12][laughter] >> Some of you may die.

[00:36:15]>> Yeah. Okay. Now, now we got to talk about another thing here because Sophia does not tell everyone that she's got the horn of hair and this is a totally normal nothing caravan. But okay, we just got to blow past that because we're not going to tell people. I guess that's fine.

[00:36:31]>> No. Now part of the conversation or at least thoughts in Fil's head are about Parishia and how she actually died. So I pointed out yes spearing through the >> from the stomach though >> it it looks like and what from Fil could tell it looks like she got knifed in the stomach to actually kill her. Now >> if she was a dark friend like why?

[00:36:52]>> Yeah I don't necessarily think she was a dark friend.

[00:36:55]>> I think that probably this was just a forsaken master plan >> like cover your tracks. were just like busting things up out of the ground to >> Yeah, but like someone had to stab her with a knife.

[00:37:05]>> Yeah, I don't know. Greyman or something. Who cares?

[00:37:07]>> Okay. Okay. No, no. The reason I'm asking So, okay. So, >> I don't care.

[00:37:11]>> I get that.

[00:37:13]>> Stabbed Barisha at this moment.

[00:37:15]>> You don't care, but other people should.

[00:37:17]And you should, but you don't. But that's fine. Now, I'm going to talk about this.

[00:37:20]>> I cannot care about every single person who stabbed in this entire book series.

[00:37:25]>> This is not just any person. This is the person who opens up the gateway that leaves them with the horn of air in the blight.

[00:37:29]>> But this is a nothing burger.

[00:37:31]>> Not necessarily. It could be an everything burger. A burger with everything perhaps.

[00:37:36]>> Okay. [laughter] A burger with everything on it. All the fixings. Okay. They talk about how do we get out of this situation because they got no channelers here. They're like, "Okay, so Satellan gives us her advice that hypothetically a few things could line up so that we get rescued. They would have to first realize that file and crew left that they did not go to the field of Marilore. Then they have to like read the residue of the weaves of the gateway >> and not everyone can do that.

[00:38:04]>> Not everyone can do that. And then they have to like recreate a gateway to the exact spot in the blight where they got dropped off >> which means that we can't move.

[00:38:11]>> That we can't move. So it's like technically technically we could be rescued. Yeah. But it makes it even more difficult because if Berisha was alive, she could then and not a dark friend, then she could be like, "Oh, I made a gateway and it took them here, right?"

[00:38:26]So if somebody kills her, then she's dead and then boom, silence.

[00:38:31]>> Yeah.

[00:38:32]>> So all the less likely that they get rescued.

[00:38:34]>> I agree.

[00:38:35]>> Yeah.

[00:38:35]>> Let's go to Shell Ghoul.

[00:38:36]>> Yeah. Let's go.

[00:38:37]>> Let's put the horn of to like Avienda. I think she needs to blow it.

[00:38:40]>> Nice. Okay. Especially cuz she's feeling lonely at the end of next uh perspective. Yeah, >> before we do that, >> something to do.

[00:38:47]>> Before we do that, we got to talk about the two options here. So, they do talk it out. And I appreciate that they talk it out. They're like, "Hey, option one, we travel for probably months."

[00:38:56]>> Yeah.

[00:38:57]>> South through the blight to escape. And Fil thinks we're for sure going to die because not possible. Like, you're not getting through the blight with eight wagons and 100 people for months.

[00:39:08]>> Yeah.

[00:39:08]>> And then Satella Nan is the one who points out Shale Ghoul.

[00:39:13]>> Yeah. Take a look at that over there. So we know uh we know her history being an isedai who is burned out. Yes.

[00:39:20]>> We studied triangel burned out moved to Abu Dar started an inn found someone else to live for.

[00:39:25]>> Now my point that I want to mention is I like how Fil clocks that there's something >> Yeah, she does >> up. Yeah.

[00:39:35]>> However, she gets it wrong at first.

[00:39:37]Yeah.

[00:39:38]>> And I wish I just wish that it stayed wrong.

[00:39:42]>> Oh. and that like Satella had to like tell her or something like the fact that Fila is like oh I get it not that then this yeah that I went no >> well she goes through iterations like oh she must have a sister or something in the tower it's like oh no she must have been tower trained like morgays and then maybe got kicked out yes >> it's like she goes through the different levels of it >> I just I wish that she was so sure >> yeah okay >> about one thing >> Yeah >> like she's kind of piecing things together she kind of understands cuz That's more realistic.

[00:40:14]>> Okay.

[00:40:15]>> Of how people think about other people.

[00:40:17]Like we're constantly making up our own interpretations of what's going on around us.

[00:40:22]>> Yeah. Put them in a box and stay in the box.

[00:40:24]>> Put our perspectives on other people.

[00:40:26]Like we do that all that's what we do as humans. And very rarely I think do we actually get it right.

[00:40:36]>> Yeah. The the thing with Fil here is she does she puts Satal in a box but then puts her in a different box and a different box and a different box. I know.

[00:40:43]>> Usually people put you in a box.

[00:40:45]>> I would just like it if she was like, "Uh-huh, I know now.

[00:40:48]>> Oh, I'm sure it's this." And then it's not and she has to like be like, "Oh, I was wrong." Like I don't know. I just was kind of It's almost too nicely laid out that she figures it out on her own.

[00:41:00]Mhm. But she does now file does run through the thoughts that Satalan is the one that suggests they go to Shell Ghoul. And this would be a really cool sleeper cell situation where it's like you lay and wait hiding out as a burned out eye for decades only to in this last moment here with the horn like hornier to throw everything off and like yeah that would be we do have to watch out for people like that probably that >> should I be more suspicious? I mean, yeah, you should be in general more suspicious because you waver between like I'm suspicious of everybody and then like I'm not suspicious of anybody, including he who killed Barisha. You don't even care.

[00:41:38]>> It was probably a dark friend >> who probably went through the gateway with them. There's probably a dark friend here.

[00:41:43]>> Oh, definitely.

[00:41:44]>> Yeah. So, you should be more worried about this.

[00:41:46]>> Statistically speaking, man, >> the thing is I think that I'm just desensitized.

[00:41:51]>> That's That's Yeah. Okay. That's a problem. That's a problem >> cuz it's like Yep. Here's another one.

[00:41:55]You're going to be so embarrassed when it's Fil who's the dark friend. Wa.

[00:41:58]>> No, that'd be cool.

[00:41:59]>> Sleeper cell for real.

[00:42:00]>> I would love that. I would never have expected [laughter] that. It's actually Basher and his wife actually dark friends and so is Fil this whole time.

[00:42:08]>> And Tinobia. Boom. It all connects.

[00:42:10]>> See, Tenobia, I'm still on. And I don't think she is dead.

[00:42:14]>> That like that was a definitive death.

[00:42:16]>> No, it wasn't. It's as definitive as this parent death.

[00:42:18]>> Oh, [laughter] okay. So, why do you think parents dead if you don't think Tanovia is dead? If it's as definitive, boom, put words right about [laughter] there.

[00:42:27]>> Either Tinobi is dead and the shadow wanted her dead because she's either done something bad as a dark friend, >> right?

[00:42:34]>> Because what's his face whose name I can't say, >> Eglear >> said it's almost like somebody wanted her, >> right, >> in that battle.

[00:42:42]>> Yeah.

[00:42:43]>> Yeah.

[00:42:43]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:42:44]>> Probably cuz she did a bad thing as a Dar friend or something.

[00:42:48]>> Yeah. All right. H bunch of stuff.

[00:42:51]>> Okay. This though, gut feeling, not Satellan.

[00:42:55]>> Okay. Any thoughts of to who it could?

[00:42:57]Cuz we also had the whole thing where she was suspicious of Ganon and stuff.

[00:43:01]Why you keep saying forsake? We don't have enough forsaken to be like >> Yeah, we do 100%. We do. It could be. It literally still could be Grundle.

[00:43:07]>> Yeah, that's true. You jump around.

[00:43:09]>> Yeah, we still have quite a few.

[00:43:11]>> And the horn of a is a pretty big deal.

[00:43:12]I don't if you know this, but uh >> I don't understand why. And like we just talked about, >> you don't understand why the horn of lyric dead heroes.

[00:43:19]>> I don't understand why it's just a big deal for this. [laughter] >> Why hasn't it been a big deal all along?

[00:43:26]And why haven't we used it? We've already had this conversation. So, we don't need to have it again.

[00:43:31]>> Turns out only got two charges on the thing. Use it once at FMA. You only got one more toot. [laughter] >> You got to use it wisely.

[00:43:38]>> Yeah. I didn't know. Okay.

[00:43:40]>> So, that's a thing.

[00:43:41]>> Okay. Um, how and why matter less to me than like what's going to happen next.

[00:43:47]>> Okay. Okay. Okay. All right.

[00:43:49]>> I'm just learning to like go with the flow.

[00:43:52]>> Yeah.

[00:43:52]>> Look at me. I'm so laid-back. That's what people say about me.

[00:43:56]>> As opposed to seven years ago when you were not laidback and now you're so laidback.

[00:44:00]>> Oh my god, I'm so laidback. I am so much more relaxed.

[00:44:03]>> Yeah. Okay. Well, that's the end of Fil's perspective. Like, they're going to go to sleep now. She's going to make a decision in the morning. They they're going to wait one day to see if they get rescued and then they're gonna start moving. So she's gonna think about it.

[00:44:14]What are you thinking? Shall go for sure? Yeah.

[00:44:16]>> Like that's the direction they head.

[00:44:17]>> Oh yes.

[00:44:18]>> Whether or not they actually make it there cuz it's the whole thing.

[00:44:20]>> Make it there.

[00:44:20]>> Okay. All right. Yeah, sure. Why not?

[00:44:22]Just throw >> Well, they make it there cuz otherwise nothing. Then they're lost in the blade forever and they all just die.

[00:44:27]>> Yeah.

[00:44:27]>> No, that's not a thing. [laughter] >> That couldn't possibly be a thing.

[00:44:33]>> That's as anticlimactic as Pin just like dying in the wolf dream by himself. You didn't want that to happen. Oh [laughter] man. Okay. My brain hurts.

[00:44:41]>> Does it?

[00:44:42]>> Yeah.

[00:44:43]>> Okay. All right. Let's >> Yeah. No, of course.

[00:44:45]>> Yeah. Okay. Yeah. For sure. How How do you get past But it's like how do you get Yeah. They're a caravan. They're going to get to Shell Ghoul, which is like surrounded by shadow spawn and actively being attacked.

[00:44:54]>> Yeah. You said that last time, too.

[00:44:56]>> Like, how are they going to get there?

[00:44:57]>> Blow the horn of Alier.

[00:44:59]>> Boom. Fight our way through.

[00:45:00]>> Yes. Maybe it won't be Avianda. Maybe it'll be Fil after all this. THAT'S IRONIC. [laughter] OH MAN. OKAY. OKAY. All right. Let's >> Don't you think >> that? Yeah, [laughter] I do.

[00:45:15]>> I think so. Let's end this perspective.

[00:45:18]>> People are going to come after me and be like, "You have no idea what irony is."

[00:45:22]>> Was that ironic? [laughter] >> I don't know.

[00:45:28]I don't know, man.

[00:45:29]>> Okay. Okay. One more perspective. Let's go over to Avienda, who's also having >> a hard time. a hard [laughter] a bad time.

[00:45:37]>> This is real interesting though. Like this. It kept me in it and I like the flipping flopping because it makes me feel like lots is happening even though I only get one chapter.

[00:45:45]>> Yeah. Yeah. You're welcome.

[00:45:47]>> I like that.

[00:45:47]>> You're welcome.

[00:45:48]>> Now, did you say you're welcome?

[00:45:50]>> Yeah, I did. Yeah. Is that ironic?

[00:45:52]>> Who are you?

[00:45:53]>> No. [laughter] Okay.

[00:45:54]>> Dwayne Johnson.

[00:45:55]>> Oh, nice. Okay. Moana.

[00:45:57]>> Yeah, it's Moana.

[00:45:58]>> Yeah. Okay.

[00:45:59]>> Okay. Avienda. Now we're back at Chail Ghoul with Avienda. She's in the middle of examining some of the bodies of the red veils because we've had a whole bunch of stuff happen since she was attacked by those red veils and then Cadway saved her and it was the whole thing.

[00:46:12]>> Yeah. Basically, there's been like an attack from last night to all through the day and again this night. So, like >> Oh, that's so much.

[00:46:19]>> And there's a it's Yeah. I mean, it's it's the last battle, so we're using all of our resources to attack the bad guys and the good guys.

[00:46:26]>> You mean the bad guys are using their resources, too?

[00:46:30]>> Yeah. Everyone's using all their resources. is the last battle.

[00:46:33]>> It's the last battle.

[00:46:33]>> Okay.

[00:46:34]>> Okay. Now, where Avienda is here, she's examining these bodies.

[00:46:40]>> Yeah.

[00:46:40]>> And she recognizes one of the guys from like her childhood.

[00:46:44]>> Yeah. Like she remembers this guy as someone who ran off into the sunset to spit in sight blinders eye as you do when you're a male ail who can channel.

[00:46:53]That's what you do.

[00:46:54]>> And she was like young, like 13 or 12 something. So >> yeah. And like she's on patrol with a couple other people. We got Flynn and then three eyesed eye.

[00:47:03]>> Okay. And now they are taking turns being part of circles.

[00:47:08]>> Yeah. Like we get a description of how this defense has evolved because you can't drain people all the way because it takes longer to recover. So we're just like doing things in shifts and resting because Yeah. It's a long long thing, >> right? Okay. So the trolics have been pushing further into the defenses of the where they are. What is this? Where are they?

[00:47:27]>> Yeah. Valley backend. Nothing's changed.

[00:47:29]We're still like one way in, one way out. Charlocks are trying to push through. We got the Ail fighting back the red veils. It's a little bit personal because like the whole >> terribleness part of that.

[00:47:39]>> Yeah.

[00:47:40]>> So, >> and all the toe.

[00:47:42]>> Yeah. And it's kind of crazy because at one point she's like, "Oh, no. They're not real Iel because they don't follow GTO." And >> Well, cuz they were like so young.

[00:47:50]>> Well, >> too, right.

[00:47:52]>> Well, they're corrupted by the dark one.

[00:47:53]>> Well, now, but also when they left, they were young. Yeah, but like that matters less to me than the fact that >> Well, that matters to me.

[00:48:00]>> They're still like they would still know about GeoT. It's like the issue is they're literal they're dark friends or literally turned >> in a certain way.

[00:48:08]>> Yeah.

[00:48:08]>> And then at like 12.

[00:48:10]>> Yeah.

[00:48:11]>> You're drafted into some I don't know cult or something. You don't remember the way that you were raised. You do the thing that the new people say.

[00:48:19]>> Yeah. No, but I mean like a lot of the red veils [laughter] too are literally like compelled or turned.

[00:48:23]>> Well, yeah.

[00:48:24]>> Capital T turned. So >> Yes. know that too. It's also not >> that too. But also, [laughter] >> let's keep in mind like our formative years are not spent actually learning.

[00:48:34]>> You got too much of the you got too much of the the you part of the educational stuff that you know.

[00:48:41]>> I don't know. I just think that like from like 12 or 13.

[00:48:45]>> Sure.

[00:48:45]>> You're easily influenced >> Yeah.

[00:48:48]>> into believing and thinking other ways of doing things.

[00:48:51]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:48:52]>> So, you didn't grow up with it.

[00:48:53]>> I get that.

[00:48:54]>> Yeah.

[00:48:54]>> Yeah. Anyways, they made the mistake a couple of times of thinking that they were going to follow Gito. The Red Veils do not. And one of them stabbed one of the maidens or whatever because like >> shoot fakers faking pretend to act.

[00:49:05]>> Yeah, come on guys. It's >> like no like guys.

[00:49:07]>> Of course. And then one of them was like ah yeah, I'll be guys shy. Yeah, that's the one, right? That's the one.

[00:49:12]>> And then he like stab the maiden and it was like ah shoot tricked me. It's like after we went all through all that stuff with the with the shido like Yeah. Come on. Okay. Okay. Yeah. So Aviand is on patrol.

[00:49:25]>> We're still actively fighting.

[00:49:26]>> Actively fighting. There's a thing where she sees a couple of like two channeling red veils attacking like a dozen actual AI. So she tells her crew to stop where they are. She goes up ahead and like blows up those guys and then does a little bit more like reminiscing on who these people might be.

[00:49:44]>> No, she doesn't.

[00:49:46]>> Doesn't Well, okay.

[00:49:47]>> No, no, no. She purposefully doesn't look at their faces this time. I know, but like she doesn't want to know by p purposefully not like you also are still she's purposely not.

[00:49:57]>> But but in doing so, you do. That's the problem. Anyways, that's not the important part. This is all just a setup for the next event that happens.

[00:50:08]>> Uh-huh.

[00:50:08]>> Because she's told her circle to stay behind >> and just like hold on a moment.

[00:50:13]>> Hold on. Wait here. And then she goes up ahead. And then while she's up ahead >> and she's like healing some of the wounded I >> Yeah.

[00:50:21]>> And then suddenly a shock goes through her because she can feel the women in her circle all like winking out of the power >> because they're dying.

[00:50:29]>> Shoot.

[00:50:29]>> They're dying. So she releases the circle because like what else are you going to do? You got to let them try and defend themselves.

[00:50:35]>> And then she dashes back to where she left them. And by the time she gets there she sees the corpses of >> Yeah. Okay. So Karuna y >> of Bara and Karuna. Like we've seen her.

[00:50:46]She's that green who had lots of orders.

[00:50:48]>> She's been around for a long time.

[00:50:50]>> We got Falin, >> who's different than Failane, >> very different.

[00:50:55]>> Falion is also someone different.

[00:50:57]>> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. So different.

[00:51:00]>> Fin is someone we don't really know or do know.

[00:51:03]>> We do know. She's been around for a long time, too. Like at this point, I don't >> They're all interchangeable for me, but Uhhuh.

[00:51:09]>> And that's fine. We can go into a deep dive if you want to later. I don't.

[00:51:12]>> Yeah. Okay. So, they're dead. They're dead on the ground.

[00:51:15]>> See, this is what I'm talking about.

[00:51:16]It's like >> burn to it, Chris.

[00:51:18]>> Ah, people died, but it's like >> Yeah, but I mean that's a that's an important like those are those are like full eyes to die.

[00:51:25]>> Yeah.

[00:51:25]>> We don't have a lot of them left.

[00:51:27]>> I know.

[00:51:27]>> Yeah. Our numbers are dwindling.

[00:51:29]>> It's almost like we should have been training better for this.

[00:51:32]>> Yeah.

[00:51:32]>> Thing that we knew was coming, >> right? But I mean, they couldn't do anything. They were in a circle. They literally couldn't fight back.

[00:51:37]>> Well, at this moment. Yeah.

[00:51:38]>> At this moment. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, turns out the hideous woman.

[00:51:42]>> No, not her.

[00:51:44]>> Another Yeah.

[00:51:45]>> way of saying real ugly person.

[00:51:48]>> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So, she's standing with Serene. Serene's water is dead on the ground. And then Serene is looking at Grand with like adoring.

[00:51:59]>> Yeah. Has Salam with adoring eyes. So, it's like compulsion.

[00:52:02]>> Uhhuh. Everything. Well, okay. So, this actually had me thinking.

[00:52:06]>> Okay. because you were like, "How can she compel just everyone at one point?"

[00:52:11]But the place that Rand Bale fired the [ __ ] out of.

[00:52:15]>> Mhm.

[00:52:16]>> Was literally an entire village worth >> Yep.

[00:52:20]>> of just people that Grundle compelled.

[00:52:23]>> Yes.

[00:52:23]>> Like that's what she did. That's what she does.

[00:52:25]>> Yeah. Everyone in her vicinity >> over how much time.

[00:52:28]>> Yeah. But everyone she comes across, she just compels. Just now you're mine.

[00:52:32]>> Blam blam blam. starts her blasting.

[00:52:36]>> Oh my gosh, it's so [laughter] easy for her.

[00:52:38]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:52:39]>> So, it's not hard for me to believe that there's a bunch of people who maybe aren't dark friends, but now, >> uhoh, >> are just >> Well, and now it's problematic, too, because now we've got Helam Grandall, who is literally going around and killing, but also compelling our own guys who then turn them into a bad guy for the other side. It's like zombie situation. This is This is bad.

[00:53:01]>> Yeah.

[00:53:01]>> Yeah. And also, Flynn is on the ground nearby, too. who's and he's missing his entire left arm.

[00:53:06]>> It's like a zombie though that like you can control. It's a remote control zombie.

[00:53:11]>> Exactly. That's even spookier.

[00:53:13]>> Yeah. Right. Like Yeah. Like a zombie.

[00:53:15]Sure. But like one that you can completely control where they go.

[00:53:19]>> Totally.

[00:53:19]>> And who they kill.

[00:53:21]>> Yeah. [laughter] Okay.

[00:53:22]>> Because zombies are just going to mindlessly kill everybody.

[00:53:25]>> Yeah. For sure. For sure.

[00:53:26]>> Including like Helam.

[00:53:28]>> I get what you're saying.

[00:53:28]>> But no, she's like, "No, I control these zombies." [laughter] >> Yeah. Good. Now people understand exactly what's happening and what compulsion does thanks to that explanation. [laughter] >> I understand it better.

[00:53:41]>> Imagine a zombie. See, but it's not like a regular zombie. It's a zombie you control.

[00:53:46]>> Okay. All right.

[00:53:48]>> He'll eat brains, but not your brains.

[00:53:50]>> Perfect. [laughter] You know what?

[00:53:51]Honestly.

[00:53:52]>> Yeah, >> I get it now.

[00:53:53]>> Okay. Did you hear what I said about Flynn? Flynn is on the ground. His arm is burned off. He's got no arm.

[00:53:59]>> It's gone.

[00:54:00]>> Gone.

[00:54:00]>> Bail fired probably.

[00:54:01]>> So, yeah. Uh so Avianda heals him as best she can before he passes out. But now it's like just her because three two Isedai dead, a warder dead, one of the Astraan has an arm missing and is unconscious and then one compelled I die. So that is a bad that's a bad day.

[00:54:18]>> Here's the thing though. Grandd Hesselam disappeared in her winky hole again.

[00:54:22]>> She did with Serene.

[00:54:23]>> Yes.

[00:54:24]>> Yeah. They went together.

[00:54:26]>> Mhm.

[00:54:26]>> So okay, here's the important question.

[00:54:29]In the amount of let's say rainbow stickers that the dark one gives out for good performance.

[00:54:35]>> Yeah.

[00:54:36]>> Who gets more rainbow and sunshine stickers? Grandal who is compelling people taking over the great captains taking out like every army on their own battlefronts or deandre who brought in an entire Shaun army >> but now is just standing in the middle of >> but is now stand shouting about one fight but still still occupying all of Matt and the forces of the light like he is still in so >> here's what I imagine the dark one gives out it's not sunshine and rainbows he gives about skull emojis that mean like dead from laughing.

[00:55:13]>> Nice. Okay.

[00:55:14]>> He's like funny.

[00:55:15]>> Dead. Yeah.

[00:55:16]>> Good one. I'm dead. I'm dead. That you did that. That is so good. That's what the dark one says.

[00:55:20]>> So, who gets more of those?

[00:55:22]>> Who gets more I'm dead? Um, >> do you mind your head's like llol just took over Shara?

[00:55:28]>> Yeah. [laughter] Dead.

[00:55:30]>> Dark one's like dead.

[00:55:33]>> How many skulls and crying [laughter] laughing emojis?

[00:55:36]>> Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

[00:55:39]>> Mhm.

[00:55:40]>> I get how the kids text out.

[00:55:41]>> Yeah, me too. So good. I don't know. I would say Moridan cuz the whole Hessam >> Mordan's not in this conversation.

[00:55:49]>> I would say that Moridan is the mastermind behind the great captain's plan.

[00:55:54]>> Yeah, cuz Hessam wouldn't have thought of that on her own and gone because she's all last chance.

[00:56:00]>> Yeah. Yeah. A good leader doesn't just take credit for everything that they they have to give out.

[00:56:05]>> Oh, no. Martin's not taking credit. I would just say that that's who the dark one would credit.

[00:56:10]>> Yeah. Morton would be like, "No, no, no.

[00:56:11]It was not me. It was all Grindle."

[00:56:13]>> Yes, he would.

[00:56:13]>> No. Well, maybe.

[00:56:15]>> But then he'd be like, "Haha, I sword fight you again." [laughter] Then >> what's he doing? Like of all things. Of all things, that's what he's doing.

[00:56:22]>> I don't even know what other Forsaken even exists still.

[00:56:26]>> Lar.

[00:56:27]>> Yeah.

[00:56:27]>> Who's doing who knows what within?

[00:56:30]>> She's getting nothing. [laughter] >> What is her game plan here? What's the game plan? And then we got Mogadian who ultimately has to die slashkill naive according to you.

[00:56:41]>> That's what I think. And everyone else is gone.

[00:56:43]>> We got Mordan, Diamandre, Lanir, Mogiadian, Halam. I shouldn't have called her Lanfir. It's Sindane, but anyways.

[00:56:50]>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's Lanir. H. Okay.

[00:56:54]>> I think they're all doing a pretty bangup job.

[00:56:56]>> Yeah.

[00:56:57]>> Yeah.

[00:56:57]>> Yeah.

[00:56:57]>> And the dark one's like, "Don't bother me.

[00:57:00]>> I'm busy.

[00:57:00]>> I'm bantering with Rand.

[00:57:02]>> Busy.

[00:57:02]>> We're bantering."

[00:57:04]>> Yeah. All right. Well, >> okay. Yeah. So, that's >> see what happens next.

[00:57:07]>> Yeah. I was gonna say so like sure we need Ren to fight the dark one. So, that's going well because like he's starting and he's like this hasn't happened before. Probably the right thing.

[00:57:16]>> Not like great though.

[00:57:17]>> What?

[00:57:17]>> Oh, cuz Taem is forsaken now.

[00:57:20]>> Yeah.

[00:57:20]>> And apparently >> I was thinking of the OG's though.

[00:57:23]>> And apparently uh he has the seals.

[00:57:26]>> Mhm.

[00:57:27]>> And we need those to break.

[00:57:28]>> Allegedly.

[00:57:29]>> Allegedly. because Rand is gonna give a signal or whatever when it's time >> from beyond the pattern.

[00:57:35]>> Yeah. Yeah.

[00:57:35]>> How's Rand gonna get back? I hope he doesn't.

[00:57:39]>> And that's the end of this episode.

[00:57:41][laughter] I hate that. I hate that.

[00:57:44]Don't care for that.

[00:57:45]>> Just going to like wake up in his bed.

[00:57:48][laughter] >> Like just like well rested after what happened, guys. [laughter] >> And there's like no explanation. Just like >> this is why you're not an author.

[00:57:58][laughter] right there.

[00:58:01]>> Well, that's what happened when he fell out of the sky after that weird sky battle and then all of a sudden he's just like in a and like Min takes him >> I mean sort of he was literally rescued by them and men and >> then and then he's just like what happened guys?

[00:58:15]>> True. Okay. Yeah. [laughter] Maybe he'll like fall in the sky and now I'm in bit.

[00:58:20]>> Yeah.

[00:58:20]>> I think that'll happen again.

[00:58:22]>> Yeah. Well, Lfir also helped at that point.

[00:58:24]>> She'll help again.

[00:58:25]>> She'll help again. Why wouldn't she? I think she's over helping men. And honestly, me, too. [laughter] >> Okay, I get it. I get it.

[00:58:36][sighs] >> Well, before you get lost in the blight with the horn of Elliar, I'm going to say that this is part of the pattern now.

[00:58:41]>> Yeah, it's part of the pattern.

[00:58:48]>> Well, that's it for this one. Thanks so much for listening, everyone. The Wheelwaves is hosted and edited by Danny and Brett. Produced by Danny and Brett with Passion Socks, Cody Felouts, Mosy, Jamie Young, Jared Berg, Ricky Moriceet, Matt Truss, Antoine Benois, MKM, Megan, Colby T, Gabby Young, Ryat, Chris G, Sarah Creech, Seavario Bartellini, Megs 621, Hamar's Lament, The Elf Witch, William Johnson, and Courtney B with music by Aionics. Now, be sure to check out our Patreon page if you're interested in supporting us and the podcast. We'd love to send you some Patreon exclusive merchandise as a thank you. Plus, you'll gain access to our episodes earlier than everyone else. And at the time of recording, we have over I think 50 bonus episodes at patreon.com/theweaves podcast. So, you can find all of that and more over there. For general information about our show, like how to get in touch with us, how to send us shot glasses, how to join our Discord, you can visit the Wheelwaves podcast.com. And as always, please be sure to give us that five-star review because it really does make a huge difference in helping people find us.

[01:00:01]And be sure to tell a friend, Riad, because referrals really are the best compliment. Thanks again for listening.

[01:00:08]This really is part of the pattern. Now.