The Cosavi case in El Salvador demonstrates how political interference in financial institutions can lead to severe consequences, including the loss of savings for thousands of citizens, the death of a cooperative manager during a helicopter crash, and the systematic silencing of affected citizens by state institutions. The case reveals that when political parties use financial institutions for their own benefit, it creates a dangerous precedent where citizens' rights are violated, and democratic accountability is undermined. The affected citizens, who had accumulated savings over 20-30 years, were left without recourse despite their legitimate claims, highlighting the importance of institutional transparency and the rule of law in protecting citizens' financial rights.
Juan José Ortiz y Marvin Reyes: "SIETE AÑOS DE BUKELE"...casos sin respuestaAdded:
[music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] [music] Greetings and good night. A big hug.
Saturday, May 17th.
A conversation I was really looking forward to. Seriously, I'm telling you, I was looking forward to this conversation.
I am actually highly disappointed and frustrated with the country's politics.
This is what journalism has recently revealed in all fields and has shown us the true face of Buchelism.
A Buchelism that is capable of tearing out fingernails, tearing someone's fingernails out.
They consider a loose end, someone capable of crashing a helicopter to silence a case, someone capable of silencing a prosecutor so that the processes cannot be investigated.
Someone who is capable of closing the door three, four, five times on those affected who are demonstrating and showing that their relatives are dying because of a situation caused by the system itself, and they are not received, they are not given an answer.
What kind of policy is being implemented? It is being implemented in the country.
What kind of politicians are making the decisions?
What kind of politicians with conscience and values, or anti-values, I don't know, are those who make those decisions to call the director of the National Civil Police on his day off to tell him to get on a helicopter that will later crash and where he will lose his life?
What kind of country do we have?
What political entity is making the decisions?
What kind of sacrifices are they willing to make? I do n't know for what purpose, but well, those are the facts we're going to discuss now. These events are narrated in a series of investigative reports that the press, once again, fortunately in this country, we are still blessed to have a press that informs us.
What kind of politicians did the country choose?
What kind of conscience, values, dignity?
Where did the love for the people go?
Where did the fantasies and promises go? That's what we're going to talk about now. The Cosabi case, without a doubt this is not going to happen through the back door. This is not just going to be a line underlined in bold, but it will somehow set a precedent for what will happen in current politics and in the practice of politics in this country. Today we're going to talk about the Cosabi case. I want to welcome you, I really want to ask you to give us your like, to help us share this content. Send it wherever you can, send it. Send it to people you don't know who have it on their phone, in their contacts, send it to them, send it to them, send it to them so they can discuss it. If they come, if trolls or government supporters come, let them help us clear this up. Send it to him, send it to him. Let's do a truly healthy, real exercise of trying to analyze what happened in that perverse, dark case, full of anti-values, morbid things, and ambitions. No, no, you never know what's there.
A political party president signs a request for 5 million for the general manager to approve. In fact, they speak of images where the president of the Assembly, the executive of the president of the Republic, the resino, arrived at the office to ask there for his his his No, what is that?
Which politicians are we talking about? Should this concern the country, or should it really be ignored?
We're getting used to it, aren't we? If this is normal in El Salvador, then let's just let it happen because we have a cool president and anything can happen here. That's not what we're talking about.
Is this a situation that should really concern us, or should we ignore it? How do those affected by the Cosabi case feel after so many lies we 've seen? That's what we're going to talk about.
Share this content. I ask you to do it from the start. Share it. Share it everywhere.
If you think, oh, that this is Nay Liver, that this is a fan, send him, send him to see us, because this talk is going to be interesting. I ask that you also share with us your questions, your inquiries, your observations, your comments, and anything else you consider important for this debate, this discussion, this analysis, this reflection that we will try to do today with all the elements that, thanks to, I insist, the investigative press has put on the table.
You know that the purpose that brings us together is to counteract disinformation and combat the manipulation of public opinion.
I want to welcome our guests. Tonight is a special night; we're going to have two guests. First, I want to welcome Marvin.
Marvin Reyes, spokesperson for the Police Workers Movement. Marvin, thank you for being with us. I know you have little time, but we'll try to stretch it as much as possible.
Marvin.
Thank you, Franklin. Good night. Good evening to Juan José as well. Thanks to the friends who are keeping an eye on Barcito FM. Hey, we also send fraternal hugs to those who follow the Barcito FM interview program, who live outside our borders.
Fraternal hugs to all and of course to one of the Cosabi spokespeople. Actually, we have seen all the faces, all the faces, from the most painful, the most nostalgic, the bravest, the most angry, the most tired, but we have seen all the faces and Juan José has been part of those faces. Juan José, I want to welcome you on behalf of all those affected by COSVI to this talk.
Good evening, Franklin, it's a pleasure to greet you.
Well, good evening to Marvin as well, it's a pleasure to share this space for analysis tonight, and of course, greetings to all the people who watch your program, and especially to those affected who are following it closely.
Okay, I want to ask you, let's see, I'm going to start with Juan José Ortiz. This last post, well, there are several posts. I saw one from Regional Journalism and I saw one from UCA that was a complement. They tell me, a little bird called me and told me that a new publication about the Cosabi case is coming midweek. But what we have seen simply and plainly describes a reality that worries us. a government that has lied to the country in the most blatant way possible and has lied to those affected by the Cosabi case. What kind of government can do that? And that's where I want to start because it goes from the most to the least. Hey, Juan José, I'll give you the floor.
Well, look, to know what kind of government we have, perhaps we still need to ask ourselves a preliminary question. What kind of president do we have? Where is the president of the Republic of El Salvador?
Since April 11, all the media outlets made it public that he was going to visit Washington because he was going to be received by President Trump.
Nobody knows about President Bukele. The last news we heard was that he was in Italy shopping, but I would probably start there.
Franklin, wondering where the president of the Republic is, regardless of whether many call him unconstitutional, or whether his supporters call him constitutional, the question is, where is he? Because a series of social and political events are happening, which are generating, right?, impact, problems that are exploding in the government's face because of its involvement, but the president is nowhere to be seen. What he has done is tweet, and I have no proof if he manages that Twitter account personally, if an advisor manages it, if a troll center manages it, etc., etc. So I think it's important, because we're probably going to touch on not only the COSABI issue, but also other issues that have been relevant this week.
Uh, when we saw the unfortunate case of the cooperative, right?, to whom, by the way, we those affected want to express our solidarity, to express all our respect, our admiration for the action they took. I have to be very honest with you. At one point we also thought about taking over the residential complex where the president supposedly lives. Our colleagues have passed away, unfortunately they are going through a situation that is condemnable, reprehensible and the least we can do as those affected is to show solidarity, congratulate them, condemn the detention of the two people, right? The human rights lawyer and the leading pastor of the cooperative demanded, right?, their release. But even on a topic like this, Frank, which we'll discuss later, the president wasn't in that colony.
Why did all the security forces arrive under the pretext that the president might be in danger if he wasn't there?
Moreover, I insist again, for more than a month we have not known whether the president is in Salvadoran territory or not. So, uh, what kind of government do we have? Well, we have an absent president, a president who doesn't face the serious problems that are happening in the country. So, the type of government we have is a distant, absent, manipulative government that creates problems and then comes out with a mule's sword saying, "Here 's the solution."
And later on, as we'll probably be touching on other topics, as I said, the president himself talks about how a community, a cooperative, is being manipulated, but he has been manipulating the case precisely to overcome that slump he's had in the polls. So I'm telling you that I think we have a government that doesn't exist, an isolated government, a government distant from the population, despite all the advertising machinery claiming that this is a government close to the people.
This is a government that doesn't exist for the serious problems that are happening in the country.
Marvin, uh, the data we've found, read, reread, well, I've read the document about three times because the truth is that sometimes, I 'm telling you, it's hard to believe.
Someone who knows the police system, who knows the investigative processes, who knows how to handle cases like these. Marvin, what did you read there? What did you interpret from all of that?
Seriously, and I ask again, what kind of government do we have?
The government we have, and I have already expressed this in other forums, is an impersonal government.
Why am I saying it this way?
Because the president is not physically with the people, he governs from social media. He communicates through messages he sends via X or through other social networks, but he is not physically with the people. We don't see him walking around there in the middle of the communities. He doesn't interact with absolutely anyone. Well, it's practically been like that since the first government that was constitutional, and even less so today in this one that is unconstitutional. Now, this is starting to cause people to get tired, isn't it? Because people want to see political leaders who come to see their problems and solve them, not send them messages from a social network that, as Juan José says, you don't know if he's managing it himself, or if someone else is managing it, or if he has a team there that's managing those accounts. That's why I say it, an impersonal government, there is no real, human bond that is close to the people, it's just done that way. Why?
Because these types of politicians, or these types of people, have lived in those social strata. They are not used to being among people, and I think they are even offended by the smell of the town. That's why they keep their distance over there, right?
They feel comfortable in the circles they've moved in, right? as an elite, as people with a different social status. It's different when a ruler comes from the true people, identifies with them, and is with them.
But here we see something totally detached from the people, and in that sense, governing like this is easy. Yes, through messages and by having control of the other branches of government.
Governing like this is easy.
The difficult thing is to truly govern, solving people's problems, understanding the situations and resolving them. I remember an anecdote about President Putin of Russia when there was a problem with some businessmen who had practically kidnapped the workers, and there was a big problem years ago, and Putin personally gathered the businessmen and even told them quite a few things to their faces and made them sign an agreement. Otherwise, they were going to restart the factories, that's what they call it there, have them taken over by the government, they were going to restart them.
So he went there directly to talk to the businessmen and correct the problem, and he earned the respect of all the workers in those companies that were run by these powerful Russian businessmen. But when have we ever seen Buquele actually go anywhere to solve a problem?
Personally, no, we haven't seen it. He arrives, sets up a stage, and people are watching him from about a kilometer away, right? And there he puts up the big screens so people can see him up close, but he doesn't go and interact with the people, he doesn't walk with the people. It's a lie. Now, this is reflected in the latest survey that we already had the opportunity to see, 55%, a truly brutal drop, right? For someone who thought they were at the top, and as we've also said in other programs, right? Bukele reached the top and the only thing left for him to do was descend because there was nothing left to go up.
So today it's its turn to descend, and it's plummeting, right? Because there are many details that people are now waking up to and realizing that many of the things he talks about, like the economic takeoff, the resolution of the problems plaguing the country, agriculture is forgotten, schools are forgotten, a number of serious problems that the country has and no solution is in sight. Now, regarding this Cosabi issue, from what we've learned, this latest information is important because it sheds new light on aspects that we had already raised in opinion pieces, showing that what the government and the Public Prosecutor's Office were saying was inconsistent with what was actually happening.
The point where the greatest controversy arises is when they publish that Manuel Coto is detained in Panama, which is not true because he was not detained; rather, what they were doing was buying time for him to move, to move from there. That's what they were doing.
Well, a smokescreen and he practically had the opportunity to move from Panama. Moving through Costa Rica, passing through Nicaragua and reaching as far as Honduras reveals extremely disturbing data from conversations they have had with officials from Nuevas Ideas, with government officials, uh with the former legal advisor to the presidency and all that whole plot, you see, of negotiating million-dollar loans in favor of the ruling party, which, well, it really catches my attention how this cooperative obtained these funds, and millions of dollars, to grant them as loans to these political institutions.
We know that these people have always acted irresponsibly, they have always been irresponsible. They lend, they don't pay, they invent anything to, as they say, get away with their responsibilities, and there we see the results. And I imagine that's why they haven't finished paying the affected people, because that money is there, the mayors and all the other people involved who received all this money aren't returning it. And it's really worrying, it's worrying because it's clear that these types of politicians are highly unscrupulous, they have no scruples and they rely on any means, legal or illegal, to get into power, and that's what they did and that's what they've done. Their political career is based on illicit actions, fraudulent actions, and criminal actions, such as the negotiation they had with gangs. So, in summary, we can say that it is a government that has already begun its decline and the people are tired of so much nonsense and it is taking its toll.
Let's see, they write to me here, look, I'm going to read you a comment and I'll stick with this because the comment is perfect. Paulo Car says, the dead in Kosabi, nine from the helicopter, five savers dead waiting for their savings, an executive missing and many with asylum abroad and countless people in an economic crisis. And we come across this type of news that reveals gruesome things.
What is the affected party from Cosavi Gonz thinking right now? Because what we've really heard is, I mean, I 'm telling you, they ripped out his fingernails, he appears with a cut on his forehead, one, I mean, they patched up his forehead.
Um, you don't know if it was in the helicopter or in the, or in the, what's it called?, in the military space, uh, I mean, there are so many doubts there. What do those affected by Kosavi think?
Above all, and I'm going to tell you this.
After going to knock on the doors of the Legislative Assembly three, four, five times, and now they find out that the election campaign was financed with your resources, with money that you had accumulated from 20, 30 years of work. They arrested them and used them to finance their election campaign. They won the election campaign and when you went to look for them they slammed the door in your face. What do those affected by Cosavios think?
Well, look, I think the report that comes out this week, right?, is the final consummation and confirmation of what we, the affected parties, have maintained from the beginning. Our case was a political issue, and it was a political issue insofar as the political class had interfered in the cooperative, particularly the ruling party for a year, right? Because we have never had access to information.
on behalf of the institutions involved. In our case, for a year, the responsible press, the professional press, the investigative press, as you have pointed out, was gradually publishing information about the case that led us to conclude and verify that the issue was a political one.
The first big piece of information was the loans to the municipalities, and as Marvin says, right? Those affected, we ask ourselves, article 3 of the INSA Focó law, which by the way the Nuevas Ideas caucus repealed, prohibits any cooperative from making loans to political parties, to churches of any denomination, that is, this INSFOC law. I didn't know that, it really surprised me. That's all it takes, you just have to look, right? I don't know if they've already taken it down from all the institutional sites, but article 3 of the INSAPO law established that prohibition.
Well, the first questions we asked ourselves when it came to light that municipalities in the country were acquiring million-dollar loans were the fact that the candidates who ultimately won public office belonged to a political party.
And then, right? In a technical financial analysis, the municipalities were also risky clients insofar as many depended on FODES, many municipalities made loans and put FODES as collateral. When the government itself takes away their FODES funds, what guarantee can a municipality offer when requesting million-dollar loans?
So, this is where one begins, right? Seeing the report that's coming out this week makes you wonder, right?
Well, the prosecutor's office itself has said that the cooperative is being investigated for money laundering, specifically the people who managed the cooperative.
Uh, there are 10 reports prior to the one that came out this week, for example, a report in today's newspaper that pointed out all the loans that the general manager, Mr. Coto, right?, made to Cosabi and it kept drawing attention, for example, Franklin, that when I was the manager of the cooperative I lent $600,000 and paid it back a week later.
So, what person has the ability to lend $600,000 a week and pay it back?
That's just the product of money laundering. In other words, a simple figure.
I steal legitimate money from the cooperative, I pay it back in a week with money that I don't know where it comes from, I launder it and launder it.
Now, even though this report has been spectacular and surprising, it's worth asking whether Mr. Coto was laundering his own money or someone else's. or whose, that is, Cosabi was a money laundering operation.
That's how it is. And also, to the extent that probably, right?, the cooperative's own authorities realized that it was becoming increasingly difficult to lend money to the political class. It is not unreasonable to think that Mr. Coto lent this money to third parties, to a political party, for example.
In other words, what we have seen with this report is that this is the confirmation of what we have maintained throughout a year, that our case was a political issue, because the political class, the ruling party, interferes in the cooperative.
Things started to come out throughout the year. Marvin already mentioned it, right?
We completely stopped believing in the Attorney General's Office the day the announcement was made that Mr. Coto was arrested in Panama.
The only time President Bukele has spoken about our case, paradoxically, was to congratulate the prosecutor for the false arrest of the Cosavi manager in Panama.
So, the indifference of the State institutions, that no institution receives us, and that the ruling party has gone to Congress four times and they have refused to receive us.
We sent a note to the President of the Republic himself, but he has not responded to us. We have made requests to the Superintendency of the Financial System. We went to the prosecutor's office. In other words, all this institutional behavior ultimately, right? Well, this report was probably what we needed to say definitively that the case is political because the ruling party interfered.
Before, we only had contempt, silence, indifference, and for a year, as I said, information gradually came out, right? uh, about loans, uh, like I said, right?
Today's newspaper, the UCA had published two reports before this week's report came out. The UCA is releasing another report this week that completes the investigative report that is done in a tripartite manner between journalists from Guatemala, Honduras, and Salvadoran journalists who live outside the country.
So, uh look, more than emotions, right? Because there have been mixed emotions, mixed feelings among those affected, frustration, anger, discomfort, and a desire to love.
Well, I can't say here, because that would be a crime, right? Well, the thing is, I think that beyond the emotions and mixed feelings, there's fear, there's frustration, there's anger, there's everything, but I think that in the end this report confirms, it's the icing on the cake that we weren't wrong from the beginning when we pointed out, right?, that the government institutions didn't want to address the case because something strange was going on there.
Finally, this is a report that aims to bring to light [clears throat] a series of pieces of information, right? It's truly a professional piece of journalism, unprecedented, I think, just like the report the lighthouse does with a gang member, because the sources are diverse.
Note that none of those affected are sources for that investigation.
It mentions that they have spoken with former employees of the cooperative, with prosecutor's office personnel, with police personnel, with Honduran police personnel. In other words, it's a truly exceptional piece of work. In other words, we consider Juan José Ortiz to be a source.
In other words, it's a job, because sometimes you hear certain YouTubers, right?, or certain people who think they're analysts saying that we 've provided all that information. Uh, I never went to Mr. Coto's wake. How can I attest that the man had no fingernails? Well, that 's a professional piece of journalism that I think government supporters and even government officials involved will hardly be able to refute. And I'll close with this. Well, you know, since the news broke, almost every media outlet has wanted to interview us, and our response has been very simple. that we don't have to give explanations about that report. Those who have to give the explanations are the officials who appear there indicated.
A number of people appear there, from the prosecutor's office, the police, government officials, former government officials, people close to the President of the Republic, and the President himself is mentioned there. So, what do those affected have to explain? Actually, nothing. We, like hundreds of thousands of Salvadorans, have been surprised by a journalistic report with sources of information that are very difficult, let's say, to want to delegitimize, right?, an investigation of that nature. Now, for those of us who have been fighting this for a year, well, as I said, it's just confirmation.
Perhaps we needed a report like this to finally state definitively what we have always maintained: that our case was political, because the ruling party used the cooperative to finance its political and electoral activities.
But in this case, neither I nor any of those affected have anything to explain. Those who have to explain are the officials who are named in that report.
Marvin, in the police part there is something that actually, and you did read the report, and there is a supplement that Ysuca makes, I remember that with you and Marvin Aguilar we were in a conversation at that moment when the helicopter crashed and the theses there. People believe, as we put it, people believe that the helicopter was deliberately crashed.
Now that we read this report, Marvin, the government either tried to kill Manuel Coto or ended up killing him. In other words, I'm asking you this after reading the report with the information provided by the investigation.
Manuel Coto himself said, "If they take me to El Salvador, they're going to kill me." And then he appears, what does he call himself? Uh, his forehead was cooked, he had no nails, nobody knows how he got there, they didn't do an autopsy. So, one thing, they really cut loose ends, that level of predation reaches politics in the country. I ask you, are you familiar with the most police-related aspects and can you give us a better, let's say, reference to this or an analysis, a reflection?
Yes of course. When you start reviewing the entire itinerary for that day, you realize there are some very suspicious elements.
First, when Manuel Coto was arrested in Honduras, the most logical thing was to bring him by land. This has been done with different people who have been captured in other countries who are Salvadoran and are brought to the border and handed over.
Uh, that's the first suspicious piece of information. Secondly, why send the police director, the deputy director of specialized operational areas, and Rómulo Pompilio, the deputy director of investigations? So, why send all three of them if, well, I've heard of a number of cases of people who have been captured, who have been detained in Guatemala, in Honduras, and they are taken to the border and a team goes to receive them, a team of investigators, the prosecutor may go, but sometimes he goes, sometimes he doesn't.
The thing is, they handed it over to the police, not to the police chiefs or the director himself. This is the point. Now, this is a detail that we have been analyzing quite a bit and well, it makes us very suspicious that there was already some kind of plot to remove Manuel Coto from the game.
The other thing is that we also spoke with experts in aircraft handling, helicopters, and they told us something interesting. They told us, "These devices, right? These devices aren't like cars, you know, you don't just look out the window and see what's happening in front of you, right? Instead, there are a lot of devices that determine the altitude, whether there's an object in front, right? All of that is controlled by devices; you don't just look at the sky to see what's there, right? Or if there's a mountain nearby or not. Now, these aspects also lead us to suspect that there was manipulation to intentionally crash the aircraft, right? There's no other way to see it, and it coincides with what Manuel Coto said, right? That he felt they were going to kill him, and logically, that's what happened. Unfortunately, they also took Ras Chicas, the other two deputy directors, a police corporal, the army personnel who were piloting the helicopter, and a cameraman. It's regrettable, because in trying to eliminate the corporals..." Loose, as they say, they dragged in others who probably had little to do with it, or nothing at all, and this is confirmed by the statements that have come to light through this report, which also reveals that some of the police chiefs didn't want to go. They didn't want to go.
And when the wake was held, this was told to me by the more private staff, yes? By the police personnel who were there at the wake, that there was almost a confrontation by the family of Commissioner García Funes, right? There was almost a confrontation when Bukele arrived because they were furious that he had been sent there and he shouldn't have been. They were so angry that they almost snubbed him and left him hanging when he arrived to greet them.
So, so you can see that the situation was practically directed towards that point.
Well, Pompilio was at the castle, he was in charge of the service, he should n't have gone. He could have sent someone else. But he was the head of the security detail at the castle. I mean, the head of security is on duty 24 hours a day, overseeing all police activity nationwide, and they conduct a follow-up assessment after their shift ends. The deputy directors do that work, but they're there; they don't go out into the field to see what's happening. That's what other officers are for. Even the police chief himself was with his family there, enjoying a strange weekend off, and they pulled him out of his rest— perhaps he hadn't had a break in years— and sent Manuel Coto to crash the helicopter. The other thing is, these experts in aircraft handling— helicopters—were always telling me that the pilot did the opposite of what should be done when there's rain, when there's a storm. Generally, aircraft climb to get through the storm, not descend to crash into a mountain. I mean, he did the opposite of what they follow. They don't show the flight manuals. And the other thing is that we'll never know—and this will probably be lost forever— the communication that took place between the helicopter and the Ilopango control tower, the Air Force station. We'll never know that. They probably burned all the tapes, burned all the audio recordings, completely erased all the information because that's where the key to understanding what happened lies. Another thing that could have been useful is whether the police chiefs had time to make a call or send a message, right? Because the helicopter didn't crash immediately. There were several minutes while it was descending; they could have sent a quick voice message or something, but we'll never know anything about that either because everything was seized, everything disappeared. And the case of Manuel Coto's body, which turned up at the Third Brigade in San Miguel, to begin with, I don't understand why they took him there, why they didn't take him to a hospital.
And these signs of torture are quite complex because if That's true, so they tried to extract information from him in the last moments of his life. He was very seriously wounded, already mortally wounded, and they still wanted to see how they could get information out of him, right? That's what one can assume based on this report, which says that they handed over his body in that condition, and we also saw what happened with Alejandro Mason, right?
With signs of torture and everything, well, the reports are there. We're not here to invent anything; we're here to expose and analyze the reality of what's happening. That's the aspect we've seen in this case, right? Regarding the helicopter crash, the physical elimination of Manuel Coto, and well, they went around getting rid of the police chiefs who, for some reason, they wanted out of the picture, which we still do n't understand why, what they were getting in their way, or why they wanted them out of the equation. We don't know, to the point that it's been almost eight months, or eight months since there's been a director in the National Civil Police, right? Aspects.
This type of information finding. I suppose there must be information in some places, and even more so within the police force, because it is the police. But this type of information, where you take someone who is resting at their country house, I don't know, on the beach, they say, and put three police officers in a single helicopter, what does that reflect? I mean, what reaction does it provoke? Do you have any reaction, any... I don't know if you've heard this? What reaction has it generated within the police force? Because they might say, "If they broke the director of..." I mean, I'm saying it like this, but it's what one normally says. If they broke the director and the deputy directors, who's next? You've both heard, Juan José, that it's become like a saying, "Ah, they're going to put him in the helicopter." So, what do people in the police force say? I mean, because they're there. And what... what does it depend on whether they put him in a helicopter again? Yes, what, well, what is raised in... The word within the police ranks is that they wanted to get rid of Rasa, girls, that's what people are saying, that's what they think. They say something happened that led to Arasachicas being ordered to go and take the other deputy directors with him, and they wanted to definitely eliminate them from the picture.
That's what people think. That's what you hear being said within the police ranks, that they wanted to get rid of him one way or another, right? It says he wanted to resign, Marvin, did you read that part? It says he wanted to resign for several months, or that they wanted to force him out, and that he was considering it.
Yes, the truth is that Arriasachicas was already tired of this. Arasachicas took on a very difficult situation in the police force, and he had to lie, right? He had to lie and be part of the circus because he was, well, in the first months of Bukele's first constitutional government, he was lying. He told the girls they'd already delivered uniforms, boots, and everything else, which wasn't true; that they'd equipped the entire police force with rifles, which also wasn't true. In other words, he had to go around lying, and I imagine he got fed up with it, because he, like any other police officer, was a graduate officer, right? He swore an oath to the national flag to defend justice and peace, the constitutional order, and democracy. I imagine he didn't feel comfortable doing the job he'd been given, having to pretend, lie, and do political work when he was a career police officer. I imagine he was tired of it and thought about resigning, but it seems they forced him out before he could, and for good. So, what's being said within the police ranks is that they wanted to get rid of him, they wanted to eliminate him from the equation, and that whoever takes over as police director— if they even appoint one, because it's not clear—faces an extremely complex challenge. I want to ask you this, Mar, Before we move on to Juan José, because I have another set of questions from the perspective of those affected, I want to ask you this.
Based on what you know and what you 've heard from the police, can the country trust this police force?
It's a very interesting question, because lately we've seen the political use or manipulation of the National Civil Police (PNC), far removed from the principles of the peace accords and the very origins of the PNC.
When we see members of the UMO, the riot control unit, capturing community leaders in the forest, what we're seeing is a political apparatus, a political apparatus or part of a political apparatus, defending a political system. The police are not meant to defend political systems or be part of a political apparatus. The National Civil Police was created to defend the interests of the people. That's why it was created, and that's why the National Guard, the Treasury Police, and the National Police were disbanded, because these were political apparatuses defending the government, which was another political apparatus or political system. And they were oppressors of the people. So, the National Civil Police (PNC) was created to replace these repressive security forces, and now they're dragging it back to those conditions when we see them arresting people who are exercising their free right to express themselves, to say, "Look, we don't agree with this, right?" And they go and arrest them. So that generates a negative perception of the entire police force, not just the PNC, but the entire police force. And today people are afraid to see a police officer, they don't feel confident because they say, "No, the police could arrest me today and fabricate any charge or any crime and take me to jail." They arrested the bus company owners, piling on charges they had nothing to do with. So people are starting to fear an institution that has been and is being politically tarnished when what they should be doing is letting the police act as they should, in accordance with the law, in accordance with the Constitution, and respecting human rights, just as the Constitution says.
The peace agreement says, right? That all police actions must be based on democratic principles.
But now, do you think those democratic principles are being upheld by the police? Of course not. There is a certain percentage of police officers who remain honest, right? They remain honest. They keep striving to do their job well. They are supporting the population and everything, respecting human rights. They arrest people who actually commit crimes, but there is a good percentage who do n't; instead, they believe that by defending a political system they are doing something good, but what they are doing is tarnishing the National Civil Police.
That's the point. So, rescuing the police is a priority, right? And it must be returned to the people, from whom it should never have been taken.
Juan José, I ask you along almost the same lines, after what you have seen, I mean, representatives who took their money and there are already documents there to campaign and get elected, with or without fraud, we don't know. Well, there are We sent signs, but they took your money. Your money, earned over 30 years in a cooperative. They used your money for their campaign, and the day you went to the assembly one, two, three, four, five times, they turned their backs on you. Can you trust them? I mean, I 'm asking so the country understands: these kinds of politicians who are currently making the decisions, when they took your money, they used it for their election campaign, and when you went to them for help, they turned their backs on you. Can you trust these kinds of politicians?
Look, definitely not. And it's not just our case; we have public statements from many members of parliament.
For example, William Soriano, who was the only member of parliament from the governing party, said, "Give the money back to those affected by Cosabi, but liquidate that cooperative."
What was the government party's interest in wanting to liquidate a successful cooperative that had 300 million dollars, of which only 35 million had been stolen according to the prosecutor's office and the financial system's superintendency?
Common sense. Franklin, I would have liquidated the cooperative if they had stolen 235 million from me and left me with 35, but then they stole 35. The superintendent says, "Don't worry, there are 230 million to cover your expenses." What was William Soriano's interest in saying, "Liquidate that cooperative"?
And as I said, it's not just about saying we don't trust these representatives because of the Cosabi case.
Representative Soriano himself came out today in a video saying he'd rather not be a representative than receive a vote from a gang member. We 've seen, right? And the videos that El Faro has published, that those videos are just confirmation of an open secret: that there has been a political agreement between the gangs, governance in exchange for impunity.
So, you ask yourself, can you trust representatives who talk a big game about representing the people and saying that when the people need them, they'll be there with open arms? We've been to the Legislative Assembly four times, and only Representative Marcela Villatoro and Representative Claudia Ortiz have met with us.
Well, Representative Lira too, right? I mean, the ARENA party hasn't met with us, right? But Representative Marcela Villatoro has been the one who's met with us the most.
But to this day, more than a year after the Cosavi case, no representative wants to talk about it. No representative has been willing to meet with us.
Representative Ernesto Castro, the Speaker, makes mocking statements, saying, "Why do we have to get involved in an agreement between private parties?" That is, between Juan José Ortiz, a private individual, and the cooperative, trying to manipulate the information, when the biggest debtor of Cosavi is the state, the government institutions. There are several journalistic reports in today's UCA newspaper. Today's latest report confirms that institutions like the municipal works department owe money to Cosavi; the municipalities owe money to Cosavi—they are state institutions. The biggest debtor of Cosavi is the state institutions.
Secondly, how easy it is to say, "Why should I get involved in a private matter?"
forgetting that in 2020, Cosabi was the second-largest financier of Nuevas Ideas.
To this day, no member of parliament or leader of Nuevas Ideas has wanted to acknowledge this. Whether what Acción Ciudadana published is true or false.
Today, this report again points out that the relationship between COSVI and the ruling party didn't end in 2020; it continued until the last elections, until the unconstitutional election for the second term of government.
So, trusting institutions like that is very difficult. I don't trust them.
I can't trust a parliamentary group that doesn't even debate, doesn't even listen.
Look, that nickname they've been given isn't accidental, man, "pushers." They're a bunch of idiots who do n't discuss anything at all.
Well, imagine, this week there's the thing with the cooperative, the Cosabi thing, the thing with the colleagues who were... An attempt to evict them. And, coincidentally, there was no plenary session that whole week because they did n't want to show their faces.
So it's very difficult, because, well, in a year we've witnessed all the state institutions treating us with indifference; they don't receive us. There's enormous contempt for the Kosavi case, and as Marvin said, there's not only contempt for our case, there's contempt for the poor.
Look, just look at that ridiculous thing he did, with all due respect to Marvin because he's part of the police force. Marvin is right. There's a dangerous process... we lost the audio. We lost the audio, Juan José, we lost your audio, Juan José. You can hear me today.
Hello. Hello. Okay, we can today. We can today, sorry. Well, maybe to summarize, Franklin, how can we trust them?
You were saying there was a dangerous process based on Marvin's comments. Yes, I'll summarize so I don't repeat myself. There's no trust.
in a state body that doesn't respond to the interests of the people. We have witnessed, we have gone four times to receive the contempt of a legislative bloc that has the power to resolve the Cosave case and doesn't want to, simply because their political party is involved in the case.
Now, in the case of the police, for example, right? And we must pay attention to what Marvin says. There is a dangerous process of police corruption.
Notice that Nayibaba said, "The people of the cooperative have been manipulated and taken to a residential area that has nothing to do with the problem," but I would also reverse the words he uses and ask what the police were doing there in that private residential area.
If the argument is going to be that they were there because the president is in danger because an angry mob is coming to burn down the dreams, right? The president was not there.
Then one wonders, who is the one who can be manipulated? So what does the police do? What does the UMO do?
What does the military police do?
What are all the security forces doing evicting a peaceful protest? They didn't enter the dreams, they didn't enter the colony. That neighborhood has private security.
Even to get to the house where the president lives you have to pass through about three security rings, and that's what the inhabitants of Los Sueños have said.
So the question is, what did the police end up doing there?
Now, I do believe what Marvin says is important. It must be emphasized, right?, that the police, being an eminently vertical institution, from middle management down, right?, receive orders and if you do not obey the orders, then you are subject to disciplinary sanctions, financial penalties, dismissal, you can be put in jail, right?
So the question here is, who is in charge of the National Civil Police at this moment, 8 months, as Marvin says, since the director of the National Civil Police died in a mysterious accident. I said accident, right? I believe that even the most fanatical supporter of Nuevas Ideas understands that this was not an accident.
Who is in charge of the police right now?
Who gives the order for the smoke to appear in dreams when the President of the Republic is not there? He is not in danger.
No one from the community entered that private colony.
Furthermore, regarding this government's publicity strategy, if I had been president, I would have gone out and spoken to the child there who says, "Mr. President, help us. We have nowhere to live."
This government loves the cameras, right? I'll tell you something I've also said on another program about our case.
Franklin, if this government were truly doing things right in the Posabi case, don't you think they would have already made a commercial interviewing a woman thanking President Bukele because she's already recovered her money in Cos?
Common sense, this government loves the show and the spotlight, right? The superintendent says she's already returned 84% of the money.
With that percentage, if I were the head of communications at the presidential residence, I would have already recommended to the president, " Look, let's make a commercial saying, let's bring people out to shut Juan José up, who says it's a lie [clears throat] that 84% of the money has been returned." They haven't even done something like that.
And Look, it's common sense, Franklin. If they're doing things right, if they're doing it transparently and correctly, why don't they give information to the press?
Why doesn't the superintendent give two pages to all the media outlets? Look, here are the details: we gave this to 100 people who received $1,000, this to those who received $2,000, this to those who received $3,000, and this to those who received $ 20,000. They're missing this. They're not accepting it from you. They're not accepting it from us.
So, look, for example, I don't trust the entire institutional apparatus of the State because it's limited. How am I supposed to cut off information? Juan José, at least according to the report— you saw it, Marvin and Juan José— people from the government and public institutions went there to destroy information, to destroy videos and other types of information that could complicate matters for the political apparatus that's running things, including the Superintendency of the Financial System. I'll end my remarks here. Right now, Franklin, to give the floor to Marvin. You know, Marvin's right, isn't he?
We're going back to a time when, if the police institution loses its integrity, it generates fear.
But in our case, the Kosabi case, I think people are losing their fear. It's mentioned that journalists contacted former employees of the cooperative.
Yes. It's mentioned that they spoke with police personnel who were involved in the operation to bring Manuel Coto to justice. It mentions Honduran police.
Look, the report points out something very interesting that completely undermines the Attorney General's and the President's arguments.
They were saying that Coto's capture in Honduras was the result of inter-institutional collaboration.
But the report says that the Honduran police didn't even know it was Coto, that Coto presented himself as Ecuadorian when they stopped him in the taxi, and that when they interviewed Honduran police officers, they themselves said, "We did n't know it was Manuel Coto."
So, where does that leave that argument? The government claims this was an inter- institutional effort between Honduran and Salvadoran authorities, right? We'd have to find the audio recordings. There, the president said that to avoid a cumbersome extradition process, an expedited process had been carried out between Honduran authorities. But the police officers interviewed for that report said, "We had no idea it was Manuel Coto."
So, as I said, right? At this point, it 's shameful that an entire state, the entire state apparatus, has been complicit in trying to hide the involvement of officials from the ruling party in this.
So, as I said, right?
Beyond the anger, the frustration, the surprise this report has caused us, we are convinced that our fight will continue, even knowing that we are facing an uphill battle, that we have the entire state apparatus against us, but that our fight is legitimate. A legitimate fight, indeed. Like the members of the cooperative did, who went to present themselves at a private residential complex where the President of the Republic lives. And look, this is interesting for pro-government analysts.
What were they doing there? They say, but everything seems to indicate that it was the right decision.
Uh, I saw, for example, some analysts yesterday saying, "And what does the President of the Republic have to do with an eviction?"
Well, absolutely nothing, but he's the one who's been tweeting the most since the case became public, trying to justify, right?
Uh, the clumsy behavior, the clumsy decisions that have been made.
Uh, what's the President doing tweeting all week?
And look, it's interesting because if we're going to talk about manipulation, what's the Minister of Housing doing going to a community to tell people they're not going to be evicted when there's a court order for eviction, a system in place? What it reveals is that the community made the best decision, that they had to go to the place where the decisions are made.
Okay, so, like I said, right? I think the country is entering a very dangerous dynamic. Cases are erupting publicly where the government appears to be involved.
There's the issue of the van with a drug shipment detained in Panama.
There are the articles from El Faro. Today the Cosabi case has emerged, transportation businessmen arrested. Unfortunately, someone died at the hands of the state apparatus, and so far the traditional and conventional media haven't even commented on the case. I do n't want to imagine, Franklin, if this had happened to the FMLN, if a transportation businessman had died.
I can't imagine Fusades, NEPA, the Chamber of Commerce, ASI.
And I go back to the original question, Frenti, where is the president? Soldier's Day has passed, and the question is, who swore in the new cadets at the Military Academy?
Let's see.
Soldier's Day has always been a date that President Bukele used to show the The arrogance of power. Today there was no Soldier's Day, no military parade at the military academy.
So one wonders, are there serious problems in this country, Franken? And where is the leader of this country?
There are questions left unanswered. I'm going to move on to the comments. I want to read a couple of them. We won't be able to read them all, of course, because there are so many. The topic is really hot. We have, well, we've reached almost 600 people connected and only 200 likes, so I'll leave you with this to ponder. I'm telling you, Juan José, I'm surprised that Bukele reacted in less than 24 hours to the El Bosque cooperative case, but at this point, he hasn't tweeted about the Cosabi case, and I'm saying this to both of you, Marvin and Juan José. I don't bet on a tweet from Bukele about the statement Charlie made in the interview he gave to El Faro. pointing out that he, his government, and his party made a pact with the gang to take advantage of the issue of crime. He hasn't tweeted about the Alejandro Mason case. He did tweet about the public transportation businessman who died because of orders he sent from his Twitter account to have businessmen arrested. There are more than 14 arrested, and one of them died. He hasn't tweeted about that either. So you think, "What kind of president tweets when these things happen and doesn't tweet when these things happen?" I'll leave you with that. I'm going to read some comments quickly, Marvin, and then I'll wait for your reaction.
Let's see, uh, let's see if we can continue. First, I want to thank Paolo Cars, who says, "So that the YouTubers and the washed-up, nosy seals watching this chat get pissed off." Thank you, Franklin, for this information. "Return it, it was stolen," he says.
Uh, the seals are slowly opening their eyes. Let's see, let's go, there are some interesting comments. Only Manceta pays for everything, the policeman. Batman says Pompilio was, let's listen, Pompilio was mentioned by negotiators who were with the Croc in Mexico. Arriasa had many songs to sing since Carla Ayala. The other mercenary, the journalist, a useful idiot. I'll leave it at that, Marvin. These are topics for you. Let's see. Just like the movie says, "What will happen when Bukele loses the elections?" That's dangerous. There was never any communication with the tower. There never was, Marvin. Communication has reach. He says artist Chicas had to accept him to the gospel. Mm. Let's see. There was never any communication with the Tower.
Communication has reach after the EMP.
Uh-huh. Let's see. Put your like. They don't want to put a dictator, a director, nor do they want to accept anyone. If not, ask the investigations department, uh, Arriasa Chicas was already an evangelical, that's why he did n't want to anymore Keep lying. Uh, if the government wanted to put on a media show at the Honduran border, why didn't the Attorney General go in the helicopter along with three police leaders? Uh, today, countless new security companies have sprung up in the municipalities and districts, now working for the districts and some municipalities. Except Batman in the movie isn't corrupt.
We'll see. Another suspicion is that the pilot was a rookie, a lieutenant, and those operations have to be led by a captain.
We'll see. Uh, thanks for the support of the channel and whoever approves those permits for the interim police director, which they're doing today. Who approves that? Juan José Ortiz. And why don't you go to the residence of the all-powerful one to demand your rights? You saw that's the only way he reacts. Ah, interesting, Juan José Ortiz. I mean, if that works, going to, what's it called? To the dreams, why don't you go to the dreams? He says, totally agree.
The police are viewed with distrust and a lot of fear. Okay, uh, don't forget to bring up the topic of the polls. Okay, I'll leave it at that. The topic of the polls. Uh, to wrap things up, I'll leave you with those topics and let's get started. Look, Franklin, all those high-ranking police officers were involved in many violations of the Constitution and they knew something compromising, that's why they put him on the helicopter. Uh, you, with what you know by name, should be able to tell us who we can trust and who we can't. Interesting.
Pay attention, who can we trust and who can't we? The people from Cosavi are only protesting about a tiny fraction, they say, of 15 affected parties, when in reality there are thousands and they aren't speaking out. What's going on? The government is corrupt. The government must pay those affected all their savings and interest. The Cosavi case. I'm not going to exist anymore, the National Civil Police (PNC) won't exist, only the military police. Pay attention, pay attention to that. Let's see. Let's continue, let's continue.
Uh, there are more than 307 million Accounts receivable at Cosabi, but they already saw that the loans were laundered, that the loans for new ideas, mayoral offices, and public works, etc., were government expenses. Don Marvin left, right? Here 's Marvin. 92 million in properties, he says, "Like this, please, eh, justice for Cosabi." Uh, the theft is obvious. They should pay the victims all their savings and interest.
208 likes. Come on, people, please, give it a like. The photo from Italy is fake. He doesn't have the power to close warehouses or streets, or the country's millionaires abroad. It's all pure propaganda.
Cosabi even gave money to Burro Castro. They say there were pictures of Burro Castro, Burro Castro, and Carolina Resinos going in to get their little envelopes. I hope no other old person dies, he says, because of the anger we've had with all these reports. Well, it's difficult, you're really right. In Actually, you're right. I'm going to tell you, like, whoever is governing us is the one who owes Cosabi all that money. That's correct.
Well, I'm going to ask production to let me have the comments, and I want to close with this. I've left some comments for you to react to. Marvin, uh, first, and then to close, Juan José.
But I also want to add this. Uh, actually, I'm going back to the same question we started with.
Uh, what kind of politicians govern us after everything we've talked about?
What do you recommend to the people, to the community listening to us, about these kinds of politicians who are making decisions? They tweet when the cooperative case comes up, but they don't tweet a single thing about Cosabi, about drugs, about Alejandro Mason, about the gangs, about what kind of politicians, what do you recommend?
What kind of politicians can we trust to govern us? I'll leave it at that.
Perhaps I'll take the floor, Franklin, with my comrade's permission, because I had to leave. It's 9:20, but I'm going to take a few more minutes.
Well, thank you, I really appreciate it.
Yes, yes, man. Regarding what people said about the good talk, Marvel, you know the talk has been good.
Yes, man. Uh, regarding what people commented about the use of the military police, uh, military police have always been in the army, uh, they are in charge of internal aspects of the military and uh, today they are trained in the Special Military Security Brigade, which is where the National Guard barracks used to be, there on 5 de Noviembre, there on the Troncal del Norte, where the Troncal del Norte begins.
And uh, there they form riot control teams, uh, also uh, PPIs, right? And they are all military police, that's why they have that uh, that sign there that says military police. What's the mistake?
Having deployed them to uh, contain people uh, in a peaceful protest.
They are not authorized for that.
Who Are they authorized to do that? The riot control unit. But what is the protocol that the UMO should use? The first thing is to negotiate and discuss a withdrawal in good terms, not to deceive them and say, "We're only going to talk to the leaders, come here." And when they already have them there, they proceed with the capture. That is being completely cynical, and the one responsible for that is the head of the UMO, Sub-Commissioner Guillén, call sign Mateo. He's the worst kind of guy, a bootlicker who has been in every government, but the most bootlicking, right? And today he's just as much of a bootlicker, or even more so, right? Serving the political interests of whoever is in power.
Marvin, I'm asking you something, Marvin, is that the one who grabs Alejandro, the lawyer?
Yes, that's right. That image can be used so people can see it, but there he approaches him and grabs him as if he's talking to him, he grabs his backpack, you see? Let's see if it 's him. They can Look for the image of him, of Sub-Commissioner Guillén, the head of the police. This guy is the one who started that whole operation to capture them. Now, what message are they sending? A negative message.
Absolutely. A message of the police's dehumanization, right? Juan Carlos, sorry, Juan José already mentioned this, right? The dehumanization of the National Civil Police (PNC), the lack of public trust, the fear it generates.
All these aspects are key, right? They are symptoms of the deterioration of this entire political system that is entrenched in our country.
Now, what situation did we see there?
The problem arose. Then they come out and say that it's manipulation by leaders and that they are linked to the left, and so on. Well, who is more manipulative than them if they manipulate people?
Look at how they manipulated people during election time, saying, "If we lose seats and the opposition wins, they're going to overthrow the regime and the Gang members are going to take to the streets by the thousands to kill people, which is not true. That will never happen. But they manipulated people into going there to vote, deceived, and they voted for them." So, who's the manipulator? These people who are demanding something just, right? Who are demanding their land, a place to live, or those who want to entrench themselves in power forever, like they're going to live 200 years, right?
And that's not true. That's why I was saying that nature takes its course. Just as things rise, they also fall, and some fall suddenly. Exactly what we 're seeing with Bukele's popularity, his image as president plummeting, right? Because of all the mistakes he's making, right? Because he's alienating many sectors of the population and not addressing the country's serious problems.
Sectors like those affected by Kosabi—he could have fixed that in a long time. In a long time. People wouldn't have needed to be out in the sun, knocking on doors. And Juan José said something very important, the The Legislative Assembly is no longer the people's house. You can't just go there and ask to speak with the representatives because nobody will see you, least of all those from Nuevas Ideas, right? Except for a few ARENA representatives or Claudia Ortiz, who are the only ones the entire ruling party caucus receives, nobody will see you at all. I challenge anyone to go there, don't believe Franklin, Juan José, or me, don't believe us. Go and see for yourselves, take a project proposal, even one with a funding source, and ask to speak with someone from Nuevas Ideas and say, "Look, I want to speak with a representative, right?" Here I bring this project that will benefit the country. We 've worked on it and here's the whole technical file. Exactly. There it is. That's the figure we 're looking for.
This is the policeman you're talking about, the director of the UMO. Eva is the head of the UMO. He is the head of the UMO. Yes. Even that man, in your logic, came with the intention of starting the Chongue incident.
Yes, with the intention of capturing. He has had run-ins with us, with people from the movement, and he has been particularly harsh with some of us. Yes. And he has even considered capturing them, but he knows it won't be easy. But there he is protected, he is protected by Buchelism, he is not what happens, what happens is that these are groveling people, these are servile people who have no dignity, they have no identity of their own.
They just go where the wind takes them. I mean, they have absolutely nothing, well, I mean, they're really the worst kind of officers. This guy should have left the police force already; he's done too much damage to the institution, as have others who have tarnished the police with their absurd actions.
And this is one of them. This Guillén, if you remember, he captured that boy who was saying things in front of the Legislative Assembly when Bukele had just won the elections and Bukele said to release him. Do you remember that tweet? Do you remember that note? Ah, well, he was the one who captured him, this same Guillén, when the smoke was there for forensic medicine at that entrance of the Legislative Assembly and was speaking out about the water issue, it was a peaceful protest. And this boy started talking things and then he gave the order to capture him and then Bukele told them to release this boy. Bukele was at that time, he had already won the elections, but he had not yet assumed the position of constitutional president. So, you can see where this guy is coming from doing things. So, well, due to commitments I have, I'm going to have to withdraw abruptly.
You're going to be late for us, but I'm telling you, the community thanks you, Marvin. Man, thank you, Franklin, thank you Juan Carlos there.
Thank you for the space. Thank you.
Uh, I'll leave you with that so we can expand on it because there are other topics we haven't touched on, like the drug issue, we haven't discussed the gang issue in depth. I ask you to make space for next week and we won't cross paths. I truly appreciate it. Good evening, Marvin. Thank you.
And we're waiting, and I hope it doesn't cross my path so we can spend the full two hours together.
It's good, it's good.
Juan Carlos, we're there.
We'll stay with Juan José, and you can also send your regards to Juan José there, Marvin.
Yes, to Juan José. I'll call him Juan Carlos. I 'm changing its name. [laughs] Greetings.
Well, I want to ask you, Juan José, following this same logic, to wrap up this conversation a bit because frankly one is left wondering, one is left doubting, one is left thinking, "Wait for me, production is asking me to come in with the monitor," he says. Let's see, give me a second, give me a second, production, eh, you didn't catch me off guard, but I'm coming right now. Let's see. I'm coming right now, I'm coming right now, I'm coming right now, I'm coming right now.
Let's see. It's on a curve, but I'll be right there. Let's see. Uh, I think we're all set.
Let's see if we can get this discussion over with. Let Marvin put up with us for a little while. No, don't worry, this is part of the fun.
Let's see.
And the audio. Okay, we're all set. Well, as we were saying, wrapping up this conversation and highlighting what we've been discussing in this exercise, I ask, what recommendation do you have, Juan José? I imagine you haven't met yet; you're a community that dialogues, discusses, shares, and crosses these kinds of elements? Are they going to meet soon? uh, what kind of decisions are they going to make, but I want to ask you to give us a preview.
Can we trust these kinds of politicians? What kind of politicians are making the decisions?
I'll answer here, but I won't answer there.
Uh, it's an attempt to manipulate the fact that I posted a tweet and here I simply [clears throat] respond to people by slamming the door in their faces. What would you recommend to him/her? to the population. Juan José, you've been at this for a year, you've already had several deaths in the case, you haven't received a single explanation at this point, and the information that the press is increasingly expanding is grim, alarming, and frightening.
What feelings do you express to people? What level of respect and trust can we feel in these types of politicians who are in charge?
Well, look, since the Kosabi case became public, I think the most important thing was to get organized.
I have always maintained that organization is fundamental in any social sphere, at the community level, at the municipal level, at the sectoral level.
It's key. Well, in our case, I'm not going to get tired of saying it, and I think that now with this publication the challenge is for Nayibele.
In every space, I urge political will.
Today is the time to prove that what the media says is not true. Let's see if it's true, shall we?
In other words, when the government has made a mistake, whether premeditated or not, it always looks for a way to appear as a scapegoat, as unfortunately happened this week with the arrest of the cooperative's members.
Uh, [clears throat] in our case, I would say to the president, look, prove that everything published in this report, right?, that these tripartite colleagues from Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador have done, right?, prove what the report in today's newspaper says, prove that the reports that the UC has done are categorically false.
the order to the Legislative Assembly to approve the trust.
In other words, the scenario is exactly as the president likes it. He's currently up to his neck in trouble with the Kusabi case. His party is mired in so much mud that it's unbearable. So, he likes that kind of scenario, right? so that everyone will applaud him. Hey, I invite him to show some political will, to send out a tweet, just like he ordered everyone else to do, right? And look how dangerous that is, right? Well, look, Franklin, there won't be enough time to talk about what's happened this week, to talk about manipulation, and what's it called? Well, when the housing minister goes to the community and tells them, "You are not going to be evicted."
Half an hour later the judge reverses the court's decision to evict him.
What's that called? In a democracy. Is there a name for that in a democracy, Juan José?
Yes. Authoritarianism, that is, the executive giving orders to the judicial body for the sake of image.
So, that's great, right? Because the community will not be evicted. I expect a tweet where he also orders the judicial authorities to release the detained colleagues.
I hope that the president, in the Kosavi case, will order the Legislative Assembly to resolve the Cosavi case and prove that it is not true that the ruling party and its officials are involved in this.
Let's see, let's show political will.
It appears, it appears, it appears, involving the cousin and even the brother.
That's how it is.
And as I'm telling you, and not only in this case, Franklin, I mean, there are serious problems in the country.
The van issue, Franklin, the lighthouse video issue. A businessman dies at the hands of the state apparatus. Today what happened to our colleagues at the cooperative is happening again, right? They were going to be evicted.
Hey, look, look at the tweets. The arrest of transport businessmen is ordered, but not the arrest of deputies who have been named in these articles published by El Faro.
And here we must remember things, Franklin. The president himself asked his party to remove the immunity of two deputies from Nuevas Ideas because they were accused of wanting to divide the faction. Is the President of the Republic now going to ask that the immunity of the deputy be removed, the alternate deputy of Sue and Callejas, the deputy who was a goalkeeper for a football team, right?, who appears there pointed out.
Uh, I mean, like you said, when it suits me I tweet to boost my image and when it doesn't I pretend it's not about me.
So, look at you now, right? If all that's left is for them to send for the boy, right? From the cooperative who told him, "Mr. President, help," and have him taken to the presidential residence, right? And have him take a picture with the family, right? And the president and the president's children, right? The daughters, sorry. I mean, there's a series of political inconsistencies. Franklin, I want to close with this question. I see several comments along these lines, and I want to close with this question.
Is it possible that the Cosabi members weren't aware of everything that was happening within the cooperative, money being moved to political bodies, to the Nuevas Ideas party, that officials from Nayib Bukele's government were coming and meeting with Coto? Is it possible that the members were unaware of this entire operation? And finally, the last question. I'll leave you with both at once, Juan José, to wrap things up. Do you think, after everything we've seen, that they're going to get their money back?
Well, look, it's a difficult question. I think this is A question for Nayibele, right? And [clears throat] precisely for that reason, I never tire of making this political appeal.
Today, the president is the one who has to tweet whether what that publication says is true or false.
If it's false, then I urge him to order the approval of the trust, to approve 230 million to return the money to those affected.
The State will continue recovering the money, as the Superintendency is currently doing, with one small difference: while the Superintendency is doing it, those affected could take 10, 15 years to recover their money. How can you ask an 85-year-old person to wait 10, 15 years to recover their money?
So, uh, my appeal is to the president, because, uh, look, Franklin, we're back to the same thing, well, I mean, serious problems in the country are exploding in our faces, and we don't see any response. I mean, we see it all the time... The media reports people complaining that there are no medicines in health institutions. A promise was made to repair 5,000 schools, but it hasn't been done.
Strategic sectors like health, education, and agriculture are suffering budget cuts. There are layoffs in the public sector. And then there are announcements—I don't know what to call them, but they're fanciful—about injecting $1 billion into the country's economy. Now that it hasn't taken off, they've invented an industrial council that wasn't even announced by the president; the president announces it and then creates it. In other words, there's a whole complex process of problems, right?, that aren't being addressed or resolved by the authorities who were elected to solve those problems.
So, I would think that in the case of the unfortunate situation of the cooperative and the eviction, it has been manipulated by the government itself. We've all been following that case, and I think the government has achieved its objective, which is to divert attention from the real issue. Drugs in Panama, articles from El Faro, the death of a businessman—today the Kosabi case is rubbing salt in the wound for the ruling party.
How convenient, isn't it? For the president to spend the entire week talking about a cooperative problem and an eviction. And look how interesting, because loose lips sink ships. In the president's own tweets, he refers disparagingly to the supposed person who filed the lawsuit against the cooperative. He says, "And it seems he's from the ARENA party, although I don't have proof, something like that, one thing is certain." So the question is, what does the eviction of a cooperative have to do with passing a law to take away 30% of the funds from NGOs? In other words, we have to see that there is media manipulation here, and that's why in the case of the cooperative, which is good for the colleagues, since they are not going to be evicted, but it is not enough, we have to make the announcement that we have to release the colleagues who did not commit any crime.
But the big question is, what is the government going to do about this character?
So she filed the lawsuit. Are they going to put him in jail? They're going to make it disappear.
They've thought, Juan, about going to knock on the door of dreams. I'm putting it this way, then, because it makes sense. And I ask you, I ask you one thing, Juan José, that you clarify this for me. Did you have any information about all of this that was happening? There were prior suspicions, because a series of pieces of information began to surface that they realized, but they did nothing. In other words, those affected by Cosabi, the partners of Cosa, saw this coming.
Wow, look, there's a lot of information in that article, isn't there? I'm going to tell you what I've experienced from what that article published.
When I was on your show, well, half an hour or 20 minutes before, I think it was about 15 minutes, we cut and it appeared in the note.
I was saying at that moment, Franklin, we are concerned about Mr. Coto's life. Yes.
15, 20, 30 minutes later the helicopter crashes. Well, probably, because there were some media outlets that knew what happened that same day my mother died.
Hey, you have no idea how many national and international media outlets wanted to contact me to get my opinion about the helicopter.
Uh, how was I supposed to know that helicopter was going to crash?
Yes, it won't work. The report says that Mr. Coto's fingernails are not appearing. If I was at my mother's wake in Chalatenango, man, or if someone wants to accuse me of going to Mr. Coto's wake. Moreover, some of those affected wanted to go, and I suggested to them that we not go so as not to create an altercation with Mr. Coto's family, that we had to be respectful of his death.
So I didn't go to the funeral home.
I didn't tell Hector Silva, look, I saw that Mr. Coto's corpse didn't have fingernails, it had some, uh, there's talk that government officials arrived and that there were videos.
How am I supposed to know that kind of thing?
How was I supposed to know about the deployment and the military operation that ultimately resulted in the helicopter crash?
If the official information was given by the prosecutor, he said, "This man is detained in Panama."
So, look, there are about 10 things in that article that I think the Attorney General of the Republic should explain. What happened during that operation to bring them back? They let everyone speak.
Hey, Mr. Chavi Sabla should explain himself, the president of the Nuevas Ideas party. Why should I be the one to explain the post?
I was unaware that the party... look, I joined the cooperative in 2022 and there's talk about loans to new ideas in 2020. How am I supposed to know about that kind of thing? How am I going to have access to documents?
to that letter that has been made public.
Here Juan José says, I heard what people are saying. I recommend that those affected by Cosabi go to their dreams.
Well, look, I told you at the beginning, it was a possibility.
Well, I congratulate the cooperative, even though unfortunately what happened to them has happened.
Now, look, we haven't been exempt from the same thing happening to us as happened to the cooperative.
We were the first to drink the wine.
Having done it in the condition in which we did it was also enough to make them want to fire the police at that moment.
We went to S City, we went to take the World Trade Center, well, we didn't take it, did we?
We held a press conference there, and World Trade Center security wanted to prevent that. It is not our fault that the Inter-American Development Bank office is here. And look how interesting.
Two weeks ago we went to leave a note expressing our concern about transparency mechanisms, and just yesterday the front page of a newspaper stated that the IDB has pointed out serious transparency problems in this government.
So, look, right? I don't think it's a question of whether or not we're going to be brave enough to pursue our dreams today.
We have done things that no other social movement has done. I'm being very honest with you. My respects and admiration for the community that made those dreams a reality.
Uh, it's really shameful to see the security forces providing protection to a private residence under the pretext that the president is there and could be in danger.
The president was not there. It would be good if the government told us where the president has been since April 11th.
So, uh, what can I say, Franky? Our fight will continue, wo n't it?
Probably with this being made public, as I said, the emotions and feelings of those affected have been diverse, from discomfort, indignation, anger, frustration, fear, even, well yes, of course, for example, right? What did they achieve with this activity?
Precisely so that no one tries to go back to their dreams to see if they can achieve them.
If they don't want people to go to the dreams, then what are they doing building a presidential house there?
It's right.
So, right? I, I close Franklin, uh, saying, I think this report confirms what we have maintained for more than a year, that our issue was not just a financial issue, it was a political issue. The political class, the ruling party, interfered and used the cooperative for its political activities. Today is the moment for the president to prove that this is not true according to him and his party, and the best way to do so is by approving the trust.
Only then will we believe that this government truly has the will to solve a problem. And watch out, right? I'm not going to get tired of saying it, and today B has told you. Resolving the Cosabi case, Mr. Nayib Bukele, will improve your international image before international financial institutions.
Well, it was actually a good chat. We still have several topics to discuss, what you all are going to do in the future, how things are going, how you're seeing this, what other international spaces. I'll leave you hanging to see if later on, when this has already happened, because as these topics explode, other threads start to appear. Let's wait a little while, Juan José, and we'll meet again. And I, what I truly want to say is that I send my message of solidarity to all those affected by Cosabi. This has truly been a real shock. They were deceived. They were deceived. They lied to them.
And I believe that in this past year, Juan José, the times you have come to knock on the door, the times you have come to the Superintendency, the messages you have given, they have received them with the intention of not turning their backs on you. There is no, I don't see any will from this government to address and resolve this. We'll talk about that later. Does that sound good to you, Juan José?
Thank you. Good evening.
Well, thank you Franklin, on behalf of those affected, and personally, it's always a pleasure to accept your invitation, and well, greetings to all your audience, and we look forward to inviting each other again. He's been asking a lot of questions lately, but we still have a very open agenda, but we 've touched on, I think, the most important things. I thank all of you, my dear laarcito community, for being part of this exercise, for all your inquiries, your questions, your comments, your doubts, and your message of solidarity. I've also sent messages of solidarity to you, Juan José, and to all those affected by Cosabi.
I believe we shouldn't let these issues go. We must not let them go. We have to keep pressing the issue, and although it may sound a bit challenging and risky, we have to do it, don't you think? We will continue working in this direction.
What a great conversation. We have learned details that we did not have at hand. I promise you that I will continue inviting people who can guide us, who can expand our information, but above all, who can give us data. Give us the data.
Good night. See you tomorrow on the midday viral segment, and in the evening we'll try to have a program with the furry ones to analyze a bit of everything that's happened this week.
Rest.
[music] [music] [music] Ah.
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