NDP MP Leah Gazan and Senator Kim Pate speak about bill targeting solitary confinement

追加: 2026-05-07

[00:00:00]Senate as passed Tona's Law, Bill S-205.

[00:00:03]This bill is a combination of nearly a decade of efforts by senators to uphold human rights in the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms in prisons. Today, our sponsor, MP Leah Gazan, and Senate sponsor, Senator Kim Pate, are hosting a news conference to discuss discuss next steps for Tona's Law in the house. MP Gazan and Senator Pate, the floor is yours. Thank you so very much.

[00:00:34]It's our pleasure to be here on the shores of the Kitchissippi in the unceded, unsurrendered, unreturned territory of the Algonquin Anishinabek Nation.

[00:00:42]Uh this the issue of uh you the use of segregation, the lack of use of options to alternatives to segregation, is an issue that has been ongoing in this country for many, many years. In 2019, uh in response to court cases that called the use of segregation in this country illegal and unlawful, and I outlined the many ways in which it violated human rights, uh called resulted in the federal government introducing a piece of legislation that would amend the Corrections and Conditional Release Act, which came into effect in 1992, and was at that time heralded as a piece of human rights legislation aimed at upholding the human rights of prisoners.

[00:01:31]Uh particularly focusing on the increasing crisis at that time of the overrepresentation of Indigenous people in prison.

[00:01:41]In 2019, when Bill C-83 was introduced, it was argued that it would actually eliminate the use of solitary confinement, uh but as many of us raised concerns at the time, it has essentially resulted in the renaming of segregation and the removal of some of the uh oversight mechanisms and legal uh remedies that existed at the time prior to Bill C-83. As a follow-up when that bill was in the Senate, the Senate made a number of amendments to the bill, and those were led in large part by uh Indigenous Senator uh Senator Forese Singh. Uh when we after that, a number of senators, including the the uh Senate sponsor of Bill C-83, um organized um efforts to evaluate what was happening in the prisons post-Bill C-83, and what we found um has been echoed by the Ministerial Advisory Committee, as [snorts] well as many of the Correctional Investigator, and that is that the law has not been upheld, it's inadequate, and that isolation continues not in not just in the form of structured intervention units, which is the name that is used now that replaced the use of segregation, but also in many other forms. That led the Senate um under the leadership of uh the late Senator Forese Singh to decide to to put forth what is now uh Bill S-205, Tona's Law. It was then Bill S-230, and it repeats the amendments that the Senate made uh that that Senate made to Bill uh C-83, and it uh has just passed the Senate now as Bill S-205. I became the sponsor when sadly, Senator Forese Singh fell ill and then uh passed away uh in uh in 2020.

[00:03:37]>> [snorts] >> So, the bill uh would um reinforces uh recommendations made by the Senate Human Rights Committee uh in the federally in the review of um the human rights of federally sentenced persons. It takes on the amendments that were made and passed in the Senate in 2019.

[00:03:57]Uh the bill it Bill S-230 passed the Senate and was in the House of Commons, but died on the order paper when Parliament was prorogued and subsequently the the most recent election was called, and uh we are now in a situation where it has passed the Senate again, and it's now come been uh referred over to the House of Commons.

[00:04:20]So, the provisions that are probably of greatest interest to many uh at a time when Indigenous women are one in two uh prisoners in federal prisons, and Indigenous men are one in three, um in addition to requiring judicial oversight of isolation, uh the original intent of sections like sections 81 and 84, uh which were brought put in place in large part to help reduce the overrepresentation of Indigenous peoples, um there has been uh an in uh the the bill would push the federal government to where a community indicates they want to have members of their community back in their community.

[00:05:01]It puts the responsibility on Corrections to actually mount the case for why that should not happen, as opposed to what happened when when those provisions were introduced in 1992, which was that many Indigenous communities didn't even know they existed. That meant Corrections took control and limited the availability of those options. Right now, they're often interpreted as the options that provide for healing lodges. Healing lodges is one form that section 81 and 84 releases can take, but it's not the only one. The other thing the bill does in um to reflect the increasing use of isolation and over-incarceration of black uh trans, other um folks, folks with mental health issues, is to encourage the use of those provisions by those communities as well. It also introduces a remedy that Louise Arbour first recommended 30 years ago, and that is where the human rights of prisoners have been violated, that uh prisoners can return to court to have their sentence revisited. So, that's essentially the bill, and I'm very, very pleased that um that it's an Indigenous Senator, started with an Indigenous Senator, and it's an um Senator um Member of Parliament Leah Gazan is sponsoring it in the House of Commons.

[00:06:15]Well, thank you so uh much, uh Kim. Uh you know, I Kim uh Senator Kim Pate has done tremendous work uh on this file, and it's through the work of in fact Senator Kim Pate that um I learned about uh even Ton- Tona's story.

[00:06:34]Uh and uh the impacts that solidarity solitary confinement had on her life.

[00:06:42]And it's also given me an opportunity to have a full first-hand close look inside of prisons, and I can see that although the federal government has changed uh the name uh for solitary confinement, what I have witnessed with my very own eyes uh in prisons is in fact a continuation of the practice of solitary confinement. Solitary confinement, which we know has been linked to um uh linked to uh individuals acquiring even more exacerbate uh exacerbated complex mental health and trauma issues. That was very uh apparent to me when I visited prisons, uh how the impacts of solitary confinement on people that are being placed in them.

[00:07:34]Uh and it's no secret, this government is no friend to Indigenous peoples.

[00:07:38]We're looking at one in two currently incarcerated persons being Indigenous women.

[00:07:44]Uh we are seeing one in three uh incarcerated persons being Indigenous men, and you know, as Amnesty International recently confirmed, this government is backpedaling on the rights of Indigenous peoples, including rights uh and considerations that have been affirmed by the courts, such as uh Gladue and Ipeelee. You being able to use Gladue and Ipeelee uh principles when making decisions, uh replacing that with uh you know, returning back to to archaic practices that we know does not reduce recidivism, things like mandatory minimums. Uh you know, because we are seeing a push by this government uh against any sort of prevention to keep people out of jails, uh the fact that we are seeing an increase of number of people in jails, the fact that the this the the current situation in jails does not uphold international law, including their use of solitary uh confinement unions uh units speaks to the need uh for this bill to ensure the protection uh and to uh ensure Canada upholds uh international conventions that they have signed on to. So, I'm very honored uh to sponsor uh this bill on the house side. I encourage all members of Parliament to really take a look at it. Um and I'm looking forward to working with other members of Parliament and continuing alongside uh my work uh with Senator Kim Pate to help this bill uh receive royal assent.

[00:09:32]Now, it's time for questions from reporters. We'll start in the room, followed by people online. One question, one follow-up.

[00:09:43]Uh so, first name with APTN News. Um Uh I know that uh the problem has been that even though that Corrections Services Canada is not supposed to uh use solitary confinement, they continue to get around that and do it.

[00:09:56]So, what uh what do you think are the parts in this bill that will make it more difficult for CSC to to continue to use solitary confinement? Sure. So, one of the things that this bill would require is after 48 hours, if corrections wants to keep something in a form of separation, and the definition is actually the definition that they currently use for SIUs, but saying that that applies beyond just the SIUs. And that, you know, some also tell you what the response of corrections has been so far is that that will put too much of an onus or responsibility on corrections that they can't meet. What that tells you is they already if they cannot meet that obligation, one, they already use video court, so and we're talking they're saying we're talking about anywhere from 800 to 2,000 people per year.

[00:10:52]We know that courts routinely deal with you know, thousands of bail applications within 24 hours.

[00:10:59]And so, the reality is if they don't have the paperwork done within 48 hours, it means they have violated at least three parts of the existing legislation.

[00:11:10]One, the need to do a mental health assessment to determine whether it's appropriate to have someone in in segregation. Two, the review of every other possible intervention to determine that the SIU is the only appropriate.

[00:11:24]And three, the 24-hour review following that to indicate that in fact it's they'll they can keep someone beyond.

[00:11:33]So, and why 48 hours?

[00:11:36]I don't know if that's part of your question, but why 48 hours is when the segregation courts were segregation cases were going through the courts, it was found that within 48 hours, and sometimes earlier than that, you can see irreparable harm done to individuals, psychological, neurological, and physiological.

[00:11:58]And certainly internationally as a member of parliament Ms. Ms. Gazan has outlined, the international standard is more than 15 days in isolation can amount to torture under the convention on the elimination of torture internationally. And so, 15 days has often been used as the end point. We also have a charter of rights and freedoms that talks about cruel and unusual punishment. And so, the question obviously becomes where between the a few hours and 15 days does cruel and unusual punishment come in? And so, there may very well be some some additional challenges. Many people think we should be eliminating it entirely. Psychiatrists who work in the system often talk about the debilitating impact. And we know that in in many jurisdictions, you know, Ontario right now is in the courts about another matter of using isolation in psychiatric hospitals, but that the use of isolation is something that worldwide is being questioned in every kind of institutional setting.

[00:13:05]I guess the other question is they're getting fairly deep in the parliamentary session of this term, maybe about another 6 weeks left, 5 6 weeks.

[00:13:15]Do you think you'll be able to get it on the agenda for this current sitting?

[00:13:22]Well, we currently have a majority government.

[00:13:25]You know, I'm sure it might not make it before summer, but certainly after summer, the the summer or when the fall session begins, this is certainly something that our leader, our new leader Avi Lewis, has come out 100% supporting the bill as as somebody who is also a defender of the charter and human rights.

[00:13:51]And this this will be certainly something that we will push for, our party will push for.

[00:13:59]I note that Tony Mills actually did pass away last month. Did you have a chance to talk to her before she passed away? Mhm.

[00:14:09]Yeah, I saw her several times in the just since the fall.

[00:14:13]And she died February 19th.

[00:14:16]She succumbed, as you know, to she had cancer and succumbed. And in fact, her family was here on Tuesday when we did the third reading and the vote on Tony's Law.

[00:14:29]One of the last things she asked me is why me?

[00:14:33]And I I said, "Well, you know, what do you mean by why me?" And she said, "Well, why did you" she had been locked in isolation when I met her. Some of you have seen the cages that were created.

[00:14:43]The fact she had was chained to the floor sometimes, that she rarely was out of any kind of isolation. And when she was, she was often fully shackled.

[00:14:53]And my response was, "Why not her?"

[00:14:57]And you know, but it made me think about the extent to which we accept the labels that are often applied. She developed she was diagnosed when she was into the mental health system as having isolation-induced schizophrenia.

[00:15:13]And you know, when I first met her, she was a very she had been an honor roll high school student. She had been escaping a horrific situation of incestuous rape when she went in in search of her birth father.

[00:15:31]And she um you know, she was dealing with a lot of trauma that first time she was criminalized. And she fought back at every opportunity, every time she was strip searched. And and that led her as many many women, but most particularly indigenous women who have past experiences of trauma, that led her to be described as dangerous and violent.

[00:15:54]When everybody in the care home she was in for the last few years before she died, when they read accounts, you know, descriptions of how she was described when she was in prison, they couldn't believe it was the same person.

[00:16:10]And certainly any staff many staff members contacted her over the last year or so apologizing for their part in how she was treated in the prison system.

[00:16:22]And most everybody agreed that if you treated as most most like most people, if you treated her with kindness and dignity and respect, that's what you got in return. And in fact, the staff at the house talked about she was in a home that was had other folks with significant mental health issues. And they talked about the kindness and patience she showed to folks even when someone might come into a room and take something or threaten her, the fact that she did not respond in kind. So, you know, it's it all this the naming it after Tony also is a symbol of how how much our prisons have become the repositories of those who are failed by every other system. And she exemplifies that.

[00:17:12]So, just you know, I mean Tony's story is is not an isolated story. And this, you know, we try and rehabilitate people. The focus is through means of punishment.

[00:17:27]But my question is, how do you create prosocial behavior in a totally antisocial, violent environment? How can you reduce violence when you force people in situations that are antisocial and violent? That is the prison systems.

[00:17:48]And we know there's a lot of reoffending because you cannot because we don't focus on rehabilitation, because the focus is on punishment, punishment often of people who have had a life of punishment before becoming incarcerated, we know the system doesn't work. We know through research that the best way to deal with crime is through prevention, through providing people with the supports they need to get the help they need.

[00:18:17]The one of the reasons why my my good friend and Senator Kim Pate and I have pushed for things like a guaranteed livable basic income, affordable housing with rent geared to income, access to head-to-toe healthcare including mental healthcare.

[00:18:35]It costs a lot less to look after people than to deal with people after the event has occurred, after the wrong has occurred, and to then put people in positions that exacerbate pre-existing trauma and mental health is costing not only costs a lot of money, it is totally un unsupported through research way of really lifting up and supporting public safety. The worst of it is segregation, like I said, I have been in prisons, I have seen these solitary confinement units units.

[00:19:22]I most people wouldn't last a day in it without permanent impacts.

[00:19:28]They are barbaric.

[00:19:31]And you know, I I really hope if we're serious about this whole focus on, you know, getting tough on crime and seeing solutions, that we actually take a public health response to reduce crime, not utilize methods that actually increase crime and sustain crime. That costs milli- billions of dollars, Canadian dollars, to sustain a system that is archaic and just doesn't work if we want to see real change.

[00:20:03]And it's uh the government currently and in introducing bills C-14 and C-16 simultaneously talked about the need for, I think Senator our Minister Fraser called it the the third pillar, the prevention component. Um and on an economic level alone um providing options other than incarceration makes incredible fiscal sense.

[00:20:28]Uh by the end, the type of the type of incarceration that Tonah was subject to and that many, many other women right now are being subject to can cost more than half a million dollars per year.

[00:20:41]Imagine what an Indigenous community can do in this country with just one of those individuals, how they could invest those resources in housing, in health care, in uh you know, therapeutic supports that would not only assist that individual but contribute to the community as a whole. And so really it's calling on the government to uh to live up to the promises they've made to Canadians in a in a fiscal way but also in terms of a more effective response.

[00:21:21]Uh since we don't have anyone online, um this marks the end of the news conference. So MP Gazan, Senator Pate, thank you. Thank you very much.

[00:21:32]>> Thank you very much.