Debate: A Horrifying View of Heaven

Added: 2026-05-05

[00:00:00]I gosh, I wish they would I wish they would hear that like deeply hear that, [snorts] you know?

[00:00:08]Okay. Oh, Snart is back.

[00:00:12]It's a fun name, by the way.

[00:00:15]Hello, welcome back.

[00:00:17]Hello.

[00:00:20]How do I sound now? Can you hear me?

[00:00:22]Yes, and I I do not hear an echo, so hurray.

[00:00:26]>> [laughter] >> Yeah, hurray.

[00:00:29]So, what can I do for you?

[00:00:32]Well, it's kind of interesting cuz I don't usually do the podcasts, but something prompted me to and then I kind of heard your story. You were saying you've had a hard time trying to you know, get that you asked God to come to you and he really hasn't.

[00:00:49]And so that's the reason that I came to you, but I'm going to I'm going to share what happened to me and pray that it can happen to you. Well, so this is not the place to share a testimony.

[00:01:03]Um, if you want to discuss why heaven doesn't make sense, I'm happy to do that, but um this would not be the That's kind of what this is. What? We can just directly talk about heaven, but this is not the place to share a testimony.

[00:01:19]Okay.

[00:01:22]Um, so do you believe in a heaven that is a place without sin and without suffering?

[00:01:35]Absolutely. Okay.

[00:01:37]So, do you think there's free will in heaven?

[00:01:45]Do I think there's free will? Mhm.

[00:01:48]Well, we were made to worship the Father. That's what we were made for, so you have to look at it like that.

[00:01:55]So, no. Like we are programmed to worship God and so we >> actually made to worship God.

[00:02:04]Great. Okay. So, that's a no on the free will then.

[00:02:10]Well, you can I don't understand I mean, I can't explain what your version of free will is. You can do what you want, but when you're in heaven, you're going to be worshipping. You're going to be able to do the things that you want to do, but but you're there to worship God.

[00:02:23]That is what you're there for.

[00:02:26]Okay.

[00:02:28]So, infinitely worshipping God is your idea of paradise.

[00:02:37]No, that's a totally different situation. My My idea of paradise is going to the casino and gambling 24/7 cuz I love to gamble.

[00:02:45]But that's not what God made us for.

[00:02:48]So, our free will is taking away from what he wants. And he ba- basically, we have to bend to his will if we want to be in heaven.

[00:02:59]Why do you want to be in heaven?

[00:03:03]Well, well, you know, I always I always thought when we die, I like when I die, I just want to be dead. I mean, literally, I just want to be in the ground and I'm dead and that's done. Okay? But what I found out is that's not the case.

[00:03:19]So, you can be with Here's what Here's what your choices are. They're very simple. You can be with God or you can be without God, but to be without God means you'll be in a place that you won't want to be. It's not like heaven.

[00:03:32]I mean, so far how you've described heaven is also not a place I would want to be.

[00:03:38]Well, if you're not in heaven, you're going to be in a place that's very hot where you're tortured 24/7 forever and all eternity. And that is your choice.

[00:03:48]God will allow you to not be with him.

[00:03:51]But to not be with him is to be in that place cuz there's only two places.

[00:03:57]Do you think God is good?

[00:04:00]God is beyond incredible.

[00:04:03]Uh no, I mean, like morally good.

[00:04:07]I just said what I said. He is beyond reproach.

[00:04:10]He is bro- beyond reproach. I mean, he he knows everything. He made everything.

[00:04:15]He is everything. We are him.

[00:04:18]He made us. Without him, we are not we don't exist. Yeah, okay. So, the God that you worship created a system in which all he just created all of these billions of humans for the purpose of worshipping him.

[00:04:38]That's exactly what he created us >> okay, and if when we die, we only have two choices.

[00:04:45]And the two choices are worship me forever or I will set you on fire and burn you forever.

[00:04:55]That's incorrect. We don't have two choices.

[00:04:59]I thought that's what you just said.

[00:05:01]There's only two options.

[00:05:03]Yeah. Before you die, you have two choices. When you die, I meant Okay.

[00:05:10]The- there are only two possibilities when you die. Correct? That's correct.

[00:05:16]Okay. So, you worship a God that has set up two possibilities.

[00:05:22]Either love me and worship me forever and if you won't worship me forever, you will burn forever.

[00:05:32]Is that right? Those are the two choices. No. No, you're incorrect. I'll give you exactly what it is. You don't have to worship him. And you will be sent to the place He will allow you to not worship him. And that place is a very hot place where you'll be tortured forever and ever. That's what I just >> have to worship him. That's what I just described. Yes. So, if I don't want to worship >> You're saying if you worship God.

[00:05:58]I said if you don't want to worship God, then your only other option is burning forever.

[00:06:06]That is correct. Okay. So, you worship God. You worship a God that has created a system where there's only two choices.

[00:06:16]Love God or burn.

[00:06:18]And you think this is a good God.

[00:06:24]Do you love your mother?

[00:06:26]My mother would never do that to me.

[00:06:31]Well, many mothers do and many fathers do. Many mothers >> on. Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Many mothers say that the child has to love the mother or they will set the child on fire?

[00:06:44]No, they end their life before they're even born. It's called abortion. Oh God.

[00:06:49]That's what it is. Here's Here's really what the problem is. You're facing the same problem. No, I'm I Give me a chance to speak. I called in. Give me a chance to speak. I mean, if you don't want people to call in, then I I want you to stay focused on the topic. I don't want you to use this as a platform to preach.

[00:07:09]So, you're welcome to stay if you will stay on topic.

[00:07:13]Okay, if you interrupt constantly, there's no reason for us to call in.

[00:07:17]Okay. Sounds good then.

[00:07:26]Wow, that made a sharp left turn that I was not expecting.

[00:07:34]Um, I cannot understand how you could say all those words out loud and think that that God was good. Like that that's wild.