Ideas con Fuerza #240 | Gonzalo Fuenzalida, Felipe Vidal y Johannes Kaiser

Added: 2026-05-20

[00:00:00]If I never joined any party at the university, or anything, OK, let's go on air because it was a condition for them to take me as a candidate.

[00:00:09]Wow, Gonzalo Fenalía's statements are quite strong. It's a shame that no one who is listening to the radio heard it on the dial because it was already being heard on social media. That's a lie, nothing serious. We stand with Johannes Kaiser, we stand with Gonzalo Fuenzalía. Ideas with Force begins at 7 pm on Tuesday, May 12, 2026.

[00:00:32]Johannes Kaiser, I tell the people who are watching and listening, is heading to the Presidential Palace of Cerro Castillo because there is a conclave of the ruling party there headed by his excellence the President of the Republic, José Antonio Cast.

[00:00:48]And in parallel, sorry, it will be palace, that's what it's called, that's what it's called, it's the voice of Gonzalo Fenal. And in the National Congress, relatively close to the Cerro Castillo Palace, the Finance Committee, my dear Gonzalo, is in session.

[00:01:09]Finally, look, there were 1295 proposals submitted, but the government cleverly submitted substitute proposals, so with that it somehow blocks the others, because as was explained so precisely you cannot argue proposals of proposals.

[00:01:32]Uh, no, and besides, be careful because of those 12 we'll see how many are declared inadmissible.

[00:01:40]Of course, we discussed it yesterday because these are matters that fall under the purview of the President of the Republic. So, those 12 indications the secretariat has to review with the president regarding admissibility, and I assure you that half of them will be rejected.

[00:01:57]Yes, she's busier than the House secretary. Uh, today an interesting article came out in the second one. There goes Mr. Johan Skyiser, who has already managed to connect. Wow, very elegant Johan, very very elegant. Lent to the president, Mr. Johanes, you're going to say what a cold guy this is, yes I recognize it, but the most important thing about today's meeting, what's on the menu? Do you know the menu or have they not sent it to you yet?

[00:02:24]I like the menu and I'm starving right now. Not anymore. [laughs] I think I have it, but I know, but I know what the menu was, the last, the last conclave, the one he participated in yesterday. Yes, no, the last one was when the Communist Party was still involved.

[00:02:43]No, but please, hey, Rico, the carrot-wrapped boy. Listen, but yesterday there was one with the Republican party, no more.

[00:02:50]Yes, I understand that with the members of parliament.

[00:02:54]Exactly.

[00:02:55]Now a conclave is something else entirely. If we are going to talk about the topic of the public account of June 1st, Johan, here on the table. I do n't think we have a general discussion, but the meeting is open to receive the concerns of those who participate. In this case, it is essentially the senators who are on the side of the government.

[00:03:27]We are invited because we have practically supported most of the executive's projects, although we are obviously not part of the Mexican Executive.

[00:03:43]Clear. And you're going in your capacity as president of the National Libertarian Party, right?

[00:03:48]In that capacity I am invited. That's correct.

[00:03:51]Good. Gonzalo Fenalía, how many conclaves did you attend at the Presidential Palace of Cerro Castillo?

[00:03:58]Not much, because the pandemic came.

[00:04:00]Ah, not much. Damn, what a shame. It didn't last long. October came, the October movement, and then the pandemic. So, they were made that year, but they weren't made much anymore, no, no, no, they weren't made much. They became one that brought them all together, they brought us all together.

[00:04:23]I think it was the same as what was done now, but this business of meeting, President Piñera seems not to have liked going there during the week as much as President Caso. Now, I think it's a good place.

[00:04:41]To meet with the parliamentary world, that is, it is strategic and I think that President Carlos is spending a lot of time on that, because in the end politics is built by talking and eating and eating.

[00:04:59]Well, in fact, we actually had lunch with Minister Secres today.

[00:05:04]Ah, we didn't present our agenda to him.

[00:05:07]Our legislative agenda includes a series of projects. Can we give you any updates?

[00:05:15]Yes, they confirmed to us that they were going to give us priority for the false accusations project, that is, to move forward with legislation on that matter.

[00:05:28]Uh, which other one? Okay, let's look at the issue of sanctions against those who do not respond to parliamentary requests, which is a fairly cross-cutting issue, but one that we continue to push with greater intensity to see what happens there. We talked about the rule of use of force, which is also a topic to study.

[00:05:49]Last week, my OSTA project at the forensic medical service was given priority, meaning that the forensic medical service can begin working without the bureaucratic obstacle of having to wait for an order from a prosecutor or judge to identify the remains in its possession, in order to carry out all the necessary examinations, including identifying the causes of death, etc. And there was another project that they gave us, six or seven projects, and for three we have a confirmed urgency, which is not bad in principle.

[00:06:30]But, but, Johan, forgive the journalistic suspicion, but beyond anything else and what you were explaining regarding what you think will happen in a little while at this official conclave there in Cerro Castillo, there are circumstances, let's say, there are contexts, there are previous situations, what has happened with the government reform, the security issue, and also what is coming now on June 1st. So the question is inevitable, and I imagine that these topics will inevitably come up in this conclave, right?

[00:07:12]Well, it's quite possible. I told the minister directly, this is no secret, I have raised this in many different forums, that I expected the public account to be very thorough. We want to know how President Cast received President Boric's government. We want to know how the situation is, what the evolution has been both of public finances and of the number of public officials, uh in the police force, etc., etc. We want to know everything. So that? In order to be able to make a comparison in a year with respect to the current situation.

[00:07:46]And we'll probably discuss this now as well, along with other topics that are of particular interest to us, such as the issue of how the pardon will be handled, etc., since we, at least, are not committed to positions where we continue trying to move forward, and also the issue of contribution.

[00:08:15]Ones, it's that we're seeing and in the same project, well, most of all this, the truth is that most of these conversations are going to take place in the same committees, especially regarding the reconstruction project.

[00:08:27]Clear.

[00:08:28]Well, we haven't filed many complaints, in fact I think only two or three in the Treasury, but we did file several in the labor and environment departments.

[00:08:41]Yes.

[00:08:42]Why? Because they are not unconstitutional there. If we get involved with the tax issue, it would be unconstitutional, regardless of how much we want or are interested in advancing the issue. We do n't want to bend the Constitution in a way that will later hurt us because we can't defend it.

[00:09:01]Of course, it's a bit like what Gonzalo was saying a little while ago, when you have a connection problem. Uh, and I'm also going to ask you this, Johanes, but so as not to leave Gonzalo behind in the conversation. Hey, you feel, Gonzalo, that beyond whether it might be too soon, there's still time to evaluate, we have to give it time, we shouldn't rush things and all those phrases, let's say. Um, you feel that it's not necessary, it's not appropriate, and you're not in favor of making a potential cabinet reshuffle?

[00:09:40]No, but not yet. I'm asking because there are some whispers suggesting that something like that is being discussed, right? At this conclave, please. No, no, I think that, like, in two months, there are things that one believes, I mean, one could say that there are some people who don't have the knack for the piano and they won't have it, they'll never play the piano well, because they're not suited for the position. Well, but there might be surprises along the way, but we have to give it time. I think it's crazy to start making cabinet changes so prematurely. So, if there were a change, I think it should be in September or at the end of the year.

[00:10:29]Well, that's what I think. But I don't think he'll make any cabinet changes now. All those speculations, I believe, are just speculations, unless they resign like the undersecretary of energy.

[00:10:43]Secretary of science, sorry, of science. The science secretary resigned, so one could say, well, if they resign it's another thing, but this way it's a cabinet change and they take out one to put in another.

[00:10:56]But I believe a cabinet reshuffle before the end of the year is inevitable.

[00:11:01]Clearly, there will be, sooner or later.

[00:11:05]Yes. And especially those who came into government with little experience and have made quite a few mistakes in two months [laughs] and will possibly continue to do so, not because they want to, but because they lack political savvy.

[00:11:25]And I'll tell you one thing, the only thing that is unforgivable is political inconsistency. That's why I would remove a minister or an undersecretary if they do n't work in alignment with the political line, and the political line has to be very clearly defined. Uh, now there might be some kind of, what's it called?

[00:11:52]Organizational deficiency. You may not have the knack for running a ministry, or you may not have understood the logic in the end. Perfect, okay. But I would say that the most serious thing in a government that lives off politics, the lifeblood of a government, is its political position. It means ceasing to have a political position. I mean, he's literally dying of anemia.

[00:12:18]And there, I think it will be very interesting to see how this executive branch evolves, whether it maintains itself or whether it becomes an administrative government or continues to be a government of transformation. That's something you can't yet define in two months, where things are headed.

[00:12:37]But, but you mean. Me, sorry, Gonzalo, go ahead. No, obviously 2 months is very little time, but it has to be a government of transformation because, I mean, the promise with which the government came to power, with that 58% who supported it, was that things were going to change, they were going to transform, but not transformations in the sense of saying that we were going to be the death of the neoliberal system or that we wanted to change the systems, we wanted to eliminate the FP, things that we know perfectly well that are not going to happen.

[00:13:10]They ended up putting money into the private health insurance company.

[00:13:13]Yes, they did the exact opposite, but it does transform things now into taking charge of the fundamental issues that mattered most to Chileans then and still matter to them today.

[00:13:27]One, the issue of public order, security, crime, the feeling of insecurity and everything that is happening in our country. Yeah, that's vital, vital, and there's still a lot to be done. and to show what is being done.

[00:13:43]And secondly, and you, forgive me, Gonzalo, forgive me. And speaking of that, do you feel there's a security plan in place? No.

[00:13:51]And do you think that's necessary from a structural point of view, to say, "Hey, this goes beyond what's been said in the last few hours about certain operations, well, here, there, but you feel it should exist because there are other voices pointing out, hey, be careful, things are done and not talked about, especially in matters of security. You have to be, you shouldn't be so, how to say it? You shouldn't be so open, or talk about or show your security strategy.

[00:14:24]I'm putting both things on the table.

[00:14:25]On that, on that I agree, obviously you shouldn't go around talking about it, especially in matters of security, but I think there was a strategy, I could be wrong, but I think there was a strategy for the issue of the northern border.

[00:14:39]Ah, to tame a person here, which is the first thing the government did, send a person as general coordinator, a former uniformed officer, and be able to do something on the northern border that would stop this uncontrolled migration."

[00:14:54]Putting certain brakes on things, anyway. And I think there was a plan and a somewhat clear strategy. In fact, President CAS, when he was a candidate, went several times, so it seems like what needed to be done was well analyzed because it's more than just doing something, doing a public works project, you see?

[00:15:14]But in terms of security, I think there were many ideas, but as for a management plan, I don't think so. And I think there was. And to round off what we've been discussing with Johannes here, the first thing, in my opinion, is that you have to have the police working on your side.

[00:15:38]And the police today have been going through a difficult process since October, carried out by the most extreme left-wing groups who have inhibited police action so that every time the police acted, they received complaints from the Human Rights Institute, and that went on until yesterday. So, when the same undersecretary plus the Council of Defense of the State and even the Catholic Church, right? Not the Catholic Church, but everyone loves each other.

[00:16:11]Of course. So, one of the first measures, in my opinion, is to make certain gestures towards the police. We've talked about pardons for the Carabineros who are currently in prison for doing their job on October 18th and trying to impose order with the force that the State and the law give them, maintaining public order in a situation of public disorder that had already been overcome. So, we have to make certain gestures, and secondly, because we have to re-empower them so they can do their job, because the Minister isn't going to do the job, nor is the Undersecretary, right? No, the police do the job on the street. So, if the police aren't empowered, well, who will? No matter how many ideas you have for doing things and strategies, and how many bills you present, if we're full of bills, I mean, we're full of laws on security matters, that's the problem. that it be applied. You can't have a preventive identity check law if there's no one doing the checks.

[00:17:17]What I want to remind you is that in Chile, the prosecution of crime is in the hands of the National Prosecutor's Office.

[00:17:25]The Prosecutor's Office, look, the Prosecutor's Office has gone unnoticed during the security crisis for a long time. The National Prosecutor also has to answer for the management, the lack of management, the successes and the failures in criminal prosecution.

[00:17:43]And it seems to me that either we change the investigation system and give the police back the power to conduct investigations, or the Prosecutor's Office itself has to answer for it. So, look, what happens is that, and in my opinion, you need a much more holistic approach here. You have to face this problem from different angles. One angle is the judiciary, the penal code, the type of sentencing system, the prison system, the prison intelligence. The second angle is the Prosecutor's Office. Does the Prosecutor's Office have sufficient resources and also the capacity to conduct investigations? In my opinion, it is Bad, the system is poorly designed in this particular case.

[00:18:26]Right. So, what happens with that?

[00:18:30]Then you have the police. The police are experiencing a shortage, or at least the Carabineros are facing a serious personnel problem, since you have to address it by implementing better recruitment, improved internal conditions, and eliminating many elements that have generated dissent within the police force. It's unacceptable that you have the labor code operating among the police forces; excuse me, but it's absurd. They have their own statutes, and obviously, they need to guarantee that the same prosecutor's office that you have to reform won't dedicate all its efforts to prosecuting law enforcement officers instead of prosecuting criminals when there's an institutional issue.

[00:19:12]And finally, you have the issue of defense, which is also integrated in some way within the threats, the new transnational threats, intelligence, customs, internal taxes—all of that requires coordination. So, look, what I'm lacking, and I have and I understand that the Minister of Security is being asked to do things, but what I'm missing is someone in charge of this, someone who is somehow responsible for all the ministries and departments related to security, and who is capable of creating a plan where they all play an integrated role.

[00:19:50]Hmm, I don't see that happening at the moment.

[00:19:53]Of course, in the past, there was a national policy that assigned functions to different departments— ministries, services, and so on— but the National Prosecutor should be the one to say what's needed.

[00:20:09]Yes, even now there isn't even a plan. Now the Prosecutor's Office pursues them, but a lot is being done in prevention, a lot is being done in prevention, a lot is being done, and I think that's where we really need to dig deep. We need to rebuild, we need to rebuild, we need to have, we need to rebuild, we need to have, we need to rebuild, the intelligence, that, that, that, that, that, preventive, it's something that was lost in Chile and that still has repercussions to this day. Customs, just the fact of having scanners in all the ports And at all entry points and fixed scanners, not mobile, including customs and internal taxes, combined with cooperation with intelligence organizations from neighboring countries, to what extent are we truly integrated in our border prevention and control work?

[00:21:07]Listen, there are so many things to do, and the truth is that so far, what I see is that everyone is demanding more laws. What we essentially need are certain institutional modifications, yes? In the justice system, the public prosecutor's office, perhaps also in advertising, but what is most needed is management, interagency management and coordination.

[00:21:30]Look, for example, fundamentally, for example, the commercial sector— Gonzalo, you can leave the example for the commercial break because we wo n't get there, he's asking for the time because it's also very good because we leave the audience in suspense, you understand?

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[00:22:46]We're going on a short commercial break and will be back with more powerful ideas at 7 pm. We're with Gonzalo Buenalida and Johannes Kaiser, our special correspondent at the CCA in Cerro Castilla. We'll be right back.

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[00:27:07]We're with Gonzalo Fensalía Johannes Kaiser, who's on his way to the Presidential Palace in Cerro Castillo. Gonzalo, I interrupted you, I was going to give a couple of examples, we were talking about security, please, you have the floor.

[00:27:20]For example, listen, weren't we talking about the connection that needs to exist between different state entities that are involved in security matters? Perhaps it's not the heart of their public business. Ah, but it does have influence, and I was giving you the example of Internal Revenue. Internal Revenue has the power to crack down on illegal trade with high penalties, and it can and has the legal standing to do so. So, when you combat illegal trade and you intelligently detect a series of warehouses that are the ones that supply wholesalers, essentially, those who sell illegally on the streets, and Internal Revenue raids them. If Internal Revenue wants to Believe me, she's not going to have it easy, the people arrested in that operation. But of course, I'm more afraid of the Internal Revenue Service than the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. I'm telling you, the Internal Revenue Service has to be committed, it has to be willing to participate in the operations, to file the complaints.

[00:28:34]So, that's why I'm telling you, I mean, you can move the state apparatus, but there has to be commitment from everyone. And because you can make life miserable for many who are dedicated to crime as a very profitable business. If nothing's squeezing you, it's very profitable to commit crimes.

[00:28:53]So you have to crack down, and to crack down you need to plan and get several people involved and manage things. I'm convinced that more than laws, you need good management and the will to apply them, because what good is it to uncover all the shady dealings in the foundations if in the end you don't end up going after the criminals?

[00:29:18]What good is it, look, what good is it to discover that... Did he murder 100 or did they die? No, he didn't murder them, but 1200-plus children who were under the protection of the State in Sename died.

[00:29:31]And where are the prisoners? Where are the convicted ones, Felipe?

[00:29:37]Yes, there it is. Uh, Johan Gonzalo asked a question. No, there, there he came back.

[00:29:43]There you came back.

[00:29:43]No, I mean, where are the convicted ones from Sename for what happened there? There are n't any.

[00:29:50]So, he's having problems approaching Congress, sorry, Viña, the Presidential Palace. You 're frozen, Felipe. I'm lost.

[00:30:07]Yes, you're lost. No, but what's happening... Well, I've been having problems for a while now, but now my problems have worsened. Uh, yes, what I was asking is how it can be that, for example, the judiciary is reactivating a case regarding the death of former Minister Toda, where it's a closed case, a case that was adjudicated a long time ago, but in the case... The SENAME issue: nothing.

[00:30:42]The issue of foundations, the prosecutor's office: nothing.

[00:30:46]And when they do start something with foundations, it's for very marginalized people or people very, very far removed from the centers of power. Let's see, what's happening when you talk to me about the will to control drug trafficking and crime? Why have illegal entries into Chile fallen by 85% now with this new government?

[00:31:11]It's pure willpower. Why have seizures at the border increased? It's pure willpower.

[00:31:18]What happened with the previous government? What's happening in San Antonio?

[00:31:22]We already knew that almost 40% of the drugs entering Europe pass through San Antonio. What did the previous government do about that? What happened at Customs? Are we really interested?

[00:31:33]I want to ask a question, let's leave it at that. But is there a genuine interest in Chile, on the part of all levels of government, to control crime, smuggling, and drug trafficking? Or are there people who are more interested in keeping this issue hidden? Whether it gets resolved or not, at least in certain very profitable areas. I'm leaving the question open because, in the end, we all know that certain efforts haven't been made.

[00:32:05]I personally believe that the Internal Revenue Service, if it wanted to, with the tools it has, is capable of eliminating much of the money laundering in our country, but it's lacking, isn't it?

[00:32:22]Yes, the Internal Revenue Service and the Public Prosecutor's Office had some differences regarding the regular financing of politics. I don't know if you remember that, but anyway.

[00:32:35]Yes, but that was because the Internal Revenue Service has the standing to prosecute, unlike the Public Prosecutor's Office, when there are tax crimes, and that has never been changed, and I do n't know if I'm very willing to change it. I trust the Internal Revenue Service's judgment more in that sense than the Public Prosecutor's Office, but that was the point of contention. It was as if I have to have the standing, because if the Internal Revenue Service doesn't file a complaint, of course, the tax service, the Public Prosecutor's Office, can't.

[00:33:06]Do nothing.

[00:33:07]Uh, but it's a fact, but when the Ministry, but when Internal Revenue wanted to sue everyone, Bachelet removed the director.

[00:33:16]Of course. I mean, look, I don't think there's a problem between the institutions. It's a matter of having to lead the issue and inspire and gain support; that's what the state is for. One has to work intensely.

[00:33:36]Hey, one last question.

[00:33:38]One last question. Who ordered the theft of the computers from the Ministry of Social Development? We do n't know because you never know.

[00:33:47]Seriously, if the thieves had nothing better to do than break into a ministry and steal used computers, especially the one from the minister's office, what's happening with that investigation? What happened to the evidence in the Jadue Luminarias case that disappeared there? Who is being prosecuted and convicted for the disappearance of the evidence?

[00:34:10]Felipe, our country has more serious problems than you think. And if you think that only the Minister of Security can solve this issue, only from the Ministry of Security... Ignoring a tremendous, not one elephant, but a herd of elephants in the living room.

[00:34:26]Yes, there are many cases left in limbo, with no progress. Uh, I'm just saying that when you ask a prosecutor, for example, about these kinds of cases—for example, I interviewed the national prosecutor in this case, and another one, not too long ago, about a year ago—they often make the argument that Gonzalo Tquera, the lawyer, correct me if I'm wrong, may be absolutely right, and it 's a perfectly legitimate argument.

[00:35:01]But they usually tell you, "The thing is, the evidence has to be so overwhelming to be able to convict."

[00:35:12]Uh, okay, and I insist, it could be a very valid reason, and who is one as a journalist to, let's say, counter a response? Yes, but that case that Johannes Gonzalo is talking about was a super scandalous case, and that's where it ended, and it seems that certain institutions think that the average citizen, like me, not like you, is left with the story that, ah, no, they never caught those responsible, and the case was archived because nothing more was ever heard of it.

[00:35:53]No, what's more interesting is that the prosecutor tells you that. At the same time, they condemn people because someone heard their voice 50 years ago.

[00:36:04]Of course. That's also where you realize, you realize that the criteria don't quite fit.

[00:36:10]That the criteria aren't what the judicial branch supposedly demands to convict in certain matters—extremely exhaustive—and you practically have to arrive with the criminal, with the bloody knife in one hand and the dead body in the other. Already? And then they finally convict him, and in other cases, well, it's enough that, well, he was just hanging around, he's convicted, so it does n't add up, the excuse doesn't fit.

[00:36:42]Of course, it seems that in some cases the prosecution has very compelling evidence, or at least that's what it looks like from the information available in the press, anyway, and the judge dismisses it because it's not compelling enough, or vice versa, as you say, that sometimes one says it's very little, but oh well, anyway. Gonzalo, the Sierra Bella case. In the Sierra Bella case, we know that there were two people who were ordered to coordinate their expert reports to [snort] defraud the municipality of 6 billion pesos. I mean, that's 100% confirmed.

[00:37:28]And that's where the case died. Nobody is being prosecuted anymore. No, there isn't enough evidence to prosecute anything, not even for the illegal payment of money to obtain a bogus expert report. Not even that.

[00:37:44]I'll tell you To say that, personally, the prosecutor's office doesn't give me any guarantees at this point. There are tremendous prosecutors, they do a tremendous job, but the prosecutor's office as an institution, when politicians are involved, doesn't give me any guarantees.

[00:38:02]That's the truth. What do you want me to say? No, I don't know, there you have it.

[00:38:08]Well, let's say hello. No, we weren't finished. I want to bring up something that came up today, which I find very interesting, regarding the mining issue. Itching, burning, throat discomfort, and right at this time of year, the solution: the original Aura Vitalis Promial spray with propolis, honey, and eucalyptus, which, in its practical application, helps relieve throat discomfort, lubricates, reduces inflammation, and provides immediate freshness. Aura Vitalis Promial spray, exquisite flavor that leaves fresh breath, protecting you from viruses and bacteria. Look for the original, look, look, I say, Promial Sprite, now Vitalis, 40 years with Chilean families. Owner and Landlord, your tenant isn't paying rent, common expenses, or utility bills. Don't waste any more time or money. At Real Estate Justice, we 've already collected debts and recovered over 3,000 properties with delinquent tenants. Don't wait any longer, write to us at [email protected] or visit our website. We are Real Estate Justice. We defend your property rights. Can you imagine a custom-built house ready in just 100 days that you can move wherever you want?

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[00:39:33]Hey, how far are you from Cerro Castillo, Johan? No, I'm standing here in front of the entrance, reminiscing about a tremendous lawyer in a very, very interesting case.

[00:39:47]What happened with the Hermosilla case?

[00:39:49]Oh, oh, no, that's not going anywhere. Ah, for months, [Clears throat] For months, to re-formalize, right?

[00:39:59]Oh, nothing happened.

[00:40:01][Clears throat] How strange. Don't you think? Doesn't it surprise you that all these cases somehow, despite the recordings, despite everything, just vanish into thin air?

[00:40:15]And how long can the judiciary and the prosecution take to hand down sentences in these cases? Look, because there's an issue regarding the application of justice. For the application of justice to be fair, it has to be timely. You ca n't, you can't just sentence someone 50 or 60, 70 years later, 10 years later, 8 years later.

[00:40:41]The same court, the same courts have established that there is—they did it in the Alongueira case—that the accused have the right to be tried within a reasonable time.

[00:40:53]What's reasonable about pursuing someone for 8, 10, or 20 years? Nothing. Now, what's happening now in the Hermosilla case and other cases? The same thing, we're simply letting the issue die with time.

[00:41:08]Of course, it's fading away, fading away.

[00:41:10]The public also has the right to see what the ruling is. Let's see, a ruling will be issued.

[00:41:18]The accused has the right to a ruling.

[00:41:21]Uh, at this hour, until at least midnight, the Finance Committee of the Chamber of Deputies will be meeting regarding the reconstruction project.

[00:41:35]Um, and tomorrow it continues from 10 a.m. tomorrow, I mean Wednesday, until the end of the session, and at midnight the chairman of the committee, Senator, Representative Romero of the Republican Party, will call for a vote.

[00:41:54]Like it or not. Uh, that's the preliminary, let's say, what has been indicated, and we'll see what happens. That at least is what 's happening at this hour very close to where Johan Skiser is at the National Congress. Valparaíso, because he's there at the entrance to Cerro Castillo. Aren't they giving you any signals, Johane, like, "Hey," or something? No, no, no, no, no, no. I don't know, I ca n't hear the program here yet. Felipe is listening to the program, and I'd like to take this opportunity to greet our Champion, our player on the Finance Committee, Papier Carlesi, who's been working his butt off over the processing of this bill, and thank him because I haven't seen his family in days, so the process has been quite intense.

[00:42:55]Today we were also talking with the minister; we had a serious problem with Article Eight regarding intellectual property.

[00:43:03]The minister promised to correct that in the Senate and gave us confirmation. Well, if that doesn't work out in the Senate, we'll obviously end up voting against it, but we're still dissatisfied with what had been said. Presented, so that's been announced, and in other matters we're more aligned, and we'll see what happens in the other committees as well, because there's still work to be done on the environment, make no mistake.

[00:43:33]Yes, Minister Quirós has already returned from Canada, right?

[00:43:37]Yes, I was with him an hour and a half, two hours ago. He was there at Chile Day and said a few things. Well, an article in La Tercera this afternoon reports a record investment in the National Environmental Impact Assessment System, better known as Sella. The first two months of Sella have registered the highest figure since the return to democracy. During the first two months of José Antonio Casta's government, the number of investment projects entering the environmental permitting process reached a historic high of 22,258 million, driven mainly by mega mining initiatives.

[00:44:21]That's good, but I think... Now, I personally think I would love to see initiatives related to data centers, light industry, everything that generates employment, employment, employment.

[00:44:36]Mining also does that, undoubtedly, indirectly as well.

[00:44:40]Ah, but let's see, well, I hope that in other areas too—services, tourism, and so on— money starts coming in. Today, Chile has a lot to offer, and the truth is that our people need work and need to be able to generate wealth for themselves and, of course, for future generations. So, hopefully, this is just the beginning of a recovery process— [clears throat] of investment.

[00:45:10]Yes, sometimes we don't think enough about the future. Ah, about what's coming, I mean, what's coming. No, no, no, no. In one, two, or three more years, let's say, a little further on.

[00:45:22]And right there, right there is where we're most complicated and most committed because, Felipe, how are we going to finance all those people who are going to reach old age at a time when we're barely having children?

[00:45:38]Right.

[00:45:39]How do we do it if we don't have savings?

[00:45:41]That's a very important issue. We can't spend the money, we can't run a deficit. The Chilean State facing the Given our demographic situation, we have to save, we have to have solid savings, because otherwise, effectively, the only answer we'll be able to give our elderly is that offer—uh, that very unchristian, very inhumane offer—which is the pill to kill them, euthanasia.

[00:46:13]Of course, when they're no longer useful. And I think a society that gets rid of its elderly because they're no longer useful, or because they can no longer afford it... Wow, what a dreadful declaration of poverty, right? From a social point of view. Of course. Where there's nothing, there literally is nothing. Of course. Well, the investment news is good news, anyway, because we have n't seen news of that magnitude for a long time, but obviously, investment has to go abroad; that is, there has to be more investment, not necessarily related to mining, but in other areas, because that starts to tell you about a country that obviously begins to generate more investment and, obviously, greater productivity, more jobs when other areas like commerce, technology, and others also begin to... Move.

[00:47:12]Well, this project, which the government is implementing, which is miscellaneous with different subjects, I think is a great bet to start changing things. Now, I find it hard to believe that the majority of parliamentarians will vote against it.

[00:47:32]I think there's a lot of media hype, but in the end, in the end, there in the chamber, I think there will be votes to move this forward because I believe there are many who want the country to do well. Yes, this is something where one can have different opinions, but we live in the same country and we all want the country to do well.

[00:47:59]There are some who perhaps want it to do badly, but I think they are the minority. And I had very interesting conversations in Congress today with people from the center-left as well.

[00:48:09]And I think that productive things can be discussed and productive agreements can be reached, and I hope that these opportunities will be taken advantage of because you don't have to agree on everything, but there can be agreements that are partial, and that is also progress.

[00:48:27]He is pleased.

[00:48:29]Yes. Um, you who were members of parliament, there are some voices that maintain that it's going to be complex— and I say this for some members of parliament or some deputies— to approve the tax cuts, because that's unpopular. I'm, please, don't punish me. I 'm simply being a spokesperson.

[00:48:58]Um, but in other matters, apparently they hardly even say they're going to try because it's practically a given. But there's an element, uh, I think, that's interesting. I don't know if you saw Rodrigo Vergara, who was president of the Central Bank, on Tolerancia Cero last night, but he said a couple of very interesting things. First, he said, "It's normal for ministers, and especially the Finance Minister, to fall in love with their ideas, but then he said, uh, "I can't understand the issue of the employment subsidy, and it seems that's the crux of the matter, uh, because we're talking about several billion dollars that would be tied up in that idea."

[00:49:48]So, how do you reconcile one thing with the other, huh? Well, I'm quoting Rodrigo Vergara, right? He was president of the Central Bank, he knows Jorge Quiroz, he spoke very highly of him, in fact, but he said, it happens that sometimes ministers fall in love with their own ideas, right? And there's not much that can be done about that.

[00:50:12]Well, the question that needs to be answered is the following.

[00:50:16]Where can we save the most money?

[00:50:18]Obviously we can't. I believe that a labor reform is also needed; you already have to formalize as much employment as possible. You ca n't have almost a third of the population in the informal sector, semi-informal sector, or self-employment, because that means there are no contributions, right? And if there are no contributions, the taxman pays for that from his left pocket, that is, it's right pocket, left pocket. In that sense, trying to promote greater formalization can greatly alleviate the tax burden with the same number of jobs, without a greater, let's say, greater cost from an economic point of view for the treasury.

[00:51:04]So, what calculation is the minister making? I don't know, but any incentive to restore formality in Chile must be analyzed with a positive attitude, because you can't have a third of the active population not contributing, but consuming public resources. That is. And it does n't matter if you're right-wing or left-wing.

[00:51:31]Yes, obviously.

[00:51:32]But that figure is simply unacceptable, it is unsustainable.

[00:51:37]No, and to top it all off, it gets worse every year as new courts reach the age of receiving transfers and no longer generating wealth. They are the oldest people.

[00:51:51]So, you can't argue that in Germany, where they were talking about relaxing the 8-hour workday law. I don't know if you've realized it yet, because the system is already unsustainable; they can't maintain it in Germany, but we believe we will be able to sustain it.

[00:52:11]I think when Germany starts to resort to shipping, it's because the system can't handle it, right? As we are moving forward, we need to see how to make it sustainable.

[00:52:22]And to be sustainable you need to be very precise and you have to prevent abuse at all costs, including the abuse of social benefits by those who should not receive them because they do not need them.

[00:52:40]Gonzalo, well, there's still a lot to do, but this meeting at Cerro Castello is going to be entertaining.

[00:52:51]All the government officials are invited to this, or so it seems, not only the government officials, wait, not only the government officials, but also Johaniser who is backing out at this moment. We have live updates.

[00:53:05]Senator Walker sees it. When everyone arrives there, they are interviewing him. Johan is our correspondent, absolutely our correspondent of the competition.

[00:53:16]Exactly. Live. We're live. Already.

[00:53:20]So we'll see you later, ladies and gentlemen, because here... Hey, but this is extraordinary because Johannes says that now he has to get off and the program ends.

[00:53:29]Johan, a hug, good luck. And there, well, there tomorrow you'll tell us the behind-the-scenes details, the behind-the-scenes details and the menu, the menu, the menu, please.

[00:53:39]Ah, the menu. We're leaving now, Johanes, take care, Gonzalo. We'll meet again tomorrow. This was 7 pm, powerful ideas. M.