Starmer Issues Challenge To Potential Leadership Candidates

Hinzugefügt: 2026-05-12

[00:00:00]I think he literally reiterated it in the cabinet this morning that he will fight any challenge that comes his way.

[00:00:05]So, he's essentially saying to all of the people who've been rumored to be thinking about it, come and have a go if you think you're hard enough.

[00:00:12]>> More than 80 Labour MPs have now called on the prime minister to resign, including a junior minister. The prime minister's future is hanging by a thread, but this is not the Conservative Party. Labour has a rulebook understood by only a select few. And I'm pleased to say that we've selected one of those select few to be with me here right now.

[00:00:28]of the New Statesman's political correspondent, Megan Kenyon. Hello, Megan.

[00:00:31]>> Hi, Hugo.

[00:00:32]>> Good morning. Thanks for being here. So, look, 81 MPs or 20% is the magic number to trigger a leadership contest, but they all have to support the same challenger.

[00:00:40]>> Yeah, that's right. So, unlike the Conservative party where you can kind of um say you have no confidence in the leader in the Labor Party, the way they've mostly got rid of their leaders is that leader has resigned. I believe the last successful challenge to a leader was when Ramsey McDonald challenged J.R. declines for the leadership of the Labour Party successfully in 1922. So, you know, if you look at the past few leaders of the Labour Party, they've just resigned because it's become clear their position is no longer tenable. Um, with the Labour Party rule book, you need 80 MPs to back one specific challenger. At the moment, we've got 81 MPs calling on the Prime Minister to resign to set out a timetable for for his departure. But no candidate has come forward and said, "Okay, great. I'm gonna run. Katherine West suggested she might do at the weekend, but then backed out uh yesterday and instead has has been canvasing support for the prime minister resigning. But yeah, the Labour Party rule book kind of doesn't mean that you can just sort of topple a prime minister that easily.

[00:01:42]>> But presumably, and correct me if I'm wrong, if those 81 MPs, they can they can back somebody today and then stop backing them tomorrow. They can just back them to breach the threshold, >> I suppose. So, yes, they could they could do that in theory. who um would step forward and do that is unclear.

[00:01:57]Katherine West could have been that person. Um she did what's called a stalking horse, which is essentially where she she said she would um challenge K star Dharma. The her deadline was yesterday obviously she pulled out and then she could in theory once say Angela Raina or West Streeting or Andy Burnham had thrown their hat in the ring had backed out. I think a lot of the a lot of MPs I was speaking to kind of were trying to pull her back down from the brink on that because obviously those who are supportive of Andy Burnham think we need more time until a leadership contest takes place because obviously he's not in parliament at the moment.

[00:02:35]>> Does that mean that he technically cannot become leader of the Labour Party?

[00:02:39]>> He he can't at the moment. No, you have to be a member of the Commons Parliamentary Labor Party. So you have to be a Labor MP. If they did trigger a contest, Karma himself would be automatically eligible to fight in it, even if he had no backers at all.

[00:02:51]>> Yes, the sitting leader is automatically on the ballot paper even if they don't have 80 backers. So, K Star Dmer has said that he is he is up for fighting any leadership challenge. I mean, I think he literally reiterated it in the cabinet this morning that he will fight any challenge that comes his way. So, he's essentially saying to all of the people who've been rumored to be thinking about it, come and have a go if you think you're hard enough. So look, there's a lot of talk about how there needs to be an an orderly transition, a timetable for an orderly transition. But I guess that's not possible. You can't have an orderly transition if you don't know what you're transitioning to. So presumably that can only happen if there's some kind of group endorsement of somebody.

[00:03:28]>> Yes. And I suppose that's the the people who are kind of talking about this orderly transition, the timetable tend to be people who are backing Andy Bernham because there has been kind of rumors, speculation that Bernham and Starmmer could discuss um kind of a handover similar to sort of what happened with Tony Blair and Gordon Brown where they sort of made a pact. I mean Tony Blair obviously had a different understanding to that pact to Gordon Brown. It could be the same with Burnham and Starmmer, but that is essentially what it would mean. And it doesn't necessarily have to be Andy Bernham. I think that he's the candidate that it would make s more most sense to do that with because he needs to be able to get back into parliament. But then there's the other challenge of if there is a bi-election, I was speaking to the Green Party yesterday who said if a bi-election is called and it's in a seat where Andy Burnham could run, they will throw the kitchen sink at trying to beat him. So, you know, Andy Burnham, massive question mark over whether he'd even get in to parliament going by the set of elections we've had. uh a couple of days ago.

[00:04:29]>> Finally, Megan, the NEC, Labour's ruling body, blocked Andy Bernham last time. Is it a given that they'd let him let him go for it this time?

[00:04:35]>> I don't think it's a given. No, I think uh there are still a lot of factors.

[00:04:39]Obviously, the NEC is very much weighed up to be supportive of Kier Starma.

[00:04:44]Karma obviously had a vote in that um decision last time whether he would make the same decision again. So, yeah, it there's still a lot of moving plates on this.

[00:04:54]>> It's like trying to untangle a ball of thread. Megan Kenya, thanks so much for being here to explain this to us. I feel I understand it somewhat better now, if albeit not necessarily perfectly. Megan, thank you. Uh, great to have you here.

[00:05:04]Look, let's speak now to one of those Labour MPs who were calling for an orderly transition to a new leader. Uh, Andy McDonald served in Karma's shadow cabinet and joins me now. Hello, Andy.

[00:05:13]>> Good morning, Hugo.

[00:05:14]>> Thanks for being with us. Look, Karma's message to his cabinet was, "The Labour Party has a process for challenging a leader and that has not been triggered.

[00:05:20]The country expects us to get on with governing. That's what I'm doing and what we must do as cabinet." uh what's your response to that?

[00:05:27]>> Well, he's right about that process, but it also remains within his gift if he was to accept that those results of last week were just utterly catastrophic um and present an existential threat to the Labor Party uh which is still the best vehicle for economic and social change in our country. um then it's in his gift to say that I recognize that I'm not communicating, I'm not delivering uh and it's best for the interest of the country and indeed for the Labor Party that I announce my resignation and a timetable to elect a successor. So um it's he still has that power. Uh it's a question of whether he wants to exercise it.

[00:06:11]>> So you want to see an orderly transition to a new leader. Do you have anyone in mind?

[00:06:15]>> Well, there a whole host those those names are are well known. People have talked about Angela uh Wes and Andy Burnham and perhaps others too. Um but what we've got to have is the opportunity for a a a thorough examination about a policy platform. Um because the one that we went into and the delivery we went into the local elections did not cut it with the the electorate. So we we can't just change the person at the top. We've got to have a a proper understanding of what that um alternative that changed uh uh option in policy terms is. And those candidates have got to set that out and we've got to have discussions with them about it.

[00:06:59]It's not just about a a personality contest. It's got to be policy based.

[00:07:03]But >> are you confident that whoever you end up with that's going to be a better situation, a more popular situation with the British public? I mean, you are you clear that that's that's definitely going to be the case? uh who can say definite in this world. What you got to do is be uh enter into these discussions with good heart and in accordance with the values and principles of the Labor Party uh and come up with a a a unifying pluralistic broad church approach that has been sadly missing. Uh I I I regret to say that Kia has often preached unity, but um has has actually has delivered um division. Uh and I think that's got to be one of the hallmarks, but it's got to be a much bolder, much more ambitious program. We've done some great things, but we always seem to temper it with some caveats that just pull us back from making those fundamental changes that people want to see to see their material living conditions uplifted. Um, and I think that's what we've got to hear from any candidate who wants to take up this position. They've got to come up with that bold and radical vision that will transform the lives of millions of people because they're saying to us in those numbers at those elections, you haven't done it. Uh, and we we've no confidence that you you will deliver it.

[00:08:22]So, let's have that discussion and set that out with with absolute clarity so that we know what we're campaigning for and we know the person who will deliver on it and we've got to have confidence in them to do it.

[00:08:36]>> Karma did a pretty effective job of of killing off the Corbonite wing of the party which you which you belong to. Do you feel like he's reaping what he swed?

[00:08:43]>> Well, I'm a socialist. I mean, the whole business about the the Coronite thing is just fills me with dread. I mean, I thought it was one of the most disgraceful episodes in the history of the Labour Party. I mean, Kia took up his office saying that Jeremy Corbyn was a friend of his and he thanked him for his his work um and intended to take up the mantle and be the elector electorally um acceptable and successful version of Jeremy Corbyn. I mean those >> I think we might have lost Annie McDonald there.

[00:09:14]>> Oh, sorry. No, sorry. Yeah, sorry. you you were saying >> well it's just that we we we turned away from that Kia came up with 10 pledges and I challenged him in shadow cabinet about those those 10 pledges and asked directly we'll be sticking to them uh because they were good pledges but we to say they've been frayed at the edges would be would be a kind understatement.

[00:09:38]Um, so it's somebody who's going to um set out that bold vision of what they want this country to be and to stick with it. I'm afraid that demonizing of other people and the vilification of individuals gets us nowhere and it's been incredibly divisive and to tell people that the door is open that they can leave. um when I'm afraid Kia has been in the party since 2015. He's been leader since 2020 as people with many many decades of of commitment to the labor movement and I don't think he's ever understood that and understood the uh uh the labor movement and its and its ethos in its history. Um and I think that has come through on innumerable occasions.

[00:10:24]>> Andy McDonald, thank you very much indeed.