LIVE: Trump PLOT BACKFIRES as He Gets SLAMMED in Court | Legal AF

Ajouté : 2026-05-11

[00:00:10]It's Dina Doll and Lisa Graves and you are here on the live Monday night legal AF podcast which incidentally is happening the same time as POPAC is in New York accepting the Webbby award for the Legal AF podcast. So, congratulations to the Legal AF podcast who were eligible for this award and uh can't wait to see those pictures. But Lisa and I, there's plenty of legal news here to break down. So grateful, Lisa, to have you here to do it. Let's h just brief everyone what we're going to be talking about today. And also, since this is live, we have a live chat going.

[00:00:48]Throw in your questions, your comments.

[00:00:51]We'll try to get those at the end here.

[00:00:53]First up is voting rights. Of course, as you know, this devastating Supreme Court ruling is just wreaking havoc across the country, especially to black voters. And pictured there is Tennessee State Representative Justin Pearson, who is leading the fight in Tennessee as Tennessee just redrrew their congressional maps, separating Memphis, a vastly majority black voting district into three parts, diluting the the political power of black voters there as this white supremacy seems to be just overtaking the right to vote. he spoke um spoke out against this and so we we're going to delve into the lawsuit he and other congressional candidates have filed in order to stop this redistricting. Also, Hegathth is going after Senator Mark Kelly yet again um for speaking out yet again. We will get into that as Mark Kelly actually just had an oral argument the hearing at the appellet level for Hex's first attempt to go after them as you know about that nobody should follow illegal orders.

[00:02:10]Hexath tried to basically lower his rank and lower the amount of pension he can receive. Seemed like the appellet court will be ruling in favor of Senator Mark Kelly. And then last but not least, Doge supposedly tried to get rid of fraud and abuse and waste. And here the amount that Trump is spending, painting bright blue, the bottom of the reflecting pool has ballooned from about 1 million to $13 million, knowing that Doge was never really about eliminating fraud and waste and abuse. At the same time, they are being sued by nonprofits because the original color of the bottom of the reflecting pool was done intentionally and of course Trump repainted it without any kind of proper necessary approval.

[00:03:02]Lisa, so great to have you here today.

[00:03:05]It's great to be here, Dina. I'm so glad to be here on uh our second show of the Monday Night Legal AF and also so exciting for Legal After won the Webbby.

[00:03:14]There's a lot of voting across the country with a lot of competition for a lot of different shows. And so I just want to thank the viewers who cast their votes uh for uh that award for this program which we're really delighted to be part of now on Monday Night's Live.

[00:03:30]>> Absolutely. Midas mighty legal a effort are this is the best community you can ever be a part of. So grateful for it.

[00:03:38]So let's first go to the words from Representative Pier Justin Pearson himself. Now if you remember he was part of that Tennessee three the state legislators who spoke out against um a gun regulation that the state was going to pass and he was expelled by his colleagues for quote disorderly conduct but then re won his seat in a special election. Well, right now he was running to become a Congress member and here this state is redistricting the district that he was going to run in. Take a listen to his very I mean to me I'll see what you think Lisa and everybody else here. I think he is a true leader and somebody we are just beginning to hear from. Take a listen to his very powerful words about Tennessee's redistricting black voters political power away. These maps are racist tools of white supremacy at the behest of the most powerful white supremacist in the United States of America, Donald J. Trump. Memphis is the most beautiful place on the planet. It's the place that raised me, my brothers, my parents, my grandmothers, and where my ancestors bones rest. And what you are doing today is eviscerating the only black majority congressional district in our state because we are majority black.

[00:05:08]We are here because this Republican party has to seek to steal elections and seats because the president and the party have refused to address the pain, the suffering, and the struggling of everyday Tennessans.

[00:05:24]This is about attacking, targeting, and cracking district 9 into pieces for more political and racial dominance and white supremacy in the state of Tennessee. And we need to realize that the Cala decision that you all are basing your decisions off of that gutted the Voting Rights Act, that that Voting Rights Act was paid in blood. It was not just a parchment of paper signed into law. It was paid in blood on the Edund Pettis Bridge. Paid in blood by Megar Evers.

[00:06:00]Paid in blood by Fanny Liu Hamemer. has been paid in blood year over year, time after time, assassination after assassination, lynching after lynching, so that more people might be able to ascertain access to this constitutional democratic republic experiment that is currently being gutted and seeking to be gutted by this chamber, by this house, this Senate, and this state.

[00:06:31]Really powerful words there, Lisa.

[00:06:34]>> Yes. I mean, I I certainly I I'm just so upset about what's happening and his words are so true. This decision of the US Supreme Court of the Roberts court is wreaking havoc on America. It is driving America back into the sort of postconfederacy period where the effort to uh rebuild the South as a place where people could exert their rights equally, where formerly uh freed black slaves could freely vote was betrayed. And so I think of this Robert's court really as a neoconfederate court, a court that is it would it knew that this would happen in part because we know that what Samolito with John Roberts help and the help of the other Republican appointees did in South Carolina was allow the state of South Carolina to bleach out 20,000 black voters from the first district by claiming that they were just doing it on a partisan basis, not based on race. And so what's happening in the aftermath of the Clay decision where the Roberts court struck down a a majority black district in Louisiana, a state that is 30% African-American and where the white legislature had drawn only one out of six maps for black representation and had five white majority maps. After the court did that, issued that decision, after the Roberts court did that just a few weeks ago, it's been days really, immediately these white legislatures in the South began trying to use the legislative power to erase black representation. America has not seen this sort of behavior since the late 1800s in terms of the effort to rest away political representation from black Americans. This is an extraordinary outrageous circumstance. And what's happening in Memphis is an example of that. And and Representative Pearson's comments are so beautiful and true. You have a situation where the white dominated legislature, even with this election coming up relatively quickly in Tennessee and nationwide, is preparing to change the maps in order to wipe try to wipe out the potential for black representation in Congress in uh Pearson's area in Memphis and in three other in three three districts in the state to have total Republican representation in the state and in Memphis, which as uh Representative Pearson described lives is a black majority city. To split that city into three parts, mirroring it with white, rural, and suburban areas in order to blot out and deny black representation.

[00:09:19]This is a fundamental im fundamentally immoral act by this state legislature, by the uh by the legislators in uh Tennessee. It is a fundamentally immoral decision by the Roberts court. And I think it's an illegitimate decision by the Roberts court to usurp the power of Congress to protect voting rights through section two of the Voting Rights Act that allowed courts to consider acts like this to be efforts to deny and dilute the power of black voting in America. And so we have got a lot of work to do in the country to rebuke the Roberts Court and to repair the Voting Rights Act and end our rights. But what's happening right now is genuinely despicable.

[00:10:05]>> Absolutely. And really to his point, I mean, a blood of assassinations, as we know, Martin Luther King was assassinated in Memphis is is where he gave his last speech. I've been to the mountaintop. I mean, it is devastating.

[00:10:17]Representative Pearson, however, is really carrying that mantle and speaking so uh uh really movingly in a time of we desperately need leaders like him. and their lawsuit, the lawsuit that Representative Pierce and others filed is actually very strong. They are trying to stop these new maps that were just passed on May 7th, not according to any constitutional right, although they say this does um this is an unconstitutional restriction on the right to vote and associate of the Tennessee voters, but they are actually asking for it to be stopped purely just based on the timing.

[00:10:59]There is a case out of the redistricting of Nashville that Tennessee attempted back in 2022 that that is so on point that perhaps Representative Pearson and the others might win. What happened there? Four officers of the state of Tennessee, including Tennessee's council attorney of record, all under sworn testimony to the court, said that the changing of those maps were too close to the election, that if they were going to change the maps back in 2022, they were very likely going to violate the federal law requiring a certain amount of time for ballots to go out in order for them to be received. D by military members and citizens living abroad. They also said it would cause significant voter confusion and also they had three reasons why it was too close to the election to change the maps in 2022. The third reason being that they were unlikely to be able to efficiently and timely prepare for early voting. Now get this though, Lisa. That change in the maps was six weeks prior to this change.

[00:12:15]That change was back in March. So you are talking about those same officers by the way are all still in their same positions. So you have the same four officers not that long ago about four years ago saying that they could not change the map that quickly. And the Supreme Court back the Tennessee Supreme Court back then said that an extension of that statutory deadline to which other deadlines are tied of nearly a month to May 5th imposes a significant delay on the election process in this state as reflected by the submitted affidavit. They are asking actually for an extension to May 15th. so significantly past what the Tennessee Supreme Court ruled back in 2022 was too close to the election. So perhaps I mean if if if we were in a if we were in a world Lisa where the law and facts matter, this would be the end of our discussion. This this president is so on point in terms of the law and the facts that these maps would be overturned. But we are not in that world. So you and I can still look at this and not know exactly how the Tennessee Supreme Court is going to rule here.

[00:13:29]>> Well, that's right. You described that exactly right, Dina, as as usual as always. And the reality is that you have a situation where under state law, under state precedents, um that these types of changes, this goes to election, you know, are impermissible and have long been held such and that's been consistent with federal law. In federal law, there's a doctrine from a case that's called the Purcell doctrine that is based on, you know, saying that the courts are not going to allow uh changes in maps too close to the election that could disrupt the election. And in fact, back in 2022, what we saw was the Roberts court, the US Supreme Court allowing districts that were drawn in violation of the Voting Rights Act in Alabama. They allowed the election to go forward, did not allow the map to be redrawn despite those findings by a lower court in January or February of 2022 under the PCEL doctrine. And so that ended up giving Republicans the advantage in taking over the US House of Representatives. And so we've seen that doctrine applied at the federal level where it's it's been applied in ways that basically help Republicans take control. In this instance, if under state law, under the the comparable state doctrine and the and the timing that you've described, if if the court of Tennessee, if the Supreme Court of Tennessee were to follow that precedent, this would be an open andsh shut case as it should be. And quite frankly, so should the Clay decision, the decision in Louisiana, it's too close the election. The ballots in that instance had already gone out for those maps.

[00:15:09]This is exactly where the courts should not be allowing a legislature to create mischief and confusion or you know where courts should not be intervening in ways that change the rules from the rules that were in place earlier this year.

[00:15:24]>> Absolutely. And I and the reason why I think it was so important for us to highlight Representative Pearson is because it could be easy for people to disengage in the process, to feel as if it is rigged against them, to become disenchanted. That is what the Republicans want. They want people to stop voting, to think it doesn't matter.

[00:15:45]And we need the inspiration and courage of the leaders. If we could put up that image, that image that went viral, it will become a historic image of Justin Pearson standing outside the um there we go. the standing outside trying to get into the sta the Senate where they were discussing the disenfranchisement where what you said Lisa going back hundreds of years rights that were fought like he said with blood and tears and that image you know so for those who want to become cynical we can't afford to be cynical and we will definitely here on Monday keep an eye out on this lawsuit and all the very many developments that are going to be coming. This is indeed the fight for the House because Republicans know Trump is deeply underwater, deeply unpowerful. I mean unpopular and unpowerful um and they have to resort to these tactics and um and we have to continue to believe in our democracy and show up for it and canvas and make phone calls and all those kind of things in the light of this kind of disenfranchisement. So, moving on to Hegathth, most unqualified >> hard turn, but yes, >> the most unqualified um Pentagon leader, I'm sure, ever. And his attack on Captain Senator Mark Kelly. Now, first of all, before we get into this, I just want to set up I I grew up uh most of my life in Arizona, and I am astounded that they would go after an Arizona senator.

[00:17:26]Of course, Arizona is already a purple state. Um, but you also have the spirit of Arizona. Even when they are Republican, they are independent. I mean, there's it's not a coincidence that they elected, you know, McCain so many times. They elect somebody like Mark Kelly so many times. There is a belief of a um, you know, get your hands off me type Republican mindset. And so to have the government go after Mark Kelly so much to me just seems like a political backfire, like a major political backfire in a state like Arizona. But in addition, it seems to be like a legal backfire. Now, as we know, Mark Senator Mark Kelly was one of the many Congress members who put the video quite some time ago saying do not file illegal orders. Haggth then threatened to demote him essentially take him down from his rank which would also lower his pension. Now the interesting thing about this the reason why he can do that is because Senator Mark Kelly served for so long and just think about that for a little bit. somebody who was perhaps in active duty but then um you know went back into private uh professions such as Hexath himself doesn't the the the military doesn't have as much le um control over them because captain Senator Mark Kelly actually retired he spent so many years in the military and retired in the military that is why he can still be court marshaled that is why they can do things like lower the pension. So, ironically, because he served more time in defense of our country, they have more power over him. So, just to make that point that I think that in particular is really disgusting. So, Mark Kelly sued saying you cannot do this based on my speech. A district court judge back in January agreed with him. He on May 7th, there was an oral argument in front of the appellet court. And they seemed to be willing to rule in favor of Mark Kelly saying that this this idea that you're just stating you cannot follow illegal orders, which is part of the rule book, and this is speech. This is not something you can demote them on. Of course, now Hegsth is moving on to a second wave of attack to Mar Kelly.

[00:19:53]Before we move on to the second one, do you have any thoughts, Lisa, on >> the what's you know, I mean, there's a lot going on between, you know, his attack on >> I really appreciate that you emphasized how long uh General Kelly or Captain Kelly had served in the military, honorably served. Uh this is someone who served with distinction. He's someone who, you know, then ran for the United States Senate. ever uh people know that his wife was uh the victim and survivor of a shooting attack. He's someone who has spoken with integrity, who has, you know, worked to try to protect the interests of service members. And it's it's outlandish to me that even though there is, you know, in principle this um this notion that you can um you know, that you're still subject to some level of military control as a retiree. It's never been used this way. And you know, I I really wonder because of all the many terrible and crazy things in my view, my personal opinion, Hegs has said as a Fox, you know, commentator, none of that, you know, would ever have been pursued as a basis for, you know, um uh uh you know, taking away his rights to freedom of speech or a General Michael Flynn who was, you know, charged with serious crimes and was pardoned by Trump and has, you know, said a an array of things like declaring that we should declare martial law in 2020 and seize voting. Like there's been no effort to remove or strip him. The B administration did nothing to strip him of his title even though those were really extreme statements that were contrary to the law. To urge basically an insurrection by, you know, Trump and by the Trump loyalists is a significant betrayal in my view. And in this instance, what Mark Kelly did was repeat the command that every soldier is taught and every cadet at West at, you know, West Point is taught and is engraved in a sign on the lawn of of West Point that it's the duty of the soldiers to follow the law and the constitution not to just follow an unle an illegal or unlawful order. That's the command of the, you know, Geneva Conventions. That's the command of, you know, that the United States basically fought for to be the rule. And so for HEXP to have pursued Mark Kelly in the first instance was outrageous. That was not the end of the story because then the Trump Justice Department also tried to indict General uh Captain Kelly, pardon me, I keep promoting him inadvertently. Captain Kelly and his fellow members of Congress for daring to say out loud what cadets are taught, which is that they should not follow illegal orders. And now here we are again having had having been rebuffed by a grand jury in the District of Columbia and having been rebuffed in the previous instance, this effort to punish uh Kelly for saying what the law is. Here we are again at take two or the second bite of the apple for Heg Seth.

[00:23:02]Absolutely. I'm so glad you brought in that attempt to go to the grand jury and the fact that as they say grand jury would, you know, indict a ham sandwich is definitely not true under this DOJ.

[00:23:13]So Mark, so Pete Hagath has a new attack on Mark Kelly. Mark, Senator Mark Kelly spoke to 60 Minutes and spoke about his concern about the um fact that we are drawing down our weapons stockpile. So Hegth did a post and if I think we have that post. Yeah. He put in quotes Captain Mark Kelly and then he goes on about how this was a classified briefing and he shouldn't have talked and did he violate his oath. The reason I wanted to put that up was the even just the putting in quotes, you know, the title that he earned. Like that's just disgusting. And I don't see how anybody who has had family members serve in the military can still support this um Trump regime when they are so disrespectful of somebody's service. Now we have um Senator Mark Kelly has a response because of course this exchange about the fact that there was the stockpile has been drawn down was in a public hearing. So take a listen.

[00:24:17]years to replenish. That's the question.

[00:24:19]>> I think that's exactly the right question too, Senator, because the time frame we were existing under was unacceptable until this budget does. I mean, months and years past years. I mean, we're building new plants in real time.

[00:24:31]>> So, just to replace what we have, >> I said months >> and then you said years, >> both it depends on the weapon system, but two to three 4x of what we have today. So, yes, we're dealing with a reality under the previous administration of what they sent to Ukraine and what they allocated elsewhere. Okay, I got it. So, we fired years >> worth of munitions >> and it is clear that we're these are being expended.

[00:24:57]>> I mean, it's not that difficult to rebut them. This is the thing. You know, this they can say anything they want. It's not that hard to say something that's not true. You can lie easily, but the facts clearly do not support Heg's claim that somehow Mark Kelly was talking about something in a classified briefing when they literally just discussed it in a public hearing that the reality is we have significantly drawn down our weapons.

[00:25:23]>> Right? I mean, here's here's the thing.

[00:25:25]you have um a secretary of defense who has used signal to convey information about plans of attack to that included a journalist. So you have someone who at the top of the defense department has already basically had loose lips and there were there was more to that exchange that was covered in the press about you know not quite a year ago um you know showing how reckless he was.

[00:25:51]But that's not all. The reality is is that what what Senator Kelly spoke about is what was covered in that hearing and you can't basically reclassify it by discussing something that was in public then again in a classified hearing and then somehow secretize it. That's not how it works. And uh Senator Kelly and the other members of the intelligence committee and the other members of armed services, they know the rules. They know the rules way better than Hegith does, who's cavalier and reckless in all sorts of ways. The fact is is that members of the um of the Armed Services Committee, members of the intelligence committees on the House and Senate, they can speak about what is in the public domain, what's been reported, what happened at the hearing that you that we just played, you know, um on the air. They can speak about matters of public record and things that, you know, can be drawn from that public record. And there's no indication that Kelly violated any rules. That was the very subject that that Hegsith was coming to Congress to say, "We need way more money because we've depleted so much of the stockpile of munitions in this folly." He didn't say folly, I'll say folly, this war of choice in Iran that they are afraid of even calling a war. Um because they're they're they're in violation of the long-standing rules of Congress in terms of Congress declaring war and the War Powers Act and more. And so you have a Secretary of Defense who's engaged in what I consider personally to be discreditable behavior in numerous instances. And this is just the latest assault on the integrity that we have a right to expect from members of the military and the civilian head of the military as the Secretary of Defense.

[00:27:31]I'm not going to call it the Secretary of War even though they've changed the URL. Congress has not made that change.

[00:27:37]And the fact is is that Hegsth is engaged in a a retribution campaign, a campaign to use any powers that he may or may not have punitively against Mark Kelly. Not just because he's a person of integrity. Kelly is a person of integrity, but also I think because this is a political play, I think they want to try to dust, you know, mark up a rough up Mark Kelly because he could be a presidential candidate in 2028.

[00:28:06]I'm so glad you brought in Signal Gate because I mean that's a stunning breach of leaking classified truly leaking classified information. I it's well known you're not supposed to use that sort of format and use of uh classified information. So yeah, I mean and the thing is is I but I think the political dustup backfires, you know, the DOJ does not and ever play to win. They play for a PR move.

[00:28:37]They play to try to extract a cost, to threaten people not to speak up, but they do it so poorly that it becomes obvious that they can't actually win in court. And this is a perfect example because you have this footage of them talking about the same exact topic. And you know, it's it's like a part of Trump's entertainment reality show that we're all suffering through. He he doesn't care if it's real or what the outcome will be. He just cares about that splashy headline that we're coming after you and maybe other people don't want to be having to go through the courts, you know? I mean, Senator Mark Kelly may not want to be going through the courts having to deal with this. The irony is that the people he ends up targeting end up becoming more popular, >> don't you think, Lisa?

[00:29:30]>> Yeah. There's there's a bit of there's a bit of a strien effect. That's the the the terminology for, you know, the reason why other than Trump, most people don't sue for defamation is because, you know, the the Stzen effect is the more you pursue it, the more widely it becomes known. But, you know, the other part of this is the is the context here.

[00:29:50]You have a defense secretary that is allowing our US military to be deployed for flybys for Kid Rock. He literally allowed I mean, I can't even believe this is true. I had to double check it just to make sure. I was not getting some sort of Onion uh type uh meme, but Pete Hixth allowed Kid Rock to address the press at the Pentagon. as if Kid Rock, this musical right-winger guy, uh, who had, I think, only one one hit, one good hit that I know of, this guy has no experience on anything, and yet he was allowed to address the press. You know, that's crazy. Hegsmith has allowed these little helicopter flybys to impress Kidrock. Kidrock was also in that ridiculous, absurd video with RFK Jr., this is like a reality TV show except for we're stuck in it. we like how do we cancel this really terrible reality show that Hegath and others are leading you just it's like you cannot believe what we're seeing and it has legal consequences like you said it makes Mark Kelly have to expend money uh you know to fight in his defense it puts it puts not only Mark Kelly's free speech at risk it puts all of the rights of all of the the former military at risk and we have so many brave uh retired soldiers who have spoken up who've joined groups to try to make sure that the VA is working when this administration has been slashing the VA. Um who've spoken out about matters of war and peace as is their right, the right that they fought for um under the First Amendment. And I understand that when you are in the military, when you are actively serving, there are limits on what you can say in part because you are in that active military. But as the court of appeals asked in the in the hearing on this on this Kelly case, you know, they basically said this is uncharted territory to try to punish someone who has retired from the military even though there you know are other rules that do relate to um you know could you have your title stripped? but for purely engaging in free speech. And not just any speech, speech affirming the rule of law and justice. Speech affirming the commandment that soldiers are taught, that officers are taught at West Point and the othermies. It is bonkers for this to even be allowed to continue. I personally hope at some point there will be accountability for the lawyers who are aiding in this punitive effort to try to destroy the first amendment rights of of service members, people who have served honorably in our military like Captain Kelly.

[00:32:34]>> Absolutely. And what an important time, you know, but that this Iran war and clearly Trump doesn't have a plan and and the killing of the 150 school children and going back and forth about there's a ceasefire or not. And the fact that Trump and Hexath are in charge and then Netanyahu just went on CBS and spoke last night about how we're not done. It's it's scary times. And the fact that the head of our Pentagon is focusing on what Mark Kelly is saying instead of actually getting our men and women who are serving the military out in a safe way, perhaps trying to salvage this to completely not lose our standing in the world. And I mean it is a mess as you said. We want to get out of this reality show nightmare. So, just to pivot to our our last breakdown here is the reflecting pool. We saw Trump do his yeah, a little drive down that reflecting pool as yet another PR stunt.

[00:33:32]Well, the I the the the details are coming out about this and he issued a no bid contract. No bid contract back in April >> for this the painting of this and it was originally supposed to be about $1.5 million. It's already ballooned to 13 a little bit more than $13 million. The administration said that it needed to be no bid because there was this was a serious issue.

[00:34:01]Definitely not a serious issue to paint the bottom of this reflecting pool. And a nonprofit has sued. They're asking for a temporary restraining order. They're also saying that this is a violation of the uh you know preservation act and that the color the gray color that was part of the bottom of the pool before Trump has uh repainted it bright blue was purposeful.

[00:34:27]And this is their description of it which to me h this seems almost like a perfect description of Trump versus you know all of the rest of our presidents and what they mean. It says, quote, "The dark color of the tile created the illusion of greater depth and a more profound reflection." And that was according to the 1999 Park Service report that authorized the the that tile. Of course, Trump is undoing the tile of a greater depth and profound reflection. He's doing it to a bright blue. He's calling it the American flag blue. Uh, and this nonprofit is suing, saying it causes not only is it a violation of the preservation act because you need to go through procedures before changing a national landmark like that. Evidently, the government used a 2008 law to streamline it, saying this was just maintenance.

[00:35:25]He's saying there I have an aesthetic injury, which is also an injury that's being alleged for the ballroom. Your thoughts, Lisa? Well, you know, I I actually was reaching because I keep this uh little painting of the reflection pool uh next to me. It's my favorite place in DC. And um I am astonished yet again that this administration has moved forward without any congressional approval, without any allocation of funding, without any architectural or historical review to repaint the reflection pool. and um and this no bid contract, this you know this sort of insider deal um that Trump has given on a non-emergency for something that you know should have been reviewed and and made sure that is aesthetically um consistent with the with the mall instead. You know, I'm actually I I suppose I'm surprised that he's not painting it gold. Having it painted in gilded a gilded pool or something, but the blue like some unnatural swimming pool blue is um you know, I think really inappropriate. It's on brand in a way with uh Trump. But again, this is a lawless act taken without any authorization, without any al proper allocation of funding, without any proper review, and just to fulfill Trump's, you know, whims to act like a king, to walk around DC and claim, I'm going to plant this arc of triumph over here, um, you know, by Arlington Cemetery. This this god-awful gigantic monstrosity that he's trying to create.

[00:36:58]Again, like with the ballroom, where there was already a ballroom in the East Wing. I've been to the ballroom in the east wing. It was beautiful, fabulous.

[00:37:06]Uh Nixon's daughter was married. The party was, you know, partly at that ballroom. This is not this was not something that was necessary. Again, it was another whim and caprice by Donald Trump trying to just remake things all around him with again without proper approval, without funding, and then to claim that he's going to have his his uh donors donate for it uh secretly, you know, without really disclosing the American people who they are. People, companies and CEOs that have business before the United States who may be facing antitrust claims or SEC investigations or the like, you know, that sort of paytoplay is outrageous.

[00:37:42]and then to come to Congress to try to get approval for a billion dollars to add into the pool of money for a ballroom that didn't need to be torn down was torn down without authorization, without congressional approval, without a budget allocation, without any architectural review to the beauty and the balance of the beautiful White House, which is the people's house. If I had a tenant who had decided to rip up the roses and tear out the magnolia trees and tear down a wing of the house I was renting them, I would evict them immediately. These behaviors are not the normal behaviors of any reasonable president or reasonable person. This even though it may seem small in the grand scheme of things because there's so many other violations Trump is engaged in so many ways in which he's trying to rewrite the law and rewrite the constitution in some instances with the aid of this Robert's court. It may seem trivial but all of these acts accumulate to try to basically arrandise his power and sav his his ego the black hole of his neediness. And I am so proud of the fact that there are historical societies and architects and others who are jumping in trying to protect our institutions, our buildings, our legacy, including the White House, including the reflecting pool, including the Kennedy Center from the destruction, the wreckage of this singularly rec, you know, singularly destructive personality.

[00:39:16]>> Absolutely. It is. You know, I was in DC. I know you're in there all the time, but I was in there that not that long ago and it was stunning seeing Trump's face, the banner of his face on the Department of Justice. It really you read about it, but when you see it, you're just like, gosh, I really am in North Korea. I mean, the difference is is sure we do honor our presidents, but it is after they have died. That is the difference between a monarch and a democracy. And Trump does want to put his signature on everything. that is his legacy. I don't think he's interested in having his children carry on his legacy.

[00:39:52]He wants to stamp everything so he lives on. We can undo all that stuff and I think we should. But yeah, I mean it's the fact that the ballroom is knocked down and in some not being able to be rebuilt because he legally does not have a pathway to it is just also an epitome of who he is. It is easy to destroy something. It is much harder to build it. Yeah, >> you can knock something down pretty easily. And that's what we've seen, right? I mean, he's gutting so many agencies. He's not rebuilding it. You know, I you know, Doge who fired hundreds of um you know, FAA employees saying, "We're planning on modernizing it." I'm not seeing or hearing anything of that.

[00:40:34]>> Not only that, right? Not only that, not only do we have an FAA that is has been damaged by Doge, which I call dodgy, uh, because it's it, you know, and also the courts have have found in a number of instances that their act that the actions of of the Dodge the Doge Doge team was, um, you know, unlawful in violation of the statutes and more. We also have a secretary of transportation at a time when gas prices are hugely high on some sort of realworld reality TV road trip around the country. You know, we need real we need serious people doing the serious job of helping to repair and improve our infrastructure and our institutions. These people are profoundly unserious. They are devoted to self-promotion, to promoting themselves, their name, their image, like Christine Gnome, uh, like Duffy, like Shawn Duffy and others. Um, like you know, with we see with the director of the FBI, these are individuals who are loyal to Trump in part because he lets them get away with their own destructive impulses. And these impulses are destructive not just to the institutions they govern govern, but to America. And so I am just so honored really to be part of these conversations with you Deina and part of Legal AF as we talk about what's happening in this country and how the law is being used to try to defend us, defend our rights and how sometimes the law is being used or abused or wielded to harm us. And so it can be very daunting to be in this environment where every day there's just another assault on common sense, on law, on rules, on rights. And some of these assaults are so historically enormous like the assault on voting rights. Um, and then some of them are so historically just damaging where like you said, like it's hard to rebuild.

[00:42:28]It's going to be hard to repair the the damage of the of to the ballroom or to the to the east wing of our White House or to a reflection pool that looks like a a swimming pool rather than an actual reflection pool. These things are going to be hard to repair. But I think there are millions and millions of Americans who are going to want to roll up their sleeves in order to rightfully take down Trump's effort to basically stamp his name all over everything and everyone and you know what have you, even passports and and currency. Like it is extraordinary what we're seeing, but it doesn't have to be this way. And legal AF, I feel like, is part of the the effort to say it doesn't have to be this way. This is what's happening and don't give up. You can help.

[00:43:18]>> Absolutely. Before we sign off, just to recap, because that was a really great point about Shawn Duffy. He did this reality road trip with his wife and his nine kids over the course of seven months. Of course, Shawn Duffy was on a reality show once upon a time, and this was part of a government initiative evidently tied to the 250 year anniversary to encourage us to do road trips. Never mind the fact that, of course, he Trump and others is making it more expensive to do road trips. Never mind the fact that Americans love doing road trips anyway. But they're actually slashing funding for national parks where most people go to do road trips.

[00:43:51]Plus the fact that they are saying, "Oh, it's privately sponsored." But of course, some of the sponsors are Boeing and United Airlines, the exact type of companies that Duffy oversees. A clear conflict of interest. So many bad things all wrapped up into one into that horrible road trip. Never mind the fact that he was just MIA during perhaps the most contentious time of flying this past year. But to leave it on, the last words of the legal aff66 says, "Mark Kelly, thank you. your service to country who are behind you all the way. A true hero. You put life on the line. Our country Mark Kelly, we will always be indebted to you for fighting for our freedom. And also to um there was somebody else here, if I can find it, talking about how Trump needs to reflect and resign. I thought that was a really good comment, too. So, appreciate uh everyone here joining us on the live, giving us the comments, um feedback. We this we're all in this together as Lisa said could not be more grateful for such a great community to be a part of and we are here every Monday night live breaking down what is going to be months of perhaps the most chaotic legal political and then after the midterms you know the race is on essentially for the presidency and and we are going to see the shenanigans I believe we're going to see more courageous leaders stand out and we definitely going to be here to cover them all. Thank you, Lisa. Um, for our second episode here, >> David, thank you. Thanks. Thanks to our producers and thanks everyone for tuning in. Uh, come see us next Monday, but catch all the other legal AFS later this week. There's going to be a lot happening and a lot to keep on top of.

[00:45:41]>> See you next week.

[00:45:42]>> Thank you.

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